Not confident about this one either. Gold Coast are playing well and Witts usually does well against us.
The Gold Coast mids are doing a much better job than ours are at the moment.
It is going to be ugly next Sunday.
My changes would be
Binns->Cottrell/Ed (Ed was solid on Merrett but why didn't he follow him fwd in the 3rd)
Cunningham->Martin (injured?)
Fogarty->Motlop
Fisher->Boyd
Cripps->Hewett (if Crippa needs a rest, 2 weeks to freshen up over the bye might be good)
Pitto->SOS
Young needs a spell but there is zero to replace him with.
Can't understand the hate for Boyd. We complain about how badly we use the ball and he's at 85.7% DE. 2nd only to McGovern and Young (??). One of his passes into F50 resulted in one of our few goals. No, keep him in, he's not the problem. Young on the other hand is completely bereft of confidence and is unrecognisable from the same bloke who competed so well last year. Hard to get rid of him as we have nothing as a back-up so don't know where we go with him. I'd like to say Marchbank but he's off with some sort of injury again so scratch that. I'd suggest maybe JSOS but he's going just as bad, if not worse, and will probably make way for Pittonet, if fit anyway.
Surely it's time for Ed to go. Started as a tag on Merrett and was going OK I thought but then what happened? Ended up forward and was just useless. Can't kick a goal from 25m almost directly in front. Cunningham can come in for him.
Motlop and Owies both out for me. Replace with Fogarty and Fisher. maybe like for like but sick of their ineffectiveness.
Hewett will probably return so I'm guessing that Dow will be sacrificed which is so wrong but that's Carlton.
I'd like to give Binns a run so maybe Cottrell?
Cripps has been woeful but unless they pull the "managed" card he won't get dropped.
Honestly the biggest mystery for me is how this team which on paper looks better than the one that what was 0.6% away from finals in 2022 looks like they could struggle to beat WC right now.
Can't understand the hate for Boyd. We complain about how badly we use the ball and he's at 85.7% DE. 2nd only to McGovern and Young (??). One of his passes into F50 resulted in one of our few goals. No, keep him in, he's not the problem. Young on the other hand is completely bereft of confidence and is unrecognisable from the same bloke who competed so well last year. Hard to get rid of him as we have nothing as a back-up so don't know where we go with him. I'd like to say Marchbank but he's off with some sort of injury again so scratch that. I'd suggest maybe JSOS but he's going just as bad, if not worse, and will probably make way for Pittonet, if fit anyway.
Surely it's time for Ed to go. Started as a tag on Merrett and was going OK I thought but then what happened? Ended up forward and was just useless. Can't kick a goal from 25m almost directly in front. Cunningham can come in for him.
Motlop and Owies both out for me. Replace with Fogarty and Fisher. maybe like for like but sick of their ineffectiveness.
Hewett will probably return so I'm guessing that Dow will be sacrificed which is so wrong but that's Carlton.
I'd like to give Binns a run so maybe Cottrell?
Cripps has been woeful but unless they pull the "managed" card he won't get dropped.
Honestly the biggest mystery for me is how this team which on paper looks better than the one that what was 0.6% away from finals in 2022 looks like they could struggle to beat WC right now.
Ed should have followed Merrett to the fwd line, to the bench, to the toilet, to the showers after the game, everywhere. He nullified him for 2 qtrs then didn't follow him fwd at the start of the 3rd, he should have made that decision himself.
No on field nous and leadership from a senior player, that's why we're broken.
No on field nous and leadership from a senior player, that's why we're broken.
Yep
And Young should have run straight through that bloke, lay a block suffer the consequences. It was p weak. He probably would have got off as well - what was he supposed to do, step aside?
I think Ed epitomizes our problems, he's been a serviceable player, but not good enough to step up when it really matters. A footsoldier at best -a true B grader.
Ed should have followed Merrett to the fwd line, to the bench, to the toilet, to the showers after the game, everywhere. He nullified him for 2 qtrs then didn't follow him fwd at the start of the 3rd, he should have made that decision himself.
Agree..but I'm over Ed and he shouldn't be playing. It just recycling busted deckchairs and ignoring kids like Dow.
I'd rather have Dow go head to head with Merritt...yes people will laugh but look at Brad Scott and what he did, he had his version of Dow in Archie Perkins run with Cripps all night. Cripps was nullified and Perkins got experience.
We will probably play Ed on Rowell or Anderson next week and play safe again but get nowhere...
If he does this I'd sack him if I was Cook.
If we're serious Ed should be cleaning out his locker over the break.
In my opinion currently Young and Motlop are boat anchors, they both take short steps.
Motlop's a kid, but he can't be persisted with at AFL level until he has a genuine attack on the ball, he needs time to develop in the VFL, not just a week or two but a season or two!
Young isn't a kid, he's never going to change, we need to look elsewhere because he's just a 200cm version of Tutt, Lang or Smedts.
Finally, the same goes for LoB, when you start shirking contests against CheatsFC and it's lightweight outside running crew there is no coming back!
Yep, over Motlop being gifted games.
In my opinion currently Young and Motlop are boat anchors, they both take short steps.
Motlop's a kid, but he can't be persisted with at AFL level until he has a genuine attack on the ball, he needs time to develop in the VFL, not just a week or two but a season or two!
Young isn't a kid, he's never going to change, we need to look elsewhere because he's just a 200cm version of Tutt, Lang or Smedts.
Finally, the same goes for LoB, when you start shirking contests against CheatsFC and it's lightweight outside running crew there is no coming back!
Fully agree...Acres has copped some crape from me and others for his kicking but he did hold his ground well on the wing in a head on contest and he gets a tick from me for that and those acts are very rare from a few of our blokes these days and I hope the coaching staff point that out during the week and tell all the players that's the standard we expect.
It's embarrassing seeing us so feeble at times...did see Owies have a crack at a few Essendon players but when Ed was jumped by a bunch of players after that Merritt goal I would have wanted my players to fly the flag and get more willing at the contest.
I'm not sold on Boyd either but at least he can hit a target....the same can't be said of too many others. I'd persist with him, and defintely Kemp.
Dow needs to be in the 22 next week. Making him the sub is just a waste of time.
Hopefully Pittonet is available to take on Witts.
Cunningham in for sure and maybe Fisher for Motlop.
Out - Acres, E Curnow, Motlop, Silvagni, Young
In - Dow, Binns, Cowan, Cunningham, Pittonet,
Arguably we're facing a very simple equation i.e. Poor game plan + only 1 AFL standard small forward + average Ruck + 1 AFL standard key back + poor foot speed across the field + raft of players who can't kick or handpass accurately + raft of players who cant make good decisions under pressure + material portion of our salary cap invested in players who are out of form.
With the exception of the game plan, lets discuss in turn
(1) Small forwards - we'd hoped that Honey was the answer and watched Durdin emerge last year, but both are not there for different reasons and it has hurt. Motlop needs time to develop. We need to delist Honey, develop Motlop in the twos and go with makeshift forwards in the meantime that can at least hold the ball in our forward half or have enough pace to pressure the ball carrier. Consider Dow, Docherty, Cottrell, Boyd, Cunningham.
(2) Average Ruck - we may have signed him for 4 years, but Pittonet is just an average AFL ruck, light years behind a Gawn, Darcy etc. TDK is flashy but delivers little & Okeefe and Mirkov are a mile off. We'll need to trade for a decent ruckman at year end.
