Carlton Supporters Club

Princes Park => Robert Heatley Stand => Topic started by: bratblue on April 08, 2021, 11:30:23 am

Title: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: bratblue on April 08, 2021, 11:30:23 am
I expect this to be an ongoing discussion but Austin is getting some early runs on the board finding some rare diamonds in Fogerty and Parks who cost us nothing at the trade table.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Thryleon on April 08, 2021, 11:33:45 am
Parks is very early.

Fog has a bit of the ed curnows about him when he first came over.

A little rough around the edges but can play Nf plays a good brand.

Ed was like that until that st. Kilda match where he did his shoulder and we out him back on.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: LP on April 08, 2021, 11:38:44 am
Parks is very early.

Fog has a bit of the ed curnows about him when he first came over.

A little rough around the edges but can play Nf plays a good brand.

Ed was like that until that st. Kilda match where he did his shoulder and we out him back on.
Agreed.

Fogarty; We have to remember Fogarty was cruelled by repeat injuries not through a lack of ability. Like Carrazzo, Fogarty was one the Handbaggers wanted to keep to bolster their stocks, but he couldn't get on the park often enough to displace the regulars with his limited game time. Let's hope his run of bad luck is behind him!

Parks; Game count = 1
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: bratblue on April 08, 2021, 11:43:33 am
Parks is very early.



I know I'm jumping the gun here. Its more about what it says about their recruitment. Our recent history of finding diamonds in the rough is a sad tale and even finding diamonds in amongst the jewels ( early draft picks ) is not looking to good at all with LOB, Dow and Cunningham looking shakey.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Lods on April 08, 2021, 01:02:41 pm
Pretty happy with the recruiting this year. ;)
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: WASurfer on April 08, 2021, 01:57:17 pm
Agree Lods.....Saad and Williams have been solid and will only get better. Fogarty is the surprise packet and Parks didn't look out of his depth at all last week. Only Round 3 but that's not a bad haul compared to some earlier years. We just need to get McGovern fit and in form. If we can stay relatively injury free for awhile and then get Fish/Martin/TDK/Newman ready to go, it'll be a lot healthier.

Just glad we didn't blow the bank on someone like a Hannaberry....just read he's done another calf...the other one. That 4 year deal the Saints offered him on big coin had bad news written all over it...he was busted up well and truly by then.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 08, 2021, 02:33:24 pm
Fog in particular looks the good, tackles like he means it, very creative with ball in hand. In the 3 games, I reckon just about every time he touched the footy, we scored.

As for Parksy, he certainly didn't look like a first gamer.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: chalkybill on April 08, 2021, 03:33:54 pm
I expect this to be an ongoing discussion but Austin is getting some early runs on the board finding some rare diamonds in Fogerty and Parks who cost us nothing at the trade table.

There is something about Parkes' looks that reminds me of Ken Hunter with a bit of Pearce thrown in.

Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 08, 2021, 04:01:44 pm
Fogarty has come from a good system and probably only lacked opportunity but its still early days but is ahead of a lot of other midfield candidates on our list.
Parks did some good things but Freo are not a yardstick team and I have reservations about his kicking under pressure.
Saad...been top shelf, defended, attacked with dash and can hit targets under pressure......tick.
Williams....started well vs Collingwood but then faded and got ragged with his kicking think it was 20 disposals @50%.
Vs Freo he was using the ball well but got a knock and that seemed to restrict him.
He is probably the key player out of all of new recruits as he is playing in a main midfield role and we need him getting plenty of ball so he can use those kicking skills. IMO he needs to be getting 25-30 possies a game with a DE% of 75% plus to be earning his money. He needs time to develop as its a new FT role for him in the midfield and also build a bond with his other mids and learn how they play so we will see how goes and its probably more fair to judge him around the middle of the season.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: WASurfer on April 08, 2021, 04:30:41 pm
And Newnes last year...picked up for basically nothing....has his limitations but was very consistent last season and hit the scoreboard regularly. Was ordinary against Richmond but been solid again since...his kick to spot up Gibbons for the last goal of the game against Freo was superb.

For years we seemed to recruit some very ordinary players from other clubs but finally seem to have hit the mark.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: jeza on April 08, 2021, 05:01:52 pm
Newnes I'm not such a big fan of. Does go missing against the better teams and is not quite quick enough.

Parks... and I know this is an early call.... but he looks like an inspired pick.

Jack Carroll also looks like a steal (even earlier call there).

Fogarty is now my favourite player. He's the tackler we've been waiting for... great kick too.

As for Cunningham, LOB and Dow - there is still hope there but even if they all fail everyone knows there are no guarantees - even in the first round. You put Walsh, Weit, Curnow, Harry, Fisher, Dekoning, JSOS, etc. in the win column and there will definitely be a few in the loss column.

