Basketball shouldn't be an Olympic sport anyway.
Over the years too many glory towners have joined.
Soccer, tennis, golf. No one gives a crap about an Olympic medal in these sports. It's not the pinnacle and it's just more games for everyone to play.
It's a deadset pisstake. If the Olympics isn't at the pinnacle of the sport you compete in, that sport shouldn't be played there IMHO.
I lost interest in the Olympics decades ago.
I only just found out that bmx and breakdancing are now an Olympic sport (or at least are exhibition sports)
When the hell did that happen?
Whatever happened to "higher faster stronger"?
Another victim of autocorrect. :-[
BreakDANCING is now an olympic sport.
Breakfasting is probably easier to officiate and less subjective to breakdancing!
Doesn't seem to be a lot of interest in the Olympics in general this time around
I was going to start a separate thread as there are a few controversial things getting a bit of attention. (super swims??? and Boxing shenanigans)
And with the main event kicking off now (Athletics) ;) :D...
Do we need to do that or just let this become a more generic thread?
Is there the interest?
Problem may be that most of the posts have been about basketball so I'll leave it to DJC (as the thread starter) to decide whether we need a separate thread for other Olympic topics.
I can't wait until it's finished. I have never been so disinterested in an Olympics.
Not even sure why, just couldn't get into it.
A woman getting knocked out by a not so female woman is just yet another background story here.
Yep.
Somehow i managed to not even know when the olympics were scheduled to start.
Only way i found out was when my social media feeds were flooded with opening ceremony comments....then i twigged, oh i guess the olympics are starting now.
Use to love it as a kid.
Use to follow it in my teens.
Use to keep an eye on it in adult life.
Haven't watched a single second of it this year.
The basketball tragics would like a separate thread :)
There's plenty going on at the Olympics though; triathlon postponed because of too much dog sh1t in the Seine, China picking on Kyle Chalmers, boxing controversy, Jessica Fox, the commentator sacked for "sexist" language, huge waves in Teahupo’o, the removal of the Australian surfing judge, new "sports", the laid back Turkish pistol shooter, and much more.
This one is definitely controversial but it may not be as straight foward as it seems.
From what I've read so far, it is a case of a female athlete possessing an XY chromosome (which is a maker for a male) but for all other purposes this person has lived their life as a female with basically female anatomy.
She hasn't transitioned.
That may change as more information is known.
Now going to the sports psychology of the incident.
If you go into a contest believing that your opponent has an unfair advantage it would mess with your head.
You're as good as beaten.
Early aspects of the fight may have reinforced that idea in the Italian fighter's head.
"She punched harder than I've ever been punched before"...that may have been real.
Or it may have been an impression, justifying the already pre-conceived idea that this was an opponent with advantages 'above and beyond'.
I sympathise with Carini because for her it is 'real' and she is distraught that after years of training she couldn't continue... that's one of the complexities of competition at this level
That's speculative, it's a what might have happened.
I think we need to know more before we make a judgement.
Apparently, the claim that Khelif has XY chromosomes is bogus. What's more, she has lost several fights to other women and that's unlikely if she genuinely has male attributes.
Perhaps Carini was simply nailed with a good punch in a fair fight.
I haven't heard the XY thing is bogus. I have read it is in some cases irrelevant, to the point some XY's can even give birth, and there are varying degrees of XX & XY combinations.
Carini has apologised for her initial reaction and comments and accepted the result. Whether that's from pressure or a genuine acceptance is an unknown..
I had no idea that so many on social media are chromosome and gender experts. I guess it's not surprising, because they are also inflation experts, infectious disease experts, foreign policy experts, French performance art experts, military experts, political experts......
If it's irrelevant compete in the men's division then.
Sorry I just don't care.
This is where the world is going.
One body banned them. One says they followed a flawed process to do so.
The record is 41 and 9 against female athletes and has been to an Olympics before. Who knows for sure but I'd be concerned talking to either of them in a night club.
https://x.com/babble____/status/1819400350572364126?s=42&t=IdMF3t7GuUyWpVkGBXO22Q
Cheating, sport corruption , Russian influence or ....
Some additional reading if interested
Read the Reddit article, not necessarily the comments
I'm certainly not claiming to be an expert....In fact the opposite. The initial reaction to this from many was "it's a man beating up a woman". Five minutes of looking a bit deeper and the situation is much more complicated and folks with a lot more information and expertise in this area than any of us have decided it all sits within the rules.
It's not complicated.
