I'm going to the game again! Sei danket Gott! I have suffered terribly, missing 2 games I would usually be at with bells on.
Brisbane: played well for 3 quarters before capitulating totally. But they beaten us larely and I don't like it. Robbo has been trying to stir up the hatred and his form has been good.
Only problem I see is one we suffered from last week: do we have enough fit guys left to win?
We have had a couple of soooo gutsy wins this year, but, fair dinkum, we pay a price for them. I hope some of those guys can come up next week!
True we have been paying dearly for those wins, but isn't that what the pinnacle of a sport is all about?
I also think Bolton's team selection really says something, the requirement to bring your A game in terms of effort is uncompromising. He doesn't punish errors, but he smashes a lack of effort!
We don't play too well on six day breaks.
Well Murphy and Sumner will have seven day breaks - but can see this one being a struggle.. the boys give so much effort that six day break doesn't seem to be enough against a team on an extra day break.
Maybe rotate some players next week.. Sumner, Murphy, Graham, Jaksch, Buckley hoping will play
We don't play too well on six day breaks.
Well Murphy and Sumner will have seven day breaks - but can see this one being a struggle.. the boys give so much effort that six day break doesn't seem to be enough against a team on an extra day break.
Maybe rotate some players next week.. Sumner, Murphy, Graham, Jaksch, Buckley hoping will play
You can't drop anyone after that effort. If anyone misses it'll be because of injury, not 'rotations'.
Gorringe may be stiff but I'm thinking Casboult will be ready to resume ruck duties. Jaksch maybe in this week to play key forward. As bad luck as it would be for Gorringe it would be a better balanced side.
Any other changes would be forced. Hopefully not.
You can't drop anyone after that effort. If anyone misses it'll be because of injury, not 'rotations'.
I agree.
Gorringe may be stiff but I'm thinking Casboult will be ready to resume ruck duties. Jaksch maybe in this week to play key forward. As bad luck as it would be for Gorringe it would be a better balanced side.
Any other changes would be forced. Hopefully not.
Laj go easy, your obsessed with Casboult rucking.
Why the feck would we play the AFL's current most feared contested mark in a position that puts a bruised tibia at even greater risk?
BTW, Gorringe's mobility looked pretty good today, while his attack at the ball wasn't as good the end result was better than Jones was able to offer. I hope Jones was watching for the next time he gets a crack! I like the current setup, it lets Kreuzer stay around the ball longer and takes some stoppage pressure off Cripps. Kreuzer 11 tackles, and Casboult busting packs, that is what we want to see.
Laj go easy, your obsessed with Casboult rucking.
Why the feck would we play the AFL's current most feared contested mark in a position that puts a bruised tibia at even greater risk?
BTW, Gorringe's mobility looked pretty good today, while his attack at the ball wasn't as good the end result was better than Jones was able to offer. I hope Jones was watching for the next time he gets a crack! I like the current setup, it lets Kreuzer stay around the ball longer and takes some stoppage pressure off Cripps. Kreuzer 11 tackles, and Casboult busting packs, that is what we want to see.
What he said. I was a massive critic of Gorringe last week, my mate at the footy today said "give the guy a go ffs". Perhaps he's right, perhaps his confidence will grow and he will be ok. Lets give him a decent crack to show us what he's got. The structure looked really good today. Even 2 blokes down, we beat a very much more fancied opponent (albeit who a get a free ride from the umps and home ground advantage at KP).
We've seen from our perspective what a toxic environment does to players, way too often for my liking.
Gorringe has come out of what looks to be a pretty toxic environment, he may just need a little time to gain some confidence to set himself free. Today Casboult had 1AW and Everitt in form and Gorringe floating forward, it sets him free and makes our opposition second guess where the ball will go.
Gorringe moved OK, got to positions that forced Geelong to respect him even if he didn't get on the end of many. Maybe we lost out in the ruck, but the extra time SpecialK got to stay in there made up for it. As much as I liked Phillips form pre-hammy, I thought todays setup worked better against a Geelong side that lacked an experienced ruck option. For half a game they had to use Blicsavs as a tagger!
It may be that against say a Norp, Swans or Wet Toast well go with Kreuzer and Phillips combo to keep them honest. But today we could back SpecialK in and have Gorringe draw some forward heat.
Possibly Murph may need a rest depending on how he pulls up and we should bring in Grahame who's been playing well in the NBs?
Possibly Murph may need a rest depending on how he pulls up and we should bring in Grahame who's been playing well in the NBs?
With the NBs having a bye it will be interesting, I bet Buckley is spewing now about that suspension! ;)
They said Byrne was "Omitted" but I suspect he was sore, perhaps he comes in for either Murphy or Sumner.
With the NBs having a bye it will be interesting, I bet Buckley is spewing now about that suspension! ;)
They said Byrne was "Omitted" but I suspect he was sore, perhaps he comes in for either Murphy or Sumner.
Corked calf
We've seen from our perspective what a toxic environment does to players, way too often for my liking.
Gorringe has come out of what looks to be a pretty toxic environment, he may just need a little time to gain some confidence to set himself free. Today Casboult had 1AW and Everitt in form and Gorringe floating forward, it sets him free and makes our opposition second guess where the ball will go.
Gorringe moved OK, got to positions that forced Geelong to respect him even if he didn't get on the end of many. Maybe we lost out in the ruck, but the extra time SpecialK got to stay in there made up for it. As much as I liked Phillips form pre-hammy, I thought todays setup worked better against a Geelong side that lacked an experienced ruck option. For half a game they had to use Blicsavs as a tagger!
It may be that against say a Norp, Swans or Wet Toast well go with Kreuzer and Phillips combo to keep them honest. But today we could back SpecialK in and have Gorringe draw some forward heat.
They say Gorringe is a great runner.....thought he did very well.
Phillips will come back through the 2s in any event after that time on the sidelines?
Rockliff the only notable inclusion?