(3) Key Defensive backs - Young and Durdin are simply VFL players at best & S Durdin is way too slow for AFL. McGovern can't be trusted at all in defence, despite this narrative that he's great for our structure. We'll need to trade off our forwards to address our backline. Consider converting one or more of our talls to key defenders & Mcgovern or Kemp forward.
(4) No pace - Pace gives you time and space and our lack of pace across the ground is consistently putting us under pressure. We cant carry Cripps, Kennedy, E Curnow, Weitering, Silvagni & Acres. Obviously Dow should come in and Cunningham should come in as soon as possible and we should inject some youth in Binns and I would also give McGovern & Kemp a run through the midfield from time to time.
'(5) Disposal and decision making - Probably our biggest issue and the hardest to resolve. All of our highest paid players, with the exception of Cerra, are guilty of of this. Whilst Cripps, Walsh, Docherty & Acres may have good stats, they repeatedly let us down with poor decisions or disposal at critical moments which is in stark contrast to Collingwood's leaders. Acres is a bust.
Laugh if you like, but I'd be putting more faith in the side below than the tripe that we've been watching for the past 8 weeks'
Preferred side:
Boyd Weitering Kemp
Saad TDK Cincotta
Walsh Cerra Cunningham
Cottrell Curnow Docherty
Owies Mckay McGovern
Pittonet Cripps Dow
Cowan, Kennedy, Binns & Martin
Make it happen!
Close to the side Id prefer
Out - Acres, E Curnow, Motlop, Silvagni, Young
In - Dow, Binns, Cowan, Cunningham, Pittonet,
Preferred side:
Boyd Weitering Kemp
Saad TDK Cincotta
Walsh Cerra Cunningham
Cottrell Curnow Docherty
Owies Mckay McGovern
Pittonet Cripps Dow
Cowan, Kennedy, Binns & Martin
Make it happen!
Good side. I like it, although I'd keep Acres based purely on that one effort on the wing where he put the body in. Very rare to see from a Carlton player so he stays and Owies can go.
Anyone know how to watch internationally without hitting up a bar?
Anyone know how to watch internationally without hitting up a bar?
Do you have Kayo or similar sport streaming service?
Do you have Kayo or similar sport streaming service?
I think you'll trouble logging in from an international IP address. Same as trying to log into overseas stream services from here. You'd have to have one of those IP address mask things, being in IT Im sure Thry would know far better than me how to do that.
I think you'll trouble logging in from an international IP address. Same as trying to log into overseas stream services from here. You'd have to have one of those IP address mask things, being in IT Im sure Thry would know far better than me how to do that.
Yeah, not suggesting that. You need to subscribe to a VPN service and then hook in through that. Did it last year to watch games from Greece. Worked pretty well, unfortunately :(
Anyone know how to watch internationally without hitting up a bar?
VPN on Kayo
VPN on Kayo
I know a guy in Thailand that does that. Apparently it works very well.
Vpn to access kayo. Got it thanks guys. Was thinking it's a lot of effort to go through in order to access kayo when there may be an international pass available. Either way it's a bit crap but I'll manage something.
Vpn to access kayo. Got it thanks guys. Was thinking it's a lot of effort to go through in order to access kayo when there may be an international pass available. Either way it's a bit crap but I'll manage something.
Thry, you can also try the TOR browser, but as you know be very careful as subject to where you are such systems are illegal in certain countries.
After watching the entire 2's game this week. In should be Cunners, Plowman (If not injured - cannot believe I am saying this), Cowan, Fogarty on top of Dow and Binns. Plow was a the general down back and something we are missing badly.
OUT: Cripps (clearly not right, cannot run), Motlop, Young, Ed plus?
We need more run and improved kicking Cunners, Plow and Fogarty were all excellent by foot.
my move for 24 season is Boyd as a midfielder so preseason running and weights
After watching the entire 2's game this week. In should be Cunners, Plowman (If not injured - cannot believe I am saying this), Cowan, Fogarty on top of Dow and Binns. Plow was a the general down back and something we are missing badly.
OUT: Cripps (clearly not right, cannot run), Motlop, Young, Ed plus?
We need more run and improved kicking Cunners, Plow and Fogarty were all excellent by foot.
Dunno about Plow ok by foot but a defender must come in to replace Young and he's it.
my move for 24 season is Boyd as a midfielder so preseason running and weights
One of my first moves for 23/24 would be Boyd delisted......never understood his recruiting or what he offers.
Poor mans Caleb Daniel, when we need the real thing imho..
Dunno about Plow ok by foot but a defender must come in to replace Young and he's it.
Plowman in for Young is like Curly in for Moe....
Vpn to access kayo. Got it thanks guys. Was thinking it's a lot of effort to go through in order to access kayo when there may be an international pass available. Either way it's a bit crap but I'll manage something.
Kayo caught up with my VPN last year. I used my own phone number but overseas but I tried the hotel WiFi and VPN so i didn't data. It woke up to my VPN....lol. The Telstra Pass used to work better. If you were with Telstra then no data was used watching the game. Not so with Kayo.
Meh.
As much excitement as I can muster.
My ins would be Dow, Fogarty, Fisher, Cowan, Pittonett, Cuningham, Hewitt, Binns. I would keep Cerra, Kennedy, Cripps, Docherty, Kemp, Walsh, Weitering Saad & Cincotta, & I would probably keep Silvagni, McGovern and Martin. I would be trialling TDK in defence in the VFL as I don't see much future in McGovern. I would also consider using Harry as the second ruckman. I would also think about playing Cripps on the wing.
For starters I would be bringing in Hewett and playing Cripps in the forward line.
Kayo caught up with my VPN last year. I used my own phone number but overseas but I tried the hotel WiFi and VPN so i didn't data. It woke up to my VPN....lol. The Telstra Pass used to work better. If you were with Telstra then no data was used watching the game. Not so with Kayo.
damn I hope not. I got given a free vpn access so ill try a few methods. Out of curiosity were you using vpn from your mobile on wifi or straight 5g services? I haven't had to worry about this before. I did look, you can get an international pass for 44 dollars a month. Given I'm using a free vpn I think I'll ignore that.
damn I hope not. I got given a free vpn access so ill try a few methods. Out of curiosity were you using vpn from your mobile on wifi or straight 5g services? I haven't had to worry about this before. I did look, you can get an international pass for 44 dollars a month. Given I'm using a free vpn I think I'll ignore that.
Are you using an E-SIM or getting a SIM there?
Are you using an E-SIM or getting a SIM there?
I hadn't decided yet. Was just going to roam but not sure.
Open to recommendations.
I hadn't decided yet. Was just going to roam but not sure.
Open to recommendations.
