Carlton Supporters Club

Social Club => Blah-Blah Bar => Topic started by: LP on December 03, 2020, 08:11:34 am

Title: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 03, 2020, 08:11:34 am
First it was Ferrari, now it's Masserati, they are going electric.

As a hobby I use to build/rebuild engines, mostly V8s, nothing like firing up a lumpy cam V8 on the engine stand with just a couple of headers attached and no mufflers. All the tools I needed come from Sidchrome, Kinchrome and Bahco and the like, maybe the only thing with power was the worklight. Even the impact driver was the old type that you use with a hammer!

But I've suddenly realised my work and hobby is merging, I spend most of the day with advanced technologies using oscilloscopes, robots and computers, to control, repair and diagnose equipment. Now if I'm working on car motors as a hobby it'll be using a PicoScope, Computer, Bluetooth and Multimeter.

FMD, perhaps it's time to retire! :o

But I wouldn't advise going off-road all electric just yet, good luck finding a local mechanic with spares or knowledge to repair those 128-Bit encrypted computer controlled monsters, you'll probably need to local computer shop or hackers!
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Professer E on December 03, 2020, 09:15:57 am
Enjoy those tools mate because those brands aren't locally made anymore and they're now  fair dinkum shyte.  Actually,  worse than useless.   Companies like "Crescent", who used to make good shifters etc now pushing stuff with the old brand names but they aren't the same... Guess where it all comes from?   Supposedly Nicholson files with the quality standards of a dog log on the nature strip.   Check the packets and they're all made in the PRC.  

Free trade seems to mean remove tariffs that protected local quality manufactures like Siddons, Titan,  Wiltshire etc so the PRC could dump shyte, kill off manufacturing  and then take over.   And they have the temerity to claim Australia is dumping goods.  The world is f""""""d
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 03, 2020, 09:53:31 am
Enjoy those tools mate because those brands aren't locally made anymore and they're now  fair dinkum shyte.  Actually,  worse than useless.  Companies like "Crescent", who used to make good shifters etc now pushing stuff with the old brand names but they aren't the same... Guess where it all comes from?  Supposedly Nicholson files with the quality standards of a dog log on the nature strip.  Check the packets and they're all made in the PRC. 

Free trade seems to mean remove tariffs that protected local quality manufactures like Siddons, Titan,  Wiltshire etc so the PRC could dump shyte, kill off manufacturing  and then take over.  And they have the temerity to claim Australia is dumping goods.  The world is f""""""d
Yeah, it's bullcrap isn't it.

I've got a builder mate, for home we buy good kit, Bosch Blue, Milwaukee, AEG, Makita, etc, etc.. He put me onto Bosch Blue years ago and through a mate at Siemens I was able to buy direct from the Bosch factory which had it's own shop for all it's staff and families. But this stuff generally doesn't get cheaper, it's getting more expensive relative to the other kit because it reliable. But for work he's gone full circle, now he buys cheap Chinese rubbish, almost a new power tool kit per job, if it breaks he buys another one because he can buy 4 or 5 for the price of one name brand. He'll tell you the quality is not the same, but the price is stupidly cheap, and the big issue for him is if someone nicks his stuff he doesn't give a rats arse because it's dead set rubbish!

All my tool kit is the old stuff, most of it imperial. I've got an old Sidchrome socket set was my fathers, bought from the Repco trade outlet which use to be in Clayton. It must be at least 50 years old, not a single broken or rounded socket, the ratchet still works perfectly and not a spot of rust even the press metal case is still rust free and the powder coating mostly scratch free. Even the foam liner is the original! Compare that to a special socket adaptor I purchased last year, a special I needed to work on a small engine in a confined space, of course the only one I could find in stock was Trojan "Superior chrome molybdenum steel" it says on the packaging. Even comes in it's own little pressed tin storage case. Used it once, put in in the bottom tray of the tool chest a less than a year later case and adaptor rusted, even the foam has started to dissolve and go sticky, chrome crap I'd say!