Player Injury Estimated Return
Harris Andrews Foot 2 weeks
Dayne Beams Knee Indefinite
Hugh Beasley Back 2 weeks
Rohan Bewick Groin Test
Michael Close Wrist and foot 2 weeks
Tom Cutler Shoulder Test
Cian Hanley Groin Indefinite
Jaden McGrath Foot Indefinite
Tom Rockliff Hamstring 1 week
Sam Skinner* Knee 2 weeks
Updated: Thursday, May 26
From 5 Talking Points:
5. Is the West-Martin partnership working?
Trent West has now played the past two matches working in partnership with Stefan Martin. Martin was noticeably quiet against the Hawks, finishing with just seven touches, while West had eight. In comparison, the Hawthorn Ceglar-McEvoy combination had a total of 29 disposals and three goals. Martin seemed frustrated at times playing in the forward 50, and with West more of a tap ruckman, rather than being dominant around the ground, it remains to be seen whether the duo is an effective partnership. With Carlton coming up next week, it will be interesting to see if Justin Leppitsch pursues with playing the two together.
Danger game? When was the last time those words were posted here?
Danger game? When was the last time those words were posted here?
Was thinking much the same.
Who gets Tom Bell? 2E?
Anyone who watched yesterdays match between the Lions & Hawks saw that the Lions are an under-rated side. They easily matched it for 3/4's but for some unexplainable reason and in complete contrast to what they were doing with monotonous regularity, started to make poor decisions and skills errors in the last and the Hawks capitalised on it.
If they rekindle that same attack & attitude as they had in the first 3/4's against the Hawks next week against us, this one will be no snack at all.
Anyone who watched yesterdays match between the Lions & Hawks saw that the Lions are an under-rated side. They easily matched it for 3/4's but for some unexplainable reason and in complete contrast to what they were doing with monotonous regularity, started to make poor decisions and skills errors in the last and the Hawks capitalised on it.
If they rekindle that same attack & attitude as they had in the first 3/4's against the Hawks next week against us, this one will be no snack at all.
Agree, but I would also add that it's very common for cellar dweller, struggling sides to drop their bundle in the last 1/4. They battle valiantly to get within a goal or so, then once they see their efforts not being enough, they lack the mental resilience and intestinal fortitude to keep going, and just give up. Happens often.
Danger game? When was the last time those words were posted here?
Well we saw off one "Danger" on Sun, let's hope we are prepared or another this Sat! >:D
Danger game? When was the last time those words were posted here?
It was Tribey who used to spin out whenever someone mentioned 'danger game'. Haven't seen him around here for a while ???
Anyone who watched yesterdays match between the Lions & Hawks saw that the Lions are an under-rated side. They easily matched it for 3/4's but for some unexplainable reason and in complete contrast to what they were doing with monotonous regularity, started to make poor decisions and skills errors in the last and the Hawks capitalised on it.
If they rekindle that same attack & attitude as they had in the first 3/4's against the Hawks next week against us, this one will be no snack at all.
I thought that the Hawks did their best to keep the Lions in the game for the first three quarters. I wouldn't mind playing Hawthorn in that mindset.
Brisbane aren't easy beats though and we'll have to replicate Sunday's effort if we are going to get a win.
We have to win this one. Im taking along my grandson who barracks for the "Loyons" and we need a win to assist me in the conversion and indoctrination process! ;)
Be a tough game as in tough...Robbo and the Lions think we are a bit soft judging by our past games and I expect plenty of hard tackling and Bryce Gibbs to be a target....
Be a tough game as in tough...Robbo and the Lions think we are a bit soft judging by our past games and I expect plenty of hard tackling and Bryce Gibbs to be a target....
You're probably right EB, but if Robbo starts throwing his weight around he would be prudent to expect some to come his way in return. He's not as tough or as good as he thinks he is IMO and he's definitely not that smart.
Be a tough game as in tough...Robbo and the Lions think we are a bit soft judging by our past games and I expect plenty of hard tackling and Bryce Gibbs to be a target....
I reckon that teams who think we are soft are in for a shock. As Levi said, teams that underestimate us do so at their peril.
It is a real turnaround and I'd like to know where WADA sits on angry pills. Or perhaps Bolton has just let the boys of the leash when it comes looking after each other.
We might see Weitering v Schache.
Laj go easy, your obsessed with Casboult rucking.
Why the feck would we play the AFL's current most feared contested mark in a position that puts a bruised tibia at even greater risk?
BTW, Gorringe's mobility looked pretty good today, while his attack at the ball wasn't as good the end result was better than Jones was able to offer. I hope Jones was watching for the next time he gets a crack! I like the current setup, it lets Kreuzer stay around the ball longer and takes some stoppage pressure off Cripps. Kreuzer 11 tackles, and Casboult busting packs, that is what we want to see.
You not watch the Collingwood game when Casboult was back-up to Kreuzer as well as our key forward. He took 11 marks, 7 contested kicked 3 goals and crashed bodies all over the place, while Kreuzer was dominate. Kreuzer goes alot better as our only ruckman with a bit of help, Casboult gets his confidence up when he gets a run on the ball and translate into his work up forward. Something that has been obvious for years and seen again against Collingwood. Kreuzer, irrespective of yesterday, is generally no-where near as good when her shares the ruck duties, and Casboult isn't quite as good as a pure forward. Hence I'd be picking Jacksh this week, whose form in the VFL has been terrific, way better than Gorringe, if Casboult's shin is good for him to ruck. Gorringe would admittedly be unlucky after yesterday but that's not likely to be a permanent thing as he's not that good. The side would be better balanced with a genuine key forward as well as Kreuzer and Casboult rucking. Been our best combination for a number of years. Casboult will crash packs the same way. Irrespective of who is unlucky you pick your best balanced side otherwise you ask to get beaten. Best for both players, best for the side.
If the shin isn't ready to ruck then the status quo remains. Gorringe plays and we carry on like yesterday as we'll need another ruckman. Agree I don't want Casboult rucking if the leg isn't ready.
The 'old' Carlton would be a monty to drop this one. The new Carlton? I'm not going to mozz us. :P
Gorringe may be stiff but I'm thinking Casboult will be ready to resume ruck duties. Jaksch maybe in this week to play key forward. As bad luck as it would be for Gorringe it would be a better balanced side.
Any other changes would be forced. Hopefully not.
Gorringe is averaging more goals a game than casboult.
Despite being 'average' in the ruck, he has 3 times more hitouts for the year compared to casboult despite playing 7 less games.
We are a better balanced side with Kreuzer and Gorringe rucking and resting forward and leaving Casboult as a FT forward/wrecking ball.
