Princes Park => Robert Heatley Stand => Topic started by: crashlander on April 17, 2025, 08:55:05 pm
Title: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: crashlander on April 17, 2025, 08:55:05 pm
Sunday 27 Apr at 15:20 at the MCG.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: laj on April 18, 2025, 07:54:44 pm
This is the real one. Win this and we are back in town.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: pinot on April 18, 2025, 07:59:40 pm
Time to find out where we sit on the Fraud spectrum. Nothing worse than flat track bullies.
Happy the team is finding form but really - WCE and NM are hapless.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: PaulP on April 18, 2025, 08:38:51 pm
Geelong will be a taller order than WC or NM, but I'm not sure a loss to them is an indication of fakery. We are still wobbly, and could not even beat Richmond, so I think a little perspective is in order. Geelong will be strong favorites, and rightly so. I'm not sure you can just flick a switch and start beating the top teams, as much as we would like to. Maybe baby steps for now.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 18, 2025, 09:53:08 pm
Geelong will be a taller order than WC or NM, but I'm not sure a loss to them is an indication of fakery. We are still wobbly, and could not even beat Richmond, so I think a little perspective is in order. Geelong will be strong favorites, and rightly so. I'm not sure you can just flick a switch and start beating the top teams, as much as we would like to. Maybe baby steps for now.
Baby steps???? We are 11 years into a rebuild!
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: PaulP on April 19, 2025, 10:20:51 am
The current regime has no say in what came before. Every time there's a change of coach, significant list turnover etc., the club has to, by simple logic, go backwards and in some cases, back to square one. "The Club" is an abstract entity that exists in the minds of supporters, but the club, in terms of performing on field, is nothing more than a collection of individuals at a given period of time The Club is a different club now than it was 10 years ago. IMO, you should not be counting back to the Teague, Malthouse, Bolton etc eras, your count should start with Voss. I know you won't agree. This may be cold comfort / irrelevant / total BS to some, but it's the truth
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: shawny on April 19, 2025, 10:23:16 am
Beaten the bottom dwellers in North and WC only in the last 10 months!
Really dont know where we sit so interested to the outcome of this game. Get another 3 days rest on them which should freshen us right up. Who knows.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: shawny on April 19, 2025, 10:28:54 am
The current regime has no say in what came before. Every time there's a change of coach, significant list turnover etc., the club has to, by simple logic, go backwards and in some cases, back to square one. "The Club" is an abstract entity that exists in the minds of supporters, but the club, in terms of performing on field, is nothing more than a collection of individuals at a given period of time The Club is a different club now than it was 10 years ago. IMO, you should not be counting back to the Teague, Malthouse, Bolton etc eras, your count should start with Voss. I know you won't agree. This may be cold comfort / irrelevant / total BS to some, but it's the truth
Your right i don't agree. Its a cop out to say forget the past and the era starts with a change of coach. Thats a losers mentality. We change coaches every second year! I follow the club and this list has been building for the past decade. Changing a coach doesn't reset the clock as far as im concerned.
So why is everyone so critical of WC there coach is a newbie ?
Does that mean Swans GF smashing with there current list are all forgotten now?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: PaulP on April 19, 2025, 10:34:21 am
Your right i don't agree. Its a cop out to say forget the past and the era starts with a change of coach. Thats a losers mentality. We change coaches every second year! I follow the club and this list has been building for the past decade. Changing a coach doesn't reset the clock as far as im concerned.
So why is everyone so critical of WC there coach is a newbie ?
Does that mean Swans GF smashing with there current list are all forgotten now?
Climbing out of the fug we've inhabited for 20 years needs a lot of things to go right. Maintaining an established winning culture is easier than recreating one from scratch. For this reason, the Swans, Cats, Hawks etc can manage transitions better than clubs like ours.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Thryleon on April 19, 2025, 11:16:39 am
Even the least objective supporter should be able to see that our rebuild started with the weitering draft. Thats at worst 9 years ago, but given where we were coming from and the lack of success at the draft table, we are likely doing mini rebuild 3.0 since then now.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 19, 2025, 05:36:20 pm
Even the least objective supporter should be able to see that our rebuild started with the weitering draft. Thats at worst 9 years ago, but given where we were coming from and the lack of success at the draft table, we are likely doing mini rebuild 3.0 since then now.
Correct.
