Early game on Sunday against a team which is actually playing quite well. God knows we aren't. The end of the season cannot come quickly enough.
Can we request that AFL invoke the mercy rule and relieve us of our obligation to front up for the next two weeks?
Us v st K, and first half v Lions was excruciating to watch. No doubt about that at all. Seriously if we can't bring that last half performance for the remaining couple of games, I'm going to have to watch with my eyes closed and the volume off.
Melbourne are looking for a final 8 spot, silly as that sounds. They should kill us on our present form. The long term weather looks wet as well, which we have not thrived in.
Cripps and Weitering should be rested. They are injured and both not close to 100% fit. But will we rest them? Probably not.
Not sure those conditions are made for Cuningham or Boekhorst at this point, but who knows?
This time last year we rose spectacularly to beat Melbourne. Everitt and Walker both did well that day, while Kreuzer thrashed Gawn. Can't see any of those things happen this time around.
Drop a bloody ruckman!
The Dees are a lot better than a year ago and we are struggling - I'm not feeling good about this game but I'll probably go along anyway. :-\
Its the last round I'm scared of.
Drop a bloody ruckman!
It will take both of ours to come close to breaking even with Gawn . . . and who would you bring in?
Phillips had a dirty day but I think that he would give more than most of the blokes in the NBs, with the possible exception of Billy Gowers.
I would send Cuningham back to the NBs, promote Gowers and play Tuohy up the ground.
The Dees are a lot better than a year ago and we are struggling - I'm not feeling good about this game but I'll probably go along anyway. :-\
We struggled for the first 6 of the last 8 qtrs, prior to that we did ok agains WC, Syd and Haw. If we can start properly against Melb, we will give them a a good run. If we start like we did against StK and Bris, we will lose again. The first two qtrs against Bris were as bad if not not worse than anything we dished up in 2014 and 2015. Totally unacceptable and BB will make this crystal clear in the reviews. Having said that, I hope he sticks with Cunningham, let him play out the year, he did some nice things, he can only benefit from the next two games in the ones.
Could have it's interest. Melbourne have come on but gee they have bad one's too and drop ordinary games. Up to today they were the only side that lost to Essendon, which only Melbourne (or maybe us) can do.
Melbourne would've had alot to answer for if they ended up being the only side to lose to Essendon....lol. Doesn't matter now after today.
Almost impossible to see us winning on form, Melbourne's win against Hawthorn was terrific and they followed it up with an easy win over Port in Adelaide.
St Kilda smashed us then got taken apart by Sydney and we just lost to a very poor Brisbane.
The form says we should be about $4.
Almost impossible to see us winning on form, Melbourne's win against Hawthorn was terrific and they followed it up with an easy win over Port in Adelaide.
St Kilda smashed us then got taken apart by Sydney and we just lost to a very poor Brisbane.
The form says we should be about $4.
But we also know that this time of the year, crazy crap happens.
Can you imagine what Gawn is gonna do to us!? If anyone is still alive in SC - lock him in for Captain.......
Melbourne will smack us.......absolutely smack us......
Almost impossible to see us winning on form, Melbourne's win against Hawthorn was terrific and they followed it up with an easy win over Port in Adelaide.
St Kilda smashed us then got taken apart by Sydney and we just lost to a very poor Brisbane.
The form says we should be about $4.
This is Melbourne we a re talking about though. They can turn to crap at any possible moment. If i were a supporter I'd have as much trust in them as I done in us. We are due actually, while after lots of promise and getting their supporters hopes up Melbourne are due to let them down again.
Am I tipping us? Of course
....not....lol.
Can you imagine what Gawn is gonna do to us!? If anyone is still alive in SC - lock him in for Captain.......
Melbourne will smack us.......absolutely smack us......
Well I hope our blokes (especially Kruze) rip right into him and work him over. Guaranteed BB will put the acid on the our two fellas this week. Lets see how they respond.
Can you imagine what Gawn is gonna do to us!? If anyone is still alive in SC - lock him in for Captain.......
Melbourne will smack us.......absolutely smack us......
Calm blue sea Brettie, calm blue sea!!!!
Well I hope our blokes (especially Kruze) rip right into him and work him over. Guaranteed BB will put the acid on the our two fellas this week. Lets see how they respond.
Happy to just concede the ruck, drop one and pick a runner instead. We'd have to do better.
Happy to just concede the ruck, drop one and pick a runner instead. We'd have to do better.
My thoughts exactly. No ruckman we have or combination of them will beat Gawn if he continues his current form, so just plan to rove to him instead, and play another runner.
