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Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2821
Disagree, the media just like to paint it that way.

Ask yourself two questions, MBB. Had the Orange One won the election and the Democrats cried fraud, how vehemently would the Orange One have defended the very same voting processes? And... had the insurrectionists succeeded at taking control of the Senate, what would the Orange One have done?
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2822
I think that Bob Dylan has a lot to answer for ...

Come senators, congressmen
Please heed the call
Don't stand in the doorway
Don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt
Will be he who has stalled
The battle outside ragin'
Will soon shake your windows
And rattle your walls
For the times they are a-changin'
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2823
I think that Bob Dylan has a lot to answer for ...

Come senators, congressmen
Please heed the call
Don't stand in the doorway
Don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt
Will be he who has stalled
The battle outside ragin'
Will soon shake your windows
And rattle your walls
For the times they are a-changin'

Ban him for inciting violence.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2824
Don’t worry,  most people don’t listen to the words. Trump kept playing CCR’s Fortunate Son at rallies despite being exactly the sort of guy the song condemned.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2825
Ban him for inciting violence.

Unlike the POTUS, he is warning the senators and congressmen about impending violence.  He was also foreseeing a leftist movement rather than right wing insurrectionists - times they are a-changing indeed!
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2826
Unlike the POTUS, he is warning the senators and congressmen about impending violence.  He was also foreseeing a leftist movement rather than right wing insurrectionists - times they are a-changing indeed!

Interesting, thats the same sort of language that I see Trump banned from Twitter.

Inferred meaning seems to be the problem to me, but thats just what I see.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2827
Love it! Because of a Dylan song in the 60s, Trump should be allowed to use Twitter to mobilise his mob. That makes a lot of sense  :D

By the way, this is another great example of the right-wing victim strategy. They’re perfectly happy to condemn Kathy Griffen over her bloody head routine, First Amendment be damned. They clutched their pearls while complaining that this would endanger the life of the President. They managed to extract an apology but Kathy Griffen had to flee the country anyway. But when Trump incites violence which kills 5 people, they then say Kathy Griffen did it so Trump should be allowed his freedom of speech. Great logic there.

After all, cancel culture is only allowed when right-wingers are wielding it as a weapon. We’ve seen it over here regarding Abdul-Magied’s Anzac Day tweet. She must have laughed when she read stories about the investigations into cold-blooded murder by the SAS.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2828
Love it! Because of a Dylan song in the 60s, Trump should be allowed to use Twitter to mobilise his mob. That makes a lot of sense  :D

By the way, this is another great example of the right-wing victim strategy. They’re perfectly happy to condemn Kathy Griffen over her bloody head routine, First Amendment be damned. They clutched their pearls while complaining that this would endanger the life of the President. They managed to extract an apology but Kathy Griffen had to flee the country anyway. But when Trump incites violence which kills 5 people, they then say Kathy Griffen did it so Trump should be allowed his freedom of speech. Great logic there.

After all, cancel culture is only allowed when right-wingers are wielding it as a weapon. We’ve seen it over here regarding Abdul-Magied’s Anzac Day tweet. She must have laughed when she read stories about the investigations into cold-blooded murder by the SAS.

Like i said inferred meaning seems to be the problem.

Apply that thought process to your response to me, and see what answer you come up with.

Speaking of cancel culture, did you hear the movie Grease is in the firing line at the moment?

Why?  Too many hetero normative relationships, and slut shaming....
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2829
It’s terrible when cancel culture is employed by non-conservatives. Surely right-wingers could sue in court to protect their intellectual property: they must be able to argue they have an enforceable copyright or patent. Senator Joe McCarthy surely invented it. Ironically, he deployed it against suspected Russian sympathisers but if he were still around no doubt he would have gladly gone after anyone who wondered about Trump’s Russian connections.

As long as cancel culture is applied the right way, e.g. killing Colin Kaepernick’s career for having the temerity to kneel, then we can be happy that all is right with the world.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2830
#notmypresident

Who was the last us president beheaded and burnt by gen public even if it was just a doll?
That's what I'm asking for, examples so I can investigate the context!

If you give me a concrete example I've got something to base an opinion on.

I presume you're not talking Trump, because that was part of an organised media stunt by a professional comedian in response to Trump's supporters stringing up effigies of Obama, which is somewhat different to the protests and protestors we see now, egged on by Trump into bashing/assaulting public officials like electoral officers just because they do their job, some officials that may in fact be GOP voters!

It would be like claiming that Trump urging protestors to roll up to your health workplace to bash people issuing vaccines had some democratic equivalent!
The Force Awakens!

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2831
Interesting, thats the same sort of language that I see Trump banned from Twitter.

Inferred meaning seems to be the problem to me, but thats just what I see.

Very different language in Dylan’s protest song to what was said by the POTUS and his henchmen directly to crowd to incite insurrectionist.

Rudy Giuliani:  “Let’s have trial by combat.”

Eric T-rump: “Have some backbone. Show some fight. Learn from [the POTUS] and we need to march on the Capitol today.”

After urging supporters to attend with “Be there. Will be wild!”, the POTUS’s remarks included:

“Republicans are constantly fighting like a boxer with his hands tied behind his back. It’s like a boxer. And we want to be so nice. We want to be so respectful of everybody, including bad people. And we’re going to have to fight much harder. …

“We’re going to walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them, because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength, and you have to be strong.”

“When you catch somebody in a fraud, you are allowed to go by very different rules.”

