The question will arise: which of the coaches has made the most improvement to his team?
F*** me.
How is everyone's heart?
Gutsy effort from the boys. These are games they we would've lost in the past. Credit to the boys who just got it done in the end.
In the end we had half our backline missing, with 2 debutants down there and we struggled.
I said it in the pre-season, i said it in the pre-game and in the in-game. Boyd is NOT up to it. Do not pick him until he dominates for weeks on end in the VFL. Almost cost us the game. Couldn't stick a tackle to save himself.
Charlie limped off, said it was a rolled ankle and he'll be fine. Not 100% on that.
Pittonet got subbed out late.
Weitering grabbed at his groin on multiple occasions in the last, and grabbed at his foot/toe multiple times as well. He'd have to have an amputated to not play next week.
Silvagni was limping post game.
I hope we can keep our boys fit enough for next week.
Also very much looking for Saad coming back. We saw with JC how important run and carry off half back is, he single handedly got/kept them in the game and we missed that from our end.
Yep agree kruddler. I've not seen someone play afl footy with so few endearing qualities as boyd.
Hes not hard, he's not tough, he didn't read it well, lacked intensity, lacked composure, leaked goals all day and isn't overly quick. He can hit a target ok, but not necessarily using it well.
I dont need a lot to warm up to a player. Ive championed plenty of also rans but he's not even good enough to be that. Williamson is a much better footballer and that is saying a lot.
Im hoping it was just nerves but I think he had an opportunity to repel about 4 or 5 goals and each and every time was guilty of not understanding his limitations and playing the percentages. That is the absolute minimum for a half back IMHO.
Yep agree kruddler. I've not seen someone play afl footy with so few endearing qualities as boyd.
Hes not hard, he's not tough, he didn't read it well, lacked intensity, lacked composure, leaked goals all day and isn't overly quick. He can hit a target ok, but not necessarily using it well.
I dont need a lot to warm up to a player. Ive championed plenty of also rans but he's not even good enough to be that. Williamson is a much better footballer and that is saying a lot.
Im hoping it was just nerves but I think he had an opportunity to repel about 4 or 5 goals and each and every time was guilty of not understanding his limitations and playing the percentages. That is the absolute minimum for a half back IMHO.
I'd have played Martin off half back before Boyd.
I probably would've played Cottrell off half back before Boyd.
Willo....yep.
Hopefully Stocker isn't too far away, Saad comes back and we don't have to worry about Boyd back there anymore.
I saw Michael gibbons in the southern stand against the Tigers. The first time he took the field I saw tenacity and smarts. Size and speed were his limitations. Boyd... not sure what they were thinking. He is miles off it.
Very good win considering how the game played out.
Young had a very good debut for the club. Looking forward getting Saad and Stock into this team.
We got torn apart on more than a few passages of play copping goals out the back .. plenty to work on
We were forced to play 2 debutants down back. That in itself made us vulnerable to the Hawks forward line. Their forwards disassembled Port last week in impressive fashion. Let’s hope our outs are not across one line of play too often.
I thought we’d have to capitalise when we won the clearances. Although I didn’t think it would come down to the last 5 minutes 🥵
Hawks were very good and never lost hope, which is a credit and reminiscent of the 3peat era. We made the most of our chances early then fought like heck to just hold on. Those wins will be so beneficial to the belief and culture in general. Those wins, however, are not so good for faint hearted supporters.
Kudos all round to the team, coaches, and the Baggers cheering from the sidelines.
Side note. Murphy was excellent in the commentary box along with Lids. He provided calm(not sure how but I want what he’s got) informed well balanced comments throughout 👍
Brilliant early but the Hawks made it a blue collar slog fest with lots of contests and seemed to mongrel the ball forward.
CJ was impressive but we didn't chase him either and didn't show enough physicality after half time imo.
Wasn't that impressed with Hawthorn and still can't believe they got that close.
Young was ok on debut but Boyd looks like a VFL player and Saad was missed badly. Harry, Charlie and JSOS were a threat all day and both Durdin and Owies were very good. Weitering of course was the general down back and saved the day but we should never have allowed such a average team like the Hawks back into the game but I'll take the 4 points.
