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Topic: CV and mad panic behaviour (Read 438723 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5206 –
On a personal level, I left this forum for various reasons, and have returned for my own reasons too which Im not going to go too heavily into here, but I can see that people continue to see things through their own myopic lenses, rather than looking at the bigger picture here.

The standard you walk past is the one you are willing to accept.

No jab no job, is an abysmal way to run things, and on a societal level, we need to think really hard about what we are doing to people.  From a health service perspective, they cannot have un vaccinated employees running around the place either so it becomes a real conundrum and simply mandating it shows a government that is out of touch with its society, and anyone advocating no jab no job, should take a really good hard look at themselves. 

When you start to resemble certain dictatorships that have occurred throughout history, it sets a really dangerous precedent for society as a whole.  I have not been a fan of people and their opinions on these subjects for the last couple of months. 

What I see playing out publically is downright appalling.  Many of these people are acting in misguided ways to achieve whatever goals they are trying to, but I struggle to see any real common sense in any of this stuff.

Vicpol, to serve and protect.  That includes democratic rights of the populace you are employed by.

The tradies have not covered themselves in glory (the attack on the journalists abhorrent to say the least) kicking dogs, ridiculous, and defending the indefensible.  Its downright outrageous and Ive had a gutful.  We are in the midst of a pandemic and its bloody serious, and people are too busy being weaponised by political motivations, and not fighting simply for their rights.  Stop being tools.

Finally, victorian and federal government.  This petty and draconian approach to shutting down conversations is ridiculous and actually welcomes the exact reaction you are fighting against.  Have the conversations, and dont let the media drive it.  Ive heard more information about all subjects covid by comedians on the ABC than I have from accredited doctors and politicians.  Where are the think tank discussions broadcast on TV that go in depth about the precise modelling you are basing your restrictions on?  Why isnt there more information out there, encouraging people to seek medical advise regarding the vaccine and NOT TO FOLLOW FING SOCIAL MEDIA!!!

I have similarly had enough of people claiming a lot about everything.  Simple equation.  You have questions about vaccination?  go talk to health professionals.  Get your answers, and then determine the appropriate course of action.  The government have absolutely not provided any real information to people here about the vaccines, their manufacture, where they get.  If you have to go searching to find it, you have stuffed this up. 

Really really shocked that we have descended to the general level of lunacy that i see perpetuated as truths these days across society and have had a gutful of all the politicised rhetoric I hear.  This is serious, or its crap, but either way, treat the public with the respect they deserve.

RANT OVER.


"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5207 –
A guy I work with just got a call from his wife saying their doctor vaccinated their 8 year old daughter.  His wife asked if she was too young but the doctor said that she is old enough. The doctor called her half an hour later saying they made a mistake and they have to make some calls and she might have to go to hospital for monitoring.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5208 –
Thanks for the welcome back I have missed the place, and have spent significant time post operation at home, so it shows just how serious I was about having a break. 
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5209 –
Good to see you back Thry.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5210 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 on
https://www.fwc.gov.au/documents/decisionssigned/html/2021fwcfb6015.htm?fbclid=IwAR2KXUD0eLLC7cn7HX0d9MtLJDE6HiZagLoForUJHjeVIblHZyd3wQrDdm0

Interesting test case regarding the firing of a admin worker at a nursing home for vaccination refusal....
What you fail to point out is that the comments you quoted were by the dissenting member. The majority ruled against the worker’s appeal and therefore ruled that the mandate was enforceable. They also lashed her crapulent “medical experts”. Surely you aren’t a believer that the minority rules?

More specifically, I hope you aren’t against the mandate in the health industry. As you point out, the lot of Nurses isn’t easy and eliminating the worry about unvaccinated co-workers increasing the risk to others is at least one thing we can do to make their lot more bearable.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5211 –
Welcome back Thry. :)

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5212 –
I think it's perfectly reasonable that certain careers require certain minimum standards and qualifications. For example, if you look after the aged or vulnerable then I think it's fair you should be well trained and vaccinated to prevent harm to your charges.

to me part of the problem is this gross generalisations, no vaccine doesn't mean "not any job", unless it is globally applied. It doesn't have to be globally applied but it's the lazy way to police the policy, so that is what happens on the basis that we are all equal, but all are not equal and never will be, all being equal is a logical fallacy.

For example, in the construction industry, there are jobs that hardly see someone come within 10m of someone else all day, and that permit the sterilisation of your work environment between shifts, like many drivers or plant operators like those on cranes or forks. So no vaccination no job is not globally applicable, but you then have to accept such positions might be limited, so by the very nature of the job, all is not equal.

