Ready for after the game.
Feck me. I did not see this one coming. How much opportunities to win, do you give your side by hitting a lead early in the last quarter. That has to be the best victory this season yet. Forget the Saints game. This was a tight game against real quality opponents. We have knocked over the three best sides in the league. What does that tell us? Any mention of Collingwood having the best coach this season will piss me off more than anything. I don’t know how we have turned a bottom 4 side into a potential genuine contender in 8 weeks is something I have never seen. 8 wins in a row. Three of the best sides. All with an injury list. How many wins in a row are needed to win a flag? lol. Kidding with that comment. Too many injuries to bring back into the side and trouble pushing players out. TDK was ordinary in the first half. Absolute warhorse after that. We won without the clearance domination we have had.
We had the umpires call every opportunity to keep Melbourne in the game. Without bias and I will not call umpires out often enough, but tonight Lever and May could jumper hold, wrestle, and push Charlie in the back with every opportunity. Nothing to see here. How many push in the back free kicks were paid the other way with our defenders. Free kick for a dangerous tackle which is very debatable in the last minutes of the game. I just hope Doc is good with his calf corker. We miss him so much when he is not on the ground. You can’t put a value on this guy.
I'm leading 2 tipping comps, and i tipped us tonight, and everyone else in the top 8 tipped the dees. >:D
VERY happy with that win.
Great gritty win, finals beckon, that game had real heat in the contest and we had a good even contribution that stood up in that finals type atmosphere and that's what you need to win finals.
Very happy to bank that victory and we should win straight through to finals now...
What a victory! Mirabile Visu!
That was a tough night for a man of my age. The longest penalty shootout in history before the Matildas won, then this, another nerve racking cliff hanger.
That was a tough win. Had to really earn that one more than any for a long time. Great performance!
good tough win.
We are playing finals!
Martin is a gun - smart, tough, skilful. Marchbank is the goal line hero. Dow may get dropped, but he doesn't deserve that fate - he's barely put a foot wrong. De Koning, whom I dearly love, will start clunking those almost marks sooner or later.
And Acres is everywhere. Those MCG Acres were his tonight.
good tough win.
We are playing finals!
Hard not to at the moment. I will enjoy watching the game tomorrow. Just wish I'd been there tonight.
Still doubting TDK, plays like a mid, might top our contested possessions against a team that has Gawn, Oliver, Petracca, etc., etc...
Once he stops worrying about winning the taps and concentrates on 2nd efforts even Gawn can't go with him, the opponents just do not have the recovery or mobility, all TDK has to do is contest in the air then mop stuff up on the ground. Guys like Cripps and Hewett must absolutely love playing with him when he gets on a role!
Gawn had a crap load of taps but stuff all impact, that's the magic of our ruck combination!
Brilliant, winning is the best. But the effort, tackling and hard running fills the heart.
Two heart attacks in one night, Maltildas penalty shoot out then our game. Gutsy finals like win against a top side. Respect.
I thought we'd win IF we could play our 'style'. What I wasn't sure about was if we could sustain it.
Bug#ger me. We did it in a heart stopper. I was listening on AFL Nation with our very own McClure again. I'm not going to lie. I prayed to the footy gods for the entire final 2.5mins. Setting myself a new record 😆
Can't wait to read your thoughts and watch the replay once or twice.
Any news on Doc's calf?
Gee I hope we've got players returning from injury. This group will be wrecked.
Still doubting TDK, plays like a mid, might top our contested possessions against a team that has Gawn, Oliver, Petracca, etc., etc...
Once he stops worrying about winning the taps and concentrates on 2nd efforts even Gawn can't go with him, the opponents just do not have the recovery or mobility, all TDK has to do is contest in the air then mop stuff up on the ground. Guys like Cripps and Hewett must absolutely love playing with him when he gets on a role!
Gawn had a crap load of taps but stuff all impact, that's the magic of our ruck combination!
Write that again, but instead of TDK, write Jack Silvagni. ;)
People want to play him because he is a 'genuine ruck'....and here you are telling him not to worry about the ruck, just contest.
FWIW, He only had 1 hta from 45 ruck contests (2%) Pittonet was poor as well but had 4 / 63 (6%) with 18% less TOG.
Which is what i've been saying about Jack all year. He doesn't need to worry about the ruck, just contest and get the ball on the ground.
Jack gets more ball on the ground. Takes more marks and kicks more goals.
So why are we choosing TDK?
Honestly, there was a lot of love for TDK from the commentators, but despite 'contesting' what did he do? He kicked a nice goal early.....but he didn't take any contested marks all game.....but he dropped a handful including one at the death that almost cost us the game....and he said as much himself.
His DE% tonight was 47.1% Only cottrell had worse in navy blue (46.2%)
He showed plenty of potential, but as i said a week or so ago, it was another case of the 'almosts'. He almost took a good mark. He almost found a teammate with his kick. He almost....
Again, we need to play both him and Pitto at the moment due to injuries. But if Harry and Jack are both fit, personally, i'm not picking TDK on form.
Any news on Doc's calf?
Supposedly just a corkie.
Time will tell
I was a bit surprised no changes this week, I'd say that can't persist, I won't be surprised to see Hollands and / or Cottrell have a rest this week.
It's not about form, it's about looking fatigued.
Statistically Motlop and Owies aren't having the same impact they did 2 or 3 weeks ago, but there is Buckley's they are going out unless injured. Both are making the maximum out of limited opportunities, even if it does come at the hand of Charlie.
Charlie who's field play is quickly turning him into the the next Franklin. I had to laugh on the broadcast when Daisy said "that kick to Owies" wasn't that good, she's been hanging around a bit too much with BT. Daisy take leaf out of Richie Benaud's book rather than follow the unending parroting of the BT, and remember sometimes it's better just to say nothing at all! :o
Da da da daaaahhh. Blues are back big time!!!
Hollands and Dow both did their jobs tonight, (Dow 80% efficiency) but I think they must make way for Cerra and Walsh. Both in the absolute heat of battle just weren't quite able to stand up. Hollands will get there and Dow will always be susceptible to pressure. Offer him another 1 year deal and see how much he wants to stay. Otherwise an EXCELLENT night at the office!
good tough win.
We are playing finals!
Not yet, do the ladder predictor, if we lose the next 2 and results go a certain way, we can drop out. We aint out of the woods yet.
Amazing win. What a ride we are on.
Pleasuring thing is every week lately our top 6 or so players are a mixed bag which is great going forward.
I thought Dow Kemp TDK Fogerty were all very important players in the win.
Cripps second half was huge. TDK second half was surprising considering who he was up against. The kid stood up provided a forward target and was as desperate as anyone to win the contested ball. Had 17 touches - 14 contested.
Thought Hewitts form is back to what it was last year.
Add a fit Cerra Walsh McGovern and harry in that team and on our day in a final we can beat anyone.
Lid is off.
Keep resting players and wait to get them back 100%. Do not risk early returns just yet. I don’t think we were the clearance kings tonight. We did not land enough marks we should have. We just had a tough fight we were prepared to endure. Keep playing this unit to develop the squad. They work together very well. Ignore the statistics. It isn’t a team of champions. It is a team that plays like champions. Talks are Dow and Silvagni might be considered for trade at seasons end. Both must have some value. Too many similar talents in this current group.
If Melbourne lose the next 2 and we win the next 2, we will jump them into 4th!
We play GC and GWS so definitely possible to win both
Dees play the in form Sydney in the last round....at the SCG no less.
We need to be cheering on the hawks next week though to make it happen......even a draw would suffice.