Sos started the rebuild and nailed our spine jn 1 draft. We've been trying to flesh out the rest of it so long, we're getting towards the end of the spines careers.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: LordLucifer on April 20, 2025, 08:24:11 am
The last two weeks we have been at a holiday camp, I don't count them as anything more than training drills even though I did have a genuine sense of concern for the NM match)
This week we are back in the saltmine playing the Cats, another loss (even a hard fought loss) will not be considered acceptable nor tolerated.
They have to do a hell of a lot to rekindle my faith & belief, I can't buy into any short-term sugar-fix, I want long-term results & consistency
Dropping this game will just show once again that we are in fact, frauds !!
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Baggers on April 20, 2025, 09:26:47 am
Ah, yes, the Pussycats... a terrific litmus test for any top 8 (or 4!) aspirant.
Our leadership, discipline and mental resolve will be tested. A real 'above the shoulders' test.
Unlike the previous 2 sides, who may have brought real heat for a few minutes here and there, this mob will bring bona fide heat persistently and consistently. And any lapses on our part (eg 2nd qtr v Kangabies), will be severely dealt with.
Optimistic? Nuh. Hopeful? You bet.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 20, 2025, 09:55:23 am
The last two weeks we have been at a holiday camp, I don't count them as anything more than training drills even though I did have a genuine sense of concern for the NM match.
This week we are back in the saltmine playing the Cats, another loss (even a hard fought loss) will not be considered acceptable nor tolerated.
They have to do a hell of a lot to rekindle my faith & belief, I can't buy into any short-term sugar-fix, I want long-term results & consistency
Dropping this game will just show once again that we are in fact, frauds !!
Yep, the last two games mean zero if we cant replicate that level of effort, tackling and pressure against the good sides (contenders). Let's hope Haw and Geel belt the living suitcases out of each other tomorrow. The one plus is that this game is at the G., however I fear their speed and firepower will trouble us. I heard a whisper Weitering's injury is a little more serious than what is thought.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: shawny on April 20, 2025, 05:15:31 pm
The last two weeks we have been at a holiday camp, I don't count them as anything more than training drills even though I did have a genuine sense of concern for the NM match)
This week we are back in the saltmine playing the Cats, another loss (even a hard fought loss) will not be considered acceptable nor tolerated.
They have to do a hell of a lot to rekindle my faith & belief, I can't buy into any short-term sugar-fix, I want long-term results & consistency
Dropping this game will just show once again that we are in fact, frauds !!
Yep spot on. You’re a realist
While i enjoyed this weeks win it changes little for me longterm. I still dont think the list is anywhere near strong enough to go deep into the season which is so disappointing considering how long we have been crap for.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: BluePhantom on April 21, 2025, 07:45:15 am
The last two weeks we have been at a holiday camp, I don't count them as anything more than training drills even though I did have a genuine sense of concern for the NM match.
This week we are back in the saltmine playing the Cats, another loss (even a hard fought loss) will not be considered acceptable nor tolerated.
They have to do a hell of a lot to rekindle my faith & belief, I can't buy into any short-term sugar-fix, I want long-term results & consistency
Dropping this game will just show once again that we are in fact, frauds !!
I heard a whisper Weitering's injury is a little more serious than what is thought.
:o :o :o Hope that's all it is, just a whisper!
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Lods on April 21, 2025, 08:33:15 am
There is no doubt that this week will be a much greater test of where we actually sit. But don't totally discount the last two weeks as an indicator.
Mediocre sides struggle to put away sides like West Coast and North. Good sides 'crush' them 71 and 82 points probably qualify as 'crushings'. ;)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Sexybronco on April 21, 2025, 08:49:57 am
There is no doubt that this week will be a much greater test of where we actually sit. But don't totally discount the last two weeks as an indicator.
Mediocre sides struggle to put away sides like West Coast and North. Good sides 'crush' them 71 and 82 points probably qualify as 'crushings'. ;)
Agree, you can’t ignore our improved form irrespective of who we played, we looked much more cohesive and go into this weeks match with much more belief.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: tonyo on April 21, 2025, 09:23:44 am
Do not underestimate the power of belief, which brings confidence, which brings improved performance.
I remember all too well sitting at the 'G in Round 14, 2023, We were 13th on the ladder with 4 wins, and playing the Suns. At quarter time, we were 10 points behind and looking as sick as ever.