Gorringe is averaging more goals a game than casboult.
Despite being 'average' in the ruck, he has 3 times more hitouts for the year compared to casboult despite playing 7 less games.
We are a better balanced side with Kreuzer and Gorringe rucking and resting forward and leaving Casboult as a FT forward/wrecking ball.
Levi hasn't had a big year in the ruck, that is certain. I wouldn't be expecting too much of him in that department for a while yet.
To be honest, I can't believe he played on Sunday and got through the game.
That said, Levi is never a huge goal kicker. He appears to play better when he starts further away from goals and moves around. Not as any opportunities to miss. :)
Gorringe, on the other hand, has shown he has the mobility to get on the end of things. Some of his goals have been from pretty close range: good football that he is there and his opponent is not.
Levi hasn't had a big year in the ruck, that is certain. I wouldn't be expecting too much of him in that department for a while yet.
To be honest, I can't believe he played on Sunday and got through the game.
That said, Levi is never a huge goal kicker. He appears to play better when he starts further away from goals and moves around. Not as any opportunities to miss. :)
Gorringe, on the other hand, has shown he has the mobility to get on the end of things. Some of his goals have been from pretty close range: good football that he is there and his opponent is not.
I can't see Levi playing in the ruck unless we're forced to play him there because of injuries. He does his best work monstering defenders as well as providing a marking target up the ground. Even when he doesn't take the grab, the opposition rarely get possession and that's really all you want from a key forward - apart from a couple of goals.
Gorringe seems to be an in between size, not really big or strong enough to to be a genuine ruckman or key forward. He moves well and his goal from the square was the result of hard running and reading the play well. I'm not sure where he should play. Perhaps he could be something of a Blicavs type with too much height for blokes able to match his mobility.
Normally Ed Curnow goes to the best mid/most skilled...I wouldnt mind seeing Curnow tag Robbo and put him out of the game and take some emotion out of Brisbane...
Normally Ed Curnow goes to the best mid/most skilled...I wouldnt mind seeing Curnow tag Robbo and put him out of the game and take some emotion out of Brisbane...
I wouldn't dignify Robbo with that honour EB! :)
I wouldn't dignify Robbo with that honour EB! :)
Take your point Cookie however Robbo by default is probably their most prolific ball winner at the minute and seems to get an extra zing in his game when he plays us
and I'd like to see him worried more about getting a kick against Ed than trying to line up our blokes and put them off their game...
Take your point Cookie however Robbo by default is probably their most prolific ball winner at the minute and seems to get an extra zing in his game when he plays us
and I'd like to see him worried more about getting a kick against Ed than trying to line up our blokes and put them off their game...
It's hard to see who else would justify having a run with player, Hanley perhaps?
I suspect that Ed on Robbo is certainly under consideration. Ed's ability to win his own ball and make good use of it would have Robbo worrying about more than just getting a kick.
Take your point Cookie however Robbo by default is probably their most prolific ball winner at the minute and seems to get an extra zing in his game when he plays us
and I'd like to see him worried more about getting a kick against Ed than trying to line up our blokes and put them off their game...
It would be good then if Ed could win some possessions from him and do some real damage with them as well as restricting Robbo's impact.. >:D
Gorringe is averaging more goals a game than casboult.
Despite being 'average' in the ruck, he has 3 times more hitouts for the year compared to casboult despite playing 7 less games.
We are a better balanced side with Kreuzer and Gorringe rucking and resting forward and leaving Casboult as a FT forward/wrecking ball.
Gorringe is effectively standing in for Phillips.
Gorringe is averaging more goals a game than casboult.
Despite being 'average' in the ruck, he has 3 times more hitouts for the year compared to casboult despite playing 7 less games.
We are a better balanced side with Kreuzer and Gorringe rucking and resting forward and leaving Casboult as a FT forward/wrecking ball.
Casboult has only played one game as a ruckman this year but when he played as a full time second ruck last year he often got taps in double figures until he went back forward. Don't think you have any sample size for stat comparison. They don't compare as footballers either. Essentially many are having a wank over one game with looking back further. Didn't watch the Collingwood game 3 weeks ago? Casboult was a wrecking ball all over the ground, took 11 marks, 7 contested, smashed bodies and kicked 3 goals from 5 shots. Kreuzer went right up a notch too once Phillips got injured. Both we suddenly alot better. I've said it for years and again got proven right that game. If people haven't seen that over the years then they simply haven't watched football, or struggle to think back beyond one game.
We are not a better balanced side with Gorringe. Much better with a genuine forward there, for me Jaksch, with Kreuzer rucking and Casboult key forward and rucking. Let's not pretend otherwise based on one game. Gorringe went ok on the weekend but isn't that good. We've seen that. Let's not get blinded by one game. He's been damn ordinary for the NB's and was ordinary against North. Casboult would simply add more in the ruck by what he does around the ground, way more important to me. Not interested in a few extra taps here and there if they actually were to occur.
We have seen for a number of years that our best rucking combination is Kreuzer rucking most of the day with help from Casboult. Kreuzer plays way better when he has the ruck to himself, doesn't go anywhere near as well when he has to share it. Casboult performs alot better when he's both our forward and has a run in the ruck. He gets a run around the ground, gets his hands on the ball that that seems to help his confidence alot when he goes forward. He does much better in that role than when purely a forward. Like I said we saw this only only talking about this 3 weeks ago after the Collingwood game and most conceded that was the case. One game won't change that. We are a much better balanced side with Krezuer rucking with help from Casboult. We can pick a genuine key forward as well as one smaller/medium type to start with giving us more run and mobility. Much better balance. Other wise we have a ruckman resting forward taking up a key position if Casboult is the only other forward, not so good, or two ruck and two key forward, which can hamper our mobility.
The only way I keep Gorringe in this week if Casboult's leg isn't ready to ruck.
It's too risky though if Kreuzer gets injured which happens a lot. When he went of injured against Port we got smashed. When he missed the following week we were smashed.
We have to play two ruckmen, Kreuzer is the one that has to learn how to share. ;D
I can't see Levi playing in the ruck unless we're forced to play him there because of injuries. He does his best work monstering defenders as well as providing a marking target up the ground. Even when he doesn't take the grab, the opposition rarely get possession and that's really all you want from a key forward - apart from a couple of goals.