“We will never give up. We will never concede. It doesn’t happen. You don’t concede when there’s theft involved. Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore, and that is what this is all about. And to use a favorite term that all of you people really came up with, we will stop the steal. …

You will have an illegitimate president. That is what you will have, and we can’t let that happen. These are the facts that you won’t hear from the fake news media. It’s all part of the suppression effort. They don’t want to talk about it. They don’t want to talk about it. …

We fight like hell, and if you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore.”

“Now it is up to Congress to confront this egregious assault on our democracy. And after this, we’re going to walk down, and I’ll be there with you. … We are going to the Capitol, and we are going to try and give — the Democrats are hopeless, they are never voting for anything, not even one vote, but we are going to try — give our Republicans, the weak ones, because the strong ones don’t need any of our help, we’re try — going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country.”

During the occupation of Congress, the POTUS tweeted:

“These are the things and events that happen when a sacred landslide election victory is so unceremoniously & viciously stripped away from great patriots who have been badly & unfairly treated for so long. Go home with love & in peace. Remember this day forever!"

Twitter removed the POTUS’s video because:

“This is an emergency situation and we are taking appropriate emergency measures, including removing President Trump's video. We removed it because on balance we believe it contributes to rather than diminishes the risk of ongoing violence.“

An appropriate response in my opinion.

It will be interesting to see how the impeachment for inciting insurrection and the prosecutions being prepared for similar offences proceed.  That should sort out what was inferred and what was meant.

“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2832
Interesting, thats the same sort of language that I see Trump banned from Twitter.
It's not a sudden event, this has been building for years, and many many people have been warning about this but too many powerful voices in powerful positions chose profit and political leverage over risk.

The only reason they rally against Trump's ban is that they fear the same, they want to reserve the right to incite!
The Force Awakens!

 

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2833
Very different language in Dylan’s protest song to what was said by the POTUS and his henchmen directly to crowd to incite insurrectionist.

Rudy Giuliani:  “Let’s have trial by combat.”

Eric T-rump: “Have some backbone. Show some fight. Learn from [the POTUS] and we need to march on the Capitol today.”

After urging supporters to attend with “Be there. Will be wild!”, the POTUS’s remarks included:

“Republicans are constantly fighting like a boxer with his hands tied behind his back. It’s like a boxer. And we want to be so nice. We want to be so respectful of everybody, including bad people. And we’re going to have to fight much harder. …

“We’re going to walk down to the Capitol, and we’re going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we’re probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them, because you’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength, and you have to be strong.”

“When you catch somebody in a fraud, you are allowed to go by very different rules.”

“We will never give up. We will never concede. It doesn’t happen. You don’t concede when there’s theft involved. Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore, and that is what this is all about. And to use a favorite term that all of you people really came up with, we will stop the steal. …

You will have an illegitimate president. That is what you will have, and we can’t let that happen. These are the facts that you won’t hear from the fake news media. It’s all part of the suppression effort. They don’t want to talk about it. They don’t want to talk about it. …

We fight like hell, and if you don’t fight like hell, you’re not going to have a country anymore.”

“Now it is up to Congress to confront this egregious assault on our democracy. And after this, we’re going to walk down, and I’ll be there with you. … We are going to the Capitol, and we are going to try and give — the Democrats are hopeless, they are never voting for anything, not even one vote, but we are going to try — give our Republicans, the weak ones, because the strong ones don’t need any of our help, we’re try — going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country.”

During the occupation of Congress, the POTUS tweeted:

“These are the things and events that happen when a sacred landslide election victory is so unceremoniously & viciously stripped away from great patriots who have been badly & unfairly treated for so long. Go home with love & in peace. Remember this day forever!"

Twitter removed the POTUS’s video because:

“This is an emergency situation and we are taking appropriate emergency measures, including removing President Trump's video. We removed it because on balance we believe it contributes to rather than diminishes the risk of ongoing violence.“

An appropriate response in my opinion.

It will be interesting to see how the impeachment for inciting insurrection and the prosecutions being prepared for similar offences proceed.  That should sort out what was inferred and what was meant.



Again, the inferred meaning of fight in these contexts means violence and also profiles the standard Trump supporter, who it sounds like you think would raise fists at each and every opportunity just with the words written.

In actuality, the comments can mean varying different things, and the inference here is that Trump is inferring violence.


For the most part, I find myself restating my position here.  I am ambivalent, I really don't see the difference between praising one, and condemning the other.  Either you do both, or you do neither.  I see the commentary, and I hear the propaganda, and I laugh at the juxtaposition that people hold when commenating about all these things.  Trump should have conceded fair and square, he hasnt, and for the most part, I support his right to question whether or not the outcome was fair and ask for recount etc.  I would state the same for any other person in the same position because I am detached from the person.  Likewise, Twitter, Facebook etc.  If someone writes something on these social media platforms, they shouldnt be silenced.  That is not the society I want to live in.  An enlightened mind will entertain an idea without accepting it.


BLM had a bunch of people fighting for their rights to protest, fighting for their rights to be heard and stand up for their human rights.  Some did so violently, others did so peacefully, but all had the same goal.  They were simply fighting for their rights, no?

I hear varying degrees of the same sort of vitriol coming from people saying "its different this time" as I always do, which is the irony and hypocrisy I am pointing to.

I bet you, that the majority of respondents here are painting me as a Trump supporter.  I am not.  I don't really care, I choose my position to keep the bastards honest, as per a previous Aussie PM. 


"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2834
I bet you, that the majority of respondents here are painting me as a Trump supporter.  I am not.  I don't really care, I choose my position to keep the bastards honest, as per a previous Aussie PM. 
I'm not sure that is correct, if they are like myself they just do not see the equivalence in behaviour that you see, that is why I've asked for examples.
The Force Awakens!