OK Thry, I'll tell you what I did. In Greece I got a Greek SIM, Around 10 euro for 30 days UNLIMITED data. Bugger all calls out but didn't matter as you just use WhatsApp to communicate if you have to. Unbelievable I know but just goes to show how much we're screwed over here, Then I got a VPN service subscription. In this case I got ExpressVPN which was about another 12 euro a month I think? From here I hot spotted off the phone. Fired up the VPN from my laptop and used Kayo to stream the game. I went even further and used a HDMI cable from the laptop to the TV, but that's optional I guess. Had a couple of times when Kayo cracked it with the VPN but all I did then was connect to a different server in Australia. that seemed to fix the problem. Couple of times the game stuck for a bit but generally it all worked pretty well. Here's a link to the ExpressVPN website
https://www.expressvpn.com/
damn I hope not. I got given a free vpn access so ill try a few methods. Out of curiosity were you using vpn from your mobile on wifi or straight 5g services? I haven't had to worry about this before. I did look, you can get an international pass for 44 dollars a month. Given I'm using a free vpn I think I'll ignore that.
Need a VPN with strong encryption protocols - McFee Total Protection software has VPN in it.
We watch stuff only available in the States, UK and other countries without a problem
OK Thry, I'll tell you what I did. In Greece I got a Greek SIM, Around 10 euro for 30 days UNLIMITED data. Bugger all calls out but didn't matter as you just use WhatsApp to communicate if you have to. Unbelievable I know but just goes to show how much we're screwed over here, Then I got a VPN service subscription. In this case I got ExpressVPN which was about another 12 euro a month I think? From here I hot spotted off the phone. Fired up the VPN from my laptop and used Kayo to stream the game. I went even further and used a HDMI cable from the laptop to the TV, but that's optional I guess. Had a couple of times when Kayo cracked it with the VPN but all I did then was connect to a different server in Australia. that seemed to fix the problem. Couple of times the game stuck for a bit but generally it all worked pretty well. Here's a link to the ExpressVPN website
https://www.expressvpn.com/
From the Germanos? Love it great tip. Not sure what happens in Portugal but I'll see.
This guy did an article on SimsDirect (probably sponsored him), but it is a good starting point:
https://www.frequenttraveller.com.au/international-esim-for-travel/
Anyway, back to the footy...
I think we have to try something different and agree with a lot of sentiment expressed here. I think Charlie plays as the predominant forward, with Harry as a forward/ruck. I like the idea of Harry doing something similar with Matthew Richardson at Richmond at the back end of his career, when he was a link player who was agile enough to get up the ground and prove a handful to match-up on.
Vpn to access kayo. Got it thanks guys. Was thinking it's a lot of effort to go through in order to access kayo when there may be an international pass available. Either way it's a bit crap but I'll manage something.
I had a terrible time trying to hook into Kayo from Dubai a few weeks back. Didn't help that VPNs are banned in the UAE.
This is the official way to do it and for the $24 it costs, it's a safer bet and easier - https://www.watchafl.com.au/
Just make sure to cancel the subscription when you get back!
Yea
I had a terrible time trying to hook into Kayo from Dubai a few weeks back. Didn't help that VPNs are banned in the UAE.
This is the official way to do it and for the $24 it costs, it's a safer bet and easier - https://www.watchafl.com.au/
Just make sure to cancel the subscription when you get back!
Yeah, I'd probably just get the afl international pass just to remove the frigging around
damn I hope not. I got given a free vpn access so ill try a few methods. Out of curiosity were you using vpn from your mobile on wifi or straight 5g services? I haven't had to worry about this before. I did look, you can get an international pass for 44 dollars a month. Given I'm using a free vpn I think I'll ignore that.
I was using my mobile on the hotel WiFi.
I suggest you have a holiday - from Carlton as well. Watching or listening to the game will only ruin things for you. Eat the Pasteis de Nata, drink the espresso and port and enjoy yourself.
I believe this is Harry McKay's 100th game. Best of luck and let's hope he kicks straight and kicks a bag.
Thanks for the reminder Paul
All the best to Big H. Hope he causes a few headaches for his opponents. 2, 3, or even 4 would be super
Thanks for the reminder Paul
All the best to Big H. Hope he causes a few headaches for his opponents. 2, 3, or even 4 would be super
I was hoping he might do a Tex Walker and kick 10, but given where Harry's at, I'll be happy with 3 straight.
2, 3 or 4 would be super if not 10 on a great day like others that have had match winning performances. We are talking about a club that scores 6 goals in an entire game. Where a key forward does a single handed effort to produce almost our entire total, while being unable to kick a simple drop punt through the big sticks at any range is expecting a miracle. An important 100 game expectation will only add to his anxiety levels. He might be lucky if he even kicks one goal. I hope I am wrong but I am expecting another loss. One that seals the fate of the coach and a number of players. Best of luck Harry. You need it now more than ever.
It's all chicken and egg stuff on how we facilitate a revival, but if BigH gets on a roll then ultimately Charlie will get a longer leash, we need then both in form, fit and firing and working together correctly.
I presume Pitto will be an in this week, I'm hoping we see BigH, Charlie and whoever of a myriad of 200cm types that get the 3rd tall roll to spread the opposition defence and not be flying against each other.
I hope they aren't too tempted to move Kemp this week as he's just settling into some good form, although long term he's a must through the midfield or the F50.
In my opinion we've made two big mistakes with a couple of players, SoJ and Kemp, they are both midfield capable big body types that can give Cripps a genuine chop out. We lose nothing in pace when SoJ subs for Cripps, and SoJ is quite good in and around stoppages, Kemp actually brings a step up in coverage in the midfield as he has exceptional acceleration and / or quick reactions for a player his size, not sure which one it is but he's got it and it's a trick wasted on the HBF.
I hope they aren't too tempted to move Kemp this week as he's just settling into some good form, although long term he's a must through the midfield or the F50.
In my opinion we've made two big mistakes with a couple of players, SoJ and Kemp, they are both midfield capable big body types that can give Cripps a genuine chop out. We lose nothing in pace when SoJ subs for Cripps, and SoJ is quite good in and around stoppages, Kemp actually brings a step up in coverage in the midfield as he has exceptional acceleration and / or quick reactions for a player his size, not sure which one it is but he's got it and it's a trick wasted on the HBF.
Who are the match ups for King, Lukosius and Casboult? Weiters to King I reckon. I'm dropping Young to the twos this week as he has been utterly horrid and bringing in (Ill give myself an uppercut later) the more experienced Plowman (oh good I can't believe I wrote that) to play on Lukosius if its not Kemp. Maybe TDK goes to CHB on Casboult? Could Kemp play HFF changing to the midfield?
Also dropping SOS as well as Pitto will come in this week, unsure on Gov as he has been terrible also.
But Im not the coach so it will propably remain largely unchanged with maybe just Pitto coming in (maybe Cunners also to add some speed).
Whatever happens Cuningham is a must, quick, good user and the ability to think his way through.
He’s sort of fit… and there’s no point in him breaking in the magoos, if he’s going to break then let it happen in the seniors.
He’ll play whatever he can this year and then it’ll be an extension or execution and if extension, then it has to be based on senior form.
Whatever happens Cuningham is a must, quick, good user and the ability to think his way through.
He’s sort of fit… and there’s no point in him breaking in the magoos, if he’s going to break then let it happen in the seniors.
He’ll play whatever he can this year and then it’ll be an extension or execution and if extension, then it has to be based on senior form.
Fully agree....plays this week and I'd give him another season if he can play out this one but he would be a year by year renewal contract.
CARLTON is toying with the possibility of calling on injury plagued midfielder David Cuningham for his first senior game in 763 days in a desperate search for forward half class to pull the Blues out of their current rut.
