Very interesting to see the result.
I didn’t see this one coming. Great result.
Best win of the year.
Seemed like the win meant a lot to the players too.
(Who needs two rucks and KPDs... not us!) ;D
(Maybe when we play Geelong. ;) )
Top performance especially considering the outs. Could we just start to dream??
Great coaching from Voss today, good matchups/tactics and we clearly won the midfield which helped our smaller backline.
Doesnt matter being outsized down back if the ball doesnt get down there and we squared the ledger after letting too many forward entries in last game. Sam Walsh was dominant and we probably should have won by more....very pleasing to beat Freo and see Longmuirs face, something about him I find annoying.
Couple of ripper taps from De Koning
Why does our leadership now look strong, uncompromising and influential?? Does a guy called Voss have anything to do with it?? Doherty in both play and leadership is a mile ahead of the previous Doc, Cripps now knows his roll and plays it to perfection, Walsh just says 'Follow Me' JSOS says 'I'm invested 110%'.... and they all look at a kid like DeKoning and say 'You can do it!' AND HE DID!!
I reckon Jack might not be the most popular bloke as far as the opposition is concerned.
He seems to get into a lot of 'discussions' ;D
I think that was probably our best 4-Qtr effort for the season against an opponent that was having a real crack.
Ross Lyon suggested through the week that Fremantle would 'dine out on us'.
He had a graphic of Freo players with Carlton bibs to support his claim.
The saddest bloke in Football today would be Lyon because he doesn't have this side.
Then again....he's no Michael Voss! ;D
Great coaching from Voss today, good matchups/tactics and we clearly won the midfield which helped our smaller backline.
Doesnt matter being outsized down back if the ball doesnt get down there and we squared the ledger after letting too many forward entries in last game. Sam Walsh was dominant and we probably should have won by more....very pleasing to beat Freo and see Longmuirs face, something about him I find annoying.
Great win indeed.
I'm with you regards Longmuir. I dislike him. Despise his flat affect and monotone drivel. Human proclivity- like what you like, hate what you hate.
Was it Ed Curnow who was given a week a few years ago for an incidental touch of an umpire?? Let's see if 2 Brownlow medals get you credits in that area?? He has to get 1 week???
Old mate sitting near me had a vintage footy bag emblazoned with, “They can smell what we’re cooking.”
The funny thing is that I think I could smell it too 🙂
Voss the Boss.
Was it Ed Curnow who was given a week a few years ago for an incidental touch of an umpire?? Let's see if 2 Brownlow medals get you credits in that area?? He has to get 1 week???
I recall Charlie in that position. At the hearing the umpire said he didn't know it happened. You'll know the outcome.
Ross Lyon suggested through the week that Fremantle would 'dine out on us'.
He had a graphic of Freo players with Carlton bibs to support his claim.
The saddest bloke in Football today would be Lyon because he doesn't have this side.
Then again....he's no Michael Voss! ;D
Now he can tuck in to a double serve of humble pie.
Old mate sitting near me had a vintage footy bag emblazoned with, “They can smell what we’re cooking.”
The funny thing is that I think I could smell it too 🙂
20yr slow cook style 🤤
Great win indeed.
I'm with you regards Longmuir. I dislike him. Despise his flat affect and monotone drivel. Human proclivity- like what you like, hate what you hate.
He has a smug look on his face and always seems reluctant to credit the opposition, Ross Lyon too as Lods said would be squirming after predicting a massive win for Freo, not a good day for Freo coaches past and present....😀
I caught the second half today and while he did some nice things after half time was surprised to see Kemp had 36 touches. No doubt his best game statistically however I’d be keen to hear others comments on his performance.
I didn’t see this one coming. Great result.
x2
Just got back from the game.
Well.....that was unexpected.
I tipped against us, for maybe, the 3rd time this season. Oops.
No way in hell we should've even been in that game, let alone win it....and by 5 goals no less.
The hunger was there.....well from our boys at least.
Darcy tried to damage yet another CFC ruckman at the '2nd?' centre bounce. Flog.
BTW, how does TDK get a free kick given against him for shepharding while he was in mid-air getting the tap? Very confusing at the ground.
Great win. Hopefully we can start getting some players back rather than rely on these kind of miracle results.
Dare to dream baggers...equal 2nd on the ladder.
Ross Lyon suggested through the week that Fremantle would 'dine out on us'.
He had a graphic of Freo players with Carlton bibs to support his claim.
The saddest bloke in Football today would be Lyon because he doesn't have this side.
Then again....he's no Michael Voss! ;D
We didn't dodge a bullet with Lyon, we dodge a nuclear missile. Peanut.
A win today by effort, spirit and system.
Our best win of the year given the personel out.
We are going places..how far is whether we can continue the effort put in today.
Great stuff today !
We didn't dodge a bullet with Lyon, we dodge a nuclear missile. Peanut.
x2
Its always all about Ross
x2
X3 My tip -19
Extremely impressive. I'd say our best win this year despite a quality oppo, and so many key outs
We didn't dodge a bullet with Lyon, we dodge a nuclear missile. Peanut.
Toss Lyon. I was vehemently against him. Thankful 🙏
I caught the second half today and while he did some nice things after half time was surprised to see Kemp had 36 touches. No doubt his best game statistically however I’d be keen to hear others comments on his performance.
Kemp had 17 touches, Freo’s Brodie had 36 🙂
I thought that Kemp played very well against a much bigger and more experienced opponent. He defends hard, spoils well and makes good use of the pill when he gets it. He has a good step and the acceleration to get clear of his opponent when he has possession. A different skill set to our other defenders.
Kemp had 17 touches, Freo’s Brodie had 36 🙂
I thought that Kemp played very well against a much bigger and more experienced opponent. He defends hard, spoils well and makes good use of the pill when he gets. He has a good step and the acceleration to get clear of his opponent when he has possession. A different skill set to our other defenders.
