Carlton Supporters Club

The after match thread. Enjoy!

Phew! We should be called the ‘Brinks’. This  team continually takes us to the brink. Imagine if we had lost today - 16th instead of 11th.

Good to see a win. We can’t be left in the bottom 4. It will show little to almost no improvement. Had me worried in the last 4 mins.

Great win against a side in top form with 5-6 of our best 22 out

Walsh, Weitering, Saad, McKay, Owies (fantastic debut & what a saving tackle), Fogarty and even old Eddie Betts (I didn’t see that coming) were great

Our much maligned  recruits also didn’t look too bad! Dow started very well,  SPS showed why he should he played through the middle, Cunningham was electric and Stocker battled hard out of position.

Carried Cripps for most of the day, but it was nice too see him kick one on the run at the end.

On the negatives, Newnes, Casboult continue to struggle, McGovern’s journey has gone from bad to worse, but hopefully the cavalry is arriving with TDK, Silvagni, Martin & Williams expected to resume soon.

Nice to beat the bombers, go blues!

Great result. Even when time looked to be the scums enemy I wasn't confident at all. Want to review the game before giving my thoughts but I will say one thing. I think everyone would agree on this website that Sam Walsh is capable of winning a Brownlow one day, but let me ask you this. Will he win it this year? Just a superman performance again. The clear difference between winning and losing.

I will take that win. What I liked was the lesser lights had some impact and kept us in the game when we were struggling.

Still have a lot of outs and McGovern injury is the only low light imo. Can Walsh get any better. He is an out and out star who must be AA to this point.

Everyone knows I rate Cunningham highly and I hope supporters can now see why.  He is calm in traffic, smart user and a reliable around goal and has outside run we lacked. He will be one of our starting midfielders imo for the next 10 years and I just hope he had string a solid season without injuries.

How much pressure gets released when a guy like Owies comes in and kicks straight?

Great win against a more talented side according to the channel 7 commentary team.

Harry equal leader of the Coleman.

A win vs Essendon with Sheedy in the crowd is always pleasing....thought Cuningham was good vs his favourite opposition team and Saad was again in our best vs his old mob.
 Walsh was BOG and seems to get better very game if thats possible and Weitering held the backline together...
McGovern didnt get a lot of ball but did chase with intent, laid some good tackles and was unlucky to get injured again, one of his better games IMO and with Betts and Owies sniffing some ball he looked a better player and more team focussed.
He also stood up when that scuffle broke out and I like players who get in and fly the flag.
While the Bulldogs look a hard mountain to climb next game we can enjoy this win and rejoice in a Bomber loss.....

Fogarty, Betts and Owies all did their bit.

Cuners, Stocker and Parks - all good - and will get better.

Put Williams, Martin, Fisher in the 22 - adds a lot of class and polish. A hell of a lot.

JSOS in for Guv if the latter has a done a hammy.

Plowman is a worry, opposition playing through his man a lot and they're kicking a heap of goals on him. Panicking badly when caught one on one.

I like Parks does his job in the air and was deceptively fast with his tackle of tippa , it was right in front of me at the game and he read the play to create the opportunity to tackle and then  nailed it. More impressive than anything I’ve seen Williamson do lately.

Great win against a more talented side according to the channel 7 commentary team.

Apparently their u23s are better than ours.   FFS - Weitering, Harry and Walsh could all be All Australian this year!!

Good to get the win, but the numbers are a worry. We just took our opportunities more than they did.

Good to get the win, but the numbers are a worry. We just took our opportunities more than they did.

And that's all you have to do sometimes....

No question, there's a lot to improve, but we could have lost by 16 and another honourable loss....

I like Parks does his job in the air and was deceptively fast with his tackle of tippa , it was right in front of me at the game and he read the play to create the opportunity to tackle and then  nailed it. More impressive than anything I’ve seen Williamson do lately.

Thought Parks showed some good signs but he had his problems with Harrison who outmarked and kicked goals on him.
Parks plays tall but we sold him a tough task playing on a 196cm player even if he is a kid.

The Hun (Acting as Flubbo's Proxy) is going to try and assert we played BiGH with COVID symptoms without getting a COVID test.

The Hun (Acting as Flubbo's Proxy) is going to try and assert we played BiGH with COVID symptoms without getting a COVID test.

Teague addressed that in the post match - said he had the test and all clear.

That was a game we probably would have lost 2 years ago.

Progress.

Thought all our (maligned at selection) ins (Dow , Owies, Parks) went OK.
I liked Dow's game until he was hurt (also liked SPS when he came on to replace him)

Owies' 3 goals justified his selection.

A significant moment in the game was Parks' tackle on Tippa.
I reckon that had a lifting effect on the side.

Walsh- Outstanding

Happy with the win.
One aspect I still think we're developing is the team -work and understanding.
Knowing where the team-mates are in the contest and backing up.
That will improve with a more settled line-up over a number of games....if we can achieve that.

Looking to next week.
Will that game take a physical toll?
McGovern looks likely to miss.
Dow is listed as an 'eye' rather than 'concussion' so may be OK to play.
The game may have been a little 'bruise free', except for some notable patches, which may leave a few pockets lighter.
But there was a fair bit of running so from that aspect it may have a physical effect next week.

Thought Parks showed some good signs but he had his problems with Harrison who outmarked and kicked goals on him.
Parks plays tall but we sold him a tough task playing on a 196cm player even if he is a kid.

Yeah Jones is going to be a very good player, but he is still very slight and shouldn't be able to fly for three marks inside 30 metres without any body contact.

Thought all our (maligned at selection) ins (Dow , Owies, Parks) went OK.
I liked Dow's game until he was hurt (also liked SPS when he came on to replace him)

Owies' 3 goals justified his selection.

A significant moment in the game was Parks' tackle on Tippa.
I reckon that had a lifting effect on the side.

Walsh- Outstanding

Happy with the win.
One aspect I still think we're developing is the team -work and understanding.
Knowing where the team-mates are in the contest and backing up.
That will improve with a more settled line-up over a number of games....if we can achieve that.

Looking to next week.
Will that game take a physical toll?
McGovern looks likely to miss.
Dow is listed as an 'eye' rather than 'concussion' so may be OK to play.
The game may have been a little 'bruise free', except for some notable patches, which may leave a few pockets lighter.
But there was a fair bit of running so from that aspect it may have a physical effect next week.

Apparently no ice on the Guv left hammy post game.

We'll see...

Yeah Jones is going to be a very good player, but he is still very slight and shouldn't be able to fly for three marks inside 30 metres without any body contact.

Parks too  ;D

Apparently no ice on the Guv left hammy post game.

We'll see...

It happened so late, and he tried to run it off.  It may have simply been a cramp.

When your muscles cramp up and lock that can happen, and it may not necessarily be anything more than fatigue.

Plowman is a worry, opposition playing through his man a lot and they're kicking a heap of goals on him. Panicking badly when caught one on one.

Please back it up Prof, or did you post this because it's harder to pot Murph when he's not in the side?
- how many times did they play through his man?
- how many goals were kicked by his man?

Dare I say that SPS coming onto the ground was when the game changed? His reading of the play on several occasions and clean hands with efficient disposal through the centre seemed to calm the team down.

Walsh was just tough, skilful and relentless. I wish he'd lower his eyes around goals though.

Owies was what we needed up forward, pressure and toughness from a small. Good return for a second gamer, who wasn't over awed by the big crowd.

Eddie was good, but played the same game as last week, he just kicked the goals this week.

McGovern was better and did present well, chased and competed. Loved the jumper punches, but now he's gone again.

Good to see Harry actually get some holding call for a change, happens every week, but I bet he doesn't get them against the Bulldogs. Another 5 to equal his year high tally and it's only round 7.

Cuningham was a difference maker in the middle, his movement and pace was something that Essendon did not handle well.

Saad and Docherty were very good, but there is little chemistry between them, unlike Simpson and Docherty who seemed to know where each other is at all times.

Jones lowered his colour for the first time this season and Weitering was guarding a decoy to closely. Plowman is always on a hiding to nothing. Tipper got two of his goals from running ahead of the play and hoping, Plowman was setting up in defence playing the percentages, they get a lucky win around the contest twice, the ball is kicked into space Tipper runs into an open goal. If Plowman stand right on him then the ball goes through the right space and we get opened up more often.

Parks, alright in the air, seems lost around a stoppage and very ordinary when the ball in on the ground. Poor kick as well, if we are thinking Parks is the answer, then we're in real trouble.

In fact we had; Parks, Owies, Gibbons, Cotteral, all playing this week, when our high draft picks are in the two's, yep sure these guys give effort, but they are just average players, add to the the other averages out there like Newnes and Casboult and this is why we are an average team.

Which brings me to the elephant in the room Cripps. He is a liability. He does not hunt the ball like he used to, Walsh now does that and what Cripps should be doing is blocking for Walsh and occasionally getting the ball. If we do not get the ball and the oppositin clear it we are playing one man down. As was happening a lot today, you wait til next week when the Dogs have their set up, with two quick handballs and then everyone scampers. Cripps cannot be played anywhere else, so that's why we don't have midfield rotations, that's why SPS and Stocker are playing down back, Setterfield and Kennedy are playing in the twos and other mids, like Ramsay will be lucky to get a look in. It's fortunate for Cuningham and Fogarty that Williams is injured or they wouldn't get much of a look either. For Carlton to blossom we have to get rid of Cripps.

Dow and McGovern out through injury, Newnes, Gibbons and Casboult should be out as well as they have been crap for weeks.

SPS for Dow, deKoning for Casboult, Philip for McGovern, Ramsay for Gibbons and Setterfield for Newnes. Start Setterfield/Cuningham at CHF and have him swap with Cripps after the centre bounce, that way Wood has to pick Cripps up rather than float as a spare against Harry. It won't happen but it should, David King has said it for a while now, we are being too nice at selection, a ruthless dropping of many may shock these under achievers into gear.

Yeah Jones is going to be a very good player, but he is still very slight and shouldn't be able to fly for three marks inside 30 metres without any body contact.

Apologies for messing his name up, was half right.. Jones it is..

