Sunday 7th August at the MCG at 1310 in the afternoon. This game should be the return of Marc Murphy. However, that will depend on his ankle, which has not been standard fare.
We probably NEED Murphy. St Kilda killed us at Etihad in the midfield where their ruck dominance (something not expected) gave their pacy mids the opportunity to really hurt us. Getting the ball out of the centre as easily as they did lead to our defence being under pressure and not being able to set up. As a result Membury kicked enough goals to bury us.
Now our ruck stocks will probably be stronger than at Etihad and the 'Aints will not be advantaged by their favourite surface, but we have to show that we have learnt from that debacle.
Another Hawthorn win and I'm frustrated. We do not have much idea how to kick goals.
Can we find something against the 'Aints? Well, if this game is an 'honourable loss' I'm going to be honourably upset.
Another Hawthorn win and I'm frustrated. We do not have much idea how to kick goals.
Can we find something against the 'Aints? Well, if this game is an 'honourable loss' I'm going to be honourably upset.
Hopefully we won't let them run free and unimpeded like we did last time.
Another Hawthorn win and I'm frustrated. We do not have much idea how to kick goals.
Can we find something against the 'Aints? Well, if this game is an 'honourable loss' I'm going to be honourably upset.
I say it every week, pick a 2nd key forward as it spreads the defence and opens up the 50 for our runners. No coincidence we started winning right at that point of picking a 2nd one. A similar structure as when we were winning and kicking goals, not when we were losing and struggling to hit the scoreboard would be more than useful. As much as I like Phillips, he'll be a player, we functioned alot better when he was injured as our structure was much better.
We need more creativity and precision going into our F50 and we need to take our chances when we do create them. Levi has lost me I'm afraid.
We all look for the answers to our goal famine , but it's a skill set, which our current crop of players don't have. It's instinctive skill to turn a half chance into a score . It's not a teachable thing , it's in bred , so if our current players don't have it , need different players. No point running out the same players Into the paddock, you will get the same result. No scores on a regular basis.
Our loss to this mob was close to our worst effort this season. Kerridge may be a better match for Stevens than Ed and Kreuzer/Phillips need to negate Hickey.
McEvoy always seems to hurt us on the scoreboard which irks me no end, can't let a similar trend develop vs the likes of Hickey because we are going to play this mob a lot in the future.
We all look for the answers to our goal famine , but it's a skill set, which our current crop of players don't have. It's instinctive skill to turn a half chance into a score . It's not a teachable thing , it's in bred , so if our current players don't have it , need different players. No point running out the same players Into the paddock, you will get the same result. No scores on a regular basis.
we've probably reached close to the full potential of our current list. We need to bring in some higher skilled talent next year, there's not a lot in the NBs from all accounts.
we've probably reached close to the full potential of our current list.
::)
we've probably reached close to the full potential of our current list. We need to bring in some higher skilled talent next year, there's not a lot in the NBs from all accounts.
I reckon there's heaps of potential in our list but possibly not in the one area that's crying out for improvement; midfielders and defenders who can deliver the ball to the forwards. Of course, we have Murphy to come back and David Cuningham could be OK if he can get fit and do a full pre-season. Billy Gowers is another who has shown a bit.
Four or five midfielders/small forwards who are upgrades on Lamb, Sumner, Graham, Whiley, Buckley, etc and we'd match it with most sides.
I reckon there's heaps of potential in our list but possibly not in the one area that's crying out for improvement; midfielders and defenders who can deliver the ball to the forwards. Of course, we have Murphy to come back and David Cuningham could be OK if he can get fit and do a full pre-season. Billy Gowers is another who has shown a bit.
Four or five midfielders/small forwards who are upgrades on Lamb, Sumner, Graham, Whiley, Buckley, etc and we'd match it with most sides.
I was referring to the list as a whole DJC. There are no doubt some talented players and some individuals who will no doubt improve further. However, taken as a whole I do not think it is capable of becoming premiership material, by a long way, without the injection of some serious talent particularly in the area you have mentioned, plus a good KPF. We have seen now two or three performances that have shown we are really pushing the envelope of our team's ability, for which they all should be applauded, but.....enter SOS.
I was referring to the list as a whole DJC. There are no doubt some talented players and some individuals who will no doubt improve further. However, taken as a whole I do not think it is capable of becoming premiership material, by a long way, without the injection of some serious talent particularly in the area you have mentioned, plus a good KPF. We have seen now two or three performances that have shown we are really pushing the envelope of our team's ability, for which they all should be applauded, but.....enter SOS.
I don't agree Cookie. Even with our obvious deficiencies we have been competitive against top 4 teams, our disposal efficiency has skyrocketed and were executing the coach's plans pretty well. As Trigg's email says;
. . . there are metrics that indicate strong effort and a game style/method that will put us in good shape for the future, as well as measurable evidence of learning.
Informed drafting and some judicious trades to bolster the midfield and add depth and we'll be flying :)
PS I'd like to know what the "metrics" are ???
I don't agree Cookie. Even with our obvious deficiencies we have been competitive against top 4 teams, our disposal efficiency has skyrocketed and were executing the coach's plans pretty well. As Trigg's email says;
Informed drafting and some judicious trades to bolster the midfield and add depth and we'll be flying :)
PS I'd like to know what the "metrics" are ???
