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Topic: Worst Leaders in the AFL! (Read 138126 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #90 –
At present across all Carlton online forums, rightly or wrongly, Marc Murphy is copping a heap of flack, mainly in relation to his leadership credentials. This is not an easy subject to dissect as most Blues supporters are fully supportive of Marc Murphy as a player, but they may not be as supportive of him as captain believing that he is not the right person for the job due to being uninspiring, too quiet and lacking in genuine leadership skills.

He came to the club as a highly talented #1 draft pick, has played some brilliant football after walking into the team immediately. On the flipside, some people believe that he hasn't taken his game up to another level like most elite players do when they get into that peak 26-30 age bracket.

The club awarded him the captaincy after Judd as he was the next in line as vice-captain. Many would argue that there wasn't a long list of captaincy options and it would of been a tough gig to take especially when you had to play in the team with Judd still there.

Having said that, when you compare him to some of the other team leaders in the competition (Selwood, Hodge, Cotchin etc), there is a stark difference in persona & presence to Murphy which may be one of the reasons that his leadership is being questioned right now.

Therefore, are the supporters right about this and if so, what should the club do about it ??

Or, is he the right man for the job and everyone should get behind our man ??

For mine, I would find it difficult to stand down a captain if they haven't transgressed to such an extent that they have brought the club into disrepute. On the flipside, sometimes you make decisions that seemed right at the time but further down the track prove to be flawed and steps have to be taken to rectify the situation.

Maybe there should be an indepth review to ascertain how much he really wants the job because I feel that he may have been a reluctant recipient initially. If that was the case, then the club could announce that the captaincy is affecting his overall onfield output and make a change, even if it is a short-term one, and then look at who may be the next best coming through the ranks.

I can see both sides of the argument here, he is a ripper player but maybe the captaincy role is too much of a burden for him right now ??
"The Other Teams Can Rot In Hell"

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #91 –
Quote from: ItsOurTime on
Every now and again the foot soldiers will stand up for their captain and other leaders but they'd do that under Ratten when they felt like it too. There still isn't that tight everyone look after each other group we so desperately need.

Agree. If it's not in people's nature they just won't do it.
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #92 –
Quote from: TheSheik on
The club awarded him the captaincy after Judd as he was the next in line as vice-captain. Many would argue that there wasn't a long list of captaincy options and it would of been a tough gig to take especially when you had to play in the team with Judd still there.

I think the club wanted to find a new captain so that Judd could / would extend his career, Malthouse said as much even before his first day on the job!

I think one of the better things our club could do is get a spread of players through the captains / leadership roles.

What other clubs have changed captain in recent years while the old captain plays on, Hawthorn, Swans, Brisbane anybody else?
The Force Awakens!
 

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #93 –
@Sheik

How did the Hawks handle the Mitchell to Hodge transfer? That would seem to me a good case study. Mitchell is an excellent player but it was said at the time that Hodge was the spiritual leader of the team and seemed to get the captaincy via force of popular sentiment.
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #94 –
Quote from: cookie2 on
@Sheik

How did the Hawks handle the Mitchell to Hodge transfer? That would seem to me a good case study. Mitchell is an excellent player but it was said at the time that Hodge was the spiritual leader of the team and seemed to get the captaincy via force of popular sentiment.

Subjectively I'd say Carrazzo is our spiritual leader, but he makes too many mistakes and like Simpson he is too old to get the job now!

Next in line if they can make him accountable, Buckley maybe or perhaps even Yarran!

If he could get a regular game Armfield would be right at the top of the list, he reminds me of Scotland in the 1/4 time huddles.

Down the track, Cripps looks another likely type.

I think it is a bonus if you can have a Captain who is also a General, but it is not a requirement that the Captain is both!
The Force Awakens!

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #95 –
Buckley can't get a game, how is he going to be given the captaincy? Murphy is going to keep it until he's 30 or perhaps if we swap coaches.

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #96 –
Quote from: ItsOurTime on
Buckley can't get a game, how is he going to be given the captaincy? Murphy is going to keep it until he's 30 or perhaps if we swap coaches.

At VFL games it's obvious who talks and who listens, Rowe got the captaincy earlier but I can tell you at VFL games he's a church mouse!

We have very few voices in the huddles, lots of listeners. Judd was a church mouse who turned into Hercules at the bounce, but few have that capability.

The blokes I listed above, they have the attitude to step forward, and doing so may actually help their game. Not unlike Richie Vandenberg!
The Force Awakens!