Thought all our (maligned at selection) ins (Dow , Owies, Parks) went OK.
I liked Dow's game until he was hurt (also liked SPS when he came on to replace him)

Dow played 14 minutes, had 4 clearances (4th best for the side), 5 contested possession and 2 inside 50's.   You can probably cut that back to 10 minutes as he ran around with one eye for a bit.   It was a shame as he looked set for a good game.

Funny what happens when you play an inside mid as inside mid and not a half forward with bursts in the middle.  

That was a game we probably would have lost 2 years ago.

Progress.

And they were coming off a 'big' win.....

Dare I say that SPS coming onto the ground was when the game changed? His reading of the play on several occasions and clean hands with efficient disposal through the centre seemed to calm the team down.

Walsh was just tough, skilful and relentless. I wish he'd lower his eyes around goals though.

Owies was what we needed up forward, pressure and toughness from a small. Good return for a second gamer, who wasn't over awed by the big crowd.

Eddie was good, but played the same game as last week, he just kicked the goals this week.

McGovern was better and did present well, chased and competed. Loved the jumper punches, but now he's gone again.

Good to see Harry actually get some holding call for a change, happens every week, but I bet he doesn't get them against the Bulldogs. Another 5 to equal his year high tally and it's only round 7.

Cuningham was a difference maker in the middle, his movement and pace was something that Essendon did not handle well.

Saad and Docherty were very good, but there is little chemistry between them, unlike Simpson and Docherty who seemed to know where each other is at all times.

Jones lowered his colour for the first time this season and Weitering was guarding a decoy to closely. Plowman is always on a hiding to nothing. Tipper got two of his goals from running ahead of the play and hoping, Plowman was setting up in defence playing the percentages, they get a lucky win around the contest twice, the ball is kicked into space Tipper runs into an open goal. If Plowman stand right on him then the ball goes through the right space and we get opened up more often.

Parks, alright in the air, seems lost around a stoppage and very ordinary when the ball in on the ground. Poor kick as well, if we are thinking Parks is the answer, then we're in real trouble.

In fact we had; Parks, Owies, Gibbons, Cotteral, all playing this week, when our high draft picks are in the two's, yep sure these guys give effort, but they are just average players, add to the the other averages out there like Newnes and Casboult and this is why we are an average team.

Which brings me to the elephant in the room Cripps. He is a liability. He does not hunt the ball like he used to, Walsh now does that and what Cripps should be doing is blocking for Walsh and occasionally getting the ball. If we do not get the ball and the oppositin clear it we are playing one man down. As was happening a lot today, you wait til next week when the Dogs have their set up, with two quick handballs and then everyone scampers. Cripps cannot be played anywhere else, so that's why we don't have midfield rotations, that's why SPS and Stocker are playing down back, Setterfield and Kennedy are playing in the twos and other mids, like Ramsay will be lucky to get a look in. It's fortunate for Cuningham and Fogarty that Williams is injured or they wouldn't get much of a look either. For Carlton to blossom we have to get rid of Cripps.

Dow and McGovern out through injury, Newnes, Gibbons and Casboult should be out as well as they have been crap for weeks.

SPS for Dow, deKoning for Casboult, Philip for McGovern, Ramsay for Gibbons and Setterfield for Newnes. Start Setterfield/Cuningham at CHF and have him swap with Cripps after the centre bounce, that way Wood has to pick Cripps up rather than float as a spare against Harry. It won't happen but it should, David King has said it for a while now, we are being too nice at selection, a ruthless dropping of many may shock these under achievers into gear.

No Williams?

No Williams?

Rumour is he has an achillies injury..

I thought Jones was kept deeper today, probably to restrict his intercept marking and forward drive from the wing, hardly had a touch before 1/2 time.

I thought that the melee fired Cripps up and although he shanked one kick,  was a lot better  from then on

Rumour is he has an achillies injury..

ok, wow....

Hope Martin's back soon.

Rumour is he has an achillies injury..

He had general soreness but regularly has issues with his Achilles. Missed all of 2019 with it.

Thought Parks showed some good signs but he had his problems with Harrison who outmarked and kicked goals on him.
Parks plays tall but we sold him a tough task playing on a 196cm player even if he is a kid.

I thought two of those times Parks had him covered only for Jones to come from nowhere trying to spoil and only succeed in knocking Parks out of the way or off balance.  Jones has a way of doing that to all our defenders!🙄

Raydan made the observation regarding SPS.  He was for the better part clean but still riled about the all too brief cameos and the lazy stuff, even today.

At least we kept the friggin' pill in our fwd half reasonably well

I will take that win. What I liked was the lesser lights had some impact and kept us in the game when we were struggling.

Still have a lot of outs and McGovern injury is the only low light imo. Can Walsh get any better. He is an out and out star who must be AA to this point.

Everyone knows I rate Cunningham highly and I hope supporters can now see why.  He is calm in traffic, smart user and a reliable around goal and has outside run we lacked. He will be one of our starting midfielders imo for the next 10 years and I just hope he had string a solid season without injuries.

Was very good today, no doubt he has talent. Its what he brings next week, the week after, the week after that, and so on  that counts. You dont get the nickname Cameo Cunners for no reason. Mind you, he has a few mates in that dept, no 5 for example who I will say was also very good today. Must have got the rocket he needed being dropped.

Great win against a side in top form with 5-6 of our best 22 out

Walsh, Weitering, Saad, McKay, Owies (fantastic debut & what a saving tackle), Fogarty and even old Eddie Betts (I didn’t see that coming) were great

Our much maligned  recruits also didn’t look too bad! Dow started very well,  SPS showed why he should he played through the middle, Cunningham was electric and Stocker battled hard out of position.

Carried Cripps for most of the day, but it was nice too see him kick one on the run at the end.

On the negatives, Newnes, Casboult continue to struggle, McGovern’s journey has gone from bad to worse, but hopefully the cavalry is arriving with TDK, Silvagni, Martin & Williams expected to resume soon.

Nice to beat the bombers, go blues!

Word is Williams has a bad achilles and may miss more.

He had general soreness but regularly has issues with his Achilles. Missed all of 2019 with it.

He seems to start games ok  but then tends to fade out, I'm no expert on achillies injuries but is fading out a symptom or maybe a pain killing jab wearing off with more running? Has been getting run down and tackled and lacking that zip to get away later in games too...

Harry equal leader of the Coleman.

One behind Tex

Raydan made the observation regarding SPS.  He was for the better part clean but still riled about the all too brief cameos and the lazy stuff, even today.

At least we kept the friggin' pill in our fwd half reasonably well

SPS took a nice mark down back at an important time, thought that was a crucial time late  in the game so I gave him points for that.
Maybe he can be a professional medical sub if he can keep that up... :-X

Nice to have a win but not convinced yet, still making too many errors for my taste. Walsh an absolute star! Let’s see what happens next week.

Dare I say that SPS coming onto the ground was when the game changed? His reading of the play on several occasions and clean hands with efficient disposal through the centre seemed to calm the team down.

Walsh was just tough, skilful and relentless. I wish he'd lower his eyes around goals though.

Owies was what we needed up forward, pressure and toughness from a small. Good return for a second gamer, who wasn't over awed by the big crowd.

Eddie was good, but played the same game as last week, he just kicked the goals this week.

McGovern was better and did present well, chased and competed. Loved the jumper punches, but now he's gone again.

Good to see Harry actually get some holding call for a change, happens every week, but I bet he doesn't get them against the Bulldogs. Another 5 to equal his year high tally and it's only round 7.

Cuningham was a difference maker in the middle, his movement and pace was something that Essendon did not handle well.

Saad and Docherty were very good, but there is little chemistry between them, unlike Simpson and Docherty who seemed to know where each other is at all times.

Jones lowered his colour for the first time this season and Weitering was guarding a decoy to closely. Plowman is always on a hiding to nothing. Tipper got two of his goals from running ahead of the play and hoping, Plowman was setting up in defence playing the percentages, they get a lucky win around the contest twice, the ball is kicked into space Tipper runs into an open goal. If Plowman stand right on him then the ball goes through the right space and we get opened up more often.

Parks, alright in the air, seems lost around a stoppage and very ordinary when the ball in on the ground. Poor kick as well, if we are thinking Parks is the answer, then we're in real trouble.

In fact we had; Parks, Owies, Gibbons, Cotteral, all playing this week, when our high draft picks are in the two's, yep sure these guys give effort, but they are just average players, add to the the other averages out there like Newnes and Casboult and this is why we are an average team.

Which brings me to the elephant in the room Cripps. He is a liability. He does not hunt the ball like he used to, Walsh now does that and what Cripps should be doing is blocking for Walsh and occasionally getting the ball. If we do not get the ball and the oppositin clear it we are playing one man down. As was happening a lot today, you wait til next week when the Dogs have their set up, with two quick handballs and then everyone scampers. Cripps cannot be played anywhere else, so that's why we don't have midfield rotations, that's why SPS and Stocker are playing down back, Setterfield and Kennedy are playing in the twos and other mids, like Ramsay will be lucky to get a look in. It's fortunate for Cuningham and Fogarty that Williams is injured or they wouldn't get much of a look either. For Carlton to blossom we have to get rid of Cripps.

Dow and McGovern out through injury, Newnes, Gibbons and Casboult should be out as well as they have been crap for weeks.

SPS for Dow, deKoning for Casboult, Philip for McGovern, Ramsay for Gibbons and Setterfield for Newnes. Start Setterfield/Cuningham at CHF and have him swap with Cripps after the centre bounce, that way Wood has to pick Cripps up rather than float as a spare against Harry. It won't happen but it should, David King has said it for a while now, we are being too nice at selection, a ruthless dropping of many may shock these under achievers into gear.

Like all that except I reckon you're harsh of Parks, Owies, Gibbo and Cotts (although I thought Gibbo was ordinary today). I reckon there is plenty to work with with Parks and Cotts. Both are animals who love it tough and hard and they give as much as they get. I can't remember the last time I saw a Carlton player give it to a bloke who he pinged HTB, Parks did today and I loved it. Thats what intent looks like to me. Owies did very well in his first game of the year (kicked straight). So if these blokes keep others out of the side and we win, Im happy with that. What I won't be happy about is if they get dropped for names like Murph, ZW etc and we lose.

As much as it pains me to say, I like the way the Cheats go about it under Rutten. They never give up that's for sure, whether they can maintain that all year is a another story. In any case, until they have Heppell, Hurley and Hooker on their list, they will be Cheats FC to me.

