Much will be answered this evening.
Immensely proud of the performance tonight.
Gutted like never before.
Cerra, Hewett & Kennedy out, almost did it anyway. Newnes will have nightmares. If he’d taken that almost uncontested mark at CHB, game over, and his opponent goes on to kick the match winner.
Gutted like never before.
X 2.
Just when we could have, should have, might have 😭
Who was it that bounced the kick back to Saad with a minute to go?
It forced Saad to kick long to a contest, which we lost and it went down the other end.
Hit Saad and we play chip/kick game until the siren blows.
Cerra, Hewett & Kennedy out, almost did it anyway. Newnes will have nightmares. If he’d taken that almost uncontested mark at CHB, game over, and his opponent goes on to kick the match winner.
Those are the moments you look to your leaders and seniors. Not to be but will be a burning learning point
Who was it that bounced the kick back to Saad with a minute to go?
It forced Saad to kick long to a contest, which we lost and it went down the other end.
Hit Saad and we play chip/kick game until the siren blows.
Just rewatched it, it was Owies. He limped off afterwards.
10 seconds later Young spoiled the ball over the line with his head turned. ::)
Does anyone know whether you should disconnect both the computer and the television when removing the former from the latter? :(
Can't believe we lost it.... after such a gallant game
Does anyone know whether you should disconnect both the computer and the television when removing the former from the latter? :(
Is that prior to kicking them both or after…?
Lost with 11 seconds to go. Unbelievable
Come to think of it. Our finals chances will probably come down to the last second of the season
Who was it that bounced the kick back to Saad with a minute to go?
It forced Saad to kick long to a contest, which we lost and it went down the other end.
Hit Saad and we play chip/kick game until the siren blows.
Yep 100%. Said the same thing when it happened.
Effort was there just lacked the composure at the end to ice it. The ball was in our hands with under a minute to go - good teams win from there.
Was I the only one that just knew that last goal was coming?
Anyone who is critical of that performance tonight is not a true supporters. Undermanned, not given any hope )by anyone) yet they slogged it out. Our strugglers were against the best midfield in the business..... proud.
100% proud of the players playing four quarters of finals football without three of our gun contested ball players.
Fingers crossed Bam Bam and Cerra and Hewett play
Lost with 11 seconds to go. Unbelievable
Come to think of it. Our finals chances will probably come down to the last second of the season
We lost to the pies with 2 seconds to go because the umpire forgot where Walsh's head was!
What a day. Dogs win by 5pts and we lose by 5pts at the death after being 7pts up with 1.50 to go.....grrrrr.
Hope this weekend doesn't haunt us.
Devastating
We will beat Collingwood and make the finals, effort was there just have to reproduce next week.
Need TDK in...hopefully rested up.
Melksham played the game of his life you can't plan for that....
As Kramer said ‘Poise counts Jerry’
Just an ounce of it and we are playing finals. We gave everything we had but just lacked composure and cool heads when it mattered most.
I'll stop swearing at umpires when they learn (1) their own bloody rules and (2) the concept of consistency.
100% proud of the players playing four quarters of finals football without three of our gun contested ball players.
Fingers crossed Bam Bam and Cerra and Hewett play
X2
We will beat Collingwood and make the finals, effort was there just have to reproduce next week.
Need TDK in...hopefully rested up.
Melksham played the game of his life you can't plan for that....
Wish I was as confident EB. Had our chance tonight and now have to stress again against pies who will be just a tough and will love nothing more then to knock us out. And if it’s another close one they unlike us know how to close it out.
The really frustrating thing is that a draw if Pickett had kicked a point would have got us into the finals. I couldn’t be bothered checking to confirm that as it really doesn’t matter now.
-20 hit outs
+3 clearances
Got to be incredibly impressed with our patchwork midfield. First the defensive crisis, then the midfield decimation. No Cerra, MK, Hewett. That's takes bad luck to a level beyond what's imaginable
The really frustrating thing is that a draw if Pickett had kicked a point would have got us into the finals. I couldn’t be bothered checking to confirm that as it really doesn’t matter now.
Confirmed
Great effort given the circumstances we found ourselves in but I still can't accept losing when 7pts in front with 1.50 to go and finals on the line. Shouldn't happen.
I won't be watching the last 2 minutes. That's for sure
The reason why we can't play like that against teams that are inferior eludes me. Play like that against next week and we win easily.
Amazing effort & determination shown by the boys tonight, so very proud of them , areal team effort and we almost pinched it, a tough game took so much effort, let’s hope the boys are up to it again next week, Pies will a dure obstacle, they must retain their double chance.
In the past 2 games, Vossy's arguably seen our best and worst.
I'm convinced we're good enough, when we want to be, but we need a bit of luck, something we haven't had for a long, long time.
Lewis Young....looked good.
You just dont lose games like that, why do we give so many goals away in the last one to two minutes of qtrs. Its insane. We did it every qtr bar 1 tonight.
We burnt too many opportunities with horrendous foot skills, the tennis equivalent of unforced errors.
Negatives;
Fans love Motlop but he's a burden at the moment, Newnes dropped more than he caught, he can be renamed Iron Gloves.
Positives;
Cottrell cares and he puts in, BigH is back baby!
Lewis Young....looked good.
Steep learning curve for the young fella. He's embraced an enormous challenge and come out on top. That’s what builds resilience right there.
More importantly for us, he's been durable too. An outstanding season 👏
You just dont lose games like that, why do we give so many goals away in the last one to two minutes of qtrs. Its insane. We did it every qtr bar 1 tonight.
Melksham kicking 4 goals 2
Charlie kicking 1 goal 4
Was the game really. But the method of finals type play with so many gun mids missing is nothing short of outstanding.
