Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

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Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #60 – July 25, 2020, 06:09:35 pm

@GTC
I gave up on trying to figure out HTB today. Seemed very random decisions by the umps, they are confused themselves iyam.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #61 – July 25, 2020, 06:10:43 pm

Quote from: townsendcalling on July 25, 2020, 05:25:27 pm

AFL Website headline:
“ Blues condemn gallant Roos to sixth loss in a row.”
Remember when they were the headlines used to describe us.......like just over a year ago!!

Oh only too well.... 😥
Not getting ahead of myself yet though. Encouraging signs just the same

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #62 – July 25, 2020, 06:13:18 pm

Quote from: cookie2 on July 25, 2020, 06:09:35 pm

@GTC
I gave up on trying to figure out HTB today. Seemed very random decisions by the umps, they are confused themselves iyam.

The problem "Is the rule" and how it is interpreted, not the umpires.

You can't write rules without regard to how people will interpret and implement them, it's a major flaw in this removing prior opportunity argument, because no umpire will penalise a player until they think they actually had possession, and that assessment remains subjective.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #63 – July 25, 2020, 06:13:43 pm

Quote from: LoveNavy on July 25, 2020, 06:10:43 pm

Oh only too well.... 😥
Not getting ahead of myself yet though. Encouraging signs just the same

Ugly wins beat gallant losses any day!

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #64 – July 25, 2020, 06:18:36 pm

I'm glad we are in the close ones, but I think for the sanity and welfare of the players, Teague needs to find ways to get on the end of some easy victories.

We won't get through the next set of matches having 4 or 5 close games in a row.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #65 – July 25, 2020, 06:42:50 pm

I know this is off topic a bit but I was just watching Clarkson on the after match Haw v Swans and he said something along the lines of "when it's 22 - 13 free kicks against it's like playing against a team with another player". Now, I am dying to see if a "please explain" comes his way from the AFL. My tip. Nothing happens. For years these tossers had a free ride from AFL HQ now when they start losing they start to bitch. We get an absolute reeming most weeks (especially this year) and nothing. Very interested to see the outcome of this seeing as we play the Dorks next Friday.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #66 – July 25, 2020, 07:05:28 pm

Why Moore was picked before TdK staggered me.

Cripps worries me.

Hard to see how moneybags pulled a hammy, don't you have to run to do one?

Not impressed but it was a game we HAD to win against a crap side and we managed to, enough said.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #67 – July 25, 2020, 07:14:40 pm

Quote from: Baggers on July 25, 2020, 04:22:42 pm

Won ugly, good sign.

Cuningham did the cameo thing again, only this time his sublime skills in the wet were cameos that could well have been the difference.

Newnes confuses me. Liability in close and under pressure, yet chips in for invaluable opportunistic goals that are full of skill. Paradox.

Kennedy, Setterfield and Williamson coming along nicely.

Plowman, Simmo, Weitering... rocks.

Ed, Walsh, Martin... so important.

What's up with Crippa? Saw him take backward steps when confronted by the kid Smith against the Dishlickers, did it again last week when confronted... Crippa, when blokes push you in the chest, hold your ground and never step backward. Get in touch with your inner 'mongrel'. And please don't catch the Murphy disease of playing for frees.

Moore about as useful as an ashtray on a motor bike.

Brackets (inj) and Moore probably out for next week. H or TDK for Moore? Fisher for Brackets (depending on weather and matchups against the Dawks.)

Pitto was also terrific in the first and completely on top of Goldstein - until Moore went into the ruck and Goldstein found some form.

Cuningham doesn't seem to be spending as much time in the midfield as he did in his BOG performance a few weeks back.

Newnes is proving his worth.

Kennedy and Setterfield are coming along nicely but I credit the big improvement in Kennedy to our new fitness guru, who has him looking much trimmer and has taught him how to get out of the slow plod that he has showed for the past couple of years.

Williamson was nothing special today but his availability has allowed Plowman to play further from the goal square and his past 2 games have been the best I have seen from him.

Murphy has been disappointing this year - like he was when Bolton was playing him on the wing - although I thought some of his last quarter efforts, today, were very valuable. He has clearly lost some pace and that probably contributes to him playing for frees. He improved, last year, under Teague when he had a chance to spend some game time in the middle and I think a similar move (along with resting him forward) would enable him to use 'inside-skills' and experience to greater advantage.

As for Moore being about as useful as an ashtray on a motor bike, that assessment might be generous. Apart from a lack of meaningful contribution, he played Goldstein into the game when he relieved Pitto and, I reckon, Levi suffered by being stuck up forward. Levi's improvements in recent years have coincided with him spending some regular time in the ruck and having a chance to run around, getting his hands on the ball.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #68 – July 25, 2020, 07:24:29 pm

Quote from: LP on July 25, 2020, 06:13:18 pm

The problem "Is the rule" and how it is interpreted, not the umpires.