I realise most people are going to buy this stuff for the odd job around the house and might use things once or twice and never gain, cheap is good in this case if it works, but that doesn't stop it being crap!
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Gointocarlton on December 03, 2020, 03:22:14 pm
Two things:
1. I never imagined you LP as being a petrol head, lumpy cam, V8 guy. Just goes to show how these forums mask our characters. We should start are Who We Are thread.
2. A mate of mine is a mechanic by trade, bought Sidchrome tools when he started 35 years ago but quickly moved across to Snap On and Stahlwille, swears by them. They still look like the day he bought them and trust me they have turned a few nuts and bolts. You do get what you pay for most of the time.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Professer E on December 03, 2020, 04:02:05 pm
Yep,  I'm a Stahlwillie man too,  simply awesome. 
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Gointocarlton on December 03, 2020, 05:06:23 pm
Yep,  I'm a Stahlwillie man too,  simply awesome. 
You hold them in your hand and they feel unbelievable.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: cookie2 on December 03, 2020, 05:17:29 pm
You hold them in your hand and they feel unbelievable.

Well what would you expect from a steel willie?
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Gointocarlton on December 03, 2020, 05:48:10 pm
Well what would you expect from a steel willie?
Well played Sir
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 08:16:15 am
Two things:
1. I never imagined you LP as being a petrol head, lumpy cam, V8 guy. Just goes to show how these forums mask our characters. We should start are Who We Are thread.
2. A mate of mine is a mechanic by trade, bought Sidchrome tools when he started 35 years ago but quickly moved across to Snap On and Stahlwille, swears by them. They still look like the day he bought them and trust me they have turned a few nuts and bolts. You do get what you pay for most of the time.
Just fascinated with technology in any form, including engineering which of course covers engines!

When you work with electronics, computers and high tech all day long like I do, anything mechanical is a great hobby, especially if you hate gardening! The irony is I can tear down and rebuild a car without the manual, and get it working even with parts left over! ;D

But never ask me to make a square cut or drill a straight hole in a piece of timber, that is black magic as far as I'm concerned! :o
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Thryleon on December 04, 2020, 11:42:29 am
Its amazing.  I know they say that EV technology is the way forward, but has anyone looked up what a Lithium mine looks like??

Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 11:58:58 am
Its amazing.  I know they say that EV technology is the way forward, but has anyone looked up what a Lithium mine looks like??
Even worse, check out some solar cell production facilities if you can find some that aren't the propaganda laden clean room images you see on corporate websites!

I visited a factory in a nearby SE Asian country a few years back to perform some hardware upgrades, they have two facilities, one they take Euro visitors to that looks like a Ferrari showroom and wins them certification as an EU supplier, and another one where they actually make stuff which looked more like a dystopian sweatshop processing toxic heavy metals! ;)
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: kruddler on December 04, 2020, 12:19:33 pm
Its amazing.  I know they say that EV technology is the way forward, but has anyone looked up what a Lithium mine looks like??


Jeremy Clarkson (i know) used to point out how 'green' all this green energy/technology is and pointed out that all the mining and flying stuff around makes it more harmful to the environment than what it is trying to replace.
His agenda was clear, but his logic was correct.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: capcom on December 04, 2020, 01:28:26 pm
The fanciful notion that we can ever replace fossil fuels without embracing nuclear is stupid in the extreme.  I have a 16 panel solar system, NOT because I want them, but rather forced to do so by insane power bills.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 01:36:07 pm
Yes, I note the renewable activists a few weeks back lauding the UK for going 3 or 4 months this year without firing up a coal fired plant, but they conveniently neglect to tell you the intermittent shortfalls are made up by importing energy much of which come from nuclear sites dotted around the EU.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Professer E on December 04, 2020, 01:37:28 pm
If you guys want to see a total environmental catastrophe,  check out the facilities that process the dirt containing REE into all those fancy metals..... And the waste is normally radioactive to boot.