Melksham kicking 4 goals 2
Charlie kicking 1 goal 4
Was the game really. But the method of finals type play with so many gun mids missing is nothing short of outstanding.
Melksham dribbled his last kick in for a goal on the left foot 45m during the warm up right in front of me. I turned to me mate and said “He’ll have a big one”.
Melksham dribbled his last kick in for a goal on the left foot 45m during the warm up right in front of me. I turned to me mate and said “He’ll have a big one”.
..and unfortunately you were right. I don't think we are a flag side but think we are more than good enough to play in Prelims if we play like that. I would have loved to have all our bulls in the team today. Would have blown them away by 10 goals IMO.
There were so many costly moments in that one that its unfair to single one player out.
Ultimately they all put in and was possibly our best 4 quarter effort for the year given the numbers out.
The umpires played a hand in Melbourne's win today. Kosi pickett somehow got a holding the ball against Stocker with no prior. The demons got away with plenty and only cripps got done for what was a correct disposal.
Can't fault the effort, but we got a few gifts and didn't hit the scoreboard.
Thats why Collingwood keep winning for what its worth. They haven't wasted their chances.
Yep luck plays a part no doubt but we had the ball in our hands with under a minute to go and we should have been able to milk the clock and not turn it into a 50/50 kick which then opens the door.
Tonight was true endorsement of Vossy’s ‘next man up’ mantra! Stoker in, Setterfield in, Martín In…..play your role.
Biggest negative was our disposal by foot - kicking to advantage by the Demons vs kicking to a contest or a disadvantage by the Blues
Have never been a Setterfield fan because of his poor kicking under pressure but his game on Oliver showed me that he does have something to offer in the guts - more so than Dow anyway - still not sold on him as a winger though
Interesting figures…..
Stevic -- 14 frees to 5 Melbourne's way.
The other two umps paid it 9-8.
Goals with Stevic awarding free kicks: Melbourne: 5 - Carlton 1.
Cannot question the effort tonight, gutsy in so many ways. Owned the last quarter, just couldn't ice it.
Sometimes the yearn after a loss like that can develop a new level of resolve. At least the ball is still in our court.
And we did manage to keep out % above WBs.
I have just watched the replay. Leaving aside problems caused by poor foot skills and an inability to control use of the ball at the end of quarters, the real problem is the stress put on our midfielders by having to play to a losing ruck match after match.
What a difference it would have made tonight if we had had a tall, mobile ruckman who was able to give our mids a better than even chance of getting first use of the ball.
If we have to go into next season with Pittonet as our main ruckman then we are almost certain to have the same inconsistent results during 2023 as we have had this year.
I have just watched the replay. Leaving aside problems caused by poor foot skills and an inability to control use of the ball at the end of quarters, the real problem is the stress put on our midfielders by having to play to a losing ruck match after match.
What a difference it would have made tonight if we had had a tall, mobile ruckman who was able to give our mids a better than even chance of getting first use of the ball.
If we have to go into next season with Pittonet as our main ruckman then we are almost certain to have the same inconsistent results during 2023 as we have had this year.
Goldstein
Tonight was true endorsement of Vossy’s ‘next man up’ mantra! Stoker in, Setterfield in, Martín In…..play your role.
First time in a long time I noticed Setterfield on the ground. I thought he was very good last night. Heck even Martin lasted 4 qtrs AND contributed goals.
Doc in the guts at the CB's was the move I wanted to see and I thought he was very good in there.
Interesting figures…..
Stevic -- 14 frees to 5 Melbourne's way.
The other two umps paid it 9-8.
Goals with Stevic awarding free kicks: Melbourne: 5 - Carlton 1.
dont worry about numbers. Number 1 Chris Donlon gave the worst decisions against us.
The reason why we can't play like that against teams that are inferior eludes me. Play like that against next week and we win easily.
I have been saying this for a long time, if only we could consistently beat teams below us, we wouldn't be in this predicament.
A very gutsy all round performance.
Docherty’s performance on the ball was excellent, whilst Stocker’s physicality through the night was important. I also thought all of Setterfield, Walsh, Cripps, Young, Weitering, McKay, Saad & Marchbank battled well.
Up forward, Martin, who I haven’t really been a fan of this year, was brilliant at key moments and could have been a match winner. Durdin was also back to his early year form and great to watch.
On the downside
(1) Newnes simply isn’t up it
(2) LOB needs to develop his body to break/stage up in tackles
(3) Pittonet, whilst physical, is a very limited/average footballer
(4) Owies good is offset by poor decisions and like Newnes he is often too slow to release the ball
(5) Silvagni’s kicking for goal has to improve and has been costly
The Pickett goal we were 1 on 1, he slipped Newnes for a tin ass goal. He then gave it to Newnes, very classy, your day will come you muppet! We probably should have had more numbers back but I get it (sort of).
The one that killed us was the Melksham goal, how does he mark it in a 4 v 2?
And we just have to go to work on stopping last minute of the qtr goals by the opponent, if I can bring myself to watch the replay, I'll check but I think we did it in qtrs 1 3 and 4 maybe?
Stocker and Setterfield should be back up bulls in the midfield and should be given contracts,
Cripps, Cerra, Hewett, Kennedy, Walsh are starters but if one goes down then Stocker and Setterfield should be next on the list.
I hope Vossy and team improves on prior regimes that they train and play in their most effective position for 23.
That was one massive positive.
The other positive is Cottrell taking Langdon to the cleaners, Nice game by Cotts.
I would still drop a few Newnes + Motlop for Cerra and Kennedy if they come up.