Gorringe seems to be an in between size, not really big or strong enough to to be a genuine ruckman or key forward. He moves well and his goal from the square was the result of hard running and reading the play well. I'm not sure where he should play. Perhaps he could be something of a Blicavs type with too much height for blokes able to match his mobility.
200cm, 100kg - he's hardly an in between size! With respect.
I would play Gorringe off the wing pushing fwd & giving the ruck a breather.
200cm, 100kg - he's hardly an in between size! With respect.
Gorringe can't hold position against opposition ruckmen and is too easily brushed aside in contests. If he is going to play mainly as a ruckman, he has to be bigger and stronger. He is most suited to playing as a tall half forward, as was his stated position in the pre-season.
Casboult has only played one game as a ruckman this year but when he played as a full time second ruck last year he often got taps in double figures until he went back forward. Don't think you have any sample size for stat comparison. They don't compare as footballers either. Essentially many are having a wank over one game with looking back further. Didn't watch the Collingwood game 3 weeks ago? Casboult was a wrecking ball all over the ground, took 11 marks, 7 contested, smashed bodies and kicked 3 goals from 5 shots. Kreuzer went right up a notch too once Phillips got injured. Both we suddenly alot better. I've said it for years and again got proven right that game. If people haven't seen that over the years then they simply haven't watched football, or struggle to think back beyond one game.
We are not a better balanced side with Gorringe. Much better with a genuine forward there, for me Jaksch, with Kreuzer rucking and Casboult key forward and rucking. Let's not pretend otherwise based on one game. Gorringe went ok on the weekend but isn't that good. We've seen that. Let's not get blinded by one game. He's been damn ordinary for the NB's and was ordinary against North. Casboult would simply add more in the ruck by what he does around the ground, way more important to me. Not interested in a few extra taps here and there if they actually were to occur.
We have seen for a number of years that our best rucking combination is Kreuzer rucking most of the day with help from Casboult. Kreuzer plays way better when he has the ruck to himself, doesn't go anywhere near as well when he has to share it. Casboult performs alot better when he's both our forward and has a run in the ruck. He gets a run around the ground, gets his hands on the ball that that seems to help his confidence alot when he goes forward. He does much better in that role than when purely a forward. Like I said we saw this only only talking about this 3 weeks ago after the Collingwood game and most conceded that was the case. One game won't change that. We are a much better balanced side with Krezuer rucking with help from Casboult. We can pick a genuine key forward as well as one smaller/medium type to start with giving us more run and mobility. Much better balance. Other wise we have a ruckman resting forward taking up a key position if Casboult is the only other forward, not so good, or two ruck and two key forward, which can hamper our mobility.
The only way I keep Gorringe in this week if Casboult's leg isn't ready to ruck.
Where does that leave Phillips ? I thought he absolutely showed enough to warrant his place before injury, his kicking for goal & strong forward marking was a notch above Kroozes, and his tap ruck work was certainly competative. But as you say, Krooze works into the game better if he's the main man.......interesting dilemma.
Gorringe can't hold position against opposition ruckmen and is too easily brushed aside in contests. If he is going to play mainly as a ruckman, he has to be bigger and stronger. He is most suited to playing as a tall half forward, as was his stated position in the pre-season.
Like many around him, the bloke needs time to gain confidence and learn the speed of the game at senior level.....the guy's played 24 senior games Clearly lost his way at GC, maybe injury, loss of confidence.....
From all reports, an elite runner and a hard match up aerobically given his stature.....
From the GC web site:
Stuck behind Tom Nicholls and Zac Smith in the ruck queue, Gorringe was again hampered by injury in 2014.
An Achilles problem cost the South Australian 12 weeks on the sidelines,
but he got three senior games late in the season to push his case before a knee injury finished his year early.
Gorringe is athletic, has a great leap and moves around the ground well, but is down the pecking order and will need to work hard to command a regular spot.
He emerged as one of the strongest runners at the club during the summer and has put his hand up for a role in the midfield during the year.
A WIP?
As someone has previously suggested, maybe Gorringe is a potential Blicavs type player? Seems to have the physical attributes.
Like many around him, the bloke needs time to gain confidence and learn the speed of the game at senior level.....the guy's played 24 senior games Clearly lost his way at GC, maybe injury, loss of confidence.....
From all reports, an elite runner and a hard match up aerobically given his stature.....
From the GC web site:
A WIP?
I think so FB. I'd like to see him develop as a tall utility with the ability to stretch opponents both aerobically and in the air.
http://video.news.com.au/v/1906/Draft-Dreams-Dan-Gorringe (http://video.news.com.au/v/1906/Draft-Dreams-Dan-Gorringe)
http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-01-21/suns-seeks-to-prove-himself (http://www.afl.com.au/news/2015-01-21/suns-seeks-to-prove-himself)
GOLD Coast tall Daniel Gorringe has a simple goal this year, but believes he might need to reinvent himself to achieve it.
Gorringe was widely regarded as the best junior ruckman in 2010 and the Suns gladly took him at pick No.10 in their inaugural draft that year.
However, the South Australian has struggled to make the transition from junior football to the AFL, and has played just 20 senior games in his four years on the Gold Coast.
After a failed attempt to return home to Adelaide at the end of last season, the 22-year-old has made a strong start to the 2015 pre-season and is determined to prove that the Suns picked wisely back in 2010.
"My main aim now is to prove to the Suns that I can play — and I want to play," Gorringe told the Gold Coast Bulletin.
"I love it here, we have a new coach with ‘Rocket’ (Rodney Eade) and I've enjoyed working with him."
However, with the Suns' ruck division already boasting Zac Smith, Tom Nicholls and pinch-hitting forward Charlie Dixon, Gorringe, 199cm, is eyeing a possible switch to the midfield in 2015.
"I think my best position is probably somewhere in the midfield where I can run and open up and take the game on," Gorringe said.
"I'm not too tall for the middle and I'm pretty mobile, as mobile as the other mids.
"Everyone has this perception that if you're tall you can't run around, but I reckon I'm right to be in there and do what they're doing."
Gorringe is coming off a horror 2014 season. Sidelined for three months early in the year with an Achilles tendon injury, he broke into the Suns' team in round 19 and played three straight games before a knee injury ended his season.
