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Topic: Trumpled (Alternative Leading) (Read 391571 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2745 –
You know, one of the weird things about political and social threads is this....
Everyone sits on a line between Gandhi and Genghis.
If someone is further up or down the line than yourself you'll get an argument....even if you're in the same half. ;D

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2746 –
Quote from: Lods on
The fact is I'm not sure how 'you' feel about the more moderate Trump supporters...only you know  that.
Why would anyone go after them? The strange thing is that Trump never sought to pivot towards the centre and instead played almost exclusively to his base. Biden, like Obama before him, is a centrist who wants to expand his base by adding moderates. He has already welcomed Never Trumpers and would be ecstatic if he could add moderate Trump voters as well. It’s not as though he is ideologically opposed to blue collar workers or those who are struggling.

I even give a thumbs-up to Chris Christie for advocating the use of masks after he caught Covid at the White House and for acknowledging Biden as the President-Elect.

But none of the corrupt Republican politicians who have pushed the bogus election fraud conspiracies should be given a pass even if they try to change their spots after Biden is inaugurated. What they’re doing isn’t business as usual in politics.

And the other group that should hang their heads in shame are:
Quote from: Lods on
people who feel a little threatened by some progressive social agendas.
This was exactly my point. Those who feel that their own status is undercut if discrimination is reduced don’t deserve sympathy or coddling. It doesn’t mean they should be hunted down and killed but they need to know they don’t have a right-wing veto over social change. Frankly, I don’t give a damn about their discomfort or feelings but I expect Biden will prefer to explain gently to such people that tolerance of minorities is a virtue. And if that just drives their intolerance underground, that’s better than the Karens thinking it’s their God-given right to impose their will on others.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2747 –
I think you're ignoring a fact here.

Trump panders to his strongest audience.   Those who will drive his election.

Theyre the antithesis to the same left agenda that is pushing some very hard agendas regarding society and they capture the moderate vote.  They lose that vote when they go too far and start behaving in a very fascist way.

Id be intrigued to see how this election pans out without the death of George Floyd.   To me that was likely the biggest turning point.  Black Lives Matter was as much anti Trump as it was anything else.

Very interesting stuff. 
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2748 –
The impact of BLM protests is a curly issue. The death of George Floyd may well have helped get out the vote in the black community. But the protests gave Trump a ready-made Law & Order appeal to white voters.

And then BLM protesters and progressives pushed the ‘Defund the Police’ slogan. I’d love to see “The Gruen” analyse that one. Taken literally, it meant that police forces would be disbanded. Maybe that’s what some extremists wanted, but most protesters meant that some money would be diverted from aggressive policing to crime prevention services. But how many white voters who would have voted Biden because they were turned off by Trump’s racism ended up voting for Trump out of fear that they might be victims of racial violence?

I reckon the biggest factor behind Trump’s loss was Covid. Perhaps voters punished his poor efforts to contain Covid although it seems he was mostly able to dodge responsibility for it. Among conservative voters, many were convinced it was a hoax and many thought Covid would have run rampant no matter who happened to be President. The more important consequence of Covid was that decades-long GOP voter-suppression strategies were rendered impotent. Early voting and mail-in voting were rapidly expanded and that made it easier for Democratic constituencies to vote. No wonder Trump was tearing his hair out over those changes. What he wanted was to force just about everybody to have to queue up on a working day, Tuesday, for hours. Of course, the lines in Republican areas would be short as there would be more voting centres open in those areas. But in Democratic areas, fewer centres would be open, fewer staff would be in attendance and for some reason broken machines would end up there. Lines would wend for miles, confronting voters with the waits of up to 10 hours in winter conditions.

What we can expect is that swing states with Republican Governors and legislatures will do their best to kill off early voting and mail-in voting in the next 4 years.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2749 –
Quote from: Mav on
The impact of BLM protests is a curly issue. The death of George Floyd may well have helped get out the vote in the black community. But the protests gave Trump a ready-made Law & Order appeal to white voters.
Yes, the general consensus seems to be the BLM reaction worked in Trumps favour, it put a lot of everyday people in fear including many African American small business owners.
The Force Awakens!

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2750 –
Well the orange one has gone to ground. When someone of his personality disorder type shuts up shop, you know he's up to no good planning / hatching some nefarious scheme!