ESSENDON                        6.4      8.7       12.8      16.11 (107)
CARLTON                           4.2      8.5       14.7      19.9 (123)

GOALS
Essendon: Hooker 5, McDonald-Tipungwuti 4, Jones 3, Stringer 3, Smith
Carlton: McKay 4, Betts 3, Owies 3, Cuningham 2, Fogarty 2, Cripps, Curnow, McGovern, Saad, Walsh

BEST
Essendon: McGrath, Hooker, McDonald-Tipungwuti, Stringer, Perkins
Carlton: Walsh, Saad, Curnow, Cuningham, Cripps, Weitering

INJURIES
Essendon: Cox (shoulder)
Carlton: Dow (eye), McGovern (hamstring)

SUBSTITUTES
Essendon: Zaharakis (unused)
Carlton: Petrevski-Seton (replaced Dow in the second quarter)

I note that SPS had 14 possessions in his half a game, while Dow had 6.
I note that Matthew Owies kicked 3. he may well keep his spot.
Gibbo had 17 and 5 clearances.
I liked the fact that Cripps had more kicks than handballs..
I liked that Cunners likes playing against the Drug Cheats. His best 2 games ever have been against them.

Cripps had a stinker. He's right out of form - yet he still managed to have an impact. But Walsh was the difference between the 2 teams.

Gibbo was so bad in the first half. Cheating out the back and looking for cheap kicks. Managed to flick the switch in the second half though and was one of our best. Good sign when a player can collect himself mid-game.

Our backline is still abysmal. So many ultra-soft goals given up.

Cunningham was excellent. Whenever he was taken away from the guts we were less effective. Super important player for us now. No more excuses he's got to progress from here - or Teague has got to PERSIST with him from here. It can't be that he has a poor game and then banished to the forward pocket for the rest of the season - which is exactly what Teague did to him last year.

Oh and Saad was brilliant. Best game for us by a mile. Perfect timing.

I note that SPS had 14 possessions in his half a game, while Dow had 6.

Both did well for the game time they had.

Time on ground %
Dow 14%  6 disposals (4 clearances, 5 contested poss.)
SPS 46%  14 disposals.

Nice of course to get the win. But the stats profile strongly favours the Bombers, and that is the profile of a team that usually wins. We did well to maximise our chances, and the level of efficiency we generated tonight looks good when it come off, but it's atypical and not really sustainable. We need to generate more of everything to beat the better teams.

Happy to have the duffle coat wearers silenced for a week, and hopefully Teague has a stay of execution - not that he deserves to be in that position in the first place, but that's another story.

Cripps had a stinker. He's right out of form - yet he still managed to have an impact. But Walsh was the difference between the 2 teams.

Gibbo was so bad in the first half. Cheating out the back and looking for cheap kicks. Managed to flick the switch in the second half though and was one of our best. Good sign when a player can collect himself mid-game.

Our backline is still abysmal. So many ultra-soft goals given up.

Cunningham was excellent. Whenever he was taken away from the guts we were less effective. Super important player for us now. No more excuses he's got to progress from here - or Teague has got to PERSIST with him from here. It can't be that he has a poor game and then banished to the forward pocket for the rest of the season - which is exactly what Teague did to him last year.

Agree, Cap’n Clanger is still trying to win games all by himself and needs a reset. Walsh is a superstar in the making, hopefully that will happen at CFC. Thought Weiters played a very good game and shows great maturity IMO. Saad was magnificent and we did really well getting him on board. Cunningham was excellent in patches, let’s hope he can move forward to become a more prominent  star rather that a permanent cameo part actor. Thought SPS was much better this game, still too many dinky kicks fo mine but definitely better value as a mid. Owies’ performance cheered me up, promise definitely shown there. Parks I love, he’s got the mongrel that we need as he showed in the tackle on Tippa. Harry will become one of if not the most dangerous big forwards in the AFL from what I can tell now. Finally, thought Eddie was very important to our win, still had it when it was needed. And finally, finally, liked the work of Fogarty. In the end we showed we are capable of gutsing out a tough win against a very determined team containing some good emerging talent.

There’s my “positive take”. Now on to next week. (Dread).

As much as it pains me to say, I like the way the Cheats go about it under Rutten. They never give up that's for sure, whether they can maintain that all year is a another story......................

I agree. They have some gaps that need addressing, but they're not a bad team at all IMO. Last night was very 50/50 until near the end.

Agree, Cap’n Clanger is still trying to win games all by himself and needs a reset. Walsh is a superstar in the making, hopefully that will happen at CFC. Thought Weiters played a very good game and shows great maturity IMO. Saad was magnificent and we did really well getting him on board. Cunningham was excellent in patches, let’s hope he can move forward to become a more prominent  star rather that a permanent cameo part actor. Thought SPS was much better this game, still too many dinky kicks fo mine but definitely better value as a mid. Owies’ performance cheered me up, promise definitely shown there. Parks I love, he’s got the mongrel that we need as he showed in the tackle on Tippa. Harry will become one of if not the most dangerous big forwards in the AFL from what I can tell now. Finally, thought Eddie was very important to our win, still had it when it was needed. And finally, finally, liked the work of Fogarty. In the end we showed we are capable of gutsing out a tough win against a very determined team containing some good emerging talent.

There’s my “positive take”. Now on to next week. (Dread).

We always match up well against the Dogs.

And their defence is definitely their weakness.

Bring the right level of intensity - for 4 quarters - no reason we can't win.

Williams back in (for Gibbons), maybe Brackets out too (JSOS or Kennedy).

Murphy the sub - gets another game marked up?

They'll have English back - and TDK is the perfect foil for him. TDK for Levi seems a no brainer to me.

They have Bailey Williams, Toby McLean and Josh Dunkley sidelined.

I agree. They have some gaps that need addressing, but they're not a bad team at all IMO. Last night was very 50/50 until near the end.

And to be honest, I was surprised we ran out the game the way we did. I said in the in game thread that our blokes looked spent at 3/4 time had spent a lot of petrol tickets. They made a concerted effort to run the game out strongly and get the right result not only for the coach, but more importantly for themselves. As we say after all wins, that's the benchmark, four solid, switched on qtrs, no nanna naps. Execution might have been off in the first but the effort was there.

We always match up well against the Dogs.

And their defence is definitely their weakness.

Bring the right level of intensity - for 4 quarters - no reason we can't win.

Williams back in (for Gibbons), maybe Brackets out too (JSOS or Kennedy).

Murphy the sub - gets another game marked up?

They'll have English back - and TDK is the perfect foil for him. TDK for Levi seems a no brainer to me.

They have Bailey Williams, Toby McLean and Josh Dunkley sidelined.

Agree FB.
In TDK JSOS Williams (if fit)
Out Levi Gov (inj) Gibbo or Newnes.

I'd also give Fogarty or Owies (Fogarty most likely) a role on Caleb Daniel.

Curb his influence and the Dogs lose a lot of potency in their ball movement.

One of the great pleasures that came from the win was wiping that smug grin off Sheedy's face.

... hopefully Teague has a stay of execution - not that he deserves to be in that position in the first place, but that's another story.

Well done to Teague
We point out he's under pressure and scrutiny when the results don't go our way so it's only fair to say that a win relieves that pressure for a bit.
Keep winning and it will be even less of a conversation.

The focus this week will, thankfully, be on others.

The 'ins' worked well for us despite some apprehension in pre-game thoughts.
Most of the match-ups also seemed OK, and where we may have been down in an area it was compensated for in another.

One of the great pleasures that came from the win was wiping that smug grin off Sheedy's face.

Always is and every Cheats supporter for that matter.

It was actually Essendon that tired, midway thru the 3rd quarter.  Saw their backs failing to chase and I was very confident we had them and the momentum.  We, on the other hand, got a second wind.

As much as it pains me to say, I like the way the Cheats go about it under Rutten. They never give up that's for sure, whether they can maintain that all year is a another story. In any case, until they have Heppell, Hurley and Hooker on their list, they will be Cheats FC to me.

Their kids did OK and if you look a bit deeper we coughed up 16 goals which isn't great.
Factor in what they had down back in terms of quality defenders and our win doesn't look as good. I'll take the win but I wouldn't want to see the Bombers get coached by anyone decent as they will be hard work down the track with those kids they have coming through.

Their kids did OK and if you look a bit deeper we coughed up 16 goals which isn't great.
Factor in what they had down back in terms of quality defenders and our win doesn't look as good. I'll take the win but I wouldn't want to see the Bombers get coached by anyone decent as they will be hard work down the track with those kids they have coming through.

When you have a bunch of new kids you get a bit of a free scope, it's free hit time, because the opposition haven't yet seen enough of them to pull their games apart.

It's when the kids are on their 3rd or 4th game against that the tell happens, which is why Walsh and Weitering are so so good!

I thought a lot of fans are being a bit tough on Plowman, they love to whip him. But he along with Parks had a tough gig at the weekend, they were the stay at home guarding 2 or 3 opponents while Jones and Weitering got up the field and intercept marked the footy. Fans have to learn that applauding Weltering or Jones for doing that role comes at a cost to other defenders who get sacrificed. Of course the opposition play through Plowman's or Park's man, because they have 2 or 3 to guard!

But one tell, that Owies tackle in the last, how long since we've seen a SF get to the FB to assist a defender, and what a difference it makes!

I thought a lot of fans are being a bit tough on Plowman, they love to whip him. But he along with Parks had a tough gig at the weekend, they were the stay at home guarding 2 or 3 opponents while Jones and Weitering got up the field and intercept marked the footy. Fans have to learn that applauding Weltering or Jones for doing that role comes at a cost to other defenders who get sacrificed. Of course the opposition play through Plowman's or Park's man, because they have 2 or 3 to guard!

But one tell, that Owies tackle in the last, how long since we've seen a SF get to the FB to assist a defender, and what a difference it makes!

That tackle was a gem, and very important in the scheme of the game.

That tackle alone gets the kid a minimum 4 week stint in the seniors.

He's only just 24 and understands what is required at the elite level.

Appears a strong mark overhead too, which was one of the things that often set Betts apart from his peers.

Hope the young man makes it - efforts like that tackle suggest he has the right stuff.