You can't write rules without regard to how people will interpret and implement them, it's a major flaw in this removing prior opportunity argument, because no umpire will penalise a player until they think they actually had possession, and that assessment remains subjective.

I've had long arguments about prior opportunity rule with you.

Whether or not they bring it in is irrelevent. Umpires STILL have to make a call on whether/when a player has possession or not now......when a player is tackled!

I maintain it will make decisions a lot easier to make, not perfect, because umpires are not perfect. But by simply removing a level of complexity in making a decision, there is less room for errors to be made. Its simple maths.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #69 – July 25, 2020, 07:36:10 pm

Quote from: cookie2 on July 25, 2020, 06:09:35 pm

@GTC
I gave up on trying to figure out HTB today. Seemed very random decisions by the umps, they are confused themselves iyam.

I can see why it frustrates people, need to simplify the interpretation parameters. That is, tackled player kicks or hand ball - yes = play on, no = holding the ball (irrespective of time). Ball spills out while tackled, free kick incorrect disposal. Forget prior opportunity, get rid of it. I dont like the rubbish rule whereby when multiple players jump on top of the tackled player he gets pinged. I know why they do it though and the same rules as above should apply, free kick not ball up. Will end up with a lot more frees but the game will move on and the interpretation will be easier. Umpires needing to determine prior op or if it spilled loose in a reasonable amount of time are the two main problems to me. Players are professionally hanging onto it prepared to give away the free (ie kill time) so their team mates have time to reset ahead of the ball/play. I saw Gibbons do this today.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #70 – July 25, 2020, 07:38:19 pm

Quote from: townsendcalling on July 25, 2020, 03:45:51 pm

As a targeted player, Cripps has 1 free to him and 5 against. 😗

I reckon that is awful. Anybody who looks at how Cripps is being treated would be giving him 10 - 20 frees per game.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #71 – July 25, 2020, 07:41:39 pm

Quote from: LoveNavy on July 25, 2020, 04:30:24 pm

65 point turnaround v NM
Woohoo 🥳
That's progress right there to shake our psychological demons and come away with a win

I read (?? Source ?? accuracy) that we have 100% W rate when we kick the first goal.

If true, that's a fun fact for the day 😉

It is a pity we couldn't continue the great form we showed in the 1st term, but you can't look at a 70+ point turnaround and be too disappointed. Now to build on it next time!

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #72 – July 25, 2020, 07:46:25 pm

Quote from: rocky on July 25, 2020, 06:42:50 pm

I know this is off topic a bit but I was just watching Clarkson on the after match Haw v Swans and he said something along the lines of "when it's 22 - 13 free kicks against it's like playing against a team with another player". Now, I am dying to see if a "please explain" comes his way from the AFL. My tip. Nothing happens. For years these tossers had a free ride from AFL HQ now when they start losing they start to bitch. We get an absolute reeming most weeks (especially this year) and nothing. Very interested to see the outcome of this seeing as we play the Dorks next Friday.

I could read that as Clarkson saying "my blokes gave away 9 more frees which gave the oppo the same advantage as having an extra player". I watch our blokes compared to other teams and we are the masters at giving away dumb free kicks in the worst possible place at the worst possible time. I sometimes think you couldnt do it if you tried but we do, week in week out.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #73 – July 25, 2020, 07:49:22 pm

Just watched the last 10 min again. North were never going to win. We dominated general play, just too hard to score in the conditions. No skill was going to be happening. Being a forward would've sucked big time. Only way North scored was due to a horrible in the back free kick.

Think I watched 10 min of the most horrible umpiring in years. Our issue was getting good leads then taking the foot off the gas. Need to bury sides when we have the foot on the throat. We were never losing that game but we have to do more than just enough.

Re: Post Game Pandemonium!: AFL 2020 Rd 8: Carlton vs North

Reply #74 – July 25, 2020, 07:54:18 pm

Quote from: Gointocarlton on July 25, 2020, 04:57:06 pm

Everyone knows I am a Willo fan, been terrible for 2-3 weeks now

Willo has hit something of a flat patch. I'd be inclined to do something different with him and give Cottrell a go.
Maybe play Willo off a wing, where he has a chance to attack with the left hoof of his.
I was also thinking that we need to do something for our co-Captain. Doc is being sweated on by defensive forwards to try to minimize his influence. Maybe we should give him some time in the middle to free him up.
Simmo is doing well enough, although not at his best. Jones and Weitering have not quite been as good as they were early. Jones struggled last week.

I know all too well that we tend to stick with the team that wins for the next round. I've never been that comfortable with that idea. I've always liked the idea of playing horses for courses. But now that there is doubt over both H and the Gov for next week (The Gov almost certainly won't play after a hamstring and a short break), we need to be very careful in selecting replacements. Certainly Tom de Koning comes to mind. He is mobile and takes a towering mark, as well as giving us options in the ruck.
I think we might play Moore again, but I am not a fan. I don't think he is up to senior football, even though he works very hard.