Skip to main content

Poll

At the 2022 Federal Election which party will receive your first preference?

LNP
[ 7 ] (26.9%)
ALP
[ 8 ] (30.8%)
Greens
[ 2 ] (7.7%)
One Nation
[ 0 ] (0%)
United Australia Party
[ 3 ] (11.5%)
Other
[ 2 ] (7.7%)
None of the Above
[ 4 ] (15.4%)

Total Members Voted: 26

Topic: Election 2022 (Poll added) (Read 7326 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #405
It seems strawman enthusiasts are never so happy as when they make up promises they claim have been broken. Even before the election, the claim was made on this site that Albo had promised to increase minimum wages by 5% even though no such promise was made. As has been stressed by reasonable observers, only the FWC has the power to do that. Now we have a false assertion that Albo promised to stop live exports within this parliamentary term. That’s just not true. Shorten promised to end live exports within 5 years (note, there was no promise to end it before the following election if he won) while Albo wouldn’t commit to any timeframe. But why let facts get in the way? Let’s just assert that Albo promised to do it more quickly than Shorten …

For the record, this is a report published by the ABC on 5 May, a fortnight before the election:
Labor confirms plan to end live sheep exports if Albanese becomes PM

In other words, the animal rights activists were under no delusion that the ALP had promised to ban the trade in its first term. In fact they were well aware no such promise was being given.
https://www.crikey.com.au/2022/05/05/labor-pledges-to-end-live-sheep-exports/
They gave the impression they were going to end live sheep exports and continue with their proposed policy from the last election, thats how I read it....looks like they rolled over to Mark McGowan who is running his own country in Western Australia and thinks a few vet checks is enough money spent and that mincing sheep live on a freighter or processing them for travel in WA isnt a big deal but farmers votes are.....Barnaby Joyce as Minister of Agriculture was a supporter of live export so I'm glad he got the ar$e too as Nationals leader..

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #406
Did you think this bit in the statement & the refusal to commit to timelines suggested Labor was hellbent on a ban?
Quote
"An elected Albanese Labor government will phase out live sheep exports in consultation with the industry and the West Australian government on what needs to happen given this decline," the statement said.

Phasing out doesn’t scream a shuddering halt to me and the consultation with the WA Govt and the industry makes it plain Labor was watering down what Shorten promised. Even the animal rights activists saw the writing on the wall.

Not that I’m elated by this position. I’d prefer a ban this term. But Labor was burnt by promises Shorten made and like it or not the lesson of electoral disasters is that you have to give up policies that hurt you. An example is the promise Shorten made to ditch negative gearing. That was a good policy but the electorate made it clear that was not on. There were too many exploiting that lurk or who were aspirationals who imagined they would exploit it on the way to becoming billionaires.

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #407
Did you think this bit in the statement & the refusal to commit to timelines suggested Labor was hellbent on a ban?
Phasing out doesn’t scream a shuddering halt to me and the consultation with the WA Govt and the industry makes it plain Labor was watering down what Shorten promised. Even the animal rights activists saw the writing on the wall.

Not that I’m elated by this position. I’d prefer a ban this term. But Labor was burnt by promises Shorten made and like it or not the lesson of electoral disasters is that you have to give up policies that hurt you. An example is the promise Shorten made to ditch negative gearing. That was a good policy but the electorate made it clear that was not on. There were too many exploiting that lurk or who were aspirationals who imagined they would exploit it on the way to becoming billionaires.

No that's political speak for im going to take action after consultation if the industry agrees but if they disagree im going to do SFA about it.

You're coming across as very defensive of the Labor government Mav.  Don't take it so personally.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #408
No that's political speak for im going to take action after consultation if the industry agrees but if they disagree im going to do SFA about it.
Isn’t that what I said?

Rather than being defensive, I’m on the offensive against outright lies being spread by Murdoch and his ilk. Sky News and the Daily Mail were the ones pushing this nonsense. If those outlets claimed it’s currently winter in Australia, I’d do my homework before accepting it.

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #409
Did you think this bit in the statement & the refusal to commit to timelines suggested Labor was hellbent on a ban?
Phasing out doesn’t scream a shuddering halt to me and the consultation with the WA Govt and the industry makes it plain Labor was watering down what Shorten promised. Even the animal rights activists saw the writing on the wall.

