Poll
Question:
Who were your top 3, WORST on ground?
Option 1: 1 - Walker
votes: 1
Option 2: 2 - Menzel (starting sub)
votes: 0
Option 3: 3 - Murphy
votes: 0
Option 4: 4 - Gibbs
votes: 4
Option 5: 6 - Simpson
votes: 0
Option 6: 7 - Buckley
votes: 0
Option 7: 9 - Lucas
votes: 22
Option 8: 11 - Warnock
votes: 0
Option 9: 12 - Robinson
votes: 9
Option 10: 13 - Yarran (subbed off)
votes: 3
Option 11: 14 - McLean
votes: 1
Option 12: 17 - Rowe
votes: 1
Option 13: 23 - Henderson
votes: 3
Option 14: 29 - Scotland
votes: 1
Option 15: 30 - Waite
votes: 0
Option 16: 33 - Everitt
votes: 2
Option 17: 38 - Garlett
votes: 0
Option 18: 39 - Thomas
votes: 1
Option 19: 40 - Jamison
votes: 0
Option 20: 41 - Casboult
votes: 12
Option 21: 42 - Tuohy
votes: 22
Option 22: 43 - White
votes: 2
A brilliant outcome, but perhaps we should've won by more. Who held us back tonight?
Casboult, Lucas and Tuohy get the thumbs down tonight, all three had major coach killing moments.
I'm having a hard time with this one. Most stood up at least once to help us get the win which makes it tricky.
Casboult, Lucas and Tuohy get the thumbs down tonight, all three had major coach killing moments.
They are the 3 that I went for. I am surprised someone picked Brock.
I am surprised someone picked Brock.
Are you really? There are people here who pick the same players every week.
I am surprised someone picked Brock.
Are you really? There are people here who pick the same players every week.
Either way he was far from our 3 worst in my eyes. Levi, Lucas, 2E were below him in quality this game.
I think Rowe is getting close to Mick Martyn levels when the ball hits the ground, but he did well defending high balls.
Robbo wasn't great. The Bolt missed his opportunities, and he doesn't get a lot of them. "Sugar" is turning out to be one of those ironical nicknames for Kane. Zac seems to have forgotten the state of the Irish economy.
Might watch the replay before I make a decision.
I went Touhy only ...everyone else did their job IMO...
Lucas was ok in the last quarter IMO which saved him from a vote..
Had to scratch my head on this and was reluctant to nominate anyone tonight really. In the end gave it to 2E.
I went Touhy only ...everyone else did their job IMO...
Lucas was ok in the last quarter IMO which saved him from a vote..
Nah, until he can stop the 3 earlier quarters of coach killing sh1te you cannot cut him slack.
Sure he gets a credit for contribution to the win, but Lucas, Tuohy and Casboult helped Weagles get back into the game with some dreadful decision making, skills and stupidity!
We are too soft at Carlton, one fecking clearance, one goal or one mark and all is forgiven for anyone. We forget just long enough for them to stab us in the heart next week, I am not so easily convinced anymore because life is too short! Now days I mark players games by mistakes not by their successes.
I thought both Lucas and Robbo performed overs compared to recent efforts. Earned automatic selection IMO.
The whole team had good and bad moments tonight.
Note on Rowe: he needs to get his head right. If he can convince himself he's not crap he'll be far better off... never mind convincing everyone else. He keeps spoiling when he's got a simple mark. Got to trust himself.
Robbo / Lucas dead heat. They were arguing with each other in the 3rd qtr.
Robbo, Yarran and Touhy.
I found this quite hard to pick as I thought we had a pretty even lot of contributors. I almost feel bad for picking any of them !!
2E unfortunately, really started to go backwards in development. Hard 2 pick 2 more but i guess Lucas could have done more ditto robbo.
Robbo, Yarran and Touhy.
I found this quite hard to pick as I thought we had a pretty even lot of contributors. I almost feel bad for picking any of them !!
Yarran? His run was so dangerous for West Coast they specifically started dragging him back to the goal square. In fact he was involved in roughly half our scoring yesterday.
