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Topic: CV and mad panic behaviour (Read 93015 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3945
They only got involved when the Japs got ahead of themselves and attacked Pearl Harbor, they were happy to keep supplying everyone with equipment, keep the war running and make a dollar out of everyone. Hitler made the wrong move attacking Russia, he could have attacked England instead , would have won that easy but attacked Russia and it was downhill from there.


Operation Sealion - the invasion of Britain - was cancelled in Sep 1940 when Luftwaffe losses from the Battle of Britain were so great that the invasion could not succeed.

Operation Barbarossa - the invasion of Russia - began on 22 Jun 1941, long after Hitler had given up on invading Britain.

As for Pearl Harbour, the Japanese didn't get "ahead of themselves", all three US Pacific fleet carriers were at sea when the Japanese attacked.  The war could have taken a very different course if the carriers had been sunk at Pearl Harbour.  Neutralising  the US Navy's Pacific fleet was a key element of Japan's strategy, and they nearly pulled it off.

The US provided military equipment to the Allies via Lend-Lease which meant that no payments were required until the end of the war.  The US was the recipient of reverse Lend-Lease military equipment from Britain after it entered the war.  It was actually in the USA's interest to end the war quickly so they could get payment, hence their insistence on the bringing D-Day forward.
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3946
Interesting the figures in Dr John Campbells video. He was saying 67% vaccinated in the UK.

https://youtu.be/Jv3Q74CLU1c

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3947
Operation Sealion - the invasion of Britain - was cancelled in Sep 1940 when Luftwaffe losses from the Battle of Britain were so great that the invasion could not succeed.

Operation Barbarossa - the invasion of Russia - began on 22 Jun 1941, long after Hitler had given up on invading Britain.

As for Pearl Harbour, the Japanese didn't get "ahead of themselves", all three US Pacific fleet carriers were at sea when the Japanese attacked.  The war could have taken a very different course if the carriers had been sunk at Pearl Harbour.  Neutralising  the US Navy's Pacific fleet was a key element of Japan's strategy, and they nearly pulled it off.

The US provided military equipment to the Allies via Lend-Lease which meant that no payments were required until the end of the war.  The US was the recipient of reverse Lend-Lease military equipment from Britain after it entered the war.  It was actually in the USA's interest to end the war quickly so they could get payment, hence their insistence on the bringing D-Day forward.
I know about the lend lease agreement and yes the USA didn't supply arms. I'm talking American industry, Henry Ford was a nazi supporter and had factories in Europe run by American managers as did GM, Ford sold the Germans parts and aircraft lubricants.
GM supplied motors for Nazi trucks, Standard Oil were also supplying oil for fuels. They were disgraceful and used Panamanian flagged boats to ship it.

Ford even pressured the govt not to bomb his factories and got a compo package after the war worth millions because they did get bombed. Reported that Hitler had a photo of Henry Ford at the Reichstag and loved the bloke. Was that bad that the American troops found GMs sub brand Opel had been building motors and aircraft when they invaded Europe..
Roosevelt wanted Ford to up production at home but instead they were focused on their euro business. Ford was asked to build Rolls Royce Merlin engines but Henry himself knocked back the idea.
Those companies copped scrutiny after the war but hired a heap of legal teams to deflect the flak.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3948
    On the 7 News tonight, 2 interesting stats were given:
    • 6 million AZ doses have been administered in Australia.
    • According to a WHO advisor, In UK the 18-24 year olds are the age category with most infections of Delta over the last month, followed by the 5-18 year olds.
Did you know if you handed out 6,000,000 bags of peanuts to a random sample of population, you'd have 150,000 hospitalisations from allergic reactions of which you'd get 750 adult deaths and up to 3,000 infant deaths. :o

Sort of makes the risk from the scientifically formulated free vaccine injection seem pretty low, mother nature is pretty deadly though!

Do they still leave bowls of peanuts as a free snack on some bars?
The Force Awakens!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3949
Interesting the figures in Dr John Campbells video. He was saying 67% vaccinated in the UK.

https://youtu.be/Jv3Q74CLU1c
Nice link @spf‍ , really helps people understand herd immunity and the benefits of vaccination, as long as not too many of the population decide to leave getting a vaccination up to somebody else! :o
The Force Awakens!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3950
There is no conspiracy, just some conspiracists with a very poor understanding of how the testing works, cherry picking isolated facts and twisting them painted in a technical veneer.

Discussing PCR cycle thresholds is a distraction and diversion, labs only proceed to calculate the viral load after a positive detection, primarily because the system is deliberately weighted towards false positives which is the safe option, but these are all filtered out when viral loads are calculated.

