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Topic: Yarran blames complacency for poor start (Read 20642 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #45 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Nah I had you pegged in the 'players aren't good enough' category. Paranoid much? :P

Edit: I also left out 'the players had 18 preseason ops' category as well. :))

Well we all know what category you're in Carrots.  :))
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #46 –
@Jamie

But in general your point has been the players aren't good enough and Mick has not enough to work with. If it was between the ears I don't see how you could dismiss Mick as a factor.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #47 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
@Jamie

But in general your point has been the players aren't good enough and Mick has not enough to work with. If it was between the ears I don't see how you could dismiss Mick as a factor.

I've been through this... This team has been consistently inconsistent for 7 years...  Its inbuilt into them now and needs time to be fixed.. For those who it cant be fixed, need to be moved on.
Mick had enough to work with against Melbourne mate talent wise (Not saying he has against better opponents), but the team didn't turn up mentally. Somehow, I cant see Mick gave them a light week, or told the boys to rest up as this week will be an easy one..  He would have gone out of his way to make sure they weren't complacent.. But guess what, the players get out on the field and think its all going to just happen..
You blame the coach, i blame the players.. That's where we both disagree...
Forget game plan, if Carlton and Melbourne both play to their potential, giving 100% effort,  we win 10/10 games..  Surely you agree to that?
Even with Waite out of the team. 

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #48 –
Well, after the Melbourne game and their last effort if they are still complacent they must be delusional, even delirious. There should be no doubts in any of their minds that they are just nowhere near good enough to take it easy against any opposition in the league. If they don't turn up prepared to give their absolute best then there's a very good chance they will be spanked.

Let's see if they've learned anything tonight?
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #49 –
Quote from: cookie2 on
Well, after the Melbourne game and their last effort if they are still complacent they must be delusional, even delirious. There should be no doubts in any of their minds that they are just nowhere near good enough to take it easy against any opposition in the league. If they don't turn up prepared to give their absolute best then there's a very good chance they will be spanked.

Let's see if they've learned anything tonight?

With the talent (or lack there of) on our list, we need to be a team that turns up each week mentally and gives 100% effort. Especially when we are missing a couple of key players.
We have no real depth yet to cover them.

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #50 –
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
@Jamie

But in general your point has been the players aren't good enough and Mick has not enough to work with. If it was between the ears I don't see how you could dismiss Mick as a factor.

I've been through this... This team has been consistently inconsistent for 7 years...  Its inbuilt into them now and needs time to be fixed.. For those who it cant be fixed, need to be moved on.
Mick had enough to work with against Melbourne mate talent wise (Not saying he has against better opponents), but the team didn't turn up mentally. Somehow, I cant see Mick gave them a light week, or told the boys to rest up as this week will be an easy one..  He would have gone out of his way to make sure they weren't complacent.. But guess what, the players get out on the field and think its all going to just happen..
You blame the coach, i blame the players.. That's where we both disagree...
Forget game plan, if Carlton and Melbourne both play to their potential, giving 100% effort,  we win 10/10 games..  Surely you agree to that?
Even with Waite out of the team. 

Absolutely I agree with that. The buck stops with the coach. IMO. Just like the buck stopped with Ratts on that fateful night at Metricon. ;)
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #51 –
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: cookie2 on
Well, after the Melbourne game and their last effort if they are still complacent they must be delusional, even delirious. There should be no doubts in any of their minds that they are just nowhere near good enough to take it easy against any opposition in the league. If they don't turn up prepared to give their absolute best then there's a very good chance they will be spanked.

Let's see if they've learned anything tonight?

With the talent (or lack there of) on our list, we need to be a team that turns up each week mentally and gives 100% effort. Especially when we are missing a couple of key players.
We have no real depth yet to cover them.

Spot on DH.
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #52 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
@Jamie

But in general your point has been the players aren't good enough and Mick has not enough to work with. If it was between the ears I don't see how you could dismiss Mick as a factor.