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #97 –
Quote from: cookie2 on
@Sheik

How did the Hawks handle the Mitchell to Hodge transfer? That would seem to me a good case study. Mitchell is an excellent player but it was said at the time that Hodge was the spiritual leader of the team and seemed to get the captaincy via force of popular sentiment.

The Hawks handled it very well, there didn't appear to be a ripple of discontent and they went on from strength to strength.
"The Other Teams Can Rot In Hell"

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #98 –
Murphy was never captain material and the half wits that made him captain are even worse leaders. It comes from the top as the successful clubs are proof of.

The biggest issue is that we can't even name one person who should be captain or is a better choice than Murphy. That is the biggest issue with our group. Simpson etc should have been given the nod but were looked over by the half wits concerned only with membership etc. Success on field gets you memberships!!!!

With Hawthorn I think even Mitchell saw Hodge as the real captain even though he wasn't. It is often said Mitchell was the off field captain of the club and Hodge on field so it was always an easy transition. Credit has to go to Mitchell also.

For mine he has to see out this year otherwise you might ruin his confidence all together but there has to be a review at the end of this year and if he is deemed the leader of the group by the PLAYERS, no club appointed "captains" then so be it.

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #99 –
Quote from: Jean-Claude on
Murphy was never captain material and the half wits that made him captain are even worse leaders. It comes from the top as the successful clubs are proof of.

The biggest issue is that we can't even name one person who should be captain or is a better choice than Murphy. That is the biggest issue with our group. Simpson etc should have been given the nod but were looked over by the half wits concerned only with membership etc. Success on field gets you memberships!!!!

With Hawthorn I think even Mitchell saw Hodge as the real captain even though he wasn't. It is often said Mitchell was the off field captain of the club and Hodge on field so it was always an easy transition. Credit has to go to Mitchell also.

For mine he has to see out this year otherwise you might ruin his confidence all together but there has to be a review at the end of this year and if he is deemed the leader of the group by the PLAYERS, no club appointed "captains" then so be it.

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #100 –
@JC

Agree, the captain has to be the "spiritual leader" as far as the players are concerned and they have to be very comfortable with who that may be. Future options at CFC appear limited or a way off. I'm struggling to suggest anyone tbh - maybe if we change coaches the new coach will want to bring someone along with him?
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #101 –
Its interesting the image that a captain has....Murphy has all the credentials but not the persona or image..he is still seen very much as a young man
 who has trouble looking after himself much less others.

Hawks Hodge has the image and persona to go with the ability..he looks a man out there and carries himself like a leader unlike Murphy who has to try and create the look.

Lewis will be the next captain of Hawthorn and on first look he seems the part, good tough player, skilled smart etc etc...but have been told he doesnt have the Hodge ability
to get on with every player on the list and Hawthorn are working on this aspect of Lewis character...the good thing for the Hawks though is Lewis does agree he needs some work in this area to improve..
You dont have to be buddies with every player but every player has to respect you.....

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #102 –
I've borrowed this from another thread that KingKouta43 (Big Bad Bill) started....it's something I've talked about before.

Quote
When a young player comes to Carlton they don't seem to be protected as much as those teams consenting for a premiership.When a youngster goes to a contending club they are allowed to develop at a steady pace and have strong leadership around them that seems to bring out the best in those players.
I look at the "stars" at Carlton and think they are nothing compared to a Bartel, Hodge, Mitchell etc
We lack real character and heart and something else that is underrated in footy smarts.

The legacy of the Pagan years lives on.
After Pagans arrival , for various reasons there was a clean-out of our natural leadership.
Young players like Murphy, Gibbs and Kreuzer came to a club devoid of leadership.
Younger players who went to the Geelongs, Hawthorns and Sydneys at the same time had the guidance and protection of strong leaders.
Murphy was knocked stupid in his first few years and nobody raised an effort in his defence.

There seemed to be a bit of an improvement under Ratten
Judd made a slight difference but he was more a leader by example than a physical presence.
The first act of defiance I can actually remember from a Carlton player during this period was when Wiggins put a hit on a Judd tagger one game.

Our leaders have had no-one to learn from....and having let it slip to this stage it's hard to know how to fix it other than giving up some of our high draft picks for leaders from other clubs....but you're not going to get a combination of leadership and highly skilled players...they cost too much.

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #103 –
Watching the Crows carve up Norf, Tex Walker seems like an inspired selection as skipper.
IN WADA WE TRUST

Re: Worst Leaders in the AFL!

Reply #104 –
Quote from: Juddkreuzer on
Watching the Crows carve up Norf, Tex Walker seems like an inspired selection as skipper.

Thought exactly the same thing - be interesting to see how things work out longer term.
Reality always wins in the end.