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Re: Collins

Reply #30 –
It's not that he did something wrong or made a wrong choice lods, mistakes can be forgiven. But to manipulate the poor place the club was in at the time to better himself? Unforgivable, no matter what he'd done in the past.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Collins

Reply #31 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
Fking bullshight, geez your ignorance and bias knows no bounds at times. You forgive these blokes but pay out on Carlton players that wanted to leave the club these blokes ruined with incompetence and ineptitude. Blokes that were forced out by tyrants these guys employed....but no, they are cleanskins in your eyes. Hard to take you seriously sometimes.*

*I mean that in the nicest possible way. ;D
Its good to see you got the point of my post. ::)
2017-16th
2018-Wooden Spoon
2019-16th
2020-dare to dream? 11th is better than last I suppose
2021-Pi$$ or get off the pot
2022- Real Deal or more of the same? 0.6%
2023- "Raise the Standard" - M. Voss Another year wasted Bar Set
2024-Back to the drawing boardNo excuses, its time

Re: Collins

Reply #32 –
Quote from: Lods on
Like most topics...too much "black and white" opinion.

Yep... You can make an argument for a poor performance as President, although we played the salary cap stuff in a morally correct manner.
When you do the wrong thing you take it on the chin. You don't delay, cloud the issue and run off to courts to win on technicalities.
I much prefer the Carlton approach to the Essendon one.
Our delay in improvement wasn't because of decisions made at the time of the cap penalties.

As for his previous efforts.
Very good player. (premiership player, hall of famer)
Outstanding (yep brilliant administator, secretary-manager (recruiter)



http://australian-rules-football.wikia.com/wiki/Peter_Motley
- Kernahan, Bradley, Motley Dorotitch Williams.
-3 premierships under his watch

By all means criticise him for the things he's done wrong... but give it a little balance.
Our history may have been very different without the efforts of Ian Collins as CEO during the1980s

Is it time to point out that Collo was in fact in charge when some of the brown paper bags were organised and distributed?

After leaving Carlton he went to work for the AFL. To engratiate himself with the AFL and show no allegiance to his former club, he pointed the finger at us and pointed out that we cheating the cap. How did he know? He set it up!

In any event, the point about Collins is this.

When someone presents you with your jumper you are supposed to be humbled, thrilled and look up to the person and one day hopefully emulate what they have been able to achieve.
Do we expect the kids to be able to distinguish 'collo the player', from 'collo the administrator' or even president?

Its like telling the kids to look up to fev. Sure, on the field he was (usually) very good. However, off field he was not what you'd call a role model over his career.

Re: Collins

Reply #33 –
I'd be interested to hear Collo's version one day of the conversations that transpired between he and Jackson/Evans/Demitriou back in 01/02. I seldom wish harm on anyone but I would not be sad to learn that Wayne Jackson has been inflicted with a massive infestation of air breathing piranha to his little nether region!
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17

Re: Collins

Reply #34 –
Collins sold us down the river and dressed it up as "saving the club" later.

You can fool some of the people some of the time.......................................

Re: Collins

Reply #35 –
I cant forgive Collins ether, shafted the club over the salary cap rort which he helped organise then did some nest feathering at our expense and we wind up at his new home at Etihad....
I'd be a bit embarrassed to be presenting jumpers after those achievements....I know some can forgive and move on and remember his other football achievements but
this is the club who gave him a start and helped him progress in the world.....likewise I have little time also for Mike Fitzpatrick and his admin career at the AFL , the old saying of when you lay with swine you end up smelling like a pig is so true when applied to Collins and Fitzpatrick...

Re: Collins

Reply #36 –
Quote from: MosquitoFleet on
we  were "forked" in your words by john elliott and his useless board and his NCA issues - he was cause of the collapse of carlton...not collo...

carlton must do more to thank collo as a great carlton man he was and still is...

i agree on Princes Park, as I never wanted to leave and want to return and develop PP to a 50K seater stadium, but on balance we had no choice, afl, media right games, ground rationalization - we were so insolvent, the home ground issue at the time was a secondary issue at the time- because of actions of mr john elliott...

again pratt was no where to be seen at this time...

Thats BS. When Pratt became president and was asked what took you so long, he answered simply " i was never asked"
with so many jewish people involved in the club, going to Pratt would unequivocally deem them as failures among their community.
They only went to pratt in an absolute crisis. If they went to him earlier, much earlier, things would have been different.

Pratts only condition becoming president was the unanimous support of the board, which he had.

Re: Collins

Reply #37 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots on
By signing us up to the then Colonial Stadium, who just happened to need more clubs, who he just happened to be CEO of, on a super shight deal. No doubt there was a nice bonus waiting for him upon the signing of that contract. He saw his opportunity with the club on it's knees and Elliot in an extremely weak position and just like the ruthless player he was, he took it. Did nothing to help the club whilst in charge, but he did manage to publicly call the list 'z-grade' players which was a lot of help. Did not even bother showing up to his handover (great respect for the club there). He is dirt in my eyes and always will be. All you that saw him play think differently, you probably have a soft spot for him. You know, human nature and all that.

Well said Carrots. Couldn't agree more.
IN WADA WE TRUST

Re: Collins

Reply #38 –
We are all posting about the same basic thing, it's called conflict of interest! ;)

The Force Awakens!

Re: Collins

Reply #39 –
Quote from: kruddler on
Is it time to point out that Collo was in fact in charge when some of the brown paper bags were organised and distributed?

After leaving Carlton he went to work for the AFL. To engratiate himself with the AFL and show no allegiance to his former club, he pointed the finger at us and pointed out that we cheating the cap. How did he know? He set it up!

In any event, the point about Collins is this.