I've a friend who's daughter highlights some of the hypocrisy of the vaccination choice / anti-vaccination movement. Historically she is anti-vaccination, and she is now pregnant and refuses to be vaccinated out of concerns for the baby. But she has told her family, parents, siblings and cousins, they cannot visit her unless they are vaccinated against both COVID and Whooping Cough. How long must they obey this inequality, forever and ever and ever?
The Force Awakens!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5213 –
    I agree we should listen to the doctors. And they prescribe mandatory vaccinations for healthcare workers:
Quote
1. Position
The RACGP:
  • supports mandatory COVID-19 vaccination for healthcare workers
  • proposes this requirement includes general practitioners (GPs), practice nurses, reception staff and other members of the practice team undertaking patient facing roles as appropriate
  • highlights the potential benefits of widespread vaccination amongst healthcare workers, including:
  • protection of healthcare workers, who by nature of their work and interaction with the community are at greater risk of contracting COVID-19
  • reduced transmission of COVID-19 from healthcare workers to patients and other team members
  • reducing disruption to health services when healthcare workers are infected with COVID-19
  • considers that vaccination of healthcare workers supports the medical profession’s duty of care and builds vaccine confidence in the community.
https://www.racgp.org.au/advocacy/position-statements/view-all-position-statements/clinical-and-practice-management/mandatory-covid-19-vaccination-healthcare-workers[/list]

Apologies for the problems with the bullets: bullets 4-6 are supposed to be indented, but that’s beyond me.
 

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5215 –
Quote from: Mav on
What you fail to point out is that the comments you quoted were by the dissenting member. The majority ruled against the worker’s appeal and therefore ruled that the mandate was enforceable. They also lashed her crapulent “medical experts”. Surely you aren’t a believer that the minority rules?

More specifically, I hope you aren’t against the mandate in the health industry. As you point out, the lot of Nurses isn’t easy and eliminating the worry about unvaccinated co-workers increasing the risk to others is at least one thing we can do to make their lot more bearable.
My daughter is a vaxed RN, three of her friends who are senior RNs with specialities are not vaxed and you want to fire them and  replace them with what? How many lives is that going to cost, there needs to be a way to still employ highly skilled nurses unvaxed and not have them leave the job.
I don't want a mandate that sacks highly skilled staff replaces them with div2 enrolled trainees from parts unknown looking for an easy way to get to get residency and burns the remaining skilled nurses who have to cover for them....there is enough of that happening already.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5216 –
Quote from: Thryleon on
Thanks for the welcome back I have missed the place, and have spent significant time post operation at home, so it shows just how serious I was about having a break. 

Welcome home, 3 Leos. I trust all in hospital went well and you'll soon be fit and dangerous.

As I've mentioned before, from a mental health/psychological viewpoint, never underestimate the power of human fear. Something politicians and others in positions of power know and capitalise on to manipulate others to their own selfish, personal benefit. But many of us get sucked into these games and divisiveness. Fear becomes an incredible motivator and creates all manner of biases and ignorances. Also breeds intolerance. To a large extent fear has its roots in something known as 'death anxiety.' Prof Sheldon Solomon has been providing heavily researched material on this phenomenon for almost 50 years. Crudely summarised, with human consciousness comes the awareness of self, including the awareness that each one of us will die. Many folks, vulnerable to this fear, live in denial and become victim to all manner of unhealthy avoidances and manipulations.

Already many, many folks who've had the jab (or two) are developing a class distinction from those who haven't, for whatever reason. Remember, there are plenty of folks who do not get the jab due to health/legitimate reasons.

Already many businesses are telling other businesses they deal with that they will not allow unvaccinated sales people to enter their premises. HR execs throughout the country, indeed many parts of the world, are now grappling with this. A pub in Sydney put up a sign saying they happily accept unvaccinated people... only to be boycotted by vaccinated people whose numbers are far greater - almost sent them broke.

This will be a social and moral dilemma to play out over the coming months and sadly, will be hijacked by politicians and extremist media to peddle their own divisive, exclusive agenda. Troubling times.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5217 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 on
My daughter is a vaxed RN, three of her friends who are senior RNs with specialities are not vaxed and you want to fire them and  replace them with what? How many lives is that going to cost, there needs to be a way to still employ highly skilled nurses unvaxed and not have them leave the job.
I don't want a mandate that sacks highly skilled staff replaces them with div2 enrolled trainees from parts unknown looking for an easy way to get to get residency and burns the remaining skilled nurses who have to cover for them....there is enough of that happening already.
Chances are they won’t be fired as they’ll vaccinate. They’ve found in the US that staff were happy to talk tough with pollsters but few followed through. The higher the qualifications, the more difficult it is to walk away.

And if a few unvaccinated walk away, the benefits outweigh the costs.

By the way, let’s not lose sight of the fact that this is not just a Victorian policy. It’s just about in force in NSW and WA is doing the same. And it’ll be hard for unvaccinated nurses to travel overseas to ply their trade if they can’t get on planes or get through immigration if they’re not vaccinated.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5218 –
Quote from: Mav on
Chances are they won’t be fired as they’ll vaccinate. They’ve found in the US that staff were happy to talk tough with pollsters but few followed through. The higher the qualifications, the more difficult it is to walk away.

And if a few unvaccinated walk away, the benefits outweigh the costs.

By the way, let’s not lose sight of the fact that this is not just a Victorian policy. It’s just about in force in NSW and WA is doing the same. And it’ll be hard for unvaccinated nurses to travel overseas to ply their trade if they can’t get on planes or get through immigration if they’re not vaccinated.
My information is that unvaxed FT permanent nurses will be placed on unpaid leave and not fired as its illegal under Fair Work conditions.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #5219 –
So why were you raising the concern about firings?