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Poll

Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

1-4
[ 0 ] (0%)
5-8
[ 0 ] (0%)
9-12
[ 11 ] (17.2%)
13-15
[ 17 ] (26.6%)
16-18
[ 36 ] (56.3%)

Total Members Voted: 61

Voting closed: March 23, 2017, 11:05:37 pm

Topic: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017? (Read 37069 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #90 –
We were bottom 5 last year - could have won a couple more and could have lost a couple we won.

The only way that I can see of doing a where do you think we will finish is by doing a blind tipping comp now.  This way you can set rules and stick to them (eg Freo is going to win every home game except one of the derbys) (be interesting to know how the media types do it)

When this is done, you get the ladder and you can justify why you think Carlton finish where they do - if we go backwards (eg bottom two), who is going past us.  If we finish say, 11th, who do we overtake.

Having said that, I hope that endeavour is there for the whole year.  If it is, there is enough good experience and skilled youngsters to helps us win a few, and a bit of confidence can do a lot.  While I think we'll finish bottom four, it would be great to be better than last year, with another win or two and finish bottom 8.

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #91 –
To put it simply, i was shocked that so many people have agreed with me about this year being a long one.

Many vocal posters argued black and blue that i was being negative. Seems that perhaps they were being overly positive.


Question to the 11 people who voted 9-12.
Have you changed your mind after last nights effort?

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #92 –
Quote from: kruddler on
To put it simply, i was shocked that so many people have agreed with me about this year being a long one.

Many vocal posters argued black and blue that i was being negative. Seems that perhaps they were being overly positive.


Question to the 11 people who voted 9-12.
Have you changed your mind after last nights effort?

Nope
Ask me again after Round five or six ;)

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #93 –
Quote from: kruddler on
To put it simply, i was shocked that so many people have agreed with me about this year being a long one.

Many vocal posters argued black and blue that i was being negative. Seems that perhaps they were being overly positive.


Question to the 11 people who voted 9-12.
Have you changed your mind after last nights effort?
No (I think I voted 9-12  ???)
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #94 –
Quote from: kruddler on
To put it simply, i was shocked that so many people have agreed with me about this year being a long one.

Many vocal posters argued black and blue that i was being negative. Seems that perhaps they were being overly positive.


Question to the 11 people who voted 9-12.
Have you changed your mind after last nights effort?

Other way around, you agree with them.

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #95 –
Quote from: bratblue on
Other way around, you agree with them.

When i first floated the idea many moons ago, i was han solo. Everybody was against me.

Then since the first ball was kicked in anger, it seems many people jumped ship very quickly and started speaking from the same hymn book as me.

Now it seems that people can't jump off quick enough.

I'm happy that the 9-12 group are sticking to their guns. I actually wished more people who thought we'd 'go ok' didn't stand by that, and instead are being all doom and gloom.

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #96 –
You can't write a season off after one game.
Life's too short...and I'm running out of seasons :(

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #97 –
Quote from: kruddler on
When i first floated the idea many moons ago, i was han solo. Everybody was against me.

Then since the first ball was kicked in anger, it seems many people jumped ship very quickly and started speaking from the same hymn book as me.

Now it seems that people can't jump off quick enough.

I'm happy that the 9-12 group are sticking to their guns. I actually wished more people who thought we'd 'go ok' didn't stand by that, and instead are being all doom and gloom.

Na, you weren't alone.

I was in agreement which is why I was thinking that in spite of a big loss last night was encouraging.

A good side would have well and truly belted us.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson
 

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #98 –
Quote from: Thryleon on
Na, you weren't alone.

I was in agreement which is why I was thinking that in spite of a big loss last night was encouraging.

A good side would have well and truly belted us.

x2..Plenty of folk think/thought we will finish well down the ladder and I agree we would have been smashed badly if we had played a really good team.

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #99 –
Here's my thinking...There's actually two components to it.

Firstly.....

Our 2017 list is an improvement on our 2016 list...(anyone think differently?).
The only way we go backwards in terms of ladder position/ games won is....

1)Teams below us improve at a greater rate (possible)
2) We get hit by a dreadful injury run (also possible)

My estimate of (9-12) of is a gamble that neither of these two things will happen.