:-[ :-[ :-[ OK, that’s makes more sense, I just got back from a short trip to Europe landing this morning so it’s back to bed for me! Seriously though I was happy with Kemps’ second half and he looked like he was finding his feet at the level. No doubt it helped that we were on top for most of the second half but he definitely wasn’t out of place. Another that might begin to establish himself along with Young and Boyd as a result of the opportunities created by our injury list.
"Cotrell is, was and always will be a spud. You cannot polish a turd. Also Walsh. We all love him but have you seen his meters gained this year? It's putrid. He is disposal seeking, then giving it off too quick to avoid contact. Needs to get that out of his game because it is costing us."
Is this the sort of game that Inboltswetrust doesn't comment on?? 😁
Our defence plus the added defence of our hard running wingers was something special.
That was off the back of our Cerraless midfield getting their mojo back. Walsh was sublime.
"Cotrell is, was and always will be a spud. You cannot polish a turd. Also Walsh. We all love him but have you seen his meters gained this year? It's putrid. He is disposal seeking, then giving it off too quick to avoid contact. Needs to get that out of his game because it is costing us."
Is this the sort of game that Inboltswetrust doesn't comment on?? 😁
🤣
Our best win for the year. even when we were down by 3 in the 1st we were playing very well, apart from scoring. Very even spread across the board. Our threadbare backline did exceptionally well. At times we had so much space going forward we over thunk it and made the wrong decision. Fantastic result. Big Johnno Brown commented on the atmosphere down at Princes Park this week as he paid the club a visit. Said the whole playing group was extremely positive and supportive. Think the days of suspect culture are long gone. Really hope we continue from here. We could be in for something really, really special I feel (keep a lid on it)
"Cotrell is, was and always will be a spud. You cannot polish a turd. Also Walsh. We all love him but have you seen his meters gained this year? It's putrid. He is disposal seeking, then giving it off too quick to avoid contact. Needs to get that out of his game because it is costing us."
Is this the sort of game that Inboltswetrust doesn't comment on?? 😁
T, you forgot this;
My final comment will piss people off, but i am happy to revist and requote at the end of the year for those who are going to abuse me now. Here it is: "We will not make finals in 2022" after losing this pathetic game to Richmond. I'm serious. We need 4 more wins. Where are they comming from ? Maybe WC is one. Maybe. Adelaide? Good luck with that on their ground. Rest of them... doubtful. We had an easy draw and bathed in the glory.
We now only need 3 more wins ;D
Great win. Agree with those who rate it out best for the season. A very even contribution from all.
Played that hard at the footy contested game that will serve us well in finals but also slowed it down and chipped it around when we needed.
Also seem to finally have a hard edge about us now. Seeing skinny fisher show some attitude to Fyfe after he tackled him late in the game, Jack mouthing off at every opportunity, Newman tells his opponent every time he has a win on them - this sort of stuff is what the great hawthorn and Brisbane teams had spades of. Who’s our coach again.
How good is the development of Cottrell, Young, Lob and TDK. One positive of having so many injuries is these sorts of young blokes get continuity and Cottrell in particular looks to have taken his game to a new level. His disposal is now clean and he is a bloody hard two way running winger who can hit the scoreboard. Not an easy match up that bloke.
Great win indeed.
I'm with you regards Longmuir. I dislike him. Despise his flat affect and monotone drivel. Human proclivity- like what you like, hate what you hate.
He leaves me cold, too. I am quite happy to rub his face in the result. Some people can be magnanimous in defeat: Longmuir isn't one of them.
Great win. Agree with those who rate it out best for the season. A very even contribution from all.
Played that hard at the footy contested game that will serve us well in finals but also slowed it down and chipped it around when we needed.
Also seem to finally have a hard edge about us now. Seeing skinny fisher show some attitude to Fyfe after he tackled him late in the game, Jack mouthing off at every opportunity, Newman tells his opponent every time he has a win on them - this sort of stuff is what the great hawthorn and Brisbane teams had spades of. Who’s our coach again.
How good is the development of Cottrell, Young, Lob and TDK. One positive of having so many injuries is these sorts of young blokes get continuity and Cottrell in particular looks to have taken his game to a new level. His disposal is now clean and he is a bloody hard two way running winger who can hit the scoreboard. Not an easy match up that bloke.
you've picked 4 blokes who have really stepped up this year. The way they have developed since last year is just one of the more notable things Voss can take some credit for. Young wasn't making an impression at the Dogs, Cottrell was patchy and his skills were an issue. Lochie O'Brien has probably saved his career and is doing a great job on a wing. As for Tom de Koning, he really showed something today. His huge leap and tap to Hewett, who kicked down Charlie's throat, was one of the best pieces of play you could ever see. (Pity Charlie stuffed up the kick!) The way he nullified one of the competition's best ruckmen was lovely to see.
Mind you, I Think playing at Marvel helps TDK: he likes the fast, hard conditions. His efforts were great.
Jack Silvagni may have had only a could of taps, but his swarming on the ball after the tap was lovely. He managed 10 or 11 marks and really provided a target around the ground.
What is extremely evident, especially today, is the camaraderie the team displays. Players, coaching staff, boot studders, united as one for a common cause and more importantly for each other. The last time I saw a Carlton team like this was 1995. Voss and co coached brilliantly today. But what impressed me most today was not Walshy's 40 possessions, not Charlies explosive 5 goals, or TDK roughing up Darcy, it was this commentary when Fish tackled Fyfe over the line in the 4th:
Jordan Lewis: "I like it Howey, This Carlton side has got a nastiness about them, which you can't say that they have had in the past five, maybe even longer"
Jono Brown: "Well it'll have something to do with the coach"
Jordan Lewis "But right now, they are physically and mentally and verbally intimidating"
Brought a tear to this old Bluebaggers eye. Finally!!
Just got into Singapore and missed the match. Nice surprise when I arrived.
Now he can tuck in to a double serve of humble pie.