Fisher needs to do a lot more I reckon EB, he's treading water ATM.
Fisher needs to do a lot more I reckon EB, he's treading water ATM.
Prof, Agree...just went today IMO and needs a big game. I still remain unconvinced about Setterfield and Obrien as being in our best 22 but I'll give Obrien points for effort and I thought Setterfield did some ok too things but still remains a player I dont trust.
Williams is getting plenty of easy ball down back but is another who makes me nervous when he has to defend and I dont see him as desperate enough.
Watched a bit of the VFL and too be honest I didnt see a lot that would challenge Fisher or any of the others for their spots, Dow was handy but still makes disposal errors, Fogarty is handy and looks a good backup player for Durdin, Owies etec but to me needs to do more to force his way in and probably the best smaller type was ex Dogs player Will Hayes who isnt on the list.
Only needed 2 qtrs, no biggie.
Still have Philip and Honey to come back to the VFL side but more than happy to go to the draft this year.
Silvagni was limping post game.
Silvagni had a huge ice pack on his knee after last week's game.
It might be something he's playing through at the moment.
If so it makes his efforts more impressive.
Where are we at?
I'm not sure.
There are signs of definite improvement but the lapses and goal runs are still present.
We'll see in the coming weeks whether we are 'front running show ponies', a side that is still vulnerable when the pressure goes up a cog....or the real deal.
Hopefully the signs of improvement are genuine and sustainable.
Worst win ever.
Worst win ever.
Doesn't matter how pretty it is, at the end of the day its another 'W' and i'll take as many as we can get at this stage.
Teams that start 3-0 have a 70% chance of making finals and i think it was a 50% chance of making the prelim.
Worst win ever.
For you maybe, Ill happily take a win every week no matter how ugly, lucky or whatever other negative adjective you can think of.
Yep agree kruddler. I've not seen someone play afl footy with so few endearing qualities as boyd.
Hes not hard, he's not tough, he didn't read it well, lacked intensity, lacked composure, leaked goals all day and isn't overly quick.
Summed him up well ...
Worst win ever.
Guys, it was a win we wouldn't have had last year, or for most of this century. We really dug deep at the end there. With a little more luck and an umpire willing to pay frees we could have won by a lot more. It really irritated me that instead of getting a free kick 25 m from goal, the ball goes the length of the field for a goal to them. We tackled marvellously but gained few rewards for it.
And don’t forget Harry’s mark that was touched by the invisible man !
Fisher needs to do a lot more I reckon EB, he's treading water ATM.
I'm not sure that you're allowed to criticise Fisher ::)
He has had good quarters in the previous games and kicked important goals but just couldn't get into the game today. At least he managed to stick some tackles and that's a good way to get back some confidence and form. The VFL stream is kaput but there were a few blokes putting their hands up for a game, and then there's Martin ... and Jesse Motlop (edit).
There weren't too many opportunities for our small forwards today. The talls marked everything that came their way in the first quarter and Hawthorn's defenders marked just about every inside 50 in the next three quarters. The big blokes need to bring the ball to ground if they can't mark.
I reckon Fisher might get another week but he needs to take the game on and make the most of his opportunities.
And don’t forget Harry’s mark that was touched by the invisible man !
That was an absolute shocker.
I'm not sure that you're allowed to criticise Fisher ::)
He has had good quarters in the previous games and kicked important goals but just couldn't get into the game today. At least he managed to stick some tackles and that's a good way to get back some confidence and form. The VFL stream is kaput but there were a few blokes putting their hands up for a game, and then there's Martin ... and Jesse Motlop (edit).
There weren't too many opportunities for our small forwards today. The talls marked everything that came their way in the first quarter and Hawthorn's defenders marked just about every inside 50 in the next three quarters. The big blokes need to bring the ball to ground if they can't mark.
I reckon Fisher might get another week but he needs to take the game on and make the most of his opportunities.
I'd bring Martin in for Fisher.
Yep agree kruddler. I've not seen someone play afl footy with so few endearing qualities as boyd.