Charlie who's field play is quickly turning him into the the next Franklin. I had to laugh on the broadcast when Daisy said "that kick to Owies" wasn't that good, she's been hanging around a bit too much with BT. Daisy take leaf out of Richie Benaud's book rather than follow the unending parroting of the BT, and remember sometimes it's better just to say nothing at all! :o
Not a good example for Daisy to follow.
Hollands and Dow both did their jobs tonight, (Dow 80% efficiency) but I think they must make way for Cerra and Walsh. Both in the absolute heat of battle just weren't quite able to stand up. Hollands will get there and Dow will always be susceptible to pressure. Offer him another 1 year deal and see how much he wants to stay. Otherwise an EXCELLENT night at the office!
That has always been my view because he has often been too slow to get his foot to the ball and has shown little defensive capacity BUT, after watching him put his body on the line like never before, a few more games like tonight and I might be forced to reconsider.
Not yet, do the ladder predictor, if we lose the next 2 and results go a certain way, we can drop out. We aint out of the woods yet.
I'm with you. Keeping the lid on until the last results of the last round are confirmed.
I still have flashbacks of the Doggies celebrating that same moment last year. 😭 you know how the rest.
Now IF we win another game, and I believe we will, the lid will be lifted.
Go Blues
I'm with you. Keeping the lid on until the last results of the last round are confirmed.
I still have flashbacks of the Doggies celebrating that same moment last year. 😭 you know how the rest.
Now IF we win another game, and I believe we will, the lid will be lifted.
Go Blues
We need one more win to seal the deal
What lid? It was off a month ago. Number 17 is within our grasp!
So we need to win our last 2 and Port need to lose 2. That would give us top 4.
What lid? It was off a month ago. Number 17 is within our grasp!
Yes, it the club that needs to keep the lid on it, not us. As for us supporters, who cares about a lid. Let it blow!!!!!
If Melbourne lose the next 2 and we win the next 2, we will jump them into 4th!
We play GC and GWS so definitely possible to win both
Dees play the in form Sydney in the last round....at the SCG no less.
We need to be cheering on the hawks next week though to make it happen......even a draw would suffice.
Same with Port. We are on 50, Port 56.
Absolutely not good for the heart that game - my heart shattered into a million pieces when they kicked the goal which turned out to be touched 😮💨
Melbourne got a lot of calls their way, not sure what the free kick count was but seems they could do no wrong 🙄
So proud of all their efforts - Hewitt and Fogs really stood out to me in the last! We deserved to have this go our way!!
Again, we need to play both him and Pitto at the moment due to injuries. But if Harry and Jack are both fit, personally, i'm not picking TDK on form.
It's fantasy for fans to think SoJ can positively impact momentum in the ruck against Gawn and Grundy the way TDK did last night. No dodgy Stats or dodgy use of Stats will change anyone's mind about that, especially not a Stat as dodgy and subjective as HtA!
Just an objective 14 contested possessions, dare I say it most of them momentum changing follow up 2nd efforts to a ruck contest that set Cripps, Dow or Hewitt free when it really mattered. ;D
Finally on this,
People want to play him because he is a 'genuine ruck'....and here you are telling him not to worry about the ruck, just contest.
FWIW, He only had 1 hta from 45 ruck contests (2%) Pittonet was poor as well but had 4 / 63 (6%) with 18% less TOG.
we can consider the full picture, and completely ignore your attempt to verbal me;
(https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6539.0;attach=1381)
I get it, I'm sure many of us get it, you fear for the future of SoJ and you deal with that by attacking the player who you have identified as the main competition for the role you think SoJ can play, but there are two flaws in your perception, that there is a genuine competition for that role and that SoJ can play it!
At least with
@ElwoodBlues1 we know why he hates TDK, in fact why he hates anyone who signs for more than two bob a game, that's exposed by him labelling players like Gov as money bags, a label he might use for TDK in the seasons to come. But @Kruddler your anti-TDK rants are just becoming largely irrational, and if readers bother to follow up your claims by looking at the objective stats you might actually hurt Pitto because they might not understand the role Pitto brings not measured by a stat, or worse still they might believe the dud commentary from the likes of Barrett or Negropontis.
Not yet, do the ladder predictor, if we lose the next 2 and results go a certain way, we can drop out. We aint out of the woods yet.
No one is gonna stop this team. This is a freight train thats finding a new gear every week with superstars to come back into the team. I'm Excited.
No one is gonna stop this team. This is a freight train thats finding a new gear every week with superstars to come back into the team. I'm Excited.
Good on ya mate, I'm glad you're excited, you should be, we all should be. But I'm gonna curb my excitement until we are 100% guaranteed a finals birth, right we now we are not.
[quote author=LP link=msg=398960 date=1691845213
Charlie who's field play is quickly turning him into the the next Franklin. I had to laugh on the broadcast when Daisy said "that kick to Owies" wasn't that good :o
[/quote]
She was referring to the kick to Charlie.
It's fantasy for fans to think SoJ can positively impact momentum in the ruck against Gawn and Grundy the way TDK did last night. No dodgy Stats or dodgy use of Stats will change anyone's mind about that, especially not a Stat as dodgy and subjective as HtA!
Just an objective 14 contested possessions, dare I say it most of them momentum changing follow up 2nd efforts to a ruck contest that set Cripps, Dow or Hewitt free when it really mattered. ;D
Finally on this,we can consider the full picture, and completely ignore your attempt to verbal me;
(https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6539.0;attach=1381)
I get it, I'm sure many of us get it, you fear for the future of SoJ and you deal with that by attacking the player who you have identified as the main competition for the role you think SoJ can play, but there are two flaws in your perception, that there is a genuine competition for that role and that SoJ can play it!
At least with @ElwoodBlues1 we know why he hates TDK, in fact why he hates anyone who signs for more than two bob a game, that's exposed by him labelling players like Gov as money bags, a label he might use for TDK in the seasons to come. But @Kruddler your anti-TDK rants are just becoming largely irrational, and if readers bother to follow up your claims by looking at the objective stats you might actually hurt Pitto because they might not understand the role Pitto brings not measured by a stat, or worse still they might believe the dud commentary from the likes of Barrett or Negropontis.
If our best tap ruckman is getting one 'hit-out to advantage' a quarter, and there's no indication what happens to it after that first possession, it's really not a stat that's worth 'two bob'.
Forget the stats...look at the positioning, the effort and the influence at the contest and it's obvious who was our best ruckman last night.
Tom missed some marks he should have taken, but first hands on the ball and bringing it to ground is the second best result in a contest.
Melbourne have some seriously good footballers who came to play tonight. Razer Ray needs to stop guessing when making decisions. He was incapable of seeing Cuningham holding up the Melbourne player in the tackle from where he was. As a former goal umpire that final shot was a point every day of the week. Good decision validated by the review.
We have six players who could be brought into the side, Silvagni, Walsh, Cerra, McGovern, Kennedy and McKay, the question is who would go out. If we ever get close to having a full list to choose from there will be some very disappointed players.
As I keep saying, winners win because they win. We need to keep our winning mentality. I think we can really cause some real damage this year.
No one is gonna stop this team. This is a freight train thats finding a new gear every week with superstars to come back into the team. I'm Excited.
That's what it feels like and a train no one can stop. I'm trying to contain my expectations for now though. Let's just make sure of playing finals and then we can really start to dream!
Good on ya mate, I'm glad you're excited, you should be, we all should be. But I'm gonna curb my excitement until we are 100% guaranteed a finals birth, right we now we are not.
