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Re: General Discussions

Reply #615 –
Quote from: Mav on
Not if you include lethality in the equation. Putin doesn't even need much polonium to do the job.
or lithium! ;)

You need to think before you post, emotion is not going to cut it in this debate. How many micrograms of nuclear waste for every tonne of lithium, cadmium, sulfide waste?

We are building a new train tunnel in Vic with a budget in the billions, we could build a tunnel the same scale in the middle of nowhere and stored a hundred years of the whole world's nuclear waste earning trillions in the process, and it wouldn't even cover the area of a biro line drawn on the page of a street directory! Zero carbon emissions and stored for an eternity!
The Force Awakens!

Re: General Discussions

Reply #616 –
Emotional? Mr Spock is more emotional than my post.

Re: General Discussions

Reply #617 –
Quote from: Mav on
Or maybe you could say Mme Curie unfortunately was at the cutting edge of new rather than mature technology. Nuclear power is now very mature whereas renewables and battery technologies will improve rapidly. Confining the comparison of nuclear and fossil fuel energy generation to only existing renewables & battery technology is misleading.

The thing with batteries is, besides the waste issue that comes along with them, is the more power you force into them, and the smaller you make them, the more dangerous they become.

We are walking around with bombs in our pockets already, better technology just means bigger bombs.

Have a look at a video of a phone battery exploding and remind yourself it's usually in a pocket that is inches away from your manhood.
Remember the Samsung phone batteries exploding when they got too hot?

I'm all for more research into batteries, but there is a limit to the size and power they can get too, and the waste that comes with it. Not to mention the fact we will probably run out of resources and/or destroy the planet trying to find it.
In the end we'd hope to achieve something close to what nuclear power already gives us....so let's just skip 70 years of research and get to the same point we are now.

There are a couple of docos about batteries and technology worth watching from a few years ago. They go through the intricacies of it all and the challenges facing them. It actually does more harm than good to the point trying to be made imo.

Re: General Discussions

Reply #618 –
Quote from: Mav on
Emotional? Mr Spock is more emotional than my post.
References to Polonium are clearly meant to scare readers, ignoring some good works of fiction just how many people have been offed using this method, out of the nearly 8 Billion currently on the planet? I mean we are all at so much risk, popping off like Polonium lightbulbs!

My mates are going on a dive trip to Bikini Atoll next year, a friend who went there back in 2019 is taking them, they have been planning it right through the pandemic and keep getting delayed by a virus., Apparently though according to you sources fusion bombs have left the joint is contaminated for 10,000 years!

Nuclear weapons and fallout are bad, but on average you get more radiation from living above a coal seam than you get from a power station or weapons residuals. you are more at risk visiting Cardiff or Yarram for a holiday than travelling to Bikini Atoll or Fugkushima Japan!

Should we ban living in South Eastern Victoria, the major coal seam runs from Metung to Ballarat? Apparently not, but burying radioactive stuff under ground isn't a solution, so I hear!

Emotion won't cut it in this debate, the feel good solutions are falling short of expectation, and all they are really doing is just another version of pushing the problem into another time and space. The planet needs stuff that actually works without carbon emission now, and it can't wait for a the glimmer of hope promised but not yet delivered by some ideologues green nirvana!

The truth hides in plain site, so many people know it, the billionaires sell you batteries and panels while they develop nuclear and hydrogen on the quiet, they aren't going to go all in on a high risk renewable bet with the only home they can really ever have! All the other shizen, moving to Mars, living under the sea, sailing off to a new planet is for Homer Simpson!

FMD, They just approved billions for an offshore windfarm in Bass Strait, how long will that last? The Navys of the world scrap billion dollars vessels each year because they can't solve "The corrosion problem" and they have been working on it for 200 years. The green dream public think they are going to build a forest of wind farms offshore and let them run for decades and decades out at sea providing green carbon free energy, when in reality they will need to be rebuilt or replaced completely on regular intervals. They'll barely get the carbon budget back from the processing of the materials they need let alone power anyone with decades of surplus green energy.

The biggest reason all these green projects get approval is economics and nothing to do with the triple bottom line, they can be monetised so someone gets to make a profit even if it's only until the subsidies run out.
The Force Awakens!

Re: General Discussions

Reply #619 –
What uplifting emotional landscapes you show me! Young girls skipping through nuclear waste followed by cute fluffy dogs. It's not a threat to health at all!

Re: General Discussions

Reply #620 –
And now I'm terrified about battery bombs going off. Why hasn't the military thought of dropping second-hand phones on the enemy? That's the best recycling plan ever. Nuclear warheads are so old hat.

Re: General Discussions

Reply #621 –
I declare my ignorance on this subject, straight up, so the following may seem naive.

From my limited (very) knowledge on this it seems just about any electricity source brings with it it's own unique problems.

I've watched docos that are pro nuclear and others than are anti nuclear (attempting to educate myself. Ditto windfarms, solar and even tidal things!).

Seems that economics play a large and controlling role in all this... quick fixes with quick and continued financial returns (on corporate investment) seem to be big drivers.