In the cold light of day....
It not often you can be really devastated by a result but pleased with the performance.
There were minor costly lapses.... but that was us being 'on' four four quarters.
Mutiple lead changes, but never more than a couple of goals in it.
How many games do you see like that?
Not many Carlton games in recent history.
So if the footy gods are not kind and we don't make it...well as Voss, said it was a finals type game... we don't really need the experience because we've got a glimpse of what it takes.
While the replacements performed really well in the middle it took them away from their own normal roles. Add one or two of our missing mids and the result probably goes the other way.
Setterfield's been the subject of a fair bit of criticism but when the boss singles you out for a mention in the presser you're probably a part of his future plans.
One thing that I liked, and we don't often get vision of it, was the interaction between the coach and assistants deep in discussion at various points of the game and in the aftermatch.
We'll never know, but we possibly could have found an injury to give a fresh Paddy Dow a run in the last 15 minutes..it may have made a difference.
Super proud of the boys tonight. To a man, they left nothing out there. 4 quarters of solid non stop effort. Just kept going and going. That type of finals like atmosphere, and finals like pressure, will hold us in good stead going forward. Nealy pipped last years premiers with no Cerra, Kennedy, Hewett, TDK. Woof Saad playing in distress or injured. Pittonet / Silvagni / Cripps vs Gawn and Jackson. Charlie as rusty as a box of hundred year old nails. Will the Whipping boy had a good game, and hopefully his critics will give themselves the day off.
Well done boys. The best game of the year. Shame about the result. Not disgraced by any means.
Stocker and Setterfield should be back up bulls in the midfield and should be given contracts,
Cripps, Cerra, Hewett, Kennedy, Walsh are starters but if one goes down then Stocker and Setterfield should be next on the list.
I hope Vossy and team improves on prior regimes that they train and play in their most effective position for 23.
That was one massive positive.
The other positive is Cottrell taking Langdon to the cleaners, Nice game by Cotts.
I would still drop a few Newnes + Motlop for Cerra and Kennedy if they come up.
Great call, Cotts was awesome last night.
Let's face it, we got away with a few close games early in the season. It was only a matter of time before we lost one.
Charlie as rusty as a box of hundred year old nails.
Charlie's off the boil.
But he's just as likely to a kick a bag next week.
That's the kind of player he is...
Can't wait for his 'complete' game.
I still don't think we've seen it, but we know he's capable of it
Charlie's off the boil.
But he's just as likely to a kick a bag next week.
That's the kind of player he is...
Can't wait for his 'complete' game.
I still don't think we've seen it, but we know he's capable of it
I can't find the latest figures, but as of the 8th August, Charlie was leading the Coleman. So for most of the season he was on fire. But lately everything seems a little off - his leaps, his running patterns, positioning, body work. kicking for goal. He looks very ineffectual compared to the earlier games IMO.
Sleeping on it still didn’t make it better.
Shattered by that result.
Sleeping on it still didn’t make it better.
Shattered by that result.
I hear ya Mick
Let's face it, we got away with a few close games early in the season. It was only a matter of time before we lost one.
Short memory.
Collingwood game last time around
And this time last year, we had just completed our review...
We were still going through the Ross Lyon stuff up.
We still hadn't signed Voss, Cook etc
We still didn't know if the playing list had what it takes.
We were still scratching our heads as to what this club had become.
Sleeping on it still didn’t make it better.
Shattered by that result.
Know the feeling, actually had a hard time sleeping!
Gutted, a popular and accurate feeling expressed by many of us BlueBaggers.
A tremendous effort under finals like pressure. And a painful lesson learned re the final 2 minutes. But so many players will have learned so much from that experience, indeed what is required for 120 minutes to get to the top of the tree. Invaluable.
Jekyll and Hyde stuff. What we witnessed from a very undermanned side last night was a
team, commitment/discipline/attitude/persistence/dare/talent wise, that can match it with the best. A far cry from the previous few weeks.
As a critic of Setterfield, credit given where due... he lifted and was an important cog. Did his job well.
Overall? Naches, as our Jewish friends might say. Along with gutted!
Now to bring that, and more, next Sunday arvo.
It was great to see, in the middle of the match, Stocker getting a run in the middle...
Well done, young man!!
And this time last year, we had just completed our review...
We were still going through the Ross Lyon stuff up.
We still hadn't signed Voss, Cook etc
We still didn't know if the playing list had what it takes.
We were still scratching our heads as to what this club had become.
It's been a roller coaster ride since then. In less than a year I suspect we have the answers to many key questions.
As exhilarated and as devastated as I am right now, it will come down to this. The final roll of the dice against the old enemy. Win and we're where we deserve to be. Having a taste for finals. Although last night was a sampler.
Go Blues
From one proud Bluebagger
I can't find the latest figures, but as of the 8th August, Charlie was leading the Coleman. So for most of the season he was on fire. But lately everything seems a little off - his leaps, his running patterns, positioning, body work. kicking for goal. He looks very ineffectual compared to the earlier games IMO.
Charlie has come up against the Geel, Melb and Bris defences, 3 of the best in the comp. Next week will also be a challenge.
Fisher has seriously improved his kicking with the non-preferred foot - so there might still be hope for a few of his teammates.
Goldstein
Was going to say Grundy but that would cost alot in $$$$.
It was great to see, in the middle of the match, Stocker getting a run in the middle...
Well done, young man!!
Was good to see him in the thick of the action, looks a bit heavy and his kicking needs work, those laconic kicks need to hit the target more.
Was going to say Grundy but that would cost alot in $$$$.
Yes but just pause for a moment or two and think of our side with Grundy as the no 1 ruck.