Still you are entitled to that opinion but Yarran was good for us yesterday.
Do we really need this thread ?
I have contributed to it previously but I think there's something a little unsavoury about it.
leave these type of threads to TC....
Every week we get people complaining about these threads. Every week i say the same thing. If you don't like them, don't read them.
If you don't open this thread, its like it doesn't exist, then you get what you want.
I see it as an important method of evaluating our players performances. Individuals are generally biased. A group of people voting individually generally shows a better account of how individual players performed, both positively and negatively.
My votes, had to sleep on it as it's very difficult this week.
A key forward needs to kick goals, Casboult clearly fails that criteria with his pathetic kicking which seems to be getting worse (didn't think that was possible). He is mildly effective as a backup ruckman though.
Probably daylight next, but eventually you'll get to Tuohy. Kicked an important goal late, but made some errors throughout the game which hurt us. Harsh, but it was a good overall performance by the rest of the blokes.
Finally, another tough call, but it goes to Robbo. Basically same reasons as Tuohy. Made some critical errors which hurt the team.
I went Touhy only ...everyone else did their job IMO...
Lucas was ok in the last quarter IMO which saved him from a vote..
Nah, until he can stop the 3 earlier quarters of coach killing sh1te you cannot cut him slack.
Sure he gets a credit for contribution to the win, but Lucas, Tuohy and Casboult helped Weagles get back into the game with some dreadful decision making, skills and stupidity!
We are too soft at Carlton, one fecking clearance, one goal or one mark and all is forgiven for anyone. We forget just long enough for them to stab us in the heart next week, I am not so easily convinced anymore because life is too short! Now days I mark players games by mistakes not by their successes.
Couldn't have put it better. You can't do a couple of nice things in the final qtr and expect that to eradicate a below average effort in the previous. 3.
Lucas, Casboult and regrettably Tuohy were the 3. Tuohy for costly and silly errors and Meat for his softness between the lugholes when it counts.
Henderson
Lucas
Tuohy
I can't understand the reasoning behind Hendo getting votes.
He took 9 marks, 3 inside 50, kicked 2 goals and set another one up.
I can't understand the reasoning behind Hendo getting votes.
He took 9 marks, 3 inside 50, kicked 2 goals and set another one up.
Thats why this is such a stupid thread.. Especially when we have such a gutsy win with everyone contributing..
I haven't seen the game as yet so cannot vote but maybe we could pull it out for the losses? I have no issue either way.
Finally, another tough call, but it goes to Robbo. Basically same reasons as Tuohy. Made some critical errors which hurt the team.
Robbo still played a better than average Robbo Game.
Though, the turn over at the end could have cost us.
I can't understand the reasoning behind Hendo getting votes.
He took 9 marks, 3 inside 50, kicked 2 goals and set another one up.
Casboult took 9 marks, 3 contested to Hendo's none, also 6 contested possessions to Hendo's 1.
Their games were similar, I felt Casboult did more crash and bash although his kicking let him down.
Casboult took 9 marks, 3 contested to Hendo's none, also 6 contested possessions to Hendo's 1.
Their games were similar, I felt Casboult did more crash and bash although his kicking let him down.
Psst, psst!
I know why they call big Levi Casboult "Meat"
Because he butchers the ball better than anyone! ;)
No one butcher's it like Butcher from Port. Many on here wanted to throw our first rounder at him (not that the first rounder is a successful one anyway).
Some of our best players butchered it as well. Gibbs, Thomas and McLean committed some horrific turnovers.
Some of our best players butchered it as well. Gibbs, Thomas and McLean committed some horrific turnovers.
Yet most would back them in to at least hit a 19m wide target from 30m away, at least once in two goes anyway! ;)
Yet most would back them in to at least hit a 19m wide target from 30m away, at least once in two goes anyway! ;)
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Yet most would back them in to at least hit a 19m wide target from 30m away, at least once in two goes anyway! ;)
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Casboults field kicking is fine.. Just lacks confidence in front of the big sticks..