Hydroelectric power has strong pros re emissions but even the large dams needed are problematic - setup costs, environmental impact, local community impact, climate vulnerabilities and even methane gas releases over time. But having lived in areas with a predominant hydroelectric power generation the improved air quality was palpable, though there may well have been other factors contributing to this ie, NZ, which has better than 50% hydro usage, is also small with plenty of wind to remove pollution... though some (polluted air) is blowing in now from other countries. I think that Tassies hydroelectric power accounts for more than three quarters of the states power and boy, the air quality there is noticeably cleaner.

We live in West Gippsland and even an hours drive to the city (Melb) delivers a difference in air quality that is noticeable.

Although perhaps very anecdotal, when I was at Franganstan High (1400 students) back in the late 60s/early 70s, students with asthma were an oddity, in fact you could have counted them on your own fingers! Now, apparently, almost 33% of young folks have asthma issues from mild, occasional... to chronic. 
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: General Discussions

Reply #622 –
Baggers, you’re a Frankganistan escapee ?
This explains a lot… 😎
🤣🤣
Let’s go BIG !

Re: General Discussions

Reply #623 –
Quote
Russian troops began leaving the Chernobyl nuclear plant after soldiers got “significant doses” of radiation from digging trenches at the highly contaminated site, Ukraine’s state power company said Thursday as fighting raged on the outskirts of Kyiv and other fronts.

Energoatom gave no details on the condition of the troops or how many were affected. But it said the Russians had dug in in the forest inside the exclusion zone around the now-closed plant, the site in 1986 of the world’s worst nuclear disaster.

The troops “panicked at the first sign of illness,” which “showed up very quickly,” and began preparing to leave, Energoatom said.

Russian Troops Leave Chernobyl, Ukrainian Nuclear Operator Says, Huffpost.

Re: General Discussions

Reply #624 –
The "pollution" of wind farms across the landscapes is unsightly and offensive.  Estimated that over a million birds are killed each year.  Go nuclear

Re: General Discussions

Reply #626 –
Quote from: Mav on
And now I'm terrified about battery bombs going off. Why hasn't the military thought of dropping second-hand phones on the enemy? That's the best recycling plan ever. Nuclear warheads are so old hat.
It's easier to extract deadly poisons from your iOS or Android device, isotopes of lithium, beryllium, cadmium, rubidium and stick them in your leg with a hypodermic than it is to obtain polonium pellets for the same job!

Or I could just go around the house and collect up all the smoke detectors and send you an Americium microdot, job done!

Maybe just get Telstra to install a 5G tower in your backyard, why not take out eh whole neighbourhood just as a safe margin!

For for god sake, stay away from the banana traders!
The Force Awakens!
 

Re: General Discussions

Reply #627 –
Quote from: LP on
So it's true, dirt does protect you and burying the longer lived waste deep is a viable solution! ;)
Yes, it's wonderful to see the preschoolers playing in the parks in the vibrant and thriving Chernobyl suburbs.

Re: General Discussions

Reply #628 –
Quote from: Mav on
Yes, it's wonderful to see the preschoolers playing in the parks in the vibrant and thriving Chernobyl suburbs.
Of course because we commercially scatter nuclear waste from modern facilities on the ground like fertiliser, much the same way we spread silicate dusts from production of solar panels!

How many lithium battery fires have we had at those mega sites so far, have they manged to put them out yet, do you live downwind of one?

What about those self-combusting Tesla's, Prius or Leaf, has it happened in your neighbourhood yet and did you get evacuated or did breakfast taste faintly metallic?

By the way, have you noticed the almost complete absence of poisons or harm information from sites like Wikipedia relating to Lithium or lithium compounds? They used to be included in those pages but it seems it is no longer political or socially acceptable to report or discuss such things so they are removed. Don't talk about the war!
The Force Awakens!

Re: General Discussions

Reply #629 –
Quote from: Baggers on
Hydroelectric power has strong pros re emissions but even the large dams needed are problematic - setup costs, environmental impact, local community impact, climate vulnerabilities and even methane gas releases over time.
The methane is an issue, but it's an issue made even bigger by the Solar PV and Wind farm boosters, they aren't really for all low or no carbon solutions but for their green solution which is "All Good". It's a hypocrisy that we can all see, and the louder they become the more widely it is exposed.

The truth is of course that every large water basin, lakes, seas and oceans release methane. It is an even bigger problem when they don't because the gradual release is quite natural while the accumulation and sudden release can be devastating.

@Baggers‍ As you suggest there is no one solution, the minute they stop postulating their specific solution as the one and only best solution they may actually make some progress in getting people to listen and act. Many hands make light work, and the same applies to technological solutions.

I read an article last year about protestors opposing the mining of underwater resources for rare earths due to the potential release of methane, but apparently it's OK do so under permafrost in high northern latitudes when the mine is collecting rare earths for use in Chinese production of your solar PV or wind farm components. But if Apple or Samsung do it to provide high tech semiconductors for phones, TVs or perhaps on the side the odd pacemaker, then it's evil, the double standard is alarming.
The Force Awakens!