Carlton Supporters Club

There is some value for the drug companies to go the early crow, but if they do, and it ends up going pear-shaped, they may miss the vaccine bus all together as they try to re-prove their product.

There are supposedly 100+ formulations in the pipeline, and someone(s) is going to make a s***load of money out of this.

Of note, CSL have yesterday commenced full-scale production of the Oxford/AstraZeneca formulation, with the University of Queensland formula not far behind.  The idea is they will ramp up production and have product manufactured early in 2021, with the (expected) outcome that one or both of the vaccines is effective.  If a vaccine doesn't work, or isn't safe, it the product will be poured down the sink. A gamble, but one which will put us 3-6 months ahead of the usual process.

Assuming the Oxford or UofQ vaccine gets the thumbs up, we will be lucky enough to have doses ready by Feb-Mar.  Probably frontline workers first, followed by vulnerable populations.

Sars-CoV-2 is a seriously complex viral infection, it affects many organs with the main short term issue being the lungs. But liver, kidney, heart are all affected, and there are signs that eyes, brain and nervous system might also be targets of infection. It is not trivial to determine what is a direct effect and what is a side-effect, these things take time, years in fact.

It looks like there are many potential drugs to treat it, either as a prophylaxis or as a remedy, it appears almost none of them work broadly to claim Sars-CoV-2 won't infect or have some side-effect on some part of your body. The main successful push appears to be one of developing managements, in effect stop it doing the really bad stuff in the short term to give your own body the time to fight the infection.

So the best defence is still not get it in the first place, there are no miracle cures.

Social distancing is king, do not go where crowds are unless you have to, and when you do wearing masks should be compulsory, they do not stop you getting it and the people around you without masks should be considered your enemy stay further away. Which includes Donald Trump, because masks do greatly reduce you giving an infection to somebody else, treat people without masks as contagious, treat them like they are zombies, give and request a wide birth from them!

Things could continue like this for several years, claims we will return to normal sooner than later are likely to be very very premature!

A calculated risk that given the circumstances has to be taken IMO.

Some quality propaganda there LP. Gotta keep up the fear right....

Off the bat, why is it called SARC COV-2? Because it shares so much in common with SARS COV-1 - it really is not 'novel' at all.

There is no science to support the proposition the SARS COV2 has any more long term harmful effects than any other significant respiratory illness that overwhelms your immune system (if you let it). Zero.

There is also overwhelming evidence that there are several very cheap and highly effective treatments (if given early - pre hospitalisation - who would have thought to treat an illness early!) readily available but largely shunned by the powers that be - and the money machines that are Big Pharma.

Masks? Again, zero evidence that there is one iota of benefit to an otherwise healthy person wearing a mask. Zero. And a lot of evidence that wearing said masks can be, and are, harmful.

It is self evident now (even if not back in March) that COVID19 is a very mild illness in the scale of pandemics over recent millenia. Indeed, in the scale of all things that kill us.

It's mortality rate continues to fall, suggesting the current mutation(s) are relatively benign (which again is the norm for these viruses).

A good read here by a very well respected Brit - https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-nine-worst-covid-19-biases

Good luck with that.

Some quality propaganda there LP. Gotta keep up the fear right....

Off the bat, why is it called SARC COV-2? Because it shares so much in common with SARS COV-1 - it really is not 'novel' at all.

There is no science to support the proposition the SARS COV2 has any more long term harmful effects than any other significant respiratory illness that overwhelms your immune system (if you let it). Zero.

There is also overwhelming evidence that there are several very cheap and highly effective treatments (if given early - pre hospitalisation - who would have thought to treat an illness early!) readily available but largely shunned by the powers that be - and the money machines that are Big Pharma.

Masks? Again, zero evidence that there is one iota of benefit to an otherwise healthy person wearing a mask. Zero. And a lot of evidence that wearing said masks can be, and are, harmful.

And heck, aren't we compelled to social distance any way?

It is self evident now (even if not back in March) that COVID19 is a very mild illness in the scale of pandemics over recent millenia. Indeed, in the scale of all things that kill us.

It's mortality rate continues to fall, suggesting the current mutation(s) are relatively benign (which again is the norm for these viruses).

The so called second waves in Europe and the US - nothing but casedemics. and that's there's something of a rise as Europe/US moves into winter just shows the seasonality of the bug.

A good read here by a very well respected Brit - https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-nine-worst-covid-19-biases

That we have to 'test, test, test' to even be aware that there's an issue says it all really (note the absence of data on the false positive rate of the infamous Beijing PCR test here in Victoria nor the number of cycle thresholds, amplifications, they're running with any given test).

Sure Donald, never give up the fight, we get it.
Nice twist of terms, complex and novel are not interchangeable.
That is pretty much a straight out lie claiming the opposite of the growing evidence, and as such not worth discussing.
Want to name some, with the evidence linking the scientific study that isn't a distorted retrospective meta-data analysis conducted by dodgy profiteers or will you just go back to Surgisphere,...again, sure not ........HCQ, even Donald din't buy that one when he fell ill, or maybe he was given all those complex and speculative treatments against his free will?
But if you take a homepathic blend of GobSnobling you'll be completely impervious to the virus, as well as free to converse with Karens and Coreys everywhere!
The second wave data has exposed the exact opposite, and the death rate has settled into a fixed percentage of infections, science is closer to defining R₀ at a stable rate that results from all the prophylactic measures including early intervention, masks, social distancing, not in difference to them! Yet in denialist regions like the US the infections rates go through the roof, 135000 in one day in one Mid-West state, after all the various break-outs to protest the election that must have been coincidence!
Ironic isn't it? Cherry-picking some of the "Types of Bias" and applying them selectively is actually one of the types of bias described, quite bizarre. One in all in!

Pot calling the kettle black.

Honestly?

We have no real data to show anything conclusive.  Long term affects???  8 months ago we had no idea what was happening.    Long term isnt 8 months.

Australia as a collective has seen all of 30 000 cases.

For a country over 20 million people, that is NOTHING.

Its not a large enough sample size to prove anything, and the timeline hasnt gone on long enough to prove anything.

Remember back in June when everyone said, lets open up, and the Andrews government warned about doing too much too soon??

Well, they did too much too soon, and then we ended up with rising infections (with or without knowledge of what that means).

Then we locked down, and despite everyone stating lockdowns dont work, in this case, it appears it actually did.  We still dont know what that means moving forward, but prevention is better than cure, and no one can tell me that this is misinformation or propaganda.

Pot calling the kettle black.

Honestly?

We have no real data to show anything conclusive.  Long term affects???  8 months ago we had no idea what was happening.    Long term isnt 8 months.

Australia as a collective has seen all of 30 000 cases.

For a country over 20 million people, that is NOTHING.

Its not a large enough sample size to prove anything, and the timeline hasnt gone on long enough to prove anything.

Remember back in June when everyone said, lets open up, and the Andrews government warned about doing too much too soon??

Well, they did too much too soon, and then we ended up with rising infections (with or without knowledge of what that means).

Then we locked down, and despite everyone stating lockdowns dont work, in this case, it appears it actually did.  We still dont know what that means moving forward, but prevention is better than cure, and no one can tell me that this is misinformation or propaganda.