Hes not hard, he's not tough, he didn't read it well, lacked intensity, lacked composure, leaked goals all day and isn't overly quick. He can hit a target ok, but not necessarily using it well.
I dont need a lot to warm up to a player. Ive championed plenty of also rans but he's not even good enough to be that. Williamson is a much better footballer and that is saying a lot.
Im hoping it was just nerves but I think he had an opportunity to repel about 4 or 5 goals and each and every time was guilty of not understanding his limitations and playing the percentages. That is the absolute minimum for a half back IMHO.
What stood out for me most about Boyd was how easy he lost his feet. Maybe it was nerves or needs time to adjust to the pace of the game.
A question for EB1 as I see you were at the game: watching on tv de Koning seemed to go missing from midway through the third quarter and most of the last quarter. Was he on the bench during that time? What I did see of his play today wasn't too impressive.
And don’t forget Harry’s mark that was touched by the invisible man !
Nah, that bounced off the back of the hawthorn defender in front of him.
I thought it did that watching it live, then they showed a replay and it didn't look like it, then they showed another angle and it showed clearly bouncing off his back as originally thought.
A win is a win is a win.
MBB... I'll take an ugly win over an honourable loss every day of the week.
The new coaches got to see clearly our lapse under pressure and inability to get the game back on our terms... work in progress. BUT... the resilience and pure 'will' not to give up is incredibly encouraging. You could mount a legitimate argument for us being 0-3 had this been just about any year previous. We have improved and I reckon our 4 qtr best might just be awesome ...something to look forward to.
I also wouldn't underestimate the importance of a few missing blokes and the positive impact they'll have on the side.
Anyone else watch our last qtr in the VFL? Demolition job on the Box Hill Dawks. Overall in that game, encouraged by the efforts of Parks, Motlop, Dow and Mirkov. Kemp worked his way into the game.
Cripps and Kennedy-3x 30 plus possessions in the first 3 games of the season ;D
Good to see the big in game momentum swings that have bedevilled Carlton over the past couple of seasons have been eradicated by the new Coaching group, defensive structure and game plan. Didn't see the game but we didn't put Hawthorn to the sword when we had them down. We need to keep our concentration throughout the match and develop a killer instinct rather than play like millionaires when we are in top.
Well we have lost a lot of games in recent years from playing 1 bad quarter now we have won a game despite playing 3 bad quarters.
We look like we have gassed out in the last half of the last 2 matches. Maybe we're not used to running so hard....lol.
We finished over Richmond but after being in control they gassed out big time today as the Saints kicked 64pts unanswered. We have at least won those games still.
How good was SOS 🆘
His last goal was a ripper.
The coaches will work out what went wrong with our poor i50 use. Fix that and get close to our best 22 and we’ll trouble most
How good was SOS 🆘
His last goal was a ripper.
The coaches will work out what went wrong with our poor i50 use. Fix that and get close to our best 22 and we’ll trouble most
[1] Jack had 11 marks for 3 goals one. really put up his hand. And all three goals were brilliant, even if the third was best.
[2] Having Saad probably would have made a difference: his disposal may be unique, but he is more likely to hit targets. McGovern would also make a difference, as he would have flown for marks instead of worrying about who was around him. We just missed that at times, even though Lewis Young did a decent job.
Having that little bit of extra pace and strength in guys like Honey and Stocker would also make a difference.
The good thing was that we won without those guys, even with our suspect defence.
Doc had a great game and was one of the reasons we won. His opponents only saw his back, as he was running away from them. he took 13 marks, some of them real clutch marks. And he didn't stuff up his kicks much.
Boyd wasn't a disaster, but he still has a long way to go. You could tell he was very nervous, and he didn't get the run off the flank that he can really provide. What worried me was that he looked relatively weak. He was outmuscled a few time and his normal good ball handling just wasn't there. He'll go out for Saad, but he will be better for the run. The more he plays, the more confidence he gets, the more we'll see his strengths instead of his weaknesses.
[3] Getting us to deliver the ball better hasn't been an issue, but it was today. Even good players kicked directly to our forwards' opponents and really made life difficult for them. Both H and Charlie had their opponents beaten in an even contest, but after half time we didn't get any even contests.