Was nice to see Sheedy sitting in the stands suffering, I wonder if he had dropped into Windy Hill before hand to sit besides JHird?

Who was Diesel barracking for?

I think our defence works better when we are attacking effectively and not turning the ball over in the middle of the field, eg Cripps left foot kick in the third quarter. Owies, Parks, Cotterel and Gibbons have all come through our Rookie system, and along with Casboult, Curnow, Betts and Saad, this means that over a third of the team were late picks in their draft year. Even though Dow was going ok before he was injured, I thought SPS gave us a real spark when he came on. We have bookends with McKay and Weitering, and a lot of good mid-fielders, we just need greater cohesion and less errors in the middle of the ground. We also need to continue to attack to the end rather than try and put the cue away five minutes out as we did yesterday. They got three goals when the pressure went off, so instead of winning by six we won by three. Good sides like Richmond finish off their opponents. I thought it was a good win by Carlton. Essendon's good players played well, they had confidence from last weeks game against Collingwood and a couple of their young players did well. I thought we were a lot more consistent across the ground. and we kicked more of the goals we should have. Kicking goals when you have the opportunity changes the game. Stringer's miss for them in the last quarter effectively killed the game.

Stringer's miss for them in the last quarter effectively killed the game.

100% agree

For all the good things players can do, it's the bad that defines them!
(Note to Cripps, do like a Stringer and want to be all to everyone and sooner or later you win the poison chalice.)

The differences, that gave us the edge v cheats.com.au whose stats were also strong:
Efficiency - so important in close games.
Walsh - how good is this kid and just how much better will he get!
Some courage/mongrel - great to see Parks, Owies, Gibbo, McGovern, H & Cottrell make important stands against the cheats.

A few other positives:
SPS creativity in the middle should tell the match committee something.
Saad... really getting into stride.
Owies surprised with effectiveness and courage.
Ripper chases from Parks, McGovern and Owies.
You won't see Eddie miss the big sticks two weeks in row.
Ed quelled Merrett.
Weiters, the rock.
Doc gaining confidence.
The work that Luke Power has done with Cuningham is really showing - now to back it up with pushing and imposing himself in contests - ball in hand his dash and skill is really dangerous.
Fogary's decision making is impressive.

Disappointment/negatives:
We can be our own worst enemies ie we too often still 'beat ourselves.'
Our start.
Crippa down early but stood up when needed in the last.
Gibbo. But did improve on last week's shocker.
Pitto slow to start but endeavour improved in the 2nd half.
Newnes, workmanlike but we have better to return to the side.
Defensive pressure still needs work - allowing cheats to get 16 gls is way too much, especially our first qtr where Tippa was allowed too much opportunity.
Casboult - liability.

But a win is a win is a win.

First time in ages both sides have kicked 100 in a game.

We beat them at their own outside game, which we wouldn't normally do. If you play a shoot out type of game you'll kick many but you'll give up many too. Type of game that can get you to finals but not sustainable in big finals.

Last time Carlton and Essendon played a game where both kicked 100 was the 1999 PF. Used to be a normal thing in the 70's, 80s and 90s. We'd give up 100 quite often in winning games back then. Different era now though.

Well done to Teague
We point out he's under pressure and scrutiny when the results don't go our way so it's only fair to say that a win relieves that pressure for a bit.
Keep winning and it will be even less of a conversation.

The focus this week will, thankfully, be on others.

The 'ins' worked well for us despite some apprehension in pre-game thoughts.
Most of the match-ups also seemed OK, and where we may have been down in an area it was compensated for in another.

Did I see an emotional tear in the eye of the TT at the end, or was it my imagination??

Did I see an emotional tear in the eye of the TT at the end, or was it my imagination??

Yes, I noticed that, tears of relief?

Agree on SPS....one of his better games and he looked composed with the ball in hand. And I reckon Saad showed exactly why we gave up big to get him. He kicked on goal himself and I reckon his field kicking set up at least another 3. Have said it before, but we've lacked blokes who you'd call "elite" with ball in hand...and he is certainly one of them.

Cunningham, like SPS, looked composed with the ball when he got it. I'd be backing him and Stocker for more time in the middle now along with SPS. Bring Newman back into the HBF and let Stocker have a run in the middle...he doesn't mind the tough stuff.

Loved Owies game and how he stuck to the crowd after that goal from the square. I reckon having him in the side just released Eddie a bit to move up the ground and they both worked well. Harry should've nailed that last one on the sired to make it 5 and equal with Walker in the Coleman.

Cripps was an absolute liability for 3 quarters but he lifted in the last when the game was on the line.

Pitto is crying out for some help in the ruck but just love the way he goes about it every week....smashes in hard.

Is TDK a likely in off the back of a VFL game or need more games? Would love to bring him, Newman and Silvagni in this week.....and sounds like Setterfield was good in the VFL too? Possible outs would be Dow, McGovern and maybe Cottrell and/or Newnes.

Agree on SPS....one of his better games and he looked composed with the ball in hand. And I reckon Saad showed exactly why we gave up big to get him. He kicked on goal himself and I reckon his field kicking set up at least another 3. Have said it before, but we've lacked blokes who you'd call "elite" with ball in hand...and he is certainly one of them.

Cunningham, like SPS, looked composed with the ball when he got it. I'd be backing him and Stocker for more time in the middle now along with SPS. Bring Newman back into the HBF and let Stocker have a run in the middle...he doesn't mind the tough stuff.

Loved Owies game and how he stuck to the crowd after that goal from the square. I reckon having him in the side just released Eddie a bit to move up the ground and they both worked well. Harry should've nailed that last one on the sired to make it 5 and equal with Walker in the Coleman.

Cripps was an absolute liability for 3 quarters but he lifted in the last when the game was on the line.

Pitto is crying out for some help in the ruck but just love the way he goes about it every week....smashes in hard.

Is TDK a likely in off the back of a VFL game or need more games? Would love to bring him, Newman and Silvagni in this week.....and sounds like Setterfield was good in the VFL too? Possible outs would be Dow, McGovern and maybe Cottrell and/or Newnes.

They wont drop Newnes, playing group love him...Kruds man is a bit of a fixture IMO.

I'm a fan of Newnes EB....but his last couple of weeks haven't been as good as some of his earlier games. They might see Setterfield as the replacement for him this week?

I'm a fan of Newnes EB....but his last couple of weeks haven't been as good as some of his earlier games. They might see Setterfield as the replacement for him this week?

Having watched the VFL, I'd rather hold off and see how Newman goes 2nd week back before pulling that trigger!

For me Newman can push forward, but he's also a foundation defender, and can cover guys like Plowman or Parks without sacrificing somebody like SPS in D50. I'm not going to say he's match fit and ready, but he looked lean which will help.

Plus Newman brings a little bit of mongrel.
PS: Loved seeing Owies get in the oppositions face, not something I've pegged him for! Good to see McGovern getting some mongrel as well, pity about the hammy.

We have scope for improvement obviously. I'd roll the dice and play TDK and get rid of Levi who has been next to useless for some time. Gibbons has had plenty of chances also and although he dragged himself up from being just as useless as Levi I'd take another punt on someone from the two's like we did with Owies. Watched the reserves and there were a couple in there who could be considered. Maybe Honey? Kennedy was also playing well in the early game but they seemed to take him off for some time after the main break. Not sure he got back on. Very strange.
Think the next level down players like Newnes and Cottrell get to stay. Happy for Cunningham, I just hope he can follow up this week.
I'm guessing Murphy comes back in this week which is a shame.
Impressed with Parks and Stocker who just go at it hard.
Walsh, clearly best on ground. Ed was his usual reliable self. Backs did OK but a few times they just messed themselves up with indecision or competing against each other.
McKay I thought played really well. Not so much for his goal kicking but he actually bought the ball to the ground more than a couple of times when he had no chance of marking. Good progress by him I feel.
Eddie keeps doing enough to vindicate his selection. Maybe one more week and then a rest?
Cripps was diabolical for 3 quarters. Frustrating at times to watch, but here's some advice. When he FINALLY kicks a team lifting goal on the run from 50, DONT take him off FFS. Just stupid, stupid strategy. Hate it.
Kept waiting for a collapse in the last and got a bit anxious towards the end but we managed to keep going so kudos.

They wont drop Newnes, playing group love him...Kruds man is a bit of a fixture IMO.

Newnes is often overlooked because he doesn't do the flashy stuff. He often outperforms similar players (Kennedy, Setterfield) but gets no kudos.

That being said, his own output has been down slightly of late and we are getting some players back from injury.

Who would you pick? Cottrell, Newnes, Setterfield, Gibbons.

3 in the side currently. Probably lose 1 or 2 more from that group when we have a fit Newman, Martin, fisher, Williams, murphy....

Newnes is often overlooked because he doesn't do the flashy stuff. He often outperforms similar players (Kennedy, Setterfield) but gets no kudos.

That being said, his own output has been down slightly of late and we are getting some players back from injury.

Who would you pick? Cottrell, Newnes, Setterfield, Gibbons.

3 in the side currently. Probably lose 1 or 2 more from that group when we have a fit Newman, Martin, fisher, Williams, murphy....

sMurph is no guarantee to get a gig if Owies keeps hitting the scoreboard, but sMurph could be an in this week from Betts being a tad sore.

I think despite his better 2nd half, Gibbons has a bit of trouble coming. He needs to get back to his old winning the football ways, because he isn't a outside runner!

I thought a lot of fans are being a bit tough on Plowman, they love to whip him. But he along with Parks had a tough gig at the weekend, they were the stay at home guarding 2 or 3 opponents while Jones and Weitering got up the field and intercept marked the footy. Fans have to learn that applauding Weltering or Jones for doing that role comes at a cost to other defenders who get sacrificed. Of course the opposition play through Plowman's or Park's man, because they have 2 or 3 to guard!

But one tell, that Owies tackle in the last, how long since we've seen a SF get to the FB to assist a defender, and what a difference it makes!

As Kenny once sang: You gotta know went to hold em, know when to fold em..."
Its fine for Jones and JW to push up for the intercept but if they mess it up, they leave their mates high and dry. The key to the modern game is how quick you react to what's going on at any point in time. I reckon sometimes, not all the time, the defenders are better off staying home and maintaining shape to defend and force a turnover rather than to attack for the intercept. Fwds and mids need to fold back to guard the middle plus space to then be ready when the turnover comes from defence. I think we are getting that balance wrong at times and are too aggressive. We wont die wondering that's for sure.

