Chris Judd or Marc Murphy?
https://www.footywire.com/afl/footy/ft_player_compare?playerStatus1=A&tid1=4&playerStatus2=I&tid2=4&type=A&pid1=1607&pid2=109&fid1=P&fopt1=2011&fid2=P&fopt2=2011
Pretty pointless comparison.
One played inside whilst the other played outside and both benefited from having each other in the same midfield.
Chris Judd or Marc Murphy?
Who cares, both were brilliant.
I'm enjoying your salty tears. 4 coaches who have to watch each player very closely and intimately know their roles will know 100 times more than you or me.
Marc Murphy ...............BEST & FAIREST!!!!!
3 replies but no answer.
The old coach knows best line gets thrown out a lot here unless of course that poster hates the coach eg. Mick Malthouse.
3 replies but no answer.
As far as 2011 is concerned, Murphy by a whisker.
Pretty pointless comparison.
One played inside whilst the other played outside and both benefited from having each other in the same midfield.
That's a good summary Thry. Mutual reinforcement is what makes a bunch of good players into a great team.
Both were great. From memory Chris Judd was the Brownlow favorite, with Murphy on the 2nd or 3rd line of betting (Swan won). Marc Murphy also won the The Age Player of the Year that year. Both were All Australians.
In regards to the AFLPA vs AFLCA, the AFLCA has to generally be considered the more accurate.
Whilst the AFLCA is based on the impact players had in a specific game against each other, with the knowledge of the specific roles players had, the efforts that went into preventing a player etc.
The AFLPA is based on picking who you think the top 3 players were from a pool of players. Not based on actual games, just a "who do you think was the best player".
I am fairly sure at the time I thought Murphy might have won the Brownlow (actually finished 15 off the lead, though Judd finished 11).
I think any attempt to split the two has to be considered subjective, as I don't think there is a clear way of determining.
Judd was a better player career-wise, probably in the top 20 all time, but in 2011 there was very little between them.
AFLPA MOST VALUABLE PLAYER
Chris Judd (Carlton) 1347*
Scott Pendlebury (Collingwood) 456
Gary Ablett (Gold Coast) 389
Adam Goodes (Sydney) 300
Dean Cox (West Coast) 276
Murphy's opponents obviously don't share the same view.
AFLPA MOST VALUABLE PLAYER
Chris Judd (Carlton) 1347*
Scott Pendlebury (Collingwood) 456
Gary Ablett (Gold Coast) 389
Adam Goodes (Sydney) 300
Dean Cox (West Coast) 276
Murphy's opponents obviously don't share the same view.
That's true. But there are other significant groups that do. If you go back and watch footage, read what was written at the time, look at the stats I posted earlier, you will see that both had brilliant seasons and splitting them is as MIO suggested, speculative, subjective, and not even remotely clear cut.
The problem with the afl pa though MBB has to be obvious
For example, who would Jaksch have selected this year?
Or Palmer?
The only way the aflpa could equate is if players selected the top players after each game. Most players who voted for either Jude or amurphy or another would be picking it based on zero encounters, with the next lot having played them once and a small amount having played twice.
All systems are flawed and you can't use any one award to determine a allures value, including coaches award. But I think the coaches probably get it right the most, then the aflpa then the Brownlow
That is just out of the major awards
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/marcus-bontempelli-left-out-of-coaches-award-votes-by-north-melbournes-brad-scott/news-story/434bdfd165f33a99ece03964426b9074
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/marcus-bontempelli-left-out-of-coaches-award-votes-by-north-melbournes-brad-scott/news-story/434bdfd165f33a99ece03964426b9074
It seems as though a grudge was at play in that situation. Were there any grudges against Murphy or Judd from coaches ? And can't players who vote in the players award also hold a grudge ?
It seems as though a grudge was at play in that situation. Were there any grudges against Murphy or Judd from coaches ? And can't players who vote in the players award also hold a grudge ?
Well if Ratten liked Murphy way more than Judd (not saying that was the case) that could have had a huge influence.
Murphy had a great year in 2011, far better than this year but Judd was on another level and is probably the prime reason why Murphy isn't as good anymore.
Well if Ratten liked Murphy way more than Judd (not saying that was the case) that could have had a huge influence.
