That's the thing though Pittonet and Tom 'are' very different ruckmen.
And both would be well within the best 22 at the moment. Would you drop Pittonet or Tom to add 'one of' Cincotta, Binns, Durdin, Owies, Carroll, Cowan, either Hollands etc etc.
Right now, i'd drop Young for Cincotta. Give Kemp the lockdown role and allow Cincotta to cover the intercept role, which adds more run.
When the game starts getting wetter, you'd think about dropping one more tall. We'll wait and see who is out of form at the time. The decision is made easier right now because we don't have Silvagni available, or any other option for 3rd tall.
There was never any doubt about their 'styles of ruck' or that they compliment eachother. The issue was they they were both doing not very much around the ground.....at all. TDK was lacking in ruck area, and performing worse than Silvagni as a forward......but better than Pittonet as a non-ruck option. Pittonet was performing better in the ruck, but not doing enough around the ground.
BOTH of them are not only performing better around the ground, but both are being genuine options around the ground and up forward. Pittonet kicked a goal first game back. TDK kicked 3 last week, and 0.3 this week. I showed stats on pittonets ruck AND around the ground work and how it was the same or better than both rucks combined....and even 2 mids combined in clearances. That kind of form from both of them was nowhere to be seen last year. THAT is what has changed......and thankfully its changed when the cupboard is very bare behind them.
However, Once we start getting players back, if you want to play both rucks in your 22, you are leaving out someone like Kennedy, Cottrell, Hollands (x2), Williams.....etc.
Not sure many doubted him or his ruck ability. You're the one who wanted to leave him out of the side
One of the thing that's really impressive is his use of handball at the moment. He's standing in tackles and dishing it off.
Plenty did and kept saying how useless those stats were and how he does nothing around the ground too.
Can't hear any of that now.
Even i underestimated his abilities.
Its imagine what a player can do when he gets back to full fitness.
My preference is still to play 1 ruck and have another player give a chop out, but that other player needs to be able to hold down another spot on his own merits. Currently, TDK is doing that with the absense of a 3rd tall in Silvagnis mold. The moment TDK drops off up forward is the moment he or Pitto needs to be dropped.
Then its a matter of who you think is best and why.
....and thats the part people cant agree on because different people weigh up different areas differently.
Hmm, maybe, but in particular I'm not so sure the comments in the heat of the moment aren't genuine.
As for having a "soft spot for Carlton", I'll assert it's his and the AFL's purse that is where a strong Carlton gives them a thrill!
I think you're jumping at shadows again or maybe your tin foil hat is too tight.
I'd love to have Dunstall commentate every game as he favours us more than anyone else. He even called out Huddo who used 'we' when talking about the Cats....he is a Geelong supporter in case you didn't know. Kingy was on our side as well. Moons has an unashamed Cats bias, but still saw we got robbed on a few occasions.
Once the second half of the season comes, with players back, heading to a peak I believe we handle anyone. If we want it badly enough this year we can certainly win it. It seems we do.
If its one thing Vossy knows its that once you get to finals, everything that comes before means nothing.
The way Leigh Matthews used to get his side cheery ripe for finals and dominate despite never finishing top. 2001 - 2004 2nd, 2nd, 3rd, 2nd - Flag, flag, flag, runners up.
The positive is we did near everything wrong, defensively terrible, never really switched on properly, little focus on our basics, half the side out and lost by just 13pts.
The negative is we did near everything wrong, defensively terrible, never really switched on properly, little focus on our basics and if that doesn't improve then getting blokes back won't help as it should. Pressure rating spent much of the day in the 160s, only going over 200 when we were a few goals behind.
Last week was similar until mid-way through the 3rd qtr where every changed once we were 20pts down. Pressure rating went from the 150s straight to 240 and stayed there changing the game. Maybe we thought we could get away with it again and didn't.
I followed the pressure ratings the last 2 weeks and it rose massively once we fell behind. Once we raised it both GWS and Geelong had issues with it. Yesterday, not long enough.
Thinking after that presser from Voss that defensively we will be way better next week. Won't be 118 to 105 again.
We've played 2 of the best teams in the league the last 2 weeks. Played terrible for majority of the last 8 quarters, with half a side not available and come out of it with a 1-1 record and plenty of upside.
Dunstall publicly stated on one of the footy shows, just last season or the season before, that despite following the Blues as a kid he now hates Carlton.
Even so, love or hate us, his comments about the rub of the umpiring can't be challenged because it's just too obvious. It was so obvious it must be almost embarrassing to some AFL officials.
Like or loath that stuff, opposition club's can't allow it to continue, they have to find a way to bring the Handbagger tactics into focus.
....and he has also stated that he has a soft spot for Carlton during the same time frame.
On his footy show 'bounce' which is most likely where you heard him say that, he plays a character as much as anything else. Kinda like Sam Newman. When he is more himself, you can see his true feelings come out.
If anyone had any doubts about Pittonets ruck ability after yesterdays efforts then they don't understand football.
Lets play a game of Pittonet vs .....
Hitouts Pittonet - 28 vs Blicavs + Stanley - 28
Hitouts to advantage Pittonet - 7 vs Blicavs + Stanley - 4
Possessions Pittonet - 19 vs Blicavs + Stanley - 19
Clearances Pittonet - 11 vs Blicavs + Stanley - 5 vs Bruhn + Miers = 11 (Geelongs highest 2 clearances winners on the ground yesterday)
TOG Pittonet - 66% vs Blicavs (83%) - Stanley (80%)
Pittonet only played 2/3's of the game, but output the combined tally of both cats rucks (or best mids), so anything we got from TDK was a bonus. Unfortunately TDK wasn't as good as he was last week, 0.3 instead of 3.0 the biggest difference, but was good enough as a forward target to keep persisting with him as a ruck/forward.