But with Williams, Saad, Martin, Fog, etc. taking spots there's not that many left over for the young guys.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: PaulP on April 08, 2021, 05:15:05 pm
I thought Newnes was a SOS selection ?
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: WASurfer on April 08, 2021, 05:16:38 pm
He was PP....just saying it wasn't a bad pickup given we didn't have to give up anything at all to get him. We had a few years of getting burnt with pickups like Mullet, Kerridge, Smedts, Lang etc.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: PaulP on April 08, 2021, 05:22:22 pm
He was PP....just saying it wasn't a bad pickup given we didn't have to give up anything at all to get him. We had a few years of getting burnt with pickups like Mullet, Kerridge, Smedts, Lang etc.

Fair enough. Those other names you mention were picked up during the rebuild days, intended to be as cheap as chips and equally expendable. Hard, seasoned bodies to give the kids a chop out for a short time whilst they developed. Dubious idea, appalling recruiting.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Baggers on April 08, 2021, 05:25:01 pm
I expect this to be an ongoing discussion but Austin is getting some early runs on the board finding some rare diamonds in Fogerty and Parks who cost us nothing at the trade table.

Early call, but so far so good.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 08, 2021, 06:48:38 pm

As for Cunningham, LOB and Dow - there is still hope there
EFA
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: jeza on April 08, 2021, 09:25:50 pm
EFA

I really hope LOB makes it. Guys that can run all day and kick like that don't grow on trees. Not to say he hasn't got holes in his game.

Cunningham just needs the ball in his hands more. Ridiculous he's playing 2s and Samo is jogging around half back flank in luke-warm form. We need speed out of defense! Give Cunningham a job.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Thryleon on April 09, 2021, 09:57:01 am
Cunningham will come good IMHO.

His problems are a bit different to the others.  He'll actually improve as he plays more because he has bags of ability but seems to go missing for periods.  That is one aspect a player can work on and improve and its usually linked to their ability to read the game and know their role.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Thryleon on April 09, 2021, 09:57:31 am
Cunningham will come good IMHO.

His problems are a bit different to the others.  He'll actually improve as he plays more because he has bags of ability but seems to go missing for periods.  That is one aspect a player can work on and improve and its usually linked to their ability to read the game and know their role.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: LP on April 09, 2021, 10:26:55 am
I really hope LOB makes it. Guys that can run all day and kick like that don't grow on trees. Not to say he hasn't got holes in his game.

Cunningham just needs the ball in his hands more. Ridiculous he's playing 2s and Samo is jogging around half back flank in luke-warm form. We need speed out of defense! Give Cunningham a job.
Personally, I think Cunningham is a mile behind SPS, and SPS is just what Jack Dyer would call a good ordinary footballer. We probably won't see the best of SPS until Ed retires, then I think you'll find SPS at more stoppages.

At the moment I see Cunningham as a highlight player, a quarter here or there, he's not the type we need right now and I'm not sure his spot won't be taken by guys like Philp who offer more consistent footy. Certainly Fogarty has made life much harder for Cunningham.

Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Milhanna13 on April 09, 2021, 10:51:32 am
Just glad we didn't blow the bank on someone like a Hannaberry....just read he's done another calf...the other one. That 4 year deal the Saints offered him on big coin had bad news written all over it...he was busted up well and truly by then.

Reckon the 'Aints are the poster child for SOS' theory on "anyone can build a list to finish 8th".....  made some big splashes in recent offseasons, but were they the right splashes ??

We have been crucified in recent years for not making moves during trade week (esp by the journos who see the club who made the most moves as the winner of the offseason, no matter what those moves are), but i think the strategy of not making moves just for the sake of it, and waiting for the right ones to come along (Martin, Saad, Williams, Fogarty) is proving to be the correct one  (maybe the McGovern one is a bit whiffy, but it could come good)

All those journos blowing the Aints for picking up Hannabery, Ryder, Hill and Jones......... they still think these were such great pick ups? (esp when it meant Josh Bruce out the door??)
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 09, 2021, 11:59:11 am
Personally, I think Cunningham is a mile behind SPS, and SPS is just what Jack Dyer would call a good ordinary footballer. We probably won't see the best of SPS until Ed retires, then I think you'll find SPS at more stoppages.

At the moment I see Cunningham as a highlight player, a quarter here or there, he's not the type we need right now and I'm not sure his spot won't be taken by guys like Philp who offer more consistent footy. Certainly Fogarty has made life much harder for Cunningham.


Agree...the reality is Cottrell is getting a game ahead of these initially higher rated players and its not because he has more talent.
Cottrell has something the coach wants more of and players like Cuningham, LOB cant deliver that ingredient the team needs...
You can probably carry one or two players on talent alone ie SPS but thats about the max.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 09, 2021, 01:38:51 pm
Cunningham will come good IMHO.
What when he's forty? Delist him.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 09, 2021, 01:46:37 pm
What when he's forty? Delist him.
I'd look at trading him first, maybe a club could be suckered in watching his highlight reel.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 09, 2021, 01:49:43 pm
I'd look at trading him first, maybe a club could be suckered in watching his highlight reel.
Name a club stupid enough.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: WASurfer on April 09, 2021, 02:07:52 pm
Cunningham into his 6th season.....I reckon we've been waiting long enough.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 09, 2021, 02:09:23 pm
Name a club stupid enough.
North.....
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 09, 2021, 03:34:06 pm
North.....
Not even they are that stupid. The guy is a VFL player at best.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 09, 2021, 06:32:07 pm
Not even they are that stupid. The guy is a VFL player at best.
Got rid of one of their few decent players in Ben Brown for not much, picked up the likes of Jayden Stephenson who is on a nice fat contract courtesy of Collingwood  and recruited Jared Polec on big dollars who they tried to move on but no one else would touch. They are about as stupid as it gets IMHO.....
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Thryleon on April 09, 2021, 08:05:26 pm
Got rid of one of their few decent players in Ben Brown for not much, picked up the likes of Jayden Stephenson who is on a nice fat contract courtesy of Collingwood  and recruited Jared Polec on big dollars who they tried to move on but no one else would touch. They are about as stupid as it gets IMHO.....
I still can't workout why they did that.

