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Topic: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday (Read 91825 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #450
See, this is kinda what i've been talking about. Who from that lineup would play on the small forwards....say Eddie Betts.

The average height of that lineup is 191+. Simpson being the 'small' at 182 but at his age, i can't see him being able to keep up with the slippery types....and if Charlie Cameron was still there?? Not sure who his replacement would be, but i'm tipping there is at least 1 more small there.

I'm not sure that Thry's lineup would spend much time together on the ground.  We would normally be rotating at least one defender off the bench and giving SOJ, Daisy, Ed and others time in the back half.

As for stopping Eddie, it would be more of a team effort to limit forward 50 entries but Plowman could do the job with a little help from his fellow defenders. 
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #451
I'm not sure that Thry's lineup would spend much time together on the ground.  We would normally be rotating at least one defender off the bench and giving SOJ, Daisy, Ed and others time in the back half.

As for stopping Eddie, it would be more of a team effort to limit forward 50 entries but Plowman could do the job with a little help from his fellow defenders.

Yep ..its about stopping supply, players like Betts, Martin, Gray etc are going to win most of the one on ones if you give them enough opportunities, doesnt matter who
plays on them.
What we dont want Rnd 1 is Martin alone with his opponent near the goal square ,we cant have players sucked up the ground or dragged to the opposite side giving Martin room...once that happens and he is alone with his man its as good as over, you see players like Hodge giving directions down back so players know what they are doing, hope we have the same happening. The backline is talented but with Docherty missing it probably lacks a bit of leadership....Simpson is experienced but not that type of player, maybe thats why I like ACOS playing as he more the type to General the defense.

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #452
See, this is kinda what i've been talking about. Who from that lineup would play on the small forwards....say Eddie Betts.

The average height of that lineup is 191+. Simpson being the 'small' at 182 but at his age, i can't see him being able to keep up with the slippery types....and if Charlie Cameron was still there?? Not sure who his replacement would be, but i'm tipping there is at least 1 more small there.

We don't need to worry about stopping their smalls if we intercept mark everything coming in and rebound efficiently (something else this team can do).

Even so, Tom Williamson is the man for that job.

What Im hoping is that teams are spending more time trying to stop us than we are them.

At some point, you have to stop worrying about how to stop a couple of players and play the best 22 for good team balance.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #453
We don't need to worry about stopping their smalls if we intercept mark everything coming in and rebound efficiently (something else this team can do).

Even so, Tom Williamson is the man for that job.

What Im hoping is that teams are spending more time trying to stop us than we are them.

At some point, you have to stop worrying about how to stop a couple of players and play the best 22 for good team balance.

Looking at your back six, Williamson, Plowman, Marchbank and Weitering have all played on undersized forwards. I suspect Jones could as well, ironically Simmo is probably the only one that would struggle given his huge turning circle.
"Ruck, ruck, ruck, ruck ....... Ruck, ruck, ruck, ruck"

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #454
Looking at your back six, Williamson, Plowman, Marchbank and Weitering have all played on undersized forwards. I suspect Jones could as well, ironically Simmo is probably the only one that would struggle given his huge turning circle.

Exactly what I was thinking LP.  No one man has to stop a small.  Its a team effort.  Bring in the 7th man to mind an additional small (one of the mids/wingers) and then play Plowman, Weitering, Marchbank as the intercept marker.

Horses for courses swap out one of Weitering, Jones, Plowman or Marchbank for Sam Rowe.  Our defense is looking very good, Im just worried about up the field.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #455
Looking at your back six, Williamson, Plowman, Marchbank and Weitering have all played on undersized forwards. I suspect Jones could as well, ironically Simmo is probably the only one that would struggle given his huge turning circle.

I was quite surprised by how often Simmo picked up a taller opponent when the ball was heading deep into our defence.  Fortunately, he has the smarts to negate a size disadvantage.

We seem to play a swarming defence trying to block forward avenues and conceding kicks to more easily defended areas.  It’s only when the ball is heading inside 50 that our defenders man up, and it often seems to be the nearest forward rather than a particular match up - apart from Jones and one or two others.

Your point is well made LP; most of our defenders have the attributes to stand almost any opponent.
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #456
I was quite surprised by how often Simmo picked up a taller opponent when the ball was heading deep into our defence.  Fortunately, he has the smarts to negate a size disadvantage.

We seem to play a swarming defence trying to block forward avenues and conceding kicks to more easily defended areas.  It’s only when the ball is heading inside 50 that our defenders man up, and it often seems to be the nearest forward rather than a particular match up - apart from Jones and one or two others.

