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Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #255 –
Quote
The Waite one was just ridiculous, the umpires voice can be heard stating something like,

"He tried to kick it!"

Since when does a failed attempt constitute a legitimate disposal?

Yep that was a shocker, the ump was trying to make excuses for Rance!
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #256 –
Quote from: Mav on
Zed, it all comes down to whether the player with the ball had a prior opportunity.  If not, then no free kick is paid if he makes a genuine attempt to dispose of it legally. 

With the Waite/Rance one, the umpire's comment that he made an attempt means the umpire thought Rance had no prior opportunity.  Umpires can't be expected to deliver full reasons in the manner of judges.  They use key words.
That said, I reckon the umpire got that one wrong.  Rance tried to break the tackle when he was held by the wrist and took a couple of steps instead of immediately kicking.  But it was debatable.

They got that one wrong I reckon......but we did get the evener up when Walks was pinged for holding the ball up near the goals & then the umps called play on, we tackled, took possession, took it down the wing & eventually Judd slotted a goal after a great Waite handball.  That was sweet.  I bet the Tiges supporters were still screaming about the play on call when the ball went over the goal umpire !!!

Life is pain....... anyone who says differently is selling something.

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #257 –
Quote from: malo on
Quote from: Mav on
Zed, it all comes down to whether the player with the ball had a prior opportunity.  If not, then no free kick is paid if he makes a genuine attempt to dispose of it legally. 

With the Waite/Rance one, the umpire's comment that he made an attempt means the umpire thought Rance had no prior opportunity.  Umpires can't be expected to deliver full reasons in the manner of judges.  They use key words.
That said, I reckon the umpire got that one wrong.  Rance tried to break the tackle when he was held by the wrist and took a couple of steps instead of immediately kicking.  But it was debatable.

They got that one wrong I reckon......but we did get the evener up when Walks was pinged for holding the ball up near the goals & then the umps called play on, we tackled, took possession, took it down the wing & eventually Judd slotted a goal after a great Waite handball.  That was sweet.  I bet the Tiges supporters were still screaming about the play on call when the ball went over the goal umpire !!!

That was the most excited I have seen Juddy get after scorinmg a goal. Sweet to watch.
2024... Moir of the same to come

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #258 –
Quote from: malo on
I bet the Tiges supporters were still screaming about the play on call when the ball went over the goal umpire !!!

The play on call was fine, you see that happen regularly and at finals pace the umpire has only a split second to decide. The player took the ball and ran forward of the mark within 20m of goal, what choice does the umpire have?

But I have not seen a decision like the Waite / Rance decision for the whole season. Rance took control of the ball, ran a couple of steps, had his arm grabbed by Waite as he either went to handball or fend off. Did almost a full 360 with Waite securing his arm, threw the ball away and did not get a foot on it! All of this in clear view of two senior experienced AFL umpires, no pack surrounding them, no player traffic hiding the event.

That Rance decision cannot be an accident and I do not blame the umpires, it must be a deliberate emphasis on favoring the ball carrier. I have no problem with this, as long as everyone knows that is the situation before play starts.

I have a real problem with rules seemingly varying widely on a game by game basis without any prior warning or announcement.
The Force Awakens!

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #259 –
Quote from: LP on
I have a real problem with rules seemingly varying widely on a game by game basis without any prior warning or announcement.

The whole holding the ball 'rule'/saga (and its varied & shady interpretations) has brought the game (furtheri) into disrepute.

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #260 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Zed on
* 4th qtr, Murphy lays an awesome tackle on Big Ivan (thought some said Murphy can't and won't tackle??).

Sort of makes you wonder WTF he's been doing all year.

Examples have been shown where a clear drop off occurred in his performance and he has been steadily building his game back over the past six or so weeks.  As the season has gone on one of two things can occur.  You get worse, or you get better.  Murphy is getting better.  Perhaps had he been going in all guns blazing all season trying to do what his body would not let him, he would be broken and unable to give us anything now.

Which would you prefer?

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/players/M/Marc_Murphy.html

He has clearly hit form since about 5 weeks ago, and although its down on his best footy, its some of the best footy he has been able to give us all season.  Sunday was his best game he has played since the game against Melbourne, and he looked proppy a week later against the Saints.

I dont believe in coincidences, but it indicates that he carried an issue from that game onwards.

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #261 –
Quote from: Thryleon on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Zed on
* 4th qtr, Murphy lays an awesome tackle on Big Ivan (thought some said Murphy can't and won't tackle??).

Sort of makes you wonder WTF he's been doing all year.

Examples have been shown where a clear drop off occurred in his performance and he has been steadily building his game back over the past six or so weeks.  As the season has gone on one of two things can occur.  You get worse, or you get better.  Murphy is getting better.  Perhaps had he been going in all guns blazing all season trying to do what his body would not let him, he would be broken and unable to give us anything now.

Which would you prefer?

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/players/M/Marc_Murphy.html

He has clearly hit form since about 5 weeks ago, and although its down on his best footy, its some of the best footy he has been able to give us all season.  Sunday was his best game he has played since the game against Melbourne, and he looked proppy a week later against the Saints.

I dont believe in coincidences, but it indicates that he carried an issue from that game onwards.
Good stats there Thry.  By memory he had an interrupted (or late start to) pre season and then had the broken cheek.  Do these stats line up with the return from the break (cheek)?
Excuses year 1, blame year 2, contract extention year 3........

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #262 –
Quote from: Goat on
Quote from: Thryleon on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Zed on
* 4th qtr, Murphy lays an awesome tackle on Big Ivan (thought some said Murphy can't and won't tackle??).