I have just watched the replay. Leaving aside problems caused by poor foot skills and an inability to control use of the ball at the end of quarters, the real problem is the stress put on our midfielders by having to play to a losing ruck match after match.
What a difference it would have made tonight if we had had a tall, mobile ruckman who was able to give our mids a better than even chance of getting first use of the ball.
If we have to go into next season with Pittonet as our main ruckman then we are almost certain to have the same inconsistent results during 2023 as we have had this year.
Got smashed in the ruck, Gawn and Jackson monstered us all night.
Probably a credit to our mids we did so well as they had no support from Pittonet.
Jack was more value imho...
Whoever was on Spargo did a great job and Langdon was really nullified as well. Lots of players 'did their job' against quality opposition.
Charlie has come up against the Geel, Melb and Bris defences, 3 of the best in the comp. Next week will also be a challenge.
Yes, I think that would certainly be a factor. But it seems more than just the opposition IMO.
Yes, I think that would certainly be a factor. But it seems more than just the opposition IMO.
Poorer Delivery and less I50s hasn't helped Charlie.
Petty is an underated defender too, does a lot of the tough work on players like Charlie so May and Lever can do the pretty intercept stuff...
Poorer Delivery and less I50s hasn't helped Charlie.
Petty is an underated defender too, does a lot of the tough work on players like Charlie so May and Lever can do the pretty intercept stuff...
Yes, that's part of the problem IMO.
I still think Charlie's getting opportunities...it's just he's been a bit fumbly, not following up on some of the contests and reluctant to bend for the ground balls...an injury of sorts perhaps.
Nothing like a heartbreaking loss to bring out all the classless individuals
Yes, I think that would certainly be a factor. But it seems more than just the opposition IMO.
When the defenders know what they are doing, they make young fwds go to the wrong spots and the mids dont get the looks they get at training.
I still think Charlie's getting opportunities...it's just he's been a bit fumbly, not following up on some of the contests and reluctant to bend for the ground balls...an injury of sorts perhaps.
Yes, it's possible.
Yes but just pause for a moment or two and think of our side with Grundy as the no 1 ruck.
Yes. Apparently the Pies are willing to pay 300k of his salary a year. Think we need to think seriously about it.
Yes. Apparently the Pies are willing to pay 300k of his salary a year. Think we need to think seriously about it.
I heard somewhere the whole salary needs to taken over or nothing. I heard if they do a part salary dump like Trelor, there will be a riot.
I heard somewhere the whole salary needs to taken over or nothing. I heard if they do a part salary dump like Trelor, there will be a riot.
I both read 5 min ago and saw on the new 2 days ago that they are willing to pay 300k. Doesn't mean it's right, just what I saw. Doubt our cap could take his full salary.
I both read 5 min ago and saw on the new 2 days ago that they are willing to pay 300k. Doesn't mean it's right, just what I saw. Doubt our cap could take his full salary.
He would be awesome for our side.
I think it is very much a case of caveat emptor..he seems a different kind of cat and I'm not convinced that footy is, or will stay, his 100% focus. It's a very long, very big coin contract.
Alex Mirkov still 22 years old - Oscar McInerney who was also a rookie is 28 and started to get his game together 2-3 years ago,
210cm ruckman don't grow on trees just needs 2-3 big pre seasons.
TDK just turned 23 and hit alot of personal bests this year. Just need to give our current ruckmen room to grow. Pitto is an honest solid contributor and will need to be first ruck next couple of years just turned 26 and was very solid before his injuries.
Got smashed in the ruck, Gawn and Jackson monstered us all night.
Probably a credit to our mids we did so well as they had no support from Pittonet.
Jack was more value imho...
I get what you're saying about Pitto. Despite that we won the clearances I believe. With a very undermanned midfield.
Walsh, Curnow & Weitering were poor last nite, had they played better it may have been a different result.
However, this was the loss we needed to have.
None of the players were smiling and patting backs last nite, it hurt and for good reason.
This was our 'line in the sand' moment and the players now know the level of intensity you have to play at every week across a season if you want to win a premiership.
A handful of players really rose to the occassion, others were found wanting when it really mattered, it will all go towards the end of season reviews and list managment decisions.
87 tackles. Wow.
87 tackles. Wow.
Or was that 87 free kicks to Melb?
Alex Mirkov still 22 years old - Oscar McInerney who was also a rookie is 28 and started to get his game together 2-3 years ago,
210cm ruckman don't grow on trees just needs 2-3 big pre seasons.
TDK just turned 23 and hit alot of personal bests this year. Just need to give our current ruckmen room to grow. Pitto is an honest solid contributor and will need to be first ruck next couple of years just turned 26 and was very solid before his injuries.
Sadly, Mirkov injured again today in q1.
Assisted off unable to put weight on ?rt.
Walsh, Curnow & Weitering were poor last nite, had they played better it may have been a different result.
However, this was the loss we needed to have.
None of the players were smiling and patting backs last nite, it hurt and for good reason.
This was our 'line in the sand' moment and the players now know the level of intensity you have to play at every week across a season if you want to win a premiership.
A handful of players really rose to the occassion, others were found wanting when it really mattered, it will all go towards the end of season reviews and list managment decisions.
The coaching box also needs looking at, as David King has suggested no extra players behind the ball in those last minutes were costly, all the other teams protecting a lead do it that way and we should have done similar.
Cant stand Goodwin but Voss and his coaching team didnt do much homework on Melksham and where and how he has been playing in the last month and its been as a negative player on the oppositions key backs.
