CV and mad panic behaviour

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Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4035 – July 25, 2021, 08:23:02 am

Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 on July 25, 2021, 12:41:01 am

Agree, More people will embrace the vaccines when there is more choice for all age groups, if you have 3-4 to choose from instead of being railroaded into one because of your age then citizens will feel in control of their own destiny.
Having a medically unqualified PM going against his vaccine advisory groups medical advice and pushing one vaccine to suit his political and economic agenda isnt going to fly in a country with low infection levels. Either is telling a citizen who is 60 and one day old you cant have the same vaccine as a citizen who is 59 and 364 days old...

I don't know thats true about the PM going against advisory groups. The advice from ATAGI has always been to consult your GP with all vaccines, IIRC that's what the both the PM and Andrews said when it was suggested that younger people could get AZ if they wanted to. Re the 60 +/- 1 day, I remember both an AMA guy and an ATAGI or TGA rep saying its a line in the sand they had to draw, that is they had to pick a number (with some science) but speak to your GP.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4036 – July 25, 2021, 08:52:23 am

I know these demos are giving me the irrits. It's a very bad look for law and order.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4037 – July 25, 2021, 09:00:14 am

Quote from: Thryleon on July 24, 2021, 11:43:46 pm

Give them time, let them come to terms that covid is here to stay and let natural selection take its course.

Bad luck for those who legitimately can't get vaccination, they risk greater harm for the preservation of rights for the deniers!

No accountability for making a choice that harms others, didn't @Mav already take you through this?

The freedom of choice can be preserved, but with consequences when that choice harms others.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4038 – July 25, 2021, 09:35:01 am

Quote from: Gointocarlton on July 25, 2021, 08:23:02 am

I don't know thats true about the PM going against advisory groups. The advice from ATAGI has always been to consult your GP with all vaccines, IIRC that's what the both the PM and Andrews said when it was suggested that younger people could get AZ if they wanted to. Re the 60 +/- 1 day, I remember both an AMA guy and an ATAGI or TGA rep saying its a line in the sand they had to draw, that is they had to pick a number (with some science) but speak to your GP.

That was pushing the responsibility onto GPs, you go to a GP and they only give you the pros and cons, they don't want to make hard recommendations.
The advice was no AZ for under 60s from ATAGI, it was Scomo who pushed for younger people to have it and not ATAGI even with GP advice.. He has been lobbying them to change their advice officially.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4039 – July 25, 2021, 09:40:40 am

Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 on July 25, 2021, 09:35:01 am

That was pushing the responsibility onto GPs, you go to a GP and they only give you the pros and cons, they don't want to make hard recommendations.
The advice was no AZ for under 60s from ATAGI, it was Scomo who pushed for younger people to have it and not ATAGI even with GP advice.. He has been lobbying them to change their advice officially.

Mine did.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4040 – July 25, 2021, 09:46:15 am

Quote from: LP on July 25, 2021, 09:00:14 am

Bad luck for those who legitimately can't get vaccination, they risk greater harm for the preservation of rights for the deniers!

No accountability for making a choice that harms others, didn't @Mav already take you through this?

The freedom of choice can be preserved, but with consequences when that choice harms others.

Who can't get vaccinated?

You guys go from take-off to 6th gear with this stuff.

Mavs post is still hypothetical and he even stated he's not qualified to say.

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/

Spf's video shows growing transmission with vaccination not decreasing, because people are still transmitting the virus, and you aren't immune from it, the vaccine decreases likelihood of serious hospitalisation because the immune response is accelerated.

At this point, its too early to make that claim and force vaccination. The only benefit is in hospital care and cost of that.

Let's see how UK goes through winter (currently summer when covid virtually vanished last year) and then we can determine using the science and data as to whether or not mandatory vaccination is any different.

I understand the hypothetical that it could lead to less transmission but if people aren't sick they won't get tested and they might not even worry and continue infecting others anyway.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4041 – July 25, 2021, 09:50:44 am

Quote from: Gointocarlton on July 25, 2021, 09:40:40 am

Mine did.

I'm talking more younger folk with no existing conditions and the offer of AZ, my son was supplied with info and said the choice was his.. Older folk with pre existing conditions on certain meds would come with more medical evidence to support a recommendation. ie my daughters MIL to be has clots behind one eye and other issues and was told no AZ or Pfizer... Maybe Novavax if and when approved but nothing for now..