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Almost correct, a few slight corrections and we get;
It's only clanger counts for guys you don't like, OK! ;)
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Almost correct, a few slight corrections and we get;
It's only clanger counts for guys you don't like, OK! ;)
okay
I can't understand the reasoning behind Hendo getting votes.
He took 9 marks, 3 inside 50, kicked 2 goals and set another one up.
Casboult took 9 marks, 3 contested to Hendo's none, also 6 contested possessions to Hendo's 1.
Their games were similar, I felt Casboult did more crash and bash although his kicking let him down.
He can do as much crash and bash as he likes, but his main job as a FF is to hit the scoreboard, not 2 sections over from where the goals are located.
Hendo didn't need to take any contested marks because he can actually run off his opponent to receive the ball, ditto contested possessions.
Anyway, you've made your decision, i just disagree with it...a lot. :P
Yet most would back them in to at least hit a 19m wide target from 30m away, at least once in two goes anyway! ;)
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Casboults field kicking is fine.. Just lacks confidence in front of the big sticks..
That is something I have noticed too. He hits targets around the ground O.K, but gets the yips in front of the big sticks. Something he really needs to work on. If its how he drops the ball to boot then maybe he needs a bigger and faster run up on a set shot.
Yet most would back them in to at least hit a 19m wide target from 30m away, at least once in two goes anyway! ;)
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Casboults field kicking is fine.. Just lacks confidence in front of the big sticks..
That is something I have noticed too. He hits targets around the ground O.K, but gets the yips in front of the big sticks. Something he really needs to work on. If its how he drops the ball to boot then maybe he needs a bigger and faster run up on a set shot.
This is a good idea. The faster run up can really help his goal accuracy, aka Nick Duigan last years final against Richmond
This is a good idea. The faster run up can really help his goal accuracy, aka Nick Duigan last years final against Richmond
Get him kicking torps at least then he will only miss to one side!
It feels good having trouble finding 3 players to vote for in this category.....
Yet most would back them in to at least hit a 19m wide target from 30m away, at least once in two goes anyway! ;)
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Casboults field kicking is fine.. Just lacks confidence in front of the big sticks..
That is something I have noticed too. He hits targets around the ground O.K, but gets the yips in front of the big sticks. Something he really needs to work on. If its how he drops the ball to boot then maybe he needs a bigger and faster run up on a set shot.
Mental lightweight. Maybe he needs to hit the piss for once it may just make him kick straight.
Yet most would back them in to at least hit a 19m wide target from 30m away, at least once in two goes anyway! ;)
It's ok clangers only count for guys you don't like.
Casboults field kicking is fine.. Just lacks confidence in front of the big sticks..
That is something I have noticed too. He hits targets around the ground O.K, but gets the yips in front of the big sticks. Something he really needs to work on. If its how he drops the ball to boot then maybe he needs a bigger and faster run up on a set shot.
Mental lightweight. Maybe he needs to hit the piss for once it may just make him kick straight.
Tried that with Eddie on the Yarra cruise.
Up until last week when he gave the club a bake I would have been happy to see Fev back in a goal kicking coaching role. Won't happen now though. Gibbs is a lovely set shot so maybe he should get in Levi's ear a bit.
Levi needs to setup a routine. JK had similar issues and then he brought in the "flintston" shuffle.
Now he is a pretty good set shot for goal.
It can make a massive difference to a players confidence and ability to do something if they have a routine. I heard on the radio that Blake Caracella was the bloke that Geelong went with to work with Tom Hawkins on his kicking.
It might be an idea that we employ a similar tactic, and I would actually go for someone like Dermot Brereton, who could teach him more than just kicking...
Levi needs to setup a routine. JK had similar issues and then he brought in the "flintston" shuffle.
I have one for him, kick backwards 20m to Tuohy, Watson or Jammo! ;)
Levi needs to setup a routine. JK had similar issues and then he brought in the "flintston" shuffle.
Now he is a pretty good set shot for goal.
It can make a massive difference to a players confidence and ability to do something if they have a routine. I heard on the radio that Blake Caracella was the bloke that Geelong went with to work with Tom Hawkins on his kicking.