Wonder metals..... It's a wonder anything is left of the planet after extraction.   The real cost of that phone in your pocket, or those solar cells or fancy bearings on that wind turbine.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 01:43:23 pm
Ahh, the wonders of triple baseline accounting! ;D
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: kruddler on December 04, 2020, 01:43:47 pm
The fanciful notion that we can ever replace fossil fuels without embracing nuclear is stupid in the extreme.  I have a 16 panel solar system, NOT because I want them, but rather forced to do so by insane power bills.

I've got the same....and i'm not sure what you are getting, but financially, its not really worth it. The buyback is BS nowadays. When i first got it it was 3x as much.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 01:51:12 pm
I've got the same....and i'm not sure what you are getting, but financially, its not really worth it. The buyback is BS nowadays. When i first got it it was 3x as much.
Yes, that is quite interesting feedback. The tariffs are now being scaled back, and the subsidies / incentives are evaporating as well, further my associates wish good luck for many purchasers if they find the panels do not last the warrantied lifetime. One associate tells me some of the panels are so feeble they should be sold at 1/5th the price and replaced after 5 years for free!

Not only that, but the importers folding well within the time period of the guarantee, long before the liabilities arise, the installers close up as bankrupts leaving a trail of bills and the factory that originally made the stuff is long long gone!
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Gointocarlton on December 04, 2020, 01:52:06 pm
I've got the same....and i'm not sure what you are getting, but financially, its not really worth it. The buyback is BS nowadays. When i first got it it was 3x as much.
But but but, our Green comrades tell us its the way of the future. Little Greta tells us so therefore it must be.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: capcom on December 04, 2020, 02:04:01 pm
Yes, I note the renewable activists a few weeks back lauding the UK for going 3 or 4 months this year without firing up a coal fired plant, but they conveniently neglect to tell you the intermittent shortfalls are made up by importing energy much of which come from nuclear sites dotted around the EU.

I have a great friend in the UK (owns a small house) and her bills are eye watering in the extreme.  Double mine without my solar feed in rebate. 
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 02:07:06 pm
But but but, our Green comrades tell us its the way of the future. Little Greta tells us so therefore it must be.
In fairness @Gointocarlton, those two separate issues, climate change and renewable energy, should probably not be conflated. The little girl is somewhat a pawn without realising the dollars behind "renewable$"!

Renewable energy is deviously correlated with / as green energy, but that is clearly not the case in many instances! As you know, anyone who has viewed a rare earth mine or copper mine knows otherwise! If you really, really, really wanted to save the planet, you be building nuclear plants a decade ago.

There is irony in Australia having one of the worlds largest reserves of uranium not having nuclear because "it's dirty", yet we are about to be paid handsomely for collecting the nuclear waste of other countries and storing it back here, "back where it came from" long before our dirty uranium provided those countries with many gigawatt years of cheap low carbon energy, which now allows them to point those critical fingers at Australia's coal! Some more unsavoury to think about for the weekend!

When do we start returning waste to or taxing the OPEC members for all those car emissions?
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: capcom on December 04, 2020, 02:16:37 pm
Not only that, but the importers folding well within the time period of the guarantee, long before the liabilities arise, the installers close up as bankrupts leaving a trail of bills and the factory that originally made the stuff is long long gone!

Essendon sponsor ... True Value Solar.  Broke and out of business.   
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 02:17:13 pm
I have a great friend in the UK (owns a small house) and her bills are eye watering in the extreme.  Double mine without my solar feed in rebate. 
I've heard it said that in the UK they pay about 6x the energy rate compared to consumers in countries the UK buys it's nuclear top up energy from!

btw., The nuclear top up energy is not nuclear, the UK doesn't buy that dirty stuff, those countries only export green offset energy and have to keep the dirty nuclear to themself! ;D
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 02:18:03 pm
Essendon sponsor ... True Value Solar.  Broke and out of business.   
 Didn't realise they had folded, but there goes the consumers 10 or 20 year warranty on the panels!
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: capcom on December 04, 2020, 02:35:39 pm
Didn't realise they had folded, but there goes the consumers 10 or 20 year warranty on the panels!