I've been through this... This team has been consistently inconsistent for 7 years...  Its inbuilt into them now and needs time to be fixed.. For those who it cant be fixed, need to be moved on.
Mick had enough to work with against Melbourne mate talent wise (Not saying he has against better opponents), but the team didn't turn up mentally. Somehow, I cant see Mick gave them a light week, or told the boys to rest up as this week will be an easy one..  He would have gone out of his way to make sure they weren't complacent.. But guess what, the players get out on the field and think its all going to just happen..
You blame the coach, i blame the players.. That's where we both disagree...
Forget game plan, if Carlton and Melbourne both play to their potential, giving 100% effort,  we win 10/10 games..  Surely you agree to that?
Even with Waite out of the team. 

Absolutely I agree with that. The buck stops with the coach. IMO. Just like the buck stopped with Ratts on that fateful night at Metricon. ;)

Ratts had 5 years with this bunch after Pagan had 4 or so years with them.
The buck will stop at Mick, when he's had long enough with the list to right the wrongs.. If that time comes and we are still a rabble, I'll over take you at 100mph on the Get rid of mick wagon and my tail will be firmly between my legs with humble pie splashed all over my face.. If he is sacked before that time, I'll put it down to a p1ss weak board bowing to member pressure and I'll be calling for the board to go..   ;D

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #53 –
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Ratts had 5 years with this bunch after Pagan had 4 or so years with them.
The buck will stop at Mick, when he's had long enough with the list to right the wrongs.. If that time comes and we are still a rabble, I'll over take you at 100mph on the Get rid of mick wagon and my tail will be firmly between my legs with humble pie splashed all over my face.. If he is sacked before that time, I'll put it down to a p1ss weak board bowing to member pressure and I'll be calling for the board to go..   ;D

Baker's Delight, Four'N'Twenty or Mrs Macs?
The Force Awakens!

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #54 –
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
@Jamie

But in general your point has been the players aren't good enough and Mick has not enough to work with. If it was between the ears I don't see how you could dismiss Mick as a factor.

I've been through this... This team has been consistently inconsistent for 7 years...  Its inbuilt into them now and needs time to be fixed.. For those who it cant be fixed, need to be moved on.
Mick had enough to work with against Melbourne mate talent wise (Not saying he has against better opponents), but the team didn't turn up mentally. Somehow, I cant see Mick gave them a light week, or told the boys to rest up as this week will be an easy one..  He would have gone out of his way to make sure they weren't complacent.. But guess what, the players get out on the field and think its all going to just happen..
You blame the coach, i blame the players.. That's where we both disagree...
Forget game plan, if Carlton and Melbourne both play to their potential, giving 100% effort,  we win 10/10 games..  Surely you agree to that?
Even with Waite out of the team. 

Absolutely I agree with that. The buck stops with the coach. IMO. Just like the buck stopped with Ratts on that fateful night at Metricon. ;)
Ratts had 5 years with this bunch after Pagan had 4 or so years with them.
The buck will stop at Mick, when he's had long enough with the list to right the wrongs.. If that time comes and we are still a rabble, I'll over take you at 100mph on the Get rid of mick wagon and my tail will be firmly between my legs with humble pie splashed all over my face.. If he is sacked before that time, I'll put it down to a p1ss weak board bowing to member pressure and I'll be calling for the board to go..   ;D

So out of interest when is that time in your book?
Excuses year 1, blame year 2, contract extention year 3........

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #55 –
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
@Jamie

But in general your point has been the players aren't good enough and Mick has not enough to work with. If it was between the ears I don't see how you could dismiss Mick as a factor.

I've been through this... This team has been consistently inconsistent for 7 years...  Its inbuilt into them now and needs time to be fixed.. For those who it cant be fixed, need to be moved on.
Mick had enough to work with against Melbourne mate talent wise (Not saying he has against better opponents), but the team didn't turn up mentally. Somehow, I cant see Mick gave them a light week, or told the boys to rest up as this week will be an easy one..  He would have gone out of his way to make sure they weren't complacent.. But guess what, the players get out on the field and think its all going to just happen..
You blame the coach, i blame the players.. That's where we both disagree...
Forget game plan, if Carlton and Melbourne both play to their potential, giving 100% effort,  we win 10/10 games..  Surely you agree to that?
Even with Waite out of the team. 

