Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

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Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #75 – September 04, 2020, 08:52:13 am

Quote from: Micky0 on September 04, 2020, 08:43:46 am

Things I was saying during the game last night were repeated by mainly Hodge a minute later; which means even I can see what we were doing wrong.

I think that just shows that we’ve run out of puff and don’t have the personnel to be a top team. The bad stuff was glaringly obvious so I have no doubt Teague knows exactly what needs improving.

We have just run out of steam and really considering cripps has not had a good season, we’ve probably done better than expected.

Was Kennedy injured? How come he wasn’t picked?

Having slept on it, I feel a lot more optimistic for next year. Let’s hope we get our players fit!

Still sucks that our season is over now, especially those of us in Vic who are enduring lockdown and it was at least giving us some joy.

Next year, we say that every year, "they will lift next year". I think we have peaked with this group, I cant take the next step. Probably finish the same position next year, the problems (inaccuracy and by default goalless qtrs, brain fades) still exist. I cant see how they will be fixed other than by bringing new personnel...again.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #76 – September 04, 2020, 08:56:57 am

Disagree. We have definitely improved from last year. Cripps has played sore all season, it’s been fast turnaround games etc.

I would like to see a huge jump by Samo next year. Martin is a gun. Harry’s marking was superb last night. When we pull it together, we look fantastic. Some of our plays this year, I couldn’t believe it was a Carlton team.

Need much much more out of Gov too - will be interesting to see where he ends

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #77 – September 04, 2020, 08:59:55 am

Quote from: Micky0 on September 04, 2020, 08:56:57 am

Disagree. We have definitely improved from last year. Cripps has played sore all season, it’s been fast turnaround games etc.

I would like to see a huge jump by Samo next year. Martin is a gun. Harry’s marking was superb last night. When we pull it together, we look fantastic. Some of our plays this year, I couldn’t believe it was a Carlton team.

Need much much more out of Gov too - will be interesting to see where he ends

I didnt say we havent improved, I am talking about taking the next step. Also selections were very bad. If you are expecting more from Samo and Gov, you are going to be disappointed.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #78 – September 04, 2020, 09:05:49 am

Last night they said GWS had kicked more in their last quarter than they had in the rest of their games, a number of time - I think that’s what I heard?

They have also been finalists for years and are a well drilled Cohesive team. Eg of Jones and Willo not knowing what the other was doing, will only improve.

Got to look at the positives, was so pissed at our capitulation last game and this one but playing experienced outfits so what can you expect.

Had we given ourselves just out of top 8 at beginning of year, I would’ve been happy with that.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #79 – September 04, 2020, 09:21:56 am

Can’t say we didn’t have opportunities

After quarter time, 42 F50 entries for one goal 😤 take those opportunities and they wouldn’t have come back!

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #80 – September 04, 2020, 09:23:10 am

What a strange game.

So frustrating because again we did so much right but couldn't get the job done and a finals spots goes begging.

Strange game.   GWS dominated the general play early, but kept us in it and somehow with 7 inside 50's we manage 4 goals.   We dominate the play for the next two quarters and extend our lead by 2 points.   We had many chances to put some scoreboard pressure on but left the door open.   Again for a 2nd week our pressure was good while it lasted.   I think next time we need to put a Carlton jumper on Nick Haynes to save time.   We picked him out so often.   Thought it was more our ball movement than his intercept marking, but he is elite in that area.   We still lack composure moving the ball inside 50 and I agree with the desire to add a mid that can play inside and out.   Zac Williams style. Again we won the contested ball and our clearance work was good.

Some tough calls need to be made by the MC in the coming games/weeks.   With finals gone it's time to rest a few and give a few younger guys games.

Walsh and Weiters were both awesome.

Betts fumbled and dropped chest marks.   It's important we keep him around the club, but it would be mad to offer him another year.   Our inability to bring the ball to ground deep inside 50 didn't help him or Fisher.