Meanwhile I think our problem over the last 2 weeks (apart from matters we can't address on the fly such as lack of talent, structure and personnel) is more than anything tiredness so I'd take advantage of the NBs bye this round to promote anyone who even borderline warrants promotion - at least they'll be fresh after a weeks rest and we need that on the big ground especially against the Dees who have good run. Perhaps the slower guys like Whiley and Graham may miss again (unless Cripps is rested in which case we would need one of them for the grunt factor) but otherwise give the better performed seconds players a shot. If nothing else it gives the dropped players a needed rest before the last round and if the incoming players don't perform they can get dropped for those guys to come back, if they do perform we may have found something we didn't know we had.
Kreuzer did OK to nullify Martin, halved Martin's average output over the last five games.
If you want to know the consequences of entering a game without a viable ruck division, take a look at Brisbane's two games prior to ours! Bolton knows that when the big men play well others follow, what we need is more of them in form and firing not less of them spread thinly in honourable losses!
My thoughts exactly. No ruckman we have or combination of them will beat Gawn if he continues his current form, so just plan to rove to him instead, and play another runner.
Meanwhile I think our problem over the last 2 weeks (apart from matters we can't address on the fly such as lack of talent, structure and personnel) is more than anything tiredness so I'd take advantage of the NBs bye this round to promote anyone who even borderline warrants promotion - at least they'll be fresh after a weeks rest and we need that on the big ground especially against the Dees who have good run. Perhaps the slower guys like Whiley and Graham may miss again (unless Cripps is rested in which case we would need one of them for the grunt factor) but otherwise give the better performed seconds players a shot. If nothing else it gives the dropped players a needed rest before the last round and if the incoming players don't perform they can get dropped for those guys to come back, if they do perform we may have found something we didn't know we had.
Yep
I reckon it's time to send those who need them off for the minor cleanouts and operations. Get ready for the pre-season.... and give the likely delistees a last couple of games.
Rest Cripps and Weitering, who've probably been carrying injuries.
We look tired and sore and the intensity we displayed against the top sides a couple of weeks back has now disappeared.
We're long odds against Melbourne but a shake up will give us a better chance than just going through the motions.
Can you imagine what Gawn is gonna do to us!? If anyone is still alive in SC - lock him in for Captain.......
Melbourne will smack us.......absolutely smack us......
Lol
In our losing Streak:
Saints - Hickey 2 Goals, in Bests
GWS - Mumford - 2nd BOG
Collingwood - Grundy 2 goals, Second BOG
Adelaide - Jacobs 3 goals, in Bests
Hawks - Ceglar 2 goals, McEvoy 1
Saints x 2 - Hickey 1 goal
Brisbane - Archie Smith, first ever goal.
Lets not froget what Tippet and Sinclair did in round 2 (7 goals) and Goldy did.
We get smashed in the Ruck every week, time to cut Krueze loose and see what Phillips can do as the Number 1.
The only really good game Kreuzer played was against a makeshift ruckman in Jackson Trengrove. I like Kreuzer but injuries have slowed him down and the game has only got quicker. We should try to get Majak Daw.
Lol
In our losing Streak:
Saints - Hickey 2 Goals, in Bests
GWS - Mumford - 2nd BOG
Collingwood - Grundy 2 goals, Second BOG
Adelaide - Jacobs 3 goals, in Bests
Hawks - Ceglar 2 goals, McEvoy 1
Saints x 2 - Hickey 1 goal
Brisbane - Archie Smith, first ever goal.
Lets not froget what Tippet and Sinclair did in round 2 (7 goals) and Goldy did.
We get smashed in the Ruck every week, time to cut Krueze loose and see what Phillips can do as the Number 1.
Well didn't it come close last year? Plus he didn't get the length of contract he was asking for. He was a stop gap.
The only really good game Kreuzer played was against a makeshift ruckman in Jackson Trengrove. I like Kreuzer but injuries have slowed him down and the game has only got quicker. We try and get Majak Daw.
Old school player in the modern game.
The amount of times he just gets it and throws it on his boot, his dropped marked stopped all our momentum in the third, and doesn't kick enough goals as a forward.
We have kept with him for years at the expense of Sam Jacobs and even Shaun Hampson who ALWAYS played better as a Number 1 ruck. I hate to see the same thing happen to a guy like Phillips, who is still a few years away.
Agreed Shadsey and I suspect it's why we're not going the one ruckman route because if we were to it wouldn't be Kreuzer.
Lol
In our losing Streak:
Saints - Hickey 2 Goals, in Bests
GWS - Mumford - 2nd BOG
Collingwood - Grundy 2 goals, Second BOG
Adelaide - Jacobs 3 goals, in Bests
Hawks - Ceglar 2 goals, McEvoy 1
Saints x 2 - Hickey 1 goal
Brisbane - Archie Smith, first ever goal.
Lets not froget what Tippet and Sinclair did in round 2 (7 goals) and Goldy did.
We get smashed in the Ruck every week, time to cut Krueze loose and see what Phillips can do as the Number 1.
