If I can only tell the future ... I'd be in deep faecal matter!
Back to our old Carlton style unfortunately. Game of 2 totally contrasting halves 😖 We even kicked straight in the first half. Then......
We had no answer for the big American or the speedy Stephenson.
Not sure why we didn't catch on to Grundy giving Adams silver ruck service. Credit to their mids. We didn't get our hands on it around the contest. In fact we were way off the mark in the 2nd half.
Very disappointing second half. If that's our best after a 9d break against a sub-par pies midfield, I worry for our next 3 short break games.
Probably the most disappointing performance of the year. Still mentally soft when a decent opponent brings serious, sustained heat. Better than last year, but that is feint praise.
Haven't got the experience playing for a spot in the finals. Showed in the last qtr. Too much panic under pressure playing for a finals spot. That was my worry all week that such a game would see us crap the bed. Half expected at our stage of development.
We should go 8-9, 9-8, which we have taken at the start of the year, but it shows we have plenty to learn to hit the next step, especially mentally.
A part of learning and developing. Never going to go from bottom to top straight away. We have to go through this part where we learn to play under a different sort of pressure. We'll be better for it.
Probably the most disappointing performance of the year. Still mentally soft when a decent opponent brings serious, sustained heat. Better than last year, but that is feint praise.
Had to be partially expected. Completely different sort of pressure. Biggest game since the 2013 EF so I was interested to see how we'd cope with it. Physically ok to go, mentally didn't handle it in the last qtr. That's the learning part.
Probably the most disappointing performance of the year. Still mentally soft when a decent opponent brings serious, sustained heat. Better than last year, but that is feint praise.
Imagine the result with Sidebottom, Treloar and a couple of other players in the side. Probably our worst game for the season. Bitter result that could have been worse. 2020 done. Start thinking about recruiting players that make a genuine difference.
Beaten by a better side.
Quite a few players down on the form of previous weeks.
Time to play the kids, do some experimentation....and maybe give a few a farewell game.
Once again we got to 9 (10?) points up but just couldn't get THAT goal.
Instead, it was a series of fumbles, poor decisions, and loose checking which finally got Coll'wood the goal which put a spring in their step and the rest was miserably predictable.
Had everything to play for today so I'll never understand the mentality or psychology of this bunch.
Teague gets a 2 out of 10 today.
The only positive is that we're a game closer to seeing a few players give it away ... I hope.
We all got ahead of ourselves, players included. I said it after team selections in picking 2 kids that have shown SFA and whack them both in together against a well drilled team. I don't care that they were undermanned the bulk of their list have played a lot of finals and they were never going to be easy beats.
That was the start of it IMO.
Our back six as a unit have been settled and a consistent area for us. How dumb is it to bring a bloke like Poulson into that mix -even for his own development it was a massive ask. Adams tore him a new one early and while i have seen him play worse games its wasnt the right time for such a risk risk to be taken and smacked of cockyness.
This game highlighted how far off our midfield is when a team with 3 of there best 5 mids out and we still get beaten up badly in the middle. We could have done with a big bodied mid like Kennedy and couldn't have hurt having the goal smarts of Cunningham roaming deep near goal. I know he is quiet too often but he is dangerous and requires attention and i think that type of player would have loved to highlight his skills in a massive game like this.
Send it countless times the midfield needs at least 2 A-B graders before we can talk about finals let alone dreaming about flags and this game showed we are miles off the real teams.
Lost this one in the coaches box and selection table.....Polson and Dow in an important game was a mistake and Teague got out coached by Buckley. Elliott in the middle worked well for them and surprised us and I thought Adams was the best player on the ground with his grunt work. Our forwards were disgraceful in terms of pressure in the second half...Noble, Quaynor and Crisp just racked them up, never had a man and we just bombed the ball long like we usually do when we have no plan B and they have the talls in Moore and Roughead to match our talls so we couldnt take any marks even on a dry day.
Daicos slaughtered us after half time and we just let him run around on his own and he created mayhem with his pace and clever ball use. Rucks were not too bad TDK, Pittonet ganged up on Grundy but I thought the Collingwood man stuck at it and we didnt get the dominance we should have...
Cripps was kept to an ordinary game by Pendlebury and Walsh wasnt dominant either...Ed battled on but his ball use wasnt great.
Eddie had his moments but the kid Quaynor worried us with his pace and ball use and Eddie didnt have the wheels to stop him..
Gibbons was poor, Fisher patchy and probably Setterfield was our best player.
Another good move by Buckley was Mihocek on Weitering in a defensive role, our man didnt really have his usual great intercept game and Mihocek chipped in with a few goals late. Cox was useless but being so big demanded attention and also got a couple of goals by sheer weight of attacking ball that was sent his way.
Plowman had a shocker as did Docherty imo.....Stephenson was too quick and smart and became the leadup target but Teague didnt seem to get what Collingwood were doing and it was the wrong matchup.
Williamson was shaky and Simpson battled on but its the end for him in a few weeks.
Given what Collingwood had out in terms of class it was a poor effort on and off the field....got to question Barkers role and what input he has into matchups and tactics as well.
Again when we wrestle control of the game and the opposition respond with tenacity and strategic change, our appointed leaders failure to respond... that's on-field leaders and those in the coaching box.
Imagine the result with Sidebottom, Treloar and a couple of other players in the side. Probably our worst game for the season. Bitter result that could have been worse. 2020 done. Start thinking about recruiting players that make a genuine difference.
Spot on. Too many patted the club on the back for snaring C graders during this rebuild, yet the real point was we failed because we couldn't influence genuine A graders - put simply we wont take the next step unless we can get real mccoy A grade midfielders in the door at seasons end.
Cripps is busted up already and looks half the player he was which is a real worry. Without bolstering our main deficiency we may not be a bottom team anymore but i can assure you we wont ever be a genuine threat either.
Our forwards were disgraceful in terms of pressure in the second half...Noble, Quaynor and Crisp just racked them up, never had a man and we just bombed the ball long like we usually do when we have no plan B and they have the talls in Moore and Roughead to match our talls so we couldnt take any marks even on a dry day.
The long high balls into the forward line are so easy to defend against especially if your 'markers' are having an off day.
If we were hoping for our small forwards to reap a crumbing benefit...it wasn't really happening.
The big forwards weren't grabbing them.
Yet we persisted with it.
Too predictable
Once again we got to 9 (10?) points up but just couldn't get THAT goal.
Instead, it was a series of fumbles, poor decisions, and loose checking which finally got Coll'wood the goal which put a spring in their step and the rest was miserably predictable.
Had everything to play for today so I'll never understand the mentality or psychology of this bunch.
Teague gets a 2 out of 10 today.
The only positive is that we're a game closer to seeing a few players give it away ... I hope.
That was the main test, playing under this type of pressure for the first time since the 2013 EF. Good enough physically but didn't cope with it mentally when everything was on the line. That's why I want us involved in these games. When we are likely a better side next year I want to make sure we are mentally ready for big occasions when the time comes. It's learning. Half expected we'd $hit the bed. Big leap from the worst rabble ever to a finals contender in 12 months.
Time to rest Cripps and let the rest of them pull their weight.
That was the main test, playing under this type of pressure for the first time since the 2013 EF. Good enough physically but didn't cope with it mentally when everything was on the line. That's why I want us involved in these games. When we are likely a better side next year I want to make sure we are mentally ready for big occasions when the time comes. It's learning. Half expected we'd $hit the bed. Big leap from the worst rabble ever to a finals contender in 12 months.
12 months? Been about 5 years!
Beaten by a better side.
Quite a few players down on the form of previous weeks.
Time to play the kids, do some experimentation....and maybe give a few a farewell game.
Just cant play 'the kids' Bolton did that and we couldnt beat a local U18 team when we go too young. Have to finish the year off with at least another 2 wins otherwise good luck trying to convince any one that can make a difference to play for us.
We will end up with more scraps again
C'est la vie
12 months? Been about 5 years!
12 months ago after being $hit for 5 years.
12 months ago after being $hit for 5 years.
12 months ago we looked okay, on the rise. Sadly we haven't improved.
Need to clean out the dead wood. Marc Murphy has cost Paddy Dow a whole season of development.
12 months ago we looked okay, on the rise. Sadly we haven't improved.
Just over 12 months ago we were on the bottom after winning 4 from the last 43. Since then we've gone 12-12. But, of course we haven't improved...lol!!!!
Hardwick took 7 years to make Richmond the side they are now.
Just over 12 months ago we were on the bottom after winning 4 from the last 43. Since then we've gone 12-12. But, of course we haven't improved...lol!!!!
Hardwick took 7 years to make Richmond the side they are now.
We haven't made finals for 7 years. Collingwood were missing a quarter of their best 22. Enough excuses.
Resting Cripps and Weitering next game might be a good idea. They both look like they need it.
I agree that we have problems in the midfield. I have even more concerns with our forward line. The way the game is coached today with forward lines packed, until we can get players who can dominate at full forward and/or centre half forward we are just dreaming of ever being more than a middle of the road side.
Our expectations of Martin have been too high. Believing he could be the key to the forward line's success was a mistake. He reminds me of Brad Pearce in size and ability, and nobody expected him to carry the forward line load for the 1990s sides.
I'm over Harry. He has had enough time to put his stamp on the game. He reminds me of Daniher in his attitude - turned on one minute then disappears the next.
Shocker! Showed yet again we are a long way off being top 8 side. Another game where we play 2-3 quarters and then stop completely. Lots of points..mostly bad:
1. Still no support for Cripps when he had a bad day. Walsh battled hard but he's only a 2nd year player. Curnow battles hard as always but we lack polish and finish in the midfield.
2. Has Docherty played a worse game for us? Fumbled, poor disposal, poor decision making at times......
3. Martin.....playing 20-30 minutes of footy in a game might work in a top side but not when you're one of the bottom 6 or 7 teams. Looks like he could be anything but then just completely stops...rarely sighted after half time. Like many, just doesn't look like he words hard enough.
4. Was anyone playing on Daicos after half time? Thrashed us and got countless uncontested posessions.
5. Dow showed once again he's not up to AFL level....even if it was his first game back. Doesn't get near the footy and when he does, looks like a deer in the headlights and just turns it over. Similarly Polson....got a few touches early but his original opponent was Thomas who dominated in the first quarter. If those two play again it demonstrates our lack of midfield class and depth.
6. Jones...superb again. Would've been a lot worse without him.
7. Hate to say it but the end is getting nearer for Simmo.....been one of the greatest ever Blues players but not sure we're in a position to have him go around again. Need some spark and Williams from GWS as a Free Agent would be handy.
Shocker! Showed yet again we are a long way off being top 8 side. Another game where we play 2-3 quarters and then stop completely. Lots of points..mostly bad:
1. Still no support for Cripps when he had a bad day. Walsh battled hard but he's only a 2nd year player. Curnow battles hard as always but we lack polish and finish in the midfield.
2. Has Docherty played a worse game for us? Fumbled, poor disposal, poor decision making at times......
3. Martin.....playing 20-30 minutes of footy in a game might work in a top side but not when you're one of the bottom 6 or 7 teams. Looks like he could be anything but then just completely stops...rarely sighted after half time. Like many, just doesn't look like he words hard enough.
4. Was anyone playing on Daicos after half time? Thrashed us and got countless uncontested posessions.
5. Dow showed once again he's not up to AFL level....even if it was his first game back. Doesn't get near the footy and when he does, looks like a deer in the headlights and just turns it over. Similarly Polson....got a few touches early but his original opponent was Thomas who dominated in the first quarter. If those two play again it demonstrates our lack of midfield class and depth.
6. Jones...superb again. Would've been a lot worse without him.
7. Hate to say it but the end is getting nearer for Simmo.....been one of the greatest ever Blues players but not sure we're in a position to have him go around again. Need some spark and Williams from GWS as a Free Agent would be handy.
Yes Simmo is done, the faster we play the worse it gets for him.
Jones was good again today, Weitering was also very good.
McKay was average and Levi hardly touched it.
Pittonet is NBG at pushing deep forward or deep defensive, he spends too much time spectating.
Just heard Collingwood hasn’t kept us to no goals in the second half of football for 111 years. At least we sit at 127 wins a piece against each other.
Interesting conundrum.....at what stage would you relieve Cripps of his duties and let him come home for personal reasons, if at all?? Once finals are a mathematical impossibility?? I think he’s physically, and most likely mentally spent, but I doubt he’d accept the offer.
Gosh I’m so disappointed. That second half was ugly.
We can play so well but then it turns to poop and I don’t understand why. Maybe Jack Martins terrible kick to Cripps was the beginning of the end. Just such a dumb decision at such an important stage.
Kicking into our F50 just infuriates me. They continue to do the same thing, for the same result - easy mark by their defenders, Every time.
Pissed off at Cripps for missing that set shot too.
And Doch had a shocker for that first turnover in the first quarter.
I’m gutted, really thought we’d turned the corner and would win easily after that first half. I knew Collingwood wouldn’t stop tho, they are more experienced and hardened.
And even with their outs, they were comfortable favourites according to the betting companies, I think we believed we were better than we are.