Males compete against males.
Females compete against males.
Intersex compete against males.
It's not that simple though...
This is a different situation from someone transitioning later in life.
If you want to fight that Caitlyn Jenner shouldn't be allowed to compete against Masters women in track and field competitions I'll jump in the trench with you. I suspect Jenner would be right there with us.
But if you're born with female anatomy and lived your life as a female you would have competed against women all your life in sporting competitions...maybe not knowing that there is part of your genetic make-up that is not exclusively female.
This is not a case of a woman transitioning to a man, or a man transitioning to a woman.
Genetic testing isn't done on a Saturday afternoon before the event in junior competitions.
It's something you have to deal with when you a reach a level of world and Olympic Championships.
This is not a simple XX and XY debate.
It is super complicated and I reckon there would be many women running around in those Saturday afternoon competitions...some with extra muscle definition, or perhap other aspects of their physical appearance that is just a little bit different from their team-mates, who have no idea of their exact genetic make-up but who regard themselves and are regarded as totally female. In some case it gives them a physical advantage.
Do we want to test all these women before we decide whether they're in the Mens, Womens or Everyone else.
I suspect that 'Everyone else' group is much larger than folks realise.
I agree, and certainly not including you in the social media harmfulness and toxicity.
Wemby had a 61cm advantage over his Japanese opponent and that’s a product of genetics. Perhaps we should ban folk who have a competitive advantage through the vagaries of DNA.
Khelif competed at the Tokyo Olympics without any fuss. Perhaps she didn’t land a lucky punch there 🤔
This whole debate, like all such debates, is garbage. All of us exist on a spectrum of strength, skill, athletic ability etc. Should Kenyan and Ethiopian long distance runners be banned for having a few genetic advantages ? What about swimmers with unnaturally large feet ?
They have xy. OK.
Were they aware of that previously?
Besides that, is there any other 'evidence' of being a male?
Point I'm getting at is that is appears to be possible that 'the girl next door' that you've known her whole life could be disqualified from the Olympics because they have some screwy chromosomes that they were never made aware of.
I could be female for all I know.
Going off on a slight tangent, why is boxing still considered a sport in 2024 ? You have two people beating the sh1t out of each other and what we are interested in is who is the best at doing that.
Then just remove gender from all sports.
Women intersex, trans etc. can watch the better athletes from the sidelines.
Hallelujah! Exactly same page here, Pauly. To be frank, I don't get boxing as a sport... full stop. With more recent medical discoveries and knowledge regarding CTEs, this seems like a sport to give CTE experts work to do! Yes, I get that most sports strain various parts of the body resulting in future issues, but brain injury is an entire different ball game, so to speak. Not a part of your body you want damaged.
Worse than that, why has UFC/MMA rissen to the heights it has despite everyone knowing the CTE issues. That is more brutal.
Funny thing is your perspective is absolutely valid. DNA is very relevant!
Yep. UFC and those cages... barbarism. And fans baying for blood and severe harm is just bewildering.
Why is football legal? Car racing?
Maybe because the primary objective is not to bash someones brains in?
There are plenty of things you can appreciate about the athleticism and skill required to compete in all the sports mentioned, doesn't mean it should be done.
We know longer have gladiator fighting tigers....albeit as entertaining as they might be in its own way.
Cricket.
The good old bouncer hey. Deliberately throwing a hard ball at someone's head for no apparent reason then act shocked when someone dies after being struck.
You could probably mount an argument to say that the bouncer should be outlawed in all forms of cricket. I'd say it would be semi convincing at best. But I'm not sure it's quite the same thing. Taking cricket as a sport overall, and taking boxing / MMA as sports overall, they are miles apart, and that's being charitable.
Thats why they invented helmets.
FWIW, if you want to get someone off their game, just include the threat of copping a hard ball to the head.
Works wonders for the psychology of the bowler.
Was more useful before they invented helmets though.
Apologies, I have yet to read the full thread but you are correct according to Snopes.
https://www.snopes.com/news/2024/08/02/imane-khelif-olympics-boxing/
Yes, I read that article earlier today, and IMO it does a good job of summarizing the issues. It's a shame that yet again, innocent people get targeted by a hateful campaign of misinformation. And influencers like Rowling and Musk just make an already poor situation worse.
I agree with JK Rowling and a host of others....its a man beating up on a woman and equivalent to a female boxer being allowed to take steroids and then allowed to compete. The IBA banned Khelif at the 2023 World Champs after failing a eligibility test and there is no indication anywhere Khelif has identified as a transgender.