Your problem is with the KPDs not the ruckmen, most of those goals were kicked while the opposition rucks rested on Rowe or Weitering! If we'd had Jammo fit allowing Rowe to take the resting rucks things may have been different, but instead we had Rowe, Weitering and Plowman to deal with blokes like Hickey and Tippett, even when Jammo played he was effectively one-armed! ;) Opposition clubs have exposed Weitering one-on-one because as a first year player he has the body but not the strength yet!
Mumford wasn't in the GWS top ten, in fact the coaches never gave him a vote! The major difference in that game was Mumford and Lobb combined offered similar output, while Kreuzer got almost no support from Phillips.
Tippett, exactly the same as the GWS game, Kreuzer matched it with Tippett and Sinclair, but Phillips ranked dead last on our list. The coaches ranked Tippett and Sinclair equally!
The Collingwood game was a bizarre affair, low scoring yet with very few stoppages. Grundy, lost the ruck, but was very effective while resting forward and benefited from our turning the ball over. Pendlebury was the coaches BOG, with Sinclair as second.
I think you are confusing losing stoppages with losing the ruck, Kreuzer was the top rated ruckmen last weekend but we were smashed in the clearances due to the slow leg speed of our midfield. I had to laugh when the Ch.7 nuffers stated Kreuzer had to lift at 3/4 time. He was the top ranked ruckmen on the ground at the time and had nullified Martin who has been the top ranked ruckmen in the competition over the last 2 months Gaunt included! :D
The only really good game Kreuzer played was against a makeshift ruckman in Jackson Trengrove. I like Kreuzer but injuries have slowed him down and the game has only got quicker. We should try to get Majak Daw.
He smashed Martin ???
Old school player in the modern game.
The amount of times he just gets it and throws it on his boot, his dropped marked stopped all our momentum in the third...
Agree. That was such a critical error, from memory they goaled from that dropped mark. However, it almost seems endemic in our side... skill errors.
Agree. That was such a critical error, from memory they goaled from that dropped mark. However, it almost seems endemic in our side... skill errors.
Yes, it's hardly a case of being Pat Malone. But if we think we are going to find a ruckmen that wins us games we are in for a world of pain. Fix the KPF and KPD problems directly, do not break stuff that is functioning just to fix another problem!
At the weekend I watched Kreuzer tap to advantage time after time, yet the only time we cleared the ball was when Cripps was in the midfield. The rest of the time the Lions got the clearance.
The only really good game Kreuzer played was against a makeshift ruckman in Jackson Trengrove. I like Kreuzer but injuries have slowed him down and the game has only got quicker. We should try to get Majak Daw.
Was terrific against Geelong too.
I'm not worried who he was against, his output around the ground lifted when Phillips wasn't around. He did take Trengrove on with a bung knee, which had minor surgery the next week, played well showed alot of heart and kicked the winner.
Lol
In our losing Streak:
Saints - Hickey 2 Goals, in Bests
GWS - Mumford - 2nd BOG
Collingwood - Grundy 2 goals, Second BOG
Adelaide - Jacobs 3 goals, in Bests
Hawks - Ceglar 2 goals, McEvoy 1
Saints x 2 - Hickey 1 goal
Brisbane - Archie Smith, first ever goal.
Lets not froget what Tippet and Sinclair did in round 2 (7 goals) and Goldy did.
We get smashed in the Ruck every week, time to cut Krueze loose and see what Phillips can do as the Number 1.
Don't care what ruckman we drop as long as we drop one. Having an extra runner rather than a lumbering ruckman is surely a no-brainer.
Kreuzer for years has been a consistently better player when he's the only ruckman. Not necessarily tapout-wise but lifts 3 cogs around the ground including tackles. Got 11 of those against Geelong. You can always win clearances against the losing ruck. That's what we miss from our rucks, around the ground output. Kreuzer at least improved in that aspect in the 2nd half and got 14 touches but is generally crap when he shares. Phillips was useless and touched it 5 times.
Which of the serious finals contenders run with only one genuine ruck option?
It seems there are very few examples that support your argument, just look at last weekend!
Hawthorn - McEvoy/Ceglar
Sydney - Nankervis/Naismith
Adelaide - O'Brien/Jenkins
Geelong - Stanley/Smith + Biclavs
GWS - Mumford/Lobb + Paton
WC - Naitanui/Lycett
Bulldogs - Roughead/Boyd
North - Goldstein/Daw
Which of the serious finals contenders run with only one genuine ruck option?
It seems there are very few examples that support your argument, just look at last weekend!
Hawthorn - McEvoy/Ceglar
Sydney - Nankervis/Naismith
Adelaide - O'Brien/Jenkins
Geelong - Stanley/Smith + Biclavs
GWS - Mumford/Lobb + Paton
WC - Naitanui/Lycett
Bulldogs - Roughead/Boyd
North - Goldstein/Daw
Sides are different and you select them to your strength but because it's the done thing to pick two.