Weitering and Mcgovern were the wrong opponents for him and I felt McGovern on the last line of defense detracts from his intercept abilities which we needed further up the ground. We were too tall down back with only Ben Brown playing as a tall forward and you have to wonder who scouts the opposition because we looked unbalanced with 4 tall defenders especially on a dewy night.
I noticed the height down back too, but we had swung Doc into the midfield, so taller defenders were probably the best defenders available.
Winners win because they win, losers lose because they lose. The commentators are concentrating on the poor skill execution, the lack of game awareness and the inability to the simple things well in the last two minutes. These things were littered through our game throughout the night, and everyone other game we have played this season and in previous seasons, it is just so easy to look at the last two minutes then you don't actually have to do any real work and analysis. Melbourne came to play and were very confident. I noticed their players an coaches were laughing and smiling at the start of the third quarter. Yet despite playing a very good team, who were committed and played well, and despite our players missing targets with hands and foot, making poor decisions, dropping marks and having three of our best six players Curnow, Weitering and Walsh down on performance, we basically lost on the last kick of the night. The lesson to learn from last night is that if you turn up to play and have a red hot go all game, you always have a chance to win. I can barrack for a team that played like Carlton did last night. If they would play like that every week they will soon learn how to win.
If we ever improved our disposal, Charlie and Harry will probably kick 100 goals each in a season. If we could consistently do the simple things well we would go close to winning the premiership. We have got a very deep squad. They have just got to start believing in themselves.
Stocker and Setterfield should be back up bulls in the midfield and should be given contracts,
Cripps, Cerra, Hewett, Kennedy, Walsh are starters but if one goes down then Stocker and Setterfield should be next on the list.
I hope Vossy and team improves on prior regimes that they train and play in their most effective position for 23.
That was one massive positive.
The other positive is Cottrell taking Langdon to the cleaners, Nice game by Cotts.
I would still drop a few Newnes + Motlop for Cerra and Kennedy if they come up.
Kennedy is out for the year with a LisFranc injury.
Kennedy is out for the year with a LisFranc injury.
We can't catch a break
We can't catch a break
If it's the bone, then yes we did.
Apart from the final result, that was one of the best games of footy I’ve seen in quite a while. Both teams played as if they had much to gain and a lot to lose and neither team deserved to lose.
Vossy’s coaching was outstanding considering our depleted list and the late withdrawal of Cerra. His decision to coach from the bench was inspired and nearly got us over the line. The post-game solidarity was inspiring and bodes well for 2023.
Setterfield on Oliver was an inspired move and, apart from keeping the competition’s premier midfielder to a modest performance, showed what Setterfield is capable of, given an appropriate role.
Docherty into the midfield was another good move but it did weaken our defence when Newnes had to play back.
Last week’s loss would have taken a lot out the boys and getting them up to go so close to beating last year’s premiers was an admirable effort by the coaching group.
I know that some supporters were fixated on Vossy’s record with Brisbane, but that’s clearly not relevant to how Vossy is coaching now, despite what tossers like Lyon and King may say.
Ok, I'll say it.
29 touches, (19 contested) 9 tackles, 6 clearances, 1 goal assist and 7 score involvements.
....and his direct opponent is getting a pat on the back?
That's BOG like numbers for Oliver, but we are all congratulating Setterfield on a job well done?
Now don't get me wrong, setters played one of his best games for the year but it's not like he tagged Oliver out of the game. He got the ball himself and put up respectable numbers, but I'm not sure we should rush to sign him up to a long term contract off the back of it.
Ok, I'll say it.
29 touches, (19 contested) 9 tackles, 6 clearances, 1 goal assist and 7 score involvements.
....and his direct opponent is getting a pat on the back?
That's BOG like numbers for Oliver, but we are all congratulating Setterfield on a job well done?
Now don't get me wrong, setters played one of his best games for the year but it's not like he tagged Oliver out of the game. He got the ball himself and put up respectable numbers, but I'm not sure we should rush to sign him up to a long term contract off the back of it.
It really doesn't matter what we think.
He impressed the coach, who singled him out for mention in his press conference.
That's an indication that the role he was assigned, he performed more than adequately.
Ok, I'll say it.
29 touches, (19 contested) 9 tackles, 6 clearances, 1 goal assist and 7 score involvements.
....and his direct opponent is getting a pat on the back?
That's BOG like numbers for Oliver, but we are all congratulating Setterfield on a job well done?
Now don't get me wrong, setters played one of his best games for the year but it's not like he tagged Oliver out of the game. He got the ball himself and put up respectable numbers, but I'm not sure we should rush to sign him up to a long term contract off the back of it.
I'm agreeing, I gave Setterfield votes but wouldn't be resigning just yet on the basis of one game.I thought he played well himself and restricted Oliver but the Melbourne player lifted when he had too along with Petracca and was still an effective player.
Thought Voss was ok up until the final minutes where he failed to put more players behind the ball and David King called it out, I also think he blundered by failing to tag Lachie Neale in the Brisbane game and he needs to read the game better..Not sure playing 4 tall defenders vs a small Melb forward setup was so smart either and he didn't seem to realise what role Melksham had been playing for the last month either.
He said lack of detail in his presser cost us the game, I agree but some of that detail is down to him imo.
Ok, I'll say it.
29 touches, (19 contested) 9 tackles, 6 clearances, 1 goal assist and 7 score involvements.
....and his direct opponent is getting a pat on the back?
That's BOG like numbers for Oliver, but we are all congratulating Setterfield on a job well done?
Now don't get me wrong, setters played one of his best games for the year but it's not like he tagged Oliver out of the game. He got the ball himself and put up respectable numbers, but I'm not sure we should rush to sign him up to a long term contract off the back of it.