Early in the game our small forwards were running rampant, but they faded when Hawthorn played an extra in defence. We've got to be quicker to counter something like that. Even then our small forward were unlucky not to get goal of the year. That was promising.
Durdin (11 possessions and 1 goal 2) looked very dangerous when we were moving the ball well, but he wasn't in possession often after half time.
Owies was the same. That little extra strength could be useful in both of them.
Fisher was probably the biggest disappointment of the three, even though he did spend time on the ball. He fumbles too often at the moment and gets bodied out too easily.
[4] Cripps had 11 tackles, yet how many frees did he get? Not very many.
George Hewett had 9 tackles and 9 clearances, yet how often was he rewarded? This is an issue that has reared its head before and probably will again. We had a couple of excellent tackles that weren't rewarded, a couple of huge rundowns that were, but too often we gave too much space to hawthorn players too often. A zone is nice, but hawthorn worked around it. We need a Plan B.
And don’t forget Harry’s mark that was touched by the invisible man !
I actually think Harry dropped it and then grabbed it again off Sicily's back.
However, the worse one was Sicily done cold losing the ball 30m out in a tackle - play on was the call and that led to Gunston booting one to grab the lead.
Both last week and this week, we went into slow, down the line footy which was picked off time and again. Lost count of the number of marks the Dawks took in their defensive 50, often unchallenged. We needed to make them work harder to get it back.
Our big achilles heel remains leg speed - as soon as the ball gets out the back, we are stuffed. That was basically the Dawks game plan - clog up our forward line, wait for a turnover, then go like the clappers while we all stood around like statues. That is where McGovern and Saad were sorely missed today.
And please, Vossy, have a word to Crippa about game awareness. With <5 min to go, and we leading by 7 points, he took a mark about 60 metres out. A wise-headed captain stops, takes time off the clock and then looks for a target. But Crippa took off straight away into an impossible situation, turnover, down the other end, Gunston goals from a free. Grrrr.....
Very good comments :)
I'm still not sure who came off for Martin, was it Pittonet?
And does activation of the sub mean the player who came off is automatically ruled out for the next match?
I'm still not sure who came off for Martin, was it Pittonet? Yes
And does activation of the sub mean the player who came off is automatically ruled out for the next match? No, if it wasn't a concussion substitution
Both teams made a lot of errors today, lots of dropped uncontested marks, lots of poor ball use heading into F50.
In the end we get an ugly win, but really if we'd kept our composure like the first two rounds we probably should have won by some comfortable margin. Our KPFs played a little naïve, and our SFs didn't give them suitable chop outs, this week we were well beaten for ground ball in our F50, never really looked like crumbing one. Dawks cleaned up too many of our F50 entries too easily.
I thought we didn't really get connected in the midfield either, we won plenty of hard balls but often made little forward progress, just not as clean this week as we have been in pervious weeks.
I actually think we got a bit greedy, I suspect the stats might show a drop in the GAs and 1%s.
Just finished watching the replay. Extremely frustrating after quarter time. Seemed to me that we began the 2nd qtr with much the same purpose and intent but about half way through, I don't know, we seemed to get cute?? Started to make the wrong decisions, poor delivery into F50, too much latitude on opponents. Were we getting arrogant? Anyway Dawks started to get a sniff and then we started to make more mistakes more out of panic. Did well to get the win really. Thought while it was our forwards who got us into a winning position it was the backline that saved the game. Doc, Weiters and even Newman and Plowman dragged us to the finish line. Thought Williams was very bad and Boyd will definitely make way for Saad. I also think Lewis Young was pretty good.
I'd give Fisher a rest and play Dow. Based on VFL reports I think he's earned it.
Our first quarter was probably the best football we have played for a decade or more. What happened next may have been a product of over-confidence or simply that Hawthorn's pressure disrupted our forward 50 entries and gave them the opportunity to score from rebounds.
What I think is indisputable is that Carlton teams of the last decade would have given up when we lost the lead in the last quarter. The fact that we got the lead back and defended it successfully is probably more important than the champagne footy we played in the first quarter.