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4042 – July 25, 2021, 10:59:11 am

Quote from: Gointocarlton on July 25, 2021, 09:40:40 am

Mine did.

Mine too.

My GP basically talked through the risks of both vaccine and Sars-CoV-2, then I asked him what he would do and he recommended I get whatever vaccine you can get as quickly as possible. But I realise my GP he has been volunteering on the COVID-19 front line at several of the big Melbourne Metro hospitals since the 1st wave.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4043 – July 25, 2021, 11:05:07 am

Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 on July 25, 2021, 09:50:44 am

. ie my daughters MIL to be has clots behind one eye and other issues and was told no AZ or Pfizer... Maybe Novavax if and when approved but nothing for now..

Your daughters MIL is a prime example of why the rest of us should get vaccinated, because there are many people who cannot be vaccinated for whatever reason, including those who develop no immunity from vaccines, those vulnerable groups all rely on herd immunity levels being achieved, the only way to protect them is to reduce the risk of transmission.

People act with a veneer of care, even the naysayers and anti-vaxxers often claim they do what they do because they fear for others, but actions expose reality. I think to claim empathy and care, it is reasonable to think a demonstration of doing the right thing by others as well as self is a basic measure.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4044 – July 25, 2021, 12:56:12 pm

I feel sorry for Stephen Harmon's family, the Hillsong apparatchik (Scomo's Church) who poked fun at vaccinations on social media, dead from COVID-19 at only 34 years of age.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UijhbHvxWrA
It was just a flesh wound.

I wonder if profit is sometimes a primary motivation for faith, how much wealth he would have potentially reaped if he had only survived the bet he placed.

How many people listened to him, how many of those people have or will share his fate!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4045 – July 25, 2021, 03:01:44 pm

https://www.smh.com.au/national/if-sky-can-put-jones-dangerous-stuff-to-air-what-can-t-you-put-on-australian-tv-20210723-p58cgx.html

Only the first section is relevant.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4046 – July 25, 2021, 04:19:22 pm

Scientists warn of different Covid variants combining and sharing traits as infections rise, the Independent.

Apparently, the fear is there’ll be “recombination events” where 2 variants share dangerous traits.

Quote

In the early days of the pandemic, due to the limited genetic diversity of Sars-CoV-2 at the time, recombination was seen as largely inconsequential, with similar-looking variants exchanging much of the same genetic coding between each other.
“It has happened, but it hasn’t happened in such a way that it’s caused, as far as I’m aware, a major advantage to the virus,” said Prof Thomson.
But as the virus continues to spread – particularly in countries where it is given free rein to do so – it will build up genetic diversity that could make recombination more pronounced, and produce an offspring variant that carries concerning characteristics.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4047 – July 25, 2021, 04:25:14 pm

Quote from: PaulP on July 25, 2021, 03:01:44 pm

https://www.smh.com.au/national/if-sky-can-put-jones-dangerous-stuff-to-air-what-can-t-you-put-on-australian-tv-20210723-p58cgx.html

Only the first section is relevant.

Dont disagree on Peter Fitzsimons views on Jones and Kelly, they are unqualified to be giving those opinions and Sky shouldnt be airing them...the irrelevant section did make me laugh, where Fitzsimons bags out Jeff Bezos and other large scale entrepreneurs for indulging in some spacecraft recreation and references the rich and the poor argument.
Of course he didnt or forgot to mention he drives a very expensive Tesla and that the proceeds of that purchase went to another Space Voyager entrepreneur in Elon Musk and that both Peter and his overpaid TV personality wife who likes her coin are probably one of the few who can afford such a new age Electric car. I guess if you are going to do your bit for the planet then Peter and Lisa want to do it in style but we wont tell those poor folk that Jeff and Elon are meant to have overlooked.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4048 – July 25, 2021, 05:11:44 pm

God, how I hate those two shoutheads.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #4049 – July 25, 2021, 05:20:29 pm

I think I heard correctly, news reports that new modelling out of the US predicting back up to 800+ deaths a day from Delta by October. Daily cases are driving towards 43,000, not good.