I think that's what I was saying? ??? We won't be flying anywhere unless we do that. Being competitive with but heroically losing to a top side and beating that top side are a long way apart IMO, especially a team like the Hawks. We won't become ultimately successful until we fix our major deficiencies otherwise we'll end up in the same old place of relying too much on too few.
I think that's what I was saying? ??? We won't be flying anywhere unless we do that. Being competitive with but heroically losing to a top side and beating that top side are a long way apart IMO, especially a team like the Hawks. We won't become ultimately successful until we fix our major deficiencies otherwise we'll end up in the same old place of relying too much on too few.
I don't think our list is all that bad, and it's certainly not the worst in the comp as some pundits proclaimed. It's also very "coachable" (if that's a word) and Bolton will be very keen to keep it that way. I am not expecting wholesale changes, but I am expecting a focus on improving our midfield stocks.
Need the midfield up grades no doubt , but when they get the ball, who do you kick it to? let's each nominate 2 players who we class as forwards on out current list , that you would want to pass to in the 50 say 35-40 metres out with pressure on
My vote Everitt & a distant second Walker ?
Need the midfield up grades no doubt , but when they get the ball, who do you kick it to? let's each nominate 2 players who we class as forwards on out current list , that you would want to pass to in the 50 say 35-40 metres out with pressure on
My vote Everitt & a distant second Walker ?
Agree - our F50 efforts are weak. Levi doesn't currently look like the answer as a KPF despite his much vaunted marking skills and we don't have any classy small forwards atm.
Need the midfield up grades no doubt , but when they get the ball, who do you kick it to? let's each nominate 2 players who we class as forwards on out current list , that you would want to pass to in the 50 say 35-40 metres out with pressure on
My vote Everitt & a distant second Walker ?
Everitt and Wright.
Need the midfield up grades no doubt , but when they get the ball, who do you kick it to? let's each nominate 2 players who we class as forwards on out current list , that you would want to pass to in the 50 say 35-40 metres out with pressure on
My vote Everitt & a distant second Walker ?
Casboult, if on two legs, and Charlie Curnow with Wright not far off.
Curnow Silvagni and Mckay are all first year forwards with talent. Patience grasshoppers.
Everitt and Wright.
And Sumner yesterday went back a slotted a nice one under pressure tucked on the boundary line. And the pressure was from his team mates as he failed to give it off or centre it when he had an option and time. He went back and duly slotted it. I think he and Lamb have been reasonably good in front of goal.
And Sumner yesterday went back a slotted a nice one under pressure tucked on the boundary line. And the pressure was from his team mates as he failed to give it off or centre it when he had an option and time. He went back and duly slotted it. I think he and Lamb have been reasonably good in front of goal.
mate, we need to graduate from reasonably good to bloody good!
mate, we need to graduate from reasonably good to bloody good!
Yeah mate, 100% agree. But whens the last time we saw a bloke wearing a navy CFC jumper go back and slot one from that angle? Everitt has a few times maybe, the last one I can think of Eddie and before that Fevalenko. We have been deplorable in front of goal, it has cost us many many games. In Sumner and Lamb, I have seen a step in the right direction. SOS looks like he can kick straight. When JW went fwd a couple of weeks ago, he kicked nicely for goal also.
Yeah mate, 100% agree. But whens the last time we saw a bloke wearing a navy CFC jumper go back and slot one from that angle? Everitt has a few times maybe, the last one I can think of Eddie and before that Fevalenko. We have been deplorable in front of goal, it has cost us many many games. In Sumner and Lamb, I have seen a step in the right direction. SOS looks like he can kick straight. When JW went fwd a couple of weeks ago, he kicked nicely for goal also.
Agreed, our goal kicking, in general, has been unacceptable for way too long....
mate, we need to graduate from reasonably good to bloody good!
Well said, Fluffy One. It's almost as if we've been so poor over the past 15 years that when we're 'reasonably good' we jump for joy. Bottom line is that we're fourth from the bottom and generally quite poor but showing definite signs of improvement... which must continue and escalate. Put another way, although there are very real signs of improvement in every area of the club the reality is that we're still sh1te but not as sh1te. Put another way again, I think that BB and the coaching group are getting the very best out of our personnel... any lesser coaching group and we would be bottom or second bottom... but we're still sh1te but not as sh1te.
Well said, Fluffy One. It's almost as if we've been so poor over the past 15 years that when we're 'reasonably good' we jump for joy. Bottom line is that we're fourth from the bottom and generally quite poor but showing definite signs of improvement... which must continue and escalate. Put another way, although there are very real signs of improvement in every area of the club the reality is that we're still sh1te but not as sh1te. Put another way again, I think that BB and the coaching group are getting the very best out of our personnel... any lesser coaching group and we would be bottom or second bottom... but we're still sh1te but not as sh1te.
i disagree. Whether it's Bolton, the players making a collective decision to try, the injection of new players or whatever, a few things seem clear:
1. our best is better than in recent years eg the win over the Cats without Murphy
2. Our worst is considerably better than our worst in recent years
3. Less of our troops drop their bundles when the heat is on
4. it appears, touch wood, we are starting to be able to stem those run ons that teams have which used to bury us eg against the Swans and the Hawks in the 3rd terms - we kept in touch.....
