Skip to main content
Topic: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle (Read 3149 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #15
I think we're going to have to face the fact sooner or later.
It's time to let it go and accept it. :(

The best ruckman on our list is Harry McKay ;D
( well he was probably our best ruckman today) ;)

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #16
Ruckman are overrated
It only looks that way because Darcy isn't the smartest ruckman going around (just one of the strongest). He is fairly predictable in how he plays and how he delivers the ball. If he changed things up occasionally, make himself more predictable to him teammates instead of his opponents, it would be different.
To be honest, not a lot of modern ruckmen are matchwinners; they do a lot of push and shove and forget some of the most important lessons in ruck play.
NicNat has been one of the most complete rucks of recent times; he guides taps do moving mids, he doesn't just do the same things any time, he is willing to give the ball a huge bash sometimes and he often is in the play after the initial contest. he is the sort of ruck that makes premierships.
Not many of that type around these days. There are a lot of crash and bash rucks, who can be effective, but most don't deliver the ball that well.
Pittonet is a crash and bash type, but he can aim his taps pretty well. Not as good this year as he was last, but other teams. have done a lot more work on him, and he has been injured or recovering from injury a lot. But he has the problem in that he is predictable; he almost never smashes the ball forward, for example. That can be a lethal trick, if his mids are ready for it.

Breeann Moody does the big smash more than most rucks. The problem was that few of our mids were prepared for it. That has changed a bit, while Moody is developing her directional tapping better than she used to.

To be a great ruck, you need to be a thinker, not just strong, which limits many modern rucks.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #17
Two games at Optus this year for a combined winning margin of 161 points.

Maybe we still think it is the old Optus Oval and we feel at home...haha.
If only!
Now we need to learnt to win in Adelaide.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #18
It only looks that way because Darcy isn't the smartest ruckman going around (just one of the strongest). He is fairly predictable in how he plays and how he delivers the ball. If he changed things up occasionally, make himself more predictable to him teammates instead of his opponents, it would be different.
To be honest, not a lot of modern ruckmen are matchwinners; they do a lot of push and shove and forget some of the most important lessons in ruck play.
NicNat has been one of the most complete rucks of recent times; he guides taps do moving mids, he doesn't just do the same things any time, he is willing to give the ball a huge bash sometimes and he often is in the play after the initial contest. he is the sort of ruck that makes premierships.
Not many of that type around these days. There are a lot of crash and bash rucks, who can be effective, but most don't deliver the ball that well.
Pittonet is a crash and bash type, but he can aim his taps pretty well. Not as good this year as he was last, but other teams. have done a lot more work on him, and he has been injured or recovering from injury a lot. But he has the problem in that he is predictable; he almost never smashes the ball forward, for example. That can be a lethal trick, if his mids are ready for it.

Breeann Moody does the big smash more than most rucks. The problem was that few of our mids were prepared for it. That has changed a bit, while Moody is developing her directional tapping better than she used to.

To be a great ruck, you need to be a thinker, not just strong, which limits many modern rucks.
Agree with all that, but I think credit needs to go to the Coaches and Mids for working hard on a plan to combat ruck dominance at ground level.  Credit to the coaches for giving the mids confidence and credit to the mids for sticking to the plan and keeping there chins up.
Darcy 58
Jackson 11
Treacy 1
Total 70

Young 10
H 6
SOS 2
Total 18

Thats a smashing in any language smart or not and yet, apart from Frees and Centre Clearances, we won every other stat.

That was as selfless, workmanlike, determined, team a performance as I have seen from a Carlton side in many years.

Pleasingly unexpected.
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #19
You have to like some of pour stats:
[1] Cripps had 29 possessions, 10 clearances and 5 tackles.
[2] Cerra had 27 possessions, 1 goal, 6 tackles and 6 clearances.
[3] H had 20 possessions from CHF, 3 goals 2 behinds, 8 marks, 6 hit outs and 4 tackles. How complete is that from a CHF!?!

We win the clearances comfortably (41 to 35), yet they have 70 taps!
And we were outscored in the last quarter, which evened up the stats a bit!
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #20
Late to the party and didn't see the game.

I was invited to a grass roots country football game. My recently deceased dad was a life member who'd filled every position from president to line marker, to water boy. He also played 400+ league games and coached juniors through to the league, winning multiple premierships.

To our surprise the club dedicated todays game to him. It will be an annual tribute match. All very moving for the family. He was such a humble man, we had no idea of the extent to which, he improved the on field performance and lives of so many people.

Arriving home to a big W v Dockers felt like a wonderful end to the weekend. The comments I've read so far are very encouraging, even heart-warming!
I can't wait to watch the replay.

Go Blues.
Coming together is the beginning.
Keeping together is progress.
Working together is success.
Henry Ford.

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #21
Late to the party and didn't see the game.

I was invited to a grass roots country football game. My recently deceased dad was a life member who'd filled every position from president to line marker, to water boy. He also played 400+ league games and coached juniors through to the league, winning multiple premierships.

To our surprise the club dedicated todays game to him. It will be an annual tribute match. All very moving for the family. He was such a humble man, we had no idea of the extent to which, he improved the on field performance and lives of so many people.

Arriving home to a big W v Dockers felt like a wonderful end to the weekend. The comments I've read so far are very encouraging, even heart-warming!
I can't wait to watch the replay.

Go Blues.
Sympathies on the loss of your father LN and he obviously passed on the love of the game to you and 400 games plus is a fair effort in any league and I cant remember what coach said the following but it was along the lines of the main role of any football club is to take in people and make them better people by the time they leave the club and your father sounds similar..