Anyway, Daw only plays when Waite is out. Boyd is a key forward, didn't pay 1 miillion a year to ruck, Jenkins is mostly a key forward. Sydney will play Tippett when he's back, Paton will always offer something good as a forward. Hawthorn are key positionless due to illness and injury but last year had Hale, who was a good as a key forward as he was a ruck. Using your names there has thoroughly convinced me we use one ruckman and Casboult, same as those sides above. Thank you for confirming what I think.
2 rucks is ok if they are mobile and do alot around the ground, goddamn friggen useless if they do nothing as you're one man down the whole game. At Carlton, who in their right mind would play two rucks when you can pick another runner and increase your run around the ground. Anyone who knows anything at all about football Casboult can take up the slack as he has done before for a few years pretty well, and where he plays some of his best footy in that dual role. Happy to lose a few tapouts for better round the ground output. Many sides win the clearances against losing rucks.
What would you prefer, two lumbering useless ruckmen or one and an extra runner? By having one you'll increase both the output of Kreuzer, Casboult as well as giving us good run with the extra midfielder. What do you think? You couldn't possibly say two useless lumbering ruckman, if you do, well......
Sides are different and you select them to your strength but because it's the done thing to pick two.
Anyway, Daw only plays when Waite is out. Boyd is a key forward, didn't pay 1 miillion a year to ruck, Jenkins is mostly a key forward. Sydney will play Tippett when he's back, Paton will always offer something good as a forward. Hawthorn are key positionless due to illness and injury but last year had Hale, who was a good as a key forward as he was a ruck. Using your names there has thoroughly convinced me we use one ruckman and Casboult, same as those sides above. Thank you for confirming what I think.
2 rucks is ok if they are mobile and do alot around the ground, goddamn friggen useless if they do nothing as you're one man down the whole game. At Carlton, who in their right mind would play two rucks when you can pick another runner and increase your run around the ground. Anyone who knows anything at all about football Casboult can take up the slack as he has done before for a few years pretty well, and where he plays some of his best footy in that dual role. Happy to lose a few tapouts for better round the ground output. Many sides win the clearances against losing rucks.
What would you prefer, two lumbering useless ruckmen or one and an extra runner? By having one you'll increase both the output of Kreuzer, Casboult as well as giving us good run with the extra midfielder. What do you think? You couldn't possibly say two useless lumbering ruckman, if you do, well......
You keep pushing that Casboult bit in bold but it's bogus. It has delivered us massive disappointments time and time again, we rob our only useful contested mark inside F50 to have him ruck poorly around the ground. It's never worked ever because as a ruck Casboult has almost no idea other than jump and hit. He gets out-bodied by the small and medium sized players, and has zero second effort when the ball hits the ground.
All those others in bold are ruckmen turned forwards, and Tippett when in the team has played ruck all year not forward, and he does so in combination with Sinclair. Tippett hasn't played as a forward once this year, and never as a solo ruck! :o
In terms of the Dawks last year, McEvoy and Hale effectively divided ruck duties right down the middle. I agree they are dead lucky they had Hale, because without him they would have been cooked. But Hale was clearly the best ruck forward in the competition last season, better than Boyd, better than Patton, perhaps only Cameron is his equal, but rightly so GWS don't ruck Cameron anymore.
If you want to fix the forward line, find a better forward option. If you want to fix the midfield division fix the midfielders. Don't shoot yourself in the foot in the ruck hoping to cover for some other deficiency, it just doesn't work.
As for Casboult, what use is a 200cm x 100kg clunking target who can only deliver when he's played as the support act! We need a bloke who can take the top job, not play as the second banana! FFS, Liam Jones takes the heat off him and he performs, holy cow that is an indictment!
Don't want to stop the argument, but you'll have to shout extra loud for me o Sunday: surgery on Friday and I won't be available. The stent has to stay in for a week to be effective, so that is it.
We are not on TV so I won't see anything of the game. That frustrates me, but hopefully we get a few more games on free to air next year. We will probably do something special for Walker and Jamison, as this is our last home game for the year.
I wonder if anyone else will decide to give it away? Simmo definitely isn't. :)
I won't be voting again either, as I will have no idea what happens, even if we do surprise and win.
I mentioned this earlier, but I would rest beth Cripps and Weitering, as neither of them are going to get huge amounts out of playing injured, even though they both probably want to play.
I would also like to see some less conservative placings: I like being difficult for our opponents to predict. I really hate it when we are VERY predictable t the opposition, which we have been often this year.
Why not have Krueze FF for the game and have Phillips No. 1 ruck and use the Bolt to pinch hit in the ruck?
Just saying....
Because Kreuz forgets how to play footy when he gets forward of centre.
Kreuzer and Cripps are similar... super oversized mids that cant play forward
The ruckman playing KP forward theory....the Brett Ratten era was full of it and it drove me insane......FF and CHF are specialist positions......end of story.