Having watched the VFL, I'd rather hold off and see how Newman goes 2nd week back before pulling that trigger!

For me Newman can push forward, but he's also a foundation defender, and can cover guys like Plowman or Parks without sacrificing somebody like SPS in D50. I'm not going to say he's match fit and ready, but he looked lean which will help.

Plus Newman brings a little bit of mongrel.
PS: Loved seeing Owies get in the oppositions face, not something I've pegged him for! Good to see McGovern getting some mongrel as well, pity about the hammy.

And Parks, doesn't take a backward step the lad.

Stocker to become a newer, shinier and slicker version of Joel Selwood in time.....

Stocker to become a newer, shinier and slicker version of Joel Selwood in time.....

Talk about setting the kid up for failure!

And Parks, doesn't take a backward step the lad.

Yep, this is perhaps a not so obvious benefit of older recruits, ones who have spent a season or two in WAFL, SANFL and VFL. 

We have to take the punt IMHO and play guys like SPS, Stocker, Cunningham through the middle....they are the future if they're up for it. Dickheads like Cornes are happy to write Ed Curnow off because "he won't be in the next premiership" but for mine, one of the first picked every week. Has always been able to play that run with tagger type, like he did yesterday, but can still find plenty of it himself. It was farcial trying to turn him into a small/mid sized forward a few years back.

Fingers crossed Williams isn't another long term injury.

Like the way Pittonet plays to instructions, hitting it to ground; just wish he'd make them more accurate to our guys as he missed two easy ones yesterday, and not just by inches.

I'm a fan of Newnes EB....but his last couple of weeks haven't been as good as some of his earlier games. They might see Setterfield as the replacement for him this week?

Surfie, I see Newnes as a value player, you get what you expect and he usually delivers a reasonable but unspectacular game(goal after the siren game excepted). 16 possies@75% DE, 3 tackles vs Essendon.
He often gets put on problem opposition players during games and has to sacrifice his own game so his stats suffer ie last week he was thrown back and was on Charlie Cameron at one stage. If I had Lachie Whitfield and Shai Bolton in the twos on the wing then he wouldnt be playing but at the moment he is better value than the players vying for his position.
The playing group also rate him for his physicality and willingness to support his teammates, co skipper Cripps is a big fan.
I see Cottrell, Gibbons, SPS and Dow as more vulnerable...

How good is it to have a small forward who has  the confidence and ability to kick accurately inside the 50 metre arc.  When Owies kicked his goals you could see the immediate positive effect it had on our other forwards.

What can be said about Levi? Well past his use by date and giving us nothing.

To me our major area of concern is still the poor delivery into the forward line.  In the second quarter in particular we spent so much energy for so little reward.  Until we improve we will be punished on the rebound by the top sides.

What can be said about Levi? Well past his use by date and giving us nothing.

To me our major area of concern is still the poor delivery into the forward line.  In the second quarter in particular we spent so much energy for so little reward.  Until we improve we will be punished on the rebound by the top sides.

Levi is just so horribly out of form its hard to not feel sorry for him, a loyal servant but...

I have tried to find an analogy to best describe what our fwd play looks like at times compared to the other mob when we play. I have come up with this, to me, it often looks like world class ballet choreography in the oppo fwd line and an ugly all in brawl in ours.

It was ok for enough times for us to score and win yesterday, but at times looked like the above.

Levi is just so horribly out of form its hard to not feel sorry for him, a loyal servant but...

I have tried to find an analogy to best describe what our fwd play looks like at times compared to the other mob when we play. I have come up with this, to me, it often looks like world class ballet choreography in the oppo fwd line and an ugly all in brawl in ours.

It was ok for enough times for us to score and win yesterday, but at times looked like the above.

We often look like a Peter Garrett dance move down forward.....lot of arms and legs going in different ways but no clear pattern or method... :P

Am I the only one who has noticed that every time my boy Luke Parks plays we win? He is the talisman!

But seriously what a pick up off the rookie draft this kid is looking like. He already shown in 3 games that he is a very capable intercept mark who backs himself to beat his opponent 1:1 in the air, he has good poise and disposal [went at 100% DE yesterday] and attacks the contest in way I haven't seen in a Carlton backman since Andy McKay and Peter Dean. And he can really close down hard on his opponent - just ask Tippa or Jack Luckosius.

I am certain that Jones and Weiters play better when he is out there because we are a much better balanced unit.

Give the lad another couple of years in the gym and he could be an absolute star.

Will be interested in where and when Nic Newman will come back in. The only like for like is Plow - Stocker is playing the tough small speedy lockdown role, and Saad and Doc are the rebounders. Maybe Plow up to the wing to replace Newnes??

I was starting to feel quite despondent as the first quarter progressed; our inside 50s were haphazard, ill-directed, shallow and, when they were directed to a target, it was usually on the head of one of our smalls.  At the other end, our lack of defensive pressure up the ground created opportunities for the Essendon forwards to get clear and they were hit up with pinpoint delivery.  It really seemed like we were in for a dismal day.  In fact, it's hard to believe that we won the last three quarters.

Walsh was outstanding ... again!  Cuningham was very good and it is easy to see why the MC persist with him when he has quiet patches.  Curnow did a number on Merrett and showed that he is still one of the best run with players going around.  Weitering was in AA form again and was well-supported by Saad, Docherty, Stocker and Parks.  Jones had one of those games where he was just that bit off in his judgement and positioning.

Samo's poise and ability to distribute the ball made a huge difference in the second half.  McKay lifted in the second half after what could have been a gastro-affected first half and he is unstoppable when in form and getting decent delivery.  Betts turned the clock back and Owies may have provided a glimpse of the future.  I have been a bit critical of our very small small forwards but you can't complain when they have a crack and finish well.

It was great to see Cripps finally nail that goal.  I suspect that the relatively simple shots that he's missed may have dented his confidence.

It was also good to see Casboult work his way back into some form.  Four telling marks around the ground was a good contribution, particularly when Pittonet couldn't get near a marking contest.

Hopefully, Dow's eye injury is just a shiner and he won't have to miss.  McGovern's hammy seemed a bad one and that's a shame because he seemed to working into some form too.

Walsh polled maximum votes in the Coaches Award....has polled in 6 of the 7 games this year!!!

I was starting to feel quite despondent as the first quarter progressed; our inside 50s were haphazard, ill-directed, shallow and, when they were directed to a target, it was usually on the head of one of our smalls.  At the other end, our lack of defensive pressure up the ground created opportunities for the Essendon forwards to get clear and they were hit up with pinpoint delivery.  It really seemed like we were in for a dismal day.  In fact, it's hard to believe that we won the last three quarters.

Walsh was outstanding ... again!  Cuningham was very good and it is easy to see why the MC persist with him when he has quiet patches.  Curnow did a number on Merrett and showed that he is still one of the best run with players going around.  Weitering was in AA form again and was well-supported by Saad, Docherty, Stocker and Parks.  Jones had one of those games where he was just that bit off in his judgement and positioning.

Samo's poise and ability to distribute the ball made a huge difference in the second half.  McKay lifted in the second half after what could have been a gastro-affected first half and he is unstoppable when in form and getting decent delivery.  Betts turned the clock back and Owies may have provided a glimpse of the future.  I have been a bit critical of our very small small forwards but you can't complain when they have a crack and finish well.

It was great to see Cripps finally nail that goal.  I suspect that the relatively simple shots that he's missed may have dented his confidence.

It was also good to see Casboult work his way back into some form.  Four telling marks around the ground was a good contribution, particularly when Pittonet couldn't get near a marking contest.

Hopefully, Dow's eye injury is just a shiner and he won't have to miss.  McGovern's hammy seemed a bad one and that's a shame because he seemed to working into some form too.

Tend to agree.  Felt a bit flat at the end of the game despite the win for it.

That was the biggest positive.  We would have lost that one 2 years ago.

Walsh polled maximum votes in the Coaches Award....has polled in 6 of the 7 games this year!!!

I see Kane Cornes has taken back his words on Walshy on FC:

"I think I was particularly hard on Sam Walsh. I said he is not a match winner, In hindsight I would use my words differently. He has been so impressive this year and I've got a lot of respect for him. I regret how hard I went on a young kid, and I would take that one back."

I see Kane Cornes has taken back his words on Walshy on FC:

"I think I was particularly hard on Sam Walsh. I said he is not a match winner, In hindsight I would use my words differently. He has been so impressive this year and I've got a lot of respect for him. I regret how hard I went on a young kid, and I would take that one back."

The thing is Kane you can't "take it back". You are a d1ck head and always will be.

The thing is Kane you can't "take it back". You are a d1ck head and always will be.

Oh, Carlton stuffed up. Connor Rozee is better and Zak Butters is better and blah, blah, blah blah. Total knob.

Am I the only one who has noticed that every time my boy Luke Parks plays we win? He is the talisman!

But seriously what a pick up off the rookie draft this kid is looking like. He already shown in 3 games that he is a very capable intercept mark who backs himself to beat his opponent 1:1 in the air, he has good poise and disposal [went at 100% DE yesterday] and attacks the contest in way I haven't seen in a Carlton backman since Andy McKay and Peter Dean. And he can really close down hard on his opponent - just ask Tippa or Jack Luckosius.

I am certain that Jones and Weiters play better when he is out there because we are a much better balanced unit.

Give the lad another couple of years in the gym and he could be an absolute star.

Luke Parks!
I like him,  I like him alot!

Plus that Owies boy aint bad either

Luke Parks!
I like him,  I like him alot!

Plus that Owies boy aint bad either

Parks is a good prospect but not vs bigger units like the kid Jones who kicked three on him and took some very strong marks.
He isn't KP size and needs the right opponent, if the Dogs play three tall forwards this week then he is going to be up against it if he cops Bruce or Naughton if Jones or Weitering have to pick up the taller English.

Parks is a good prospect but not vs bigger units like the kid Jones who kicked three on him and took some very strong marks.
He isn't KP size and needs the right opponent, if the Dogs play three tall forwards this week then he is going to be up against it if he cops Bruce or Naughton if Jones or Weitering have to pick up the taller English.