Setters was slow to start but finished with 9 contested possessions.   Building nicely.

Levi has gone from chocolates to boiled lollies.   The only part that has saved him is that he is more than a capable 2nd ruck.

Pitto was solid against Mummy. He has had 3 gettable set shots this year and really needs to start nailing them.   Needs to have more impact and hurt the oppostion on the scoreboard.   But wrapped with his output this season.

I thought the backline was fantastic as a general rule.   Jones is amazing with ball in flight.   Scary with ball in hand and cost us at least one goal and should have been two.   I really liked Willo's game.   Thought he was great and still developing.   Only played 29 games.   Just a baby.

I didn't think Polson did a lot wrong.   Yeah he didn't have a big influence on the games but a lot of the criticisms are unfounded.   Like last week.

Dow struggled.   IMO I would still give him games.   He was stronger around the contests than I previously remember, but struggled to spread and have a impact in general play.    The concern with Cripps, Setters, Dow and Kennedy we are a very one paced midfield.

SPS was a non event last night.   But again needs game time.

Big H.   9 marks and 3 contested. Hit the scoreboard for Christ sake.

McGovern was disappointing.   Got his hands to it inside 50 but couldn't hold onto them. Thought he worked pretty hard.

Cottrell looks a natural replacement for E.Curnow.   Needs to tidy up a few things.

All in all a lot of positives, however a lot of work to be done.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #81 – September 04, 2020, 09:34:08 am

What’s with Govs continuous too early leaping for the ball?

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #82 – September 04, 2020, 09:42:31 am

My takeouts from the game for what it's worth.
Betts - Why they haven't rested this bloke defies all logic. Regardless of his output last night one of the few who puts pressure on in F50 100% of the time. Feel sorry for him. They are flogging a dead horse.
Casboult - Has not played a good game since the club got fined for his family's COVID indiscretion. Seems like it doesn't take much for his head to go AWOL.
Cottrell - Very quiet. Maybe getting dropped for no reason affected him. God knows head cases seem to be common amongst this group.
Cripps - Match committee obviously thought we were a better chance of winning with him in the team. They were wrong .... AGAIN
Curnow - Same old same old. Put this blokes commitment into all the other useless C&%$s bodies and we would not lose a game.
Docherty - Actually think he got better as the game went on. Amongst our best.
Dow - They just need to play him now for the rest of the year just to see if he can get some touch or confidence. Not giving up on him yet.
Fisher - Quiet but he has some real skill and always looks dangerous when the ball is in his hands.
Jones - Played reasonably well but every time, and I mean every time he goes near the ball I s#!t myself.
Martin - Thought he was good. We are a better team with him in the side.
McGovern - Bloody hell, what a disaster this pick-up has been, Shows nothing. Gets a rare mark inside 50 and can't even make the distance.
McKay - Serious deficiencies in his kicking. Could be SO much better. Why can't we fix it? Even the goal he kicked in the first from 15m out directly in front JUST scrapped in FFS.
Murphy - No impact and maybe he gets a rest. Another who could have kicked a crucial goal at a crucial time and just stuffed it. Hard to understand his hesitation.
Newnes - Another quiet one. Still he competes and kicks the odd goal. Persist.
Petrevski-Seton - Pathetic. Soft, lazy and disinterested.
Pittonet - Did better than I thought he would to tell you the truth, but he just doesn't do enough around the ground and his kicking at goal is worse than Harry's.
Polson - Not nearly as bad as people make out and last night he was actually better than last week IMO. Like Dow, needs to be played for the rest of the year and if no MAJOR improvement delisted.
Sam Walsh - Another solid effort by the kid. showing up a lot of our more experienced players. If he doesn't win the B&F should get the most consistent (if we have one?)
Setterfield - You'd think being in reasonable form and playing against your old club you would turn it up a notch but he didn't and just had no influence.
Simpson - Needs to be rested with Eddie, but probably won't. No point in playing him any longer unless it's for a farewell game.
Weitering - Our best I thought. Should have the B&F wrapped up.
Williamson - No point in trying to defend this bloke. Get's bagged a lot but 1. One of the few GOOD LONG kicks in our team and 2. Is being played off half-back. Let’s play him on a wing and utilise his attributes

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #83 – September 04, 2020, 09:46:12 am

Quote from: Micky0 on September 04, 2020, 09:05:49 am

Last night they said GWS had kicked more in their last quarter than they had in the rest of their games, a number of time - I think that’s what I heard?