I don't blame Cripps, his kicking is not what his football is about, we've known that for years so I'm not sure why we want him pushing so deep forward, just because he's tall it seems. He's an average field kick and a below average set shot. He should be keeping out of our F50 and helping the talls setup the zone to send the footy straight back in, plus he won't collect so many miles!
Push Setterfield forward if we want a midfield marking inside F50.
I thought today we looked disorganised, we had good intensity, attack the contest the equal of the Filth, but we didn't have the same well organised structures when we won the footy that the Filth had. I was pretty obvious.
We haven't made finals for 7 years. Collingwood were missing a quarter of their best 22. Enough excuses.
Don't talk crap. We played an experience finals side today while we've come from a rabble. We need to learn to ply under that pressure to learn how to take the next step because we haven't played finals for 7 years. If you know your football you'd know that basic fact.
Not as if we aren't missing any but that doesn't count when the only reason you're on here is to knock the side.
Sometimes your negative stuff is just bullcrap..
Gosh I’m so disappointed. That second half was ugly.
We can play so well but then it turns to poop and I don’t understand why. Maybe Jack Martins terrible kick to Cripps was the beginning of the end. Just such a dumb decision at such an important stage.
Kicking into our F50 just infuriates me. They continue to do the same thing, for the same result - easy mark by their defenders, Every time.
Pissed off at Cripps for missing that set shot too.
And Doch had a shocker for that first turnover in the first quarter.
I’m gutted, really thought we’d turned the corner and would win easily after that first half. I knew Collingwood wouldn’t stop tho, they are more experienced and hardened.
We've turned some corners, still a couple of blocks to go. Next step is playing under this level of heat. We have 4 days.
Don't talk crap. We played an experience finals side today while we've come from a rabble. We need to learn to ply under that pressure to learn how to take the next step because we haven't played finals for 7 years. If you know your football you'd know that basic fact.
The Filth's structure behind the football was so much better.
I thought some of our field kicking was very good today, but I feel our forwards had a very very ordinary day.
McKay was average and Levi hardly touched it.
Pittonet is NBG at pushing deep forward or deep defensive, he spends too much time spectating.
With TDK covering the second ruck position, I think it’s time to give Levi a rest, bring back McGovern because Casboult still makes everyone nervous even with the simplest of shots for goal and won’t be part of the next real assault, especially with Charlie C in the wings.
Sometimes your negative stuff is just bullcrap..
Don’t get sucked in by some of the uneducated who periodically visit this site. Sometimes it’s a good place to avoid after a loss because some of the comments are far too emotional.......or just plain dumb!!
Don't talk crap. We played an experience finals side today while we've come from a rabble. We need to learn to ply under that pressure to learn how to take the next step because we haven't played finals for 7 years. If you know your football you'd know that basic fact.
Not as if we aren't missing any but that doesn't count when the only reason you're on here is to knock the side.
Sometimes your negative stuff is just bullcrap..
Truth hurts.
Don’t get sucked in by some of the uneducated who periodically visit this site. Sometimes it’s a good place to avoid after a loss because some of the comments are far too emotional.......or just plain dumb!!
Uneducated?
I’m gutted, really thought we’d turned the corner and would win easily after that first half. I knew Collingwood wouldn’t stop tho, they are more experienced and hardened.
And so did the pampered s0ftcock bed wetters who get paid over $200k per year.
Memo to CFC recruiters - when you’re scouting for players please watch carefully how they handle defeat. Do they HATE losing? Like, REALLY hate losing? Pay special attention to that player who is pissed to let a late goal through even though they’re 20 goals up. If they take it in their stride and are happy to run around showing off their muscles and perfect skin, please move on and let someone else draft them.
Don’t get sucked in by some of the uneducated who periodically visit this site. Sometimes it’s a good place to avoid after a loss because some of the comments are far too emotional.......or just plain dumb!!
Yes, because you and "laj", are so insightful it hurts.
So you're saying, playing the likes of Murphy and Co for the last decade has worked so well, let's continue on that path becuase, hey it's bound to turn around soon.... right, right!?
Tell me, what's the definition of insanity?
Unfortunately completely out coached and we’ve got some gaps.
McKay, TDK, Casboult, Gibbons and Betts simply didn’t do enough to quell Quaynor, Noble, Maynard and Moore who consistently pushed forward to outnumber our midfield - if you don’t go with them it’s hard to win.
Plowman vs Stevenson was indescribably stupid for so many reasons.
At least we know our deficiencies - we need
- A tough fast defender to play on fast attackers
- 2x tough fast midfielders (Adams like intensity)
- 1x fast small forward to partner Fisher
At the end of the year, time is up for Betts, Simpson, Kreuzer and probably Murphy and we need to make a call on Plowman.
Time to rest Cripps and let the rest of them pull their weight.
Yes. He will not get up for a game on Thursday. Give him a break so he can manage the last couple of games adequately.
It’s so bloody hard not to wonder if we are heading in the right direction when you watch a performance like that.
I was at last years game against them and we looked every bit like a team on the rise and if it wasn’t for some late awful decisions against us we deserved that win more then they did. And they had a full team off memory. I walked away disappointed but under no doubts we were going the right way.
Fast forward 12 months and year 5 of the rebuild we dish up this rubbish when they were no where near full strength and with everything to play for. I want to be opportunistic but I dunno what to think to be honest.
Interesting 4 weeks coming up.
Need to clean out the dead wood. Marc Murphy has cost Paddy Dow a whole season of development.
More than harsh, mate. Just not accurate. Paddy Dow wasn't fit enough until a couple of weeks back. Murphy, on the other hand, has played some of his best footy for the year in those few weeks.
We haven't made finals for 7 years. Collingwood were missing a quarter of their best 22. Enough excuses.
And we were not? We had 13 players available for the 2nds game. We needed half of the GC side to field a team.
Just heard Collingwood hasn’t kept us to no goals in the second half of football for 111 years. At least we sit at 127 wins a piece against each other.
That is simply terrible. We need to rise to the occasion, not drop off. We need to get ahead of these ... meat pies!
Don't reckon we can play Pittonet, TdK, Casboult and McKay against the half decent teams. It means that for most of the game 3 of those 4 are inside forward 50, and Pittonet gives nothing up there, TdK gives nothing for now but may improve, Casboult has to run up to the wings to get a touch, and McKay always seems to be flying against Pittonet/TdK and their opponents. If it wasn't for Eddie's first half, we would hardly have scored in this game. Too big, too slow
Beaten by a better side and shows where we need to improve to actually improve.
TDK-Casboult-Mckay.... Any chance of these jokers actually holding a mark? And what was worse... Why do they get out marked so frequently?!? By midgets!!!! Moore did as he pleased today, ##@$/! Our tall forwards are frustrating. Maybe it's because they get blocked and held, but the delivery to them was excremental. Anyway, very poor these three today.
Everybody loves Eddie but Quaynor ran off him at will today and killed us. Sorry Eddie, but if you can't chase and pressure exiting defenders it's curtains mate.
And Cripps stunk today, Pendles - his direct opponent - flogged us... As did every single small pies running player.
We desparately need a line breaking half back with penetration, hence I can see the interest in Zac Williams.
Beaten by a better side and shows where we need to improve to actually improve.
TDK-Casboult-Mckay.... Any chance of these jokers actually holding a mark? And what was worse... Why do they get out marked so frequently?!? By midgets!!!! Moore did as he pleased today, ##@$/! Our tall forwards are frustrating. Maybe it's because they get blocked and held, but the delivery to them was excremental. Anyway, very poor these three today.
Everybody loves Eddie but Quaynor ran off him at will today and killed us. Sorry Eddie, but if you can't chase and pressure exiting defenders it's curtains mate.
And Cripps stunk today, Pendles - his direct opponent - flogged us... As did every single small pies running player.
We desparately need a line breaking half back with penetration, hence I can see the interest in Zac Williams.
Really out-thought. each of these moves was a winner for them. We simply need to be willing to change opponents during the game if something is not working.
In that respect, Teague is a lot like Ratten. He won't move someone until it is too late. This is something he has to learn before we are going to be a top side.
Casboults last month has been very poor. Tempted to give him a week off.
More grunt and run required as well. Kennedy and Cottrell please would have helped.
We desperately need another running/rebounding defender who can kick.
Beaten by a better side and shows where we need to improve to actually improve.
TDK-Casboult-Mckay.... Any chance of these jokers actually holding a mark? And what was worse... Why do they get out marked so frequently?!? By midgets!!!! Moore did as he pleased today, ##@$/! Our tall forwards are frustrating. Maybe it's because they get blocked and held, but the delivery to them was excremental. Anyway, very poor these three today.
Everybody loves Eddie but Quaynor ran off him at will today and killed us. Sorry Eddie, but if you can't chase and pressure exiting defenders it's curtains mate.
And Cripps stunk today, Pendles - his direct opponent - flogged us... As did every single small pies running player.
We desparately need a line breaking half back with penetration, hence I can see the interest in Zac Williams.
Exactly how I saw it along with the Plowman on jaidyn Stevenson debacle
So can we end the Polson experiment now?
Can we send Dow back to the 2's?
Try something/someone else.
Bring in Owies, let the lad get a crack at it.
Can someone explain how we have a 9-day break in a season where 5 day breaks are the norm, and fail to kick a goal in the second half?
We should've ran all over them.
The strange thing (per running stats) is that we did run the game out. The fastest on ground was no other than Eddie. Their running was best in defense. Ran rings around us in fact.
We had enough i50. In this sense, it was our inability to go i50 with poise (plan, or marking ability), have a shot, and to a lesser degree to convert, that cost us.
Like others have said, our tall forwards in particular had a stinker, and weren't helped by i50 delivery.
Perhaps the best learning will be how to handle a touch of pressure. Coaching staff included.
PS
I see Zac Williams has put a high price on his head😳
So can we end the Polson experiment now?
Can we send Dow back to the 2's?
Try something/someone else.
Bring in Owies, let the lad get a crack at it.
Can someone explain how we have a 9-day break in a season where 5 day breaks are the norm, and fail to kick a goal in the second half?
We should've ran all over them.
Agree, Polson is done and Dow probably gets another season to show something but its not looking great for him.
Cripps needs a rest too...
Owies in to work with Eddie and Martin..
We had enough i50. In this sense, it was our inability to go i50 with poise (plan, or marking ability), have a shot, and to a lesser degree to convert, that cost us.
Like others have said, our tall forwards in particular had a stinker, and weren't helped by i50 delivery.
When you bring in 2 blokes that can't kick, and drop one who can, you clearly make your ability to spot up a target more difficult....and we were struggling with it before.
I've said that our biggest area of need is an outside running mid who can kick.
I think some others are starting to agree with me.
Bring in Williams, Papley and Atkins and we never have to wonder about that area again.
Why has Dow stagnated so badly?
Why has Dow stagnated so badly?
He's just another to add to the litany of poor high draft picks to add to the pile. Nothing more, nothing less.
Who in their right mind selects a player at pick 3 that can't kick and has no tank? Only Carlton my friend, only Carlton...
I wanted Cerra.
I wanted Cerra.
He is looking the goods. Runs all day, has skill and is a great kick. What's not to like?
He's just another to add to the litany of poor high draft picks to add to the pile. Nothing more, nothing less.
Who in their right mind selects a player at pick 3 that can't kick and has no tank? Only Carlton my friend, only Carlton...
Dow is young and looks like he’ll make it - progressing well and his form in the twos was exceptional. Will take a game or two to get back to the pace of AFL
Once again we got to 9 (10?) points up but just couldn't get THAT goal.
Instead, it was a series of fumbles, poor decisions, and loose checking which finally got Coll'wood the goal which put a spring in their step and the rest was miserably predictable.
Had everything to play for today so I'll never understand the mentality or psychology of this bunch.
Teague gets a 2 out of 10 today.
The only positive is that we're a game closer to seeing a few players give it away ... I hope.
Training wheels Teauge was absolutely outcoached today. That is an embarassment as well to be outcoached by Buckley who is mediocre at best. What does the club expect? Waste pics 3 (Dow), 6 (Seton), 10 (Obrien) 10 (Harry?) thanks to SOS and that seals the deal IMO. Bloody disgraceful, given the pain we as supporters have had to bear for this supposed 'rebuilt' like GWS. ??? This club tells lies.
12 months? Been about 5 years!
Correct. You sound like Brendon Bolton and his 'green shoots'. It has been 5 years. And it may well be another 5.
Don't talk crap. We played an experience finals side today while we've come from a rabble. We need to learn to ply under that pressure to learn how to take the next step because we haven't played finals for 7 years. If you know your football you'd know that basic fact.
No mate, his 'negative stuff' is reality. Would be good if those in the positions to make the big decisions at the club saw it too.
Not as if we aren't missing any but that doesn't count when the only reason you're on here is to knock the side.
Sometimes your negative stuff is just bullcrap..
It’s so bloody hard not to wonder if we are heading in the right direction when you watch a performance like that.
I was at last years game against them and we looked every bit like a team on the rise and if it wasn’t for some late awful decisions against us we deserved that win more then they did. And they had a full team off memory. I walked away disappointed but under no doubts we were going the right way.
Fast forward 12 months and year 5 of the rebuild we dish up this rubbish when they were no where near full strength and with everything to play for. I want to be opportunistic but I dunno what to think to be honest.