Not a great deal different from the overnight "companies" that installed pink batts.  Quick kill.


Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on December 04, 2020, 03:10:47 pm
Not a great deal different from the overnight "companies" that installed pink batts.  Quick kill.
I suppose CheatsFC will beg the AFL or state government for supplementary funding to cover the shortfall from their plummeting memberships and loss of sponsors!

Then they will argue they deserve the prime time slots because they are the biggest most popular highest rating club in the land!

This has weird parallels to another thread that we debate today!
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: capcom on December 04, 2020, 03:23:32 pm
Might find ourselves in a similar position with Virgin.  As will the AFL.  Qantas might not wanna touch them again, but there's another carrier out there :) 
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on December 04, 2020, 05:45:26 pm
Might find ourselves in a similar position with Virgin.  As will the AFL.  Qantas might not wanna touch them again, but there's another carrier out there :) 
Cap...whats your opinion on Rex getting into the domestic capital city routes?.. how does that work for Qantas when the govt have bailed them out but allowed Rex to compete with them on a couple of major routes.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: capcom on December 04, 2020, 06:52:43 pm
Hi EB.  Zero.  By the time Qantas ramps up, they'll swamp them with schedules / capacity and fares.  They have no background in jet operations, airport gate management, and will need far greater staff numbers with checkins at airports where they might become a familiar entity.  Never happens overnight.  The killing blow where they expect regional route integration with the mainline MEL SYD BNE jets is fantasy when their far more powerful rival services those same smaller ports.

A fleet of SAAB 34 seat turbos is a LOT different to operating 737s as well.  It'll be a sick repeat of Compass and Impulse.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on December 04, 2020, 10:25:34 pm
Hi EB.  Zero.  By the time Qantas ramps up, they'll swamp them with schedules / capacity and fares.  They have no background in jet operations, airport gate management, and will need far greater staff numbers with checkins at airports where they might become a familiar entity.  Never happens overnight.  The killing blow where they expect regional route integration with the mainline MEL SYD BNE jets is fantasy when their far more powerful rival services those same smaller ports.

A fleet of SAAB 34 seat turbos is a LOT different to operating 737s as well.  It'll be a sick repeat of Compass and Impulse.
They have been spruking cheaper fares but with all those setup costs you listed I cant see how they will make a dollar. They are really foreign owned which I didnt know, share price has been flying(pardon the pun), up 14% today to an all time 5 year high and they pay a handy 6% dividend too. 100,000 tickets on sale starting at $79 Melb to Syd, they have backing from a Asia Pacific Finance group called PAG holdings who manage 40 Billion dollars worth of dough and have already sunk 200 mill into Rex.
PAG have two directors now on the Rex board, given the background of the Rex Chairman Lim Kim Hai and PAGs investment this is essentially a foreign airline operating under the Rex banner so I dont get why our Government are allowing them to operate the City routes when Qantas are sacking staff and on the drip feed for money.
Throw in Virgin and its a real mess IMO.....

 
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: capcom on December 04, 2020, 11:07:57 pm
They have been spruking cheaper fares but with all those setup costs you listed I cant see how they will make a dollar. They are really foreign owned which I didnt know, share price has been flying(pardon the pun), up 14% today to an all time 5 year high and they pay a handy 6% dividend too. 100,000 tickets on sale starting at $79 Melb to Syd, they have backing from a Asia Pacific Finance group called PAG holdings who manage 40 Billion dollars worth of dough and have already sunk 200 mill into Rex.
PAG have two directors now on the Rex board, given the background of the Rex Chairman Lim Kim Hai and PAGs investment this is essentially a foreign airline operating under the Rex banner so I dont get why our Government are allowing them to operate the City routes when Qantas are sacking staff and on the drip feed for money.
Throw in Virgin and its a real mess IMO.....