I want to be all in but I’m with you. Too many disappointments in the past of ‘almost ’. It feels different with this group, there’s a confidence there that wasn’t previously. There are no more stuttering nervous kicks -
It’s just one way traffic and go.
I had no expectation for the win last night. Am beyond proud, let’s knock over GC so we can really start believing!
Good on ya mate, I'm glad you're excited, you should be, we all should be. But I'm gonna curb my excitement until we are 100% guaranteed a finals birth, right we now we are not.
Yes agree. My lid is firmly on, until as you say, finals are confirmed.
Can someone tell me why Gawn kicking it away after we got the mark or free kick, wasn’t paid 50m? I think it was to Jack? At the ground I couldn’t see how on earth he wasn’t penalised .
[quote author=LP link=msg=398960 date=1691845213
Charlie who's field play is quickly turning him into the the next Franklin. I had to laugh on the broadcast when Daisy said "that kick to Owies" wasn't that good :o
She was referring to the kick to Charlie.
Yes that’s right. She’s a great commentator and knows her sh1t. She knows Charlie is a top field kick and mentions it often.
Very impressive, especially when you factor in the quality 'outs'.
The two 'in-form' sides put on a finals like display. Looking ahead, the difference between the two in-form sides is the room for improvement... the Go Dees have some room for improvement, ours is significant.
We continue to be the hunters and last night we were up against another side that hunts really well, with strong contributions from all their players. We absorbed their hunting really well, but still conceded more than we would have liked... we will learn much from that, and a win that was as hard fought as you can imagine.
As Vossy pointed out, we've found different ways to win in different circumstances - culture, leadership and maturity (not to mention, confidence).
How good is the development of Kemp? And when TDK starts clunking his grabs, lookout.
Melbourne have some seriously good footballers who came to play tonight. Razer Ray needs to stop guessing when making decisions. He was incapable of seeing Cuningham holding up the Melbourne player in the tackle from where he was. As a former goal umpire that final shot was a point every day of the week. Good decision validated by the review.
We have six players who could be brought into the side, Silvagni, Walsh, Cerra, McGovern, Kennedy and McKay, the question is who would go out. If we ever get close to having a full list to choose from there will be some very disappointed players.
As I keep saying, winners win because they win. We need to keep our winning mentality. I think we can really cause some real damage this year.
For the avoidance of doubt
Yes that’s right. She’s a great commentator and knows her sh1t. She knows Charlie is a top field kick and mentions it often.
That kick to Owies from Charlie was sublime.
For the avoidance of doubt
Even if he hadn't touched it, he was interfered with in the contest and should have received a free kick.
That kick to Owies from Charlie was sublime.
Yes, top shelf - and that's not a fluke or a one off.
Yes, top shelf - and that's not a fluke or a one off.
Agreed, he does with monotonous regularity.
Re: the ruck battles and the continuing debate...Gawn dominated the ruck contests imho but didn't do much around the ground .Grundy was ineffective in both roles ruck and forward and I gave TDK the points around the ground over Pittonet.
None of the ruckman could take a mark and the stats showed that and the conditions probably helped us negate Gawns marking and influence as much as anything. TDK vs Pittonet...points to TDK as he was more handy in general play but was he a dominant factor..not for me.
Kicked a goal which was handy given the score line but in terms of being a 600-800k a year messiah ruckman he isn't there for me yet.
@LP...Yep..I don't like over paying for players, cars, houses, coffees or anything and we have had a lot of overpaid underperforming players some of which are starting to give a return and so they should. They don't deserve special praise because it's over due and they have been carried by some of our hard working understated players for a while.
The question I have is can TDK carry the ruck load without Pittonet having to do the grunt work to make his life easier?
Re: Jack....reckon he would have enjoyed the conditions last night and been a handy player and would have got the same amount of hitouts as the other ruck bar Gawn plus been handy forward.
I want Jack back for the finals and Charlie will need help if Harry doesn't get up fitness wise because teams will now hunt us and Charlie will be targeted more and I don't think TDK is the answer down forward..
My daughter was talking about the footy on Friday and kept hinting she barracks for the blues now even though she was a cat i think because we lived in Geelong for a few years. Maybe we should go to a game one day dad she said. I upgraded my ticket and bought her one on the ground level behind the goals and just behind the cheer squad. Got her a Carlton puffer jacket on the way in to the ground and I'm pretty confident she'll still be wearing it in the middle of summer. Last night was her first ever live footy experience. Boy oh boy does she love the footy now. And very much does she love Charlie. What an introduction! That was epic. The best thing of all she could not get over the atmosphere and how amazing the blues supporters are, she already feels part of the baggers family. Wowee.
My daughter was talking about the footy on Friday and kept hinting she barracks for the blues now even though she was a cat i think because we lived in Geelong for a few years. Maybe we should go to a game one day dad she said. I upgraded my ticket and bought her one on the ground level behind the goals and just behind the cheer squad. Got her a Carlton puffer jacket on the way in to the ground and I'm pretty confident she'll still be wearing it in the middle of summer. Last night was her first ever live footy experience. Boy oh boy does she love the footy now. And very much does she love Charlie. What an introduction! That was epic. The best thing of all she could not get over the atmosphere and how amazing the blues supporters are, she already feels part of the baggers family. Wowee.
When Carlton are winning like this (or just winning), there is nothing better.
One final point on the Marchbank touch. He should have been given a free kick as Van Rooyan interferes with him in the marking contest.
There will always be injuries in footy. For whatever reason though, we've had more than most teams for the last decade. Right now we had 8 players who play regularly in the stands. For me, that's the most exciting part of this crazy journey. We're beating premiership favourites with all that talent waiting to return. We have very few on the cusp of retirement. There you have the makings of sustainable success.
Just one more win and you know the rest.
Go Blues
Replay is up. Super Sunday viewing Bluebaggers. Enjoy ☕️
She was referring to the kick to Charlie.
My apologies to Daisy then, I thought she was discussing the kick from Charlie to Owies.
PS; Actually the kick from Hewett to Charlie around the body was pretty much perfect as well, gave Joel Smith zero chance, how Smith ended up on Charlie at that stage is a mystery that Goodwin must answer. TDK led May up the field, Lever ended up on Fogarty! :o
One final point on the Marchbank touch. He should have been given a free kick as Van Rooyan interferes with him in the marking contest.
Absolutely. Nor was van Rooyen alone. That should have been a free and no score.
It's fantasy for fans to think SoJ can positively impact momentum in the ruck against Gawn and Grundy the way TDK did last night. No dodgy Stats or dodgy use of Stats will change anyone's mind about that, especially not a Stat as dodgy and subjective as HtA!
Just an objective 14 contested possessions, dare I say it most of them momentum changing follow up 2nd efforts to a ruck contest that set Cripps, Dow or Hewitt free when it really mattered. ;D
Oh the irony.
For someone who complains about the hitout to advantage stat so much, you highlighting the contested possessions stat while completely ignoring the DE% stat at least shows you are true to form.
Kruddler: What good is a hitout if it it goes to a 50-50 contest or turn it over?
Kruddler: What good is a contested possession if it goes to a 50-50 or turn it over?
Its great TDK got so many contested possessions. Now if only he could find a teammate with them. Like his ruckwork, its basically useless. It helps the opposition as much as it helps us....so why are we celebrating it? 47.1% DE, that means over half of his possessions did not advantage us at all.
Add in the numerous dropped marks throughout, especially at the death, 3:20 to go, 1:20 to go (i think) and he let slip 2 opportunities to win us the game. The first cost us a shot on goal. The second allowed them to get the ball I50.