Interesting 4 weeks coming up.
I feel your pain Shawny. I've said it before, and I'll say it again... the club has sold us a lie. This is a Terry Wallace 'rebuild of a rebuild', and this, with another rookie coach. It's ridiculous and not fitting of our great club. The board has to go.
Dow is young and looks like he’ll make it - progressing well and his form in the twos was exceptional. Will take a game or two to get back to the pace of AFL
Can't agree, looks hesitant to run and kick, sold players into trouble with handballs and even a player like Cottrell looks more advanced and intense.
He has to take the game on and he just looked like he wanted to get rid of the ball quickly..
I dont agree with the out coached comments. 5mins to go is when the score blew out.
Had martin actually had a shot rather than try hit up cripps at the end of the 3rd term, and had cripps kicked straight on his shot for goal we would have been a better chance.
I'd like to hear Teague's after match thoughts as that was a crap effort and totally uncoordinated. Really poor. And Martin, learn how to kick FFS.
I wanted Cerra.
Cerra this way, SPS that way.
I thought it wasn't the MCs best effort, side looked horribly unbalanced.
Some bigger bodied flankers - jsos (unavailable), Kennedy and Cunners would have given us both more onball options and their marking abilities would have kept the mid sized pies backs honest. Fisher, Betts and Gibbo do their work at deck level, and our big forwards didn't create enough spillages. Coupled with poor delivery the one dimensional forward set up was rookie thinking. Martin has tapered as well in his performance, like many needs to learn that a season goes past round 15, though being in the frame this late is novel for our club in the last 20 years.
I'd like to hear Teague's after match thoughts as that was a crap effort and totally uncoordinated. Really poor. And Martin, learn how to kick FFS.
I was thinking about the game last night and some vision I saw. I thought in the first half we were ok and it was pretty even. At half time, they went to a shot within our rooms and you could see all the players with their line coaches intently looking at computer screens, discussing, plotting, planning, gesturing. Then they went out and didn't score a goal.
As for the game, we lost to a better more hardened team (even with their outs) who simply wanted it more. Not going to bother with singling out players or coaches, you simply don't win games of footy with a goalless qtr let alone two.
SPS was an earlier draft.
The Dow draft year was a tough one for recruiters, most clubs went LDU as no. 1, there was no clear cut choice. Ultimately Rayner went no. 1 and there were concerns re his fitness levels. We went with the more speculative pick due to perceived upside.
Dow's underage footy hasnt translated to senior level because his breakaway pace and the uncluttered nature of underage footy let him hunt the ball at will (no tagging) and blast away without learning how to negotiate through traffic and
dispose under pressure. So he needs a lot of development work (IE twos footy) to skill him up to harness that bust away pace. Compare that against say Fisher, who learnt tricks to compete in heavy traffic given his diminutive size.
SPS was an earlier draft.
The Dow draft year was a tough one for recruiters, most clubs went LDU as no. 1, there was no clear cut choice. Ultimately Rayner went no. 1 and there were concerns re his fitness levels. We went with the more speculative pick due to perceived upside.
Dow's underage footy hasnt translated to senior level because his breakaway pace and the uncluttered nature of underage footy let him hunt the ball at will (no tagging) and blast away without learning how to negotiate through traffic and
dispose under pressure. So he needs a lot of development work (IE twos footy) to skill him up to harness that bust away pace. Compare that against say Fisher, who learnt tricks to compete in heavy traffic given his diminutive size.
Great points Prof, I do believe though that Fisher does possess much better natural evasive and footwork skills than Paddy, not to say Paddy cant add that string to his bow.
I liked Cerra, because he was a hard, competive kid with a good size, skill set and adequate pace... Just a good solid, competitive player. A hard footballer is the best description I remember. But I can see why we overlooked him because he lacked that standout feature - Rayners goal kicking tricks ("the next Dusty"!!!), Dow's pace or LDUs massive frame.but I had no doubts he'd be a 200 game player.
Probably highlighted just how far we still have to go to catch the big boys.
Not going to bother with singling out players or coaches, you simply don't win games of footy with a goalless qtr let alone two.
You sure don't GTC. I can see a hectic trade season coming up. As for your comment on Cera / SPS trade, yes ... amongst others. Off topic, but Daicos impressed me.
You sure don't GTC. I can see a hectic trade season coming up. As for your comment on Cera / SPS trade, yes ... amongst others. Off topic, but Daicos impressed me.
Daicos found a lot of space which we didn't respect, he used his pace to hurt to us.
Great points Prof, I do believe though that Fisher does possess much better natural evasive and footwork skills than Paddy, not to say Paddy cant add that string to his bow.
Fisher did have half a season playing senior football in Perth for Perth in 2016 which helped him craft his game.
Fisher did have half a season playing senior football in Perth for Perth in 2016 which helped him craft his game.
Agree but I still reckon that aspect of his game (dancing evasive feet) he had as a young kid.
There are a lot of players who look good when their team is in front and winning. The real test of a player's worth is when its tough and they are behind just like yesterday's game. These players put their hand up in the clinches and really "want it", they are desperate for a win.
Sadly, there were more than a few of our lads who didn't "want it" enough and in turn, have to be questioned as to whether they are genuinely up to the standard required to win premierships.
Yes, there are plenty still with their trainer wheels on but that isn't an excuse for a lack of skills & "never say die" attitude.
Extremely disappointing & embarrassing performance in the second half, I hope Teague stripped paint off the walls in his spray at them for that effort.
I thought for a moment that we did well, generally, against a hardened finalist until analysing where that finalist was at... ordinary form and missing a few key personnel. Then it became clear... if we were fair-dinkum we should have accounted for this mob also considering all that was at stake. We're still a fair way off being a bona fide finalist. We're about where we deserve to be.
The Good:
Zachery... quick and creative, personally much prefer him in the midfield
Setterfield's development... plus his tackles stick. Has a footy brain/IQ
Walsh... leader
Weitering... leader
Jones... fair-dinkum effort and attitude
Curnow's consistency & reliability
We have definitely improved on previous years - much better %, in more games, no more hidings.
The Bad:
Midfield - forward line connect... it's as if they speak different languages or are playing different games. Rottingwood was there for the taking but their breathtaking confusion was telling and cost us, and was a joy to behold for Buckley. The talent is there, they just don't seem to understand each other!
Our in-game inconsistency was on glorious display... 7 goal 1st half, SFA in the 2nd half.
The Sad:
Casboult's form... such a confidence player. Woeful contribution, or lack thereof
H. So much talent but seemingly clueless between the lugholes
Pittonet's 'pavement paws' when trying to mark
Cripps. Looks like he's carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders and in some ways, he is. Banged up body, trying to do too much, goal kicking yips and Mon back in Melbourne. Too often you could see Crippa just jogging between contests... might be lots of justification, but it aint good enough and sets a bad example. Harsh to say, but true.
Murphy's hesitancy. Too much waiting for the ball to come to him, though he did try the facts are he can no longer 'create' what he used to be able to 'create.' Another year? Who will he keep out? Money could be better spent elsewhere?
Simmo. Still better than too many - and he shouldn't be. Time has caught up with him
Doc's drop in confidence. Effort is sure there, but seems confused at critical moments...
That we still play Gibbons out of position
That we lack creativity from the coaching box on game day
That our stubbornness to stick with too many talls, remains (TDK & Meat rucking, means Kennedy (for example) could have come in for Pitto). Such a lack of balance.
All in all, we're improving but yesterday against Rottingwood was a shocker and a poor reflection of the capability of our group - well, most of them. Rottingwood applied enormous pressure in the 3rd and we didn't cave... didn't do anything else, but didn't cave in. As for the 4th...
Finals might be a distant dim light now, but we still have 4 games remaining to give development and hope and finish the season on a high... we need to do this to convince potential suitors that we're going somewhere and that investing their lives with us would be a good decision. I'm optimistic about the remainder of the season.
Let's get some ruthlessness into the place, especially into the coaching group. How do we get Hodge into the place and some of the hangeron-erers out? We're still too nice. And I would seriously consider a mentor for Teague.
(Intentionally didn't say anything about Dow or Polson. Neither has played senior footy for a long time and it's a big jump into the seniors from this makeshift Magoos competition).
They all had a shocker ala the last 3 quarters against the Hawks....
Zac Williams is a priority - way ahead of Papley. Papley is icing on the cake....
Many 'moments' again - TDK's 'mark (well, a free for arm chopping) not paid just on the HT siren.
Martin not taking a shot.
Tall forwards missing 95% of marks. in good conditions.
All over, too many, even in H1 trying to be cute. Ball movement was slow and predictable. And nothing changed all day.
We made them look good - they are ordinary (bar a few).
Teague - 2/10 - picking Dow and Polson. Is Kennedy still injured? Cuners played in the 2s.
Moves on the day?
ps Jack Martin 10 disposals - needs a rocket.
Play him in the midfield for a whole bloody game.
I doubt Martin is up to a full midfield rotation, I suspect it would break him rather than fix him and doing that stuff only interferes with the regular midfield group.
Is he ever going to be more than that player who give 5 min here and there?
To me he looks exactly that type of 5 minute player, a guy who has tricks and kicks 3 in a quarter and then you don't see him again, they are hard to find and you have to have one or two of them but they never give you 4 quarters.
Martin has got comfy and gone back to his GC form....not enough ball and lazy disposal.
No plan B down forward....Casboult and McKay didnt have a size advantage like they usually do and we bombed the ball to them and they couldnt out mark Moore and Roughead.
Who ever played on Crisp should be dropped for their refusal to man him up, think we are the worst team for manning up in the comp, reckon the Pies unconstested marking stats would be high.
Cripps needs a rest, he is shot, couldnt get away from an old timer in Pendles and his kicking is worse every week...
We were lazy in the coaching box, on the field and it cost us...
Agreed EB....but Cripps' disposal by foot has never been a strong point....which makes it even harder to comprehend that we haven't drafted or targeted elite ball users over the last few years. We simply don't have enough of them in our team. I know McKay and Levi had quiet games but it must be frustrating to have the ball put over your head or 5 feet in front of you....or direct to an opposition player so often.
I thought for a moment that we did well, generally, against a hardened finalist until analysing where that finalist was at... ordinary form and missing a few key personnel. Then it became clear... if we were fair-dinkum we should have accounted for this mob also considering all that was at stake. We're still a fair way off being a bona fide finalist. We're about where we deserve to be.
The Good:
Zachery... quick and creative, personally much prefer him in the midfield
Setterfield's development... plus his tackles stick. Has a footy brain/IQ
Walsh... leader
Weitering... leader
Jones... fair-dinkum effort and attitude
Curnow's consistency & reliability
We have definitely improved on previous years - much better %, in more games, no more hidings.
The Bad:
Midfield - forward line connect... it's as if they speak different languages or are playing different games. Rottingwood was there for the taking but their breathtaking confusion was telling and cost us, and was a joy to behold for Buckley. The talent is there, they just don't seem to understand each other!
Our in-game inconsistency was on glorious display... 7 goal 1st half, SFA in the 2nd half.
The Sad:
Casboult's form... such a confidence player. Woeful contribution, or lack thereof
H. So much talent but seemingly clueless between the lugholes
Pittonet's 'pavement paws' when trying to mark
Cripps. Looks like he's carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders and in some ways, he is. Banged up body, trying to do too much, goal kicking yips and Mon back in Melbourne. Too often you could see Crippa just jogging between contests... might be lots of justification, but it aint good enough and sets a bad example. Harsh to say, but true.
Murphy's hesitancy. Too much waiting for the ball to come to him, though he did try the facts are he can no longer 'create' what he used to be able to 'create.' Another year? Who will he keep out? Money could be better spent elsewhere?
Simmo. Still better than too many - and he shouldn't be. Time has caught up with him
Doc's drop in confidence. Effort is sure there, but seems confused at critical moments...
That we still play Gibbons out of position
That we lack creativity from the coaching box on game day
That our stubbornness to stick with too many talls, remains (TDK & Meat rucking, means Kennedy (for example) could have come in for Pitto). Such a lack of balance.
All in all, we're improving but yesterday against Rottingwood was a shocker and a poor reflection of the capability of our group - well, most of them. Rottingwood applied enormous pressure in the 3rd and we didn't cave... didn't do anything else, but didn't cave in. As for the 4th...
Finals might be a distant dim light now, but we still have 4 games remaining to give development and hope and finish the season on a high... we need to do this to convince potential suitors that we're going somewhere and that investing their lives with us would be a good decision. I'm optimistic about the remainder of the season.
Let's get some ruthlessness into the place, especially into the coaching group. How do we get Hodge into the place and some of the hangeron-erers out? We're still too nice. And I would seriously consider a mentor for Teague.
(Intentionally didn't say anything about Dow or Polson. Neither has played senior footy for a long time and it's a big jump into the seniors from this makeshift Magoos competition).
Notice Levi's form's dropped off since we started playing 2 rucks? Always has in the past. He's a forward/ruck not a forward per se. When he gets a run in the ruck he gets confidence from getting his hands on the ball. He carries that confidence then back to the forward line. As a forward, in a low scoring scrappy season with crappy delivery, it makes with very tough for all our forwards.