It might be an idea that we employ a similar tactic, and I would actually go for someone like Dermot Brereton, who could teach him more than just kicking...
After 4-5 years at the club and with the kicking issues he has if the club has yet to implement a routine or have a kicking expert work with him then that is an utter disgrace.
After 4-5 years at the club and with the kicking issues he has if the club has yet to implement a routine or have a kicking expert work with him then that is an utter disgrace.
As much as I have bagged Casboult about his blunders, his marking around the ground and contests in the ruck were 200% better this week. Still has a few one -on-one problems but is getting better.
Just keep him away from goal and tell him to aim for the big semicircle, he can kick like a mule when he wants to!
Gotta say I'm finding it hard to see any reason for the Casboult love.....I'm far from convinced he adds anything to this team.
Gotta say I'm finding it hard to see any reason for the Casboult love.....I'm far from convinced he adds anything to this team.
Size, but only when he uses it!
Levi needs to setup a routine. JK had similar issues and then he brought in the "flintston" shuffle.
Now he is a pretty good set shot for goal.
It can make a massive difference to a players confidence and ability to do something if they have a routine. I heard on the radio that Blake Caracella was the bloke that Geelong went with to work with Tom Hawkins on his kicking.
It might be an idea that we employ a similar tactic, and I would actually go for someone like Dermot Brereton, who could teach him more than just kicking...
After 4-5 years at the club and with the kicking issues he has if the club has yet to implement a routine or have a kicking expert work with him then that is an utter disgrace.
Agree.
Its clear as day the best key forwards seem to have a set thing they go through prior to kicking. Lloyd used to pick up a piece of grass and throw it in the air, Sticks used to pull up and straighten his socks. Kennedy the Flintstone, Jonno Brown the gallop, Fev had the weird hand ball drop thing happening (which he implemented after being a pretty ordinary set shot for goal unless it was from distance).
Cloke has a routine he employs most times, but he is a confidence player and as soon as he stuffs up an elementary action (like dropping a sitter) then his game is over until he bags a goal.
I reckon get Levi into a routine that he is comfortable with, and the rest will fall into place for him. What irritates me, is that the further out he is, the better he seems to kick it (still not accurate though) but some of his better shots for goal when he is reaching his range limit.
The old adage rings true, strike through the footy and go for distance, and usually you hit it better. Even Fev had a higher percentage miss rate when he was closer to goal, but take him outside 50 and he was in his element.
While Levi drops the ball with two hands he will never be a decent kick........
Levi is a real paradox.
I've also been critical of him, especially between the lugholes when shooting for goal. But I've seen him slot them from 55 no probs. About time someone taught him to use the karate principle when shooting for goal - ignore the goals and pick a person/target 55 metres from his boot behind the goals and just aim to kick it to that person / target. He should also practice that at training and make it a habit.
Until he gets his shooting for goal confidence he'll remain a 'just about' kind of player. As mentioned previously he has definitely improved his marking around the ground (which was already pretty darn good) and for a big bloke he is deceptively quick.
If the Oxford Dictionary had a definition of "Coach Killer", they would show a picture of Levi Casboult!
He is the guy that the opposition teams will happily let have the ball inside F50. He won't just fail to hurt them on the scoreboard, but he will also rip out his own teams heart in the process! It is called a momentum killer, and it just sucks the life out of a team!
There are only two solutions, get him on the wing, or get him in the goal square!
Gotta say I'm finding it hard to see any reason for the Casboult love.....I'm far from convinced he adds anything to this team.
Can take a mark around the ground, makes him a handy 2nd ruck in that respect at least, and takes alot of pressure off Waite and Henderson up forward. Think he just lacks a bit of confidence. A bit more of that, a slight improvement in ruck work, plus kicking better close to goal, could see him form a decent career at least. He started in the seniors with an ability to smash packs and put fear into the opposition, and still remember how he chased down Courtney Dempsey twice in one game. Want him to get back the confidence to do all that again.
