CV and mad panic behaviour

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Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #705 – July 03, 2020, 01:04:29 pm

Quote from: Thryleon on July 03, 2020, 11:53:17 am

Using my education as a case study, in most lectures I went to, females to male ratios were at least 20 to 1, yet most females working in IT are actually promoted faster. That means that not only is the industry biased towards promoting females, they are also hiring them quicker. Thats discrimination. Its ignored, because we have to correct it apparently. Thing is, by being sexist, we are being sexist. That is the actual ill. Not whom we are being sexist against.

Whingers are winner Thry, and generally racism has very little to do with discrimination or deliberate bias, although I appreciate racism or sexism is often the publicly broadcast reason/excuse for explaining away a rejection. it has to be that way I suppose, or else they arrive at the conclusion they are just second rate at whatever position they tried to apply for!

In your industry it's particularly relevant, because there are 10x as many male job applicants rejected for every position, yet we do not usually here them discussing sexism! Yet we are ear-wormed by the media and feminists about equal representation. btw., I see the same in science, industry and education, ironically the education situation is apparently inverse with a shortage of males in the industry.

But we have to be careful, because terms like racism and sexism are plastic, and are frequently re-framed to suit the debate!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #706 – July 03, 2020, 01:27:18 pm

It’s useful to look at History because it provides a background to subsequent events.
The Australian indigenous culture is one of the oldest (if not the oldest) continuing ‘unaffected’ cultures in the world. Unaffected, that is until European settlement. Some aspects of this are that (from all evidence) tribal groups were relatively small. They were mostly nomadic. There is some evidence of permanent settlement but things like houses, strong fortified walls, castles and cities weren’t part of the landscape. As a result there were also no large armies, kings or emperors. There was no great battles involving armies of tens or hundreds of thousands of ‘soldiers’. There appears to have been no strong unifying figure who ‘united the tribes’ and built an empire as occurred in other parts of the world. No doubt there would have been tribal conflicts but that would usually have resulted in the losing side simply moving to another area. The ‘unity’ of the Indigenous Australian is a relatively modern idea but that unity has given a voice and strength to fighting for recognition of past injustices and improvements.
If we look at other areas of colonization we see a similarity. In the USA the most obvious similarity occurs not with the African Americans, whose ancestors were forcibly brought to the country, but with the native American. It’s the same with the native South Americans ‘invaded’ by the Spanish and Portuguese. Conflict, domination and particularly disease had a devastating effect on all these populations. The indigenous population of Australia dropped by about 80-90% in the first 100 years of European settlement.
A significant difference between the Australian/North American experience and colonization elsewhere in the world is that in places like Africa and India/South East Asia the colonist population never grew to the extent where they greatly outnumbered the indigenous population. As a result these countries have mostly now reverted to control by original inhabitants, albeit still with some ‘tribal’ conflict in places.
So we have a situation in Australia where for tens of thousands of years the population was pretty much unaffected by a large invader impacting greatly on their culture. Contrast that with Britain who over a period of around 1500 years were under constant threat. Romans, Vikings, Saxons, Normans all invaded and imposed changes to the native population. Even in subsequent years there was always the threat of invasion. Around the early 1800s when our young colony was finding its feet, ‘back home’ there was a threat from Napoleonic France. Communication was slow. The next ship coming into Port Jackson may have been a French warship or a ship carrying news that the ‘home country’ had fallen.
It wasn’t just a British thing. The borders of Europe were constantly shifting. It may not excuse the attitude of conquest and colonization but it does explain why these things happened (Conquer or be conquered) and it’s not just a White European thing either. Invasion, domination (and associated atrocities) were committed across the Middle and Far East. Religion played a huge part and the damage done in the name of a ‘God or Gods of choice’ is profound.
The point of all this…World history is exactly that raw. Every racial group has probably at some time experienced invasion and damage to their culture. Take the Irish for example…Racism, massacres dispossession and transported half-way around the world in great numbers.
For some nations ‘invasion’ has been a factor in the development of their own bias, hatreds and the way they operated as time went on, yet for some it’s also resulted in an enrichment, modernization and an improved way of life. For the European it’s old history but it’s history that shapes the various nationalities. For the indigenous Australian the injustices all seem relatively ‘new’ especially as they’ve found a unity and voice over the last 50 years or so and there are prejudices that still need to be fought. The important thing is we all learn from the past, acknowledge past mistakes and injustices but give greater emphasis to a future of advancement, fairness and equality of opportunity for all.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #707 – July 03, 2020, 01:36:15 pm

Yes good points Lods, but I don't weight written history over archaeology.

Archaeology might actually be exposing a lot of what is written about history as bullcrap!

I agree, we have to move forward, we all have to move forward.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #708 – July 03, 2020, 01:58:41 pm

Moving forward can only occur with a proper acknowledgment of the past, and genuine attempts to redress significant imbalances in society. You can't move forward by simply forgetting, ignoring history or sweeping things under the carpet.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #709 – July 03, 2020, 02:21:20 pm

Quote from: PaulP on July 03, 2020, 01:58:41 pm

Moving forward can only occur with a proper acknowledgment of the past, and genuine attempts to redress significant imbalances in society. You can't move forward by simply forgetting, ignoring history or sweeping things under the carpet.

Absolutely. 'Those who ignore history are deemed to repeat it' as the saying goes. I actually see much in the world that is addressing and seeking to change the injustices and inequities of the past. And that aint easy. Humans don't like change.