Last October, Gorringe sought a trade home, with Port Adelaide emerging as the keenest suitor.
But the Power's main focus was brokering a deal for Essendon ruckman Patrick Ryder, and when those negotiations dragged into the final day of the trade period, Gorringe's hopes of a move were dashed.
However, since returning to Metricon Stadium for pre-season training in November, Gorringe has totally committed to preparing himself for a 2015 season that he acknowledges could be career-defining.
"I've laid some good foundations through the pre-season, so it's going to be a big year for my future, which is exciting and a bit nerve-racking at the same time," he said.
"But I’m always up for a challenge."
The way Gorringe moves reminds me of Lawrence Angwin hopefully not his nocturnal ways ;D
Really, if we bring the same intensity we brought against the Cats on Saturday, this should be an easy win.
But on their day, as the Hawks found out last week, the Lions can be a formidable opponent and not that easy o shake off.
Just need to maintain focus, make sure the players keep their feet on the ground this week after all the good press we ve been getting.
On a side not, wish Tommy Bell a good game, but not too good. Feel no ill will towards him.
Robbo on the other hand, I hope cops a few crunching tackles from big Crippa!!
The way Gorringe moves reminds me of Lawrence Angwin hopefully not his nocturnal ways ;D
Lawrence had very sticky fingers and long arms.....was a good mark too... ;)
Really, if we bring the same intensity we brought against the Cats on Saturday, this should be an easy win.
But on their day, as the Hawks found out last week, the Lions can be a formidable opponent and not that easy o shake off.
Just need to maintain focus, make sure the players keep their feet on the ground this week after all the good press we ve been getting.
On a side not, wish Tommy Bell a good game, but not too good. Feel no ill will towards him.
Robbo on the other hand, I hope cops a few crunching tackles from big Crippa!!
Dom I think our pressure will be more intense and unrelenting than that of the Hawks if we repeat last Sundays dosage. Hopefully the Lions will then cough up plenty of turnovers and make plenty of mistakes. 8)
Gorringe can't hold position against opposition ruckmen and is too easily brushed aside in contests. If he is going to play mainly as a ruckman, he has to be bigger and stronger. He is most suited to playing as a tall half forward, as was his stated position in the pre-season.
How many ruck contests do you reckon occur during any given game?
Whatever it is, halve it, as he is rucking in tandem with kreuzer.
Halve it again as the opposition will win half anyway.
Of whatever is left, what % of them are there clear hitouts to advantage? maybe 20%.
Given about 80 stoppages a game, thus ruck contests.
Kreuzer takes 40, Gorringe 40.
Opposition win half - leaving gorringe with 20.
Of that 20, 20% go to advantage.....so 4.
Now assume Gorringe only wins 10% of his hitouts, instead of 50%.
Hitouts to advantage drops from 4 to 1.
You want to drop a bloke because over the course of a game he might get you 3 hitouts to advantage less than someone else....say phillips.
What about the rest of the game played outside the ruck? He's kicking 1.5 goals a game at the moment and offering a target around the ground. I'd argue that is far more valuable than 3 hitouts to advantage we might be losing.
People think ruck = hitouts.....and forget that for 95% of the game the ruckman doesn't do any rucking!
The way Gorringe moves reminds me of Lawrence Angwin hopefully not his nocturnal ways ;D
Gorringe certainly moves well, but Angwin still has him covered. Never seen a bloke his size simply run around people trying to tackle him......Buddy excluded.
How many ruck contests do you reckon occur during any given game?
Whatever it is, halve it, as he is rucking in tandem with kreuzer.
Halve it again as the opposition will win half anyway.
Of whatever is left, what % of them are there clear hitouts to advantage? maybe 20%.
Given about 80 stoppages a game, thus ruck contests.
Kreuzer takes 40, Gorringe 40.
Opposition win half - leaving gorringe with 20.
Of that 20, 20% go to advantage.....so 4.
Now assume Gorringe only wins 10% of his hitouts, instead of 50%.
Hitouts to advantage drops from 4 to 1.
You want to drop a bloke because over the course of a game he might get you 3 hitouts to advantage less than someone else....say phillips.
What about the rest of the game played outside the ruck? He's kicking 1.5 goals a game at the moment and offering a target around the ground. I'd argue that is far more valuable than 3 hitouts to advantage we might be losing.
People think ruck = hitouts.....and forget that for 95% of the game the ruckman doesn't do any rucking!
Did I say anything about hitouts, or about dropping Gorringe for that matter? Comprehension doesn't seem to be your strength ???
My point is that Gorringe is too easily brushed aside by opposition ruckmen (and defenders) in contested ball situations and that's part and parcel of a ruckman's workload, regardless of how much time he spends on the ball. Gorringe is actually reasonably effective at centre bounces because he has an unencumbered leap at the ball.
My preferred position for Gorringe is as a tall utility (as discussed below) and Gorringe sees himself as a tall midfielder.
By the way, thanks for the ruck analysis. It is probably the most over-thought, meaningless nonsense I have read on this site and it gave me a very good laugh and, yes, I know small things amuse small minds ;)
OK: enough of the baiting. Agree to disagree and move on. There is much too much positive going on around here to lose it. Playing the poster is not our way.
Did I say anything about hitouts, or about dropping Gorringe for that matter? Comprehension doesn't seem to be your strength ???
My point is that Gorringe is too easily brushed aside by opposition ruckmen (and defenders) in contested ball situations and that's part and parcel of a ruckman's workload, regardless of how much time he spends on the ball. Gorringe is actually reasonably effective at centre bounces because he has an unencumbered leap at the ball.
My preferred position for Gorringe is as a tall utility (as discussed below) and Gorringe sees himself as a tall midfielder.
By the way, thanks for the ruck analysis. It is probably the most over-thought, meaningless nonsense I have read on this site and it gave me a very good laugh and, yes, I know small things amuse small minds ;)
That wasn't just directed at you but to everyone who has been bagging out Gorringes ruck ability. (Jimbo amongst others), yes your post was quoted because it served as the popular opinion, not just because it was yours.
Not like you to go off half-c0cked and overreact.
So you thought that analysis was over-throught? I thought it was a very simplistic example myself. Each to their own.