Having watched the replay this morning, even the commentators were astounded by how much the Handbagger Dad's Army get away with, even Dunstall who normally thinks us getting a raw deal is good was inspired to something, before trying to explain it way with an excuse of being kind to the Handbaggers.
Dunstall only gives us a raw deal when we don't try. He used to barrack for the blues and very much has a soft spot for us now. If he is critical, you can guarantee we are on here as well. He actually loves the club.
Nothing in the rule changes can stop the asymmetry, the problem is not a rule the problem is that some teams basically badger and batter officials until things fall their way.
A great example is happening today, rather than the AFL media focussing on Handbaggers continually infringing off the ball, the Handbagger mafia is at play beating up a storm about Williams staging for a free? The AFL media has largely ignored the act of holding 20m off the footy, it's a smokescreen by the Handbaggers, who are desperate to escape a focus on their off the ball activities.
Fans forget, when the Handbaggers do the fast break, it leaves opponents loose all over the ground, if the opposition force a turnover they are left vulnerable, so they get away with it by nefarious off the ball tactics that stop opponents finding or closing space.
We have more AFL umpires out on the ground than every before, how can it be they don't see the illegal holds and shepherds that allow the Handbagger Dad's Army to remain competitive?
You consistently seem to miss the point of removing the rule. It doesn't fix every decision in the game. It doesn't solve world hunger. It doesn't cure cancer.
It fixes players/teams using it as a tactic to cause stoppages instead of trying to continue the play. Thats it. Remove it, and that tactic goes with it.
The knock on from there is a much more free flowing game with more of a one-on-one focus because the ball will be pinging around so quickly (due to less stoppages) that teams will be found out if they don't man up. Leaving your man behind will be high risk, low reward. In turn, that will help defensively with turnovers if you start with a more defensive mindset to begin with.
Currently, its attack at all costs and if it doesn't go your way, hatch the ball, cause a stoppage and reset.
The problem that's now been created is that he hasn't been playing football on a regular basis for a while now at any level...so will essentially come in cold.
Gotta bite the bullet sometime.
Couldn't have been any worse than Binns was......which is to be expected as a debutant....but it fills a need.
Why can the likes of Tuohy or Guthrie take the footy run 2 or 3 steps, be tackled and then just hold onto to it unpenalised, but Hewett or Acres does that and it's holding the ball?
The constant just holding onto the ball without trying is furiating to watch.......but thats what happens with the 'no prior' rule.
I keep banging on about it, but remove that rule and that doesn't happen.
Players can't simply cause a stoppage because they want to by not attempting to move the ball on. THAT needs to be penalised, but current rules don't allow it.
Remove 'prior' and that immediately disappears. Players are handballing/kicking/slapping/punching/tapping the ball on rather than simply hatching it. AFL won't do it, because they are too slow to see/fix trends and justify their own existence, but i'm telling you, the game would be much better for it.
I don't know what Cincotta has done or said but his card appears to be marked. I think i had him in my best 22 at the start of the year or at least next in line. He has been an emergency just about every game, and it doesn't how many injuries we get, he still remains an emergency.
Honestly, i would've preferred him in the side over Young yesterday, and that is saying something with the twin towers they had there. Young loses his opponent too many times, and that costs us goals. Kemp and Weitering don't lose their opponents half as much, and even if they did we'd still be better off with the extra run we'd get by not having Young as a hinderence in that area. McGovern provides exactly that, and Cincotta is a poor mans McGovern.
Explain to me how the whole Southern Stand saw Williams get coat hangered but not one of the 4 umpires saw it? That turned the game back in their favour.
Not sure if you saw the replay or not, but i wouldn't have paid it from the replay, and if i was Vossy, i would be tearing strips of Williams for diving and giving them a goal as a result.
Pressure acts are weighted; physical pressure acts (bumping, pushing, tackling) are worth 3.75 points, closing acts are worth 2.25 points, chasing acts are 1.5 points and corralling are 1.2. Chasing and corralling (Zac Fisher's forte) are worth less because they don't have much impact on the ball carrier's ability to dispose of the ball. Fantasia isn't tackling as much as Durdin and Owies so he must be doing a hell of a lot more corralling, chasing and closing to be 17 to 8 and 5.
The same applies to Charlie. Apparently he doesn't chase and his tackle numbers are relatively low so, to be so far ahead of Harry, Durdin and Owies in pressure acts, he must be dynamite on closing acts and corralling.
Harry has incredible acceleration for a big man and his ability to put pressure on defenders by closing and tackling is a bonus for our forwards. Charlie has greater endurance but not the same acceleration. He puts his endurance to good use by applying pressure, closing and corralling, but his main priority is to create separation with his defenders. That's not quite so critical for Harry as he usually enjoys a size and strength advantage.
As MBB said, you are describing something different.
If you compare a players pressure acts with Tackles, you generally see a player higher in one or the other. So Charlie is high in pressure acts, but low in tackles. Harry is higher in tackles, but lower in pressure acts. They almost need to be read together to get a true understanding of how well a player is doing.
What you are talking about is the pressure rating that they show during games, which is a combination of everything you say.
Its very difficult getting consistent stats on all of this stuff. AFL app, shows different to AFL website, which is different to footywire which is different to AFL tables etc etc