The coaches and playing group will have a bit to take out of the game and that must help with our development. Meanwhile, 3-0 is probably beyond even the most optimistic supporter's expectations, particularly when the third win is over a previously undefeated team and one that we've struggled with recently.
Another positive is the first up form of Lewis Young. Despite the pressure on our defence from turnovers in our forward 50, Young showed good judgement and poise and, with Weitering, controlled the air with his marking and contest-killing spoils. Boyd was a less successful inclusion and he has to make way for Saad's return. The other likely change is Martin for Fisher.
Meanwhile, Paddy Dow is hammering on the selectors' door and Motlop, Kemp and Stocker aren't far behind.
A great win in the circumstances.
Very impressed with Young looked like he was given a job to do on Lewis and he stuck to it. Not flashy but steady with no Chaos kicking and I think will be a good partner to Weitering for awhile.
Can’t believe the dog’s rucked him with their undersized backline on todays form a definite win for Austin’s recruiting. Unfortunately Boyd dime a dozen VFA player others should now be preferred in front of him but he has had a taste of what’s required and the extra pace etc might help him to improve to handy level
Our first quarter was probably the best football we have played for a decade or more. What happened next may have been a product of over-confidence or simply that Hawthorn's pressure disrupted our forward 50 entries and gave them the opportunity to score from rebounds.
I was at the ground and I have to say a lot of us saw the momentum swing coming. Despite our start we looked flat, even in the 1st term, like the first two rounds had taken a lot of run out of our legs. We were terrific at the contest, but once the Dawks got into the open we were struggling to react and then slow to chase.
As much as fans bag LoB and Setters without those two today deep running from BP to FP we would have lost. Along with BigH, SoJ, Hewett and Owies they were the only others who ran hard all day. Even Cerra looked flat.
Dawks inexperience played into Weiters hand, and our ball use did much the same at the other end, we fatigued very early and the decision making and ball skills went out the window.
Dawks were undersized today, and after 1/4-time we could leverage that, it wasn't a great game.
Part of the problem will be new coach versus new coach, neither appeared clued up on what the other was doing and it showed.
Dawks dragged the likes of Durdin and Owies we'll up the ground after 1/4-time, and this meant despite being given lots of opportunities we had nobody at the feet of BigH, SoJ and Charlie running interference. It's a weakness in our game plan and when we lose the centre clearance it sticks out because we need Durdin and Owies chasing up beyond the wing.
I'm still not sure who came off for Martin, was it Pittonet?
And does activation of the sub mean the player who came off is automatically ruled out for the next match?
100% Pittonet is the AFL report.
100% Pittonet is the AFL report.
We will get a “please explain” for that as Pitto didn’t seem to be injured.
We will get a “please explain” for that as Pitto didn’t seem to be injured.
Twice he went to ground in the last 5 minutes and struggled to get up off the deck without assistance.
The eight is certainly shaping up to be different from 2021
We look like we have gassed out in the last half of the last 2 matches. Maybe we're not used to running so hard....lol.
Not a joke - I think the high pressure game that we are playing is almost impossible to sustain for an entire match - maybe we will gain further conditioning as the season progresses - if not, we will need to improve the efficiency of plan B for when we need to play some tempo football.
We looked to try and be a bit cute after 1/4 time was how I saw things.....but obviously just from the TV. Gone was the precision kicking into the forward line and a bit of the old fashioned panick kicks and handballs crept back in....Williams a culprit for sure.
But wins over the Hawks have been few and far between over the years so I'll take the 4 points. We've found a way to win all 3 games....twice when we've been behind in the last quarter....and against the Dogs (last year's Grand Finalists) when they were coming hard. In recent years we probably would've lost all 3.
I thought Young showed some really good signs with some confident marks and big spoils. Long term he's probably the second key defensive bloke with McGovern more of an intercept role.
Boyd didn't look up to the tempo at all so probably goes back out for Saad assuming Saad is right to go.
Probably sound like a broken record but Silvagni is just such an important player for us. He plays the perfect 3rd tall option but he's ferocious when it hits the ground and/or if we haven't got the ball. His non-stop running and chasing and tackling sets the example and it was fitting that he kicked the winning goal IMO.