Agreed EB....but Cripps' disposal by foot has never been a strong point....which makes it even harder to comprehend that we haven't drafted or targeted elite ball users over the last few years. We simply don't have enough of them in our team. I know McKay and Levi had quiet games but it must be frustrating to have the ball put over your head or 5 feet in front of you....or direct to an opposition player so often.
Surfie...Cripps looks tired when he kicks like he has no energy, maybe the off field stuff with his GF is weighing him down.
Harry and Levi have been used to outmarking smaller players one on one and needed to demand the ball more on the lead rather than encouraging our mids just to bomb it everytime....maybe that was a coaching issue.
Teague seemed paralyzed in the box and couldnt think his way through problems in this game...
Daicos found a lot of space which we didn't respect, he used his pace to hurt to us.
I got sick of hearing that 40 years ago...lol.
Must admit, things was better than it was mid last year. I just like the fact we are still talking finals, even if we miss out, rather than the no.1 pick. Make a big change!
Must admit, things was better than it was mid last year. I just like the fact we are still talking finals, even if we miss out, rather than the no.1 pick. Make a big change!
Hallelujah.
A big step, with more to come. Now how to deal with impatience.
Really out-thought. each of these moves was a winner for them. We simply need to be willing to change opponents during the game if something is not working.
In that respect, Teague is a lot like Ratten. He won't move someone until it is too late. This is something he has to learn before we are going to be a top side.
I thought that our preparation was good and we showed that we could at least match if not play better footy than Collingwood. Buckley made some changes and we kept doing the same.
Our coaching panel seems to lack a tactician that can respond to opposition moves and create winning moves for us. That said, appalling kicking for goal, shallow inside 50s, frightful decision-making and inexplicable umpiring didn’t help.
Just a small qualification on our improvement.
I think we need to start thinking in terms of comparing 'Teague' to 'Teague.'
Comparing Teague to Bolton is an easy win...and history.
Are we better at this stage of the season than we were at the 'end' of last season?
I reckon we are so that's a positive.... but there is still plenty of work to do.
The test for Teague is to continue to improve the side based on performance under him.
That's what he'll be judged on.
teague needs help coaches box , not enough moves been happening all year.
Hows this for comparing Teague to Teague.
Losing hurts again. For the first time in a long time. Even halfway through the 4th quarter, I thought we were in with a chance if we could get the next goal to steady the tide.
A massive plus, no real 4 goal run on by the opposition. It was an arm wrestle until we couldnt score, and then we just didnt take our chances well enough (we had a lot of forward pressure time in the third where we didnt hit the scoreboard that cost us the game).
Sometimes we spend too much energy looking at the overall result, and the way the scores changed, but the old adage is true. There is no pressure like scoreboard pressure. A couple of times there I thought we were on the back foot, we stood up well, and managed to score against the tide and some other times, when we were pressuring them in the forward half, we didnt hit the scoreboard and they scored against the tide. The game swung around a lot. I remember commenting in the second quarter we had the games on our terms, and it was a bit easier, but we just didnt hit the scoreboard with a lot of forward entries.
I know a lot of people are going to point to the coaches box, but you have to remember that coaches are countering each other all game.
Just because they get one move right and another wrong, doesn't mean they made no moves.
Just because something they tried didnt work, doesnt mean they made no moves.
Cripps final attempt at goals in the 4th quarter was a direct result of pushing him forward. He missed, and I think we didnt score again for that quarter. Lets not forget he limped off too, and thats when Collingwood put the foot down and scored 2 in a row to put the game pretty much out of reach.
Teague has proven he can make changes in game to swing games.
In this game it didnt yield the result we would have liked, but when it comes down to it, it was a failure to take advantage of the momentum that cost us the game, not the efforts.
Must admit, things was better than it was mid last year. I just like the fact we are still talking finals, even if we miss out, rather than the no.1 pick. Make a big change!
True Jim, as much as we may miss and some of those losses may haunt us, its a pleasant change being able to watch the remaining games with some sort of hope that we may make the 8.
Just a small qualification on our improvement.
I think we need to start thinking in terms of comparing 'Teague' to 'Teague.'
Comparing Teague to Bolton is an easy win...and history.
Are we better at this stage of the season than we were at the 'end' of last season?
I reckon we are so that's a positive.... but there is still plenty of work to do.
The test for Teague is to continue to improve the side based on performance under him.
That's what he'll be judged on.
If I had to nit pick, someone mentioned earlier about the poor mids-forward connectivity. This was an issue under BB and Teague was one of the protagonists in that debate. He should have been working on this and fixed it by now seeing he was aware and knowing the problem existed. As I said, its nit picking.
Hows this for comparing Teague to Teague.
Losing hurts again. For the first time in a long time. Even halfway through the 4th quarter, I thought we were in with a chance if we could get the next goal to steady the tide.
A massive plus, no real 4 goal run on by the opposition. It was an arm wrestle until we couldnt score, and then we just didnt take our chances well enough (we had a lot of forward pressure time in the third where we didnt hit the scoreboard that cost us the game).
Sometimes we spend too much energy looking at the overall result, and the way the scores changed, but the old adage is true. There is no pressure like scoreboard pressure. A couple of times there I thought we were on the back foot, we stood up well, and managed to score against the tide and some other times, when we were pressuring them in the forward half, we didnt hit the scoreboard and they scored against the tide. The game swung around a lot. I remember commenting in the second quarter we had the games on our terms, and it was a bit easier, but we just didnt hit the scoreboard with a lot of forward entries.
I know a lot of people are going to point to the coaches box, but you have to remember that coaches are countering each other all game.
Just because they get one move right and another wrong, doesn't mean they made no moves.
Just because something they tried didnt work, doesnt mean they made no moves.
Cripps final attempt at goals in the 4th quarter was a direct result of pushing him forward. He missed, and I think we didnt score again for that quarter. Lets not forget he limped off too, and thats when Collingwood put the foot down and scored 2 in a row to put the game pretty much out of reach.
Teague has proven he can make changes in game to swing games.
In this game it didnt yield the result we would have liked, but when it comes down to it, it was a failure to take advantage of the momentum that cost us the game, not the efforts.
Good post Thry, just to be clear, we didnt score a goal in the 3rd or the 4th. Two goalless qtrs is unacceptable. At what point does someone gather the troops or send a message out that "WE WILL SCORE THE NEXT GOAL NO MATTER WHAT". Now you might say that this is the obvious objective of football. But sometimes it takes an stern eyeballing from your skipper or coach that makes it crystal clear its non negotiable and by hook or by crook, we score a goal. I read once that Hodge (who I despise BTW) was renowned for this. When a undesirable trend was occurring in a game, he was the man who ensured it was stopped/changed.
Teague can make as many moves as you like but if the talent on the ground is not performing well enough, then what? The Pies are definitely performing better than us at the moment, even with their current injuries, and I am convinced that we need to inject more midfield talent if we are to improve to that next level.
Teague can make as many moves as you like but if the talent on the ground is not performing well enough, then what? The Pies are definitely performing better than us at the moment, even with their current injuries, and I am convinced that we need to inject more midfield talent if we are to improve to that next level.
Some goal kicking midfield talent would be nice, but I'll settle for an express mid with elite disposal. ;D ;D
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/08/31/have-carltons-top-young-draft-picks-actually-improved/
Cornes is a flog but it's a pretty valid point. Go back as far as the draft of 2015 through to 2018 (LY too early to call yet)....and in those 4 years, who has really come on?
2015
Weitering - been a gun this year.
McKay - frustrates us with glimpses in patches but is also injured a lot.
Curno - ditto
Cunningham - ditto
Silvagni J - been a surprise packet for mine for such a late pick.
2016
SPS- again, glimpses in patches but hasn't come on.
Fisher - been good and looks like he can make it.
Macreadie - barely played with injuries and form.
Polson - been enough said already.
Williamson - finally getting some return this year.
Kerr - gone.
2017
Dow - enough said.
O'Brien - not sure he'll make it either.
TDK - after a couple of injury plagued seasons he's looking like a great pick up and a long term future for sure.
Schumacher - gone
Garlett - gone
2018
Walsh - gun
Stocker - who knows?
O'Dwyer - speculative pick unlikely to survive the cut.
Silvagni B - same as O'Dwyer?
So for 4 years worth of draft picks and plenty of really high ones, the only successes to date look to be Weitering, Curnow (?), Fisher, Williamson (maybe), Walsh, TDK....McKay into his 5th year and needs to get better pretty quickly....
Charlie Curnow would be a superstar if he wasn't injured all the time.
Good post Thry, just to be clear, we didnt score a goal in the 3rd or the 4th. Two goalless qtrs is unacceptable. At what point does someone gather the troops or send a message out that "WE WILL SCORE THE NEXT GOAL NO MATTER WHAT". Now you might say that this is the obvious objective of football. But sometimes it takes an stern eyeballing from your skipper or coach that makes it crystal clear its non negotiable and by hook or by crook, we score a goal. I read once that Hodge (who I despise BTW) was renowned for this. When a undesirable trend was occurring in a game, he was the man who ensured it was stopped/changed.
We had the position to score in the 3rd qtr but made some bad decisions. Wasn't so worried about not scoring in the 3rd, we should've, but the other mob only kicked one too pretty late. That's not unusual throughout the comp this year. 4th qtr different as the other lot were scoring. and we weren't.
Our last 4 2nd halves have totally 7.26. We have won two of those. Lost the other two to sides in the 8. Two things from that. One, maintaining our composure under pressure when leading against top sides, and, two, kick f$#@! straight! We dominated against the GC in the 2nd half but missed nearly everything we shot at.
Dow, SPS and Obrien are all top tens and you expect a return when you invest your hard earned top picks and that hasnt happened.
As MBB has suggested Charlie is the real deal but cant get on the park and stay there and there has to be doubts about his future..
Weitering and Walsh have lived up to the hype and are cornerstone players who should play 250 plus games....
Stocker is the mystery player....so far he has impressed me everytime I see him play but where he is at only a few people outside his family know..
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/08/31/have-carltons-top-young-draft-picks-actually-improved/
Cornes is a flog but it's a pretty valid point. Go back as far as the draft of 2015 through to 2018 (LY too early to call yet)....and in those 4 years, who has really come on?
2015
Weitering - been a gun this year.
McKay - frustrates us with glimpses in patches but is also injured a lot.
Curno - ditto
Cunningham - ditto
Silvagni J - been a surprise packet for mine for such a late pick.
2016
SPS- again, glimpses in patches but hasn't come on.
Fisher - been good and looks like he can make it.
Macreadie - barely played with injuries and form.
Polson - been enough said already.
Williamson - finally getting some return this year.
Kerr - gone.
2017
Dow - enough said.
O'Brien - not sure he'll make it either.
TDK - after a couple of injury plagued seasons he's looking like a great pick up and a long term future for sure.
Schumacher - gone
Garlett - gone
2018
Walsh - gun
Stocker - who knows?
O'Dwyer - speculative pick unlikely to survive the cut.
Silvagni B - same as O'Dwyer?
So for 4 years worth of draft picks and plenty of really high ones, the only successes to date look to be Weitering, Curnow (?), Fisher, Williamson (maybe), Walsh, TDK....McKay into his 5th year and needs to get better pretty quickly....
Kerr was dead unlucky, victim of too many key forwards, Schumacher also to a lesser extent. We've done ok with later picks, which has been a big change.
McKay goes ok. Tough work being a key forward this year where 7 goals is often a winning score.
With some of those other early picks, those kids were thrown into the deep end. They should've been in lesser roles as they develop. That has definitely not helped them at all. Even Weitering struggled for quite a while.
If I had to nit pick, someone mentioned earlier about the poor mids-forward connectivity. This was an issue under BB and Teague was one of the protagonists in that debate. He should have been working on this and fixed it by now seeing he was aware and knowing the problem existed. As I said, its nit picking.
I brought up the fact we dropped 1 kid who could kick and brought in 2 that couldn't. We were already struggling going inside 50, so i thought this was the wrong move.
I also questioned pre-game that Stephenson was a player i didn't see a matchup for.
I also found it difficult to justify playing 2 rucks, when it was clear we needed pace.
We all know the end result.
Personally, i think we lost this game when the teams were picked.
I reckon the teams were picked with 1 eye on thursdays game and i reckon there will be plenty of changes. There should be.
Polson banished for all time.
Dow back to the 2's.
Pittonet/TDK/Harry/Levi.....one has to go. Too many players who all trying to play the same role. Pick 3, any 3 and leave it at that.
SPS, Kennedy, Cottrell all need a recall to the side. I'd even bring in Honey too.
If ANY of our boys are running at 90%, rest them. We have enough depth (of sorts) to play AFL level players while resting some. Do it.
We still have a chance to play finals, and while we do, we should be picking a side to win.
I'm not sure we gave ourselves our best chance on Sunday.
Dow, SPS and Obrien are all top tens and you expect a return when you invest your hard earned top picks and that hasnt happened.
As MBB has suggested Charlie is the real deal but cant get on he park and stay there and there has to be doubts about his future..
Weitering and Walsh have lived up to the hype and are cornerstone players who should play 250 plus games....
Stocker is the mystery player....so far he has impressed me everytime I see him play but where he is at only a few people outside his family know..