They have also been finalists for years and are a well drilled Cohesive team. Eg of Jones and Willo not knowing what the other was doing, will only improve.

Got to look at the positives, was so pissed at our capitulation last game and this one but playing experienced outfits so what can you expect.

Had we given ourselves just out of top 8 at beginning of year, I would’ve been happy with that.

And thats exactly what we have been conditioned to expect. Fark that, I wanted to make the 8. If you want to talk hypotheticals and told me at the start of the year we were going to just miss the 8, I would have said,hypothethetically, dont bother with the season then. I dont get that way of thinking. Again, not saying we havent improved, just saying the same issues/deficiencies exist.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #84 – September 04, 2020, 09:50:53 am

When Ross Lyon starts criticising your drop off in scoring you've got a problem.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkfDku2-wLE

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #85 – September 04, 2020, 10:38:58 am

Quote from: Gointocarlton on September 04, 2020, 09:46:12 am

And thats exactly what we have been conditioned to expect. Fark that, I wanted to make the 8. If you want to talk hypotheticals and told me at the start of the year we were going to just miss the 8, I would have said,hypothethetically, dont bother with the season then. I dont get that way of thinking. Again, not saying we havent improved, just saying the same issues/deficiencies exist.

I get what you’re saying and would’ve agreed last night - I’m sick to death of sitting on or near the bottom. Just trying to see some positive in what has been an all round crap year.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #86 – September 04, 2020, 10:45:20 am

So, in the cold heart of the next day, I can review a turning point of sorts.

Pittonet scores instead of hitting the post, and we blow the lead out to the largest of the match.

Does that do enough to break the GWS resolve and win us the game?

Maybe. we had plenty of opportunities up to that too.

Yesterday was yet another game that was riddled with positives and negatives all in one.

We have absolutely decreased our reliance on Cripps, which is probably the most positive thing to come out of this season. I noticed Setterfield getting in De Boers grill yesterday. Cripps really needed this as much as the team did.

Plenty of positives there to see.

Dont retire anyone too quickly. Sometimes players affect our team in ways we dont understand. Even McGovern who has been poor, has shown that we do better with him in than out as a unit.

Plowman too. Pittonet in his first full season has battled admirably. Will be interesting if he can start dominating games. Liam Jones was a bit of a chook raffle early on when he moved down back. Has developed into an admirable defender. Just goes to show, let them settle, build their confidence. We havent done much of that over the last few years.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #87 – September 04, 2020, 10:58:44 am

Quote from: Micky0 on September 04, 2020, 10:38:58 am

I get what you’re saying and would’ve agreed last night - I’m sick to death of sitting on or near the bottom. Just trying to see some positive in what has been an all round crap year.

I hear ya brother.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #88 – September 04, 2020, 11:00:15 am

We need to face the facts, we are frauds !!

Yes, that's right, frauds !!

We are not on the cusp of success, we are another 2-3 years away, we still need to "restructure" our playing list.

Last night's game confirmed a lot of things for me, the first being that our coaching panel definitely needs a revamp. Teague is new and still learning the caper but he needs some strong support around him.

The second is that we have a number of players in the the team who just aren't up to AFL standard and won't ever be.

Weitering & Walsh were superb and really cared. Williamson & Curnow tried hard and got belted around the body for it too. Outside of those chaps, the rest can GAGF !!!!