I just heard that he's raised about a quarter a billion dollars from his supporters... and the loot has been siphoned off into an account administered by his daughter and son-in-law and a coupla other buddies!! How can this sh1te be legal? Wholesale ripping off but, apparently, there is some fine print which may save him - his followers are unlikely to read such things! He's been able to pay his legal bills with half of it...

Then, some military guru reckons Trump has the authority to order another election in the 4 swing states overseen by the military!!

I wonder if he's on the dogger to his buddy in Russia seeing if he can help out with the promise of a returned favour of some magnitude?

Coup by stealth? This sleazy pr1ck aint going away any time soon. January 20th can't come soon enough... then freeze his accounts pending an investigation.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2751 –
Quote from: Baggers on
Then, some military guru reckons Trump has the authority to order another election in the 4 swing states overseen by the military!!
I think the only military grade component of that opinion is the tugging?

I've heard a retired and a serving Major-General both state the same thing. Regardless of what the GOP politicians and alarmists state, it's the opinion of the military that Trump couldn't even launch a spud gun at the moment if he wanted to without bipartisan support, as far as the military are concerned the gig is now Biden's, and if Trump goes loco they'll just change the locks!
The Force Awakens!

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2752 –
Interesting that the election fraud conspiracists haven’t leapt on the news of the massive SolarWinds hack of US Government computer systems. Ordinarily, the tin-foil brigade behave like bower birds, incorporating anything interesting into their own reality. And this news was right down their alley: a foreign or other actor hellbent on gaining access to sensitive systems. Why didn’t they claim this proved their fears over election fraud?

Such a claim would have flown in the face of the facts. Dominion has stated that it’s platform didn’t utilise SolarWinds in any way. The other problem is that there is a paper audit trail: a hack of Dominion’s software might succeed in changing votes digitally but could not affect the paper votes retained by the states. There have been many hand audits of the paper votes which have confirmed the digital tallies in the battleground states Trump lost.

But just because the conspiracy flies in the face of the facts has never worried the conspiracy theorists to date as dozens of ridiculous court cases show. More likely is the fact that the Dear Leader had stayed silent about the hack while Pompeo and security experts blamed Russia. Trump’s base knows that blaming Russia is verboten in Trumpland, so they were in a pickle. QAnon fanatics could hardly do anything that would humiliate Trump, who they believe is Q.

But Trump has now given them their marching orders. He has furiously rebuked Pompeo for blaming Russia and has said it might be China. Phew! The election fraud conspiracy theory is back on track. Everyone knows that the election fraud conspiracy involves Hugo Chavez, Venezuela, George Soros, the Clintons, the Democrats, the CIA and FBI, and CHINA! It all fits together nicely now  :D

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2753 –
Quote from: Mav on
Interesting that the election fraud conspiracists haven’t leapt on the news of the massive SolarWinds hack of US Government computer systems. Ordinarily, the tin-foil brigade behave like bower birds, incorporating anything interesting into their own reality. And this news was right down their alley: a foreign or other actor hellbent on gaining access to sensitive systems. Why didn’t they claim this proved their fears over election fraud?

Such a claim would have flown in the face of the facts. Dominion has stated that it’s platform didn’t utilise SolarWinds in any way. The other problem is that there is a paper audit trail: a hack of Dominion’s software might succeed in changing votes digitally but could not affect the paper votes retained by the states. There have been many hand audits of the paper votes which have confirmed the digital tallies in the battleground states Trump lost.

But just because the conspiracy flies in the face of the facts has never worried the conspiracy theorists to date as dozens of ridiculous court cases show. More likely is the fact that the Dear Leader had stayed silent about the hack while Pompeo and security experts blamed Russia. Trump’s base knows that blaming Russia is verboten in Trumpland, so they were in a pickle. QAnon fanatics could hardly do anything that would humiliate Trump, who they believe is Q.

But Trump has now given them their marching orders. He has furiously rebuked Pompeo for blaming Russia and has said it might be China. Phew! The election fraud conspiracy theory is back on track. Everyone knows that the election fraud conspiracy involves Hugo Chavez, Venezuela, George Soros, the Clintons, the Democrats, the CIA and FBI, and CHINA! It all fits together nicely now  :D

 :))  :))  :)) yep, getting sillier by the day.