As I just said in the last post some of those kids have been chucked in the deep end when they should have been allowed to develop in lesser roles. Done them no good whatsoever. Look how it effected Weitering for a long while.
Charlie will be ok. Recovered nicely and training well.
Dow, SPS and Obrien are all top tens and you expect a return when you invest your hard earned top picks and that hasnt happened.
Dow has played 40 games and O'Brien 35. Most of those were 'development games' in a crap team in the big league. Spots weren't earned because of outstanding form in the twos, they were given to fast track development. By all reports Dow has been really finding his feet in the scratch matches (best we can offer at the moment) and has, this time around 'earned his place'....a first for him! 12 disposals, 3 marks, 3 clearances,
all on 67% game time is a pass mark for me and he will improve as he is given more opportunities.......like Will Setterfield.
O'Brien is not being given a free ride this time, he needs to earn it, or waits his turn. If he wants it enough, he'll keep working hard to get there. Not everyone is a ball buster after 35 games, especially some of the 35 that he experienced!
I am prepared to be patient a bit longer with Dow as he has shown glimpses of what might be and could develop into the type of mid we need.
Don't know about O'Brien, haven't seen him for a long time.
Dow has played 40 games and O'Brien 35. Most of those were 'development games' in a crap team in the big league. Spots weren't earned because of outstanding form in the twos, they were given to fast track development. By all reports Dow has been really finding his feet in the scratch matches (best we can offer at the moment) and has, this time around 'earned his place'....a first for him! 12 disposals, 3 marks, 3 clearances, all on 67% game time is a pass mark for me and he will improve as he is given more opportunities.......like Will Setterfield.
O'Brien is not being given a free ride this time, he needs to earn it, or waits his turn. If he wants it enough, he'll keep working hard to get there. Not everyone is a ball buster after 35 games, especially some of the 35 that he experienced!
When you are a top ten pick you get more opportunities but are also judged more harshly, thats the reality.
Dow's 12 possies are interesting, he only had 4 kicks with 8 handballs, I noticed he didnt want to kick the ball..DE was 67%.....by foot thats reasonable but the majority by hand thats not so flash and thats his problem. IMO he has been ordered to handpass more and kick less. At U18 level he would get enormous amounts of ball every game..35-40 was common but about 25-30% were no good but the volume of possies made up for it. At senior level he cant get the ball and if he goes at 67% with what I call simple kicks/handpasses he is a liability.
I liked Dow at U18 level and think he can still make it but its going to be interesting to see if the club can carry him long enough in the senior team for him to improve enough to become a fixture. The kids coming through like Kemp, Philp, Ramsay etc are all much better users of the ball and the latter two all have Dows pace, so he has two problems, himself and the competition from other younger players.
Obrien was pick 10 but IMO it was a weak draft and he was a poor pick for us and when the coach has labelled his attack on the footy etc needing work thats a label that sticks and is hard to shake. Not being contested enough is harder to fix because its instinct...Cottrell is raw as a piece of fresh beef but contests well and you can see Teague has preferred both him and Philp over Obrien for one main reason.
SPS is Yarran without the fire in the belly...when CY was wound up he was top shelf, pace, intensity, skill etc etc...we know his story and it was sad to watch his decline. SPS doesnt have the CY problems but he is just too laconic, lazy and inconsistent for a No 6 pick and we all know it. He can play the game and doesnt need skills training, just needs a can of "whoop arse" before each game to fire him up but so far neither Bolton or DT has found that formula...76 games is a decent sample too. Not sure we can continue too long waiting for him to become consistent, hiding him down back to protect him from critique has to stop as well.
He needs to be back in the midfield somewhere providing the run and carry we recruited him for or he will prove the " mugs to the backline theory" right...
Why am I always thinking of Stocker and Richmond in the same sentence?
Personally, i think we lost this game when the teams were picked.
I reckon the teams were picked with 1 eye on thursdays game and i reckon there will be plenty of changes. There should be.
Polson banished for all time.
Dow back to the 2's.
Pittonet/TDK/Harry/Levi.....one has to go. Too many players who all trying to play the same role. Pick 3, any 3 and leave it at that.
SPS, Kennedy, Cottrell all need a recall to the side. I'd even bring in Honey too.
If ANY of our boys are running at 90%, rest them. We have enough depth (of sorts) to play AFL level players while resting some. Do it.
We still have a chance to play finals, and while we do, we should be picking a side to win.
I'm not sure we gave ourselves our best chance on Sunday.
Many good points, in my most humble of opinions!
Have we 'omitted' any of the non or poor performing senior players this season? Or have we only been omitting kids & fringe players given a taste then banished after 1 or 2 games?
There is a conservatism at the selection table which is, as you say, costing us (selection table not conservatism, don't want to put words in your mouth). Or is this a symptom of our unswerving commitment to 'niceness' which is something I believe is costing us, big time. This is a gladiatorial sport. On a football field if you're committed to 'nice' then ruthlessness and passion are fckd. Whenever we get in front it seems -- except for the Dishlickers for some reason -- we almost apologise and back off or do poos in pants if the opposition responds with 'vigour'. Ah, vigour. Vigour wins games, vigour is good, vigour is a symptom of ruthlessness. Vigour has spirit and boldness. Vigour builds resilience. Nice kills vigour. Nice extinguishes passion and ruthlessness.
Does this 'niceness' extend to the coaching ranks? Now Lloyd couldn't be one of those, he saw first hand how Lyon was anything but 'nice'. I liked that about Ross. This is why I make noise about a Hodge or Goddard, blokes with passion and knowledge, joining our coaching ranks, and maybe Lyon as a mentor for the TT. Now TT, as a player, was uncompromising but where is that attitude in the players when we take the field?
So, yep, our selections last week were confusing, to say the least. But is all this a symptom of some obsession with being correct, nice and the AFL's little blue eyed boys... ever co-operative, ever subservient?
We've made a step this year but to advance further we now need to make the most important step, persistent ruthlessness. The biggest omission from our side that fronted up against a vulnerable Rottingwood was SPIRIT when challenged in the 3rd. Better than some previous years, good, but still weak against an out of form opponent in a high stakes game - hey, but at least we help play Rottingwood back into reasonable form - how nice of us.
Perhaps a lot of these assistant coaches should spend a week coaching from their collective hearts and guts and not a spreadsheet. Stats are meant to work for humans, not humans for the stats - I mention that as I read that at half time all our coaches were gathered around technology, searching for clues I suspect. FFS, trust what your own eyes tell you and your own gut tells you.
I brought up the fact we dropped 1 kid who could kick and brought in 2 that couldn't. We were already struggling going inside 50, so i thought this was the wrong move.
I also questioned pre-game that Stephenson was a player i didn't see a matchup for.
I also found it difficult to justify playing 2 rucks, when it was clear we needed pace.
We all know the end result.
Personally, i think we lost this game when the teams were picked.
I reckon the teams were picked with 1 eye on thursdays game and i reckon there will be plenty of changes. There should be.
Polson banished for all time.
Dow back to the 2's.
Pittonet/TDK/Harry/Levi.....one has to go. Too many players who all trying to play the same role. Pick 3, any 3 and leave it at that.
SPS, Kennedy, Cottrell all need a recall to the side. I'd even bring in Honey too.
If ANY of our boys are running at 90%, rest them. We have enough depth (of sorts) to play AFL level players while resting some. Do it.
We still have a chance to play finals, and while we do, we should be picking a side to win.
I'm not sure we gave ourselves our best chance on Sunday.
Couldnt agree more.....
Quick question, because there seems to be some confusion.
Who did Polson play on in the first half?
Who did he play on in the second half?
Dow has played 40 games and O'Brien 35. Most of those were 'development games' in a crap team in the big league. Spots weren't earned because of outstanding form in the twos, they were given to fast track development. By all reports Dow has been really finding his feet in the scratch matches (best we can offer at the moment) and has, this time around 'earned his place'....a first for him! 12 disposals, 3 marks, 3 clearances, all on 67% game time is a pass mark for me and he will improve as he is given more opportunities.......like Will Setterfield.
O'Brien is not being given a free ride this time, he needs to earn it, or waits his turn. If he wants it enough, he'll keep working hard to get there. Not everyone is a ball buster after 35 games, especially some of the 35 that he experienced!
Well said - Dow has been injures and has earned his recall. People need to give the guy a go because he does have that breakaway speed we currently lack. I’d play him for the rest of the year.
Well said - Dow has been injures and has earned his recall. People need to give the guy a go because he does have that breakaway speed we currently lack. I’d play him for the rest of the year.
No point having breakaway speed if he just kicks it to a 50-50 at best. You can do that from the middle of a pack.
Where is the benefit?
Look, the kid has shown glimpses....but not enough for the pick he was taken. He's almost played 50 games and we still don't know if he is any good.
When you are a top ten pick you get more opportunities but are also judged more harshly, thats the reality.
Dow's 12 possies are interesting, he only had 4 kicks with 8 handballs, I noticed he didnt want to kick the ball..DE was 67%.....by foot thats reasonable but the majority by hand thats not so flash and thats his problem. IMO he has been ordered to handpass more and kick less. At U18 level he would get enormous amounts of ball every game..35-40 was common but about 25-30% were no good but the volume of possies made up for it. At senior level he cant get the ball and if he goes at 67% with what I call simple kicks/handpasses he is a liability.
I liked Dow at U18 level and think he can still make it but its going to be interesting to see if the club can carry him long enough in the senior team for him to improve enough to become a fixture. The kids coming through like Kemp, Philp, Ramsay etc are all much better users of the ball and the latter two all have Dows pace, so he has two problems, himself and the competition from other younger players.
Obrien was pick 10 but IMO it was a weak draft and he was a poor pick for us and when the coach has labelled his attack on the footy etc needing work thats a label that sticks and is hard to shake. Not being contested enough is harder to fix because its instinct...Cottrell is raw as a piece of fresh beef but contests well and you can see Teague has preferred both him and Philp over Obrien for one main reason.
SPS is Yarran without the fire in the belly...when CY was wound up he was top shelf, pace, intensity, skill etc etc...we know his story and it was sad to watch his decline. SPS doesnt have the CY problems but he is just too laconic, lazy and inconsistent for a No 6 pick and we all know it. He can play the game and doesnt need skills training, just needs a can of "whoop arse" before each game to fire him up but so far neither Bolton or DT has found that formula...76 games is a decent sample too. Not sure we can continue too long waiting for him to become consistent, hiding him down back to protect him from critique has to stop as well.
He needs to be back in the midfield somewhere providing the run and carry we recruited him for or he will prove the " mugs to the backline theory" right...
Agree that we need SPS delivering the ball into our forwards and we also need to put him on notice that if his intensity doesn’t lift he’s on the trade table......we can’t cop the mediocrity any more. He needs to run with more urgency, kick harder and longer and commit to tackles - he’s developed a touch of the Bryce Gibbs and it’s not good enough.
No point having breakaway speed if he just kicks it to a 50-50 at best. You can do that from the middle of a pack.
Where is the benefit?
Look, the kid has shown glimpses....but not enough for the pick he was taken. He's almost played 50 games and we still don't know if he is any good.
I thought he did well to pick up the pace of the game after such a long absence and I can’t recall any howlers over the weekend. I’m a believer in Dow and think he’ll be just as good a Walsh given an extended run and with confidence I’m sure his disposal efficiency will improve.
I thought he did well to pick up the pace of the game after such a long absence and I can’t recall any howlers over the weekend. I’m a believer in Dow and think he’ll be just as good a Walsh given an extended run and with confidence I’m sure his disposal efficiency will improve.
Dow could improve year after year until he retires. At this point, he will still not be as good as Walsh was in game 1.....or game 2....etc
Walsh has the ability to sense pressure and he is calm under it. Some players just have it. Murphy and Gibbs had it from day 1.
Dow, as you say, is still picking up the pace of the game, but he is coming from too far pack to get to Walsh level.
I thought he did well to pick up the pace of the game after such a long absence and I can’t recall any howlers over the weekend. I’m a believer in Dow and think he’ll be just as good a Walsh given an extended run and with confidence I’m sure his disposal efficiency will improve.
there was one handball in the second quarter that absolutely killed gibbons and made him a sitting duck. High looping and in the middle of 3 Collingwood players. Absolute hospital handpass.
Agree he'll make it. I noted he went into the coalface at certain stages so it wasn't a complete waste.
He's competing and he's not scared of the contest but his disposal is a bit average.
Quick question, because there seems to be some confusion.
Who did Polson play on in the first half?
Who did he play on in the second half?
I thought he played abit on Thomas and a bit on Daicos or Brown, I'd have to have a look at the game. Why do you ask Two Dogs?
I thought he played abit on Thomas and a bit on Daicos or Brown, I'd have to have a look at the game. Why do you ask Two Dogs?
I have no idea who he was playing on.
It's too difficult to give a definitive answer from the television
I've been reading a few different forum/facebook pages today.
There are the usual calls for him to be dropped straight away....but he also has some spirited defenders who are suggesting he did a good job on Thomas in the second half... and the reason we didn't see much of Polson was the negating role he was playing.
I guess the 'tell' will be if he retains his spot.
Quick question, because there seems to be some confusion.
Who did Polson play on in the first half?
Who did he play on in the second half?