5. The average gap between our best and worst seems to be shrinking - though granted much room for improvement.
2017 - key goals
1.Trading for two established mids with established skill at senior AFL level (not O'Meara or Prestia); one, at least, a big body;
2. Some smart draft picks and trading as per 2016 Draft - you'd assume Tomlinson is a done deal, for example. I'd like Stewart too (son of....)
3. Plenty of gym time for the younger blokes - Charlie, SOJ, Harry......
4. Kicking practice galore for the likes of Levi, Kerridge....
4. Kicking practice galore for the likes of Levi, Kerridge....
Levi will never be able to kick straight, his technique is too poor.
As of now he's as good as anything we've got in the VFL, which isn't saying much, but we need to find something much better if we want to be a flag contender.
Kerridge has an OK technique but might be another Jordan Russell, who also had a good technique but sprayed it all over the place under pressure.
3. Plenty of gym time for the younger blokes - Charlie, SOJ, Harry......
4. Kicking practice galore for the likes of Levi, Kerridge....
I think our culture and future is such that many players will be prepared to work in their own time on their deficiencies (as Cripps did last year with a running coach) in order to improve. I don't believe that this sort of attitude was part of the group in the past. You could really see someone like White who is now 'in the fold' being ultra keen to go to the next level along with our young blokes as well.
Never underestimate the influence of a positive, supportive culture!!
i know we are improving but with our currant list we are bottom 4 team.
Levi will never be able to kick straight, his technique is too poor.
As of now he's as good as anything we've got in the VFL, which isn't saying much, but we need to find something much better if we want to be a flag contender.
Kerridge has an OK technique but might be another Jordan Russell, who also had a good technique but sprayed it all over the place under pressure.
Levi will hold the fort until McKay and Curnow are ready. He'll be the big body to take the heat. Imagine McKay will plays games next year so he'll need Levi with him fr a year or so. After that Levi will have essentially served his purpose, which he has done admirably given his ability.
Kerridge will be good for us but his kicking is a little wayward. His disposal, as might his ability, might remind me more of Carrazzo over time more than Russell. Probably not quite as good as Carrots was a gun but you get my gist.
i know we are improving but with our currant list we are bottom 4 team.
Tend to agree and I posted similar sentiments a couple of days ago. We probably have a bit of marginal improvement left as a team but until we get in more significant talent we will not really progress to being a serious flag candidate. BB will be painfully aware of this and IMO he's focused this year on getting our defence right, ingraining the principles of our game plan and establishing the necessary club culture and attitudes. I'm looking forward to seeing who we recruit for next year and maybe we can start our move up the ladder as a result?
And Sumner yesterday went back a slotted a nice one under pressure tucked on the boundary line. And the pressure was from his team mates as he failed to give it off or centre it when he had an option and time. He went back and duly slotted it. I think he and Lamb have been reasonably good in front of goal.
Similar angle to Kreuzer's goal . . . and the one he missed. I'm not sure what he was thinking with that first attempt ???
u know when we go the long bomb into f50 CAN we please have our smalls front and centre to either kick goals or pressure the saints defenders .We need to stop there running game which begins from our fwd turnovers.
u know when we go the long bomb into f50 CAN we please have our smalls front and centre to either kick goals or pressure the saints defenders .We need to stop there running game which begins from our fwd turnovers.
Second that motion. Seen nothing but grass and oppo players when ball hits ground off our forward marking packs. Just another forward line defficiency that's yet to be rectified but it really should be an easy one.
Similar angle to Kreuzer's goal . . . and the one he missed. I'm not sure what he was thinking with that first attempt ???
Sorry if this is well out of context.
But if I was playing for Carlton, and surrounded by the current forward list as the only options to hit up within range of goal, I think I'd prefer to take set shots from +60m out and I'd still give myself a better chance than half our current lot.
(Except Weitering who can actually kick them from +65m if he is unleashed within goal range. Weitering on a good day up forward is as good as Taylor Walker.)
i disagree. Whether it's Bolton, the players making a collective decision to try, the injection of new players or whatever, a few things seem clear:
1. our best is better than in recent years eg the win over the Cats without Murphy
2. Our worst is considerably better than our worst in recent years
3. Less of our troops drop their bundles when the heat is on
4. it appears, touch wood, we are starting to be able to stem those run ons that teams have which used to bury us eg against the Swans and the Hawks in the 3rd terms - we kept in touch.....
5. The average gap between our best and worst seems to be shrinking - though granted much room for improvement.
2017 - key goals
1.Trading for two established mids with established skill at senior AFL level (not O'Meara or Prestia); one, at least, a big body;
2. Some smart draft picks and trading as per 2016 Draft - you'd assume Tomlinson is a done deal, for example. I'd like Stewart too (son of....)
3. Plenty of gym time for the younger blokes - Charlie, SOJ, Harry......
4. Kicking practice galore for the likes of Levi, Kerridge....
Tomlinson and Marchbank from GWS would be a good start. Add James Stewart to that too.