I know Kim Hai personally ... and an ultra low opinion of the man.  They are entitled to operate as they have an AOC (Air Ops Certificate) and can add (when licenced over a city pair) any route they wish to their network.  BTW, Rex would not exist without the death of Ansett and of Kendell airlines and Hazelton airlines, both owned and affiliates of the AN mainline.

They ain't seen anything yet and are totally out of their league.  They will never survive on the two highest density routes in Australia and they're headed for a major fail and fall.

Arrogant SOBs.  The terminal lease costs alone will see them off, even if they secure the space.  Virgin and Qantas hold all of the prime real estate at MEL / SYD / BNE.  Operating RPT (regular public transport) brings with it enormous dollars in expense.  

EDIT - Tiger didn't last either
              


Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on March 03, 2021, 01:00:25 pm
Interesting to read about the new Mercedes Hybrids being release, C200 and C300 in both Petrol and Diesel variants, no more V8 or V6, all will be Turbo4.

But performance is extreme, the C300 Turbo 4 Diesel Hybrid outperforms most of the older V6 and V8 models, with 0 to 100 KPH in about 5.2s, and does it with 6ltr/100km fuel efficiency.

I suspect the next step for Mercedes will be Hydrogen Hybrids with at home off-grid hydrogen generation and battery recharge.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on March 03, 2021, 03:50:43 pm
Interesting to read about the new Mercedes Hybrids being release, C200 and C300 in both Petrol and Diesel variants, no more V8 or V6, all will be Turbo4.

But performance is extreme, the C300 Turbo 4 Diesel Hybrid outperforms most of the older V6 and V8 models, with 0 to 100 KPH in about 5.2s, and does it with 6ltr/100km fuel efficiency.

I suspect the next step for Mercedes will be Hydrogen Hybrids with at home off-grid hydrogen generation and battery recharge.
Think the Tesla Model S Plaid does 0-60kmh in 2.28s(without rollout subtracted), thats insane .....
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on March 03, 2021, 03:58:23 pm
Think the Tesla Model S Plaid does 0-60kmh in 2.28s(without rollout subtracted), thats insane .....
That's 2.1s for 0-100km/hr for the Plaid+ 2022 model, as touted.

There is a bit of a trick here with the Tesla, I've got mates who own various Tesla with all the major high performance AWD models covered. None of that high performance comes off the shelf, you have to go through a lot of procedures and pre-heat the battery and motors to get anywhere near that performance, if the warm up is not followed the current protection circuits prevent the required power levels. Just doing this once, destroys about half your charge/range, there are a few guys who do chop jobs on having them setup for off-road drags! It's a bit tricky to get the peak performance out, like baking a soufflé!

Having said that, even the stock standard 100D pins you to the non-stain white leather seats when you floor the accelerator. Some people may find the non-stain leather quite useful!
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: kruddler on March 03, 2021, 05:55:30 pm
Mitsubishi are supposedly releasing a hybrid triton next year.

First hybrid ute i believe.
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: Gointocarlton on March 03, 2021, 07:46:32 pm
Mitsubishi are supposedly releasing a hybrid triton next year.

First hybrid ute i believe.
Ewww
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: LP on March 03, 2021, 08:13:56 pm
Ewww
 Transurban will buy a brace!
Title: Re: Electric Vehicles
Post by: spf on March 04, 2021, 02:59:11 pm
That's 2.1s for 0-100km/hr for the Plaid+ 2022 model, as touted.

There is a bit of a trick here with the Tesla, I've got mates who own various Tesla with all the major high performance AWD models covered. None of that high performance comes off the shelf, you have to go through a lot of procedures and pre-heat the battery and motors to get anywhere near that performance, if the warm up is not followed the current protection circuits prevent the required power levels. Just doing this once, destroys about half your charge/range, there are a few guys who do chop jobs on having them setup for off-road drags! It's a bit tricky to get the peak performance out, like baking a soufflé!

Having said that, even the stock standard 100D pins you to the non-stain white leather seats when you floor the accelerator. Some people may find the non-stain leather quite useful!

So I can lose my licence in under 3 seconds? That is quite impressive.