Sadly, he was still our most important player last year IMO
Our season changed upon his return, even Murphy captained better when he was around but he can't carry us as far as he used to.
So what role does he play for us next year and can he go on?
He looked seriously dangerous up forward late last season, even jumped at a few packs.
Let him work blokes out of the forward pocket and get them on the burst back towards goal. FMD, who'd want the job standing him, the opposition won't be putting a spud on him, and the rest is break even or lose!
HFF.
Reckon he will end up being used on the ball especially if we are not going so well and Mick's job is on the line...Cripps, Graham, Bell, Whiley are still way short of the better mids and Judd is still our best in and under player when the heat is on...
Primarily Forward Pocket, with bursts on the ball.
half back flank for the next 3 years...
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
Midfield with longer stints on the bench (less game time) a la Lenny Hayes this year. Less forward time IMO.
I would rather have Judd dominating games in the middle for 80% game time than playing 90%+ with time up forward. "resting" up forward is a myth. Forwards still need to run their guts out and don't get much time on the bench.
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
In the past he has looked miffed, even disinterested maybe, but a few times late last season he really looked ready to have a crack up forward. Like he had overcome the Sads about not being on the ball 24x7.
Midfield with longer stints on the bench (less game time) a la Lenny Hayes this year. Less forward time IMO.
I would rather have Judd dominating games in the middle for 80% game time than playing 90%+ with time up forward. "resting" up forward is a myth. Forwards still need to run their guts out and don't get much time on the bench.
There isn't a traditional back pocket in the league that could run with Judd or Ablett for 15 mins, let alone half a game. They have to put blokes like Crowley on them and that weakens the opposition defensive setup as much as anything.
Have Judd learn to turn the right way relative to the umpire location and he will get holding the man free kicks half a dozen times a game.
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
In the past he has looked miffed, even disinterested maybe, but a few times late last season he really looked ready to have a crack up forward. Like he had overcome the Sads about not being on the ball 24x7.
Midfield with longer stints on the bench (less game time) a la Lenny Hayes this year. Less forward time IMO.
I would rather have Judd dominating games in the middle for 80% game time than playing 90%+ with time up forward. "resting" up forward is a myth. Forwards still need to run their guts out and don't get much time on the bench.
There isn't a traditional back pocket in the league that could run with Judd or Ablett for 15 mins, let alone half a game. They have to put blokes like Crowley on them and that weakens the opposition defensive setup as much as anything.
Have Judd learn to turn the right way relative to the umpire location and he will get holding the man free kicks half a dozen times a game.
Taking Judd out of the midfield and putting him forward means running one of our forwards through the midfield. Not sure Menzel has the tank yet and Ellard doesn't have anywhere near the class of Judd. Play players in the position they play their best footy.
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
x2....
Not a real great overhead mark and I think he is better up the ground running into goal than being a permanent forward...
Play him where we need him . On the ball.
Hes the same vintage as Ablett, Hodge, Stevie J. He can handle it . Specially with some younger blokes coming through to ease the pressure.
In the last few games he played for us in the mid field this year he looked great and was definitely very fit. I'd leave him there - if it ain't broke etc etc.
We're off to a flyer if he has a good and uninterrupted preseason then follows up with a long run of games in 2015, punctuated by some strategic rest weeks.
In the last few games he played for us in the mid field this year he looked great and was definitely very fit. I'd leave him there - if it ain't broke etc etc.
We're off to a flyer if he has a good and uninterrupted preseason then follows up with a long run of games in 2015, punctuated by some strategic rest weeks.
x2
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
I've never seen it either. Not a great set shot for goal.
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
I've never seen it either. Not a great set shot for goal.
x2, as great as the Champ has been, he is not a fwds a-hole. Set shot or on the run, he is pretty average IMO. Its what makes Ablett a better player than Judd, kicks many more goals.
We still need him in traffic.
Still has enough pace and the awareness to make good decision and put the ball to our advantage.
We still need him in traffic.
Still has enough pace and the awareness to make good decision and put the ball to our advantage.
this
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
I've never seen it either. Not a great set shot for goal.
x2, as great as the Champ has been, he is not a fwds a-hole. Set shot or on the run, he is pretty average IMO. Its what makes Ablett a better player than Judd, kicks many more goals.
I reckon Judd WCE days he was a better player than Ablett at his best. Big call I know but Judd was just electric.
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
I've never seen it either. Not a great set shot for goal.
x2, as great as the Champ has been, he is not a fwds a-hole. Set shot or on the run, he is pretty average IMO. Its what makes Ablett a better player than Judd, kicks many more goals.
The game has evolved so much that we almost need to consider the nomenclature we use. A forward doesn't actually have to be a forward in the traditional sense. We now have defensive forwards, hit up forwards, crumbing forwards...
