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Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #90
Our three big forwards need to sort out a system.

Harry looked rusty, the Guv just stuffs up too much presently.

Our forward 6 looked squashed up, there was no space....plenty of talent there but wasn't working at all yesterday.

Won the I50 count easily....

Everyone knows we should have won that game yesterday, even after Q1.

It's on out leadership group to step up. That where tight games get won....

Cripps can't do it every week.

Weiters was very, very good.

Harry started well, then Dees switched to going the body on him and he barely got another kick.  If umps treated him the same way they treated Gawn, he would have had 15 frees

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #91
Yes Gawn gets very well looked after....

The I50 delivery was back to its worst and Big H and the Guv simply didn't lead enough....but often are ball movement was so slow and haphazard hard for them to know when and where to go?
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #92
Harry started well, then Dees switched to going the body on him and he barely got another kick.  If umps treated him the same way they treated Gawn, he would have had 15 frees
People blame the crowds, but at the moment there is no crowd, it's the opposition officials and coaches talking in the media that influence the outcome more than anything else!

Last season Melbourne bitched and moaned about Gawn's treatment at the hands of various opponents, Dimma is continually complaining about how hard done by Dusty, Cotchin or Riewoldt is, despite those three being some of the biggest offenders. Clarkson was always banging on about Buddy, or how we didn't want players like Hodge prevented from attacking the football. Scott never stops bleating about the treatment of Danger, Ablett or Selwood, they need protection.

At our club, guys like Murphy, Cripps, Fisher, Kreuzer get illegally smashed week and week out and it's crickets!

Surely, yesterday with Gawn in the absence of crowds, added to events like Dangerfield's Curnow commentary, tells us this isn't a crowd problem!
The Force Awakens!

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #93
We're soft,  mentally and physically, end of story

The next bloke we draft has to a hard as *+*! Ultra competive mid.  Dusty Ziebell Viney  Selwood Hodge Lewis or even Rowell.   That kind of bloke. No more pretty, nice,  players like Fisher O'Brien  SPS Murphy Dow Setterfield.  Blokes that will smack the bloke next to them as soon as they get looked sideways at.

Got a lot of hope for Stocker,  at least he's shown some grit.   Why isn't he playing?
DrE is no more... you ok with that harmonica man?

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #94
I want North Melbourne's attitude. They are invariably switched on and never give up. Give everything. Now they'll beat the GWS in Sydney.  If we had what they had with the players we have, we'd be soooo much better. I want that intangible they have.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #95
Five years ago at the beginning of the 2016 season we all bought the story that, following a rebuild, we long-suffering supporters would reach that great big shining light at the end of the tunnel.

We believed that by 2020 we would be serious contenders for the flag, well entrenched in the top 8.

So where are we? We have a side that is still incapable of playing four quarters of consistent football.  We are so desperate for any signs of success that we seem to be happy if we can get a medium/maximum effort for three quarters of a game and hope the side can get off the bottom of the ladder.

I have just re-read this thread, and clearly we have so many problems I don't know where to start.

Motivation is lacking. So few of our players are desperate for the ball. It's like watching our old side before the re-build when players such as Gibbs would roll up and play bruise free football.  Basic skills such as making tackles stick, and the ability to kick, are missing week in, week out.  There is no mongrel in the side. 

How is it that with so many early draft picks we are still so short of players with football nous and skills?

I hate being negative but realistically when are we ever going to stop being the bottom feeders of the AFL?





Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #96
It seems like the old adage of you play the same way as you train.
Two games this year but many games over the years we have failed to fire a shot in the first qtr only to just miss out on the chocolates.
The players must do this at training, just gradually build their intensity instead of warm up then into it.
There also seems to be a lack of intensity at training, yeah sure enough they run around and tackle each other and work up a sweat but this is similar to what happens on game day. There is no 'I'm going to make this personal' or I'm going to really hurt you tackles, there are no consequences for not succeeding.
Goal kicking?????? They must practice it but if they miss at training they just grab another ball and try and get it with the next one.
There are no consequences for missing, no pressure! This is what needs to be replicated at training, pressure.
Throw the medical science out the window that says you can only kick 10 times or can only be out on the training ground for x number of minutes.
Training should be harder than the game. The sessions don't need to go as long as a game but needs the same intensity, pressure and that feeling of the need to succeed and to win every battle.
I know it is different sport but when I played high level volleyball our training's were always harder than our games and the results proved it. Undefeated for 3 years in a row and won 9 titles in a row. (age is what got us in the end)
Also dislike the smiling at the end of the games when we lose. They seem to not care.
Farkum neither do I anymore
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #97
West Coast got pumped by Gold Coast....