We are actually living through a kind of multi-level revolution which will take generations. As it took generations for women to get the right to vote - seems extraordinary, doesn't it, that less than 100 years ago women in the US did not have the right to vote... in fact go back to circa 1790 and beyond in the US and only white, wealthy males had the right to vote as was the case in many parts of the world... so there has been significant progress, which needs to earnestly continue as horrendous injustice does still occur. Sheesh, here in Oz the White Australia Policy was only officially done away with in the early 70s!!! It's gonna take time but we're heading in the right direction though the road be rocky and often difficult and painful.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #710 – July 03, 2020, 02:30:24 pm

Quote from: Baggers on July 03, 2020, 02:21:20 pm

Absolutely. 'Those who ignore history are deemed to repeat it' as the saying goes. I actually see much in the world that is addressing and seeking to change the injustices and inequities of the past. And that aint easy. Humans don't like change.

We are actually living through a kind of multi-level revolution which will take generations. As it took generations for women to get the right to vote - seems extraordinary, doesn't it, that less than 100 years ago women in the US did not have the right to vote... in fact go back to circa 1790 and beyond in the US and only white, wealthy males had the right to vote as was the case in many parts of the world... so there has been significant progress, which needs to earnestly continue as horrendous injustice does still occur. Sheesh, here in Oz the White Australia Policy was only officially done away with in the early 70s!!! It's gonna take time but we're heading in the right direction though the road be rocky and often difficult and painful.

Fred Craddock once said the longest trip any human will ever make is the trip from the head to the heart. Practicing what you preach is extremely difficult.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #711 – July 03, 2020, 03:41:55 pm

Quote from: Baggers on July 03, 2020, 02:21:20 pm

Sheesh, here in Oz the White Australia Policy was only officially done away with in the early 70s!!! It's gonna take time but we're heading in the right direction though the road be rocky and often difficult and painful.

Yet, global modern societies elected "The Donald", and also surrendered long term control to the likes of Putin and Xi.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #712 – July 03, 2020, 04:33:13 pm

@ PaulP @Lods @Thry @Baggers @LP
Some seriously insightful posts, thanks for sharing. But my point stands and I cannot take someone like Winmar seriously anymore when he refers to people as "white fellas", sorry I just cant its simply appalling. It's hypocritical, derogatory, racist and only hurts the people he is in fact trying to protect and fight for, not to mention giving the uneducated haters more ammunition. If youre gonna fight for change, do it properly FFS or you'll be considered as just another money grabber (which is how I view Winmar today).

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #713 – July 03, 2020, 04:58:17 pm

Quote from: Gointocarlton on July 03, 2020, 04:33:13 pm

@ PaulP @Lods @Thry @Baggers @LP
Some seriously insightful posts, thanks for sharing. But my point stands and I cannot take someone like Winmar seriously anymore when he refers to people as "white fellas", sorry I just cant its simply appalling. It's hypocritical, derogatory, racist and only hurts the people he is in fact trying to protect and fight for, not to mention giving the uneducated haters more ammunition. If youre gonna fight for change, do it properly FFS or you'll be considered as just another money grabber (which is how I view Winmar today).

Agree, I dont really understand the "white fella" lingo either, I believe Winmar that he was making reference to his skin colour and being proud of what he had achieved and no problem with that and that Newman and crew were wrong but that language only fans the flames and makes it a "us against them" situation and thats not going to win the war against racism.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #714 – July 03, 2020, 06:52:51 pm

Quote from: LP on July 03, 2020, 03:41:55 pm

Yet, global modern societies elected "The Donald", and also surrendered long term control to the likes of Putin and Xi.

The orange weazel is a gift to the US, demonstrating to them very clearly how stuffed their election system is and how useless their impeachment stuff is... though it did work against Nixon.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #715 – July 03, 2020, 07:07:50 pm

I don't mind being called a "white fella" or even a "honky" for that matter.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #716 – July 03, 2020, 07:14:51 pm

Quote from: cookie2 on July 03, 2020, 07:07:50 pm

I don't mind being called a "white fella" or even a "honky" for that matter.

Me neither, but it really depends on who is calling me those names, my relationship with them, context, the way the words are delivered etc. It is also easier to dismiss those jibes when you are part of the majority culture.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #717 – July 03, 2020, 07:35:13 pm

Quote from: PaulP on July 03, 2020, 07:14:51 pm

Me neither, but it really depends on who is calling me those names, my relationship with them, context, the way the words are delivered etc. It is also easier to dismiss those jibes when you are part of the majority culture.

I don't mind who does it tbh. I don't take offence easily. Also, I am used to spending time in the minority at various times in my life.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #718 – July 03, 2020, 07:49:05 pm

Quote from: cookie2 on July 03, 2020, 07:07:50 pm

I don't mind being called a "white fella" or even a "honky" for that matter.

Very topical, some uni mates and I do a weekly zoom catch up and were discussing a Love Thy Neighbour video from the series all those years ago. It was deemed comedy at the, so inappropriate.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #719 – July 03, 2020, 07:51:19 pm

Quote from: cookie2 on July 03, 2020, 07:07:50 pm

I don't mind being called a "white fella" or even a "honky" for that matter.

So I can refer to Aboriginal person as Black Fella? I would be labelled racist for sure, its totally inappropriate I reckon.