I agree EB.  Someone posted a future team with Parks as CHB and we would be in deep strife if that came about. 

I was surprised to see that young Luke is 93kg - he must have heavy bones  ;) - so most medium forwards should find him hard to move.  Plowman remains as our third tall defender and our back six will have to work on their match ups so that Parks doesn't find himself mismatched against a taller opponent.

The third tall defender is always a mismatch EB,  they tend to be tall mediums (if you get my drift) that play on all sizes. Like Parks' attitude - he's scruffy - but he wants it bad.

Really like Stocker too,  not afraid to put his body in either - made of the right stuff too this  kid.  Ratten started as chunky back pocket as well.

The third tall defender is always a mismatch EB,  they tend to be tall mediums (if you get my drift) that play on all sizes. Like Parks' attitude - he's scruffy - but he wants it bad.

Really like Stocker too,  not afraid to put his body in either - made of the right stuff too this  kid.  Ratten started as chunky back pocket as well.

Prof, This is why Richmond are hard to play against... Grimes, Astbury, Balta and they also have Broad.
I like Parks, messy looking awkward hombre but I don't want to see us try and cheat with him on bigger players and bugger him up like we have done in the past with other players.
If we need the extra tall I would play Casboult down back and run smaller down forward.
Stocker is gutsy and attacks the ball better than most, took a big hit for the team in a contest vs Essendon but got up quick and we need more of that.

If we need the extra tall I would play Casboult down back and run smaller down forward.

While I understand this, I fear that adding Levi to the existing Jones presence just increases the incidental impact risk to Weitering!

Levi and Jones are 50/50 on cleaning up one of their own! For me it's tragic McGovern got injured, he could easily play that 3rd KPD role and do so safely.

Any official news yet on McGovern?

While I understand this, I fear that adding Levi to the existing Jones presence just increases the incidental impact risk to Weitering!

Levi and Jones are 50/50 on cleaning up one of their own! For me it's tragic McGovern got injured, he could easily play that 3rd KPD role and do so safely.

Any official news yet on McGovern?

Wouldnt be that keen to play McGovern on genuine KP Forwards either....good mark for his size but again its trying to cheat
vs bigger players who are taller and stronger and he is always an injury risk.
If Marchbank could hold up injury wise and add some kegs to his frame he would be ideal but thats fantasy so I think we need to look for that 6'3-4" swingman type who can play on those bigger types when we are one short of a tall down back.
Kemp might be the man if he can get fit and add some size...

Cornes throws out a headline grabbing statement virtually every day in the hope that one of them comes to fruition so he can look smart. Walsh was an obvious No.1 draft pick for pretty good reasons and has done everything to support the decision to pick him....probably more. Rozee is a good player no doubt but probably helped him that he's been playing in a top 4 side. Walsh has been playing in a bottom 6 side and is still in the best player list virtually every week and has been from game 1.

Cornes throws out a headline grabbing statement virtually every day in the hope that one of them comes to fruition so he can look smart. Walsh was an obvious No.1 draft pick for pretty good reasons and has done everything to support the decision to pick him....probably more. Rozee is a good player no doubt but probably helped him that he's been playing in a top 4 side. Walsh has been playing in a bottom 6 side and is still in the best player list virtually every week and has been from game 1.

Walsh is our No 1 mid and has surpassed Cripps IMHO and there is daylight between Walsh and Rozee......
Dont know when the contract for Walsh expires but that extra for Cripps probably needs to be going to Walsh....

Walsh is our No 1 mid and has surpassed Cripps IMHO and there is daylight between Walsh and Rozee......
Dont know when the contract for Walsh expires but that extra for Cripps probably needs to be going to Walsh....

End of 2022.

Heard / saw his pre game interview prior to the ESS match.

He could go captain tomorrow afaic.  We have unearthed an out and out champion.

End of 2022.

We should extend him now. He might be the league MVP by the end of 2022.

We should extend him now. He might be the league MVP by the end of 2022.

Yes, fair point. Plenty of clubs will come sniffing around with crazy deals if we don't lock him away soon.

We should extend him now. He might be the league MVP by the end of 2022.

Right now he is giving the Brownlow a fair old nudge.

Right now he is giving the Brownlow a fair old nudge.

Not sure I'd agree with the media assessment, he's not polled heavily so far in his career, his game style doesn't suit and the Brownlow often goes to run and carry types that get noticed in the clear! In 2019 he won the Rising Star and only polled 6 votes, he probably had an even better year last year and only got 8 votes!

Oddly, I won't be surprised to find Cripps out polls him, the umpires see under their nose the win of the contested footy and the break away, but the shizen DE% or missed set shots that irks fans and media don't really matter to the umpires.

Cripps, for whatever reason, is a shadow of his former self.

Perhaps personal stuff, or the Captaincy is burdensome, who knows but what a fall....

We should extend him now. He might be the league MVP by the end of 2022 2021.

Fixed

I see Kane Cornes has taken back his words on Walshy on FC:

"I think I was particularly hard on Sam Walsh. I said he is not a match winner, In hindsight I would use my words differently. He has been so impressive this year and I've got a lot of respect for him. I regret how hard I went on a young kid, and I would take that one back."

Dear Kane.

Thankyou for acknowledging your persistent errors of judgment, and the ill effects of your big mouth. No need to apologise though, because personally, I take all of your words with a grain of salt and splash of vinegar.

😂

End of 2022.

Thanks Paul.....that makes it a bit more urgent to sign him, I dont know our money position but
I dont think we should be offering mega bucks to Cripps or anyone else until we have Walsh locked away for a long contract.

Dear Kane.

Thankyou for acknowledging your persistent errors of judgment, and the ill effects of your big mouth. No need to apologise though, because personally, I take all of your words with a grain of salt and splash of vinegar.

😂

All it takes is watching some of his media work, absent all other information, to realise he could only have been a tagger in his playing days, and a very good one at that. His ability to irritate the cr@p out of people is elite, a level that can only be attained through years of practice and refinement.

All it takes is watching some of his media work, absent all other information, to realise he could only have been a tagger in his playing days, and a very good one at that. His ability to irritate the cr@p out of people is elite, a level that can only be attained through years of practice and refinement.

I like Kane.
He's a funny bloke.
An absolute clown ;D

He does it on purpose.
Makes these outrageous claims....Carlton and Adelaide are his prime targets.
One of our blokes must have got to him at some stage.
I think he enjoys the outrage, even when other commentators tell him he's being ridiculous.
You can see the smug half-smile as he says things.

I actually do enjoy the shows he's on just to see what gem he comes up with next.
Don't get upset with him.... laugh along, or ignore him.

Not sure I'd agree with the media assessment, he's not polled heavily so far in his career, his game style doesn't suit and the Brownlow often goes to run and carry types that get noticed in the clear! In 2019 he won the Rising Star and only polled 6 votes, he probably had an even better year last year and only got 8 votes!

Oddly, I won't be surprised to find Cripps out polls him ...

Tend to agree. He’s so unobtrusive. Doesn’t remonstrate, doesn’t argue, doesn’t overcelebrate, hasn’t dyed his hair.

Just.plays.brilliant.footy.

Mind you, he’s got more of a chance now than if he’d played a few years ago.

How good is a win?
Made sure my boy watched the replay and he has been replaying the Carlton moves through the house for the last 2 days.
You'd wonder that we did win if you listened to a few fans around the traps.

Well done to the boys. If you cant see obvious improvements this year, you're not looking hard enough, or merely looking for the negatives.

We hear all this crap about the ‘Baby Bombers’. Compare these figures….
They had six players 22 and under. So did Carlton.
They had 4 , 10 games or less. So did Carlton. 13 of their 16 goals were kicked by players 27 yrs or older. Blues had 15 of 19 kicked by 27 or younger.

We’re in reasonable shape age wise…..

We hear all this crap about the ‘Baby Bombers’. Compare these figures….
They had six players 22 and under. So did Carlton.
They had 4 , 10 games or less. So did Carlton. 13 of their 16 goals were kicked by players 27 yrs or older. Blues had 15 of 19 kicked by 27 or younger.

We’re in reasonable shape age wise…..

Ling said he’d take their u23s over ours!!

Must have overlooked weitering, Walsh, McKay on the team sheet?? (All potentially all Aus this year)

We hear all this crap about the ‘Baby Bombers’. Compare these figures….
They had six players 22 and under. So did Carlton.
They had 4 , 10 games or less. So did Carlton. 13 of their 16 goals were kicked by players 27 yrs or older. Blues had 15 of 19 kicked by 27 or younger.

We’re in reasonable shape age wise…..

Our age/games played profile is skewed by Eddie and Murph.  Take those two out of our lineup and we have a very young, inexperienced side. 

Some ex-footballers provide interesting insights and Ling is no exception.  However, in this case, he should have engaged his brain before making his under 23 comment.

In fact, you’d only need half a brain to see that our under 23s are far superior to Essenscum’s 🙄

Theyre just selling bombers fans hope that the future is bright.

For the most part, they have found a few players, and their best 22 isnt exactly full of old players either.

Hooker is 32 (kicked 5.1) and take him out of the equation, who else in their team was "old"?

Zaharakis who didnt even get on the field?

The rest of them are around 28 or younger.  Stewart, Smith, Stringer, Tipungwuti, Heppell arent that old.  They have a fairly bright looking future really.

Their list looks a bit more balanced than ours does.  We have lots of inexperienced kids, lots of also ran older players, and a few sprinklings of experienced performers in between.

I actually think its the next layer of players that we are waiting on.  Guys like Philp, Honey, Ramsay, Kemp, TDK.  Our older brigade fell apart at the wrong time.

Ling is a tool

Any number of reasons to hate Geeling and he's one of 'em

Theyre just selling bombers fans hope that the future is bright.

For the most part, they have found a few players, and their best 22 isnt exactly full of old players either.

Hooker is 32 (kicked 5.1) and take him out of the equation, who else in their team was "old"?

Zaharakis who didnt even get on the field?

The rest of them are around 28 or younger.  Stewart, Smith, Stringer, Tipungwuti, Heppell arent that old.  They have a fairly bright looking future really.