Murphy had a great year in 2011, far better than this year but Judd was on another level and is probably the prime reason why Murphy isn't as good anymore.
mbb, your case will continue to be on shaky foundations if you rely on things like this. The stats I quoted earlier would indicate that Murphy had a better year, although there really wasn't anything major separating them.
Judd's great inside work definitely helped Murphy. Of that there is no question. I've said before Murphy is at his best as an outside receiver / distributor and goal sneak / small forward. He was never built to do inside grunt work, and has battled manfully in this position under less than ideal circumstances.
And I should also add whilst most of the focus for the inside work falls rightfully on Judd, we shouldn't forget the good work of blokes like Carrots, Robbo and Brock, who all helped give the 2 stars a big chop out.
Who was better in 2000? Kouta, Ratten or Campo?
Who was better in 2000? Kouta, Ratten or Campo?
My vote is for Ratten under any circumstances, but then I have a grudge.
Well if Ratten liked Murphy way more than Judd (not saying that was the case) that could have had a huge influence.
Murphy had a great year in 2011, far better than this year but Judd was on another level and is probably the prime reason why Murphy isn't as good anymore.
Weren't you trying to tell everyone how good Mitchell was by pointing to the AFLCA votes earlier this year?
You 'proved' Mitchell was better because he had more votes.
Even though Murphy polled in more games this year.
Perhaps Mitchell is very much liked by Al Clarkson since he had to justify his recruitment to the club.
Perhaps Bolton is very much an anti Murphy and should give him MORE votes.
Perhaps....just perhaps....you are fighting a losing battle and you should just accept that Murphy is a very good player who you have underrated. ;)
I have said he is a good player just not our best this year. Docherty and Kreuzer were easily our best hence AA nominations.
Losing battle?
Our club is the one fighting a losing battle at the bottom end of the ladder with him as our skipper.
I have said he is a good player just not our best this year. Docherty and Kreuzer were easily our best hence AA nominations.
Again, flawed logic.
The best 22 players in the game might all be midfielders. But the AA side is not going to have 22 midfielders is it. (although they do try sometimes).
So Murphy didn't make the team, maybe he was the next best mid, maybe he was the 10th best mid. If Mids were the best players in the game, then there would be some who would be better players than those who actually made the squad.
Look at it this way. Is there someone who was NOT in the AA team who you would want in your side before someone who was?
Losing battle?
Our club is the one fighting a losing battle at the bottom end of the ladder with him as our skipper.
Who should be skipper and i'll give you a reason why they shouldn't be.
Losing battle?
Our club is the one fighting a losing battle at the bottom end of the ladder with him as our skipper.
The casual inference in your last paragraph is that Murphy is either solely or significantly responsible for our current predicament. A very dubious claim at best. My guess is that the club wishes it had more Murphys and not less.
Also, there are many very good players who receive very few awards, or none at all. Nathan Jones from Melbourne is one example.
Well if Ratten liked Murphy way more than Judd (not saying that was the case) that could have had a huge influence.
Murphy had a great year in 2011, far better than this year but Judd was on another level and is probably the prime reason why Murphy isn't as good anymore.
Isn't any good? He just won the B & F. Obviously very good. Because you don't like him doesn't change things.
I have said he is a good player just not our best this year. Docherty and Kreuzer were easily our best hence AA nominations.
That is flawed again
They are competing in different roles
And it is from a panel that probably watch at best 1/2 our games
I thought Murphy or Doc were our best Kreuzer slightly behind
Who cares? I am more interested in who is going to be the best in 2018. There are people on this site who do not like Murphy or Gibbs. Get over it, they are both great Carlton players.
Who cares? I am more interested in who is going to be the best in 2018. There are people on this site who do not like Murphy or Gibbs. Get over it, they are both great Carlton players.
BM, the mods have a strictly enforced policy that anyone who comes on here speaking plain English and making perfect sense receives a lifetime ban.
I apologise!
I apologise!
That's ok. We all make mistakes !!
Who cares? I am more interested in who is going to be the best in 2018. There are people on this site who do not like Murphy or Gibbs. Get over it, they are both great Carlton players.
If you don't care, don't post.
Chris Judd was on fire until he twisted his ankle against Geelong that year... I felt he was never the same after that.
I remember seeing him in the stands, he looked like a wounded animal.
Still did some amazing things and one of his best ever goals a quarter or so after that incident.