The way Voss is going this year I have been eating humble pie by the slabful....haha.
Doing what I thought he couldn't do, and more! Good to see us back!
Stop talking up Voss. The experts o TV have been banging on about Craig McRae being the best coach this season so far. Making the most with what players he has. WTF have we been doing with more key players out than almost every other side in the league? So far our coaches in total, and players efforts is more than pleasing. This is a foundation we can really build on. Now we need to not be complacent with the Saints. The next few games could really set up a great season with some finals experience.
Best win of the year.
Totally agree - undermanned and outreached (on the rare occasions that they got the ball forward) but every player contributed to imposing an all over level of intensity that I haven't seen since I don't know when.
Even fringe players (e.g. Motlop, Kemp, Boyd) showed up well and showed that we might have greater depth than was previously believed.
I continue to be impressed by the efforts of wingers Cottrell, O'Brien and Newnes. These guys are running deep back to provide extra defensive efforts and running hard forward to hit the scoreboard and set up other scoring plays.
Now he can tuck in to a double serve of humble pie.
Tuck him
I was not expecting:
5 goals from our wingers
83% DE
17. Yes 17 i50 tackles
More marks i50
Triple their centre clearances
50% more clearances from half the ho
More tackles
Less free kicks
All that and a W over 2nd on the ladder
I'm staggered and extremely impressed by the players, coaches, and staff 👏
This performance will give our boys
belief they can match it with good sides when they all play their role.
I'll be praying that Boyd and Owies didn't sustain serious injuries.
BOG: Team defensive pressure, toughness & persistence. Not one passenger.
BOG: Team defensive pressure, toughness & persistence. Not one passenger.
Agreed, but I have one reservation.
I'm not sure at all that you can play that game style week in and week out, fans think it's great, but it takes a toll. You need to have a few different ways to win a game, because the level of repeat running we saw yesterday from the guys like LoB, Fisher, Walsh, Cottrell and Boyd is not really sustainable week after week.
One of the things that made Nthmond successful was that they had more than one tempo, they rarely played more than a half of berserka type footy. They also played the tempo game very well. Yesterday, while it made fans happy, it was 4-Qtrs of finals beserka footy.
I suspect with a 6 day break we will have a lot less run next Friday night against the Aints, it will be intriguing to see how Voss manages the tactics.
Jordan Lewis: "I like it Howey, This Carlton side has got a nastiness about them, which you can't say that they have had in the past five, maybe even longer"
Jono Brown: "Well it'll have something to do with the coach"
Jordan Lewis "But right now, they are physically and mentally and verbally intimidating"
Brought a tear to this old Bluebaggers eye. Finally!!
Likewise.
Those words (from Lewis & Jono) made the hairs on the back of this little black duck's neck stand on end. This wasn't only our best game for the year, this was the best game from the CFC in many, many years. Especially when you consider the calibre of the opposition and our injury list. Every single player at Marvel Stadium last night honoured the navy guernsey, did the club proud. The bar has been raised, officially, at PP... now to repeat it.
Likewise.
Those words (from Lewis & Jono) made the hairs on the back of this little black duck's neck stand on end. This wasn't only our best game for the year, this was the best game from the CFC in many, many years. Especially when you consider the calibre of the opposition and our injury list. Every single player at Marvel Stadium last night honoured the navy guernsey, did the club proud. The bar has been raised, officially, at PP... now to repeat it.
Its very much about that at present too. I reckon once a week a see a player tug on their CFC logo after a big goal. This week it was Charlie.
They spoke to Jack after the game and asked him what he thought about it, the first thing he said was that he was happy to see so many Carlton fans out and be able to make them proud.
Also good to see every single player on the ground run to Newnes to celebrate his goal in his 200th.
Boys are united.
Agreed, but I have one reservation.
I'm not sure at all that you can play that game style week in and week out, fans think it's great, but it takes a toll. You need to have a few different ways to win a game, because the level of repeat running we saw yesterday from the guys like LoB, Fisher, Walsh, Cottrell and Boyd is not really sustainable week after week.
One of the things that made Nthmond successful was that they had more than one tempo, they rarely played more than a half of berserka type footy. They also played the tempo game very well. Yesterday, while it made fans happy, it was 4-Qtrs of finals beserka footy.
I suspect with a 6 day break we will have a lot less run next Friday night against the Aints, it will be intriguing to see how Voss manages the tactics.
Yes and no.
The running from Walsh and Cottrell is very much repeatable. 2 of the fittest blokes in the AFL who are among the top 2 for ground covered almost every match. They don't give out a list past the top 5, but LOB has been in that previously.
That being said....
You don't NEED to win like that every week.
Some weeks its easier than other weeks.
Freo have been on a roll of late. They've knocked off both the Dees and the Lions (and the Hawks last week) so they are up there with the best in the league. THIS is exactly the game you need to play that way....and we did.
it was great to win in that manner yesterday,we finally played 4 Q,hopefully we can play the same way at the MCG
Agreed, but I have one reservation.
I'm not sure at all that you can play that game style week in and week out, fans think it's great, but it takes a toll. You need to have a few different ways to win a game, because the level of repeat running we saw yesterday from the guys like LoB, Fisher, Walsh, Cottrell and Boyd is not really sustainable week after week.
One of the things that made Nthmond successful was that they had more than one tempo, they rarely played more than a half of berserka type footy. They also played the tempo game very well. Yesterday, while it made fans happy, it was 4-Qtrs of finals beserka footy.
I suspect with a 6 day break we will have a lot less run next Friday night against the Aints, it will be intriguing to see how Voss manages the tactics.
We still played tempo footy for periods, but not for as long as we have in other games.
Walsh, Cottrell, Newnes, O'Brien and probably a few others could back that up almost immediately. That's a tribute to their professionalism and the work of the Terrier.
