As supporters outside the walls of the organisation, we obviously dont possess any facts around selection or non selection of players. However we do see the end results of selection and can only trust that the MS are making the right calls. Dow is an odd one, he is getting a lot of the footy week in week out in the twos and he does posses a trait all of our current first choice mids dont, break away speed. For that reason alone, give us a look at him MC, unless the data they may posses suggests otherwise, he cannot possibly do any worse than those currently playing in the ones. Over on BF there was a suggestion from someone they heard the only change this week will be Fisher for SOS.
If that change is true then I will be in despair. Fisher has done nothing in the VFL to warrant a return to the firsts.
I don't agree that the players are apathetic and I don't believe they lack pride. And I don't believe that the genuine efforts of dozens upon dozens of people at the club should be denigrated by that sort of nonsense. There is no doubt in my mind that the players and coaches carry the hurt way more than armchair experts. One must legitimately ask what a membership fee, entry to the game etc., actually buys you. It doesn't buy you the right to spout dribble, or to insult and belittle others and treat them like sh1t.
In a commercial, competitive environment, clubs are in the business of selling hope. Hope can be the allure of playing finals, it can be the allure of a top coach, young No1 draft pick etc. Clubs will always try to give supporters some reason to believe. You won't ever find a club that will tell you this season will be a write off, don't bother, come back next year. I don't believe everything the club says - why can't Mr Snapper apply some very basic critical thinking skills and wait until he sees some evidence of improvement before he parts with is hard earned ? Oh wait, he's from talkback land, so.............
I am 100% convinced that players, coaches and clubs in general must find supporters to be a mixed blessing.
Let's agree to disagree.
Carlton has a paid up membership of some 80 thousand. I believe that they believe membership entitles them to entry into a ground, no more, no less.
Whether they cheer, clap, jeer, shout at the umpire, or opposition players or even their own team players, contact radio hosts, newspapers etc to give their opinions is totally unrelated to their membership.
Their actions are no different from those supporters, also as passionate, who do not have memberships but attend matches on a regular basis.
As for Mr Snapper and his failure to apply some very basic critical thinking skills, probably it is caused by what you say the clubs are selling - hope. In the Carlton context that word could be replaced by 'wishful thinking'. For people to buy into "hope" or "wishful thinking" occasionally requires the suspension of basic critical thinking skills.
As for the true believer, the supporter who turns up to every match decked out in jumper and beanie and believing against all the odds that Carlton will win each game, basic critical thinking skills have never been a prerequisite.
I agree with you that players, coaches and clubs in general must find supporters to be a mixed blessing, but without them the AFL would not survive.
I agree. He probably does think those things. But I'm not convinced that type of behaviour is anything other than selfish. I don't believe it leads to anything good. I don't believe it represents any real understanding of football clubs, or football players or football in general. It's just a selfish vent. Supporters need to accept their agency and be more responsible. Those types of outbursts lead to coach sackings and more. People from the club read the temperature of the room from many sources : forums like this, direct contact from fans, talkback radio (God forbid) etc.
I don't understand your saying it's a selfish vent. He sounds like a long-time supporter who has bought into the current message of the club that we are finally on the up and up, and based on that information he has parted with hard earned cash for membership.
And has the club delivered? Definitely not. The Collingwood game was more of the same litany of basic skill errors, the usual brain fades etc, delivered by a team that had no pride and for the most part seemed detached from proceedings.
Fans such as Snapper help fill the financial coffers of clubs. If the Carlton side keeps presenting at future matches with the same apathetic attitude then the club may get a rude awakening at the end of the season when it calls on members to dip into their wallets for next year's membership.
Our biggest problem is our best players are not doing any damage despite their stats. Docherty, Cripps, Walsh and Wetering are our leaders and they show no direction out there. Malthouse said it before the game that Collingwood would show our boys what leadership looks like and he was spot on.
Agree. A good example of brain fade by a senior player occurred in the second half when Docherty took possession in the centre following a turnover. He ran to the half forward line and then, under no pressure, unloaded a long bomb deep into the forward line.
There was not one Carlton player within 40 metres but there were three Collingwood defenders, one of whom gratefully took a chest mark and drove the ball straight into attack.
I feel sorry for Voss. He is being let down by senior players not setting an example for the team.
Yep, Hollands needs a rest. Ed can have a stint in the 2's Young is underperforming and should be swapped out for Kemp. Harry in the ruck would only be relief...and would spend most of the time sitting in the goalsquare or on the bench, so its basically whats happening now. I'd give him a 1 week rest to boost his confidence and bring him back. Binns, i missed most of the first half today which is when he really dominated, but might be a time to bring him and dow in for hollands and Ed. Durdin might miss too (leg?), rather than bring in Honey or Fisher, i'd go straight for Martin or Cuningham.
Binns is a type of footballer you rarely see these days - he can kick with either foot. I saw him trapped against the boundary line near the goal and when his path was blocked to kick with his right foot he simply balanced and shot off a quick left foot pass to a player who was then in a position to score.
He is small and it's hard to judge if he is ready for AFL but looks promising for the future.
Thinking about it, he could be an improvement on either Motlop or Durdin considering how they are going at the moment.
Make sure Charlie has a shadow, and Harry has a shadow. Ensure neither of them are targeted without one of our smalls ready to pounce at their feet.
A couple time we went to Harry when he was 1-on-1 and he failed to mark. 99 times out of 100, he loses once the ball is dropped. We must have a small forward with him to mop up. Similarly with Charlie, although he is a bit better on the ground, just not as good as required.
Of course we can use this to our advantage and have Harry block for our small forwards who can find space themselves and we kick to them instead.
But, it should all start by 'pairing' a small forward with a key forward.
I agree. But why aren't we doing that now?
For as long as I've been following football it's been accepted that part of the role of small forwards is to go after the ball once it hits the ground at the feet of the tall forwards.
My worry is that we don't have players on the list with the necessary hand and foot skills to make this happen - and who are also lacking in decision making.
As people have stated, our delivery into F50 is awful. That's a coaching issue. So DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT Voss.
If players can't deliver the ball into F50, then F them off and get some one who can
Seriously, why can't these idiots spot up somebody else other than bombing it to Charlie and Harry...surely JSOS and the others are making position!?!
Part of the problem when we do go forward is that Durdin, Motlop and Owies seem to go missing, allowing the backs to clear the ball away under little if any pressure, and we are in trouble again.
While we have to rely on Charlie and H to do most of the work then the ball is directed to them and we become so predictable.
Also, our poor kicking for goal from set shots is a morale killer.
Perhaps the powers that be have decided that any side that can produce the rubbish we dished up in recent weeks can't be trusted not to do the same thing again and thereby destroy ratings.