@Kruddler your anti-TDK rants are just becoming largely irrational, and if readers bother to follow up your claims by looking at the objective stats you might actually hurt Pitto because they might not understand the role Pitto brings not measured by a stat, or worse still they might believe the dud commentary from the likes of Barrett or Negropontis.
Again, i've said this more times than TDK has played games. I'm not against him. I'm against his output He underdelivers.
People notice him because he is tall, blonde and can leap small buildings.....but he doesn't impact the game nearly as much as he should. You and the commentators can continue to fawn over him, but he hasn't lived up to the hype yet.
Objective stats? What stats did i hide? Contested possessions are not objective??? BS
Same with Port. We are on 50, Port 56.
Port have to lose 3 games.
Dees only have to lose 2
Kemp, Cincotta & Hollands .................... sensational.
TDK drops way too many marks at crucial points in a match, some of them uncontested too. If he can't fix that problem in his game and quickly, then he is a huge liability and waste of time.
De Koning definitely drops marks, but IMO it's a very fixable problem. He needs to spend the off season really working on that aspect of his game.
Some Melbourne folk are criticising Gawn for his missed marks last night.
Pressure and conditions.
Port have to lose 3 games.
Dees only have to lose 2
Yes, correct!
Can someone tell me why Gawn kicking it away after we got the mark or free kick, wasn’t paid 50m? I think it was to Jack? At the ground I couldn’t see how on earth he wasn’t penalised .
Exactly Micky. When Dee sympathisers start moaning about the touch or non-touch decision remind them of that moment in the game. Martin goes from 50m out to the goal line and effectively ends the game then and there. So stick it up where the sun don't shine Melbourne supporters. Maybe the football Gods are smiling on us. For a change
Unbelievable atmosphere last night. The whole Matilda's penalty shootout situation playing out while the 1st quarter was on. The weirdness of the crowd going nuts at on field player stoppages was surreal, and amusing to be honest. I was constantly turning back from TV screen to the ground until quarter time, where thankfully the Matilda's game came to a conclusion.
Then in the last quarter I experienced something I've never experienced before. The ENTIRE stadium went completely silent when the video review decision was broadcast over the audio. I'm talking ANZAC day silence. It's was unreal. Then when the word's "insufficient evidence to overturn" played out the cheer was deafening. Will never forget last night's game. A one in a million.
For the avoidance of doubt
Barrett on Ch 9 did not stop banging on about this moment. He even went as far as to ask Kemp if he HEARD Marchys touch on the ball. kemp, cool as ice said in that atmosphere you can’t hear anything but Marchy said he touched it, so he did.
Had a really obnoxious Melb guy behind us, my god they’re a whinging bunch! Mind you had a Carlton guy near us that a mother moved her kids away from. Settle down people and understand you’re not at home in front of your tv, by yourself - keep yourself in check! Night games can get feral.
Unbelievable atmosphere last night. The whole Matilda's penalty shootout situation playing out while the 1st quarter was on. The weirdness of the crowd going nuts at on field player stoppages was surreal, and amusing to be honest. I was constantly turning back from TV screen to the ground until quarter time, where thankfully the Matilda's game came to a conclusion.
Then in the last quarter I experienced something I've never experienced before. The ENTIRE stadium went completely silent when the video review decision was broadcast over the audio. I'm talking ANZAC day silence. It's was unreal. Then when the word's "insufficient evidence to overturn" played out the cheer was deafening. Will never forget last night's game. A one in a million.
Same however I didn’t realise umpire had called it touched and saw the Melb cheer squad going nuts and figured it was another heartbreak for us. From
Then I knew we could hold on!!
How much did we miss Harry’s marking last night. I remember him clunking marks when needed in the Geelong game.
Pickett should be cited by the MRO for trying to kick the ball out of Kemp's arms when he was on the ground after taking that hanger.
If you have the game on tape/Kayo etc, go and have a second look, it's in the slow-mo replay.
Some Melbourne folk are criticising Gawn for his missed marks last night.
Pressure and conditions.
Exactly. Apparently the pill was soap like last night and conditions very slippery so maybe not the best time to make judgments.
Over the past seasons I have been critical of Carlton for using pick 3 to select Dow. But on his recent performances he has finally arrived and I would hate to see him running around next year in another team's jumper.
I know that when we have a full list available there is not room for him in the midfield, but given the hard tackling, high pressure game we now play what is the likelihood of ever having an injury free list?
In no particular order these are what I see as his main attributes:
He is only 23
He has developed physically into a very solid unit
He is not injury prone
His kicking skills are now at an acceptable level
He is hard at the ball and helps to take the pressure off Cripps.
I believe he has shown enough to be offered a contract.
Over the past seasons I have been critical of Carlton for using pick 3 to select Dow. But on his recent performances he has finally arrived and I would hate to see him running around next year in another team's jumper.
I know that when we have a full list available there is not room for him in the midfield, but given the hard tackling, high pressure game we now play what is the likelihood of ever having an injury free list?
In no particular order these are what I see as his main attributes:
He is only 23
He has developed physically into a very solid unit
He is not injury prone
His kicking skills are now at an acceptable level
He is hard at the ball and helps to take the pressure off Cripps.
I believe he has shown enough to be offered a contract.
And I feel the playing group absolutely are on board with him. Seems very well liked
And I feel the playing group absolutely are on board with him. Seems very well liked
Agree. In fact Cripps seems to have, to a degree, taken him under his wing.
With our win over Casey, it's just become a Deelightful weekend for Bluebaggers.
Someone had to say it 😝Anyways it's got to be better than "isn't that good" or "woowee". And it doesn't cost a cent😉
Agree. In fact Cripps seems to have, to a degree, taken him under his wing.
If what's on socials is anything to go by, Dow is popular. He went away with a group of boys to the US. Crippa, Walsh, Setters were amongst the others. I don't think there's any issue with popular amongst players. Or amongst supporters.
As we've all seen the weakness on his defensive game is improving at afl level. You can't assess that in the 2's. His challenge is to show he can maintain it and stay abreast of the fast decision-making required. I can't fault him since he's come in and congratulate his determination, tenacity, and perseverance. Sometimes those qualities trump pure skill when the heat is on. 1yr Contract would be drafted if I was in charge.
Dark Lord, some of Pickett's on field actions are a bit questionable, arms get up around people's head a lot and is a bit indiscriminate in his tackling. You'd have though that after trying to main Smith in round one he'd have learnt. Only a matter of time before he mains somebody I reckon.
Plenty of focus, me included, on the blokes we're missing.....Cerra, Walsh, McGovern, Harry, Silvagni and Kennedy. But I reckon the blokes who've come in or returned from injury over the last 8 weeks have been instrumental in the turnaround. Martin has been fantastic and is tough and hard at the ball and man. Motlop and Owies and Fogarty are providing pressure stuff in the forward line, and Fog up around the middle at times. Cunningham wasn't as good last night but he has a bit of class about him. Pittonet coming back in, Cincotta has really stood up and Kemp seems to go from strength to strength every week. That hanger last night showed he's got the confidence now to go for that. And Dow has been great too. Yes, still makes some blunders but last night I thought he was really hard at it and put his body on the line a number of times late in the game and tackled strongly. He looks to be doing everything that's being asked of him and if it means we offer him another year or two, so be it.
And the senior blokes stood tall again...Cripps was huge and Weitering solid as a rock down back.
That's the top 3 teams and St Kilda (who were 5th) that we've beaten in the last 5 or 6 weeks. Hard to believe but we're the form team in the competition. Don't worry about other results (will be nice though), just win the last two, get some players back, and hopefully snare a home final in week 1.