Sort of makes you wonder WTF he's been doing all year.

Examples have been shown where a clear drop off occurred in his performance and he has been steadily building his game back over the past six or so weeks.  As the season has gone on one of two things can occur.  You get worse, or you get better.  Murphy is getting better.  Perhaps had he been going in all guns blazing all season trying to do what his body would not let him, he would be broken and unable to give us anything now.

Which would you prefer?

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/players/M/Marc_Murphy.html

He has clearly hit form since about 5 weeks ago, and although its down on his best footy, its some of the best footy he has been able to give us all season.  Sunday was his best game he has played since the game against Melbourne, and he looked proppy a week later against the Saints.

I dont believe in coincidences, but it indicates that he carried an issue from that game onwards.
Good stats there Thry.  By memory he had an interrupted (or late start to) pre season and then had the broken cheek.  Do these stats line up with the return from the break (cheek)?

If you scroll down to the table, it shows the round in which the game was played immediately after the opponents name.   He had a fairly flat middle of the season with only 2 games being particularly good.  One against Port which he spent majority of the game playing forward.  The other against the Bombers.  He was pretty good against the Lions in between those games, and then broke the cheek bone.

The others he was at worst servicable with some games being better than average, but still no where near as good as his last 5 or 6 weeks.  Make of that what you will, but you could argue that Sunday was his best game of the year quite convincingly and even then its been one of the few that he has been able to give us 4 quarters of good footy.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #263 –
Quote from: Thryleon on
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Quote from: Zed on
* 4th qtr, Murphy lays an awesome tackle on Big Ivan (thought some said Murphy can't and won't tackle??).

Sort of makes you wonder WTF he's been doing all year.

Examples have been shown where a clear drop off occurred in his performance and he has been steadily building his game back over the past six or so weeks.  As the season has gone on one of two things can occur.  You get worse, or you get better.  Murphy is getting better.  Perhaps had he been going in all guns blazing all season trying to do what his body would not let him, he would be broken and unable to give us anything now.

Which would you prefer?

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/players/M/Marc_Murphy.html

He has clearly hit form since about 5 weeks ago, and although its down on his best footy, its some of the best footy he has been able to give us all season.  Sunday was his best game he has played since the game against Melbourne, and he looked proppy a week later against the Saints.

I dont believe in coincidences, but it indicates that he carried an issue from that game onwards.

I was talking about tackling blokes, not general form.

All players carry injuries throughout the year, we were led to beleive he was on one leg, he definitely aint on one leg. Kudos to him for stepping up when we needed him most. His ability to get the ball when no other Carlton player could on Sunday was important early on.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #264 –
Murphy's fractured cheekbone was more serious than I thought:

Quote
Murphy and Hodge had their eyes firmly fixed on the ball at Etihad Stadium in round 12 when the heavy clash forced Murphy from the field with concussion and a fractured cheekbone. He was taken to hospital and expected to miss up to a month.

The incident could not have come at a worse time for the tough midfielder, for he had just had 31 disposals against Essendon and rediscovered his groove. This came on top of a restrictive right knee, operated on over summer, which has reduced him to one training session a week.

Surgery to repair the cheekbone meant he was unable to eat properly, living on what he said on Monday was a diet of protein shakes and mushy food.

As the surgery was in a delicate spot, he could not lift weights, for fear it would affect the alignment of his jaw.


Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/murphy-lost-3kg-after-cheek-break-20130909-2tgd2.html#ixzz2eSH9AlAv

He has done exceptionally well to get back into decent form, particularly with his limited training. 
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #265 –
He's had what you might call a character building year has Murph!
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #266 –
Just watched it again, you can hear victory with every second half goal!

Kaching, EFC out!

Kaching, Pies out!

Kaching, Nthmond out!

Kaching, Carlton into 6th!

Four in a row, jackpot!
The Force Awakens!

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #267 –
Quote from: raven on
Quote from: LP on
I have a real problem with rules seemingly varying widely on a game by game basis without any prior warning or announcement.

The whole holding the ball 'rule'/saga (and its varied & shady interpretations) has brought the game (furtheri) into disrepute.

Holding the ball, and the incorrect disposal rule for mine.
Malthouse alluded to it at one stage earlier in the year, there is a trend amongst tacklers to tie at least one of the arms up, and blokes are opting to just drop the ball cold when this happens rather than try and make genuine attempts to "legally" dispose of the ball. The umpires seem to be ignoring the incorrect disposal. It's almost as if the AFL is trying to reduce the impact of tackling within the game.

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #268 –
@Deags
Equally annoying Deags is the trend now for a bloke about to be tackled to immediately duck his head and try for a high contact free kick - drives me nuts and we can thank the Selwood family for that one. In fact it should be called "going for a Selwood".

IMO ducking the head should be actively discouraged as it is just as likely to result in a head injury as laying a high tackle.
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: ELIMINATION FINAL : Ninth Beats Ninthmond (Ha Ha Ha Ending)

Reply #269 –
Agree Cookie.
Ducking the head should be play on. It is in other "tackling" codes. But then again in other tackling codes it isn't high contact if the tacklers arm slips upwards after contact is made either. I think at the moment the AFL is caught in no-man's land with regards to tackling. They need to either change the rules to reward and encourage tackling, ie no ducking, no high contact if first contact was fair and the arm bounces or slips upwards, holding/incorrect disposal of the ball (you could potentially also look at the tackling around the legs rule as well)... Or look to do away with it by taking impact out of tackling and make it really a "tying up the ball" type of exercise.