You keep pushing that Casboult bit in bold but it's bogus. It has delivered us massive disappointments time and time again, we rob our only useful contested mark inside F50 to have him ruck poorly around the ground. It's never worked ever because as a ruck Casboult has almost no idea other than jump and hit. He gets out-bodied by the small and medium sized players, and has zero second effort when the ball hits the ground.
All those others in bold are ruckmen turned forwards, and Tippett when in the team has played ruck all year not forward, and he does so in combination with Sinclair. Tippett hasn't played as a forward once this year, and never as a solo ruck! :o
In terms of the Dawks last year, McEvoy and Hale effectively divided ruck duties right down the middle. I agree they are dead lucky they had Hale, because without him they would have been cooked. But Hale was clearly the best ruck forward in the competition last season, better than Boyd, better than Patton, perhaps only Cameron is his equal, but rightly so GWS don't ruck Cameron anymore.
If you want to fix the forward line, find a better forward option. If you want to fix the midfield division fix the midfielders. Don't shoot yourself in the foot in the ruck hoping to cover for some other deficiency, it just doesn't work.
As for Casboult, what use is a 200cm x 100kg clunking target who can only deliver when he's played as the support act! We need a bloke who can take the top job, not play as the second banana! FFS, Liam Jones takes the heat off him and he performs, holy cow that is an indictment!
^this 100%
You keep pushing that Casboult bit in bold but it's bogus. It has delivered us massive disappointments time and time again, we rob our only useful contested mark inside F50 to have him ruck poorly around the ground. It's never worked ever because as a ruck Casboult has almost no idea other than jump and hit. He gets out-bodied by the small and medium sized players, and has zero second effort when the ball hits the ground.
All those others in bold are ruckmen turned forwards, and Tippett when in the team has played ruck all year not forward, and he does so in combination with Sinclair. Tippett hasn't played as a forward once this year, and never as a solo ruck! :o
In terms of the Dawks last year, McEvoy and Hale effectively divided ruck duties right down the middle. I agree they are dead lucky they had Hale, because without him they would have been cooked. But Hale was clearly the best ruck forward in the competition last season, better than Boyd, better than Patton, perhaps only Cameron is his equal, but rightly so GWS don't ruck Cameron anymore.
If you want to fix the forward line, find a better forward option. If you want to fix the midfield division fix the midfielders. Don't shoot yourself in the foot in the ruck hoping to cover for some other deficiency, it just doesn't work.
As for Casboult, what use is a 200cm x 100kg clunking target who can only deliver when he's played as the support act! We need a bloke who can take the top job, not play as the second banana! FFS, Liam Jones takes the heat off him and he performs, holy cow that is an indictment!
You're talking crap. i dismantled your argument completely. Spin won't change anything.
For 4 years it hasn't been bogus. We play our best with one ruck two key forwards and Casboult backing up. Be shown for the last 4 years. He marks well around the ground, better than anyone else we have, and it improves his game up forward, not to mention improving Kreuzer's game. Been that way since 2012. Our rucks are crap around the ground hence why a Kreuzer/Casboult ruck combo has work best. One ruck and Casboult was one of the few things that did work well last year in a miserable season. Levi and Everitt were able to hit the scoreboard and Levi did a decent job when he rucked too. Did a decent job as permanent 2nd ruck early in the year with Wood. You know it, I know it unless your eyes were shut. Worked well on the odd occasion we tried it this year. We actually won. Means we can pick and extra runner. What would your prefer, 2 lumbering ruckman or one ruck, help from Casboult and and an extra runner. Not a tough question for anyone that knows anything about football in regards to Carlton.
If you, or anyone else, haven't noticed that then sorry you have failed to follow football as results back that up. So spare me your spin on the subject.
Why not have Krueze FF for the game and have Phillips No. 1 ruck and use the Bolt to pinch hit in the ruck?
Just saying....
Just ruck Kreuzer most of the day, help from Casboult, and pick and pick an extra runner. Kreuzer is a dreadful key forward.
Just ruck Kreuzer most of the day, help from Casboult, and pick and pick an extra runner. Kreuzer is a dreadful key forward.
Casboult's days as back-up ruckman ended with his knee injury - for this season at least.
While I wouldn't say Kreuzer is a dreadful key forward, he certainly isn't anywhere near adequate. Of course, that begs the question; who plays as key forward if Casboult is in the ruck?
At worst, the Kreuzer-Phillips combination has broken even with opposition ruck combinations with the exception of hitting the scoreboard when resting forward. There's no reason to change our ruck combination but we do need to find a way to get more value from them when resting.
At worst, the Kreuzer-Phillips combination has broken even with opposition ruck combinations with the exception of hitting the scoreboard when resting forward. There's no reason to change our ruck combination but we do need to find a way to get more value from them when resting.