Firstly, the labs just do not have the time to test all the samples collected to a deep thermal cycle threshold. Most are processing using the system defaults of 20 to 30 thermal cycles(equipment dependant) requiring between 30min to 60min to complete a PCR run.

The typical systems use 20 to 30 thermal cycles, the reports comparing the BGI PCR system are discussing the ability of the BGI to replicate the sensitivity and accuracy of the existing systems as part of a validation against systems most of which are not BGI. But even so it does not mean the BGI PCR systems are run to a high number of cycles as asserted by some detractor claims.

I believe the default BGI PCR use 30 cycles, the validation claim is that at 30 cycles the BGI will miss cases with very low viral load, not report false positives at a much higher rate. One cause/outcome is not the inversion of the other, asserting that the BGI needs more cycles to achieve low level sensitivity leads to more false positives is a false equivalence, because they just don't use it that way!

Secondly, the process is false positive biased at about 3% of all positives are false positives, and that is at the calibrated run length for the default of 20 to 30 thermal cycles(equipment dependant), so too many more cycles and you get a false positive anyway which is clearly not the case give how many positives are reported as a percentage of all tests. Do enough cycles with any machine and you get a false positive, which is why positive results are always repeated.

Finally, verification typically occurs by other means/methods and can take several days to complete, this is when you get confirmations of both viral load and the variant. After verification, the false positive rate falls from 3% of all positives to about 1 in 10000 of all positives, hardly an earth shattering conspiracy! :o

That looks to be a rather self serving response.

The ad hominem attack - I know more than you so butt out - classic LP.

The default BGI # of cycles - as per the manufacturer's specs - 38x.

Talking about 20-30 cycles blah blah is straw man stuff - from what very little information is released here and in NSW, it is undeniably clear that 40+ is common.

They wouldn't proclaim they were running tests at 40-45x if the vast majority weren't. Factoid.

Are some run at 20-30? Possibly.

But the fact remains that the greater majority of positive testees are showing little or no symptoms - which strongly suggests little or no viral load which strongly suggests more cycles are being run.

What is a positive detection in any event? Yes, well let's not forget all the PCR test is amplify a given sample, nothing more, nothing less.

And there's a matching with some sort of pre installed primer.

Verification? Of what, the PCR positive? By what means? And what are you verifying? You can't by definition verify a flawed test.

And given you're so good at stats, you'd know that it in a low prevalence population, where there is little virus, the % of false positives is very likely to be high - to the point numerically, that every result could well be a false positive.

You claim ongoing, later verification - likely true. Though i'd like to see what they do...

But by then the damage has already been done right.
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3951
I still find myself somewhat surprised that there are some brains out there that believe comparing the number of folks who sadly pass away after a vaccine with those who pass from the virus, is a legitimate comparison??? Wouldn't you compare, if you must, the numbers of those who died from the vaccine with the number of folks 'saved' by the vaccine???

In the interest of disclosure, I am p1ss poor at algebra, advanced mathematics and so on. In fact during such lessons at school I was the kid daydreaming, putting live crickets down the shirt of the girl sitting in front of me or doing imitation farts. After form 4 at Frankston High School we could drop all math subjects before going on to year 11. Ripper. I was more your science, psychology and sociology/anthropology nerd... oh, and sport, mmmm sport.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3952
That looks to be a rather self serving response.

The ad hominem attack - I know more than you so butt out - classic LP.

The default BGI # of cycles - as per the manufacturer's specs - 38x.

Talking about 20-30 cycles blah blah is straw man stuff - from what very little information is released here and in NSW, it is undeniably clear that 40+ is common.

They wouldn't proclaim they were running tests at 40-45x if the vast majority weren't. Factoid.

Are some run at 20-30? Possibly.

But the fact remains that the greater majority of positive testees are showing little or no symptoms - which strongly suggests little or no viral load which strongly suggests more cycles are being run.

What is a positive detection in any event? Yes, well let's not forget all the PCR test is amplify a given sample, nothing more, nothing less.

And there's a matching with some sort of pre installed primer.

Verification? Of what, the PCR positive? By what means? And what are you verifying? You can't by definition verify a flawed test.

And given you're so good at stats, you'd know that it in a low prevalence population, where there is little virus, the % of false positives is very likely to be high - to the point numerically, that every result could well be a false positive.

You claim ongoing, later verification - likely true. Though i'd like to see what they do...

But by then the damage has already been done right.


FB, no need to lead with 'self-serving' comment to the Spotted One before making your legitimate point. Though I do get it... El Spotto can come across as a know-all (look who's talking FFS). When I first joined this forum I thought he was an app that would automatically have an opinion on everything, absolutely everything. BUT, what I've come to understand and respect is an obvious high intelligence and legitimate concern for his fellows. Likewise, you. Both your opinions are valued.