Cuningham has impressed in his recent return to the field in the VFL, impressing with 26 disposals and two goals on unrestricted minutes in the win over Essendon.
Carlton is also hopeful of regaining experienced pair George Hewett (concussion) and Marc Pittonet (hand) after missing the past two weeks.
"Desperate search" Gimme a spell with that emotive crap.
He hasn't been fit....for 2 years.
If he was fit, we don't have to 'search', we just play him, but we haven't had that option have we?!
I've been trying to pick him for a month now since his first VFL game back.
Cuningham the lucky charm for me if he plays and we can win this game. GC are great at home and less convincing away and surely the tide has to turn for us. Not so sold on the GC forward line and our backs might have it a bit easier with no Rankine anymore and players like Ben King still finding their way in AFL footy.
Pittonet back along with TDK might be able to take the edge off Witts and I think our midfield can exert some muscle over the young GC mids who have been terrific but are still kids learning the game.
Prefer if the game was at Marvel than the wide open spaces of the MCG so leg speed wasnt so much of an issue but Im tipping Charlie Curnow to have big game after a few quiet ones on the scoreboard. He has been playing ok just not hitting the scoreboard but he is a class player and is overdue for a bag and vs a defense that is workmanlike but doesnt have the big stars like Moore, May etc. I think GC will hammer us in Qld but we should win this initial contest by around 5 goals, it wont change my opinion on where I see the list and the clubs future but its more about the law of averages that we cant keep losing and this is one of our easier and best chances to win a game Imho.
"Desperate search" Gimme a spell with that emotive crap.
He hasn't been fit....for 2 years.
If he was fit, we don't have to 'search', we just play him, but we haven't had that option have we?!
I've been trying to pick him for a month now since his first VFL game back.
I was under the impression he's only been back 2 weeks and last week was his first VFL game with full minutes :-\
I was under the impression he's only been back 2 weeks and last week was his first VFL game with full minutes :-\
Correct
Maybe because I have 6 weeks' worth of scars, I wouldn't back us to beat anyone at the moment (well, probably WCE)
We seem to find inventive ways every week to shoot ourselves in the foot and lose by 3-4 goals.
Unfortunately there is a nagging, little voice in the back of my head that keeps saying 'it will all click soon.....'
Will this be the week?
Remember when we were desperate to crack the ton? I'd be happy with 70 on Sunday.....
I was under the impression he's only been back 2 weeks and last week was his first VFL game with full minutes :-\
:D
I think we’ll win.
Ed was pretty good on Merrett last week when Merrett was on the ball. Does he get another run-with role this week on one of Rowell or Anderson? If so, and if Hewett comes in, do we need to drop one of the midfielders? I'd prefer to see Docherty go back to half bank flank and provide a bit of a cool head down there....we've been all over the shop the last few weeks.
Ed was pretty good on Merrett last week when Merrett was on the ball. Does he get another run-with role this week on one of Rowell or Anderson? If so, and if Hewett comes in, do we need to drop one of the midfielders? I'd prefer to see Docherty go back to half bank flank and provide a bit of a cool head down there....we've been all over the shop the last few weeks.
Doc has been one of the wasteful ones with the footy in recent times. Might be e cool head defensively, needs to do the same with disposal.
SOS Motlop Out
Pitto Newman In
They have given the full squad yet
Carlton has rung the changes yet again after its eighth loss in the past nine games. The versatile Silvagni has been dropped from the 22 to face Gold Coast along with Jesse Motlop, while Nic Newman and Marc Pittonet are certain starters. David Cuningham has been named on the extended bench and remains a chance to play his first game since round nine, 2021.
SOS Motlop Out
Pitto Newman In
They have given the full squad yet
Carlton has rung the changes yet again after its eighth loss in the past nine games. The versatile Silvagni has been dropped from the 22 to face Gold Coast along with Jesse Motlop, while Nic Newman and Marc Pittonet are certain starters. David Cuningham has been named on the extended bench and remains a chance to play his first game since round nine, 2021.
Interchange from:
Jaxon Binns
Alex Cincotta
David Cuningham
Ed Curnow
Paddy Dow
Lachie Fogarty
Matthew Kennedy
Lewis Young
Round 14 squad v Gold Coast
Backs:Jordan Boyd Jacob Weitering Nic Newman
Half-backs:Brodie Kemp Mitch McGovern Adam Saad
Centreline:Blake Acres Patrick Cripps Matthew Cottrell
Half-forwards:Sam Docherty Harry McKay Jack Martin
Forwards:Matthew Owies Charlie Curnow Tom De Koning
Followers:Marc Pittonet Adam Cerra Sam Walsh
Interchange from:Jaxon Binns Alex Cincotta David Cuningham
Ed Curnow Paddy Dow Lachie Fogarty Matthew Kennedy Lewis Young
No real clues with Interchange, listed in alphabetical order
Binns has been named as "NEW" in the AFL teams. Doesn't that usually mean they get on the ground?
I was under the impression he's only been back 2 weeks and last week was his first VFL game with full minutes :-\
Correct.
Should have had 'rumoured' in there somewhere.
He was 'ready' to be picked a few times but was never picked, and a couple byes didn't help.
I remember quizzing whether he was playing in about R4 because he was (almost) 'ready to go'.
Binns has been named as "NEW" in the AFL teams. Doesn't that usually mean they get on the ground?
Nope.
A couple years ago there was a bloke that was 'new' for about 4 weeks in a row before he actually made his debut.
Extended squads are a killer.
Jack out again doesnt bode well for his future at the club, same boat for Fisher who wasnt recalled.
Im thinking Motlop out needs a small forward replacement......Cuningham plays imho.
Not really sure how we are (relatively) large favourites for this one, but you can't say we are not due for a win.
Not really sure how we are (relatively) large favourites for this one, but you can't say we are not due for a win.
That's my Theory...law of averages and the opposition being less daunting especially away from home.
I fear what will happen if we lose....
Looks like Jack is cooked.
Will take a miracle from here.
A little bit of forward of centre connection and we might be in with a chance.
Dont like Doc being named HF....he is a defender or defensive type mid.
Cunners and Martin is the missing piece if they ever find top form.
Agree on Cunningham EB....reckon he plays forward....bit of pace and he can find the goals.
Not sure Doch plays HF.....he'll be middle/half back. Maybe Jack Martin/Kennedy can share the medium size forward roles a bit. And TDK might have to push back a bit this week.....Young might not make the cut but it'll leave us a bit short down back. Kemp might be a good match up for Lukosius.
By the way, how does Newman play, wasn't he listed as 2-4 weeks estimated return?
By the way, how does Newman play, wasn't he listed as 2-4 weeks estimated return?
So was Docherty when he returned.....maybe Saad too (at least there was someone else who did similar)
Kennedy, Cunningham, Dow, Binns
Pace required Kennedy / Dow midfield rotations , Binns on the wing, Cunners up forward. Doc to be the 7th defender.
For me Newman is a huge inclusion, if he is fit, I'm not sure like a bunch of others that he has been fit for many weeks now.
He's the righthand for Weiters, make no mistake, he is as important to our D50 as any other player, he might not be the fastest, but he's got a footy brain 2nd to none!
I know we shouldn't pick a side for any reason other than what's the best option on the day or maybe at a pinch for development purposes but...