It's been a very weird year.

Even discounting the deplorable first quarter, we should have won that in a canter but for terrible kicking.

The kicking at goal, from relatively easy positions, in benign conditions, was below sub standard.

Our midfield was down, Pittonet aside (terrific debut), and our forward line was a mess, ditto the delivery I50.

We'll improve markedly from that effort.

Of bigger concern was a lot of our guys looked to be holding back/waiting for someone else to do the heavy lifting.

Unacceptable at this level.

Would be getting McGovern's eyes checked - he missed a lot of marks by a wide margin, despite being in a great position to mark.

Bad news for Newman, obviously. But great that Willo can now come in...
Seems the obvious choice...which means Polson will come in
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #98
Lang was never an answer as a mid and I doubt I ever said as such....i can see why they picked him up (what 3 years ago now?) but he's had injuries and simply doesn't do enough now. Philp for him is a no brainer.

But, why hasn't had been given a crack in the guts?

The other two simply aren't getting their job done....still have high hopes for Setters, Newnes always just a soldier but didn't even do that last night.

That said, all of them were off the pace for a lot of it last night.

Who's our midfield coach? Big, big FAIL.


Stanton (Midfield and Transition) and Barker (Midfield and Stoppages), I would have sacked them today. Plenty of good coaches sitting around off work due to Covid19.
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #99
Newman out for 2020😥
Recover well son.

Losing is always disappointing, and for some, infuriating.

Losing as many suggest, through poor goal kicking, inept adaptation to what's in front of you, and mental unpreparedness, heightens emotions. No doubt. The sought after W is so close yet so far.

Many have provided sound analysis of the problems and suggested plausible solutions. In the end we were caught short. Imo our shortcomings fell in areas amenable to correction.

I empathise with Baggers demanding mass reform. I also believe we have what it takes to climb the proverbial. Albeit not consistently for 4q. 6 of our last 8q has shown just that. I expect most footy fans would agree with that to some extent.

Aside from minor adjustments across a few areas, I see one main glaring flaw, and it's not new. Get another quality inside mid or two. Not an athlete or fly weight with fancy footwork, but an inside bull with footy smarts and effective disposal.

This could be SOJ and Kemp in future. Right now though, neither were available. We're still trialling young men in different positions and playing seniors in positions they no longer own. Fix that, and master the 4q focus, and we're in the frame.

Go Blues
Coming together is the beginning.
Keeping together is progress.
Working together is success.
Henry Ford.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #100
We're soft,  mentally and physically, end of story

The next bloke we draft has to a hard as *+*! Ultra competive mid.  Dusty Ziebell Viney  Selwood Hodge Lewis or even Rowell.   That kind of bloke. No more pretty, nice,  players like Fisher O'Brien  SPS Murphy Dow Setterfield.  Blokes that will smack the bloke next to them as soon as they get looked sideways at.

Got a lot of hope for Stocker,  at least he's shown some grit.   Why isn't he playing?
Coz we gotta play Lang ::)
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #101
Who is the midfield coach?   Please tell me it's not that useless crap truck Barker.

Like everybody else I'm bewildered by the rinse and repeat same old crap that was dished up - on every level - yesterday.

I just don't see a way out if this.   We have,  seriously,  twenty players that have shown nothing on our list.   We can't draft (consistently), we can't acquire players,  we can't develop players, we lack football nous,
ability,  skill,  hardness,  smarts,  effort ....its a mobius loop of mediocrity going nowhere.

I'm utterly bereft how we're ever going to exit this situation.  We've had a parallel before.     Once hope and faith are lost,  and let's face it,  we're almost there,  the club is finished.  Like Fitzroy.
Yep. I am all for Cripps leaving now (ie I think he will go rather stay), he cant keep tolerating this rubbish. Failure is so ingrained in our club now I cant see how to fix it. Start all over again? How many times can we keep starting all over again ? 86 days between round 1 and 2 and we repeated the same rubbish against Melbourne no less. That alone makes my blood boil. I simply cant see how anyone can take positives out of games at this point, every member to a man/woman/cat/dog/bird should be at the front gate tomorrow morning baying for blood. The clubs predicament is is completely unacceptable and something drastic needs to happen NOW 
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #102
Newman out for 2020😥
Recover well son.

Losing is always disappointing, and for some, infuriating.

Losing as many suggest, through poor goal kicking, inept adaptation to what's in front of you, and mental unpreparedness, heightens emotions. No doubt. The sought after W is so close yet so far.

Many have provided sound analysis of the problems and suggested plausible solutions. In the end we were caught short. Imo our shortcomings fell in areas amenable to correction.