As far as good mids go - look to Jack Steele from the Giants and some Crows mids.
The Crows mids in order of preference for me are Brad and Matt Crouch (Matt contracted next year), Mitch Grigg, Cam Ellis-Yolmen and to a lesser extent Harrison Wigg.
Grigg and Ellis-Yolmen we'd get much cheaper than the likes of Tom Mitchell, Prestia, O'Meara and the like. Even Brad Crouch but IMO he's very gettable and still wouldn't cost the earth. Jack Steele is gettable as far as trade goes IMO and $$ wise.
Steele and Brad Crouch/Grigg added to Cripps, Murphy, Gibbs, Ed Curnow, Kerridge, Wright, Cuningham and some draftees, hopefully some early picks to secure two gun young mids.
Depends on who's going out, what trade bait we use, how much we get for them, how many draft picks we want/get, etc.
Grigg a left footer too!
Tomlinson and Marchbank from GWS would be a good start. Add James Stewart to that too.
As far as good mids go - look to Jack Steele from the Giants and some Crows mids.
The Crows mids in order of preference for me are Brad and Matt Crouch (Matt contracted next year), Mitch Grigg, Cam Ellis-Yolmen and to a lesser extent Harrison Wigg.
Grigg and Ellis-Yolmen we'd get much cheaper than the likes of Tom Mitchell, Prestia, O'Meara and the like. Even Brad Crouch but IMO he's very gettable and still wouldn't cost the earth. Jack Steele is gettable as far as trade goes IMO and $$ wise.
Steele and Brad Crouch/Grigg added to Cripps, Murphy, Gibbs, Ed Curnow, Kerridge, Wright, Cuningham and some draftees, hopefully some early picks to secure two gun young mids.
Depends on who's going out, what trade bait we use, how much we get for them, how many draft picks we want/get, etc.
Agree on all of that....one Crouch Brother will probably mean the other either now or later.....
Jack Steele will probably come at some cost as other teams are keen especially Stkilda so I would view him as a separate deal to say Tomlinson, Marchbank/Stewart who you
might be able to package up either as 2or 3 player deal.
I like Mitch Grigg out of the cheaper options...nice kicking left footer who would help our delivery up forward.....Curnow and Kerridge are great workhorses but we need an onballer who can give
us some Pendlebury/Burgoyne like silky disposal.....Ellis Yolmen is more your bigger Blue Collar mid and would be my backup if any deal for Steele fell through.
We need more depth with our midfield and I remain unconvinced about Graham, Boekhorst and Buckley...
Agree on all of that....one Crouch Brother will probably mean the other either now or later.....
Jack Steele will probably come at some cost as other teams are keen especially Stkilda so I would view him as a separate deal to say Tomlinson, Marchbank/Stewart who you
might be able to package up either as 2or 3 player deal.
I like Mitch Grigg out of the cheaper options...nice kicking left footer who would help our delivery up forward.....Curnow and Kerridge are great workhorses but we need an onballer who can give
us some Pendlebury/Burgoyne like silky disposal.....Ellis Yolmen is more your bigger Blue Collar mid and would be my backup if any deal for Steele fell through.
We need more depth with our midfield and I remain unconvinced about Graham, Boekhorst and Buckley...
Yep I agree with you re Graham, Boekhorst and Buckley.
Grigg as a cheaper option would be good. Nice left foot kick and can win the ball. Good size too. Not a stick.
Steele would be my first option also, then Ellis-Yolmen. Probably prefer not both.
Is George Horlin-Smith worth a crack? Don't mind him. Hard to get a gig ahead of Danger and the skipper.
Horlin-Smith is solid without being a world beater, may lack a yard of pace.
smart trading is keep our 1st pick and then land a cheapie like grigg,steele,crouch,ellis-y as already mentioned need to stay away from the big names at this stage.
Looks as though Murphy will not be available this week. Maybe next week.
Walker will come in. Who goes out?
I'm not keen on trading in second stringers no matter how cheap they are, we've tried it over the last few seasons and haven't landed anyone who stands out as a Premiership player.
Kerridge, Boekhorst and Wright go OK but aren't class players by any stretch, Whiley and Tutt are VFL players, Graham was pick 54 so nothing wasted really.
As hard as it seems our only realistic road to success lies at the draft, we got Cripps at 13 so it's not impossible to get hold of another two high quality kids over the next two or three years.
Pick 4 or 5 this season should give us a good one.
The only other option is a Dangerfield like deal but they come at a big cost and it wouldn't be easy convincing someone like him to come to Carlton.
How did this become a trading thread?
Never mind: it is Thursday afternoon and the teams will come out in the next 90 minutes or so.
[1] I would give Weitering a rest. He was injured last week. I am not sure it is worth running him into the ground.
[2] Murphy is unlikely to play until next week. That means out mids have to play like they did last week. Not impossible.
[3] Our rucks need to be MUCH better than last time. Last time a hack and a 1st gamer shamed our rucks and gave St Kilda the midfield dominance they needed to win the game. We cannot afford that again.
[4] Walker is coming in for the last game. Who goes out for him?