Lods I watched the highlight package and in the second half, he appears to be following Josh Thomas around. Now If Im not mistaken, Thomas was quiet in the 2nd half, gave us some trouble in the first though right? I reckon Willo was on Thomas in the first half.
Lods I watched the highlight package and in the second half, he appears to be following Josh Thomas around. Now If Im not mistaken, Thomas was quiet in the 2nd half, gave us some trouble in the first though right?
Yep
So the question is did he have Thomas all game or was he moved onto him in the second half.
There's some suggestion in other places that it was Willamson on Thomas in the first half.
there was one handball in the second quarter that absolutely killed gibbons and made him a sitting duck. High looping and in the middle of 3 Collingwood players.
We do this type of handball all the time. Why can’t we be creative instead of reactionary when the heat is put on?
Yep
So the question is did he have Thomas all game or was he moved onto him in the second half.
There's some suggestion in other places that it was Willamson on Thomas in the first half.
Yes, I amended my post, Willo appears to following Thomas in the first half.
It's quite funny what we can see then believe, and then without hesitation put it in hard-copy on the inter-webs forever and ever!
There are a lot of posts on the forum blaming this player or that player, Plowman, Polson, Williamson, sMurph, Simmo, etc., etc., etc.. I suspect if I did a forum audit I'd find those few playing all over the ground on the majority of opponents who had a good 30 seconds on camera!
Plowman's been blamed for the sudden good form of about 4 or 5 opponents, some of them he probably wasn't within 50m of for the bulk of the game, but it's that split second they ran past him on camera that was the critical moment triggering their resurrection from AFL spud to rising star and Carlton killer! ;D
It's safer just to assume everything you want to post is wrong until you've gone back and double checked! :o
It is the reason why I only vote in Jim Park when I've had a chance to re-watch the game in cold emotionless detail.
Quick question, because there seems to be some confusion.
Who did Polson play on in the first half?
Who did he play on in the second half?
Polson is pushing it up hill with the Carlton faithful to start with even with solid form in the scratch matches.
He has been credited with two Josh Thomas Goals.
The first is from a dump kick from Sam Walsh that Quaynor roves from the marking contest outside 50. The ball deep inside 50 is contested by Cox and Jones. Williamson follows Thomas who roves and goals. Polson in not one of 7 Carlton players pictured inside 50. Jones, Weitering, Plowman, Doc, Cripps, Setterfield and Simpson. Hard to tell if Polson is actually on the ground at the time.
The 2nd goal Thomas loses Plowman working up the field and first gets involved at wing/half back. Crisps miss bounces and Thomas gets the handball receive and kicks a nice goal.
While I am not suggesting Polson was great he wasn't directly responsible for the two Thomas goals.
Now as EB points out Thomas had 9 score involvements so his influence wasn't limited to his 2 goals.
I must admit I didn't mind trying Polson in the new role. Reading the reports his disposal looks to have improved.
He did have 246 meters gained which is not huge, but when you consider he only had 8 touches at 30.75metres per touches that was the highest for any Carlton player. Just need to get the ball a little more, which in turn might free up SPS to play a more natural role.
The small defender role is important in terms of the player having to be a very good user of the ball these days and be able to hit targets under pressure to clear the ball.
Lets give Polson a pass on defending but IMO his use of the ball, decision making wont stand up under pressure from really good teams. The player we really needed to nail as a trade was Saad...he was a bad miss for us, can defend, has pace and is a decent kick and decision maker, shame he picked EFC and I wish we had probably offered a bit more money to sway his opinion.
The small defender role is important in terms of the player having to be a very good user of the ball these days and be able to hit targets under pressure to clear the ball.
Lets give Polson a pass on defending but IMO his use of the ball, decision making wont stand up under pressure from really good teams. The player we really needed to nail as a trade was Saad...he was a bad miss for us, can defend, has pace and is a decent kick and decision maker, shame he picked EFC and I wish we had probably offered a bit more money to sway his opinion.
Out of contract and after more money than the Bombers are keen on offering. Good footballer but I would spend my money elsewhere. Just need a solid citizen with good foot skills.
Out of contract and after more money than the Bombers are keen on offering. Good footballer but I would spend my money elsewhere. Just need a solid citizen with good foot skills.
Been an area thats been ignored and given we spent 800k on a 3rd tall forward I think a bit of money spent down back is fair enough. Appreciate we will probably be looking at Williams who will be around 800-900k but I think Saad is a decent player to pursue and spend a dollar or two on as well.
Saad can be a game breaker and if he is available we should look at him.
Worth remember he snubbed us to go to the Bombers though, and what impact that would have on the team.
Polson is pushing it up hill with the Carlton faithful to start with even with solid form in the scratch matches.
He has been credited with two Josh Thomas Goals.
The first is from a dump kick from Sam Walsh that Quaynor roves from the marking contest outside 50. The ball deep inside 50 is contested by Cox and Jones. Williamson follows Thomas who roves and goals. Polson in not one of 7 Carlton players pictured inside 50. Jones, Weitering, Plowman, Doc, Cripps, Setterfield and Simpson. Hard to tell if Polson is actually on the ground at the time.
The 2nd goal Thomas loses Plowman working up the field and first gets involved at wing/half back. Crisps miss bounces and Thomas gets the handball receive and kicks a nice goal.
While I am not suggesting Polson was great he wasn't directly responsible for the two Thomas goals.
Now as EB points out Thomas had 9 score involvements so his influence wasn't limited to his 2 goals.
I must admit I didn't mind trying Polson in the new role. Reading the reports his disposal looks to have improved.
He did have 246 meters gained which is not huge, but when you consider he only had 8 touches at 30.75metres per touches that was the highest for any Carlton player. Just need to get the ball a little more, which in turn might free up SPS to play a more natural role.
Exactly what I saw in the highlights package, Polson went onto Thomas in the second half who was largely unsighted.
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/08/31/have-carltons-top-young-draft-picks-actually-improved/
Cornes is a flog but it's a pretty valid point. Go back as far as the draft of 2015 through to 2018 (LY too early to call yet)....and in those 4 years, who has really come on?
2015
Weitering - been a gun this year.
McKay - frustrates us with glimpses in patches but is also injured a lot.
Curno - ditto
Cunningham - ditto
Silvagni J - been a surprise packet for mine for such a late pick.
2016
SPS- again, glimpses in patches but hasn't come on.
Fisher - been good and looks like he can make it.
Macreadie - barely played with injuries and form.
Polson - been enough said already.
Williamson - finally getting some return this year.
Kerr - gone.
2017
Dow - enough said.
O'Brien - not sure he'll make it either.
TDK - after a couple of injury plagued seasons he's looking like a great pick up and a long term future for sure.
Schumacher - gone
Garlett - gone
2018
Walsh - gun
Stocker - who knows?
O'Dwyer - speculative pick unlikely to survive the cut.
Silvagni B - same as O'Dwyer?
So for 4 years worth of draft picks and plenty of really high ones, the only successes to date look to be Weitering, Curnow (?), Fisher, Williamson (maybe), Walsh, TDK....McKay into his 5th year and needs to get better pretty quickly....
You can add getting McGovern for Shane Mc Adam and 2 picks in the 20s there was also some future late picks swapped
Setterfield for ultimately a pick in the low 20s and Nathan Kreuger
My other beef with SOS was recruiting so many crap players from other AFL clubs to prop up the list when he and his crew should have look more closely at the VFL SANFL WAFL NEFL
For late bloomers
Only Lang remains although I don’t rank Plowman
Kennedy isn’t a mid he is a forward
Keogh....I've posted it before and didn't want to torture the readers again.....but if you look at the 2014 Draft, that was the killer! An absolute disaster....blokes from that draft would now be in their prime years but not one of them is left at the club.
Keogh....I've posted it before and didn't want to torture the readers again.....but if you look at the 2014 Draft, that was the killer! An absolute disaster....blokes from that draft would now be in their prime years but not one of them is left at the club.
Hughes or Rogers
Either way they were both useless
As I pointed out in the other forum the lack of improvement in our future midfield is a concern
And yes SOS had to get rid of many at the end of 2015
But why replace spuds with spuds?
We were panced in between the arks yet again.
They had Sidebottom and Treloar both out
Elliott Daicos Phillips Noble Quaynor
Crisp and Maynard like Noble are essentially defenders but provided plenty of drive around the middle
Ed Curnow gets a pass
Setterfield got the ball but his impact is minor
It’s called depth in the middle
We don’t have it
The question is how long do you wait before guys turn the corner?
smarter quicker team .the space that stephenson had and delivery was perfect and could of kicked 4 goals /why cant we do the same with eddie for example our coaches have to do better on match day
Been an area thats been ignored and given we spent 800k on a 3rd tall forward I think a bit of money spent down back is fair enough. Appreciate we will probably be looking at Williams who will be around 800-900k but I think Saad is a decent player to pursue and spend a dollar or two on as well.
Terrible decision to pay that much for McGovern given his output and our needs in other areas. I wouldn't use that as a reason to justify over spending in other areas.
Hughes or Rogers
Either way they were both useless
As I pointed out in the other forum the lack of improvement in our future midfield is a concern
And yes SOS had to get rid of many at the end of 2015
But why replace spuds with spuds?
We were panced in between the arks yet again.
They had Sidebottom and Treloar both out
Elliott Daicos Phillips Noble Quaynor
Crisp and Maynard like Noble are essentially defenders but provided plenty of drive around the middle
Ed Curnow gets a pass
Setterfield got the ball but his impact is minor
It’s called depth in the middle
We don’t have it
The question is how long do you wait before guys turn the corner?
And yet we played twice as well against them last year when nobody gave us a hope in hell.
But for some terrible umpiring decisions in the last 5 minutes of that game, it was ours.
It's all between our ears...
And that Cripps is wounded, or mind elsewhere, doesn't help.
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/08/31/have-carltons-top-young-draft-picks-actually-improved/
2015
Weitering - Close to AA. Leader.
McKay - playing the hardest position on the ground. 44 games in this bloke is super talented. Need continuality. The rest of the football community is wetting their pants over this guy. Wouldn't trade him for the world.
Curno - Dynamic Footballer that could push into midfield. Amazing talent and a great get at 12.
Cunningham - Has pace and is a nice kick. Has the ability to break games open. Only played 34 games and needs more game time. Don't like him trapped forward which he has been a lot this year out of need I am hoping. Showed against Essendon what he can go.
Silvagni J - Good get late in the draft. Works his back side off and applies a lot of defensive pressure.
2016
SPS - Starting to hit his sweet spot. While people are critical of his work in defense no-one has really got a hold of him. Good in the contest with good skills we will be rewarded when he is moved up the ground.
Fisher - We know what this bloke can do. Another that needs game time. Injuries has hampered him a little.
Macreadie - For a bloke taken at 47 he has shown enough to suggest he can play. Injuries have set him back.
Polson - At pick 59 the picking are slim. Has 4 games to show if he is up to it.
Williamson - Taken at pick 61. Just a baby at 28 games. Needs more game time to adjust to the pressure and unleash that left foot. Body the real concern.
Kerr - Spec Tall.
2017
Dow - His debut season was great. Struggled with 2nd year blues and has been injured for most of 2020. Has put on a little bit of bulk and needs at least another pre-season or two. You see the improvement in a guys like Setterfield and that comes with an improved tank. As a result he is able to get to more contests, can spread defensively, is not fatigued when he goes to dispose of the ball and as a result make better decisions. Again only 41 games. Must play as much as possible.
O'Brien - Outsider user of the ball. Needs to work on his defensive side. Ideal replacement for Simpson. Showed in the pre-season how good he is with ball in had. Will get better as our insdie game gets better.
TDK - Oh boy. The struggle to make sure he gets games.
Schumacher - Pick 70. Nuff said.
Garlett - Gone. Talented. Lacked in other areas.
2018
(It's really too early to comment on any of these guys. Way to early.)
Walsh - Gun
Stocker - who knows?
O'Dwyer - speculative pick unlikely to survive the cut.
Silvagni B - same as O'Dwyer?
Kano is a flog and of the highest order. He is just click bait and each week he takes turns in crap canning someone. There is no depth or any insight to his views. Unfortunately this type of media is common in the AFL.
Terrible decision to pay that much for McGovern given his output and our needs in other areas. I wouldn't use that as a reason to justify over spending in other areas.
Reminds me of why we went after Warnock when we had Kruezer and Jacobs then recruited Hampson.
Terrible decision to pay that much for McGovern given his output and our needs in other areas. I wouldn't use that as a reason to justify over spending in other areas.
Backline has a few cracks wallpapered over with Weitering and Jones IMHO and our smaller defenders dont really defend.
I think a couple of quality small/mid backs who can defend/run the ball out well are the priority and where the money should be spent along with another quality mid who can help Cripps.
Keogh....I've posted it before and didn't want to torture the readers again.....but if you look at the 2014 Draft, that was the killer! An absolute disaster....blokes from that draft would now be in their prime years but not one of them is left at the club.