When someone presents you with your jumper you are supposed to be humbled, thrilled and look up to the person and one day hopefully emulate what they have been able to achieve.
Do we expect the kids to be able to distinguish 'collo the player', from 'collo the administrator' or even president?

Its like telling the kids to look up to fev. Sure, on the field he was (usually) very good. However, off field he was not what you'd call a role model over his career.

I don't know of any other 100 game number 19s who would be available to present the jumper. Eddie is otherwise occupied and (I think) John O'Connell passed away.

Re: Collins

Reply #40 –
Quote from: Jofo on
I don't know of any other 100 game number 19s who would be available to present the jumper. Eddie is otherwise occupied and (I think) John O'Connell passed away.

I have no problem with Collins presenting a jumper or being around the club.

We must divorce our opinions about administrative and governance issues which affect Carlton from the on-field playing history.

There are a lot of players, past greats, who have not necessarily acted in the Carlton's best interest off the field. If we don't separate their off-field from their on-field history then potentially blokes like SOS, Brown, Jesaulenko, Sheldon, Harris, Harmes, Austin, Fitzpatrick, Williams, etc., etc., would all be unwelcome back at Carlton. Which would clearly be wrong if it was the case.
The Force Awakens!

Re: Collins

Reply #41 –
Quote from: Jofo on
I don't know of any other 100 game number 19s who would be available to present the jumper. Eddie is otherwise occupied and (I think) John O'Connell passed away.

Who presented Wright with his #46 guerney? We have no 100 game players in the 46 or premiership players

Doesn't have to be a 100 game player, premiership player or even someone who wore the same number!

I'm sure those things are nice to do in the right circumstances, but you can make exceptions.

Re: Collins

Reply #42 –
Quote from: thrunthrublu on
Thats BS. When Pratt became president and was asked what took you so long, he answered simply " i was never asked"
with so many jewish people involved in the club, going to Pratt would unequivocally deem them as failures among their community.
They only went to pratt in an absolute crisis. If they went to him earlier, much earlier, things would have been different.

Pratts only condition becoming president was the unanimous support of the board, which he had.

With Board matters, there is not enough information on the records but word of mouth,

My word of mouth is Pratt couldn't remove some directors and that was a fact.

Ask youself why Pratt did not take on the destructive elliott and take the Presidency- but 5 years after Elliott was pushed out by Collo?

In 1981 Collo was appointed Secretary-Manager of the Carlton Football Club, a position he filled with distinction for twelve years. In this time the Blues won three more flags. In 1993 he became the AFL Director of Football Operations, and in 1999 was appointed CEO of Stadium Operations Ltd, responsible for the AFL's showpiece Docklands Stadium. He was elected to the Carlton Hall of Fame in 2001, and awarded an Order of Australia for his service to the game.

In 2002 Collo returned to Princes Park as President, heading a reform group that successfully ousted the administration of high-profile incumbent John Elliott. Collins had spent much of his time as Secretary under Elliott's tenure, but there was no love lost when Carlton under Elliott was found guilty of serious breaches of the AFL's salary cap regulations. The Blues were fined heavily and denied access to the best young players in the country for three years. It was a savage blow that plummeted Carlton to the lowest point in our history, and two wooden spoons in three years resulted.

Throughout this dark and bitter time, Collins and his board worked hard to limit the damage to Carlton's profile, prestige and financial position. Despite health scares brought on by the pressures of juggling two demanding jobs, Collo led the club through some of its darkest hours until he stepped down from the Presidency in April 2006, and was replaced by Graham Smorgon.

So Collo already had another role and came back to get rid of elliott. Why ? because no one had the courage to directly take on a bloke who was wrecking the club.

so those posters that punish collo - effectively wanted Elliott to stay, because no one - i repeat no-one was prepared to take on the destructive elliott and remove him, including Pratt

so posters that say - Collo was feathering his own nest is talking BS themselves.

Re: Collins

Reply #43 –
Quote from: kruddler on
Who presented Wright with his #46 guerney? We have no 100 game players in the 46 or premiership players

Doesn't have to be a 100 game player, premiership player or even someone who wore the same number!

I'm sure those things are nice to do in the right circumstances, but you can make exceptions.

The coach did, actually.

Re: Collins

Reply #44 –
Quote from: Raydan on
Oh my a "brilliant Carlton administrator"?

How brilliant was it to agree to working with the AFL with the salary cap charges for a lenient sentence, then get bent over with no lube. 2 years out of the first two rounds of the draft, we got Walker due to the poor wording of the penalties, something the AFL tried to stop. I forget the fine, but it was huge for the time and more than the Essendon fine when adjusted for time. This was then said years later to be too harsh a penalty by none other that Vlad himself.

When Vlad, Ron Evans and co were holding the whip hand - we had no power. You cannot blame collo for the punishment
My only criticism of Carlton then is that they should have went to court and killed the penalties - but we had no money

He took Carlton away from home to an ground that did not suit our game and a poor return when we had strong ties to the MCG, tried to run the football department on a shoestring budget and blamed the players for being greedy expecting to be paid what the club agreed to. Then he resigned Pagan when the football world could see he wasn't the coach for Carlton.

the afl controlled the situation and sent us to Etihad - we had no say because we were insolvent

Say what you want about Essendon, but they fought the fight to stand up for their club, Collins just whimpered us into penalties that would stuff Carlton up for 15 years.

agree with you there. Hindsight a wonderful thing

So that leaves him as a premiership player and former president, I wonder if there are any more around who we could ask how to run the club, maybe if they were a former captain that would help too?

That being said I have no problem with Premiership players who wore a number presenting it to a new player, especially when they speak about pride in the jumper, however I believed Southby more.

Collo was a great administrator when at Carlton before he was President if you know your history