Judd can play forward, but he doesn't necessarily have to kick goals to be effective. His ability to find space where there is little, and find someone in space when it is nigh on impossible would be a welcome addition to any forwardline.
I still remember a clip where he picked up the ball either in or at the top of the goal square, heavy traffic, was about to give a handball off over the top of the pack but at the last second held onto it, and gave off a handball to the next bloke running past who was in a better position = goal.
The presence and ability to read the situation is second to none. Kicking goals or not is irrelevant.
I can't find footage of that handball.
I did find this however, guess it'll have to do.
[flash=560,315]http://www.youtube.com/v/GoeH6mtrcTQ[/flash]
Could watch that all day Krudds ;)
He did that on a borked leg as well. I think he creates far more goals from the middle though
I reckon Judd WCE days he was a better player than Ablett at his best. Big call I know but Judd was just electric.
I'd second that. He was also playing alongside Cousins and Kerr which equates to Ablett's Geelong era heroics alongside Bartel, Selwood and Co. Judd just seemed so explosive.
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
Actually, in his last year for the Eagles, because of his injury, he played out of the goalsquare and did well, especially considering he was restricted. He read the play well and was certainly good on the lead.
Am I the only one who thinks he is fairly ordinary as a forward?
Actually, in his last year for the Eagles, because of his injury, he played out of the goalsquare and did well, especially considering he was restricted. He read the play well and was certainly good on the lead.
I understand his best is behind him but he has never really played as a forward. Sure he rested there in games but his game mindset was always as a mid and any forward play he did was filling in a blank rather then changing his game as a forward.
Lets not forget how good this man is when he puts his mind to it. I would back him to kick 30-40 goals a year and as a permenent forward but doubt it will ever happen. We cant afford that luxury. He is still out best inside mid by a streak when fit so unlikely to see he great man change his game to focus on being a forward.
Put him in hawks team and lock him in on a HFF. Easy 40 goals a year and will set up heaps as well.
Judd is the most extraordinary player of our era.
Only people jealous that he came to carlton and not their team would say otherwise. imo. ;D
WCE got the best of him as he had better team mates.... but they also ran him in to the ground.
Ablett is on another level to Judd and any other player of this century.
^^
No chance. Ablett could only dream of having the break away speed Judd possessed at his best.
Comparing Ablett to Judd is like comparing Sam Jacobs to Dean Cox, all equally good footballers but very different!
Ablett links up through the midfield with plenty of gives and receives because players can keep pace with him. Ablett has better agility than Judd and so perhaps this makes Ablett a more rounded option.
Judd doesn't link up much at all, because when he gets the ball in free space they watch him head off into the distance. It's a problem because often the preferred targets cannot ahead of him even when he is carrying the ball! This is why you don't see Judd with 40 possession games, Ablett can rack up 40 possessions before he has exited the center square!
Ablett gets pinged with the ball quite often, Judd hardly ever got caught until a year or so ago.
Ablett is a better forward option, Judd is a better midfield option.
If our club stops butchering Murphy he could be as effective as Ablett, they actually play a very similar game if only Murphy was a touch bigger. For what it is worth Gibbs could be as effective as Ablett. But none will ever be like Judd, superior skills aside they just don't have the tricks.
The Judd v Ablett debate will continue for ever and everyone has their own opinion. To use an F1 analogy, Schumacher went to Ferrari when they were a basket case, attracted some good support staff, 5 WC's later... His impact was immense. Senna chose to go to Williams instead of Ferrari because they were the best team with the best resources. Why? What did he achieve there? Didnt score a single point for the first time in his career and then unfortunately lost his life. The analogy is that I reckon Ablett has had a bigger impact on the Suns than Judd has at Carlton. Not saying Judd has had no or little impact on his young team mates, I just reckon Gaz has had more. Coming from me thats a massive statement. (a). Because I would turn and marry Juddy if he asked me to (b). I was a big Ablett hater who thought he was overrated when he was at Geelong. They will go down as two of the best mids to ever play the game, I just reckon Gaz shades just because of the few things I have mentioned.
I think Gaz has achieved more for sure but at his best Judd was the better player. Ablett has longevity on his side plus it took him a good 4-5 years to become the star he is whereas Judd was unstoppable from the get go and gradually slowed down after his groin injury with the WCE in his final year. If Judd was still playing at that same level as he did in his first 6-7 years I think many of you would be going with Judd.