That wasn't just directed at you but to everyone who has been bagging out Gorringes ruck ability. (Jimbo amongst others), yes your post was quoted because it served as the popular opinion, not just because it was yours.
Not like you to go off half-c0cked and overreact.
So you thought that analysis was over-throught? I thought it was a very simplistic example myself. Each to their own.
It reminded me of an analysis my late brother once did of basketball. It showed that in a team of five players, each player will only have the ball for around four minutes of a 40 minute game. The message was meant to be about working harder when you don't have the ball but it was lost in the maths. It's not the hitouts Gorringe may win that is important, it's how well he nullifies his opponent, blocks opposition midfielders, brings the ball to ground in marking contests, makes a contest and, as he did so well on Sunday, uses his run and anticipation to create scoring opportunities.
Like many of our players, he's a work in progress and I have a feeling that he will develop into a similar player to Blicavs; almost impossible to match up - unless you're Patrick Cripps :)
It reminded me of an analysis my late brother once did of basketball. It showed that in a team of five players, each player will only have the ball for around four minutes of a 40 minute game. The message was meant to be about working harder when you don't have the ball but it was lost in the maths. It's not the hitouts Gorringe may win that is important, it's how well he nullifies his opponent, blocks opposition midfielders, brings the ball to ground in marking contests, makes a contest and, as he did so well on Sunday, uses his run and anticipation to create scoring opportunities.
Like many of our players, he's a work in progress and I have a feeling that he will develop into a similar player to Blicavs; almost impossible to match up - unless you're Patrick Cripps :)
The bold was the take home point.....as mentioned previously, wasn't specifically directed at you.
He does other more important things on the field that make him far more valuable than people realise. Hitting the scoreboard being the obvious one that can't be overlooked.
The bold was the take home point.....as mentioned previously, wasn't specifically directed at you.
He does other more important things on the field that make him far more valuable than people realise. Hitting the scoreboard being the obvious one that can't be overlooked.
Indeed!
No matter what you may think about Gorringe and his present limitations, hitting the score board has been a real positive. He usually kicks the ball well and straight. Not many of our forwards in recent years can make the same claim.
No matter what you may think about Gorringe and his present limitations, hitting the score board has been a real positive. He usually kicks the ball well and straight. Not many of our forwards in recent years can make the same claim.
In some ways he's a bigger version of Everitt. During the pre-season I speculated that we could only play one or the other but I was definitely on the wrong track there.
To digress, i thought 1AW found some form too though he still tries for way too many speccies!
How many times did we have 3 or 4 fly for the mark in the forward line? Too many imo.
re: Gorringe.....Bolton will have to decide if he wants two specialist ruckman ie Kruezer and Philips or have the flexibility of Gorringe and Casboult to support Kruezer.
I dont rate either Gorringe or Casboult as great ruckman and its more about giving Kruezer a rest than gaining any advantage in the ruck or though Casboult gives you marking ability around the ground and some size.
Philips is a steady ruckman who has done well IMO and you know what you are getting...Gorringe is like a bigger Everitt as someone suggested and has that X factor/upside tag as you are not sure week to week what you will get unlike Philips....
I'd like to see Gorringe stay in the team and see if he can improve both his ruckwork and consistency...some of his handball is creative and he gives me the impression he could kick a bag of goals he if worked hard and tried to learn more about forward play....
The time to experiment is now while we are in a learning phase and just for the moment I would give Gorringe a few more games and see how far he can go with his development, if he doesnt work out then you have the reliable Philips to come back into the team..
To digress, i thought 1AW found some form too though he still tries for way too many speccies!
How many times did we have 3 or 4 fly for the mark in the forward line? Too many imo.
I thought Walks was very good and I loved it when he turned Hendo inside out and strolled in for a goal. He is another that seems to play better when he is a touch aggro and I suspect that the Bolton way will suit him.
I think I only counted two speccy attempts but there were several occasions when all of the forwards near the contest were flying and we missed easy crumbers' goals as a result.
1AW has definitely improved as the year has progressed and is currently a good contributor. However, I wonder how many more years he has left in him? I think Gorringe would be an option to eventually replace him in the forward structure and we should definitely take the opportunity to continue his development. Alternatively he might be an option as a tall on ball type like Blicavs.
In all the talk post game, one theme that has reoccurred is the fact that the 'back six' is looking extremely settled. Plowman, Touy, Rowe, Simpson, Dougherty, Weitering, Thomas ......and Byrne ready to be reinstated. Unfortunately the name Michael Jamieson seems to be a thing of the past.
In all the talk post game, one theme that has reoccurred is the fact that the 'back six' is looking extremely settled. Plowman, Touy, Rowe, Simpson, Dougherty, Weitering, Thomas ......and Byrne ready to be reinstated. Unfortunately the name Michael Jamieson seems to be a thing of the past.
IMO Jamo is done unfortunately and will see out the remainder of the year, and CFC career, as a backup player, having achieved his 150th. All good things eventually come to an end.
IMO Jamo is done unfortunately and will see out the remainder of the year, and CFC career, as a backup player, having achieved his 150th. All good things eventually come to an end.
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IMO Jamo is done unfortunately and will see out the remainder of the year, and CFC career, as a backup player, having achieved his 150th. All good things eventually come to an end.
I have been critical of Jamison in the recent past and I wonder if his shoulder injuries are limiting his ability to play at the top level. However, I'm not going to write him off just yet. The fact that he isn't required to plug a gaping hole in our defence may give him time to regain some form.
In all the talk post game, one theme that has reoccurred is the fact that the 'back six' is looking extremely settled. Plowman, Touy, Rowe, Simpson, Dougherty, Weitering, Thomas ......and Byrne ready to be reinstated. Unfortunately the name Michael Jamieson seems to be a thing of the past.
Bad for Jamo who has been a loyal servant but good for us in the sense that we have a back six that will see us into the short term future. Rowe is the next one we need a succession plan for, he is 28 but has durability on his side. Rarely injured (touch wood) and hence is ok for the short term but we need a plan. At the moment though, the defence is looking good and after seeing it in action live on Sun, I liked what I saw.
Bad for Jamo who has been a loyal servant but good for us in the sense that we have a back six that will see us into the short term future. Rowe is the next one we need a succession plan for, he is 28 but has durability on his side. Rarely injured (touch wood) and hence is ok for the short term but we need a plan. At the moment though, the defence is looking good and after seeing it in action live on Sun, I liked what I saw.