Its just fashionable Wokie drivel that drives the argument for him/her to be allowed to compete and given the distasteful Olympic opening ceremony from the French its hardly surprising...
Do yourself a favor eb and read the Snopes article.
The Snopes article is just the tip of the iceberg. There’s plenty out there that makes Khelif’s personal and professional record pretty clear.
I’ve read enough, I searched out the Snopes article after a normally sensible mate was sharing the agenda driven clickbait
https://au.yahoo.com/sports/gold-silver-medals-not-olympic-193028940.html
A bizarre situation imo....a country is either eligible or not and if Belarus are out then so are their athletes imho, regardless of their political status as neutrals or good guy Belaruskies.
Russia are banned and Belarus and their Dictator Putin Puppet president Lukashenko and citizens should be treated the same as an entirety.
Not sure why they aren't allowed to compete really. It's a farcical situation to politicise the games that are supposed to be about the international community coming together.
Eanwhile Israel are competing...
Previously they've had athletes competing under the olympics flag. Not sure why they don't do the same.
You are either in or out imho not half way and as Krud suggested if special exemptions have been allowed previously then fine let them compete under the Olympic flag ie athletes who maybe from a banned country but have sought political refuge in another country but dont qualify for their new country.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDzJC9k6qjQ
Stingers were good last night.
I can't say I'm a fan of water polo, but in the end the game became very interesting. Bizarrely, to me at least, the first 3 Qtrs were almost procedural like a warm up, then in the last it all came alive.
One thing that I can't get my head around, they can pinpoint each other with passes, and do so routinely to hit a raised hand, but then miss the 2m wide goal completely! :o
Repechage in track events....stupidest idea ever. ::)
I've watched the video today of the Breaker girl who lost in the Olympic qualifiers to Raygun.
I've got to say there wasn't a lot of difference between them, and it sounds like much of the social media and media vitriol is baseless.
I'll say this, the Aussie girls are quite different in moves to most of the international competitors and that seems to be the big issue, most of the international competitors are the same same but different, almost clones, while the Aussie moves and style is drastically different.
Also no doubt also that Breaking is physical enough to be a sport, it's probably as deserving if not more deserving than some of the gymnastic or skating events at various Olympics.
One of the problems with events that rely on an independent observer rather than a 'first past the post in the quickest time' is that they will always have this 'eye of the beholder' criteria.
Things like Gymnastics, synchronised swimming, diving, breaking, skateboarding...even boxing (other than knockout) etc...these all rather depend on a judges perceptions and bias.
It's usually where the biggest controversies arise.
Yep.
Keep it simple.
"Citius. Altius. Fortius."
Swifter (Faster). Higher. Stronger.
Its rubbish to call it a sport and shouldnt be in the Olympics but the pile on and coverage that Ms Gunn has received is mind boggling, its taken the limelight off the fact that Australia had a mighty fine games and apart from the bozo hockey player who wanted his fix there was plenty to be proud about.
I enjoyed watching most of the Olympic events tuned in for.
The breaker fiasco highlights a problem with several disciplines - they rely on judges, as Lods mentioned and Kruddler emphasised with his "Citius. Altius. Fortius."
Get rid of gymnastics, diving, synchronised swimming, boxing, surfing, dressage, martial arts and pole dancing and bring back sports that rely on individuals or teams beating their opponents by being faster, stronger or scoring more (or less in the case of golf). Sports like Greco-Roman wrestling should be brought back, along with jousting, netball, darts, spear throwing, handball, snooker, and maybe arm wrestling. The modern pentathlon should have the horse discipline brought back, but as a cross-country event with laser pistol shooting (or perhaps archery) conducted at several points along the course and from horseback.
Wasn't pigeon shooting an event?
It was.
In 1900 Donald Macintosh represented Australia and won a Gold and a Bronze.
Killed a total of 40 birds.
Unfortunately the IOC has amended the records so that the events are now classified as non-olympic.
We lose some medals....but think about the pigeons saved.
It still is but with clay pigeons. Penny Smith won a dirty gold medal for us.
While it’s probably not on to kill animals at the Olympics, I reckon there would be interest in events like sheep shearing, rabbit skinning and wood chopping. We might do OK 🙂
It’s quite poor of the IOC not recognise the original pigeon shooting. Trap shooting is really just an evolution of the original “sport” … and pigeons are a feral species and pest throughout much of their range.