He must have wanted out more than they wanted him.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 09, 2021, 11:19:15 pm
I still can't workout why they did that.

He must have wanted out more than they wanted him.
Tend to agree, seem to fall out of form and favor and had the chance earlier to sign for big dollars but hung out for more
and ended up being on less at Melbourne where he still cant get on the park.
Its been a lose lose for both club and player...
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 10, 2021, 07:05:56 am
Got rid of one of their few decent players in Ben Brown for not much, picked up the likes of Jayden Stephenson who is on a nice fat contract courtesy of Collingwood  and recruited Jared Polec on big dollars who they tried to move on but no one else would touch. They are about as stupid as it gets IMHO.....
Since you put it that way.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Thryleon on April 10, 2021, 10:43:19 am
Tend to agree, seem to fall out of form and favor and had the chance earlier to sign for big dollars but hung out for more
and ended up being on less at Melbourne where he still cant get on the park.
Its been a lose lose for both club and player...

Hes not as good as he thinks he is either.  Ben brown is one of those players who benefited from free kicks just by being tall.  Converts well but I've seen games where his opponents have too easily been able to get him out of the ball drop zone with a bit of body pressure.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 10, 2021, 11:18:51 am
Hes not as good as he thinks he is either.  Ben brown is one of those players who benefited from free kicks just by being tall.  Converts well but I've seen games where his opponents have too easily been able to get him out of the ball drop zone with a bit of body pressure.
Brown is a lead-up FF who relies on delivery, he is a good converter and they are hard to find. Nth have only the kid Larkey as a KP target, to me it was a strange move to trade Brown especially when the return they got from the trade was just a second rounder from memory.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: kruddler on April 10, 2021, 06:24:35 pm
Brown is a lead-up FF who relies on delivery....
Melbourne mate of mine scoffed at the idea of getting Brown (and then was disappointed when it happened) for the same reasons.

He reckoned North didn't have anyone capable of kicking to Browns advantage on the lead and said the same about his own Demons.

If his only way of getting the pill is being hit lace out, and you don't have players that can kick, what you have is a disappointing forward line.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: Milhanna13 on April 11, 2021, 12:13:04 am
and recruited Jared Polec on big dollars who they tried to move on but no one else would touch. They are about as stupid as it gets IMHO.....
And most on here (and in the media) pottted us, big time, for not doing something and recruiting Polec
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: LoveNavy on April 11, 2021, 02:18:19 pm
Parks cracked in again last night. What he lacks in skill, he makes up for in toughness and composure. Haven't seen much of his aerial work yet. Looking forward to seeing his development as he's got some innate mental and physical talent.

Young Fogarty's defensive skills are a standout. Hope he teaches our coaches how they were developed. Quickly gaining my respect
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: tonyo on April 11, 2021, 08:57:24 pm
Parks cracked in again last night. What he lacks in skill, he makes up for in toughness and composure. Haven't seen much of his aerial work yet. Looking forward to seeing his development as he's got some innate mental and physical talent.

Young Fogarty's defensive skills are a standout. Hope he teaches our coaches how they were developed. Quickly gaining my respect

Fogarty has been a huge get - very smart user of the ball and strong defensive skills.  Set up Cottrell beautifully in the 3rd quarter when we were being challenged,
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: jeza on May 07, 2021, 02:46:20 pm
Parks has to learn how to position himself to keep his opponent out of the contest. He's a run and jump at the ball man which is great when it works but Harrison Jones got the better of him quite a bit last weekend. He's only young so plenty of time to improve on that but loved that tackle on Tippa.

Fogarty still impressive. Does go quite in some games but his tackling is outstanding and a very smart user.
Title: Re: Parks and Fog's, is Curly's boy the Real Gem?
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on May 07, 2021, 02:49:50 pm
Parks has to learn how to position himself to keep his opponent out of the contest. He's a run and jump at the ball man which is great when it works but Harrison Jones got the better of him quite a bit last weekend. He's only young so plenty of time to improve on that but loved that tackle on Tippa.

Fogarty still impressive. Does go quite in some games but his tackling is outstanding and a very smart user.
Jones is a 196cm KP player ,bit of a tough ask for Parks IMO, coaching box got that matchup wrong.
Fogarty is good value and I reckon Caleb Daniel would be a good task for him this week.