Not that I’m elated by this position. I’d prefer a ban this term. But Labor was burnt by promises Shorten made and like it or not the lesson of electoral disasters is that you have to give up policies that hurt you. An example is the promise Shorten made to ditch negative gearing. That was a good policy but the electorate made it clear that was not on. There were too many exploiting that lurk or who were aspirationals who imagined they would exploit it on the way to becoming billionaires.
I take Phasing out as a Yes and it will go through parliament as legislation, I take not in the term of this Government as a No and we might think about it if you elect us again.
I believe Libs 2IC Susan Ley would have supported the proposal as she was keen to support the idea a while back.
Happy to concede I am a meat eater but I wont eat meat that comes from known inhumane treatment sources or where baby animals eg Lambs, Veal or young Pigs are slaughtered. The thought of sheep being thrown into live mincers or some asian slaughterhouse beating cattle heads in with Sledgehammers makes me want to do same to the perpetrators so for me I'd like to see some bipartisan agreement reached where proper standards both here and for export are adopted.
As I said I enjoy my rib eye/scotch fillet and a parma but I want my Aus animals treated properly in the process...

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #410
Isn’t that what I said?

Rather than being defensive, I’m on the offensive against outright lies being spread by Murdoch and his ilk. Sky News and the Daily Mail were the ones pushing this nonsense. If those outlets claimed it’s currently winter in Australia, I’d do my homework before accepting it.

Defensive.


All politicians are liars, and all of them break election promises probably because they don't understand the full impact of those decisions until they see the wider impact those policies effect.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #411
Not defensive. Now you’re being offensive.

You’ve conceded that the statement released before the election pretty much gave the WA Govt and the industry the ability to block action in this parliamentary term and yet you imply that Labor promised a ban in this term and broke that promise. Which is it?

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #412
Not defensive. Now you’re being offensive.

You’ve conceded that the statement released before the election pretty much gave the WA Govt and the industry the ability to block action in this parliamentary term and yet you imply that Labor promised a ban in this term and broke that promise. Which is it?

Have a rest Mav.  Ive actually criticised no one but you.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #413
Yep, I realised you were criticising no one but me. And in a thread about politicians, that’s quite something.

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #414
I take Phasing out as a Yes and it will go through parliament as legislation, I take not in the term of this Government as a No and we might think about it if you elect us again.
I believe Libs 2IC Susan Ley would have supported the proposal as she was keen to support the idea a while back.
Happy to concede I am a meat eater but I wont eat meat that comes from known inhumane treatment sources or where baby animals eg Lambs, Veal or young Pigs are slaughtered. The thought of sheep being thrown into live mincers or some asian slaughterhouse beating cattle heads in with Sledgehammers makes me want to do same to the perpetrators so for me I'd like to see some bipartisan agreement reached where proper standards both here and for export are adopted.
As I said I enjoy my rib eye/scotch fillet and a parma but I want my Aus animals treated properly in the process...

Well said, EB1. Same page.

I feel very fortunate to live in an area (Gippsland) where I can go to the local butcher and get locally grown grass fed rib eye and scotch fillet, but very importantly... I know the beasts have been raised well and their demise is without suffering or inhuman treatment. Likewise, I wouldn't touch any meat knowing that the beast was ill-treated. I hope it is a 'quick' phase out.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #415
Defensive.


All politicians are liars, and all of them break election promises probably because they don't understand the full impact of those decisions until they see the wider impact those policies effect.

No they're not, 3 Leos. A sweeping generalisation there old son.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #416
No they're not, 3 Leos. A sweeping generalisation there old son.

Sorry Baggers, you are correct.  Politicians don't lie, they make qualifying statements and never speak a categorical truth to be caught acting contradictory later.  They just move the goalposts and cover their arse with "that was true based on the information I had at the time", and then hide behind "can't recall" later.

😃

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #417
Over promise and under deliver is standard business for parties/politicians.
There is an old saying that Truth comes at a price, Lies are cheap...

 

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #418
One of the paradoxes of politics is that, while folks prefer the party they favour to be in power, they find it less enjoyable as casual watchers.
It's much more fun to watch the party you dislike 'under the pump'.
It can be uncomfortable to watch the party you support under similar pressure.

The party in power is often in defensive mode as decisions it makes, or promises not kept, alienate increasing sections of the community.
Parties do get a honeymoon early on, and that's when they need to go hard with the tough decisions.
Hopefully by the time the next election comes around they're in a position to hand out a few sweeteners.

Re: Election 2022 (Poll added)

Reply #419
Gotta say I don’t have a problem with qualifying statements. The more detail the better. The categorical statement is usually the sign of dishonesty and is watered down after the event by qualifications that weren’t made clear before an election.

The same issue arises with assessing the veracity of witnesses. The bombastic witness who states everything with certainty tends to impress the audience when compared to witnesses who try to be as candid as they can be about what they can’t be sure about.

Confusing bombast for honesty and competence is what made Trump possible. Unfortunately, our election campaigns aren’t geared towards drawing out the detail or the qualifications that should be provided. It’s much more important to see our candidates kicking a footy or eating a hot dog.