I think the apparent free scoring of opposition ruckmen gives some supporters an impression that it is normal and expected from ruckmen. But we are the exception, most of those opposition ruckmen do not kick goals on a regular basis. Excluding Tippett who is clearly a better than average KPF most rucks kick very few goals, and this season even Tippett scored 25% of his goals in one game against us!
Our problem isn't the ruck division, our problem is the KPFs and KPDs. We are generating more I50s than most teams but scoring less, we've had several games where despite losing we held a large positive I50 bias. But we don't score, and then teams take the ball to the other end and score relatively easily. Even last weekend, Brisbane stated the game scoring at 50% of I50s for their first six goals. You can't even blame the midfield for that, but certainly ball use from mids and HBFs is a problem.
As for blokes slamming the ball on their boot, it's usually a symptom of nobody running past to receive or nobody placing an effective shepherd or block.
Casboult's days as back-up ruckman ended with his knee injury - for this season at least.
Correct. Let's see how quickly he's filling out the admissions forms at the Epworth after the last game!
Casboult is a very ordinary footballer, if we are ever hoping to play in the big dance there's no point shifting the team around and playing others out of position to compensate for his weaknesses.
He's only there until we find a better option, hopefully within the next couple of years.
Target in the off season the Swans Sam Naismith as our no 1 ruck or go with Phillips for an extended period of time to see if that was a traded in player worth doing.
Really though, we are playing pure ruckmen as one of our key forwards.
We need a Callum Sinclair/Ben Brown-type that is more tall forward/ruckman as opposed to the Kreuzer, Phillips, Wood, Hampson when we had him theory of playing them as a genuine marking target and key forward...doesn't work, and hasn't worked!
Target in the off season the Swans Sam Naismith as our no 1 ruck or go with Phillips for an extended period of time to see if that was a traded in player worth doing.
Really though, we are playing pure ruckmen as one of our key forwards.
We need a Callum Sinclair/Ben Brown-type that is more tall forward/ruckman as opposed to the Kreuzer, Phillips, Wood, Hampson when we had him theory of playing them as a genuine marking target and key forward...doesn't work, and hasn't worked!
How many goals do you expect from this ruck/forward type?
Not much interest in our line up for Sunday?
It's a bit ho-hum with Sumner, Everitt and Graham added to last week's 22.
Murphy didn't get up and the match committee doesn't seem inclined to give Billy Gowers a run ???
Carlton
B: Zach Tuohy, Sam Rowe, Jacob Weitering.
HB: Dylan Buckley, Lachie Plowman, Sam Docherty.
C: Kade Simpson, Sam Kerridge, Ed Curnow.
HF: Jack Silvagni, Liam Jones, David Cuningham.
F: Matthew Kreuzer, Levi Casboult, Matthew Wright.
Foll: Andrew Phillips, Patrick Cripps, Bryce Gibbs.
Int: Dennis Armfield, Simon White, Liam Sumner, Dale Thomas, Andrejs Everitt, Blaine Boekhorst, Nick Graham
In: Liam Sumner, Andrejs Everitt, Nick Graham
Melbourne
B: Sam Frost, Tom McDonald, Neville Jetta.
HB: Jayden Hunt, Oscar McDonald, Tomas Bugg.
C: Christian Petracca, Bernie Vince, Dom Tyson.
HF: Angus Brayshaw, Jack Watts, Aaron Vandenberg.
F: Jeff Garlett, Jesse Hogan, Dean Kent.
Foll: Max Gawn, Nathan Jones, Jack Viney.
Int: Clayton Oliver, Billy Stretch, Cameron Pedersen, Viv Michie, Sam Weideman, Alex Neal-Bullen, James Harmes
In: Viv Michie, Sam Weideman, Alex Neal-Bullen
Really going out on a limb with those selections.
Not much interest in our line up for Sunday?
It's a bit ho-hum with Sumner, Everitt and Graham added to last week's 22.
Murphy didn't get up and the match committee doesn't seem inclined to give Billy Gowers a run ???
I haven't checked but is Gowers able to remain as a rookie at our footy club next seas?
If we have to delist him to rookie him again, then it makes sense that we haven't played him as we don't want him gaining too much value and going to the draft.
Murphy gone for the season, not unexpected and the right decision.
Murphy gone for the season, not unexpected and the right decision.
Yep, not worth risking him now and he's not 100% anyway by all accounts.
What the heck did he do to that ankle that ended in a 15 week lay off? Was that from the Dangerfield tackle?
What the heck did he do to that ankle that ended in a 15 week lay off? Was that from the Dangerfield tackle?
They jabbed him and wanted him to go back on. It would've been the end of his career if he did.
Sumner replaces Boekhorst.
Sumner replaces Boekhorst.