I empathise with Baggers demanding mass reform. I also believe we have what it takes to climb the proverbial. Albeit not consistently for 4q. 6 of our last 8q has shown just that. I expect most footy fans would agree with that to some extent.

Aside from minor adjustments across a few areas, I see one main glaring flaw, and it's not new. Get another quality inside mid or two. Not an athlete or fly weight with fancy footwork, but an inside bull with footy smarts and effective disposal.

This could be SOJ and Kemp in future. Right now though, neither were available. We're still trialling young men in different positions and playing seniors in positions they no longer own. Fix that, and master the 4q focus, and we're in the frame.

Go Blues

Sorry Navy, heard all that before many many times before and nothing has happened and wont happen any time soon. We are a laughing stock make no mistake about it and this upsets me. Something radical and drastic is required because nothing traditional has worked thus far. All I here is excuses. When I was a kid, my late old man used to say "why do you get so upset, its just a game". It is so much more than a game Dad.
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #103
And now for something completely different....

What would you prefer?
a) Getting out of the blocks, getting a jump on the opposition only to be overrun at the end and running out of puff. Ala Tigers a few years ago, 5 goals to 0 up, lost.
or
b) Giving the opposition a leg up early, regrouping and chasing them down late.

Before you answer, i know what it will be....
"c) Jump out of the blocks AND dominate late"

That aside...you'll probably choose a)....and hope not to get run down.
I've got a different approach and i'll explain why.

In the past, if we were lucky enough to get off to a good start, the opposition would make some changes and run over us.
THAT showed a lack of
- Belief/confidence - we drop our bundle
- Ability to adjust matchday tactics

Since Teague has taken over, we've struggled early, but almost always been in matches.
This shows that we have
- Belief/confidence - we don't give up.
- Ability to adjust matchday tactics

I'd much rather the latter option. In all honesty, its a lot easier to fix a 'slow start' from a coaches perspective than it is to fix a lack of belief/confidence and matchday nous which we have suffered from previously.


Hang in there lads. We are simply a couple of early goals away from being able to dominate a game.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2020 Rd 2: Carlton vs Melbourne

Reply #104
Newman out for 2020😥
Recover well son.

Losing is always disappointing, and for some, infuriating.

Losing as many suggest, through poor goal kicking, inept adaptation to what's in front of you, and mental unpreparedness, heightens emotions. No doubt. The sought after W is so close yet so far.

Many have provided sound analysis of the problems and suggested plausible solutions. In the end we were caught short. Imo our shortcomings fell in areas amenable to correction.

I empathise with Baggers demanding mass reform. I also believe we have what it takes to climb the proverbial. Albeit not consistently for 4q. 6 of our last 8q has shown just that. I expect most footy fans would agree with that to some extent.

Aside from minor adjustments across a few areas, I see one main glaring flaw, and it's not new. Get another quality inside mid or two. Not an athlete or fly weight with fancy footwork, but an inside bull with footy smarts and effective disposal.

This could be SOJ and Kemp in future. Right now though, neither were available. We're still trialling young men in different positions and playing seniors in positions they no longer own. Fix that, and master the 4q focus, and we're in the frame.

Go Blues


Greetings LN, and happy New Year... 😁 😉

Many good points though I think you've confused me with someone else re 'mass reform'. Nuh, we're fundamentally on the right track and the 'comebacks' in our past two games were full of merit and fight and indicate we're, in the words of Renee Geyer, heading in the right direction.

However...

As I mentioned earlier our issues are fundamentally above the shoulders. Plus being 2 HARD mids short and some coaching intelligence for the midfield. Our midfield started like it was at training... bruise free/lacking mongrel, trying to finesse/easy way out and no initiative/boldness to respond to the Dees smart coaching in nullifying the Cripps influence. This is where one of our Directors, C Judd, should be exerting his expertise and experience... in terms of attitude and strategy, on the group and the midfield coaching staff (FFS, would someone please wrench Barker off the security of the CFC tit and bring in a midfield coach with smarts and a bit of shyte on his liver). And Stanton... really?

It was embarrassing how soft we started. How the hell does Murphy play as an inside mid and have 0 tackles... WTF? Even if we'd won, there'd be forceful questions being asked about our soft attitude and lack of smarts at game commencement.

I understand that we probably went for Lang when SOJ went down due to his speed... but fair-fkn-dinkum, the bloke fills his durps when he's confronted with physicality - we can't carry blokes like this (fair finisher but there's a reason the Pussycats were glad to see the @rs end of him) when you've got a bloke like Kennedy warming the pine who has a forward presence AND a physical presence. Blokes like Lang only add to 'softness' above the shoulders.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17