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Topic: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs (Read 2839 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #180
Whether you post it or somebody else! ;D

You know the debate. We were 'beaten in the ruck' thats why we lost the stoppages. It was Pittonets fault.

Except....when it was the total opposite. Ruck stats clearly show that.
FWIW, Pittonet beat him around the ground too, but that wasn't the argument.

 

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #181
You can talk til you’re blue in the face about how well we did and how the Dogs lost their bundle the week before to lose their lead and on and on.

The fact is we had complete control of the game and we blew it - we could not, again, temper their bombardment, not even once. We did not give one whimper, just let them go and stood and watched, twice we didn’t stand on the mark - I’ve never played or coaches AFL but I know that is a basic thing that should be done.  Not sure what the problem is but leadership seems to be number 1. Fitness. Smarts.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #182
"The Blues were pinned down in their back half when Adam Saad gave away two free kicks. Saad first pushed Lachie McNeil in the back and then caught Lachie Hunter high as the Dogs’ ballwinner swivelled and leant in with his head to draw the high contact 35m from goal. Nice set shot from Hunter to slot his second major."

niether of them were free kicks!!!  dogs got a lot of iffy frees early, which we weathered.  what we couldnt weather, was the "monstering" (as someone on here put it) at stoppages.  some of it was sheer brilliance by Bont, Mccrae and Treloar, but some of it was down to our blokes being tackled before they had the footy, and blocked off the footy etc.

in the Sun, the article next to this one is Bevvo complaining about Bont's deliberate out of bounds (which was a terrible call) - the article also mentions the Dogs have had the least frees against this year.   they certainly seemed to get away with a bit against us.  as a few on here have pointed out - we never complain about this stuff in the media.  Bevvo does, and they get away with a bit more on field... coincidence?

I thought the frees were there and we would have wanted them paid if it was our players but that wasnt why  we lost...those two goals wouldnt have been a factor if Jack and Fogarty had kicked those easy ones and the Bont wasnt allowed that easy mark in the goalsquare. Saad had a bit of a shocker and wasnt his usual switched on self, he had been manned up all day to stop his run and I would have moved him onto a wing.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #183
twice we didn’t stand on the mark - I’ve never played or coaches AFL but I know that is a basic thing that should be done.
I can remember one time which was highlighted by the commentary team.....and i think that was smart.

It was basically 10m out, nobody stood the mark.
As a result the player starts walking in from 20m out and walks right up to the 10m mark (which once he passes is called play on!) and thats what he did, walked passed it and the umpire called play on.
Watching all this happening was Eddie Betts, right as the play on call occurred he was in full sprint mode to get to the kicker.
Now it didn't work, he got the kick away and the goal, but it was close. For something that was a gimme goal, i found it an interesting tactic.....and i think it was just that, a tactic, rather than someone forgetting.

On other occassions i've noticed players fall back from the mark (not standing on the mark) and that gives them the freedom to move sideways (as long as they are '5m' behind the mark.) and actually puts more pressure on the kicker as a result.
Again, this is a tactic and something we've done at least a handful of times.

So maybe don't be so quick to point the finger. ;)

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #184
You can talk til you’re blue in the face about how well we did and how the Dogs lost their bundle the week before to lose their lead and on and on.

The fact is we had complete control of the game and we blew it - we could not, again, temper their bombardment, not even once. We did not give one whimper, just let them go and stood and watched, twice we didn’t stand on the mark - I’ve never played or coaches AFL but I know that is a basic thing that should be done.  Not sure what the problem is but leadership seems to be number 1. Fitness. Smarts.

I thought Pitto, Cuningham and Ed were just about our only mids!
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #185
I thought Pitto, Cuningham and Ed were just about our only mids!
Ed has been consistent all season and Cuningham has played a couple of decent games in a row, jury still out on him but he
has some weapons in terms of pace and being able to kick goals and lets hope he can stay fit and interested.
I'm going to agree with Krud on Pittonet and I dont get the negative waves about his game, I thought he won the ruck, was handy
in the clearances getting his frame in the play and had a good game as you alluded too.
He isnt going to be the next Dean Cox but given he was a cheap moneyball solution from the Box Hill Hawks in the main he has earned his money unlike a few more highly paid imports who have been in the news on this forum lately.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #186
I can remember one time which was highlighted by the commentary team.....and i think that was smart.

It was basically 10m out, nobody stood the mark.
As a result the player starts walking in from 20m out and walks right up to the 10m mark (which once he passes is called play on!) and thats what he did, walked passed it and the umpire called play on.
Watching all this happening was Eddie Betts, right as the play on call occurred he was in full sprint mode to get to the kicker.
Now it didn't work, he got the kick away and the goal, but it was close. For something that was a gimme goal, i found it an interesting tactic.....and i think it was just that, a tactic, rather than someone forgetting.

On other occassions i've noticed players fall back from the mark (not standing on the mark) and that gives them the freedom to move sideways (as long as they are '5m' behind the mark.) and actually puts more pressure on the kicker as a result.
Again, this is a tactic and something we've done at least a handful of times.

So maybe don't be so quick to point the finger. ;)

Got me thinking...
With the 'stand still' rule... Is there an advantage to not standing the mark in a forward defensive situation...when the opposition has the ball deep in your attacking zone?
You wouldn't do it all the time.
You would think you're leaving yourself wide open and that may very well be the case (almost certainly)  but...