Weitering and Docherty huge down back and I thought Newman was a lot more composed today.
Anyone else notice how good Hewett is at keeping his feet and getting his arms free when tackled so he can still get rid of it? He's been a huge bonus and, along with Kennedy's form, is one of the reasons we're 3-0. Walsh wasn't up to his usual lofty standards but when Hewett and Kennedy step up, it doesn't hurt us as much.
GC won't be an easy one either, especially up there but we've got the forward line and midfield more than capable of winning....dare to dream of a 4-0 start.
Gov - I'm convinced more than ever the player we missed was Gov, he has the ability to deliver some stability when we try to change momentum, then he can kick the eyes out of a crow at 50m, and when he does we change direction and all of a sudden we score.
Walsh might be professional and extremely talented, but it's obvious he's struggling fitness and strength wise having missed a chunk of pre-season.
Cerra might be cleared to play, but COVID or something has impacted his running ability.
De Koning struggled a bit, he started the season like a train but has gone off the boil, he might be carrying an injury and has lost elevation and timing in ruck contests. Some of this will be due to the weird umpiring penalties we have copped in the ruck, we shouldn't be changing the ruck tactics, we should be asking for a please explain from certain umpires about certain decisions and telling Pittonet and De Koning to ignore the aberration. When an umpire does a shizen bounce it's not the ruck's responsibility to clear out and give his opponent a free run, the ruck has a right to hold his ground and defend the fall of the ball! But the real problem is that when Nankervis does it he is not penalised, but when Pitto does it he's pinged for blocking, it's bullshizen variable umpiring!
Given the good form of BigH and Charlie, we have become a bit more predictable, we stopped picking out those smaller options as often and just started bombing it long to the taller timber too often.
We lost structure and they tightened up in our forward line as the bombs continued, but not to our advantage and didn't have the same presence on the ground for the spills as in the first quarter.
The first quarter was great, second half, we lost our one-touch skills and started fumbling a lot - as well as slipping over a bit.
I thought Kennedy took a couple of really nice marks early, that had they been spilled we may have been in trouble.
I was at the game, great being in a big crowd again - the noise when the Hawks hit the front was pretty impressive, but not as good when we got back in front (although was pretty loud when Durdin kicked the goal that ended up being touched).
I'm getting too old, so find it hard to tell who has been a standout at the game. There were a few great kicks by LOB, some of H's chasing was great, some great marks, Jack S had a really good game - his last quarter just kept on presenting and being an option.
CJ had an excellent 3rd quarter for Hawks, but we did keep kicking it to him.
For those playing at home, the issue wasn't what we did, its what the hawks did.
They were able to get 6 to the full back line and run out of defense whilst we were content to keep entering deeply.
We should have been eyeing off spares up the ground but the hawks were disciplined and we had too many trying to press up which meant they could rebound easily.
That was their only game against us, playing counter punch footy and I think voss was happy with that because it allows you to attack as you need to. Where it broke down was the ability to bring the ball to ground in the forward line.
Credit to hawthorn for making our strength our weakness.
The art for our boys is knowing how to change it and react because we were stuck trying to ram it in and didn't do enough to create separation in the forward line. At least that's how I saw It.
For those playing at home, the issue wasn't what we did, its what the hawks did.
They were able to get 6 to the full back line and run out of defense whilst we were content to keep entering deeply.
Those of you who were at the ground may also have noticed at least once the game resumed with only 5 in the Dawks F50, the warning they got was actually a 2nd offence not the first. Our fans and players were actually remonstrating to umpires at the time and umpire Leigh Fisher ignored it. Some Dawks fans were claiming they had one short on the field as a defence, but no Dawks ran into the F50 until after the next restart.
In any case, if that is true and you are one short on the field, is that legal under the current rules?
Things that would have been strange if we said them 12 months ago..... ;D
We really missed McGovern!
Kennedy notches up his 3rd 30 disposal game in a row!
An interesting perspective that I heard today was:
- Ironically what got us to that big lead (playing style) ultimately got us to conceding it
- Making changes to stop a run is a short term view (ie within a game), coninuing to play to your identity is the long term view and may cost a win or two along the way.