[5] Casboult has been ordinary of late and not having much of an impact. If we bring in Jones or Jaksch to help out, as both have been reasonable lately, who goes out?
[6] Small forward role: do we play Jack there? he is about the only guy we have who actually reads the pack and can kick a crumbing goal, even though he is primarily a marking forward. Do we bring Lamb back in? Personally I wouldn't do it. Not until he plays a 4 quarter game or 2 at VFL level.
Walker, Thomas, Whiley into 25.
Interchange from: 23. Jacob Weitering 39. Dale Thomas 1. Andrew Walker 32. Nick Graham 19. Liam Sumner 24. Mark Whiley 33. Andrejs Everitt
Two rucks and just one key forward again. Our usual match losing, non-scoring structure. Zero from 10 with that one. Tough gig for Casboult those circumstances.
Walker, Thomas, Whiley into 25.
Interchange from: 23. Jacob Weitering 39. Dale Thomas 1. Andrew Walker 32. Nick Graham 19. Liam Sumner 24. Mark Whiley 33. Andrejs Everitt
Two rucks and just one key forward again. Our usual match losing, non-scoring structure. Zero from 10 with that one. Tough gig for Casboult those circumstances.
Who knows, maybe Weits will get a full game up forward.
Carlton
B: Simon White, Lachie Plowman, Sam Rowe.
HB: Zach Tuohy, Sam Docherty, Kade Simpson.
C: Blaine Boekhorst, Patrick Cripps, Ed Curnow.
HF: Dennis Armfield, Matthew Kreuzer, Matthew Wright.
F: Dylan Buckley, Levi Casboult, Jack Silvagni.
Foll: Andrew Phillips, Bryce Gibbs, Sam Kerridge.
Int: Jacob Weitering, Dale Thomas, Andrew Walker, Nick Graham, Liam Sumner, Mark Whiley, Andrejs Everitt.
In: Dale Thomas, Andrew Walker, Mark Whiley
Walker will play if he can play at all.
Weitering was injured last week, and not for the first time, and was not mentioned during the week. How he is really going is anyone's guess.
I would have started Thomas off in the VFL: he has had an extended break. Finding form in the VFL is not a sin.
I would like to see another large forward out there to take marks, but that is not to be.
St Kilda
B: Dylan Roberton, Sean Dempster, Jarryn Geary.
HB: Jack Newnes, Sam Gilbert, Leigh Montagna.
C: Shane Savage, Sebastian Ross, Blake Acres.
HF: Maverick Weller, Nick Riewoldt, Jack Billings.
F: Tim Membrey, Josh Bruce, Nathan Wright.
Foll: Tom Hickey, Luke Dunstan, Jack Steven.
Int: David Armitage, Jade Gresham, Sam Fisher, Daniel McKenzie, Cameron Shenton, Darren Minchington, Jason Holmes.
In: Sam Fisher, Cameron Shenton, Jason Holmes
St Kilda will be confident after flogging us last time with most of their talls unavailable. Especially as their ruck division dominated and Jack Steven was allowed to run around freely. If we repeat that blunder, we are toast. Interesting to see who lines up on Riewoldt too.
How about introducing some pace into team Whiley/ Thomas ? Tex is excused. What about introducing a youngster the swans have had 6 debutants this yr.
Be nice if we could man Steven up and have players in front of him so he cant run onto taps from Hickey and run out of the centre with no one in front of him....
Simon White could be a good player to man Membrey up with this time....
How about introducing some pace into team Whiley/ Thomas ? Tex is excused. What about introducing a youngster the swans have had 6 debutants this yr.
Where's the pace in the 2's Mina? Tutt???
Gee, the writing is surely on the wall for Liam Jones. Gotta be gawn even with one year remaining on his contract??
Gee, the writing is surely on the wall for Liam Jones. Gotta be gawn even with one year remaining on his contract??
I can only assume he is either now considered back up for the younger guys, or else Bolts just doesn't want him around. I was not a fan initially, but he's been ok the times I've seen him this season. I would've thought his wage is the lowest of the low, and keeping on for one more season would make sense.
I can only assume he is either now considered back up for the younger guys, or else Bolts just doesn't want him around. I was not a fan initially, but he's been ok the times I've seen him this season. I would've thought his wage is the lowest of the low, and keeping on for one more season would make sense.
Much will come down to the ins and outs of list management.
I can only assume he is either now considered back up for the younger guys, or else Bolts just doesn't want him around. I was not a fan initially, but he's been ok the times I've seen him this season. I would've thought his wage is the lowest of the low, and keeping on for one more season would make sense.
Maybe that will happen. We got him pretty cheaply and he's probably seen as low cost insurance. Jaksh is also well on the outer and it'll be interesting to see whether he is retained - not even named as an emergency this week and unlikely to get another senior gig this year I would think.
Maybe that will happen. We got him pretty cheaply and he's probably seen as low cost insurance. Jaksh is also well on the outer and it'll be interesting to see whether he is retained - not even named as an emergency this week and unlikely to get another senior gig this year I would think.
Yes, fair points cookie. If you look at this season, he hasn't done too much wrong, and for all his oft discussed limitations, we do seem a better team with him there. If he's feeling a little aggrieved at being constantly overlooked, it may not be entirely unjustified.