:o
Melbourne's odds of making the finals just improved ;)
:o
Melbourne's odds of making the finals just improved ;)
I think Sumner when fit has done OK this season, not sure from the games I have seen that I can say with certainty that Boekhorst is an upgrade. Toss of the coin between these two, it's a battle for the spot as a small forward.
I think Sumner when fit has done OK this season, not sure from the games I have seen that I can say with certainty that Boekhorst is an upgrade.
Personally I think Sumner has more to offer than Boekhorst but only time will tell.
We just might surprise on Sunday. I'm not as pessimistic as many.
Personally I think Sumner has more to offer than Boekhorst but only time will tell.
We just might surprise on Sunday. I'm not as pessimistic as many.
I think we'll see an improved effort.
It's mostly the ones we've been expected to do well in that we've played poorly.
Against some of the better sides we've performed fairly well and ran them close.
BB is a better player than Liam Sumner.
Personally I think Sumner has more to offer than Boekhorst but only time will tell.
Not even close - Sumner has a much greater upside.
Starting to question BB with his selections.
How does Thomas stay in and Boekhurst gets dropped?
Not even close - Sumner has a much greater upside.
Perhaps, but Sumner just doesn't get the ball and doesn't impact games. Boekhorst hasn't done much since his return from injury but he has still shown a lot more than Sumner.
To be honest, they are both liabilities on current form.
Starting to question BB with his selections.
How does Thomas stay in and Boekhurst gets dropped?
If we had a proper list, neither would get a gig.
How the F does Thomas continue to get a game? Are we tanking?
Sumner>>> Boekhorst... but I agree with DJ that he doesnt get enough of the ball to be a lock in for the future
Perhaps, but Sumner just doesn't get the ball and doesn't impact games. Boekhorst hasn't done much since his return from injury but he has still shown a lot more than Sumner.
To be honest, they are both liabilities on current form.
Probably too accurate. Sumner probably got a go because he has a negative side to his game. Boekhorst's is patchy at best. Boekhorst can be a very good mark, but we just don't see that often enough. Sumner doesn't get off the ground but he does have a reasonable pair of hands.
I can see more of a future in Sumner, but neither of them is close to their best form and neither of them is providing what we desperately need: run and carry and maybe even a crumbing goal.
How the F does Thomas continue to get a game? Are we tanking?
Thomas' second half last week was good and he can hit targets, which is more than can be said for about half of our current team.
Carlton supporters in general will never accept Daisy as a Carlton player, there's just too much Collingwood history there, but he's a long way from our worst in my opinion.
I'd be surprised if we got within 6 goals tomorrow.
Thomas' second half last week was good and he can hit targets, which is more than can be said for about half of our current team.
Carlton supporters in general will never accept Daisy as a Carlton player, there's just too much Collingwood history there, but he's a long way from our worst in my opinion.
I'd be surprised if we got within 6 goals tomorrow.
There's probably an element of the Collingwood factor....also a bit of Malthouse resentment attached to his being a part of our list..... but it's a bit like the situation with Brock McLean.
He's come to us for what many of us consider "way overs" in terms of salary and the lack of compensation for Betts has meant that we (rightly) questioned the net value of his acquisition. Continuing injury problems in subsequent years have only reinforced that resentment.
McLean was the same.We gave up a first round Draft pick for a player with question marks over his fitness. McLean struggled with injury for a couple of years but he did play some good football (often forgotten) when these injuries settled down.
Salary considerations aside (and that's another issue)...If Thomas can get an injury free run he could still be a useful player for us.
Daisy's main problem with CFC supporters is that he has not been able to produce any sparkling match-winning performances that have won games and excited the supporters BUT at the same time he is being paid what many consider to be a huge amount of money. Added to that, he is seen as MM's pet.
Unfortunately for Daisy (and CFC I guess) this situation is unlikely to change as his body does not now appear capable of recapturing those golden moments. He is destined to remain then just an average player for us who is seen as being vastly over-paid. Would be great if that could change but I doubt it and it will be interesting to see what happens when his contract runs out.
I understand the reasons for the resentment Lods but he's on our list and wearing the jumper, and it seems to me that he gives 100% when he runs out.
I for one am happy to see him wearing Navy Blue, God knows we're well short on class and even half fit he's well ahead of the four or five players that we rotate in and out of the VFL.
He might even go a bit better if he thought that the supporters were behind him, he's not an idiot and he'd pick up on the fact that half of them resent his being at the club.
It can't be easy for him under those circumstances.
Would be great if that could change but I doubt it and it will be interesting to see what happens when his contract runs out.
He'll finish his career at Carlton on less money than he's on now, but will the supporters ever accept and support him?
He'll finish his career at Carlton on less money than he's on now, but will the supporters ever accept and support him?