Over the past seasons I have been critical of Carlton for using pick 3 to select Dow. But on his recent performances he has finally arrived and I would hate to see him running around next year in another team's jumper.
I know that when we have a full list available there is not room for him in the midfield, but given the hard tackling, high pressure game we now play what is the likelihood of ever having an injury free list?
In no particular order these are what I see as his main attributes:
He is only 23
He has developed physically into a very solid unit
He is not injury prone
His kicking skills are now at an acceptable level
He is hard at the ball and helps to take the pressure off Cripps.
I believe he has shown enough to be offered a contract.
He absolutely should be offered a contract but West Coast are going to be given compensation package where they must trade end of 2nd round and 3rd round pick for an established player. Someone like Dow could be given assurances of regular AFL football and double his pay. So this one could be out of our hands.
He absolutely should be offered a contract but West Coast are going to be given compensation package where they must trade end of 2nd round and 3rd round pick for an established player. Someone like Dow could be given assurances of regular AFL football and double his pay. So this one could be out of our hands.
175 tackles between the two sides. 88 to 87. That's some pressure.
Razer Ray needs to stop guessing when making decisions. He was incapable of seeing Cuningham holding up the Melbourne player in the tackle from where he was.
Razor was going to ball it up. A non-controlling umpire 30-40m away paid the dangerous tackle free.
What about the blatant throw from Petracca that resulted in the Neal-Bullen goal in the third quarter?
Good on ya mate, I'm glad you're excited, you should be, we all should be. But I'm gonna curb my excitement until we are 100% guaranteed a finals birth, right we now we are not.
X100
Before we get all high and mighty about the umpires Cripps was gifted a goal he probably shouldn't have had for a throw that was really an illegal disposal.
That being said, they get a lot wrong both for and against both teams and the result was the correct one imho. We were due a bit of footy gods luck.
Razor was going to ball it up. A non-controlling umpire 30-40m away paid the dangerous tackle free.
What about the blatant throw from Petracca that resulted in the Neal-Bullen goal in the third quarter?
Yes was going to mention that. Razor looked from side to side to see if any of the other umpires were going to pay the free kick. He was the controlling umpire and was directly in front of it.
No wonder their sponsored by OPSM!!
Yes was going to mention that. Razor looked from side to side to see if any of the other umpires were going to pay the free kick. He was the controlling umpire and was directly in front of it.
No wonder their sponsored by OPSM!!
Has anyone in the media mentioned WHY Ray has been afforded the luxury of not having to bounce the ball at centre bounces?
Has anyone in the media mentioned WHY Ray has been afforded the luxury of not having to bounce the ball at centre bounces?
Honestly, i think the bounce is a very outdated tradition.
We are losing good umpires, and preventing new ones from joining the elite, because they need to perfect the bounce.
Forget that. Throw the ball up and get the best umpires we can get based on decision making ability and knowledge of the game......not a party trick.
Before we get all high and mighty about the umpires Cripps was gifted a goal he probably shouldn't have had for a throw that was really an illegal disposal.
That being said, they get a lot wrong both for and against both teams and the result was the correct one imho. We were due a bit of footy gods luck.
Oliver threw the ball and it was unquestionably a free to Cripps.
It’s disappointing that so many throws are let go.
Just watched the replay 🙃
- didn't capitalise on early dominance. High pressure but also missed a couple of easy one's
- last line work is next level
- leaders led
- role players played their roles
- 100% effort 100% of the game
- Harry-less Charlie double teamed again. Held, pushed, but kept fighting
- we made a mockery of some of the commentary
- priceless celebrations by players, coaches, and game day staff (Vossy's bear hug with physio summed it up 🥹)
- our supporters are so important (bring it v gws)
- we have cohesion, commitment, team focus, and some kind of x-factor going on. Then there's momentum!
- just one more W
- any Voss doubters have been challenged
Go Blues
With our win over Casey, it's just become a Deelightful weekend for Bluebaggers.
Someone had to say it 😝Anyways it's got to be better than "isn't that good" or "woowee". And it doesn't cost a cent😉
Waverley Blues defeated Montrose Demons in U11 GF as well. Great weekend.
Waverley Blues defeated Montrose Demons in U11 GF as well. Great weekend.
🤣
Perfect. Pretty sure the U11's would appreciate the humour. Or not 😳
I'll test it out in the morning
Oliver threw the ball and it was unquestionably a free to Cripps.
It’s disappointing that so many throws are let go.
looked like he made contact to me.
To be quite frank, the stuff around whether Marchbank touched it or not is starting to really P me off...it's covering for some pretty average umpiring. I mean, are Carlton not allowed to attempt to clear D50 under immense pressure? Is every errant kick going to given as deliberate out of bounds?!?
Basically **** YOU salty Melbourne support ers.
It will still be the same result 100 years from now, Carlton by 4 points...so everyone should just get over it.
The bizarre thing is that so many folks will say it 'definitely' was a goal even though they were nowhere near it, and a reviewer with the aid of technology couldn't give a definitive judgement... or even be confident enough to overturn the opinion of a goal umpire who was there on the spot.
Has anyone in the media mentioned WHY Ray has been afforded the luxury of not having to bounce the ball at centre bounces?
It should be questioned because the 'perfect elevation' is going to advantage some ruckmen over others. With his height and physical presence, I'm sure Gawn loves to know exactly where the ball is going. The advantage of the bounce is that it can be slightly unpredictable which means that dominant ruckmen have to second guess what is going to happen. Easy answer, if we keep the bounce, the best bouncer of the 4 umpires bounce it every time.
... or even be confident enough to overturn the opinion of a goal umpire who was there on the spot.
It's exactly as Goodwin stated, the person closest to the event in the best position to make a decision called touched.
If you watch the unedited video you'll see Marchbank signalling touched as he falls to the ground, his signal is instant.
Secondly, the side on footage the media outlets have stopped showing seemed to indicate the ball was not only touched by Marchbank's hand but also hit Marchbank on the knee on the way down well before it crossed the line.
Personally, I'd rather leave all decisions to the goal umpires and kybosh the sluggish momentum killing score review system altogether, it become an excuse to not make a decision, and a tool the likes of BT use to inject excitement in the absence of fundamental commentary skills!
It's bizarre, it's like a lot of neutral supporters wanted it to be a goal.
It's bizarre, it's like a lot of neutral supporters wanted it to be a goal.
The media want the controversy, they are fundamentally lazy, they like stories that can write their own narrative as they rate highly with very little effort!
As a Blues fan, we should be use to listening to and watching broadcasts where the bulk of the commentary is against us, anyone who watched the launch of the new book documenting the 70s would confirm that when the media took Balme's perspective over Southby, ask
@ElwoodBlues1 and
@Lods what they think of Balme! ;o
🤣
Perfect. Pretty sure the U11's would appreciate the humour. Or not 😳
Humor was appreciated! Thanks for the line, LN.
The media want the controversy, they are fundamentally lazy, they like stories that can write their own narrative as they rate highly with very little effort!
As a Blues fan, we should be use to listening to and watching broadcasts where the bulk of the commentary is against us, anyone who watched the launch of the new book documenting the 70s would confirm that when the media took Balme's perspective over Southby, ask @ElwoodBlues1 and @Lods what they think of Balme! ;o
I have had s Geelong supporter and a Richmond supporter tell me today it was a clear goal.
I have had s Geelong supporter and a Richmond supporter tell me today it was a clear goal.
I had a StK and Haw prick tell me it was a goal on Sat after it occured. Salty much?
I have had s Geelong supporter and a Richmond supporter tell me today it was a clear goal.