And those far right media channels (OAN & Co.) pedaling bullshizen re fraud are now in the sights of Dominion and the other vote counter org from California that I can't recall at the minute, with legal action, likewise FOX. Now that's a language they understand and are ducking and weaving and ensuring that any opinion from their 'guests' is identified as the guest's opinion and not necessary theirs. Good luck with that.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2754 –
I’d love to see Fox News taken to the cleaners but the 1st Amendment makes it hard to sue over political mudslinging. When the lies are coming from the White House and the President’s Campaign team/lawyers, FoxNews will be able to say it has to air them.

Fox News has successfully defended a defamation case by arguing that Tucker Carlson is just an entertainer and no one takes him seriously, and no doubt will argue the same in future if Tucker or other night time hosts are sued.

Will it be enough for Dominion to show that the election fraud stories were without factual foundations or will it be necessary to show the on air “talent” didn’t believe the stories were true? If it’s the latter, this may be difficult to show as the night time hosts are lunatics. Let’s face it, who really knows if Trump believes the stuff he spews out. Many people think he is genuinely deluded, and the same could be said of Rudy and Sidney Powell.

After Elon Musk won the defamation case brought by one of the rescuers of the boys trapped in the cave by saying that calling him a pedo guy didn’t mean he was accusing him of being a paedophile, it’s hard to see anyone being able to win a defamation case.

But I guess if Fox News doesn’t argue that their stories are true but wins only by arguing no one believes them or their presenters put them forward in good faith, that would be a win of sorts for Dominion and Biden.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2755 –
Trump has guaranteed that he’ll be universally regarded as one of the worst Presidents of all time. First, Covid spread unchecked in the US on his watch and the death toll will be greater than US forces have suffered in any war. Secondly, he has presided over the greatest intrusion into US systems by a foreign power and he displays complete indifference to it. Then there’s all the corruption, racism and the attempted coup. Future historians will be aghast.
 

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2756 –
Baggers, you’re right: Smartmatic has sued Fox and no doubt to help its defence Fox News has forced Lou Dobbs, Maria Baritomo and Judge Jeanne Pirro to run a pre-recorded segment debunking their own conspiracy theories :D

Can you imagine Trump watching that segment as he tunes in to his favourite wingnuts  :D

Watch here

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2757 –
Quote from: Mav on
Baggers, you’re right: Smartmatic has sued Fox and no doubt to help its defence Fox News has forced Lou Dobbs, Maria Baritomo and Judge Jeanne Pirro to run a pre-recorded segment debunking their own conspiracy theories :D

Can you imagine Trump watching that segment as he tunes in to his favourite wingnuts  :D

Watch here

A very deep shade of orange I suspect...

I wonder what Putin has on Trump to ensure his co-operation? A certain motel room video, perhaps?
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2758 –
They are just glorified News Readers, parroting away what comes off the teleprompter, if you give them any serious credence about having and broadcasting their own ideas you've gone too far.

Even when they conduct a live debate or interview the questions and response are feed to them via the earpiece, their real talent is to be able to read, speak and listen all at the same time!
The Force Awakens!

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2759 –
Quote from: Baggers on
I wonder what Putin has on Trump to ensure his co-operation? A certain motel room video, perhaps?
Unfortunately, Biden seems intent on closing the book on Trump’s Administration for fear of angering Republicans. It’s pretty obvious, however, that the GOP will practice total opposition if they keep the majority in the Senate. They’ll run a new slate of Benghazi-style investigations through the Senate. But maybe Trump will annoy Biden enough by leaving behind special prosecutors to go after Hunter Biden and election fraud that Biden will allow a comprehensive review of Trump’s dirty doings. Imagine a special prosecutor gaining access to Trump’s taxes and financial documents and requiring Trump to attend for an interview. Even better, s/he would be able to require all of the pardoned co-conspirators to testify as they can’t plead the 5th. Then various House Committees could call the Special Prosecutor before them to find out what s/he’s learned.

Trump is apparently mulling over appointing Sidney Powell as a Special Prosecutor into election fraud (as well as declaring martial law)  :o

I wonder if Trump was dumb enough to invite the Russians to trawl through Government systems in the hope they could help him winkle out the Deep State? After all, he was the one who asked the Russians to go after Hillary’s emails (“Russia, if you’re listening ...”) and delivered up classified material to the Russian Foreign Minister in the Oval Office.

After watching General Flynn in action, will Americans lose their hero worship of military types. Man, that guy is a moron and total fruitcake. How the hell did he manage to end up as a General?