Oliver's stats don't show the job that Setterfield did, and Setterfield really seemed to have gotten into his head, and should have received more than just the one free kick for getting put on his bum at contests.
I agree regarding signing him up on the back of it, but we do require some sort of depth until the newbies can come on and one of him or Dow is out at end of year, and simply put, as much as Id rather keep Dow because I see more upside there, they are both behind Carrol in the pecking order for next season, and that means at least one of them must go.
Dow is worth more at the trade table, so he is the one out IMHO.
After watching it again, just loved our hunger for the contest. First rate. With limited stocks in the player cupboard, the coaching group made a coupla bold moves.
Also loved Vossy walking off with his boys. Stirring stuff.
Few boys from the Magoos put themselves into selection consideration.
IMO, Will the Whipping boy deserves the BOD, and should be awarded another contract, even if it's 12 months. IMO, he's been the victim of bad timing and / or mismanagement more than anything else. He's played just a tick over 50 games with very little continuity over several seasons. I suspect there's untapped potential there, and his best is still ahead of him.
IMO, Will the Whipping boy deserves the BOD, and should be awarded another contract, even if it's 12 months. IMO, he's been the victim of bad timing and / or mismanagement more than anything else. He's played just a tick over 50 games with very little continuity over several seasons. I suspect there's untapped potential there, and his best is still ahead of him.
With Ed Curnow's decline, we have a clear need for a player who can do an inside run-with role a la Jack Steele, Tom Atkins, Jarryd Berry, it's even how the Brayshaw boys started out.
Setterfield is clearly the man for this - he has been played out of position on a wing for too long. If another club gets hold of him, I am sure we will be wringing our hands when they put him in the right role.
Ultimately, are SoJ and Setterfield basically competing for the same spot?
To me, having watched the influence SoJ can have on the ball, excluding ruck duties mostly I'm concerned with 2nd efforts, inside stoppage work and chaining, and comparing that to what Setterfield offers, I can't really see a significant difference. Perhaps Setterfield has an edge at the D50 end, and SoJ an edge at the F50 end.
How many players "of a type" can a team have?
I think tagging is highly over-rated, it's just a concession that you have a player who cannot compete in some other way. I do not think it's coincidence that many of Ed's very best games came when he was set free to work both ways, the ABlett Jnr game springs to mind. As for the opposition in that tagging consideration, no matter how good an opponent, or how rare they might be in the opposition list, 1 can never compete with 2, 3 or more and consistently win!
The concept of "Stop him and you win" has been taken to a very bizarre extreme in modern AFL.
The coaching box also needs looking at, as David King has suggested no extra players behind the ball in those last minutes were costly, all the other teams protecting a lead do it that way and we should have done similar.
Not sure how correct that was - SOJ was sent back for most of the last few mins. The Melksham mark was 4on2 to our advantage. Yeah, the numbers at that last contest were even, but that could have been because the spares were otherwise occupied. King talks a lot and is occasionally on to something, but he does talk out of his backside at times
Walsh, Curnow & Weitering were poor last nite, had they played better it may have been a different result.
Hurt earlier in the year, coming off 3 years off and hurt earlier in the year.............
100% agree that they were down - but you prob expect that at this time of the year, from them (Weiters hasnt been right since he came back)
With Ed Curnow's decline, we have a clear need for a player who can do an inside run-with role a la Jack Steele, Tom Atkins, Jarryd Berry, it's even how the Brayshaw boys started out.
Setterfield is clearly the man for this - he has been played out of position on a wing for too long. If another club gets hold of him, I am sure we will be wringing our hands when they put him in the right role.
That sounds pretty reasonable to me.
How many players "of a type" can a team have?
Two...in case one gets hurt. ;)
I see Jack SIlvagni more as 3rd tall forward / occasional ruckman, and Setterfield as an inside / outside mid.
Not sure how correct that was - SOJ was sent back for most of the last few mins. The Melksham mark was 4on2 to our advantage. Yeah, the numbers at that last contest were even, but that could have been because the spares were otherwise occupied. King talks a lot and is occasionally on to something, but he does talk out of his backside at times
Owies skill error to Saad that forced Saad to rush disposal and kick long to a contest was the game. I love Owies pressure acts but his skill execution and lack of hitting the scoreboard is worrysome.
I see Jack SIlvagni more as 3rd tall forward / occasional ruckman, and Setterfield as an inside / outside mid.
+1. Jack is a pretty good link player between Mids and Forwards too. Setters is an inside mid trying to be moulded into something he is not. Let him train and play in his natural position. It could cost us trying to experiment with him too much
Two...in case one gets hurt. ;)
Two on top of Hewett, Kennedy, Cerra, Stocker, now Doc, and maybe even Kemp! Presuming Walsh and Cripps are automatics, although we have for some reason of insanity started Walsh on the wing at times this season!
Personally, after Doc going so well last weekend, I'd leave him in there and bring Williams into the HB line to bolster the D50 run.
+1. Jack is a pretty good link player between Mids and Forwards too. Setters is an inside mid trying to be moulded into something he is not. Let him train and play in his natural position. It could cost us trying to experiment with him too much
Having watch SoJ in the ruck, and also watched him play on ball in the VFL in earlier seasons, I doubt he can be labelled experimental.
I suspect SoJ is more of a genuine chop-out for Cripps than Setterfield.
Not sure how correct that was - SOJ was sent back for most of the last few mins. The Melksham mark was 4on2 to our advantage. Yeah, the numbers at that last contest were even, but that could have been because the spares were otherwise occupied. King talks a lot and is occasionally on to something, but he does talk out of his backside at times
More often than not, and particularly when he has to give an opinion without reviewing the video. King will have a different take on the game by now.