It gives the player with the ball a few things to think about.
Does he play through the mark?
Where is the mark?
When does he bounce?
You have an extra player ahead of the ball with freedom of movement.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #187
Ed has been consistent all season and Cuningham has played a couple of decent games in a row, jury still out on him but he
has some weapons in terms of pace and being able to kick goals and lets hope he can stay fit and interested.
I'm going to agree with Krud on Pittonet and I dont get the negative waves about his game likewise, I thought he won the ruck, was handy
in the clearances getting his frame in the play and had a good game as you alluded too.
He isnt going to be the next Dean Cox but given he was a cheap moneyball solution from the Box Hill Hawks in the main he has earned his money unlike a few more highly paid imports who have been in the news on this forum lately.

Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #188
Since you guys are so good at using stats to back up your argument
Here is mine
He basically played around the ground on ball with some stints up forward
As we know he is the best kick in the team
9 score involvements when you get only 12 possessions is amazing
Here is the bit you blokes conveniently don’t bring up
In the last quarter Cuningham like most in the team played 100% in defence
2 possessions
Not one tackle
When the pressure was on like always with him he went missing
For a guy in his 6 th year it ain’t good enough

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #189
Since you guys are so good at using stats to back up your argument
Here is mine
He basically played around the ground on ball with some stints up forward
As we know he is the best kick in the team
9 score involvements when you get only 12 possessions is amazing
Here is the bit you blokes conveniently don’t bring up
In the last quarter Cuningham like most in the team played 100% in defence
2 possessions
Not one tackle
When the pressure was on like always with him he went missing
For a guy in his 6 th year it ain’t good enough


You know who else got 2 possessions in the last quarter.....Captain Cripps.
For a guy who is captain, that is CLEARLY not good enough.

The whole team was crape in the last, using that to justify your argument (if it is indeed based on stats or just your opinion) doesn't make him look bad, it makes him look like the rest of the team.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #190
Got me thinking...
With the 'stand still' rule... Is there an advantage to not standing the mark in a forward defensive situation...when the opposition has the ball deep in your attacking zone?
You wouldn't do it all the time.
You would think you're leaving yourself wide open and that may very well be the case (almost certainly)  but...

It gives the player with the ball a few things to think about.
Does he play through the mark?
Where is the mark?
When does he bounce?
You have an extra player ahead of the ball with freedom of movement.

It has been done, re not standing the mark, but standing 5m back from it. It is mainly utilised when the player has the ball close to the boundary. They stand back 5m and at the 45. Essentially chopping off the inboard 45 kick, forcing them to go long down the line, or switch it across goal.

Same thing happens when a player is having a shot from about 50-55....again, when on an angle. It stops the player looping around to get some extra distance and cuts off the 45 inside.

There are actually a lot of tactics that have been trialled in certain circumstances that the average joe either doesn't realise or misinterprets what is actually happening.

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #191
Ed has been consistent all season and Cuningham has played a couple of decent games in a row, jury still out on him but he
has some weapons in terms of pace and being able to kick goals and lets hope he can stay fit and interested.
I'm going to agree with Krud on Pittonet and I dont get the negative waves about his game, I thought he won the ruck, was handy
in the clearances getting his frame in the play and had a good game as you alluded too.
He isnt going to be the next Dean Cox but given he was a cheap moneyball solution from the Box Hill Hawks in the main he has earned his money unlike a few more highly paid imports who have been in the news on this forum lately.

You blokes are easily please with Cunners calling his game decent.
2017 - 16th
2018 - Wooden Spoon
2019 - 16th
2020 - dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021 - Pi$$ or get off the pot

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #192
You know the debate. We were 'beaten in the ruck' thats why we lost the stoppages. It was Pittonets fault.

Except....when it was the total opposite. Ruck stats clearly show that.
FWIW, Pittonet beat him around the ground too, but that wasn't the argument.

Funny, I thought their kid jumped him early and had him rattled and beat him, when the clearances were pretty even.  Later, I thought Pitto got it together and about broke even - and that’s when we got creamed in the clearances!

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #193
I can remember one time which was highlighted by the commentary team.....and i think that was smart.

It was basically 10m out, nobody stood the mark.
As a result the player starts walking in from 20m out and walks right up to the 10m mark (which once he passes is called play on!) and thats what he did, walked passed it and the umpire called play on.
Watching all this happening was Eddie Betts, right as the play on call occurred he was in full sprint mode to get to the kicker.
Now it didn't work, he got the kick away and the goal, but it was close. For something that was a gimme goal, i found it an interesting tactic.....and i think it was just that, a tactic, rather than someone forgetting.

On other occassions i've noticed players fall back from the mark (not standing on the mark) and that gives them the freedom to move sideways (as long as they are '5m' behind the mark.) and actually puts more pressure on the kicker as a result.
Again, this is a tactic and something we've done at least a handful of times.

So maybe don't be so quick to point the finger. ;)

Yeah, I didn’t get the comm box going nuts over standing the mark.  He was 10m out, standing he mar wasn’t going to make much difference.   I didn’t pick up what you mentioned about Eddie - but it makes sense - may as well roll the dice and see if you can do something different with an almost certain goal

Re: Post Game Analysis: AFL 2021 Rd 8: Carlton vs Western Bulldogs

Reply #194
Funny, I thought their kid jumped him early and had him rattled and beat him, when the clearances were pretty even.  Later, I thought Pitto got it together and about broke even - and that’s when we got creamed in the clearances!

Seems about right to me.

Coming up against a new kid, you have to learn on the job. You don't really know what he is going to do because you haven't played against him yet. Limited video to study. Wing it.

Once you get some idea on how he plays, then you work out how to beat him....and beat him he did. Unfortunately the other 3 blokes around him went MIA all at the same time. Cripps and Williams having their worst games for the year, if not their career.