Their list looks a bit more balanced than ours does.  We have lots of inexperienced kids, lots of also ran older players, and a few sprinklings of experienced performers in between.

I actually think its the next layer of players that we are waiting on.  Guys like Philp, Honey, Ramsay, Kemp, TDK.  Our older brigade fell apart at the wrong time.

While I think that too much emphasis is placed on the age of players, Essenscum's best 22 includes Heppell (29), Hooker (33), Hurley (31), Smith (28), Stewart (27), Stringer (27), Tipungwuti (28) and Zaharakis (31).  Phillips, at 30, isn't far off their best 22 either.  It's a rubbish list put together by one of the greatest conmen to have managed an AFL list and weakened by the desire of their players to find new homes elsewhere.

The Bombers list is a mixed bag for mine, still a work in progress. There's a few of their players I'd be happy to have at Carlton : Tippa, Shiel, Merrett, Cox, Perkins, Jones, Ridley, Caldwell, McGrath, Parish. Other guys have been good players for them, but are probably getting on a bit now : Hurley, Hooker, Zaharakis, Heppell.

Actually, Peter Wright would be very handy for us.

Can't stand Ling, but the media pushing the second biggest lie in history "the baby bummers".... Four kids sprinkled amongst a couple of mercenaries,  middle rung established players, some no name rookies and some vets is not anything revolutionary.

Can't stand Ling.

The BPP was a good footballer, but in the media he is spineless and he knows who butters his bread, so he bows down to them without hesitation!

The Hooker, Hurley show has kept Essendon competitive for years, Hurley in particular has been a great player imo.
When those two are gone they will have zero leadership, I don't rate Heppell in that area or McGrath. The fact they rely on Stringer so much is also concerning if you are an Essendon supporter. He has to kick goals, play as a onball mid to try and give them a big body in the middle and if he is your main man then it's a flaky setup.
They have some newbie kids that are ok but they don't have that Walsh, Cripps, Weitering, McKay, C. Curnow quality at the top end.
The really wanted Dunkley to be their new Jobe Watson but missed out there and are going to stay a midpack team IMHO.

We are underselling their rebuild.

Parish is a better player than a lot give credit for.

If we had recovered like they have on the back of our sanctions we'd all be patting Carlton on the back.  What, one wooden spoon and a couple of finals appearances on the back of the biggest penalty in history?

We ended up with 5 wooden spoons in 20 years, kicked out of our old home, almost on the brink of bankruptcy, and only just became debt free now.

Their playing list is in decent shape, and potting stop gap elder players for making them old when we carry blokes like Murphy and Betts every week is akin to drinking our own bathwater.

i wouldnt trade our kids for anything, but Id be pretty pleased with Nick Cox, and Harrison Jones if I were them.  Mckay showed less in his first year.

Their sanctions handed them a no 1 pick.  That was a ducking gift for doing the wrong thing.  We lost three picks in our sanctions.   So did they really get whacked?

Their sanctions handed them a no 1 pick.  That was a ducking gift for doing the wrong thing.  We lost three picks in our sanctions.   So did they really get whacked?

Their penalties were way bigger than ours.

Their penalties were way bigger than ours.

 In what way?

In what way?

MBB is right.

Straight from wikipedia :

Essendon was fined $2 million (staggered over three years). This was the largest fine imposed on a club in the history of Australian sport.
Essendon forfeit its place in 2013 AFL finals series and be deemed to have finish in 9th. The club was on track to qualify for the finals in seventh place.
Essendon was prohibited from exercising draft picks in two drafts. In 2013, its first and second round draft picks were prohibited; in 2014, Essendon was prohibited from exercising the first and second round draft picks it would have received based on its finishing position, but was granted the last draft pick in the first round.
Senior coach James Hird was suspended from involvement in any football club for twelve months, effective 25 August 2013.
Football operations manager Danny Corcoran was suspended from involvement in any football club for four months, with a further two-month suspended sentence, effective 1 October 2013.
A fined $30,000 was imposed in relation to Mark Thompson. Ultimately, Thompson personally paid $5,000 of the fine, with Essendon covering the balance.

On top of all that, player suspensions, long drawn out legal processes, court cases, uncertainty and all the rest. You can't possibly say we were hit harder than they were.

And Carlton ? Also from wikipedia :

The club was fined a total of $930,000 (including $57,576 which had been suspended from previous breaches). The club was also stripped of several early draft picks in the 2002 and 2003 AFL Drafts, specifically:

Draft picks No. 1, 2, 31 and 34 from the 2002 National Draft
All draft picks in the 2003 Preseason Draft
Its first and second round draft picks in the 2003 National Draft[2]
Carlton later earned a priority draft pick for the 2003 Draft, which it was permitted to keep, even though that selection took place prior to the first round of the draft. This was used to recruit Andrew Walker.

Although the club was penalised, no individuals within the club were ever formally identified or penalised by the AFL's investigation. The Carlton Football Club stated at the time that the only people at the club who had knowledge of the breaches were president John Elliott, and directors Wes Lofts, Kevin Hall and Barry Stone. The players were never found guilty of any wrongdoing.

I think there are some omissions in those facts.

I thought despite having their default draft picks removed CheatsFC was allowed to trade back into the draft but Carlton wasn't? Do I have this wrong?

The dollar amount is a bit rubbery as well, if I recall after much begging the AFL reneged and suspended or backdoor financed CheatsFC payments by giving them access to emergency funding. What value is a fine if the fine is in effect paid by the authorities?

What was the difference in TPP between 2003 and 2013?

I think there are some omissions in those facts.

I thought despite having their default draft picks removed CheatsFC was allowed to trade back into the draft but Carlton wasn't? Do I have this wrong?

The dollar amount is a bit rubbery as well, if I recall after much begging the AFL reneged and suspended or backdoor financed CheatsFC payments by giving them access to emergency funding. What value is a fine if the fine is in effect paid by the authorities?

What was the difference in TPP between 2003 and 2013?

I don't know about trading back into the draft, but Essendon were helped by their insurer and wealthy benefactors, that much is clear, but I'm not sure you can say the AFL let them off lightly. The AFL can't impose restrictions on where the money comes from - you can't stop supporters or the club from fundraising. We also have wealthy supporters, who could have wiped out our debt and other financial issues in a jiffy.

Leaving aside money for a minute, the toll on their players, coaches etc., was way worse than what we endured. Jokes about us and brown paper bags are still in wide circulation, and we almost wear them as a badge of honour, which gives a bit of insight into how "serious" the offences were regarded. Apart from sites like this one, I don't hear too many injection jokes.

I know there are folks on here who will go to the grave believing the AFL, the umpires, the world in general hates us, and wants us dead and buried forever, but the overwhelming majority of our wounds are self inflicted.

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/teams/essendon/essendon-will-post-a-700000-profit-in-2014-despite-ongoing-costs-of-supplements-saga/news-story/3471b84bb0e8c3bb5754cc321e936c59

Essendon drafted Zac Merrett in the second round of the 2013 draft.

They drafted Langford and Laverde in the first round of the 2014 draft.

They should have got a harsher penalty than we did, but the AFL went soft on them after sounding tough.

I know there are folks on here who will go to the grave believing the AFL, the umpires, the world in general hates us, and wants us dead and buried forever, but the overwhelming majority of our wounds are self inflicted.

@PaulP‍ I think you tend to be naturally empathic, so you respond accordingly.

Personally, I tend to be cynical about the stated effect of the saga, it's too easy to say "I'm doing it tough" in the absence of any real evidence!

Essendon drafted Zac Merrett in the second round of the 2013 draft.
.................................

Yes, they traded Stewart Crameri to the Doggies for pick 26.

Essendon drafted Zac Merrett in the second round of the 2013 draft.

They drafted Langford and Laverde in the first round of the 2014 draft.

They should have got a harsher penalty than we did, but the AFL went soft on them after sounding tough.

So the CheatsFC penalty was drafting three of the list that Ling now says are better than ours! ;)

Everything at CheatsFC going back to the start of the Sheedy era is smoke and mirrors, fans should realise that, because I'd assert in that history is the ultimate source of the crook CheatsFC culture, and guess who's back! :o

@PaulP‍ I think you tend to be naturally empathic, so you respond accordingly.

Personally, I tend to be cynical about the stated effect of the saga, it's too easy to say "I'm doing it tough" in the absence of any real evidence!

That may well be true, but I'm not sure what evidence you need. In addition to everything else I've stated, those boys still don't know what they were injected with, and could potentially be ticking time bombs. If a football context, if that doesn't deserve empathy, I'm not sure what does. I also sense a red herring fallacy in there somewhere, but anyway.................

That may well be true, but I'm not sure what evidence you need. In addition to everything else I've stated, those boys still don't know what they were injected with, and could potentially be ticking time bombs. If a football context, if that doesn't deserve empathy, I'm not sure what does. I also sense a red herring fallacy in there somewhere, but anyway.................

You can assert that there is a red herring in there, but you have to accept that what CheatsFC and it's apologists have publicly presented is true just to get to the start of it!

I don't start off assuming anything they say is true, because we know it was managed by corporate communications professionals right from the very start. The first people/person CheatsFC called was not a doctor or scientist, but a PR consultant! That is a significant tell!

Let's not forget the frantic "Mother Hunting", because they were deeply concerned about the poor women's mindset, they are so community minded it puts us to shame!

@PaulP I'd assert that fundamentally you want to see the good in people, and I'd also assert CheatsFC Psychopaths know that as well! That is not accusing you of being naivé, just having a default position that some bastards may conveniently manipulate.

...........................

They drafted Langford and Laverde in the first round of the 2014 draft.
......................................

Yes, traded Paddy Ryder to Port for pick 17 and drafted Langford.

Then picked up Laverde (the green) with pick 20, which was allowed under the original sanctions.

Giving up Ryder and Crameri is not exactly cheating the draft penalties. They're both good players. They had to give up something to get those draft picks.

...........................................................
I'd assert that fundamentally you want to see the good in people, and I'd also assert CheatsFC Psychopaths know that as well! That is not accusing you of being naivé, just having a default position that some bastards may conveniently manipulate.

Cynicism can be manipulated just as easily as empathy.

I keep hearing that we were 'harder at it', 'more aggressive' , 'played with more grit', 'all in supporting each other when the push and shove started' after Saturday's game, which I totally agree with.