The eagles normally get a lot from their rucks, using them as marking/link players around the ground to augment their midfield (which I reckon is suspect, but that's another issue). Warnock played a very good all-round ruckman's game, but around the ground Casboult at worse halved marking contests and prevented Cox and Nic Nat having their usual massive impact when they probably expected to exert dominance over the second (Casboult) ruck.
I thought Rowe did really well, his presence wasn't lost on Nic Nat around many forward contests.
Gotta say I'm finding it hard to see any reason for the Casboult love.....I'm far from convinced he adds anything to this team.
Can take a mark around the ground, makes him a handy 2nd ruck in that respect at least, and takes alot of pressure off Waite and Henderson up forward. Think he just lacks a bit of confidence. A bit more of that, a slight improvement in ruck work, plus kicking better close to goal, could see him form a decent career at least. He started in the seniors with an ability to smash packs and put fear into the opposition, and still remember how he chased down Courtney Dempsey twice in one game. Want him to get back the confidence to do all that again.
There has been a lot of love for Warnock. Some of his ruckwork was very good but he was worked over by Cox and Natanui. However, the worst part of Warnock's game was his failure to take a mark and that simply isn't good enough.
On the other hand, Casboult's marking was pretty damn good and he more than made up for Warnock's inability to get into a position where he could attempt to mark. Casboult also makes life a lot easier for Waite and Henderson. Of course, his kicking for goal is almost on a par with Warnock's and it must be demoralising for the team when he misses set shots from within 40 metres.
I think Casboult has to continue as back-up ruckman and third tall forward. Tuohy, Murphy, Simpson and Gibbs have to be prepared to run past for a handball if Casboult marks inside 50.
I might be missing something here, but, was there a marking contest he should have won?
Forgive me if this is incorrect, but I seem to recall that if your sole intent is to go out there and do something on the park, then you can probably achieve that goal to the detriment of your team. If Warnock were to go out, and aim to get 4 marks every week why would that make a difference to how well he played?
IMHO, whether you play well has little to do with whether or not you take a mark, or 5, kick a goal or 5, or whether or not you spoil 5 marks in the backline, win a few clearances, tackled 5 times etc, its how well you play your role for the team. That being said, achieve some of that stuff and you will help us go a long way to winning the match, but at the end of the day, Warnock played his role really well. So well that he was arguably the best ruckman on the ground on saturday night.
Whether he took a few marks in the process is frankly details. He kicked our first goal of the game, which is a step up in itself for him.
Now if next week he took 5 marks, wins a few more tap downs, but fails to help us win the game, what is the use in that?
Taking marks is part of a ruckman's job description Thry. They all do it, apart from ours and NicNat apparently.
It means you can kick to a contest and be confident that you'll retain possession or, at worst, force a stoppage. It also means that the opposition rucks don't have easy possessions, as Cox did. Most importantly, marking ruckmen provide an outlet and link plays. Sam Jacobs is a master at this.
McEvoy and Hale are probably the best pair of marking ruckmen going around and I suspect that their work is not insignificant in Hawthorn's success.
I might be missing something here, but, was there a marking contest he should have won?
He was beaten in a one on one contest by Jamie Bennell, Warnock had
2627cm on him!
Corrected, 27cm on him!
I might be missing something here, but, was there a marking contest he should have won?
He was beaten in a one on one contest by Jamie Bennell, Warnock had 26cm one him!
That was funny to watch. Not at the time, but laughed about it later. Just like us crossing the ball from the wing to the centre corridor to 2E and Murphy when Nic Nat was directly behind them.
That was funny to watch. Not at the time, but laughed about it later. Just like us crossing the ball from the wing to the centre corridor to 2E and Murphy when Nic Nat was directly behind them.
Yes funny as hell like;
- Garlett outmarking Cox
- Murphy smashing Nic Nat in the air! :D
Oh hang on, could I have been dreamin? :-[
Can you imagine if 206 took half the marks of Cox, that would mean Casboult could stay deep, maybe even in the square! Maybe 206 could even rest in the goal square!
Imagine how that would affect our opponents, at the moment they stand a rover on him when he rests forward and they win the contest!
FFS, what is he scared of, standing on them! ::)