I reckon Thomas, Walker and Weitering are certainties to play assuming that Weitering is fit, so that leaves room for one of Sumner, Graham, Whiley and Everitt.
I doubt that Whiley will get a gig and Walker will probably take Sumner's spot, Everitt's form has been down but he's capable of kicking multiple goals and scoring has been our biggest problem this season.
Graham's pedestrian, he lays a fair few tackles but doesn't impact on games and he's pretty slow.
Everitt, Walker, Thomas and Weitering in the 22, Graham if Weitering doesn't play.
Casboult's lucky in my opinion, Jones must really be on the outer.
Hopefully Murphy's back next week and we have a few more wins to round out the season.
I reckon Thomas, Walker and Weitering are certainties to play assuming that Weitering is fit, so that leaves room for one of Sumner, Graham, Whiley and Everitt.
I doubt that Whiley will get a gig and Walker will probably take Sumner's spot, Everitt's form has been down but he's capable of kicking multiple goals and scoring has been our biggest problem this season.
Graham's pedestrian, he lays a fair few tackles but doesn't impact on games and he's pretty slow.
Everitt, Walker, Thomas and Weitering in the 22, Graham if Weitering doesn't play.
Casboult's lucky in my opinion, Jones must really be on the outer.
Hopefully Murphy's back next week and we have a few more wins to round out the season.
I would have thought Sumner might be a good chance to play because of his speed, especially against the Saints?
I would have thought Sumner might be a good chance to play because of his speed, especially against the Saints?
He's got some pace but he doesn't get much of the ball and doesn't kick many goals, he looks like he might make the grade eventually but he'll need to improve by a fair margin.
Weitering has to be doubtful if named on the bench.
He's got some pace but he doesn't get much of the ball and doesn't kick many goals, he looks like he might make the grade eventually but he'll need to improve by a fair margin.
He looks like he is carrying abit of pudding compared to the other guys. He needs to get himself supremely fit over the PS, if he does that he will be a jet.
He looks like he is carrying abit of pudding compared to the other guys. He needs to get himself supremely fit over the PS, if he does that he will be a jet.
PS He also has to do something with that hair, its a shocker! :D
PS He also has to do something with that hair, its a shocker! :D
Murph will take him to Ciccone's.
Final rd20 Sunday teams Carl v StK
Walker, Thomas for Everitt, Sumner
Int; Weitering, Thomas, Walker, Graham
Emerg; Sumner, Whiley, Everitt
I reckon Thomas, Walker and Weitering are certainties to play assuming that Weitering is fit, so that leaves room for one of Sumner, Graham, Whiley and Everitt.
I doubt that Whiley will get a gig and Walker will probably take Sumner's spot, Everitt's form has been down but he's capable of kicking multiple goals and scoring has been our biggest problem this season.
Graham's pedestrian, he lays a fair few tackles but doesn't impact on games and he's pretty slow.
Everitt, Walker, Thomas and Weitering in the 22, Graham if Weitering doesn't play.
Casboult's lucky in my opinion, Jones must really be on the outer.
Hopefully Murphy's back next week and we have a few more wins to round out the season.
Should be playing both Casboult and Jones. Not that either are stars by any means but as a structure it worked great mid season. Playing both split the defence and created some space for our smaller blokes to run into space in the 50 and kick goals. If Jones had to be the only key forward in the side he'd probably have a worse time than Casboult being triple teamed with the ball bombed on his head. Unless you're Fev you'll struggle in that circumstance. Not alot of blame on thee key forwards there just the people selecting the team.
Final rd20 Sunday teams Carl v StK
Walker, Thomas for Everitt, Sumner
Int; Weitering, Thomas, Walker, Graham
Emerg; Sumner, Whiley, Everitt
Makes sense. Then next week, hopefully, it will be Murphy for Graham.
wheres the pace in the 2nds? You see what 1 of our promblem is and by playing the same old is like moving the deck chairs.
Cunningham and DVR Mina, rest couldn't run out of sight on a dark night.
Should be playing both Casboult and Jones.
Our best win of the season has undoubtedly been against Geelong and Jones didn't play.
Casboult had 8 touches and kicked a goal, Armfield kicked 3 and Everitt 4, Gorringe kicked a couple playing second ruck.
Jones and Casboult played in the win against Port Adelaide which is our second best win of the season but Casboult was out of the game after 10 minutes.
Jones kicked 2 from 8 touches, Everitt kicked 3.
Realistically the common factor seems to be Everitt in good form, the other games we've won have been against teams no better than us and in the case of Brisbane and Essendon worse, so I don't rate them too highly.
Two key forwards are always better than one unless they're substandard, and in our case they are.
I missed out on Everitt for Graham, I guess they figured that dropping Graham would leave the midfield thin but he doesn't score and scoring has been our biggest problem, Everitt can at least kick a few although his form has slipped.
We'll go OK but we're certainly down on pace and St Kilda are quick if nothing else, it's about 50/50 I reckon.
Caboult and Jones together are undefeated.
Oddly I think we can get hold of the Saints in the ruck, Hickey won't jump over Phillips like he did to Gorringe last time we played. And other than Bruce it puts the Aints solo ruck up against two proper ruckmen and two part timers.