Another factor is that you expend less energy when you dominate inside 50s, tackles inside 50, uncontested possessions, disposal efficiency, centre clearances, etc. The Frockers were running around like blue-asked flies and I suspect that they were more fatigued than we were.
One of the things that made Nthmond successful was that they had more than one tempo, they rarely played more than a half of berserka type footy. They also played the tempo game very well. Yesterday, while it made fans happy, it was 4-Qtrs of finals beserka footy.
I actually think we phased the tempo perfectly. Frenetic all out attack when we extracted the ball from the centre, and patience in building an avenue to attack when we had possession down back.
It’s great (finally!) to see the players resist the tendency to take the “near enough is good enough” option in favour of the single best available option.
What I can’t get over is how our field kicking has improved. We’ve gone from god-awful ‘chip it up and turn-it-over merchants’, to a team which passes with clinical precision.
Two different views of the Newnes goal. ;D
Commentator A (let's call him BT)
"They get around Jack Newnes, surely that's not his first goal for the football club" :o
(He must have missed the one against Freo after the siren in 2020)
They've all come to him We're a bit mystified"
"It's his 200th"
"The players really know their numbers these days don't they, 200 goals?"
"No it's his 200th game"
Oh well, that's about games.
Big deal.
Chair him off, chair him to the interchange.
Commentator B
(As the players get around Newnes)
"If you want to know what culture looks like on the field. That's it right there!"
Surprisingly I think B was actually Jordan Lewis (no Carlton lover)
I listened to creeping Longmuir saying how they would stretch our defensive crisis. As if it was a hard-nose uber smart strategy. Although it probably was just that, it made me nauseous.
Come game day. We had 2 injuries to cover, then another at warm-up. I wasn't confident we'd be competitive for 4q. Much less dominate 4q with a pattern of play that ebbed and flowed with momentum. The thing that made sense was something Walshy said months ago. He said Vossy wants us to play what's in front of us.
That sounds easy enough but at that time seemed unreachable. Yesterday, even though we were outstretched and outreached, we achieved that goal.
It looked like every single player, including a handful with less than 20 games under their belt did just that. The boys played what was in front of them!! To perfection I might add.
Vossy's plan of adding layers to our game is now on show. We've won in a variety of ways. We will face challenges we have no answer for, but the boys now have a repertoire of options. Our leaders have experience changing tactic when needed.
They were brilliant yesterday.. Vossy is the man.. and he's got the right crew behind him. Longmuir moping was the cherry on top.
Go Blues
Two different views of the Newnes goal. ;D
Commentator A (let's call him BT)
"They get around Jack Newnes, surely that's not his first goal for the football club" :o
(He must have missed the one against Freo after the siren in 2020)
They've all come to him We're a bit mystified"
"It's his 200th"
"The players really know their numbers these days don't they, 200 goals?"
"No it's his 200th game"
Oh well, that's about games.
Big deal.
Chair him off, chair him to the interchange.
Commentator B
(As the players get around Newnes)
"If you want to know what culture looks like on the field. That's it right there!"
Surprisingly I think B was actually Jordan Lewis (no Carlton lover)
I'd call Commentator A
Uninformed Commentator DH.
Falsely posing as Commentator A, when he's not a commentator of any name, colour, or creed 🤥
Likewise.
Those words (from Lewis & Jono) made the hairs on the back of this little black duck's neck stand on end. This wasn't only our best game for the year, this was the best game from the CFC in many, many years. Especially when you consider the calibre of the opposition and our injury list. Every single player at Marvel Stadium last night honoured the navy guernsey, did the club proud. The bar has been raised, officially, at PP... now to repeat it.
And another thing, I loved Vossy's presser where he spoke about not looking at who we haven't got (ie injured) but focussing on who we do have. I love this attitude, I love this focus, its one thing for a coach to talk it, its another to actually walk it and drive a group of men to execute it.
And another thing, I loved Vossy's presser where he spoke about not looking at who we haven't got (ie injured) but focussing on who we do have. I love this attitude, I love this focus, its one thing for a coach to talk it, its another to actually walk it and drive a group of men to execute it.
Authentic leadership that embodies inclusive culture. Once that part's in place and the players experience it, success will follow IMO
Great win - just watched it. Browny was pretty enthusiastic about LOB's work rate and he loves Walshy.
I kind of like Mark Howard as a commentator - he seems to have brought his style in from big-bash - knowing where he can contribute and will ask the others questions about the game or what the others have said. Is passionate where he needs to be as well as being a bit understated, without the hyperbole of some.
Again for those at the game , the commentators remarked on how big the noise was when Charlie kicked one of goals - would have been great to have been there and part of it.
Isn't it amazing how expectations of game day have turned 180 degrees!
Motlop only 5 touches but he had 5 tackles and 20 pressure acts.
Motlop only 5 touches but he had 5 tackles and 20 pressure acts.
Did well I thought. I wonder if his tackle on one of their talls ?Logue was included. He hung on and got spun around like a pole dancer.
Motlop only 5 touches but he had 5 tackles and 20 pressure acts.
Yep
Noticed him at times running to repeat contests.
That was a bit of a contrast to a recent VFL game where he seemed disinterested.
A work in progress.
Two different views of the Newnes goal. ;D
Commentator A (let's call him BT)
"They get around Jack Newnes, surely that's not his first goal for the football club" :o
(He must have missed the one against Freo after the siren in 2020)
They've all come to him We're a bit mystified"
"It's his 200th"
"The players really know their numbers these days don't they, 200 goals?"
"No it's his 200th game"
Oh well, that's about games.
Big deal.
Chair him off, chair him to the interchange.
Commentator B
(As the players get around Newnes)
"If you want to know what culture looks like on the field. That's it right there!"
Surprisingly I think B was actually Jordan Lewis (no Carlton lover)
BT is a dinosaur that has hit his used by date.
I wasn't there but the commentators (especially those at ground level) spoke of the noise level when Charlie and H (especially the former) went to work and did their thing. They were saying how it was like nothing else they've ve heard in along time. Can anyone comment on this?