Just say to them I've watched the replay and I didn't see anyone else next to the goal umpire other than a few players.
If Marchbank says he touch it then that is good enough
Players tend to react honestly in the heat of the battle. You can usually tell in the split second after an incident if the player drops their head and looks forlorn, or if they jump up and down gesturing maniacally to the umpire.
I have had s Geelong supporter and a Richmond supporter tell me today it was a clear goal.
There is no way known anyone watching the replay could say one way or the other. They a full of sh*t if they think it was a clear goal. It was an inconclusive as it gets. Under the pre-review system it was a point because the goal umpire, bloke making the decision 2 metres away, said it flicked his right wrist.
I watched us lose a game by a ball deflecting from Wiggo's hand from Peter Riccardi, plus Hawkins kicked a goal in a close GF which wasn't. When it comes to goal umpire decisions Geelong have used up a lot of luck and their supporters should STFU.
re: Petracca...I thought it was a goal initially but also thought Marchbank was interfered with and it should have been a free so no goal awarded.
@LP Just the mention of Balme's name gets my blood boiling....
re: Petracca...I thought it was a goal initially but also thought Marchbank was interfered with and it should have been a free so no goal awarded.
@LP Just the mention of Balme's name gets my blood boiling....
Let's not talk about the P****, let his behaviour speak for itself.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKXn-ySUUNg
Best advert for a send off rule ever. >:( >:( >:(
If Marchbank says he touch it then that is good enough
I would be interested to know if the goal umpire believed it had been touched and just wanted confirmation that it hadn't cleared the goal line before being touched. If so, there is no controversy because any touching, with whatever part of the body, occurred before the ball crossed the line.
On a separate issue, I thought the umpires did a good, consistent job in a very intense and physical game. The allowed play to continue without paying soft free kicks and the late frees for kicking the ball out of bounds were both justified and to be anticipated.
The dopiest aspect of the so-called controversy was asking Petracca what he thought when he was 50 metres away.
I would be interested to know if the goal umpire believed it had been touched and just wanted confirmation that it hadn't cleared the goal line before being touched. If so, there is no controversy because any touching, with whatever part of the body, occurred before the ball crossed the line.
What the goal umpire says to the field umpire initially is a bit hard to hear.
But the field umpires direction to the ARC is this....
"Score review...Umpire's call is touched one behind. Please make sure it was touched inside the field."
So from that we can make the assumption that it wasn't whether the ball was touched or not that was being questioned, but whether it was touched in the field of play.
EOS
The dopiest aspect of the so-called controversy was asking Petracca what he thought when he was 50 metres away.
Almost up there with Damien Barrett yesterday asking Kemp if he HEARD Marchys hand touch the ball 🤦♂️
re: Petracca...I thought it was a goal initially but also thought Marchbank was interfered with and it should have been a free so no goal awarded.
@LP Just the mention of Balme's name gets my blood boiling....
Indeed. I think I wrote elsewhere that Marchbank should have got a free; he was impeded without the ball by not one, but at least two Melbourne players. No score at all.
As for Neil Balme: I will forgive him for 1973 when Satan chases him around the MCG thrice, stabbing him in the backside the entrie way around. His behaviour ... I'm not going there. It is still a raw wound 50 years after the fact. We had 14 fit players for most of that game. Kevin Hall played with a broken cheekbone. As to Southby - that was inexcusable.
Coaches' votes :
9 George Hewett (CARL)
7 Patrick Cripps (CARL)
7 Nicholas Newman (CARL)
3 Jack Viney (MELB)
2 Angus Brayshaw (MELB)
1 Christian Petracca (MELB)
1 Jacob Weitering (CARL)
Almost up there with Damien Barrett yesterday asking Kemp if he HEARD Marchys hand touch the ball 🤦♂️
Damien who?
😉
I would be interested to know if the goal umpire believed it had been touched and just wanted confirmation that it hadn't cleared the goal line before being touched. If so, there is no controversy because any touching, with whatever part of the body, occurred before the ball crossed the line.
On a separate issue, I thought the umpires did a good, consistent job in a very intense and physical game. The allowed play to continue without paying soft free kicks and the late frees for kicking the ball out of bounds were both justified and to be anticipated.
He has to know ~90%, he can't guess. The other ~10% is making sure. If doesn't see a touch then he calls a goal and asks it for a check to see if it is touched.
These are the best two sides right now. Bar St. Kilda's first half against us, Melbourne is the only side of the last 8 to be able to properly match it with us. They just looked like the two best sides. Pity we likely have to come from 5th. Hopefully the ladder stays as it so a win first week keeps us in Melbourne. Carlton v Collingwood week 2 would be big! Does mean an away PF if we won that but rather that in a PF than a SF. Anyway, best we get there then get past week 1 first before worrying about the rest.
It's bizarre, it's like a lot of neutral supporters wanted it to be a goal.
They are scared of us.
We are feared once again!
He has to know ~90%, he can't guess. The other ~10% is making sure. If doesn't see a touch then he calls a goal and asks it for a check to see if it is touched.
Refer to Lods' comment (above), which specifically addresses my query "the field umpires direction to the ARC is this....
"Score review...Umpire's call is touched one behind. Please make sure it was touched inside the field."
That indicates that there was no question about whether the ball was touched but whether it was touched in the field of play.
https://www.afl.com.au/video/1007372/match-replay-carlton-v-melbourne?videoId=1007372&modal=true&type=video&publishFrom=1691886600001&references=AFL_MATCH:4965
At 2.00.48
https://www.afl.com.au/video/1007372/match-replay-carlton-v-melbourne?videoId=1007372&modal=true&type=video&publishFrom=1691886600001&references=AFL_MATCH:4965
At 2.00.48
Thanks Lods - clear as a bell
Refer to Lods' comment (above), which specifically addresses my query "the field umpires direction to the ARC is this....
"Score review...Umpire's call is touched one behind. Please make sure it was touched inside the field."
That indicates that there was no question about whether the ball was touched but whether it was touched in the field of play.
Don't think you can draw this conclusion from this statement.
When looking at a touched call, there are two criteria (a) was it touched and (b) if it was, was it in the field of play, or behind the goal line. When the field umpire sends it upstairs, I am sure the expectation is that both criteria will be assessed. I think "Please make sure it was touched in the field" is a simplified way of the umpire requesting that both criteria are checked.
Our saving grace was the soft call from the goalie - if he says not touched, and video evidence can't prove otherwise, criteria (a) is out the window.
I say we train all our backmen to wiggle all fingers when they are reaching to touch a ball on the goal line.
I say we train all our backmen to wiggle all fingers when they are reaching to touch a ball on the goal line.
You mean like the Filth players are all doing?
I thought they were just singing "Twinkle Twinkle Little Star" to the Daicos babies!
Tell all the supporters of other teams and the media that the ball wasn't touched. It will wind them up no end. It is a bit like the Harmes incident. It doesn't matter whether the ball was in or out, we won the flag. It doesn't matter if the ball was touched or not, we won the game. We are Carlton, everyone one else can take care of themselves.
Tell all the supporters of other teams and the media that the ball wasn't touched. It will wind them up no end. It is a bit like the Harmes incident. It doesn't matter whether the ball was in or out, we won the flag. It doesn't matter if the ball was touched or not, we won the game. We are Carlton, everyone one else can take care of themselves.
Funny how this one gets all the press, and the two Jeremy Cameron ones have gone all quiet when they were much bigger clangers.
Cameron's mark in the third quarter was so far over the boundary, I'm surprised he wasn't asked to show his reserved seat ticket.