Is it a coincidence  that it was the first week that John Worsfold was in around the place onsite?  Could it be an area that he identified from a distance and he had the opportunity to address the group and or individuals prior to last week's game?? They say Choco Williams has brought a harder edge to Melbourne just by being around and giving some good, old fashioned pumping up and needling to players.

Just a thought.

I keep hearing that we were 'harder at it', 'more aggressive' , 'played with more grit', 'all in supporting each other when the push and shove started' after Saturday's game, which I totally agree with.

Is it a coincidence  that it was the first week that John Worsfold was in around the place onsite?  Could it be an area that he identified from a distance and he had the opportunity to address the group and or individuals prior to last week's game?? They say Choco Williams has brought a harder edge to Melbourne just by being around and giving some good, old fashioned pumping up and needling to players.

Just a thought.

Some AFL supporters believe Essendon played a soft, outside brand of football under Worsfold.

Some AFL supporters believe Essendon played a soft, outside brand of football under Worsfold.

 Yet I thought last weekend a couple of them tried their best to rough up our kids and it backfired!

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2021/05/05/why-matthews-believes-carlton-versus-essendon-was-the-perfect-game-of/

Some AFL supporters believe Essendon played a soft, outside brand of football under Worsfold.

I agree with those supporters, the modern Essendon is a team of outside runners IMHO, they tried real hard to get Dunkley for that reason and his leadership skills but essentially Worsfold had them playing a game style that suited their list.
They tried to rough us up a bit but they dont really have the artillery for that like in the old days under Sheedy and both teams would hardly come under the heading of playing a overly physical brand.
I think the high scoring game was a reflection of how both teams like to play and it showed defensive pressure and staying close to your man are not priorities for either club.

I keep hearing that we were 'harder at it', 'more aggressive' , 'played with more grit', 'all in supporting each other when the push and shove started' after Saturday's game, which I totally agree with.

Is it a coincidence  that it was the first week that John Worsfold was in around the place onsite?  Could it be an area that he identified from a distance and he had the opportunity to address the group and or individuals prior to last week's game?? They say Choco Williams has brought a harder edge to Melbourne just by being around and giving some good, old fashioned pumping up and needling to players.

Just a thought.

You know what is more of a coincidence.
Luke Parks.

3 games he's played, we've been hard at it and we've won all 3.

He is yet to play in a loss.

His tackle on Tippa where he buried him and then let him know about it, is everything this club was missing in the first couple of rounds.

You know what is more of a coincidence.
Luke Parks.

3 games he's played, we've been hard at it and we've won all 3.

He is yet to play in a loss.

His tackle on Tippa where he buried him and then let him know about it, is everything this club was missing in the first couple of rounds.

Yep.  It was a very "you've been robbo'd" moment.

Makes everyone walk taller.

You know what is more of a coincidence.
Luke Parks.

3 games he's played, we've been hard at it and we've won all 3.

He is yet to play in a loss.

His tackle on Tippa where he buried him and then let him know about it, is everything this club was missing in the first couple of rounds.

Personally, I prefer the Schache whack, but point taken.

Reckon Stocker has a similar mindset.

His tackle on Tippa where he buried him and then let him know about it, is everything this club was missing in the first couple of rounds.

Tippa looked downright shocked somebody from Carlton had the temerity to push back! CheatsFC Board Member and Culture King Sheedy has probably been in the rooms all week telling them how pissweak Carlton is and they believed it!

Our historical problem has been that when an opposition deemed it time for retribution against someone like Parks none of his team-mates would stand by / up for him. I think that is different now, Weitering, McGovern, BigH, Pittonet and a couple of others do not take shizen!

You know what is more of a coincidence.
Luke Parks.

3 games he's played, we've been hard at it and we've won all 3.

He is yet to play in a loss.

His tackle on Tippa where he buried him and then let him know about it, is everything this club was missing in the first couple of rounds.

Parks seems to have a bit of Andy Mackay about him.  Let's hope the trajectory continues.

So the CheatsFC penalty was drafting three of the list that Ling now says are better than ours! ;)

Everything at CheatsFC going back to the start of the Sheedy era is smoke and mirrors, fans should realise that, because I'd assert in that history is the ultimate source of the crook CheatsFC culture, and guess who's back! :o

Ling... please. About as much credibility as Kane Cornes.

Essendon could have had a better list had they doubled down on the draft instead of chasing the shortcut with Stringer, Smith, Saad and Shiel. Instead they've got a lop-sided list with a few decent mids and a few young key position players who will take another 3 or 4 years to hit their straps by which time most of their mids will be gone / too old.

All of those players wanting out last year forced them into the draft. There is no grand strategy behind it. Which sums them up under Dodo. He doesn't appear to be capable of thinking more than 6 months ahead. Premiership lists are built over 6+ year periods.

Ling is the complete package for me - I just can't stand anything about him. Probably a bit unfair as I've stopped listening to anything he says - just gives me the creeps.

When Ling first started commentating, I thought he was pretty good. It didn't take long for BT to sort him out lol.

Gerard Whateley was the same. When he was used to commentate with Tim Lane on the wireless some years back, he was also pretty good IMO. At some point after that he became screechy and insufferable.

When Ling first started commentating, I thought he was pretty good. It didn't take long for BT to sort him out lol.

Gerard Whateley was the same. When he was used to commentate with Tim Lane on the wireless some years back, he was also pretty good IMO. At some point after that he became screechy and insufferable.

There are times when Ling makes some erudite comments, particularly when he's on the wireless.  Put him on a commentary team with BT and co and he just gets caught up in the boys' club attempts at humour and sensationalism.  To give him his due, he didn't join in with BT's "the Bombers can win this" garbage in the final quarter.

Yes, traded Paddy Ryder to Port for pick 17 and drafted Langford.

Then picked up Laverde (the green) with pick 20, which was allowed under the original sanctions.

Giving up Ryder and Crameri is not exactly cheating the draft penalties. They're both good players. They had to give up something to get those draft picks.

Ryder demanded a trade because of the drug cheating and there was talk at the time of allowing Essendon players to walk.  Ryder is still going around, in a somewhat diminished capacity, and, yes, he is a decent player.  Crameri had a limited career after Essendon and getting pick 26 for him was a gift.

However, my point is that Essendon were permitted to draft players in the early rounds of 2013 and 2014 drafts.  That is, the AFL allowed them to ameliorate their draft penalties.  Meanwhile, we lost picks 1, 2, 31 and 34 in the 2002 national draft, all picks in the 2003 pre-season draft, and our first and second round picks in the 2003 national draft (but we were allowed to draft Andrew Walker).

Anyway you look at, we were penalised more harshly than Essendon for less serious wrongdoing.  The AFL wanted to come down hard on Essendon but they were hampered by their desire to avoid litigation through negotiated penalties.  I suspect that they also realised from our penalties that hamstringing a club's list management isn't good for the competition.

David, I think we should agree to disagree.

Some sense on this subject for a change ... we were bl00dy well crucified by that fat slug.

Just on the above....
We were hit harder because we finished last....and we had no way of getting better.
Couldn't use our early draft picks, stripped off us, including a priority pick which wasn't even part of the 'deal'.
Couldn't trade into the first round, so even if we had talented players other teams wanted, we couldn't trade them unless it was for unders.
At the time, the money was a big deal. It nearly broke us. We were broke. We had to sell our soul for 1mil to move away from PP.
Alternatively, Bombers had a war chest saved up and wrote a cheque and moved on.

I don't rate Heppell in that area

Never understood heppell.  He did exactly zip against us.  Even earlier in his career when he was in the guts, he’d get a little bit of it, but was never damaging.  A lot of nothing handballs and sideways kicks.  I don’t see him as overly skilful and not overly tough

Never understood heppell.  He did exactly zip against us.  Even earlier in his career when he was in the guts, he’d get a little bit of it, but was never damaging.  A lot of nothing handballs and sideways kicks.  I don’t see him as overly skilful and not overly tough

I think he has had some some serious injuries which have sapped him of his confidence, much like Doc.

So the CheatsFC penalty was drafting three of the list that Ling now says are better than ours! ;)

Everything at CheatsFC going back to the start of the Sheedy era is smoke and mirrors, fans should realise that, because I'd assert in that history is the ultimate source of the crook CheatsFC culture, and guess who's back! :o

Sheedy was a master of smoke and mirrors.   There is a lot of discussion on here about the club selling hope (our kids are great, we are ready to launch, the coach is revolutionary),  sheedy was doing all this in the mid 80s, probably 20 years before other clubs were doing it.  I actually admire it.

He could spin any situation Essendons way and make anything into either a possitve Essendon story or create a rivalry, which would increase crowds.  He used the media to skew biases essendons way.

I remember in the late 80s, after the back to back, in a down time, he had the media bluffed that they had a new set of champions coming thru (look at our kids with 50games under their belt, 50 games is the key when they blossom), the media swallowed it, talked them up, and kept the heat off him and the club, didn’t mater that the kids in question were terrible (ed considine, come on down), he spun the media his way and they wrote what he wanted

Sheedy was a master of smoke and mirrors.  There is a lot of discussion on here about the club selling hope (our kids are great, we are ready to launch, the coach is revolutionary),  sheedy was doing all this in the mid 80s, probably 20 years before other clubs were doing it.  I actually admire it.

I too, it's why I argue for Carlton to have a stronger media presence, staying mum leaves you a victim of opportunity for a Sheedy or a McGuire.

What I don't like was when he loudly and publicly pointed the finger at Carlton, all the while CheatsFC behaved equally badly behind the scenes. In biblical terms Sheedy would have been the one unhesitant in casting the first stone, in Asian terms he has no face!

Never understood heppell.  He did exactly zip against us.  Even earlier in his career when he was in the guts, he’d get a little bit of it, but was never damaging.  A lot of nothing handballs and sideways kicks.  I don’t see him as overly skilful and not overly tough

Agree, thought he was a strange choice for captain too, not really a follow me into battle type leader...

Agree, thought he was a strange choice for captain too, not really a follow me into battle type leader...

He was injured for a protracted period and is still struggling to get back to his best.

He was injured for a protracted period and is still struggling to get back to his best.

 Doubt he'll ever get those roid legs back, they made him unstoppable!