Assuming he doesn't play, and that's a big assumption with this side... to drop Jack Silvagni the week after he's singled out for disgraceful, and very public abuse, probably isn't a great move for the guy's state of mind.
On the other hand, maybe they've had a discussion around it, perhaps including him, and with the bye coming up they do see it as a bit of release of pressure for Jack.
He hasn't been playing well Lods
He hasn't been playing well Lods
Yes, it's not just the fact he's played out of position, even when he's been in F50 he's hardly had a touch.
Much like the SFs if you're the 3rd wheel in F50, you have make the very most of every opportunity because reality is you will be lucky to get just 2 or 3 per match even on a good day!
He hasn't been playing well Lods
No, he hasn't and I can see a justification for his omission on that basis alone.
But he's not Robinson Crusoe in terms of playing below his capabilities.
And probably the events of last weekend shouldn't come into play.
It's just he's been kicked in the guts in a very public way and while he's been down on his haunches he's been given another one.
Hopefully he plays VFL and gives a really good account of himself.
It's just he's been kicked in the guts in a very public way and while he's been down on his haunches he's been given another one.
Hopefully he plays VFL and gives a really good account of himself.
While you might look at this prejudicially, if it was a no name like Cottrell or LoB and not a Silvagni would fans react the same?
If we stay truly impartial, if there is an imbalance over the long term, it actually seems to be in his favour yet ironically now some are claiming he has become the persecuted! The media will pick up on this fan bias, you can expect a series of articles about his future at the Aints or CheatsFC, but I think it's highly unlikely CheatsFC have any real interest, it's just Dodo throwing his old mate a bone!
I don't buy the "played out of position" theory. Sometimes you're just out of form. But we all know that he's much better than what he's showing at the moment.
That theory was posited regarding SPS, who was constantly being "played out of position", but subsequently it's been clear in two seasons at WCE that he's just a very average player.
While you might look at this prejudicially, if it was a no name like Cottrell or LoB and not a Silvagni would fans react the same?
If we stay truly impartial, if there is an imbalance over the long term, it actually seems to be in his favour yet ironically now some are claiming he has become the persecuted! The media will pick up on this fan bias, you can expect a series of articles about his future at the Aints or CheatsFC, but I think it's highly unlikely CheatsFC have any real interest, it's just Dodo throwing his old mate a bone!
I'd think I'd feel pretty much the same if that had happened to either of Cottrell and LOB.
It wouldn't though because they're names not Silvagni.
If one of our blokes had been abused in that fashion and then dropped the following week it wouldn't sit well.
To the point of his name.
He has always been held to a higher standard by Carlton people because of his name.
Some folks seem to think it works in his favour, I've always thought it was a bit of a burden.
But it's a cross he'll have to bear while he stays at this club.
Yes, he should be in the frame for omission, but while we have three small forwards who collectively contribute very little, there's plenty of competition for the chop.
The fact is he's probably given way because both Pittonet and Cunningham have been named, and that pushes him out of two spots he could possibly fill.
Jack Martin's 'almost' performance probably saves him, but gee, the bloke needs to play for more than ten minutes.
I'm with you on that one Lods, JSoS is clearly omitted because Pitt + TdK are selected, but the other forwards aren't earning their keep. Another nothing game from Martin and I'd put a line through him - the bloke has received more opportunities than most of the list and given nothing.
Yep
For team balance it probably makes sense
...and maybe I'm over-reacting.
Players get abused every week...it's just the very personal and very 'public' nature of this one that's triggered me.
Yep
For team balance it probably makes sense
...and maybe I'm over-reacting.
Players get abused every week...it's just the very personal and very 'public' nature of this one that's triggered me.
I’m 100% with you and I’d like to whack the guy that abused him in such a manner. Low dog act
In fact I’d like the club to identify the person and revoke their membership - probably isn’t a paid up member tho 🙄
That is not what we’re about!
You’re a disgrace to your family, he said! How fking dare he! Absolutely repugnant.
Agree re the fan abuse. Everyone is angry and wants answers....but to hurl some pretty vile abuse like that is uncalled for. I was embarrassed when I saw that footage. Would be horrible to be at the game, sitting nearby with a young family and have to see and hear that.
I'm a big fan of JSOS and reckon he goes in and gives as much every week as anyone....but like a lot of players, he's outta form and for team balance, probably needs to make way this week to inject a bit of pace in the forward line if nothing else.
Agree re the fan abuse. Everyone is angry and wants answers....but to hurl some pretty vile abuse like that is uncalled for. I was embarrassed when I saw that footage. Would be horrible to be at the game, sitting nearby with a young family and have to see and hear that.
I'm a big fan of JSOS and reckon he goes in and gives as much every week as anyone....but like a lot of players, he's outta form and for team balance, probably needs to make way this week to inject a bit of pace in the forward line if nothing else.
Love Jack for his heart and soul approach, and because of the romance of the family tradition, and when he is playing well he gives us something but at the moment he isn't performing well enough to hold his place in the side.
Voss has confirmed Cunningham is in. https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/1358826/afl-team-news-cuningham-returns
Voss has confirmed Cunningham is in. https://www.carltonfc.com.au/news/1358826/afl-team-news-cuningham-returns
That's positive news for David and the Club
That's positive news for David and the Club
Martin,McGovern and DC wouldn't have played too many games together.
Let's hope DC can hold up physically, reserves footy is fine but senior footy is more demanding and relentless in the modern era so I hope the coaching staff look after him and gets a few rests on the bench.
The MC picks the side that gives us the best chance of winning, which means maximising our strengths and minimising our weaknesses. Unfortunately for Jack Silvagni, he needs to be at or near top form to be an asset to the team. Any drop off in that space, and he struggles. Lack of pace, lack of athleticism, not a great 2nd ruck, struggling to hit the scoreboard. It's not hard to understand why he's out. In some ways, this is a tale of two Jacks. One as described herein, and the other struck down with constant injury, and seems to have attributes that we need, and that the other Jack does not.
It may suck, and it may seem unfair, but the MC has no choice IMO.
Yep
For team balance it probably makes sense
...and maybe I'm over-reacting.
Players get abused every week...it's just the very personal and very 'public' nature of this one that's triggered me.
Yes, I get it, and I'd suggest we probably all want that fan banned.
On the flipside, it's also not unreasonable to think the focus on SoJ was possible worse because he might have been getting a game based on performances that were unsustainable for a lesser name. The name works both ways, as unfair as that may be!
I bet the fan still idolises SOS even after the way he treated SoJ on his 100th game, ...................... ironic isn't it? ::) Personally, if I happen to pass SOS in the street I won't even acknowledge his existence, I'm so disappointed, I wish Serge was alive to clip him around the ears. Before that moment I would have offered to pay for his coffee, perhaps bought him his lunch, etc., now he's invisible to me, hardly a Hayley Lewis moment!
The MC picks the side that gives us the best chance of winning
That's a nice theory but, so far this season, the theory has not been supported by the outcomes.
I know we shouldn't pick a side for any reason other than what's the best option on the day or maybe at a pinch for development purposes but...
Assuming he doesn't play, and that's a big assumption with this side... to drop Jack Silvagni the week after he's singled out for disgraceful, and very public abuse, probably isn't a great move for the guy's state of mind.