I wasn't there but the commentators (especially those at ground level) spoke of the noise level when Charlie and H (especially the former) went to work and did their thing. They were saying how it was like nothing else they've ve heard in along time. Can anyone comment on this?
I took my kids (7 and 5) and our seats were level 1 under the cover of level 2 so you get that echo and they were a bit scared. It was loud.
I wasn't there but the commentators (especially those at ground level) spoke of the noise level when Charlie and H (especially the former) went to work and did their thing. They were saying how it was like nothing else they've ve heard in along time. Can anyone comment on this?
I was there and lucked into some medallion club tickets on level 2.
Never sat there before, but didn't think the noise was anything out of the ordinary.
Like mbb though, I've got 2 kids same age and they've been scared once or twice when on level one. It's louder down there.
The biggest roar I heard in recent memory was when Kreuzer kicked the winner against Port Adelaide at the Dome in Simmos 250th to put us ahead with only a couple of mins left.
My niece actually started crying, and we were up on level 3.
The biggest roar I heard in recent memory was when Kreuzer kicked the winner against Port Adelaide at the Dome in Simmos 250th to put us ahead with only a couple of mins left.
My niece actually started crying, and we were up on level 3.
That was an amazing and emotional moment which I will always remember.
Having the roof closed probably amplifies crowd noise; Darklands’ crowds certainly seem noisier than the MCG.
Charlie’s goals certainly produced a great response but I’m not sure that the crowd was any noisier than when responding to other plays, positively or negatively. The frequent high noise levels seemed louder than at other games … but we still didn’t achieve the positive affirmation that other well-supported teams seem to enjoy.
Agree with the sentiment...best win of the season. In terms of 4 quarters of footy AND given who we had out with injuries and not forgetting it was against a team that beat Melbourne and Brisbane in consecutive weeks. Voss clearly doesn't like dwelling on who isn't out there, but it's hard as a fan not to think "what might be" if we could get the likes of Weitering, McGovern, Marchbank, Pittonet, Williams, Cerra, Martin, Owies etc back fit and firing.
Lewis Young is shaping up as a real find and no doubt the last 3 or so weeks out there without Weitering will probably prove to be a huge boost for his confidence in knowing he can mix it with the good forwards and spoil and compete.
The midfield was back to its best, our defence held strong and we got 6 goals from Harry/Charlie.
For me, the biggest thing to take out of that win is the performances of our blokes who play a role....Newnes, Cottrell, Fisher, O'Brien etc. If I'm correct, 5 of our 12 goals came from Newnes, Cottrell and O'Brien? At the start of the season, the majority of us wouldn't have had any of them in our best 22. And yet a bloke like Cottrell has probably cemented his spot in the 22 and O'Brien is probably the same? They seem to be able to do the little things and play their part.
No doubt a lot of this comes back to Voss as the coach. He looks to have instilled something in the players we haven't seen before. They love the contest, they love getting in there and scrapping. He was a brutal competitor and 14 games into the season, it's starting to show I reckon. As someone else commented, Silvagni is right in the opposition's face every chance he gets. But he backs up the verbal jousting with a fierce competitiveness....he doesn't back down....don't tell me Voss wouldn't just love that.
Injuries might cruel any chance of going deep into the finals....who knows. But I see a playing list that's capable of winning one within the next couple of years:
1. Quality backline with the likes of Weitering, Docherty and Saad.
2. Quality midfield with Cripps, Walsh, Kennedy, Cerra, Hewett.
3. TDK developing very quickly and his ability to go forward with his skillset...he can become a real weapon.
4. Elite tall forwards with Harry and Charlie...and a bevy of small forward options who can apply the pressure...Owies, Durdin, Motlop, Honey and Fisher (who gets up the ground and uses his pace too).
Play like that against St Kilda and we should account for them
Thought I noticed Fisher using his right foot a couple of times Saturday, something I'd like him to persevere with just a few times a game.
Having the roof closed probably amplifies crowd noise; Darklands’ crowds certainly seem noisier than the MCG.
Charlie’s goals certainly produced a great response but I’m not sure that the crowd was any noisier than when responding to other plays, positively or negatively. The frequent high noise levels seemed louder than at other games … but we still didn’t achieve the positive affirmation that other well-supported teams seem to enjoy.
The deliberate out of bounds against Fyfe (I think) was a crowd decision. He had absolutely no motive to kick it out of bounds on purpose.
BT is a dinosaur that has hit his used by date.
I thought he reached that date after the first game I heard him commentate.
The Fyfe decision was the wrong decision but the circumstances were bizarre enough that the decision can’t be solely ascribed to the crowd noise. With the benefit of replays and time to think, the commentators came up with a very plausible explanation for that kick. They noted an umpire had run into F50 moving towards goal and Fyfe appeared to be targeting the umpire in the mistaken belief he was a team mate running free into goal. If the umpires had had the luxury of time as cricket umpires do to get together for a discussion, they may have figured it out.
Without that missing piece to the puzzle, the kick from Fyfe was a perfectly executed kick which went exactly where he intended. There was no hint of it being a miskick. And it would have ended up with Freo having a stoppage and the chance to lock the ball in to F50 by setting up the wall. In the umpire’s mind, Fyfe may have preferred this outcome rather than kicking to a contest or taking a very low percentage pot shot at goal that was likely to yield only a point and hand possession to Carlton.
The deliberate out of bounds against Fyfe (I think) was a crowd decision. He had absolutely no motive to kick it out of bounds on purpose.
I would actually disagree. I thought at the time that there wasn't anything he was a certain to kick to, so he chose the boundary to get a ball-in, which should be to their advantage.
I may be wrong: I can't read people's minds. However, I thought at the time that his disposal was tactical.
When they paid the decision against us early in the piece, they opened a can of worms.