Now the second component... and this is probably more important.

I think a lower finish will do a great deal of damage to our rebuild and confidence.
In short...we can't afford to drop off.

You've seen the first evidence of it already after just a few practice games and a first round loss.
Media were pretty strongly behind Bolton when he was first appointed...now we're getting a few backhanders....watch the buggers stick the knives in if it goes completely pear shaped.

Some supporters have already written the season off.
List management, team selections, skill levels and match day coaching are all coming under scrutiny...the criticisms aren't real strong at the moment but fast forward to say round 5, and if our  scoreline reads 0-5 that criticism will have grown.

I know what's trying to be achieved so I'll hit round 22 still on board with the rebuild whatever the result..as will all those preaching patience.


My concern though is that with a bottom 3 finish we can probably hold our "we're on board" meetings in a much smaller venue.

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #100 –
Quote from: Lods on
Here's my thinking...There's actually two components to it.

Firstly.....

Our 2017 list is an improvement on our 2016 list...(anyone think differently?).
The only way we go backwards in terms of ladder position/ games won is....

1)Teams below us improve at a greater rate (possible)
2) We get hit by a dreadful injury run (also possible)

My estimate of (9-12) of is a gamble that neither of these two things will happen.

There is also a twist on option 1, that is a 1.1 if you will.
We are not as lucky as we were last year.
We won a few games (Geelong) in which a couple of things change and the result is different. We won that game by 19 points. But they had 1 more scoring shot.
A bounce here, a gust of wind there and all of a sudden different result.

Now back to the original premise. Our 2017 list is an improvement on 2016.

Define improvement.

Walker, Jamison, Tuohy were all best 22 at the start of the year. All gone, 2 through injury essentially. 472 games experience walks out the door.
What kind of experience did we get back? Palmer?? Not in best 22 at this stage.

Long term improvement, sure, more talent added.
Immediate improvement, not so sure about that.

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #101 –
Luck is a variable...our luck may turn out to be better this year.
We don't know that yet

Walker and Jamison gave us very little last year for all their experience
Tuohy is a loss but the addition of Marchbank into the backline has allowed Weitering to move forward so that kind of negates that loss.

Definitely a better list.

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #102 –
Quote from: Lods on
Luck is a variable...our luck may turn out to be better this year.
We don't know that yet

Walker and Jamison gave us very little last year for all their experience
Tuohy is a loss but the addition of Marchbank into the backline has allowed Weitering to move forward so that kind of negates that loss.

Definitely a better list.

Better list for 2017......or 2019?

Its easy to say its a better list now because our next Lucas, Watson, DVR, Smith....hasn't outed themselves yet

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #103 –
I'm judging it just on the best team we can put on the field in 2017....compared to the best team we could put on the field in 2016

Do you think the 2016 side was better Kruds?

Re: Where do you think Carlton will finish in 2017?

Reply #104 –
Quote from: kruddler on
Better list for 2017......or 2019?

Its easy to say its a better list now because our next Lucas, Watson, DVR, Smith....hasn't outed themselves yet
How true - it's too early to say whether the list is better. It's easy to say at this stage that last years and this years draftees will mean we have a better list in another 2 years time, but we just don't know.

When you look at the list the problem is that the 12/13/14 drafting and trading is a train wreck, and we therefore have very few guys with 40-60 games experience who a solid AFL footballers. Doc and Crippa are it really. We have a massive hole in the middle of the list, and you can't lose experience like Tuohy, Jamo, Walks and Hendo and replace them with kids and hope to get the same results in the short term. You are likely to go backwards.

In a perfect world 4-5 of Boek, Whiley, Tutt, Jones, KJ, Gorringe, DVR, Menzel, Temay, Graham, Giles, Holman, Everitt, Smith, Dick, Foster would have developed into solid players who contributed strongly week to week - even that would be a 33% strike rate. Instead we got almost nothing out of that cohort, so we now have to keep playing White, Casboult, Armfield and Daisy because we have nothing better. And we have to keep blooding a high proportion of players with under 25 games experience and pray we find some diamonds in that group.