The Judd v Ablett debate will continue for ever and everyone has their own opinion. To use an F1 analogy, Schumacher went to Ferrari when they were a basket case, attracted some good support staff, 5 WC's later... His impact was immense. Senna chose to go to Williams instead of Ferrari because they were the best team with the best resources. Why? What did he achieve there? Didnt score a single point for the first time in his career and then unfortunately lost his life. The analogy is that I reckon Ablett has had a bigger impact on the Suns than Judd has at Carlton. Not saying Judd has had no or little impact on his young team mates, I just reckon Gaz has had more. Coming from me thats a massive statement. (a). Because I would turn and marry Juddy if he asked me to (b). I was a big Ablett hater who thought he was overrated when he was at Geelong. They will go down as two of the best mids to ever play the game, I just reckon Gaz shades just because of the few things I have mentioned.
Pretty easy claim to make.
One player went to a club that was being helped hand over fist by the league, the other player went to a club that was the leagues fashionable whipping boy.
Imagine if Judd had gone to a club that was being offered so much support?
Then there is the darker aspect of this, the one nobody talks about!
Ablett shades Judd IMO...more goal kicking power and more consistent as his Brownlow votes show...he probably should be a triple brownlow medallist except for injury...hard to beat that record although Judd runs him close.
I like watching Judd better than Ablett though...bit like watching Michael Holding bowl vs Malcom Marshall or Mark Waugh bat vs his bro Steve...the former's had the style the others didnt...
Injury hampered 2012/2013/2014 hurt Judd in this argument. Remembering him doing those gut busting runs out of the back pocket to kick goals or dragging a pack of 4 players on his back in a clearance. Truly remarkable player.
I think he ran straighter than just about anyone in the game as well.
Ablett shades Judd IMO...more goal kicking power and more consistent as his Brownlow votes show...he probably should be a triple brownlow medallist except for injury...hard to beat that record although Judd runs him close.
I like watching Judd better than Ablett though...bit like watching Michael Holding bowl vs Malcom Marshall or Mark Waugh bat vs his bro Steve...the former's had the style the others didnt...
But at their best, forget their careers, at their best who was better? Who would you pick?
Ablett shades Judd IMO...more goal kicking power and more consistent as his Brownlow votes show...he probably should be a triple brownlow medallist except for injury...hard to beat that record although Judd runs him close.
I like watching Judd better than Ablett though...bit like watching Michael Holding bowl vs Malcom Marshall or Mark Waugh bat vs his bro Steve...the former's had the style the others didnt...
But at their best, forget their careers, at their best who was better? Who would you pick?
Pre Ablett going to Suns, I would have said Judd, now I would pick Ablett by a bees pee pee.
Ablett shades Judd IMO...more goal kicking power and more consistent as his Brownlow votes show...he probably should be a triple brownlow medallist except for injury...hard to beat that record although Judd runs him close.
I like watching Judd better than Ablett though...bit like watching Michael Holding bowl vs Malcom Marshall or Mark Waugh bat vs his bro Steve...the former's had the style the others didnt...
But at their best, forget their careers, at their best who was better? Who would you pick?
Too hard to call.... :-\
But at their best, forget their careers, at their best who was better? Who would you pick?
JUDD!!!
I remember wishing we had a player like Judd in his prime.
At their best you could only dream to have both, as no other pair in the league could come remotely close.
But at their best, forget their careers, at their best who was better? Who would you pick?
JUDD!!!
I remember wishing we had a player like Judd in his prime.
I remember wishing we just had Judd!
I've never in my life seen a player just step into the AFL at that age and do what he did. I still remember the first time I saw him play, first bit of play in fact it was a centre bounce and he just swooped on the ball and took off with a Port player right on his hammer. He put ten metres on him in a flash, whilst bouncing, ran to 50m and kicked the goal. I just thought to myself WTF is this, who is this?
@Elwood
First time I've seen you sit on the fence mate! :P
I admired Judd more after he came to Carlton, I felt Kerr was the one doing all the grunt work for him at the Eagles.
Ablett became the best player in the comp in 2007 and has been ever since.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/t31.0-8/10496178_10152825336543334_3858760729606689833_o.jpg)
Has Juddy been training with the Essendon boys?
Has Juddy been training with the Essendon boys?
Got the drink bottles mixed up... :)
Has Juddy been training with the Essendon boys?
Got the drink bottles mixed up... :)
I follow both Juddy and Becs on Instagram, he hasnt stopped running and training since the season finished. Has been enjoying himself at the races for sure but he as been working pretty hard maintaining himself in ripping condition. Thats why he is a legend.
Looking at this photo, you can come to the conclusion that he wants to leave the AFL with a bang.
Without wanting to out a dampener on things, all players look a little bigger at this time of the year, especially if they've been hitting the gym. Still promising signs.
He does look to be in tip-top condition.
Maybe 2 or 3 seasons left in that body yet.