I thought that was a pretty interesting way to look at it.
Similar to what ol mate Thry says in #51 (Credit to hawthorn for making our strength our weakness)
An interesting perspective that I heard today was:
- Ironically what got us to that big lead (playing style) ultimately got us to conceding it
- Making changes to stop a run is a short term view (ie within a game), coninuing to play to your identity is the long term view and may cost a win or two along the way.
I thought that was a pretty interesting way to look at it.
Similar to what ol mate Thry says in #51 (Credit to hawthorn for making our strength our weakness)
I was just going to say similar to your first point (and Thry's) but expand on it a bit.
There was 1 obvious difference between the first quarter and the rest. In the first quarter, we literally clunked everything. Harry, Charlie, Jack, Cripps all took big marks I50 in the first quarter. Commentators were raving about how many CM's we had taken and we're at the average early in the 2nd quarter.
From there though, we didn't take those marks (or enough, at the same frequency) and the ball was well cleared as a result.
The big forwards were on fire early and our mids got lazy as a result. "Bomb it up, someone will mark it." worked early, but not often enough later on. Hawks were awake to it and chopping everything off and rebounding, quickly, from there. We were chasing a lot more tail because of it, and ultimately tiring ourselves out......which exacerbated the problem.
In R1, it was the smalls and mids.
In R2, it was the talls.
In R3, it started with the talls, and the smalls barely got a lookin because the ball never hit the deck.
We lost structure and they tightened up in our forward line as the bombs continued, but not to our advantage and didn't have the same presence on the ground for the spills as in the first quarter.
The first quarter was great, second half, we lost our one-touch skills and started fumbling a lot - as well as slipping over a bit.
I thought Kennedy took a couple of really nice marks early, that had they been spilled we may have been in trouble.
I was at the game, great being in a big crowd again - the noise when the Hawks hit the front was pretty impressive, but not as good when we got back in front (although was pretty loud when Durdin kicked the goal that ended up being touched).
I'm getting too old, so find it hard to tell who has been a standout at the game. There were a few great kicks by LOB, some of H's chasing was great, some great marks, Jack S had a really good game - his last quarter just kept on presenting and being an option.
CJ had an excellent 3rd quarter for Hawks, but we did keep kicking it to him.
Thought Hawthorn went harder at the ball in the second half, their kid mids like Worpel, Newcombe, McDonald wanted it more and few of our blokes thought the job was done and stopped contesting and chasing.
We have the weapons and class now to kick big scores and win shootouts so I'm expecting opposing teams to be a lot more physical and turn games into scrimmages and ugly contests to bring us back to the field a bit.
We have the weapons and class now to kick big scores and win shootouts so I'm expecting opposing teams to be a lot more physical and turn games into scrimmages and ugly contests to bring us back to the field a bit.
Yep, dealing with that is the next big test, it's the difference between being a good side and being the next Nthmond.
We need to kick the ball so our talls can run and hit the pack on the move. We continually kick onto their heads and they just stand their and jump which is easily defended.
When they are on the move watch out, such as Harry's last mark on the wing.
Still get worried when LOB has the ball. Seems to put his team mates under pressure with his decision making. Yes he can run and yes he can kick the ball but... he seems like a very talented, fit VFL player. Good but not quite there.
Great to finally watch a game with SOME confidence that we have a great chance of winning. It;'s only been 21 years.
Great work Vossy, love the Vosswagen!
Things that would have been strange if we said them 12 months ago..... ;D
We really missed McGovern!
Kennedy notches up his 3rd 30 disposal game in a row!
Just on Gov, I think he is a defender who is attacking but can actually defend (which is a lost art with all the zoning BS).
IMO Defenders who can actually defend are worth their weight in gold, they win you games (eg Weiters yesterday). Weiters is a gun, a pure defender who is selfless. I think Gov has the similar traits, I think Saad is a very good small defender as is Doc.
The rest? There are a couple who I believe will cost us games and this needs a serious look at by the coaches.
Not so sold on McGovern as a defender but like his brother he is the genuine intercept defender. Weitering and Plowman are genuine lockdown types but only Saad and Stocker imo do both attack and defend well.