Considering a number of other decisions that did NOT go our way, especially when Durdin was tackled around the knees, I was quite willing to take that one as payback. H should have had about 8 frees in goalkicking range, but had one (and probably the least obvious one at that).
A similar thing happened with a mark that was paid. The 3rd Freo goal was paid from a mark that wouldn't be paid 99% of the time. It was a poor decision, and we paid for it. However, it did make the umpires pay the one to Charlie Curnow later in the game. Mind you, he should have got a free for front on contact, but I'm not going there.
The free paid against Docherty was another shocker: Docherty stopped when he heard a whistle and didn't try to get rid of the ball. Then he was tackled and had the free paid against, which cost us a goal. That was not smart umpiring.
Did well I thought. I wonder if his tackle on one of their talls ?Logue was included. He hung on and got spun around like a pole dancer.
Think that was the one on the wing in font of me. Remember he came steaming in and virtually went past him to then lay the tackle from the opposite side that he came from. Outstanding and it really stood out.
The deliberate out of bounds against Fyfe (I think) was a crowd decision. He had absolutely no motive to kick it out of bounds on purpose.
As others have mentioned, Fyfe may have been honouring an umpire’s lead. However, the rule is now insufficient intent to keep the ball in play and the free against Fyfe was no worse than a couple we got pinged for.
Perhaps the angry response to those decisions helped sway the umpire’s mind 🤔
I remember thinking as Fyfe kicked it and before the decision was made "What will the umpire do here?"
It was uncertain enough that the decision could have gone either way and it would have been OK.
There is not one single thread of logic to suggest that a guy 50 metres out from his own unguarded goal would deliberately kick a perfect drop punt to go out of bounds 20 metres around from goal.
Fyfe himself said at the time that he thought the boundary umpire was a team mate.
If it had been paid against us, we would have been screaming.
There is not one single thread of logic to suggest that a guy 50 metres out from his own unguarded goal would deliberately kick a perfect drop punt to go out of bounds 20 metres around from goal.
Fyfe himself said at the time that he thought the boundary umpire was a team mate.
If it had been paid against us, we would have been screaming.
Exactly.
There is not one single thread of logic to suggest that a guy 50 metres out from his own unguarded goal would deliberately kick a perfect drop punt to go out of bounds 20 metres around from goal.
Fyfe himself said at the time that he thought the boundary umpire was a team mate.
If it had been paid against us, we would have been screaming.
That's till insufficient intent to keep the ball in play. Even kicks that slew off the boot or bounce at right angles are paid if the umpire deems that the player isn't trying to keep the ball in play.
If Fyfe had kicked towards goal, we had numbers back and were likely to have gained possession. A boundary throw in 20 metres from goal and with Darcy to contest the hitout is a much better option.
The sooner they follow the SANFL's lead where all kicks out of play are penalised the better.
Remove the grey area.
Oh and no one ever kicks it out on purpose.
The sooner they follow the SANFL's lead where all kicks out of play are penalised the better.
Remove the grey area.
Oh and no one ever kicks it out on purpose.
I'm not a fan of this idea. I've seen players of one team take out opponents so the ball goes over the line untouched. That is not what our game is about.
I'm not a fan of this idea. I've seen players of one team take out opponents so the ball goes over the line untouched. That is not what our game is about.
That would be rare. I watched a lot of SANFL games last year and it works well.
Currently an umpire will pay whatever he feels like paying.
Adrian Barridge labelling SOS the newest sledging machine in the league.
Not very nice is it?
Mind you. I'm ok with our boys losing the choirboy moniker
Adrian Barridge labelling SOS the newest sledging machine in the league.
Not very nice is it?
Mind you. I'm ok with our boys losing the choirboy moniker
He's a Silvagni, chip off the old block, love it.
I’m sure that Jack has copped it for 15 yrs about how he’s no good and only gets a game because of his name, He’d relish giving it back with interest.
I'm not a fan of this idea. I've seen players of one team take out opponents so the ball goes over the line untouched. That is not what our game is about.
Not a fan either. I don’t think it adds to AFLW game, particularly with the different outcomes inside and outside 50.
The “insufficient intent” rule is another failed attempt to provide umpires with greater clarity when determining whether a free should be paid. The previous “deliberate” out of bounds rule resulted in less frees being paid for inconsequential acts.
I’d rather see more ruck contests than free kicks - particularly when we’ve got such dominance in stoppage clearances 🙂
That would be rare. I watched a lot of SANFL games last year and it works well.
Currently an umpire will pay whatever he feels like paying.
Don't mind the idea. I like the AFLW rule where it is the last touch between thd 50m arcs.
Don't mind the idea. I like the AFLW rule where it is the last touch between thd 50m arcs.
Yep, I think that's the starting point.
I'd like to see it as last touched by foot over the line first though.
Agreed....imagine a defender going for a match saving spoil in the back pocket in the dying seconds of a game and be penalised because the ball goes out? Opponent gets a shot on goal....
Could consider the idea of "indirect free kicks" i.e. cannot directly score a goal from such frees?
The sanfl is last touch by foot.
Adrian Barridge labelling SOS the newest sledging machine in the league.
I reckon that's pretty obvious. ;) :)
I made a similar observation on page one of this thread.
I reckon Jack might not be the most popular bloke as far as the opposition is concerned.
He seems to get into a lot of 'discussions' ;D
He gets in more blues than Mike Tyson. ;D
Agreed....imagine a defender going for a match saving spoil in the back pocket in the dying seconds of a game and be penalised because the ball goes out? Opponent gets a shot on goal....
This is one that actually confuses me.
Maybe I'm missing something.
If a player deliberately kicks a ball out of bounds it's a free kick.
If a player in attempting to spoil a mark knocks the ball out of play (often with obvious intent to find the boundary) it isn't.
The question is why?
18.10 OUT OF BOUNDS
18.10.1 Spirit and Intention
Players shall be encouraged to keep the football in play.