Coaches can't influence contests or skill execution but we were set up to protect the lead.
Not sure how correct that was - SOJ was sent back for most of the last few mins. The Melksham mark was 4on2 to our advantage. Yeah, the numbers at that last contest were even, but that could have been because the spares were otherwise occupied. King talks a lot and is occasionally on to something, but he does talk out of his backside at times
Yep, I suspect some of the commentary offered at times this season comes from guys that are often not even watching the game they analyse. They throw rocks after the fact, often in ignorance of what is happening in the video replay, sometimes aided with a little selective post-game editing!
Maybe they have become too comfortable and grown fat at the trough, leading to shortcuts and a flagging analytic performance.
Daisy is better, but the minute she shows them up they get passive aggressive and shut her down! She seems as yet not to have grown jaded by the game, unlike the exposed timbre in the voice of some!
At times some of "The Old Boys" sound as equally unenthused about the game as they would the prospect of being trapped in a bottle with a fart!
Personally, I think the more A graders and B graders we have that can competently rotate through the midfield, the better off we'll be. As we can see right now, it doesn't take much to get thin in that part of the ground.
So many what ifs.....but was it the right decision to play 4 "tall" defenders against Melbourne who really only had Brown and one of the ruckmen forward? Having Newman injured didn't help but to see someone like Melksham kick 4 goals infuriates. Was there a role for Plowman or has his form been such that he just didn't deserve a game?
I think we've missed a trick by not running TDK with Pitto and having SoJ as a big bodied Mid in Kennedy and Hewett's absence.
Maybe it's deliberate, perhaps Cripps and SoJ have no midfield chemistry, perhaps Setterfield is more compliant and just stays out of the way!
So many what ifs.....but was it the right decision to play 4 "tall" defenders against Melbourne who really only had Brown and one of the ruckmen forward? Having Newman injured didn't help but to see someone like Melksham kick 4 goals infuriates. Was there a role for Plowman or has his form been such that he just didn't deserve a game?
I dont call Marchbank and Mcgovern as true talls anyway. For me, they are interchangeable with Newman and Plowman, with greater intercept marking and high marking ability as well as being better users of the footy.
Plowman and Newman are more capable defenders in general, but I dont think the issue was match up related.
Its like blaming Saad for dumping a not long enough kick forward after the bounce pass from Owies. Thing is, he had more time than he thought he did and could very easily have found another target, but I think he may have gone into rush mode and just disposed of the footy to ensure he didnt get caught holding it which is fair enough.
Thing is, it didnt go long enough to clear the area, it wasnt to advantage, and was as big a execution stuff up as Owies kick, even though he had enough time to not only do better with the kick, but also pick a shorter better option.
It really doesn't matter what we think.
He impressed the coach, who singled him out for mention in his press conference.
That's an indication that the role he was assigned, he performed more than adequately.
Sure, mention it, thats fine.
But remember the game SOJ played on Fyfe a couple years ago? SOJ kept Fyfe to under 20 touches (I've got 14 in my head, but that might be another game) and SOJ got a bit of the ball too.
THAT was a good game....and you know what, Silvagni has never played the same role since.
So again, congratulate the kid, but he's hardly deserving on being locked in long term off the back of that 1 game, surely.
I think we've missed a trick by not running TDK with Pitto and having SoJ as a big bodied Mid in Kennedy and Hewett's absence.
Maybe it's deliberate, perhaps Cripps and SoJ have no midfield chemistry, perhaps Setterfield is more compliant and just stays out of the way!
We played all 3 a few weeks ago and we looked tall and slow.
Now we're missing some more mids, it could work.
However, with Setterfield playing that role, i think we are better off playing 1 ruck + SOJ to not look slow again.
Sure, mention it, thats fine.
But remember the game SOJ played on Fyfe a couple years ago? SOJ kept Fyfe to under 20 touches (I've got 14 in my head, but that might be another game) and SOJ got a bit of the ball too.
THAT was a good game....and you know what, Silvagni has never played the same role since.
So again, congratulate the kid, but he's hardly deserving on being locked in long term off the back of that 1 game, surely.
SOJ was BOG that day. He killed Fyfe. He was put on him at half time from memory and absolutely ruined him. You know who else played well that day on Mundy? Dow.
None of them are in the starting 4 midfielders on the list at the moment.
We played all 3 a few weeks ago and we looked tall and slow.
Not really, we changed the wider mix, and left our F50 too tall and slow in the absence of Durdin and Owies. Motlop came in, but is slow by comparison. We effectively had zero defensive run from a F50, that is the price we pay while carrying Motlop for his attacking attributes.
By the way, in keeping like for like in the midfield, SoJ or Setterfield are not really slower than Kennedy or Hewett.
We played all 3 a few weeks ago and we looked tall and slow.
Now we're missing some more mids, it could work.
However, with Setterfield playing that role, i think we are better off playing 1 ruck + SOJ to not look slow again.
Horses for courses for me....we got caught with TDK too burnt out to play imho and he was managed rather than dropped vs Melb and normally I think he would have played to help Pittonet vs the comps best ruck brigade in Gawn and Jackson.
This week its Cameron and Cox who I thought were ok vs the Swans, but I dont think they are dominant ruckman like the Melb pair and agree that one specialist ruck plus Jack should suffice.
I'd give Setterfield the job on DeGoey if he plays in the middle or Crisp....Id be expecting Degoey to play forward though given his injury and the fact he has dined out on us there in previous games.
By the way, in keeping like for like in the midfield, SoJ or Setterfield are not really slower than Kennedy or Hewett.