Docherty imho is another whose defending is questionable at times.
If Weitering was to get injured then I feel we would be very shaky down back.
Not so sold on McGovern as a defender but like his brother he is the genuine intercept defender. Weitering and Plowman are genuine lockdown types but only Saad and Stocker imo do both attack and defend well.
In fairness
@ElwoodBlues1 it took you many years to be convinced about Weitering, I suppose in this regard you wouldn't be classified an early adopter! ;D
In fairness @ElwoodBlues1 it took you many years to be convinced about Weitering, I suppose in this regard you wouldn't be classified an early adopter! ;D
I'll pay that LP and give you bonus points for having a good memory. :D
Regarding Weitering, did anyone else find it odd, when he over committed to a marking contest, allowing Gunston to waltz into 50 and create a 2 on 1 situation where they were almost guaranteed a goal?
Was the one that put Hawthorn in front, and I remember thinking to myself, for the first time Weitering absolutely failed to play the percentages there and should have just held him up in order to try and get some mates back. Either that, or he is carrying an injury and knew that Gunston would just run past him on the mark, and he would be done.
Thing is, we cant see what he sees either, and it might have been a fait accompli based on no one else running back to help.
Regarding Weitering, did anyone else find it odd, when he over committed to a marking contest, allowing Gunston to waltz into 50 and create a 2 on 1 situation where they were almost guaranteed a goal?
Thing is, we cant see what he sees either, and it might have been a fait accompli based on no one else running back to help.
Maybe it's a TV issue, I was at the ground and that happened in front of me, the Dawks already had an overlap with a spare player forward of the ball. Weitering had no choice but to try and intercept the pill before it got back to where they already had greater numbers. The Dawks were sprinting forward off our Mids from the 2nd Qtr onwards, pretty much every time CJ got the pill they would just take off. So pace is still a glaring issue, but I have to say we looked flat even in the 1st Qtr.
More disturbing was how many of their blokes were giving our blokes the "Don't Argue" and getting away too easily, we missed so many tackles it cost us dearly.
We needed an extra small / medium lock down forward who could exert pressure of CJ, BigH was about the only bloke we had that could run him down and who was sticking tackles, but often BigH wasn't near the scene of the crime.
Talking to a few Dawks fans after the game, they had Weiters as Carlton's best, they said he monstered their medium forwards all day long. They had their bloke CJ as best overall, I thought Doc was best overall. So much you don't see on TV, the hard work is often already done and dusted before they come into camera view.
Yes, Weiters was in a hard place. At the game, I did think the better option was to have tried to hold Gunston up. (Not that it matters, but I didn't realise it was #23 at the time).
Interestingly, the Parkin medalist (Doc) wasn't in the coaches votes.
Interestingly, the Parkin medalist (Doc) wasn't in the coaches votes.
@dodge not sure where you are looking, he got BoG with 9 votes!
AFLCA
9 Sam Docherty (CARL)
8 Changkuoth Jiath (HAW)
5 Jacob Weitering (CARL)
5 Patrick Cripps (CARL)
3 Dylan Moore (HAW)
https://aflcoaches.com.au/awards/the-aflca-champion-player-of-the-year-award/leaderboard/2022/20220103
Oops. Quite wrong on my behalf!
Regarding Weitering, did anyone else find it odd, when he over committed to a marking contest, allowing Gunston to waltz into 50 and create a 2 on 1 situation where they were almost guaranteed a goal?
Was the one that put Hawthorn in front, and I remember thinking to myself, for the first time Weitering absolutely failed to play the percentages there and should have just held him up in order to try and get some mates back. Either that, or he is carrying an injury and knew that Gunston would just run past him on the mark, and he would be done.
Thing is, we cant see what he sees either, and it might have been a fait accompli based on no one else running back to help.
To be honest, Jacob hasn't looked 100% yet. He is never that quick, but he appears to be carrying a few niggles at the moment. Maybe lacking the confidence he had last year as a result. He will be better. Last year he often ran off his man and provided a target and he took a lot more marks. he has done neither very often this season. But, it will come.