Only Jones obtained by the PSD from memory. What a disaster those years were, everybody just glosses over it but it set us back years.
https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/08/31/have-carltons-top-young-draft-picks-actually-improved/
2015
Weitering - Close to AA. Leader. Agree
McKay - playing the hardest position on the ground. 44 games in this bloke is super talented. Need continuality. The rest of the football community is wetting their pants over this guy. Wouldn't trade him for the world. Talented for sure
Curno - Dynamic Footballer that could push into midfield. Amazing talent and a great get at 12. Agree on talent but injuries remain a major issue and we need to prepare for the worst if he breaks down again
Cunningham - Has pace and is a nice kick. Has the ability to break games open. Only played 34 games and needs more game time. Don't like him trapped forward which he has been a lot this year out of need I am hoping. Showed against Essendon what he can go.Can play but too inconsistent
Silvagni J - Good get late in the draft. Works his back side off and applies a lot of defensive pressure.Agree
2016
SPS - Starting to hit his sweet spot. While people are critical of his work in defense no-one has really got a hold of him. Good in the contest with good skills we will be rewarded when he is moved up the ground.Disagree, lazy contester, picks and chooses when to go and struggles when its physical
Fisher - We know what this bloke can do. Another that needs game time. Injuries has hampered him a little.Agree
Macreadie - For a bloke taken at 47 he has shown enough to suggest he can play. Injuries have set him back.Delist
Polson - At pick 59 the picking are slim. Has 4 games to show if he is up to it. Delist
Williamson - Taken at pick 61. Just a baby at 28 games. Needs more game time to adjust to the pressure and unleash that left foot. Body the real concern.Agree
Kerr - Spec Tall.Harshly done by IMO
2017
Dow - His debut season was great. Struggled with 2nd year blues and has been injured for most of 2020. Has put on a little bit of bulk and needs at least another pre-season or two. You see the improvement in a guys like Setterfield and that comes with an improved tank. As a result he is able to get to more contests, can spread defensively, is not fatigued when he goes to dispose of the ball and as a result make better decisions. Again only 41 games. Must play as much as possible. Poor user at U18 level, poor decision maker at senior level, has pace and will attack a contest but 50/50 only with other young players coming through who kick the ball better
O'Brien - Outsider user of the ball. Needs to work on his defensive side. Ideal replacement for Simpson. Showed in the pre-season how good he is with ball in had. Will get better as our insdie game gets better.Poor contested player and his kicking is over rated, at half back he would be a liability IMO so close to goal
TDK - Oh boy. The struggle to make sure he gets games.Agree, great prospect
Schumacher - Pick 70. Nuff said.Odd choice
Garlett - Gone. Talented. Lacked in other areas.Dud
2018
(It's really too early to comment on any of these guys. Way to early.)
Walsh - GunAgree
Stocker - who knows?Has the talent
O'Dwyer - speculative pick unlikely to survive the cut.Ridiculous pick IMO
Silvagni B - same as O'Dwyer?Has size and can take a mark, unlike his brother though in attitude IMO and does he want it enough?
Kano is a flog and of the highest order. He is just click bait and each week he takes turns in crap canning someone. There is no depth or any insight to his views. Unfortunately this type of media is common in the AFL.
@ Shakin
What EB said.
@ Shakin
What EB said.
That's fine. I am not suggesting that every player draft will be a star, but as a collective it's a handy bunch and if we can get a few thing right via free agency we are pretty well set.
I get the feeling SOS's legacy will come down to how well the midfield develops plus his inability to bring a Shiel or Coniglio in.
6 weeks ago Kano was banging on about Walsh. He is just a Muppet.
GTC....traded a draft pick to the Dogs to get Liam Jones. The Dogs used that pick to snare Caleb Daniel. Daniel has been superb for them and we would've been kicking ourselves early but I think Jones has been pretty good down back in the last few seasons for us.
The rest of 2014 draft/trade period is stuff of nightmares!
@ WAS
Surfie I think MM was instrumental in getting Jones iirc. A family friend, from memory.
@ WAS
Surfie I think MM was instrumental in getting Jones iirc. A family friend, from memory.
Yes that's my recollection too. MM was also keen on Kristian Jasck (?sp) 😖
Tuesday arvo calmness - well at least I hope that comes through the post!
I agree we may have lost it in selection - but then I look at this with calmness and think who else could we bring in?
At some point form has to be the key. Both Dow and Polson were showing form - it isn't anyone's fault the games they are playing in resemble little of the action in senior footy.
Further to this I am fascinated with Polson. When played as a fwd he displayed to me dear in a headlight symptoms. Would run fast, miss easy marks and kicking was an issue. The move to defence is a good move for him and the team - as we have a shortage here with no access to Stocker atm. So when I saw Polson take the ball and run out of defence early in the first qtr I felt this was what the coaches wanted - dare, pace, carry. They would know kicking is an issue but the other key points come first. Then my joy changed.
I noticed Polson look down field, then look behind to Simpson to handball backwards. At this point I had to pause as I simply can't determine from the vision if he looked back cos Simpson was screaming to him to do this - or if no fwd was leading to the space his kick could reach? It wouldn't surprise me to see down field vision of no one running to the space to warrant a lead as our fwds currently aren't the smartest bunch. Here is when I feel for Polson - his very first involvement looked good but ended poorly with a turn over - a 50 50 kick in hope, Well we all should know this isn't the first time in a very long time this has happened. Bloody hell our joint captain gave away our fist goal with the worse kick I have ever seen him do - talk about setting the tone. We are a confidence team and a good start has always been vital.
I'm pretty confident Polson spent solid time on the pine. Most likely dragged as Teague is displaying very little patience for youth anymore and their mistakes. Let's not forget this was one of the biggest criticisms of Ratten - wouldn't play or develop the young guys enough. Tended to stick to the core of senior players. I fear we are headed down this path again. We can't have the SOS injection of youth - and our Exec committee saying this is the re-build we needed. Then bye to SOS and Teague shows strong signs of not backing enough of the youth. For example...He brings in Honey v Freo. Wet rainy conditions. Not allowing to displaying his skill set. I felt his touch was very good considering - so why drop him? One match in the wet - give me a spell. We stuck with Cottrell who showed some very good signs up until needing a rest. Honey is explosive as is Philp. Pace is what we are screaming for. Play these 2 then. Give Eddie a rest for example. Or rotate him on the bench more - thus dropping a big guy. We are way too tall against any team.
With Dow he also is fascinating. We all know kicking is a real issue. Yet in the twos it's not as noticeable. My issue with him is a perceived lack of hunger for the contest. And a real fear to kick the ball. Many times I saw a lack of desire to tackle - and when he did Collingwood players easily brushed him off. My read of Teague is this would be the number 1 thing he wouldn't like. A lack of defensive pressure (hence O'Brien not playing imo).
If this can't be taught or injected in to these players, under Teague they simply won't get a game or will be de-listed.
It will be fascinating to see if they persist with Dow and Polson in an absolute must win match. this to me will say so much about our current coaching and selection crew. PS is Sav Rocca still the kicking coach? I recall 2 years a go Cripps nailing a high percentage of set shots and having a clear method to his pre kick routine. For a star like him I am amazed his routine this year (which CLEARLY) isn't working - hasn't been amended. If he is injured which affects his kicking - don't bloody put him fwd!! Calmness gone sorry...
smarter quicker team .the space that stephenson had and delivery was perfect and could of kicked 4 goals /why cant we do the same with eddie for example our coaches have to do better on match day
Takes alot of work to get to that level of structure unfortunately otherwise we'd entrenched in the 8. Bit hard to work on it this year as you can only work with 8 players at a time on the training track. Many forget that. This year is highly advantageous to very established sides for that reason, as Hodge said this morning. Sides with ingrained structures. It's why the Pies can forever miss top players but not miss a beat making GF's and PF's with a number of good ones missing. We are still working to establish that. It's much better than it was and at times have manged to use it and find that space on occasions, just not consistently.
GTC....traded a draft pick to the Dogs to get Liam Jones. The Dogs used that pick to snare Caleb Daniel. Daniel has been superb for them and we would've been kicking ourselves early but I think Jones has been pretty good down back in the last few seasons for us.
The rest of 2014 draft/trade period is stuff of nightmares!
Yep agree
@ WAS
Surfie I think MM was instrumental in getting Jones iirc. A family friend, from memory.
Yes, MM mates with Jonesy's dad from memory.
Yes, MM mates with Jonesy's dad from memory.
Took lots of years and frustration but eventually paid dividends.
Reminds me of why we went after Warnock when we had Kruezer and Jacobs then recruited Hampson.
Kreuzer was a kid, Hampson, not real good and young, Jacobs was pretty average and just got his 2nd run on the rookie list. Hindsight always helps.
Things changed after.
And yet we played twice as well against them last year when nobody gave us a hope in hell.
But for some terrible umpiring decisions in the last 5 minutes of that game, it was ours.
It's all between our ears...
And that Cripps is wounded, or mind elsewhere, doesn't help.
Different pressure last year. Nothing to lose last year. Highest stakes in 7 years by a long way this year.
@ WAS
Surfie I think MM was instrumental in getting Jones iirc. A family friend, from memory.
Yep. true. Jones asked to come to Carlton and Mick jumped
Mick didn't exactly do us any other recruiting favours.... Cost us Waite, Betts and Robinson. Words fail me describing that useless flog.
Sean Charles, Mick Martyn, Corey McKernan ... more genius from Pagan
Sean Charles, Mick Martyn, Corey McKernan ... more genius from Pagan
McKernan escaped Norf to get away from Pagan then Pagan came to us, he then went back to Norf.
Sean Charles, Mick Martyn, Corey McKernan ... more genius from Pagan
Bit unfair on McKernan IMO. He got there BEFORE Pagan took over as I recall. His first year he played really well and won the B&F. After Pagan arrived it all went to crap for him and he left.
Beat me to it, G2C ;D
Mick didn't exactly do us any other recruiting favours.... Cost us Waite, Betts and Robinson. Words fail me describing that useless flog.
As much as you may despise MM, his account of Waites departure differs to that of the supporters. Betts departure had nothing to do MM from what I have been told. You can blame Eddies manager at the time for that.
Sean Charles, Mick Martyn, Corey McKernan ... more genius from Pagan
Corey was a winner. 40 goals up forward as well as being the no.1 ruck with our injuries. Did a huge job that year. Got the B & F. That one was a success....................until Pagan returned, the reason he left North in the first place.
Delete.
Tuesday arvo calmness - well at least I hope that comes through the post!
I agree we may have lost it in selection - but then I look at this with calmness and think who else could we bring in?
At some point form has to be the key. Both Dow and Polson were showing form - it isn't anyone's fault the games they are playing in resemble little of the action in senior footy.
Further to this I am fascinated with Polson. When played as a fwd he displayed to me dear in a headlight symptoms. Would run fast, miss easy marks and kicking was an issue. The move to defence is a good move for him and the team - as we have a shortage here with no access to Stocker atm. So when I saw Polson take the ball and run out of defence early in the first qtr I felt this was what the coaches wanted - dare, pace, carry. They would know kicking is an issue but the other key points come first. Then my joy changed.
I noticed Polson look down field, then look behind to Simpson to handball backwards. At this point I had to pause as I simply can't determine from the vision if he looked back cos Simpson was screaming to him to do this - or if no fwd was leading to the space his kick could reach? It wouldn't surprise me to see down field vision of no one running to the space to warrant a lead as our fwds currently aren't the smartest bunch. Here is when I feel for Polson - his very first involvement looked good but ended poorly with a turn over - a 50 50 kick in hope, Well we all should know this isn't the first time in a very long time this has happened. Bloody hell our joint captain gave away our fist goal with the worse kick I have ever seen him do - talk about setting the tone. We are a confidence team and a good start has always been vital.
I'm pretty confident Polson spent solid time on the pine. Most likely dragged as Teague is displaying very little patience for youth anymore and their mistakes. Let's not forget this was one of the biggest criticisms of Ratten - wouldn't play or develop the young guys enough. Tended to stick to the core of senior players. I fear we are headed down this path again. We can't have the SOS injection of youth - and our Exec committee saying this is the re-build we needed. Then bye to SOS and Teague shows strong signs of not backing enough of the youth. For example...He brings in Honey v Freo. Wet rainy conditions. Not allowing to displaying his skill set. I felt his touch was very good considering - so why drop him? One match in the wet - give me a spell. We stuck with Cottrell who showed some very good signs up until needing a rest. Honey is explosive as is Philp. Pace is what we are screaming for. Play these 2 then. Give Eddie a rest for example. Or rotate him on the bench more - thus dropping a big guy. We are way too tall against any team.
With Dow he also is fascinating. We all know kicking is a real issue. Yet in the twos it's not as noticeable. My issue with him is a perceived lack of hunger for the contest. And a real fear to kick the ball. Many times I saw a lack of desire to tackle - and when he did Collingwood players easily brushed him off. My read of Teague is this would be the number 1 thing he wouldn't like. A lack of defensive pressure (hence O'Brien not playing imo).
If this can't be taught or injected in to these players, under Teague they simply won't get a game or will be de-listed.
It will be fascinating to see if they persist with Dow and Polson in an absolute must win match. this to me will say so much about our current coaching and selection crew. PS is Sav Rocca still the kicking coach? I recall 2 years a go Cripps nailing a high percentage of set shots and having a clear method to his pre kick routine. For a star like him I am amazed his routine this year (which CLEARLY) isn't working - hasn't been amended. If he is injured which affects his kicking - don't bloody put him fwd!! Calmness gone sorry...