Funny how this one gets all the press, and the two Jeremy Cameron ones have gone all quiet when they were much bigger clangers.
Cameron's mark in the third quarter was so far over the boundary, I'm surprised he wasn't asked to show his reserved seat ticket.
I thought this was pretty funny from Vic Pol
I say we train all our backmen to wiggle all fingers when they are reaching to touch a ball on the goal line.
Richmond did that last year against us as we kicked for goal, sucked in the dopey dicks in the Arc, and cost us badly as it would have put us within a kick late in the game.
Don't think you can draw this conclusion from this statement.
When looking at a touched call, there are two criteria (a) was it touched and (b) if it was, was it in the field of play, or behind the goal line. When the field umpire sends it upstairs, I am sure the expectation is that both criteria will be assessed. I think "Please make sure it was touched in the field" is a simplified way of the umpire requesting that both criteria are checked.
Our saving grace was the soft call from the goalie - if he says not touched, and video evidence can't prove otherwise, criteria (a) is out the window.
I say we train all our backmen to wiggle all fingers when they are reaching to touch a ball on the goal line.
What the goal umpire is saying is that he definitely touched and wanted to make sure it was in the field of play. As far as the ARC goes, as you said, they check both whether it was touched and if it was whether it was touched in the field of play.
What the goal umpire is saying is that he definitely touched and wanted to make sure it was in the field of play. As far as the ARC goes, as you said, they check both whether it was touched and if it was whether it was touched in the field of play.
Exactly correct, if he did not think it was touched he would have called a goal and asked to confirm that it wasn't touch or was touched over the line.
The truth of the situation doesn't suit those wanting to make it a debate.
What the goal umpire is saying is that he definitely touched and wanted to make sure it was in the field of play. As far as the ARC goes, as you said, they check both whether it was touched and if it was whether it was touched in the field of play.
No problems, however Marchbank didn't have to come out afterwards and say that he thought it went through and was goal and that he might have cost Carlton the game etc. Just STFU mate and say nothing other than "I definitely touch it and the ump called it that way". Some of these players aren't the sharpest tools in the shed.
Did Marchbank really say that?
I thought Marchbank comment was that he touched it but he thought it was perhaps over the line already, the question was never if he touched it but which side of the line it was touched on.
Well I was wearing my brand new glasses and had perfect position on the couch. I was absolutely sure the ball was touched before crossing the line. Eos. 😇
Had Marchbank no been interfered with, he probably would have marked that.
I thought Marchbank comment was that he touched it but he thought it was perhaps over the line already, the question was never if he touched it but which side of the line it was touched on.
Does he say what hand or part of the body he touched it with?
Does he say what hand or part of the body he touched it with?
He said the ball touched his fingertips, on the left hand I believe. I don't think Marchbank ever doubted he touched the ball, I think his doubt and uncertainty was around whether the umpire would recognise the touch, and whether justice would prevail.
https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;sa=tmpattach;attach=post_tmp_324_2c0d5fa5892d09ebf4556ad080a796c5;topic=6539
(https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6539.0;attach=1389)
@DJC Obviously an AI fabrication, quick check with ChatGPT, how could it possibly be TDK flies while Gawn is left watching on? ;D
Did Marchbank really say that?
I read this:
Marchbank told ABC Radio post-match he was adamant he had touched the shot, even if replays raised doubts about whether it actually touched his fingertips.
“I turned around and thought, “Please touch this, please touch this”. Fortunately I did and the umpire called it. It was nice. The crowd was going so crazy so I didn’t know if they called it a point or a goal.
“My heart stopped, I thought they kicked a goal and I thought I just cost us the game but they called it the other way and here we are.”Asked where he touched the ball he said: “On the fingertips but I was just hoping for anywhere. It was heart-in-mouth stuff. I was just hoping it would go in my favour.”
Its the bold bit that caught my eye. Having read it all again, I guess he starts with that he touched it.
I just watched the last two minutes again and both Pitto and the King were heavily involved.
Acres exit kick went down the line and the King got to the marking contests and spoiled the ball out of bounds.
Pitto and Gawn contested the throw in and neither got the hitout. Acres cleared the ball back into the corridor where Hibberd and the King contested the mark. The ball went to ground for a ball up.
Pitto and Gawn contested the ball up, Pitto got the hitout but the ball went to Langdon. He was tackled and another ball up ensued.
Pitto and Gawn contested the ball up, Pitto got the hitout but the ball bobbled around before it was kicked to the wing.
Pitto collected a loose ball after Charlie contested the mark. He handpassed to Charlie and the ball was knocked out of bounds by Acres.
Pitto ran hard to get to the next marking contest inside 50 and attempted a spoil from the front of the pack (Kemp got the spoil).
Melbourne got another inside 50 and the King spoiled the contest (as per the photograph above).
Both players were instrumental in denying Melbourne scoring opportunities. The King's athleticism enabled him to get to marking contests and effect spoils or stop Melbourne marking. Pitto neutralised Gawn in ruck contests where a decisive hitout and clearance could have changed the result.
The acres kick to TDK was the one i was referencing previously. Not sure how much was acres poor kicking (a huge bugbear of mine) or how much was TDK not getting to the contest (ie being blocked in getting there) but i thought TDK was the intended target.
No mention of the dropped TDK mark in there somewhere?
As for the photo, credit to TDK for the spoil, i didn't have a freeze frame image to see which one of the 73 players got their hand on it though. Honestly cannot remember a bigger pack.
The acres kick to TDK was the one i was referencing previously. Not sure how much was acres poor kicking (a huge bugbear of mine) or how much was TDK not getting to the contest (ie being blocked in getting there) but i thought TDK was the intended target.
No mention of the dropped TDK mark in there somewhere?
As for the photo, credit to TDK for the spoil, i didn't have a freeze frame image to see which one of the 73 players got their hand on it though. Honestly cannot remember a bigger pack.
The Acres kick wasn’t intended to go where it did. Kemp spoke about kicks down the corridor not being part of the plan and that kick went as high as it went long. I don’t like the term but it was a dump (or dumb) kick that could have cost us the game.
That was the mark the King didn’t hold but it was an incredible effort for him to get to the contest and stop Hibberd taking the mark.
I'm sure Melbourne wish a few of their forwards got almost marks that stopped Weitering, Kemp and Newman from intercepting.
The Acres kick wasn’t intended to go where it did. Kemp spoke about kicks down the corridor not being part of the plan and that kick went as high as it went long. I don’t like the term but it was a dump (or dumb) kick that could have cost us the game.
That was the mark the King didn’t hold but it was an incredible effort for him to get to the contest and stop Hibberd taking the mark.
OK, we are talking about different kicks.
Acres had one that sprayed into the middle.
Acres also had one that went long down the line that TDK got a fist on. May have been just outside the last 2 minutes.
OK, we are talking about different kicks.
Acres had one that sprayed into the middle.
Acres also had one that went long down the line that TDK got a fist on. May have been just outside the last 2 minutes.
Acres’ kick down the line was the one that De Koning made up 20m to effect the spoil and get the ball out of bounds. That’s the first contest I referred to.
https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;sa=tmpattach;attach=post_tmp_324_2c0d5fa5892d09ebf4556ad080a796c5;topic=6539
That’s one of his efforts that I commended, one of those non stats that add up to be critical to success.
I think earlier this year it wouldn’t have happened…
That’s one of his efforts that I commended, one of those non stats that add up to be critical to success.
I think earlier this year it wouldn’t have happened…
It probably wouldn't have happened when the ruck is a solo because late in games they run out of legs, and no a D-Grade relief doing 5 minutes here or there is not the same as having a 4-qtr fulltime 1st ruck partner.