Absolutely I agree with that. The buck stops with the coach. IMO. Just like the buck stopped with Ratts on that fateful night at Metricon. ;)

Ratts had 5 years with this bunch after Pagan had 4 or so years with them.
The buck will stop at Mick, when he's had long enough with the list to right the wrongs.. If that time comes and we are still a rabble, I'll over take you at 100mph on the Get rid of mick wagon and my tail will be firmly between my legs with humble pie splashed all over my face.. If he is sacked before that time, I'll put it down to a p1ss weak board bowing to member pressure and I'll be calling for the board to go..   ;D

So it's the players fault because they are crap and every poor performance is down to them, and has nothing to do with the coach, but if we win and play well he will get the credit? Just want to get this one right. :P
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #56 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
@Jamie

But in general your point has been the players aren't good enough and Mick has not enough to work with. If it was between the ears I don't see how you could dismiss Mick as a factor.

I've been through this... This team has been consistently inconsistent for 7 years...  Its inbuilt into them now and needs time to be fixed.. For those who it cant be fixed, need to be moved on.
Mick had enough to work with against Melbourne mate talent wise (Not saying he has against better opponents), but the team didn't turn up mentally. Somehow, I cant see Mick gave them a light week, or told the boys to rest up as this week will be an easy one..  He would have gone out of his way to make sure they weren't complacent.. But guess what, the players get out on the field and think its all going to just happen..
You blame the coach, i blame the players.. That's where we both disagree...
Forget game plan, if Carlton and Melbourne both play to their potential, giving 100% effort,  we win 10/10 games..  Surely you agree to that?
Even with Waite out of the team. 

Absolutely I agree with that. The buck stops with the coach. IMO. Just like the buck stopped with Ratts on that fateful night at Metricon. ;)

Ratts had 5 years with this bunch after Pagan had 4 or so years with them.
The buck will stop at Mick, when he's had long enough with the list to right the wrongs.. If that time comes and we are still a rabble, I'll over take you at 100mph on the Get rid of mick wagon and my tail will be firmly between my legs with humble pie splashed all over my face.. If he is sacked before that time, I'll put it down to a p1ss weak board bowing to member pressure and I'll be calling for the board to go..   ;D

So it's the players fault because they are crap and every poor performance is down to them, and has nothing to do with the coach, but if we win and play well he will get the credit? Just want to get this one right. :P

A coaches job is to build a list, teach his list a certain game style that suits the list and gives them every chance to win and also develop as players.. He then will implement it and train his players for it. His job is also to develop players to their potential. The coaches also choose match ups, tactics etc, .. But once out on the field, win lose or draw, its 99% the players and whether the players bring the effort required, right mindset and work ethic, and nail their skills under pressure to carry out the instructions and plans they have been given all week. Some weeks they can, some weeks they cant.. Some 1/4's they can, some 1/4's they cant. Good opposition wont let teams like ours dictate terms for too long during games. It takes a lot of concentration, hard work, and discipline.. We lack the ability to sustain all 3 for long enough at the moment. 
If we brought 100% effort every week, I still don't believe we have the list to consistently beat the top teams and challenge for a flag..  The trouble is we don't give 100% every week, so we struggle to beat the mid range teams aswell..  I hope we are now clear.  :D
Mick is known as a great motivator, so I don't believe for one second he lacks motivational skills.
Bomber Thompson said when he came to Essendon, he said to Hird it was a 4-5 year job to get the list to where he wanted.. He said by the 4th year, the players should be able to coach themselves out on the ground.
Its now Essendons 4th year and he says this is happening.. Now this is from Bomber Thompson..  So he has instilled a gameplan, but its now up to the players to execute it..

@ Goat

As far as how long..  I think around 60 games is fair to get a lot of things done..  But to right every wrong, I would say 3-4 years.

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #57 –
@Jamie

You can't compare lists with other clubs that weren't in the same position. MM does not have to build from ground up he had 11 first round draft picks out there last night FFS. He has 3 more sitting in the reserves and two out injured..
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Yarran blames complacency for poor start

Reply #58 –
Quote from: Dirty Harry on
@ Goat

As far as how long..  I think around 60 games is fair to get a lot of things done..  But to right every wrong, I would say 3-4 years.
Given his 30 years experience and 3 premierships, I reckon 3-4 years is a bit much, but thanks for your honesty.  He has a 3 year contract and by now I would have expected to see improvement across the team, and more consistent performance. 
Excuses year 1, blame year 2, contract extention year 3........