I (most of the time) support all players who wear the navy blue CFC jumper. Whilst his output has not been commensurate with this pay (and I say again that I have been told by someone who would know its not what has been reported in the media), he appears to give his all and from all reports is a good leader. Does he deserve a spot in the side on current form? I'm sure if there was a replacement in the 2's to play his role, or allow deck chairs to be shuffled, the change would have been made. The reality is we don't have the depth just yet. I also agree he will be on a significantly reduced package when its time to renew.
He'll finish his career at Carlton on less money than he's on now, but will the supporters ever accept and support him?
Yes it annoys the sh1te! out of me when fans deride someone wearing the navy blue, it shouldn't happen, it should never happen!
If a blokes out there with the jumper on, making an effort, regardless of form and function, he is 100% Carlton. Fans should accept that fact and fall in behind every one of them with 100% support.
Yes it annoys the sh1te! out of me when fans deride someone wearing the navy blue, it shouldn't happen, it should never happen!
If a blokes out there with the jumper on, making an effort, regardless of form and function, he is 100% Carlton. Fans should accept that fact and fall in behind everyone of them with 100% support.
Damn right!
Yes it annoys the sh1te! out of me when fans deride someone wearing the navy blue, it shouldn't happen, it should never happen!
If a blokes out there with the jumper on, making an effort, regardless of form and function, he is 100% Carlton. Fans should accept that fact and fall in behind everyone of them with 100% support.
100% LP, however I admit to slipping up on this at times when the emotions take over.
I've attended plenty of games this year and tbh I haven't heard anything negative from the crowd directed at Daisy specifically. OK he isn't setting the world on fire but I think supporters are resigned to the fact that he's there for the time being and he does get encouraged, as do other players, when he does do something good.
I've attended plenty of games this year and tbh I haven't heard anything negative from the crowd.........
The supporters on this forum must be the exception to the rule in that case because he sure cops some crap on here.
I was discussing the CFC with my sister this morning, who is a life long and passionate Blue, and she hasn't got a good word to say about him.
The supporters on this forum must be the exception to the rule in that case because he sure cops some crap on here.
I was discussing the CFC with my sister this morning, who is a life long and passionate Blue, and she hasn't got a good word to say about him.
Its a Collingwood hatred thing I reckon. I know half a dozen Blues supporters who carried on like pork chops when we drafted MGuane, got Malthouse, Swann and the same with Daisy. They just hated the fact we got Filth people into our Club. Personally, I have always had respect for them. My best mate as a kid was a Filth supported and his parents took me to many Coll games. I love the Coll-Carl rivalry, I reckon its the best in he AFL. The Scum on the other hand, always despised them, always will.
Melbourne will have a bit of extra incentive with the North loss.
My best mate as a kid was a Filth supported and his parents took me to many Coll games. I love the Coll-Carl rivalry, I reckon its the best in he AFL. The Scum on the other hand, always despised them, always will.
I grew up in Pascoe Vale, nearly all of the local kids barracked for Essendon and I saw plenty of games at Windy Hill, nevertheless I hate them as much as you do.
My sister's neighbour in North Carlton was a bloke called Norm Crewther who played for Collingwood before the war until he did his knee, he was a lovely bloke and I remember him telling me that the hatred between Carlton and Collingwood was all between the supporters and that the players got along fine both on and off the ground.
Even today I think Daisy and Murph have been mates for a good while, well before Daisy came to Carlton.
I suspect if some club folk were asked they would say we benefitted alot from the services of Thomas. He is a very professional player that experienced success. In the shambles that he came to, we shouldn't underestimate the influence such a player could have had.
Yes he has not played that much, but in the working week, playing time is two hours. I recall malthouse saying how important nick duigan was to the club despite not being able to take the field.
I suspect if some club folk were asked they would say we benefitted alot from the services of Thomas. He is a very professional player that experienced success. In the shambles that he came to, we shouldn't underestimate the influence such a player could have had.
Yes he has not played that much, but in the working week, playing time is two hours. I recall malthouse saying how important nick duigan was to the club despite not being able to take the field.
His effects on the off field stuff may well be spectacular - unfortunately, I see little evidence of this filtering through to match day.
Melb need percentage, this could be a long afternoon.
Melb need percentage, this could be a long afternoon.
Indeed - well another season I can not wait for it to end before it ends. When is that feeling going to stop?
Silvani & kerrige out,
Everett & Graham in,
Tanking !!!!!!
Yep, tanking. I hope we don't gift the Dees a finals slot.
Silvani & kerrige out,
Everett & Graham in,
Tanking !!!!!!
Hardly tanking. Replacing like for like with roughly the same output, just not the same nous.
I'm disappointed that I won't see SOJ today but I'd rather see him fitter and firing in 2017.
Kerridge looked like he had run out of steam.
I don't think the changes will affect the result; Blues by 10 points :)
Hardly tanking. Replacing like for like with roughly the same output, just not the same nous.
i'd say Graham's nous better/higher than Kerridge's - the latter has made some stunning howlers this year.
Everitt - playing for his career?