It's the combination of rucks that compliment each other that is providing the flexibility, there is no pressure for one player to be all over the ground for the bulk of the match, they can setup and rotate in a way that best suits them and get the time on the bench needed to rest.
Some fans talk about Pitto being off the ground as a sign of a negative, it isn't, it's the rotation that allows Pitto to keep up with a bloke like Gawn, if Pitto had to stay out there with Gawn he'd be cooked, it's also the rotation that allows TDK to run deep right to the very end of the game.
Also, perhaps a bigger plus, we no longer have a single point of failure.
As a Blues fan, we should be use to listening to and watching broadcasts where the bulk of the commentary is against us, anyone who watched the launch of the new book documenting the 70s would confirm that when the media took Balme's perspective over Southby, ask @ElwoodBlues1 and @Lods what they think of Balme! ;o
Don't start me on Balme !!!
He is obviously a very good adminstrator in his later years but he was one of the dirtiest pricks to ever play the game in the 70's. When he took out Big Nick every Carlton fan went nuts, they nearly jumped the fence when he cleaned up Southby. I was a young lad back then but it was incidents like those that truly galvanised the Cartlon throng and turned them into a major force who insisted we win mega premierships as a payback.
Don't start me on Balme !!!
He is obviously a very good adminstrator in his later years but he was one of the dirtiest pricks to ever play the game in the 70's. When he took out Big Nick every Carlton fan went nuts, they nearly jumped the fence when he cleaned up Southby. I was a young lad back then but it was incidents like those that truly galvanised the Cartlon throng and turned them into a major force who insisted we win mega premierships as a payback.
Lawrie Fowler took out Big Nick.
That's the only time I've ever witnessed an MCG crowd in stunned silence.
Don't start me on Balme !!!
He is obviously a very good adminstrator in his later years but he was one of the dirtiest pricks to ever play the game in the 70's.
Mal Brown says hello!
It probably wouldn't have happened when the ruck is a solo because late in games they run out of legs, and no a D-Grade relief doing 5 minutes here or there is not the same as having a 4-qtr fulltime 1st ruck partner.
It's the combination of rucks that compliment each other that is providing the flexibility, there is no pressure for one player to be all over the ground for the bulk of the match, they can setup and rotate in a way that best suits them and get the time on the bench needed to rest.
Some fans talk about Pitto being off the ground as a sign of a negative, it isn't, it's the rotation that allows Pitto to keep up with a bloke like Gawn, if Pitto had to stay out there with Gawn he'd be cooked, it's also the rotation that allows TDK to run deep right to the very end of the game.
Also, perhaps a bigger plus, we no longer have a single point of failure.
In terms of ruckwork, in terms of keeping rucks fresh....no, of course its not a negative.
However, in terms of the rest of the team, its a negative.
If you want to keep ruckwork even fresher, have 4 of them on the bench. Your ruckwork will imrpove dramatically and Gawn will never be able to keep up. However, the trade off is that the rest of the team has to pick up the slack. Whether its 4 rucks, or 2 rucks, the rest of the team has to compensate for that luxury.
Every man and his dog tells us that the ruckwork itself means little to the overall contest of the game......but at the same time they want to add 2 of them? Now either its important or its not? If its not, why do you need 2??
However, in terms of the rest of the team, its a negative.
It's only a negative if the 1st ruck on the field can't go with him, otherwise it's just another man on man match up and has no penalty to the rest of the team.
When one 1st ruck starts running off others, it's a big issue, because others have to start minding extra numbers and they fatigue.
It's only a negative if the 1st ruck on the field can't go with him, otherwise it's just another man on man match up and has no penalty to the rest of the team.
When one 1st ruck starts running off others, it's a big issue, because others have to start minding extra numbers and they fatigue.
Swing and a miss. Try again.
Its not about the rucks. Its about the 20-21 other blokes who will have more influence on the game.
Swing and a miss. Try again.
Its not about the rucks. Its about the 20-21 other blokes who will have more influence on the game.
You're trying hard, but the rucks resting, whether it is a solo ruck or a pretend ruck the bench time works out about the same.
Your claim infers the 2nd ruck or pretend ruck can magically rotate through the ruck and still be available to give a teammate a chop in the usual position as a HFF or KPD, but that is yet another fantasy. Sure they can still act as a backup, but they won't be in the general D50 or F50 rotations because they are committed elsewhere.
You're trying hard, but the rucks resting, whether it is a solo ruck or a pretend ruck the bench time works out about the same.
Your claim infers the 2nd ruck or pretend ruck can magically rotate through the ruck and still be available to give a teammate a chop in the usual position as a HFF or KPD, but that is yet another fantasy. Sure they can still act as a backup, but they won't be in the general D50 or F50 rotations because they are committed elsewhere.
Yet another fantasy, but Jack Silvagni has done it plenty of times....and he's not the only one.
Picking a player who is already on the ground to give a chopout in the ruck, means that whereever that 2nd ruck is, that is the bench more often than not, an alternative player is...ie an extra midfielder.
So yes, #1 ruck would ruck more than normal, and would get less bench time.
Yes, that backup ruck would spend some time in the ruck instead of forward for the whole game.
But....the rest of the players on the team would get more rest because there is an extra rotation for them.
Mate, its not a difficult concept.
Go look at afl tables. Pick any game with 2 rucks. See how much TOG they have.
Now go look at another game with 1 ruck, see how much TOG they have....and their backup has.
The difference between the 2 is the extra bench time given to another player/midfielder........as well as another actual midfielder playing.
Yet another fantasy, but Jack Silvagni has done it plenty of times....and he's not the only one.
Really, care to tell us a game and when?
The truth is quite different from your assertions, when Silvagni rucked he spent between 18% and 23% of time off the ground, not all that much different from the injured Pitto last weekend! ;)
(https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6539.0;attach=1397)
I'm obviously a SoJ hater, so I'll admit the fraud and confess by posting a comparison between SoJ and TDK exposing my folly.
(https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6539.0;attach=1399)
Surely that can't be right, there is bugger all difference when we know "the fact is" when SoJ rucks he can double down and still offer the regular F50 rotations!
If you going to make grand claims @Kruddler, it's best you check the stats actually support your claim first! ;)
Hang on sorry I've may have made another mistake, it's a huge error, I forgot SoJ can bend time! ;D
So please explain why you have failed to identify which games we have 1 ruck, 2 rucks etc. Which games a player was subbed out.
You've just posted a list of numbers with no context.
Respond in the other thread.
Yep.
There's two other threads to discuss this in.
TDK or the Pittonet thread.
Move the discussion over to one of those.
Respond in the other thread.
So we get it, you are special, you are the only one permitted to post this stuff wherever you like, are we not even allowed to respond to your posts in context, just where you tell us to?
It's probably a genuine request that we just use the relevant threads...as long as everyone abides by that. ;)
Over the years we've had some subjects 'infiltrating' different threads and derailing the main topic.
When that happens it makes it really difficult to follow the arguments...especially when we have multiple threads making the same arguments.
Folks can get a little upset when they make an 'on-topic' post and look for a response, only to see it overwhelmed by an 'off-topic' subject.
A couple of posts isn't too much of an issue but when it becomes the main topic of an unrelated thread it can cause a problem.
It's often happened with discussion about coaches, Pagan and Malthouse in particular.
It's cost us posters, both through leaving in frustration and banning.
The ruck argument is being hotly debated.
It's probably timely to just step back and have a think before posting in the relevant thread.