Back to Covid. I recall very vividly your strong concern and care for your kids. And when I heard and read of what this Delta strain is doing to the young and very young I immediately thought of my grandson and your kids and the kids of my family & friends. The vaccines and the strategies to get them into everyone and the strategies (lockdowns) to protect as many people as possible could very well be the things that will protect your kids. And I believe kids are at increased risk of long-covid.

I now ask myself what is the next mutation of virus? First, elderly/sick/diabetics/immune compromised are the most vulnerable. Then Delta comes along, far more transmissible and increasingly dangerous to our young. Our vaccines may be chasing this pr1ck of a virus for years and years... but I'd rather give myself a fighting chance with a vaccine AND I'd rather wear a mask at every opportunity to protect others from my exhalations/sneezes/coughs etc. should I get the damn thing... and be asymptomatic. If I'm at a supermarket, kids are playing near me and I sneeze into my mask & sleeve... well, thank fck for that.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3953
    On the 7 News tonight, 2 interesting stats were given:
    • 6 million AZ doses have been administered in Australia.
    • According to a WHO advisor, In UK the 18-24 year olds are the age category with most infections of Delta over the last month, followed by the 5-18 year olds.

This is good data but what is the impact of these infections is a more important question from where I sit.
Come on you Blue FLAGGERS!!

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3954
This is good data but what is the impact of these infections is a more important question from where I sit.
Watch the video @spf‍ linked above, the UK doctor touches on the difference in symptoms between unvaccinated and vaccinated and why that is an important distinction when discussing infections in both groups. It's a first class plain language summary.

To summarise if you've not got the time to watch it.

 - The infection in vaccinated groups are mostly producing trivial symptoms, headaches, runny nose, sore throat.

 - The infections in unvaccinated groups are increasing in under 30s but decreasing in unvaccinated overall, probably due to the reduced availability of infection targets, UK 67% fully vaccinated so naturally there are less unvaccinated to infect.

 - Under 30s now form a higher percentage of hospitalisations and ICU critical care for Delta variant.
The Force Awakens!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3955
That looks to be a rather self serving response.

The ad hominem attack - I know more than you so butt out - classic LP.
I can fully see why you think my criticism is personal, I'm criticising global behaviours that you seem to locally replicate! ;)

Oddly there is nothing in the document that you link to support your claims, it's primarily a discussion on the calibration and verification of various PCR systems / methods and how they compare.

Posting lengthy documents to seemingly support spurious claims just by the documents presence, to add a semblance of technical or scientific credibility, it is a fairly obvious and repeated tactic by lobbyist groups going back to the tobacco industry that published pages and pages of documents accompanied by heavily distorted summaries. Of course if anybody actually reads the whole document they quickly know the truth.

Oddly, versions of many of the points I listed are even contained in the very document linked which supports my conclusions, has it not been read by the naysayers or are they just deliberately cherry-picking headlines or a brief segments of the summary to support the distorted conclusions they publish?

It is a bit like arguing infections are up in heavily vaccinated regions, without clarifying the case severity or viral loads, given that many infections in vaccinated individuals only present very mild or no symptoms, it can only be assumed the naysayer claims are a deliberate distortion to try and discredit the effectiveness of vaccines. Reminds me of Pete Evans.
The Force Awakens!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3956
The dissertations on this topic are endless.  I'm heartily sick of it, but I'm hardly alone either.

Nonetheless, life (such as it is) goes on.  Hopefully not with China.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3957
https://www.9news.com.au/national/australia-astrazeneca-vaccine-two-deaths-recorded-in-past-week-from-rare-blood-clotting-disorder/7605e3d5-29fc-4408-9638-b08b2ccca39f

6 Deaths from AstraZ vs 5 Deaths from the Delta Variant?
There may well only be 5 deaths to date from NSW COVID cases in recent times, maybe 6 now according to the news today.

But as the doctor in the video linked in the earlier @spfmessage points out, COVID deaths lag hospitalisations by a few weeks, and deaths can explode when the hospital system gets overrun.

How many hundreds or thousands of COVID cases a day can Australian hospitals deal with if we ignore the warnings and then by chance the flood gates open?
The Force Awakens!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3958
Gladys calling for the vaccination program to be ‘refocused’. Does that mean redirecting vaccine supplies to Sydney?
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #3959
Gladys calling for the vaccination program to be ‘refocused’. Does that mean redirecting vaccine supplies to Sydney?
Probably. They need to get it under control in NSW or we will ALL suffer the consequences.
2017 - 16th
2018 - Wooden Spoon
2019 - 16th
2020 - dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021 - Pi$$ or get off the pot