On the other hand, maybe they've had a discussion around it, perhaps including him, and with the bye coming up they do see it as a bit of release of pressure for Jack.
Maybe the voice wasn't from above the race but inside the tunnel.
That's a nice theory but, so far this season, the theory has not been supported by the outcomes.
The process is not linear and not a given. There are no guarantees that your best side produces a win. It simply gives you the best chance. You can be quite certain that if the MC picked the team based on supporter input, our season would look a lot worse.
The process is not linear and not a given. There are no guarantees that your best side produces a win. It simply gives you the best chance. You can be quite certain that if the MC picked the team based on supporter input, our season would look a lot worse.
That goes without saying but I am still not impressed with the MC's judgement.
That goes without saying but I am still not impressed with the MC's judgement.
That's fine, but you need to accept that their judgment comes with a wealth of insight, knowledge and experience that is not available to any supporter. We are, all of us, starting from a position of ignorance. It cannot be any other way. I don't mean ignorance about AFL football in general terms, I mean ignorance about all the inputs that are required to make player selection decisions from week to week.
That's fine, but you need to accept that their judgment comes with a wealth of insight, knowledge and experience that is not available to any supporter. We are, all of us, starting from a position of ignorance. It cannot be any other way. I don't mean ignorance about AFL football in general terms, I mean ignorance about all the inputs that are required to make player selection decisions from week to week.
Fair points, Pauly... however...
Sometimes having a lot of information about players and the inputs you speak of can make the MC too subjective/close; even to the point of gifting blokes games based on reputation or even physical attributes alone to handle a specific position. And supporters (who think without sentimentality), have a basis of judgement solely on what they see on match day, and have a level of detachment/objectivity which can validate certain perspectives.
In addition we humble supporters witnessed, this year especially, out of form blokes being gifted game after game based on nothing more than potential/promise/reputation without delivery; persistent failure week after week - Fisher, JSOS, Honey, etc... much to the chagrin of we humble observers.
That's a nice theory but, so far this season, the theory has not been supported by the outcomes.
Yep our MC usually lose us a few games through the season with ridiculous selections/non selections.
Fair points, Pauly... however...
Sometimes having a lot of information about players and the inputs you speak of can make the MC too subjective/close; even to the point of gifting blokes games based on reputation or even physical attributes alone to handle a specific position. And supporters (who think without sentimentality), have a basis of judgement solely on what they see on match day, and have a level of detachment/objectivity which can validate certain perspectives.
In addition we humble supporters witnessed, this year especially, out of form blokes being gifted game after game based on nothing more than potential/promise/reputation without delivery; persistent failure week after week - Fisher, JSOS, Honey, etc... much to the chagrin of we humble observers.
I disagree. I would bet both testy satchels that supporters have way more attachment / sentimentality to certain players than the MC. It is simply impossible for outsiders to have the knowledge required. As a supporter we have one input with which to guess a player's suitability for selection (game day performance). The MC has several inputs, which we cannot see and cannot know. We are handicapped to begin with, a handicap that is impossible to overcome. Within the comfort of one's own mind, or within the comfort of the CSC echo chamber, naturally we're right and the MC is wrong. I get that.
You are simply making assumptions about players being gifted games, MC foolishly persisting with certain players etc. I'm just speculating here, but I've heard Voss, Chris Scott and others on a number of occasions extolling the virtues of continuity - maybe what you classify as under performers being gifted games, is perhaps something that has a bigger objective behind it ? Perhaps chopping and changing week in week out creates too much instability, for a club that has had far too much of that in recent times ? Perhaps also another reason that such players get games is because the alternatives are worse ?
And there's nothing humble about keyboard warriors thinking they know more / could do a better job than professional football staff. Just take Voss as an example. He's been in the system for 30 odd years. By the time you take into account junior football, the various pathway programs that lead to AFL footy, 289 games on an AFL list with all the attendant accolades, 140 odd games as senior coach at 2 clubs, 7 seasons as Port assistant. How many thousands of hours does that equate to ? Add to that the experience of the other assistants, inputs from the senior players / leaders..............there's a lot of experience and knowledge there. Now clearly, the combined best efforts of all those individuals have not been good enough, and some would say nowhere near good enough. And to some extent that's true. But it's simply crazy to say that I know better than the MC, I decree that such and such a selection was a balls up etc.
Forums like this are dress ups and role playing for blokes. We can all have a go and be experts, pretend that we're the coach, the MC etc. We can all yell and scream and think this player stuffed up, the MC stuffed up, the club etc. But a little perspective and little humility go a long way.
I would bet both testy satchels that supporters have way more attachment / sentimentality to certain players than the MC. It is simply impossible for outsiders to have the knowledge required.
While I agree, we are too experienced in the Carlton ways of the past to plainly accept that our MC could ignore external influences.
For me I have to continually question who runs the club, the football department or the Marketing and Executive division?
I see improvements under Cook but I also see the very recent past and how many remain, for example how we felt that we needed to kibosh SOS to either get control or to appear to have control. It looks like nobody had the necessaries to stand up to the legend so they went The Game of Thrones route!
Looks like Paddy Dow is Sub again! (Won't be Young, Can't be Ed, shouldn't be a debutante!!)
In: David Cuningham, Lachie Fogarty, Marc Pittonet, Nic Newman
Out: Ed Curnow (Omitted), Jack Silvagni (Omitted), Jesse Motlop (Omitted), Lewis Young (Omitted), Paddy Dow (Omitted)
Emerg: Ed Curnow, Lewis Young, Jaxon Binns, Paddy Dow.
While I agree, we are too experienced in the Carlton ways of the past to plainly accept that our MC could ignore external influences.
For me I have to continually question who runs the club, the football department or the Marketing and Executive division?
I see improvements under Cook but I also see the very recent past and how many remain, for example how we felt that we needed to kibosh SOS to either get control or to appear to have control. It looks like nobody had the necessaries to stand up to the legend so they went The Game of Thrones route!
I currently sit 4th on the total number of posts for the CSC. I am the last person to tell people not to have opinions, not to speculate etc. Whilst I can appreciate that a forum like this is not much different to blokes in a pub talking footy, the real problem that I have with it is the same problem I have with all social media. Firstly the reach is significantly greater than blokes in a pub (which brings with it problems), and secondly the de-legitimation of real knowledge and experience in favour of fake news is amplified, both in range and potential.
I disagree. I would bet both testy satchels that supporters have way more attachment / sentimentality to certain players than the MC. It is simply impossible for outsiders to have the knowledge required. As a supporter we have one input with which to guess a player's suitability for selection (game day performance). The MC has several inputs, which we cannot see and cannot know. We are handicapped to begin with, a handicap that is impossible to overcome. Within the comfort of one's own mind, or within the comfort of the CSC echo chamber, naturally we're right and the MC is wrong. I get that.
You are simply making assumptions about players being gifted games, MC foolishly persisting with certain players etc. I'm just speculating here, but I've heard Voss, Chris Scott and others on a number of occasions extolling the virtues of continuity - maybe what you classify as under performers being gifted games, is perhaps something that has a bigger objective behind it ? Perhaps chopping and changing week in week out creates too much instability, for a club that has had far too much of that in recent times ? Perhaps also another reason that such players get games is because the alternatives are worse ?