Agree.
IMO Jamo is done unfortunately and will see out the remainder of the year, and CFC career, as a backup player, having achieved his 150th. All good things eventually come to an end.
I agree, but it is a massive shame. There was hardly any mention of his 150th when it was Simmos 250th (fair enough), but Jamo was a gun at his best. He was one of the best 1-2 marking key defenders in the competition for a while there. I was talking to a mate recently who asked what had happened to him because "he was a gun"...
Unfortunately with Jamo his body just doesn't seem to be able to hold up to the rigours of AFL football and now a few years have passed by and I don't see him ever being a key position player again. There may be an option for him to play as a rebounding/marking half back, but in reality with the likes of Simmo in the team we have that role also covered.
It sucks, but it will be very hard for him from here I think
It was Tribey who used to spin out whenever someone mentioned 'danger game'. Haven't seen him around here for a while ???
Missing me DJ?
Missing me DJ?
Missing your "danger game" reactions even more :)
Jamo has been a great servant at the club. He may not be doing much this year on field but off field I hear he is worth every penny and then some, contracted for next year.
Murphy out for three weeks - Byrne to come in.
Gorringe is doing well but Phillips is the better ruckman - prefer Kreuzer in the middle when the heat is on.
Jamo has been a great servant at the club. He may not be doing much this year on field but off field I hear he is worth every penny and then some, contracted for next year.
Murphy out for three weeks - Byrne to come in.
Gorringe is doing well but Phillips is the better ruckman - prefer Kreuzer in the middle when the heat is on.
no poinr bringing Phillips straight back into the 1s - he'd beas rusty as hell
no poinr bringing Phillips straight back into the 1s - he'd beas rusty as hell
absolutely rusty - I just saw his hair on the tv
Strangely enough, I think this game is more of a test than the last two weeks - this time we are expected to win, and probably by a decent margin.
It's one thing to produce when your collective backs are against the wall (don't get me wrong, that stuff is great), but it will be interesting to see how well they go when it is expected of them.
A good team in our position would win this one by 6-10 goals and not be too troubled.
Brendan Blue Bolton should have the boys up for this one. Remember his message about being on an even emotional keel in regards to every game.
I wonder if KJ is going to get a run?
Be another good win this one, another building block of handling expectations now that the army has awoken.
BB has a job and half of keeping a lid on it when we start winning because the media love writing about us and we love reading it. Gee i'm getting excited already thinking about that winning feeling. ;D
I'm going along and looking forward to it! I'm hoping we are prepared in the same way as we were for last week - we should play our normal game and system with the same intensity irrespective of who the opposition may be. I think BB will be going hard for the same effort and a degree of improvement in our execution.
The nightmare of the corresponding fixture at Etihad last year still lingers.
Missing easy shots at goal... Blowing a comfortable lead.... Turnovers galore... Flogs like Lewis Taylor and Robbo getting in our players faces.... Side coming to a stand still in the last, with both Gibbs and Murph statless...
One of our dark moments in the last weeks of Mick's reign.
Im really hoping we show just how far we ve come as a side in the space of 12-13 months. A repeat of last years performance against a side who, away from the Gabba, has been next to useless, will be a bit of a step back in our development...
Greg Denham says that a friend of his gave him some info about Marc Murphy. According to this bloke, he was walking around Princes Park yesterday and Murphy shot past him twice, running 2 fast-paced laps. Doesn't seem consistent with suggestions he'll miss up to a month.
Greg Denham says that a friend of his gave him some info about Marc Murphy. According to this bloke, he was walking around Princes Park yesterday and Murphy shot past him twice, running 2 fast-paced laps. Doesn't seem consistent with suggestions he'll miss up to a month.
It's hard to run if your ankle is immobilised ??? Perhaps a case of mistaken identity?
Although, the club did say that they wanted to have scans done with the ankle under stress ???
Greg Denham says that a friend of his gave him some info about Marc Murphy. According to this bloke, he was walking around Princes Park yesterday and Murphy shot past him twice, running 2 fast-paced laps. Doesn't seem consistent with suggestions he'll miss up to a month.
KB was just on about something along similar lines on SEN a few minutes ago. Didn't catch the full story though.
It's hard to run if your ankle is immobilised ??? Perhaps a case of mistaken identity?
Although, the club did say that they wanted to have scans done with the ankle under stress ???
I doubt there are two Smurfs in the vicinity!
Even the shot of him post injury in the changerooms during the game - he was moving ok.....
Hmmmmm.
I doubt there are two Smurfs in the vicinity!
Even the shot of him post injury in the changerooms during the game - he was moving ok.....
Hmmmmm.
They gave him a few jabs to try to get him back on the ground and he was OK running in s
straight lines..
I haven't seen any photos of his immobilised ankle though ???
Footage i saw (from a bar on level 2 at Etihad) he was doing zigzags! :o
^^
I saw that too.
Whilst that indicates he might not be as bad as first feared, it could be that they gave him a jab, and prior to swelling they had no idea just what they were dealing with.
Could be anything from a sprain to a full on fracture, and you would never know until its scanned.
Then again, who knows.
Footage i saw (from a bar on level 2 at Etihad) he was doing zigzags! :o
Are you sure that wasn't a product of what you were consuming in the bar?
I think you're right though - just not very fast zigzags :)
Are you sure that wasn't a product of what you were consuming in the bar?
I think you're right though - just not very fast zigzags :)
And hopefully not zigging when he should have been zagging? :o
http://www.zerohanger.com/brisbanes-bizarre-preparation-for-blues-clash-5207/
LOL! This tells me that they re pretty mentally fragie.
IN: Graham, Byrne
OUT: Murphy, Sumner
Emergencies: Jaksch, Phillips, Tutt
B: Zach Tuohy - Sam Rowe - Jacob Weitering
HB: Dale Thomas - Lachie Plowman - Simon White
C: Sam Docherty - Patrick Cripps - Ed Curnow
HF: Jed Lamb - Levi Casboult - Matthew Wright
F: Sam Kerridge - Andrew Walker - Andrejs Everitt
R: Matthew Kreuzer - Nick Graham - Bryce Gibbs
I: Ciaran Byrne - Daniel Gorringe - Kade Simpson - Dennis Armfield
Emergencies - Andrew Phillips - Kristian Jaksch - Jason Tutt
In: Byrne, Graham
Out: Marc Murphy (Ankle), Liam Sumner (foot)
Byrne's inclusion is a no-brainer and selecting Graham to replace Murphy wouldn't have required too much thought.