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #22
Sorry for your loss LoveNavy but that would have been a lovely day for you yesterday to see your Dad's contribution remembered in such a fashion.

And then to come home to see a good win.
Groundhog day. ;)

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #23
Just had a look at Longmuir's press conference.
A shell-shocked, shattered mess.
No idea what went wrong or what to do about it.
Not sure he will be there much longer.

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #24
Just had a look at Longmuir's press conference.
A shell-shocked, shattered mess.
No idea what went wrong or what to do about it.
Not sure he will be there much longer.
Agree...he looks clueless and defeated.

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #25
Just had a look at Longmuir's press conference.
A shell-shocked, shattered mess.
No idea what went wrong or what to do about it.
Not sure he will be there much longer.

Chris Scott has made the point that games are won and lost during the pre-season and in the lead up to the game, not in the coach’s box. I don’t think that Longmuir could have done anything to change the game.  It was lost in the lead up.

I can understand Longmuir expecting his midfield to dominate with Darcy and Jackson being virtually unopposed.  Jackson doing nothing didn’t help but Longmuir was blindsided by our ability to neutralise Freo’s hitouts.  I suspect that he was also sucked in by our form slump and their home ground advantage.

The flip side is how well our team was prepared and well every player performed their roles.
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #26
Have watched the game twice now. My thoughts, for what it's worth;

Acres - Fair game but his disposal by both hand and foot still not great. A lot of high balls. Nevertheless he would have been happy with his game against the old team.

Boyd - I'm a bit of a fan and think he's going along nicely. A bit of toe and always tries hard. He also likes to try and pinpoint his passes which might not always come off but 70% DE is pretty good.

Cerra - Another outstanding game. Not sure how much Cripps won the B&F by last year but he's on track to smash that margin, whatever it was. The complete package. Great pick-up

Cincotta - In the same camp as Boyd but a bit better above his head and kicks very well on BOTH sides of his body.

Cottrell - Good return game back. Ran hard both ways, as he always does, and is a consistantly reliable shot on goal.

Cripps - Back playing the way he was last year. Strong at the ball and using it very well, for the most part. I think that he's not trying to do it all anymore. He draws in opposition players to the tackle and then feeds it off, which is when he's at his best. Terrific at the moment.

Cuningham - Quietish sort of game but his disposal is predominatly fantastic and he is a smart footballer.

Curnow - Did really well I thought. His kicking over a long distance is so effective at times, it's a joy to watch. My only gripe was his last goal where he had the handball option over the top to Harry in the goal square on offer. Don't get greedy Charlie. Team first please. Something like that could come back to bite you

Docherty - Another great game by Doc. Just seems to have so much time and usually chooses the right option.

Fogarty - Worked hard for the whole game. Played the small forward role well and a nice conversion. I have him ahead of Owies.

Hewett - Not a lot of it when he came on but I'm glad he's still getting a game. Could really be handy with the unfortunate loss of Kennedy.

Kemp - A bit of up and down was Kempy yesterday I thought. Some really good, then some shocking but thought he finished off well. Getting better.

Kennedy - Devastating loss. Was on target to being BOG IMO. Just wormanlike from the start. Hope it's not serious but I fear it will be.

Martin - Best of the 3 small forwards. No goals this week (although did give one off), some fumbles but his work up and back was outstanding. That bump in the middle of the ground on a much bigger body was terrific. Another full game into him. Can only get better I think.

McGovern - Very solid. No horrendous mistakes and kicks a goal. Looks like a bad cork but hoping the re-hab gets him back for a very important game this week.

McKay - Top game by Harry. Worked hard. Took marks. Rucked well. Two drop punt goals that never looked like missing. Are his dramas over?

Newman - Good and bad but overall 23 disposals off half-back is a fair return, AND he played on Walters. We seem to play better when he's in the team?

Owies - Two handball receive goals and some would say that's effective but I look at the shot he had from 40 out directly in front that didn't even score and this for me is a real tell. He doesn't do enough for me and I have him as no.3 of the small forwards. Just doesn't go hard enough when the ball is there for the taking.

Saad - Really impressed with his game this week. Worked really hard and contested at times on blokes way bigger than him. Nice game

Silvagni - Very good from Jack. He and Young battled manfully against the big lug and his sidekick. They are both working like ruck-rovers so I'm wondering if we even need true ruckmen. Not sure what happens if one or both ruckmen become available. A real dilemma.

Walsh - Great game. His field kicking has steadily improved over the last month and his tank is unbelievable. On song at the moment. BOG
 
Weitering - Completely dominated his opponent. Punched when he had to and took his marks when he had to. Think it may have been his best game for the year.

Young - Better this week than last and as I said about Jack battled manfully against much bigger bodies. Thought Jack was better but did well. Just needs to throw his weight around a bit more 

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #27
Jackson's form must be a big concern to Freo.  Like TdK, where does he fit?
The bloke they ditched (Lobb) to fit in Jackson is now somebody else's problem.
DrE is no more... you ok with that harmonica man?

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #28
I read this morning that Fremantle are the 4th or 5th youngest list in the AFL, so I guess that may partly explain their indifferent form over the season. No doubt some will take the view that Justin Longmuir is the most boring man in AFL football, and puts the players to sleep. Personally, I find his calm, unruffled demeanour to be a pleasant antidote to some of the other AFL coaches.

Re: AFL Rd 17 2023 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs Fremantle

Reply #29
Rocky, Cripps polled 181 votes in the 2022 B+F. Docherty was 2nd with 173 votes.