And there's nothing humble about keyboard warriors thinking they know more / could do a better job than professional football staff. Just take Voss as an example. He's been in the system for 30 odd years. By the time you take into account junior football, the various pathway programs that lead to AFL footy, 289 games on an AFL list with all the attendant accolades, 140 odd games as senior coach at 2 clubs, 7 seasons as Port assistant. How many thousands of hours does that equate to ? Add to that the experience of the other assistants, inputs from the senior players / leaders..............there's a lot of experience and knowledge there. Now clearly, the combined best efforts of all those individuals have not been good enough, and some would say nowhere near good enough. And to some extent that's true. But it's simply crazy to say that I know better than the MC, I decree that such and such a selection was a balls up etc.
Forums like this are dress ups and role playing for blokes. We can all have a go and be experts, pretend that we're the coach, the MC etc. We can all yell and scream and think this player stuffed up, the MC stuffed up, the club etc. But a little perspective and little humility go a long way.
The scary thing about that scenario Paul, is that you may be right.
I guess the problem is that reservations are often expressed in pre-match threads...and they then play out exactly as predicted during the game.
The selections may be the best, with the best possible knowledge...but the downside of that means things are pretty crook.
I currently sit 4th on the total number of posts for the CSC. I am the last person to tell people not to have opinions, not to speculate etc. Whilst I can appreciate that a forum like this is not much different to blokes in a pub talking footy, the real problem that I have with it is the same problem I have with all social media. Firstly the reach is significantly greater than blokes in a pub (which brings with it problems), and secondly the de-legitimation of real knowledge and experience in favour of fake news is amplified, both in range and potential.
I suspect if we got all the 'active' members of this forum together we'd be lucky to fill a pub. :D
I think Paul seriously overates our MC's decision making ability, but this is an opinion-based and driven site.
The process is not linear and not a given. There are no guarantees that your best side produces a win. It simply gives you the best chance. You can be quite certain that if the MC picked the team based on supporter input, our season would look a lot worse.
It couldn't possibly be worse.
It couldn't possibly be worse.
This response, coming from you of all people, took me by surprise.
So really to be a bonefide voting member of a football club you need to have played the game at the highest level to know how to interpret the clubs results and vote?
Be the same as saying to BHP shareholders you need a Mining Engineering degree to be able to cast your vote correctly at a board meeting to judge the performance of the board.
Doesnt work that simplistic way in the real world and the club have to face scrutiny, and be accountable in all areas.
The club in its Consitution have to subscribe to the Corporation Act of 2001, the club are bound to provide certain undertakings....
Preliminary Objects:
2.1 The Club exists for the benefit of its supporters and the community. It seeks to serve this purpose by undertaking the following.
(a) In playing the game of AFL football, to provide its supporters with enjoyment, engagement, fulfilment and with hope of success.
Id suggest the club have failed supporters with reasonable expectation on point 2.1(a) and supporters have every right to scrutinize and comment on the clubs performance especially as Directors, Players, Staff etc are considered ordinary members just like everyone else under the Constitution and have no elite protected status.
I suspect if we got all the 'active' members of this forum together we'd be lucky to fill a pub. :D
1995 GF on the big screen, GTC buying the drinks, EB1 taking care of the food... what a night it'd be 😁
We have had so many different MC's past five years it's beyond a joke.
It will be nice to have stability next five years.
Funny thing EB, most mining company boards don't have technical people on them, so decisions made at the top are by people actually not qualified to do so. They rely on advice from lower level staff.
That's a nice theory but, so far this season, the theory has not been supported by the outcomes.
I wouldn't limit it to just this season.
Club has had a history of losing the game at the selection table.
Funny thing EB, most mining company boards don't have technical people on them, so decisions made at the top are by people actually not qualified to do so. They rely on advice from lower level staff.
All too true Prof, most large miners employ smaller mining service companies to handle a lot of the technical day to day stuff.
The BHP board is mainly financial backgrounds and most sit on boards in non acting roles of other companies as well so they know SFA about anything Technical and probably have never been in a mine up close.
I wouldn't limit it to just this season.
Club has had a history of losing the game at the selection table.
Yet it’s not the same MC.
It’s led by the senior coach of the day with the assistants… anyone got an abacus to tally up the number over the past 10 years ?
I think we'll win. :D
GC will be overconfident, won't turn up to play...possibly ;)
With Martin and Cunningham in the forward line it creates a bit of x-factor type difference they won't really have a handle on. Fogarty there too gives the whole forward line a different look. It looks a diverse, yet balanced group...on paper.
Weitering seems to go OK without Young there. ;), and Newmans back so the defence doesn't worry me.
It all comes down to the midfield battle, and giving that forward line the opportunities.
We're due, and I think if we do get on top it won't be close.
Blues by 42.
I think we'll win. :D
GC will be overconfident, won't turn up to play...possibly ;)
With Martin and Cunningham in the forward line it creates a bit of x-factor type difference they won't really have a handle on. Fogarty there too gives the whole forward line a different look. It looks a diverse, yet balanced group...on paper.
Weitering seems to go OK without Young there. ;), and Newmans back so the defence doesn't worry me.
It all comes down to the midfield battle, and giving that forward line the opportunities.
We're due, and I think if we do get on top it won't be close.
Blues by 42.
IF we capitalize on our forward entries with majors, that'll help confidence and we should win...
However... to win we must also eliminate the 20 minute disappearing act and rather sustain effective defense and offense for 120 minutes.
Ifs buts and maybes. Toss a coin. I'd be rapt if we could get it together and crank out a win and I've tipped us but I tend to be a sucker for punishment.
Ifs buts and maybes. Toss a coin. I'd be rapt if we could get it together and crank out a win and I've tipped us but I tend to be a sucker for punishment.
This is our most winnable game for a while so expectations are up given we are overdue but it's going to be very sombre if we lose and the club can't afford the fallout that will follow. This is a must win ...
I'm not sure if it's been mentioned...
There's another huge unknown in this game.
The Suns MCG appearances are as rare as hen's teeth.
They've only played there 3 times in the last five years.
I remember malthouse saying that once you make 5 changes your chance of winning diminishes significantly.
I've tipped Gold Coast to win. The way our seniors are playing we wouldn't beat the echuka under 16s.
Gold Coast have been plucky and have played matches to the end. Rowell, Anderson and lukosius in form. King to make a name for himself and plenty of outside run.
Gold Coast might not play the G much, but neither do we.
Gold Coast might not play the G much, but neither do we.
We've played the MCG around 30 to their 3 in the same 5 year time frame, Thry.
We usually have around 8 or 9 games there each year
...and 5 times already this year.
But only one win and a draw.
So the argument is more which side will it suit best.
They have some speed and the open spaces may be to their advantage.
Based on the VFL team, Curnow and Dow have been held over.
We've played the MCG around 30 to their 3 in the same 5 year time frame, Thry.
We usually have around 8 or 9 games there each year
...and 5 times already this year.
But only one win and a draw.
So the argument is more which side will it suit best.
They have some speed and the open spaces may be to their advantage.
I was being a bit facetious lods. We haven't played football well at all lately.
I was being a bit facetious lods. We haven't played football well at all lately.
I get it Thry,
We might turn up there, but we sometimes don't turn up there. ;D
Despite being on the wrong side of the win/loss record of late, its been largely due to our poor kicking. Consistenly poor kicking.