It's good to see that Gorringe has another chance to show what he can do. I wasn't all that impressed with his pre-season form and he had a torrid time against Goldstein but I thought he showed a bit last week. I don't think he will ever be a genuine ruck prospect but I like the idea of a 200cm midfielder :)
No surprises there.
Carlton
B: Zach Tuohy, Sam Rowe, Jacob Weitering.
HB: Dale Thomas, Lachie Plowman, Simon White.
C: Sam Docherty, Patrick Cripps, Ed Curnow.
HF: Jed Lamb, Levi Casboult, Matthew Wright.
F: Sam Kerridge, Andrew Walker, Andrejs Everitt.
Foll: Matthew Kreuzer, Nick Graham, Bryce Gibbs.
Int: Ciaran Byrne, Daniel Gorringe, Kade Simpson, Dennis Armfield.
Emg: Andrew Phillips, Kristian Jaksch, Jason Tutt
I like the Emergencies. All 3. Phillips is fit: a big plus. Jaksch is getting close and Tutt is doing his best.
As for the team, I don't think it is perfect, by any means. Neither Walker nor Everitt have been able to play 2 good ones on the trot for quite a while. However, they were good last week, so maybe I'm just stuck with a dose of the Malthouses. :) I still see structural problems, but last week I was proved to be an idiot.
Brisbane Lions
B: Ryan Harwood, Daniel Merrett, Jackson Paine.
HB: Daniel Rich, Daniel McStay, Sam Mayes.
C: Tom Rockliff, Allen Christensen, Tom Bell.
HF: Pearce Hanley, Lewis Taylor, Nick Robertson.
F: Trent West, Josh Schache, Ryan Bastinac.
Foll: Stefan Martin, Dayne Zorko, Mitch Robinson.
Int: Ben Keays, Jarrad Jansen, Tom Cutler, Jonathan Freeman .
Emg: Claye Beams, Josh Clayton, Rhys Mathieson
Brisbane look quite reasonable on paper, if a little small. McStay played well against us last year, picking goals and marking well as a forward. He's in defence. Stefan Martin has dined out on our ruckmen in recent times. Robinson hasn't had a bad one against us yet. ( :( ) Tom Bell kicked 4 goals last week. They beat us twice last year when we looked to be better and in better form. I really hated that.
I doubt there are two Smurfs in the vicinity!
I played cricket against his brother - they do look similar...
Just a piece of trivia that doesn't deserve its own thread: on Marngrook Footy Show, Adam Treloar said he was a Carlton fan and his faves were Kouta and Juddy.
Just a piece of trivia that doesn't deserve its own thread: on Marngrook Footy Show, Adam Treloar said he was a Carlton fan and his faves were Kouta and Juddy.
Another piece of trivia; in 2003 Brendon Bolton won the Horrie Gorringe Medal for B&F as captain-coach of North Hobart. I'm not sure if Horrie and Daniel are related but Gorringe is a relatively rare surname.
Anyway, back to the footy.
Bolton started his press conference last Sunday by apologising for being monotonous and he hasn't changed his ways:
Blues coach Brendon Bolton said despite the excitement of last week’s win, his team would be ready to tackle the Lions.
“If you’re one or two per cent off in terms of your focus and approach you can get hurt … We need to be on again,” Bolton told the media on Friday.
“We’re wary of Brisbane. They have pushed some real quality sides.”
Blues vice-captain Kade Simpson will lead the side in the absence of skipper Marc Murphy, who will miss up to a month after suffering an ankle injury against the Cats.
Bolton admitted Murphy’s absence would “leave a hole” in the Blues’ midfield, but was confident his team’s improved leadership would fill the void.
“We’ve built leadership density,” he said.
“We can’t rely on one individual … We need to be a team that’s about the sum of the parts.”
. . .
“We want to be defined by our pressure and he (Graham) will just add to that.”
. . .
But Bolton was quick to reduce the hype around the possible match-up [Weitering-Schache].
“I don’t want to overplay that match-up," he said.
“We play team defence, so it (Weitering-Schache match-up) can’t happen all the time.”
Despite recent media discussion around a potential lottery system for the national draft, Bolton reiterated the Club’s position to put winning above positioning for draft picks.
“Creating a culture for sustained success is important, that’s about standards, values and behaviours,” he said.
“That’s No.1 and always will be at the Carlton Football Club.”
Keep on being monotonous Brendon :)
Taking my two girls to the footy for the first time tomorrow...a win would be nice.
Taking my two girls to the footy for the first time tomorrow...a win would be nice.
I hope you and your girls have a great day :)
I hope you and your girls have a great day :)
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I hope you and your girls have a great day :)
Enjoy and shout out loud for those who can't make it ;)
i doubt very much we'll play as badly as the Tiges!
Ridiculously we are a good chance of being 6-5 half way. Who would've thought, especially after being 0-4 and pretty ordinary in a few of those games. Nothing like crapty, scratchy wins, like those against Freo and Essendon, to build confidence and belief. 90% of the time it certainly beats an honourable loss.
Am i the only one nervous about today?
Play 3/4 as good as last week and we get the win but our past history of dropping these sorts of games is always in the back of my mind.
Loins paying $4.10 :-\
We were a bit flat against Nth but hopefully we'll avoid that today. If we come out fully firing I think we should get the win alright. Looking forward to seeing Byrne back in the side and seeing how Graham performs after the raps he's been getting from his recent NB form. Also looking forward to Kreuz v. Martin - should be a fascinating contest.
Go Blues!
Am i the only one nervous about today?
Play 3/4 as good as last week and we get the win but our past history of dropping these sorts of games is always in the back of my mind.
Loins paying $4.10 :-\
I'm a little nervous before most games.
Lions always make me nervous, they have delivered some monumental defeats in the past, cost Wallsy and Den (I think) their jobs, knocked us out of finals, are the sort of team that can bob up and bite us....
But this time its Different :o
No late changes