Teague is still playing the kids. He's rotating them through the key roles rather than throwing them in the deep end.
As for the polson assertion he had 80% time on ground against Collingwood according to afl tables.
He's stuck by de koning as another example. Don't worry too much about the first year kids and them not getting more than a bit of a taste. They'll get their time in the sun.
Weve spent a bit of time trying to keep our line up settled and thats what Luke hodge reckons will help our team. Continuity. We haven't seen much of it over the last 5 years.
Keogh....I've posted it before and didn't want to torture the readers again.....but if you look at the 2014 Draft, that was the killer! An absolute disaster....blokes from that draft would now be in their prime years but not one of them is left at the club.
Indeed. The 2014 was awful. Other teams made better choices. We traded ordinarily, but we drafted disastrously. That draft put us back probably 2 years all it itself.
The small defender role is important in terms of the player having to be a very good user of the ball these days and be able to hit targets under pressure to clear the ball.
Lets give Polson a pass on defending but IMO his use of the ball, decision making wont stand up under pressure from really good teams. The player we really needed to nail as a trade was Saad...he was a bad miss for us, can defend, has pace and is a decent kick and decision maker, shame he picked EFC and I wish we had probably offered a bit more money to sway his opinion.
Saad? Your kidding EB!
The bloke’s run at all costs modus operandi is well in to Emu territory, and I don’t ever want to see that from another Carlton player.
Saad? Your kidding EB!
The bloke’s run at all costs modus operandi is well in to Emu territory, and I don’t ever want to see that from another Carlton player.
I agree with both of you, in that Saad's run is elite and we lack that sort of drive off the HBF, and I agree that he can run himself into trouble just like Williamson has been doing recently.
But some of that trouble for both Saad and Williamson comes from team-mates leading into the wrong places and creating roadblocks. As team-mates get to know and trust the runner they'll learn to create space for them to run into and won't run towards them closing the space up!
Same thing affects Fisher, we see team-mates thinking they are doing the right thing by running towards him to assist, when all the team-mate is really doing is dragging an opponent into the clear space.
Our team needs to trust that with a few metres of clear space and a head of steam the likes of Fisher and Williamson can keep clear to gain 20 or 30 metres.
There is a lot of rubbish being posted in social and professional media about our loss to the Filth, but we shouldn't take too much notice of it.
Why...........it's clear to me the loss was different?
It was different because in the bad old days we lost because we couldn't get the football, we'd be beaten to it, lose the contest and be out-marked, we never looked in the contest.
Last weekend we won as much football as our opponents, we won as many if not more contests, we won as many if not more marking contests, and we found as much run and space as any Filth opponent. We generated as many if not more I50s, but the big difference is we burnt the I50s with poor decision making and disposal, leaving Moore to clean up over and over again in what I think made him BoG. We can easily fix this, the coach knows it, the MC knows it, the players just have to learn it! I'd suggest most of the efficiency deficits shown in the image below come about when we entered F50.
Agree with the thrust of the above post. This time, after twenty or so years, the pies took us seriously. We're not a contender yet, but we're no longer the utter joke of the past. Our list and coaching stuff need to learn how to win (made inroads on that this year), play well in, and then progress to winning big, high pressure games.
Yes, LP and the Prof have nailed it!
It was drummed into me at a very young age that Carlton supporters must not tolerate losses. However, after a couple of days have passed and the disappointment has dissipated somewhat, there are positives to take out of the game.
Teague is still playing the kids. He's rotating them through the key roles rather than throwing them in the deep end.
As for the polson assertion he had 80% time on ground against Collingwood according to afl tables.
He's stuck by de koning as another example. Don't worry too much about the first year kids and them not getting more than a bit of a taste. They'll get their time in the sun.
Weve spent a bit of time trying to keep our line up settled and thats what Luke hodge reckons will help our team. Continuity. We haven't seen much of it over the last 5 years.
Agree with your last point that a consistent line up is a key and something we haven't had for some time. My pint was more in this season with so many games and inconsistent rest periods we could have benefited from resting a few more. And to my first point outside of Dow and Polson not much else outside of Philp and Honey imo
Agree with your last point that a consistent line up is a key and something we haven't had for some time. My pint was more in this season with so many games and inconsistent rest periods we could have benefited from resting a few more. And to my first point outside of Dow and Polson not much else outside of Philp and Honey imo
We actually havent had a heavy schedule yet though. From memory, I think our shortest break was 5 days (correct me if Im wrong anyone) and it only happened once.
Have a look at how people have reacted to one loss in which we rested Cottrell and SPS, to bring in Polson and Dow.
Teague's on a hiding to nothing in that equation.
Not saying your point isnt worth considering, just challenging it to make sure its one to consider. I think we will see a few more trialled coming up too, but time will tell.
Yes, LP and the Prof have nailed it!
It was drummed into me at a very young age that Carlton supporters must not tolerate losses. However, after a couple of days have passed and the disappointment has dissipated somewhat, there are positives to take out of the game.
Yep, I said this in another thread, our biggest sin against Collingwood wasnt capitalising on the sustained pressure we were putting on and our time in forward half. For some reason we seemed unwilling to have a go for goal. Martins pulled kick to Cripps might tell a story in itself. I thought he was in range and he decided to go short, we might have a few more soft tissue issues than we first thought, and the advise might be to go short rather than long.
I havent seen anyone try and pot one 40+ out for a few weeks.
I was very disappointed with the result. I am actually a bit surprised by the lack of vitriol on this site. I said before the game that to defeat Collingwood you had to beat their midfield and the truth is that Pendlebury, Thomas and Adams beat Cripps, Murphy and Curnow. While Walsh, Curnow and Setterfield were amongst our better players, especially after half time, we just didn't get the drive thru the midfield Collingwood were able to generate. I have said before that we lack pace and while guys like Cuningham, Dow, Fisher, O'Brien, Polson, Philp and Honey all have it, there is never enough of them in the one side in any given match for various reasons to actually have an impact on the game. Thomas really exposed our lack of pace from the contest. The question is can the players I mentioned become a Prestia type player.
The narrative in the media was Carlton was a near full strength Carlton was unable to defeat an undermanned Collingwood. Obviously the availability of Silvagni, Samo, Kennedy, Kreuzer, McGovern, Marchbank, Newman, Cuningham and Charlie, would have no impact on the quality of the team we put out on Sunday. Cornes is a goose and he has a real set against Samo who he seemed to blame for our loss even though he didn't play. It is hard to have an impact on a game if you are not out on the ground. I am quite happy that a lot our young players are playing in the reserves, developing their skills and bodies. I was actually surprised by the change in body shape of Dow. Because of circumstances we have been sending young kids out against men over the past few years. It should be noted that Alex Rance didn't become an all Australian until his seventh season.
Our forward line failed again after half time. I thought nine goals would win the game and when we were seven at half-time, I was quite confident. Not to kick a goal after half-time was quite disappointing. Eddie should have been give a free, Cripps should have kicked the one in the last quarter, and I have no idea what was going thru Martin's head at the end of the third. It is one of my enduring criticism that not enough Carlton players are willing to take on the responsibility of kicking goals. Cuningham is one of the few who is always willing to back himself. I thought our entries into the F50 were too shallow. We seemed to be trying to hit someone in a crowded forward line with a dinky 15 meter pass when we should have bee getting the ball to the top of the square. If you get the ball to the square and you take marks and kick crumbing goals, the forward area will open up as the defenders will be forced to defend closer to goal. If you keep kicking shallow entry balls, then the defenders will press up.
We actually havent had a heavy schedule yet though. From memory, I think our shortest break was 5 days (correct me if Im wrong anyone) and it only happened once.
Have a look at how people have reacted to one loss in which we rested Cottrell and SPS, to bring in Polson and Dow.
Teague's on a hiding to nothing in that equation.
Not saying your point isnt worth considering, just challenging it to make sure its one to consider. I think we will see a few more trialled coming up too, but time will tell.
Yep, I said this in another thread, our biggest sin against Collingwood wasnt capitalising on the sustained pressure we were putting on and our time in forward half. For some reason we seemed unwilling to have a go for goal. Martins pulled kick to Cripps might tell a story in itself. I thought he was in range and he decided to go short, we might have a few more soft tissue issues than we first thought, and the advise might be to go short rather than long.
I havent seen anyone try and pot one 40+ out for a few weeks.
Yes we had several last weekend, it's a bit odd, so maybe one of our coaches or a player is bashing the players about missing set shots because we've lost a few close games!
If so the coach or player should shut the feck up, it doesn't make things better it only makes things happen like you have described!
Saad? Your kidding EB!
The bloke’s run at all costs modus operandi is well in to Emu territory, and I don’t ever want to see that from another Carlton player.
No I am not kidding DJ...SOS wanted him and for good reason...
From Wikipedia...
Renowned for his precise kicking and ability to break the lines and cut angles to evade opponentsNone of our players could be labelled precise kicks, break the lines?? a foreign concept to our team having that type of player doing that consistently and not just a one off..and cut angles to evade opponents?, once again our blokes tend to create angles and run into opponents more often than not and get pinged with the ball or turn it over.
IMHO Saad is exactly what we need coming out of the backpocket and if you team him with Zac Williams there is your rebound pace problems solved and someone like SPS can play in his comfort zone more and be used to carry the ball after Saad and Williams hit him up..
I think the anger, disappointment etc from the Collingwood match stemmed more from the contrast between halves.
We more than matched them in then first half but couldn't go with them in a goalless second half.
If you think you're in with a real chance at half time and it ends up a bit one sided at the end that's disappointing.
It would be interesting to see a comparison of some of those key stats before and after half time.
Agreed Lods....it's become a bit of a disturbing trend under Teague as the coach. The inability to play 4 quarters of footy. We seem to either give teams a 4-5 goal start and then spend a lot of energy hauling them in....or we get a big lead up and then just completely stop and go back into our shell and stop the style of game we were playing to get in front in the first place. There'd only be 3-4 games I can think of where we've dominated and played 4 quarters of footy.
you beat collingwood by stopping there run from defence it is so simple ,happened last year and i blame our coaches for not adjusting during game . plowman on stephenson ,he is to quick + space to lead LP got no hope so why didn't the coaches make the change
We actually havent had a heavy schedule yet though. From memory, I think our shortest break was 5 days (correct me if Im wrong anyone) and it only happened once.
Have a look at how people have reacted to one loss in which we rested Cottrell and SPS, to bring in Polson and Dow.
Teague's on a hiding to nothing in that equation.
Not saying your point isnt worth considering, just challenging it to make sure its one to consider. I think we will see a few more trialled coming up too, but time will tell.
Yep, I said this in another thread, our biggest sin against Collingwood wasnt capitalising on the sustained pressure we were putting on and our time in forward half. For some reason we seemed unwilling to have a go for goal. Martins pulled kick to Cripps might tell a story in itself. I thought he was in range and he decided to go short, we might have a few more soft tissue issues than we first thought, and the advise might be to go short rather than long.
I havent seen anyone try and pot one 40+ out for a few weeks.
Yes, and in the current era it's even more important to be able to kick "over the crush" from 40-50m. Sometimes you just have to take you shot rather than handballing about to find the perfect position. Have to be able to kick on the opposite foot. How many shots at goals, clearer shots, that haven't taken because the player can't kick on his opposite foot. Goals are at a premium, have to take them when they are there.
In this current climate cleans hands delivering and receiving is so important. Makes such a difference.
I havent seen anyone try and pot one 40+ out for a few weeks.
Newnes did Sunday and kicked it - he is the only one. Betts, Gibbons, Martin, Cripps wouldn't make the distance. SPS def wouldn't
Newnes did Sunday and kicked it - he is the only one. Betts, Gibbons, Martin, Cripps wouldn't make the distance. SPS def wouldn't
Martin can kick 50 comfortably.
Its great that Teague has everyone playing team footy, but FFS, when we get the ball within range, just take a ping at them. We are more of a chance of kicking a goal from 40-50 than we are of trying to hit up someone closer, and having them convert.
So....why bother?
Martin can kick 50 comfortably.
Didn't look like it on Sunday flyboy. In fact I was thinking to myself earlier in the year he was our best kick at goal. Has something changed since his last injury perhaps? In fact I don't think he's kicked a goal since the Hawthorn game.
Didn't look like it on Sunday flyboy. In fact I was thinking to myself earlier in the year he was our best kick at goal. Has something changed since his last injury perhaps? In fact I don't think he's kicked a goal since the Hawthorn game.
Could be that he doesnt want to extend the hammy/calf that was troubling him
Notice Levi's form's dropped off since we started playing 2 rucks? Always has in the past. He's a forward/ruck not a forward per se. When he gets a run in the ruck he gets confidence from getting his hands on the ball. He carries that confidence then back to the forward line. As a forward, in a low scoring scrappy season with crappy delivery, it makes with very tough for all our forwards.
I felt his form fell away after the oldies took the grandkids to movieworld (or wherever it was) prior to that he was flying.
I do agree he’s not a key forward, especially when he’s number 1 or 2, however as a ruck/3rd forward he gets a lot more time and space and is very effective.