It is imperative that we find a replacement for Jones at CHB, he cost us two goals last night with his indecision and in a low-scoring match, that was the difference. Sure he punched hard from behind and took a hanger but that's not the only things we need from him. It's been a good experiment but we are not going to transform into a genuine contender with him constantly making so many costly errors.

McGovern .......... free to a good home, i'm over his lack of effort and skills.

McKay ......... if you can't kick for crap then you shouldn't be playing in the big league. It's one thing to take some strong marks but as a key forward, we expect you to kick at least 50% of your set shots. His kicking style is all wrong, he has a bent leg which means he doesn't get full distance or accuracy.

Docherty has become a liability too. He isn't the calm and assured player we normally expect, I'm not sure we can persist with him playing like this for too much longer.

Murphy got plenty of it but some of his disposal was woeful.

Cripps is a non-event, we'd be better of dropping him and letting some of the others have a go. I've nearly convinced myself that we should trade him to one of the WA clubs for two players & two first rounders.

Simpson has to retire, time is up.

Newnes, apart from that great chase & tackle, there wasn't a lot else.

Polson is just not up to it, let's stop with the charade.

Cottrell is Mitch Robbo-lite, his attack on the contest is terrific but his disposal is errant.

Pittonet cannot kick over a jam-tim !! He did beat Mummy in the ruck but he doesn't take marks around the ground nor kick goals, he is just filling a spot until we unearth someone better.

Betts ......... just retire !! I've had enough of the party tricks (eg. swinging the ball around his waist like a basketballer when he ran out of bounds), your job is to (a) stand up, not slip over & (b) kick some goals and you are failing on both accounts.

Dow is a bust, nice goal in the first but spent the rest of the game jogging around in a meaningless fashion. Trade him if he wants to go.

Casboult .......... what has happened to him ?? He's out of contract and did nothing to earn another one, if he gets an offer to jump ship just let him go.

Fisher tried valiantly but didn't have much impact.

Petrevski-Seton .............. I didn't even know he was playing until the third quarter, he's on the trade table.

Martin had that great chase & tackle but went downhill from there, I noticed he leans back on his kicks which makes his long shiots at goal drift to the left.

Setterfield was "so-so" mainly trying to handball his way out of trouble, I'm losing confidence in him by the week.

Do you think I'm angry ............ damn right I am.

I'm not advocating that we enter into another rebuild but we desperately need to address at least 8 of the players running around last night, we will never ever progress if we keep them on the playing list.

Re: Post Game Commiserations AFL 2020 Rd 15: Carlton vs GWS

Reply #89 – September 04, 2020, 11:02:59 am

Quote from: Thryleon on September 04, 2020, 10:45:20 am

So, in the cold heart of the next day, I can review a turning point of sorts.

Pittonet scores instead of hitting the post, and we blow the lead out to the largest of the match.

Does that do enough to break the GWS resolve and win us the game?

Maybe. we had plenty of opportunities up to that too.

Yesterday was yet another game that was riddled with positives and negatives all in one.

We have absolutely decreased our reliance on Cripps, which is probably the most positive thing to come out of this season. I noticed Setterfield getting in De Boers grill yesterday. Cripps really needed this as much as the team did.

Plenty of positives there to see.

Dont retire anyone too quickly. Sometimes players affect our team in ways we dont understand. Even McGovern who has been poor, has shown that we do better with him in than out as a unit.

Plowman too. Pittonet in his first full season has battled admirably. Will be interesting if he can start dominating games. Liam Jones was a bit of a chook raffle early on when he moved down back. Has developed into an admirable defender. Just goes to show, let them settle, build their confidence. We havent done much of that over the last few years.

Fair post Thry, I still reckon Eddie and Simmo in particular have run their race. They looked really old, I am not for a minute solely blaming them for the loss. I was surprised and nervous when Simmo went and stood Greene at the opening bounce. I cant recall if Simmo followed him up the ground but deep fwd, I thought that was a horrible match up early.