If our big blokes were ever going to have a good day it should be tomorrow! The Aints have gone small with pace, we need to dominate clearances and then clunk some marks.
Our best win of the season has undoubtedly been against Geelong and Jones didn't play.
Casboult had 8 touches and kicked a goal, Armfield kicked 3 and Everitt 4, Gorringe kicked a couple playing second ruck.
Jones and Casboult played in the win against Port Adelaide which is our second best win of the season but Casboult was out of the game after 10 minutes.
Jones kicked 2 from 8 touches, Everitt kicked 3.
Realistically the common factor seems to be Everitt in good form, the other games we've won have been against teams no better than us and in the case of Brisbane and Essendon worse, so I don't rate them too highly.
Two key forwards are always better than one unless they're substandard, and in our case they are.
I missed out on Everitt for Graham, I guess they figured that dropping Graham would leave the midfield thin but he doesn't score and scoring has been our biggest problem, Everitt can at least kick a few although his form has slipped.
We'll go OK but we're certainly down on pace and St Kilda are quick if nothing else, it's about 50/50 I reckon.
Two forwards are always better than one for structural purposes no matter how good they are. The worse they are the more you need (up to two). One is only ok if you have the likes of Fev, who could carry a defence on his own, even then two is way better. Like I said both take men. Don't respect Casboult and Jones and they'll still hurt you. If there's one the defence all go to him. With two they split them, allows Casboult gets up the ground where he can play, takes defenders with him, opens the 50 and we score. Everitt was able to kick plenty in that period for the same reason, space and the fact the two key forwards had taken the opposition defenders. He too has been no good since we went back to one key forward. While Casboult and Jones didn't kick many but allows many others too, including Everitt. Can't argue with the scoreboard.
We are undefeated with Jones and Casboult in the side and kicked much better scores. Casboult averaged 1.5 a game, and alot of marks, last year as either a permanent 2nd ruck or key forward/ruck, while we had a 2nd key forward, Henderson, who while playing poorly but certainly needed defenders. Any club would take that. Note that allowed Everitt to kick 31 goals. Casboult's game this year, forward backing Kreuzer, who was rucking alone, 11 marks, 7 contested, 3 goals. Good reason clubs were interested in him last year. Moral there is to player average players to their strengths or they struggle.
Against Geelong, Goringe, a forward/ruck more than the other way around, got 14 touches, 7 marks and 2 goals against Geelong. Same argument applies. He actually played on the wing in the VFL the other week.
We definitely need to keep the ball in tight and not give away turnovers otherwise they will run us into the turf.
Two forwards are always better than one for structural purposes no matter how good they are.
I know it's a hobby horse of yours Laj and I respect your opinion, I just don't agree with it.
Two forwards are always better than one for structural purposes no matter how good they are. The worse they are the more you need (up to two). One is only ok if you have the likes of Fev, who could carry a defence on his own, even then two is way better. Like I said both take men. Don't respect Casboult and Jones and they'll still hurt you. If there's one the defence all go to him. With two they split them, allows Casboult gets up the ground where he can play, takes defenders with him, opens the 50 and we score. Everitt was able to kick plenty in that period for the same reason, space and the fact the two key forwards had taken the opposition defenders. He too has been no good since we went back to one key forward. While Casboult and Jones didn't kick many but allows many others too, including Everitt. Can't argue with the scoreboard.
We are undefeated with Jones and Casboult in the side and kicked much better scores. Casboult averaged 1.5 a game, and alot of marks, last year as either a permanent 2nd ruck or key forward/ruck, while we had a 2nd key forward, Henderson, who while playing poorly but certainly needed defenders. Any club would take that. Note that allowed Everitt to kick 31 goals. Casboult's game this year, forward backing Kreuzer, who was rucking alone, 11 marks, 7 contested, 3 goals. Good reason clubs were interested in him last year. Moral there is to player average players to their strengths or they struggle.
Against Geelong, Goringe, a forward/ruck more than the other way around, got 14 touches, 7 marks and 2 goals against Geelong. Same argument applies. He actually played on the wing in the VFL the other week.
There may be a few reasons the MC are not selecting the team as you have suggested Jim:
1. The ultimate game plan they are trying to implement, and lets face it we don't know the intricacies of it, doesn't suit that type of selection;
2. They are trying to implement a game plan structure which involves unpredictability in the fwd line;
3. They are selecting a side which is defensively minded (being the main focus in year 1), competitive (effort) but doesn't necessarily win too many games in year 1 (ie position ourselves for decent 1st round draft picks).
If you don't agree with 3, then its mainly 1 and 2.
They are my thoughts.
There may be a few reasons the MC are not selecting the team as you have suggested Jim:
1. The ultimate game plan they are trying to implement, and lets face it we don't know the intricacies of it, doesn't suit that type of selection;
2. They are trying to implement a game plan structure which involves unpredictability in the fwd line;
3. They are selecting a side which is defensively minded (being the main focus in year 1), competitive (effort) but doesn't necessarily win too many games in year 1 (ie position ourselves for decent 1st round draft picks).
If you don't agree with 3, then its mainly 1 and 2.