Your point is well made LP; most of our defenders have the attributes to stand almost any opponent.

And they're athletic enough to run off their man in most instances....
Finals, then 4 in a row!

 

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #457
I'm not sure that Thry's lineup would spend much time together on the ground.  We would normally be rotating at least one defender off the bench and giving SOJ, Daisy, Ed and others time in the back half.

As for stopping Eddie, it would be more of a team effort to limit forward 50 entries but Plowman could do the job with a little help from his fellow defenders.

Plowman, at a stretch, is all we've got IMO. If there are 2 eddies....we're screwed. We'd have to drop another mid-type back. So where does the extra defender go?

I know a lot of our blokes can play on talls, and smalls to a certain degree given there agility, but you still need a Tuohy/Docherty type which you can rely on more often than not to take those slippery blokes.

Look, i know how good our defenders are, i'm a huge wrap for them. I reckon our '2nd back 6' would still beat our '1st forward 6', i just think we need to be fluid down there and pick horses for courses.

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #458
I'd even consider Garlett on the slippery types, as required.

Horses for course, hardly a new strategy?

Move on zkruddler, this has been discussd ad nauseum...

Thats what i'm suggesting. And some courses might mean that the Weitering horse is better off resting for the following week.

Hardly a mew strategy, but people are fricken losing their minds over suggesting a #1 pick could be the 'casualty'.

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #459
Plowman, at a stretch, is all we've got IMO. If there are 2 eddies....we're screwed. We'd have to drop another mid-type back. So where does the extra defender go?

I know a lot of our blokes can play on talls, and smalls to a certain degree given there agility, but you still need a Tuohy/Docherty type which you can rely on more often than not to take those slippery blokes.

Look, i know how good our defenders are, i'm a huge wrap for them. I reckon our '2nd back 6' would still beat our '1st forward 6', i just think we need to be fluid down there and pick horses for courses.

Byrne seems to have been left out of the discussion.  He could match most small forwards for agility and acceleration but may get lost by his opponent - as often happened to Tuohy.

Docherty generally plays as a loose man in defence; not picking up an opponent but helping out his fellow defenders.  Not having Doc, and with apparently more emphasis on attacking footy, may mean that we give up on the extra man behind the ball.
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #460
Thats what i'm suggesting. And some courses might mean that the Weitering horse is better off resting for the following week.

Hardly a mew strategy, but people are fricken losing their minds over suggesting a #1 pick could be the 'casualty'.

His name is tom Williamson.

His name is ciaran Byrne. 

I even gave Byrne an Honourable mention.

Weitering is in our best back 6.  He's probably in our best forward 6, but irrespective of where he's named unless we are pushing for a flag we should play the back 6 that is both capable of winning and will likely be there in the medium to long term.

Weitering plays. 

I understand horses for courses but unless something changes dramatically weitering will be first name on the sheet and it's not because of his draft number it's because we rate him as the total package.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #461
Saints looking pretty average again tonight, and this is with a stronger side. Maybe our chance to leap frog them this year.

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #462
Apparently Williamson has a "stress reaction" in his back. I really hope the club is VERY conservative with him, don;t expect to see him in the first half of 2018 if that is the case

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #463
Apparently Williamson has a "stress reaction" in his back. I really hope the club is VERY conservative with him, don;t expect to see him in the first half of 2018 if that is the case

I understand that it is a minor stress reaction ... and modern medical imaging techniques will ensure that the medicos will know exactly when he's right to play.  However, your concern about a conservative approach is well founded.  Young Tom will be a very important part of our resurgence and we need to ensure that he can contribute to our premiership campaigns of 2019-2025.
“Why don’t you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don’t you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don’t you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?”  Oddball

Re: JLT 2018: Carlton vs St Kilda at Ikon on Wednesday

Reply #464
Byrne seems to have been left out of the discussion.  He could match most small forwards for agility and acceleration but may get lost by his opponent - as often happened to Tuohy.

Docherty generally plays as a loose man in defence; not picking up an opponent but helping out his fellow defenders.  Not having Doc, and with apparently more emphasis on attacking footy, may mean that we give up on the extra man behind the ball.

Byrne is good running down the field , both him and Jones can look a bit nervy running back towards goal....Simpson like Docherty doesnt really man up anyone and is more about rebound footy.....which is fine vs some teams but not vs a team like say Richmond and Port who have dangerous small/mediums who need close attention.
The lock down small defender/s is my problem area for our defense and where we need to find some players and lose a rebounding type....no point Simpson or Docherty getting 30 possies if a Robbie Gray type has kicked five on them....