Too true
Ok, I'll say it.
29 touches, (19 contested) 9 tackles, 6 clearances, 1 goal assist and 7 score involvements.
....and his direct opponent is getting a pat on the back?
That's BOG like numbers for Oliver, but we are all congratulating Setterfield on a job well done?
Now don't get me wrong, setters played one of his best games for the year but it's not like he tagged Oliver out of the game. He got the ball himself and put up respectable numbers, but I'm not sure we should rush to sign him up to a long term contract off the back of it.
The only thing Setterfield did the other nite was improve his trade value/potential.
He did some okay things but wasn't as big an influence on the match as some of the media analysts are trying to suggest.
When the Demons needed a key play at crucial times in the match, Oliver was well involved every time, granted he is a very difficult player to quell for a full 100-mins.
Horses for courses for me....we got caught with TDK too burnt out to play imho and he was managed rather than dropped vs Melb and normally I think he would have played to help Pittonet vs the comps best ruck brigade in Gawn and Jackson.
This week its Cameron and Cox who I thought were ok vs the Swans, but I dont think they are dominant ruckman like the Melb pair and agree that one specialist ruck plus Jack should suffice.
I'd give Setterfield the job on DeGoey if he plays in the middle or Crisp....Id be expecting Degoey to play forward though given his injury and the fact he has dined out on us there in previous games.
Excellent suggestion.
Will show whether Setterfield has what it really takes to be a senior footballer.
Horses for courses for me....we got caught with TDK too burnt out to play imho and he was managed rather than dropped vs Melb and normally I think he would have played to help Pittonet vs the comps best ruck brigade in Gawn and Jackson.
This week its Cameron and Cox who I thought were ok vs the Swans, but I dont think they are dominant ruckman like the Melb pair and agree that one specialist ruck plus Jack should suffice.
I'd give Setterfield the job on DeGoey if he plays in the middle or Crisp....Id be expecting Degoey to play forward though given his injury and the fact he has dined out on us there in previous games.
Yep, Setterfield seemed to relish a specific, clearly defined task.
The Setterfield show ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s2C-LiUJgI
Wasn't Owies trying to come off with cramp? If so, it was a miracle the kick went in the same post code as the intended target.
Wasn't Owies trying to come off with cramp? If so, it was a miracle the kick went in the same post code as the intended target.
If you can't kick it properly, kick it as far forward as you can do NOT kick it backwards!
Owies tried to do the right thing but had poor execution.
LOB slapped the ball forward into space which is what you would do if you are 1 point behind not in front.
The only thing Setterfield did the other nite was improve his trade value/potential.
He did some okay things but wasn't as big an influence on the match as some of the media analysts are trying to suggest.
When the Demons needed a key play at crucial times in the match, Oliver was well involved every time, granted he is a very difficult player to quell for a full 100-mins.
That's how I saw it, Oliver and Petracca stepped up when the big moments were happening and still had some impact.
Setterfield played well though and was generally reliable with the ball which hasn't been his forte imho.
So many what ifs.....but was it the right decision to play 4 "tall" defenders against Melbourne who really only had Brown and one of the ruckmen forward? Having Newman injured didn't help but to see someone like Melksham kick 4 goals infuriates. Was there a role for Plowman or has his form been such that he just didn't deserve a game?
In fact, our overly "tall" backline was very close in size to Melbourne's forwards. Plowman and Marchbank (who are the same size) can play on taller or smaller opponents so I don't think we would have gained anything by swapping those two. Our only other possibility was Kemp - just a smidegeon smaller than Plowman and Marchbank - and I think he could have been a good match up with Melksham. Kemp's not really in great form in the magoos. On top of that, Melksham had few touches and five goals from his last four games and you aren't really going to expect him to play his best game since he kicked five against four years ago.
While Doc was a good contributor in the midfield, he was missed in defence. Newnes, as our seventh defender, loses his opponent too often and Stocker isn't yet as reliable as he should be.
I wonder if David King has watched the replay yet?
With three minutes to go we had an extra two players behind the ball. That's why Gawn didn't have an opponent when he kicked inside 50 for Melksham to mark (in a two on four contest).
I wonder if David King has watched the replay yet?
With three minutes to go we had an extra two players behind the ball. That's why Gawn didn't have an opponent when he kicked inside 50 for Melksham to mark (in a two on four contest).
King and Montagna said we didn't do a lot wrong.
King and Montagna said we didn't do a lot wrong.
I found two other things. Poorly positioned when Melksham marked against 4 Blues, should never happen, and 3 blokes spoiling each other on wing. A mark there rather than knocking it out of bounds and that would be more time off the clock.
That last 2 minutes will be one of the great learning experiences this club will have going forward.
I found two other things. Poorly positioned when Melksham marked against 4 Blues, should never happen, and 3 blokes spoiling each other on wing. A mark there rather than knocking it out of bounds and that would be more time off the clock.
That last 2 minutes will be one of the great learning experiences this club will have going forward.
Three guys flying for the one ball is something we have had a real problem with all year, especially in the forward line. Almost always means no mark, and at least one extra defender on the ground to clean up.
Did I hear correctly that kosi Pickett got fined for rough conduct at the tribunal?
Apparently for the tackle on Liam Stocker which was paid holding the ball and consequently a goal...
Did I hear correctly that kosi Pickett got fined for rough conduct at the tribunal?
Apparently for the tackle on Liam Stocker which was paid holding the ball and consequently a goal...
Holy mackerel... doesn't that just amplify the disconnect between the umps and match review dudes!!! Just as well that free kick wasn't important ::) ::) ::)