They are my thoughts.
Maybe, interesting thoughts, but when we were winning mid-year we were great defensively and because there was space the transition was quick and allowed us to score through many different options. Against Port our defence was outstanding but we always looked like we were going to score even when 2-3 goals behind late, finishing with Kreuzer snagging the winner. All the defensive aspects were in place but we also moved the ball out of the defensive 50 quickly. Nothing teaches better than that. With one key forward we actually become predictable. Without the same space we move it slowly then eventually have to bomb it to Casboult. The poor bugger is covered by a number of defenders, who know exactly what is going to happen. Casboult done a good job in his time here but he's certainly not that good to counter that. He's the poor bugger that cops the flack.
That's the way I see it anyway.
Maybe, interesting thoughts, but when we were winning mid-year we were great defensively and because there was space the transition was quick and allowed us to score through many different options. Against Port our defence was outstanding but we always looked like we were going to score even when 2-3 goals behind late, finishing with Kreuzer snagging the winner. All the defensive aspects were in place but we also moved the ball out of the defensive 50 quickly. Nothing teaches better than that. With one key forward we actually become predictable. Without the same space we move it slowly then eventually have to bomb it to Casboult. The poor bugger is covered by a number of defenders, who know exactly what is going to happen. Casboult done a good job in his time here but he's certainly not that good to counter that. He's the poor bugger that cops the flack.
That's the way I see it anyway.
Firstly, unpredictability comes from multiple avenues to goal, not via one or two key forwards.
Secondly, when the Key Forward is being double and triple teamed, where the feck are the opponents (ie our blokes) of the ones doing the double a triple teaming ? Got to be smarter around the fwd line with the loose blokes picking up crumbs or getting into position to receive goal side. Watch the Hawthorn, Sydney and Geelong poachers do it.
Firstly, unpredictability comes from multiple avenues to goal, not via one or two key forwards.
Secondly, when the Key Forward is being double and triple teamed, where the feck are the opponents (ie our blokes) of the ones doing the double a triple teaming ? Got to be smarter around the fwd line with the loose blokes picking up crumbs or getting into position to receive goal side. What the Hawthorn, Sydney and Geelong poachers do it.
I often wonder about that myself.
Just read Blues haven't beaten Saints at the G since 1998, what the ......
I've tipped us to get the job done. Hopefully like Melbourne, we'll succeed against the odds.
Go Blues - Nail this one for your mate 1AW
Just read Blues haven't beaten Saints at the G since 1998, what the ......
I've tipped us to get the job done. Hopefully like Melbourne, we'll succeed against the odds.
Go Blues - Nail this one for your mate 1AW
x2..Good test for BB. was outcoached last time and this is a chance for him , Neil Craig, Barker etc to rejig how we play and set-up better than we did the first time we played the Saints...Philips should help against Hickey and we cant let Steven run onto the ball in open ground like we did last time...
Blues by 18 points.....1AW to kick 2-3 and go out a winner...
Just read Blues haven't beaten Saints at the G since 1998, what the ......
I've tipped us to get the job done. Hopefully like Melbourne, we'll succeed against the odds.
Go Blues - Nail this one for your mate 1AW
We've barely played them at the MCG since 1998. Almost always at Etihad, and not many wins there either. It is about time we changed that piece of stupidity.
We've barely played them at the MCG since 1998. Almost always at Etihad, and not many wins there either. It is about time we changed that piece of stupidity.
I reckon we will be a different proposition for StK at the G. I'm confident.
@ EB1
Blues by 18 points.....1AW to kick 2-3 and go out a winner...
Now that would be fitting for our Carlton-blooded champ, the little man up front, and a chance for the club to turn these unsavory trends around.
@ EB1
Blues by 18 points.....1AW to kick 2-3 and go out a winner...
Now that would be fitting for our Carlton-blooded champ, the little man up front, and a chance for the club to turn these unsavory trends around.
Unsavoury recent trends? Our last 20 games against the Aints were as follows:
LLLLLLLLLWWLLLLWWWWL
The last 20 against Haw is unsavoury
LLLLWWLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
Looking forward to this, hoping for 1AW that we can send him off with a win, would nice if he could lift those knees for a few grabs today , oh bugger it just take Mark of the Day
Never seen the Krakouer mark, so looked it up in you tube. Its ok, but seriously, how did 1AW not win mark of the year???
Kind of like Woewoedin winning the brownlow in front of Kouta.
True Prof E , we got robbed in that one for sure , would be nice if he could top of the career with a nice hanger today
I'm sitting on a sand dune in far north west Victoria and will probably only get occasional scores. I would appreciate plenty of in game commentary - particularly if we're doing OK :)
Never seen the Krakouer mark, so looked it up in you tube. Its ok, but seriously, how did 1AW not win mark of the year???
Kind of like Woewoedin winning the brownlow in front of Kouta.
Says it all when you never see krakours Mark replayed whereas walkers is used to highlight the excitement of AFL - they really should rectify it and give it Mark of the decade or similar
Says it all when you never see krakours Mark replayed whereas walkers is used to highlight the excitement of AFL - they really should rectify it and give it Mark of the decade or similar
Agree.