I think we are due to find the big ones on a more regular basis this week. Together with the GC/MCG factor, i agree with Lods that it could be a big win. As long as we get out of the blocks early and get some momentum up, we'll be ok.
Great article in The Age on Harry McKay. Well worth a read.
Psychology student, Coleman Medal giver: There’s more to Harry McKay than meets the eye https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/psychology-student-coleman-medal-giver-there-s-more-to-harry-mckay-than-meets-the-eye-20230616-p5dh5u.html
The article is behind a paywall.
"When Michael Voss said nobody worked harder on their game than Harry McKay, it was more than just glib spin from a coach sticking up for his star forward.
This is a player who moved from Richmond to the seaside to be closer to the chilled waters of the bay for his recovery; who has installed a steam room at his home; who hired a sprint coach in the off-season. Teammates say he is the hardest worker at the club. He is so devoted to his football they joke he does not have time for a girlfriend.
"I don't think any girl could be with him until he's finished his career," teammate and close friend David Cuningham laughed this week.
This is the side of McKay fans do not see when their only exposure to the forward is the two hours on game day. Like many professional athletes, there is more to Harry McKay than meets the eye.
Key forwards, like fast bowlers in cricket, are not meant to be smart. McKay is a thinker. A deep thinker. Some might even say an over-thinker. At a time when McKay is battling mental demons in front of goal, it will amuse some that he is studying psychology at uni.
Key forwards are supposed to be mean and snarly, eager to inflict pain. Think Tony Lockett, Barry Hall and Jonathan Brown. McKay is a well-mannered giant who praises reporters for a thoughtful question and, according to his father Peter, "won't stick a knee in the back of someone's head just to hurt them".
McKay, who plays his 100th game on Sunday, is also a thoughtful and sensitive soul. Two years ago for Christmas, he framed his Coleman Medal to give to his parents. At the height of his goalkicking yips, he spoke openly about his anguish at the effect his on-field problems had on his teammates, coaches and parents. It made for tough listening at home.
"It is hard to hear as a parent your child worrying about us," his mother Tracey said. "That's a lot of pressure on a child to worry about their parents. In the context, it's his vulnerability showing out. That's not necessarily a bad thing. You've got to understand your vulnerability and address it to be able to move forward."
Said his father: "We're not walking around town with our chins on the ground because Harry's missing goals."
What they are pleased about is McKay, an optimist, has finally acknowledged a problem, and sought help to rectify it.
"That's why he's taken a little while to say it's not quite working the way he wanted to," Peter said.
Do not confuse any sense of denialism with a lack of work ethic or hunger. If the pained expressions on his face after he misses a goal tell you anything, it's that he should not take up poker – and that he cares.
From the moment he walked into Princes Park and saw how hard Marc Murphy and Kade Simpson trained, McKay knew how much work was required to succeed at the top level.
"He's always thinking about footy and how to get better," Cuningham said. "Every decision he makes is footy related. He's actually studying psychology, so there you go.
"In terms of the footy side of things, he's bought a steam room he uses at home. He's recently moved to bayside so he can do recovery very conveniently. Off-season he sees that as a big opportunity to improve his game. He hired a sprint coach."
Former teammate, and housemate, Jed Lamb, remembers McKay's "obsessive nature". He would be leaving training while McKay was doing extras with the assistant coaches, catching balls and honing his forward play.
"It got to the point where the boys would take the piss out of him because he was the first there in the morning, last to leave," Lamb said this week.
"I was given the arse two years later, and he won the Coleman – so I guess it's no secret," Lamb added with a laugh.
Nic Newman quickly clicked with McKay upon his arrival at Carlton for the 2019 season. Coming from Sydney, where he had played some decent but inconsistent football, Newman was eager to take a more dedicated approach to his game.
In terms of professionalism, Newman said, McKay was "if not the best, then close to the best I've seen", which speaks volumes as he came from the famed Bloods culture.
McKay may be quieter than most, but Newman admires the leadership he has shown behind the scenes in helping foster a more inclusive culture at the club, especially among the younger players.
Harry Lemmey, a draftee from last year, has taken a particular shining to McKay, following his older namesake like a "shadow", Newman said.
McKay has also been supportive of Cuningham through his lengthy injury struggles, constantly reminding his teammate how much faith he has in him.
"He's at the forefront of making others better – and that's allowing them to be comfortable and being in their own skin, not fear being a bit different," Newman said.
"It'd be a bit boring if all 45 of us are the same. It can happen at footy clubs, you get a bit institutionalised in terms of what we say, how we act. He's been pretty big with that stuff.
"He knows who he is as a person. That's something he should be really proud of. He doesn't waver for anyone, really strong in his convictions for who he is, how he thinks about things."
Those principles were evident this week when McKay called out fans who hurled abuse over the players' race in proximity to kids eager to get close-up to their heroes.
"A lot of people might go 'I don't want to upset the Carlton faithful by telling members to pull their head in'," his father said. "He's a man of principle.
"You've got grown men and women who have had a gutful of beer abusing and swearing and cursing. They really should have police there. It's quite intimidating for young kids.
"I've never challenged anyone because that's my son, but I have challenged them to keep their opinions to themselves if they're loud and screaming."
The McKays, who sit among the crowd in the family section, accept player sledges from fans come with the territory, but they believe fans overstepped last week.
"We know how hard it is as supporters. We had kids that would give everything for their team to win every weekend," Tracey said. "There would be tears at home if they didn't win. We know how much it means to the fans. There's a line of decency you don't cross. We never did as supporters, and the vast majority don't."
There would not be a player who has not had a rough patch during their career. McKay is going through his now. Whether he needs to train smarter rather than harder, he will figure out. What his coaches and teammates are confident of is he will emerge on the other side better for the experience.
"Some people make the argument you need to step back, he's too wired up – I think he's got the balance, he can have a laugh and relax," Newman said. "He still does a decent job of that.
"If there was a knock on him at all, it's around that he invests so much. If that's the knock you're going all right."
Absolutely love this.
Those abusive supporters gave us all a really bad name - I want them named and shamed and memberships - if they have them - removed. We have no right to tell personal abuse at players for losing a game ffs! We can be frustrated we can be angry we can be anything we want, but as Harry’s mum says in this article, there is a line of decency that should not be crossed, and they bound over it. Scumbags.
Yesterdays at my kids bball game another parent - who doesn’t follow AFL but knows I am Carlton - immediately brought up the abuse and said it was everywhere apparently, Carlton supporters screaming at their players that their families should be embarrassed! Your supporters are feral, they said to me.
I was on level 2 and missed it all until seeing it on the news and reading it here. Absolutely unacceptable.
I've read enough, our next Captain ;)
Nice read, thanks for posting.
It’s good to humanise footballers.
Also good to disprove the “theory” of people who can “look” laconic…
Lambs comments were interesting too.
Hard to imagine the person / academic described in the article is the same one that hangs sh!zen on his brother in the podcast!
I'd be weighting my assessment on all the evidence before we elect him Australia's 1st President!
Glad to see Paddy D as the sub. No disrespect to Ed C but a conservative sub isn't the answer - Paddy has earned his senior opportunities.
Can't for the life of me understand why we start favourites. Yet here we are.
Go Blues