18.10.2 Free Kicks - Out of Bounds
A field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against a Player who:
(a) Kicks the football Out of Bounds On the Full;
(b) Kicks, Handballs or
forces the football over the Boundary Line and
does not demonstrate sufficient intent to keep the football in play; or
(c) fails to immediately hand the football to the boundary Umpire or drop
the football directly to the ground once the football is Out of Bounds.
This is one that actually confuses me.
Maybe I'm missing something.
If a player deliberately kicks a ball out of bounds it's a free kick.
If a player in attempting to spoil a mark knocks the ball out of play (often with obvious intent to find the boundary) it isn't.
The question is why?
18.10 OUT OF BOUNDS
18.10.1 Spirit and Intention
Players shall be encouraged to keep the football in play.
18.10.2 Free Kicks - Out of Bounds
A field Umpire shall award a Free Kick against a Player who:
(a) Kicks the football Out of Bounds On the Full;
(b) Kicks, Handballs or forces the football over the Boundary Line and
does not demonstrate sufficient intent to keep the football in play; or
(c) fails to immediately hand the football to the boundary Umpire or drop
the football directly to the ground once the football is Out of Bounds.
Spoils can't be penalised as deliberate, even if it goes 20 rows back.
Could consider the idea of "indirect free kicks" i.e. cannot directly score a goal from such frees?
Like a 'corner' in some rectangular fielded sports?
Different, but has legs.
The last kick out being an auto free is not a big deal as it hardly happens. It just takes the grey area away.
The last kick out being an auto free is not a big deal as it hardly happens. It just takes the grey area away.
...and it forces players to try and keep the ball in rather than escort it over the line.
Like a 'corner' in some rectangular fielded sports?
Different, but has legs.
Exactly. Would need some more thought and work but the idea is promising imho.
...and it forces players to try and keep the ball in rather than escort it over the line.
All of the deliberate kicks are paid and all of the accidental.
Currently we have some of the deliberate paid and some of the accidental. It's just plain stupid.
Spoils can't be penalised as deliberate, even if it goes 20 rows back.
What's the rule that says that?
What's the rule that says that?
Not sure if there is a written rule or not, but the logic follow this.
His intention was to spoil first and foremost, NOT hit the ball out of bounds.
Not sure if there is a written rule or not, but the logic follow this.
His intention was to spoil first and foremost, NOT hit the ball out of bounds.
As far as I can see it is not a rule.
I'll stand corrected if you can find it.
Often the intent of the spoiling player is obviously to force the ball out of play.
Rule 18.10.2 (b) Kicks, Handballs or 'forces' the football over the Boundary Line...
is a rule and seems quite clear.
It should be a free kick if the intention of the player (in the opinion of the umpire) is to put the ball over the boundary line.
It happens every week.
As far as I can see it is not a rule.
I'll stand corrected if you can find it.
Often the intent of the spoiling player is obviously to force the ball out of play.
Rule 18.10.2 (b) Kicks, Handballs or 'forces' the football over the Boundary Line...
is a rule and seems quite clear.
It should be a free kick if the intention of the player (in the opinion of the umpire) is to put the ball over the boundary line.
It happens every week.
I think i've heard this discussed by an umpire.
As mentioned, you intention is to spoil. It cannot be deliberate if its a spoil.
If you start paying that then you get players holding back on their spoils so they don't get pinged for deliberate, which means the ball is more likely to be marked.
18.5 MARKING CONTESTS
18.5.1 Spirit and Intention
The Player whose sole objective is to contest or spoil a Mark shall be permitted to do so
I think i've heard this discussed by an umpire.
As mentioned, you intention is to spoil. It cannot be deliberate if its a spoil.
If you start paying that then you get players holding back on their spoils so they don't get pinged for deliberate, which means the ball is more likely to be marked.
Rather than worrying about introducing new rules like 'last touch', just enforce the rules as they are .
The onus should be on the spoiling player to make the spoil sure, but also keep the ball in play not deliberately knock it out of bounds.
There is a difference between a spoil that goes to ground and rolls out and one that gets deliberately knocked twenty metres into the stand.
18.5 MARKING CONTESTS
18.5.1 Spirit and Intention
The Player whose sole objective is to contest or spoil a Mark shall be permitted to do so
Yep that's fair
The key words are "sole objective" and when you deliberately knock it over the line it's no longer a sole objective.
It becomes a spoil and a reset
Rather than worrying about introducing new rules like 'last touch', just enforce the rules as they are .
The onus should be on the spoiling player to make the spoil sure, but also keep the ball in play not deliberately knock it out of bounds.
There is a difference between a spoil that goes to ground and rolls out and one that gets deliberately knocked twenty metres into the stand.
Yep that's fair
The key words are "sole objective" and when you deliberately knock it over the line it's no longer a sole objective.
It becomes a spoil and a reset
How many times have you seen someone wind up with a huge round arm spoil that could knock someone's head off, but the player still clunks the mark. Think Levi, when he got his hands to it, a bazooka couldn't dislodge it. Thats one reason why you can put it into the outer.
FWIW, i'm not sure why you are fixating on this rule. It might happen once a round. It doesn't hold up play or delay a game so why would you need to penalise it?
In the SANFL all of the deliberate kicks are paid and all of the accidental kicks are paid.
In the AFL some of the deliberate kicks are paid and some of the accidental kicks are paid.
You could not argue that the AFL system is better.
How many times have you seen someone wind up with a huge round arm spoil that could knock someone's head off, but the player still clunks the mark. Think Levi, when he got his hands to it, a bazooka couldn't dislodge it. Thats one reason why you can put it into the outer.
FWIW, i'm not sure why you are fixating on this rule. It might happen once a round. It doesn't hold up play or delay a game so why would you need to penalise it?
It does hold up play.
It causes a stoppage and a throw in.
If it was a free kick it might cause players to modify their spoiling and keep the ball in play.
At the very least redirect the spoil.
I think it probably happens much more than once a round.
Watch it in our next game.
I guess I'm fixating on it because it seems a bit inconsistent to penalise a 'dubious' deliberate out of bounds with a kick.
Yet a definite 'deliberate' punch of the ball out of bounds is fine.
If we're going to seriously look at 'last touch' either by hand or foot then all these will be free kicks anyway under that rule.
Upshot of all this....leave the rules as they are. Introducing more rule changes with grey areas just infuriates fans when you see different interpretations on the same infringement week after week.
Upshot of all this....leave the rules as they are. Introducing more rule changes with grey areas just infuriates fans when you see different interpretations on the same infringement week after week.
Absolutely!
Apart from changes that protect players’ health and safety, the only rule changes should be to wind back the rule changes/interpretations that have come in over the last decade.
In the SANFL all of the deliberate kicks are paid and all of the accidental kicks are paid.
In the AFL some of the deliberate kicks are paid and some of the accidental kicks are paid.
You could not argue that the AFL system is better.
Or we could just can the deliberate kick altogether.
If you are skilful enough to bounce the ball inside the lines, then a throw in ensues, thats a genuine tactic to help get out of defense and prevent repeat entries.
Or we could just can the deliberate kick altogether.
If you are skilful enough to bounce the ball inside the lines, then a throw in ensues, thats a genuine tactic to help get out of defense and prevent repeat entries.
Yes Thry, a kick out of defence that landed millimeters inside the boundary line before bouncing out was a sublime skill, particularly when it was disguised as a miss-kick.
I think I’d prefer no deliberate out of bounds to the last kick rule. However, umpires should be able to determine blatantly deliberate out of bounds. That would be better than the current “insufficient intent” interpretation.
Or we could just can the deliberate kick altogether.
If you are skilful enough to bounce the ball inside the lines, then a throw in ensues, thats a genuine tactic to help get out of defense and prevent repeat entries.
I don't know which is worse, the current farce or the introduction of a licence to "kick for touch" with the resulting increase in stoppages.
I don't know which is worse, the current farce or the introduction of a licence to "kick for touch" with the resulting increase in stoppages.
It depends what you want.
The 'look' of the game is the driving factor of the AFL and its clear they want less stoppages.
However, from an 'evenness' point of view, having the ability to deliberately put the ball over the line opens up a whole set of tactics available to coaches and a more diverse style of game plans available.
The more diverse styles available, the more of a chance a team can win on any given day. That is, one style of play can outdo a different style of play. Whereas if everyone is playing the same style, one team will always be better at it.
We've got a team that wins via domination over stoppages, and the current AFL administration wants to remove/diminish stoppages as part of the game, that change could not be worse for us as players like Cripps, Hewett and Kennedy will be involved in less play.
From my perspective, the current balance in the rules of the game and the speed of play is just about right, across the competition we've got midfielders getting 30+ possessions, small forwards kicking goals and KPFs taking marks. I think they should just leave the game alone for a few seasons to see where it settles.
There is too much politics in the way the AFL fiddles with the rules, it is nearly always due to one coach or club executive having the ear of the AFL authorities to change rules to favour a list. The debate is further driven by the AFL media, and it's rarely impartial because it's not even close to being representative!
Consistency is overrated. Apply it religiously and it will set start a chain reaction that will result in perverse results. Fatprick Smith used to argue that the AFL’s changes to the bump rule to protect the head (with which he agreed) required the AFL to bring in similar changes regarding marking contests. He believed that a guy like Naughton who flies into a pack should be banned if his hip or knee contacts the head of anyone in the pack. For him, outlawing the Byron Pickett pick-off should lead to a ban on pack marks.
Excluding spoiling from the deliberate out of bounds penalty isn’t confusing. Only the dimwitted players think they’re allowed to intercept a handball by punching it 10 rows back. And it’s not such a regular occurrence that it needs to be addressed. You could even argue the ability of a defender to spoil over the boundary provides a disincentive to teams that hit up targets close to the boundary to reduce their exposure on turnovers. But such justifications aren’t necessary. All we have to do is recognise that a rule change doesn’t have to result in the domino effect forcing a chain of consequential changes. Enjoy the messiness of the game rather than seeing it through the eyes of an OCD sufferer.
Spoiling over the boundary line is a skill, hate to see it lost to the game.
Who gives a flying.... what Patrick Smith thinks anyway. Bloke was irrelevant 20 years ago. .
In the SANFL all of the deliberate kicks are paid and all of the accidental kicks are paid.
In the AFL some of the deliberate kicks are paid and some of the accidental kicks are paid.
You could not argue that the AFL system is better.
The Fisher out of bounds deliberate free kick tonight was garbage, he may have been facing the boundary line but the ball was miskicked not deliberately aimed for the boundary line.
The Fisher out of bounds deliberate free kick tonight was garbage, he may have been facing the boundary line but the ball was miskicked not deliberately aimed for the boundary line.
Totally agree. The umps have no idea about this rule. To make it easier for their pea brains should just be any kick that is not touched and that does not have a player within 20 metres of it is a free to the opposition. Need to take the thinking out of it cause they have no feel for the game these blokes.
Totally agree. The umps have no idea about this rule. To make it easier for their pea brains should just be any kick that is not touched and that does not have a player within 20 metres of it is a free to the opposition. Need to take the thinking out of it cause they have no feel for the game these blokes.
For every deliberate decision, the umpire should have to replicate it in the same circumstances to prove it was deliberate.
If an umpire managed to even get the ball to touch his foot trying to exectute that same manouver, i'd be very impressed. To suggest he had enough skill to deliberately kick it where he wanted to is very much far fetched.
That's paid regularly. I am ambivalent about the 'insufficient intent to keep the ball in play' rule.
Player: Sorry, Ump, I didn't mean to push him in the back
Ump: Oh, Ok. Your free then for holding the ball.
Player: Cheers
The solution is in the sanfl. Proven to work.