Then, someone somewhere flicked a switch. We kicked 9 in the second quarter and had a nice 'flat-track' win.
Then we pumped the Hawks, which was also a flat-track win in 2023, having kicked the first 8 goals of the game..
We all know what happened from there, with an ounce of luck we could have pinched the flag.
The last two weeks were against lowly opposition, but the manner of the wins was the more important feature. Foot on the throat, and kept it there.
It is a big game next week, but I have always felt we match up pretty well with the Cats.
I remain highly optimistic about 2025.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: PaulP on April 21, 2025, 10:20:19 am
The season's not over until it's over, which means either until it's mathematically / practically impossible to make finals, or if we make finals, until we are eliminated. A loss or win against Geelong proves little IMO, in the context of a full season. If we win and build self belief, that self belief vanishes if we lose the next three. There needs to be a body of work and a mental attitude that doesn't live or die by a single game, or a couple of games. Otherwise the boys are just like weather vanes, and you can't build a sustainable brand like that IMO.
Geelong's form is better than ours at the moment, and they deserve to start favorites. I'll be watching today's game with great interest.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: pew2 on April 21, 2025, 01:42:50 pm
firstly let cats do battle with hawks and then we can start with thoughts / predictions
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 21, 2025, 04:09:22 pm
Do not underestimate the power of belief, which brings confidence, which brings improved performance.
I remember all too well sitting at the 'G in Round 14, 2023, We were 13th on the ladder with 4 wins, and playing the Suns. At quarter time, we were 10 points behind and looking as sick as ever.
Then, someone somewhere flicked a switch. We kicked 9 in the second quarter and had a nice 'flat-track' win.
Then we pumped the Hawks, which was also a flat-track win in 2023, having kicked the first 8 goals of the game..
We all know what happened from there, with an ounce of luck we could have pinched the flag.
I was at that game too and it certainly was flicking a switch. It came out of nowhere and lasted basically the rest of the year.
Wasn't until the port game that I really believed it was anything sustainable.
Not quite sure how or why it happened, but it may have happened again...we just need more time to confirm.
Biggest issue we have is the potential long term loss of Weitering and how we expect to replace him.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: laj on April 21, 2025, 06:32:20 pm
So, if we win and the Dogs. Freo, Essendon, Port and and St.Kilda lose, we'll be in the 8...lol.
Only problem is we have to beat Geelong and Port have to lose to North in Adelaide.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: northernblue on April 21, 2025, 06:37:59 pm
Let’s just try and play well and win regularly and see where that gets us, huh.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: hanwell on April 21, 2025, 07:58:47 pm
Everyone, everywhere has been banging on about how the "last teams we've beaten are Norf and Toasters", well here is the other one, and even after today's great game I reckon we will have their measure. Definitely play H, just not 100% sure who goes, Young did nothing wrong last round. Nice to be back...
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Professer E on April 21, 2025, 08:00:29 pm
Any word on Weeters? Curtis should have weeks I reckon.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: pew2 on April 22, 2025, 03:19:33 pm
if we stop the long bombs into F50 and find different ways to score we are a huge chance
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 22, 2025, 04:02:38 pm
Cats will be down a couple of handy players with Miers and maybe Atkins out which will help us and are due for a loss, that was a tough game vs the Hawks and they will be sore. Same old problem though is who can stop Cameron or at least restrict him to a minimal contribution, do that and we can win. Its about taking your opportunities when other teams are at their weakest and taking advantage of their injuries, playing in tough big games etc and as good as Geelong are you cant win every game and we should be cherry ripe after a couple of games where we didnt have to over exert ourselves and players like Elijah, Charlie will be better for the run and Harry coming back will create problems for the Cats.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: pinot on April 22, 2025, 06:45:03 pm
What wins them alot of games is tackles inside 50 and efficiency inside 50. This game is for the defence in our D50 to stay cool as ice because I think forward of center they can be beaten through clearances. They press very hard and H being an outlet kick could be handy.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: pew2 on April 23, 2025, 03:19:50 pm
cats without a couple of players been there many times and we still get beaten unfortunately
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: DJC on April 23, 2025, 05:33:53 pm
I just had a look at the Geelong website and their injury list makes ours look like it's providing a wealth of information in comparison. They have seven players with TBC timelines and two others with indefinite timelines. ::)
Interestingly, former Blue liniment lizard, Jack Martin, is suffering from "Management" and his timeline is TBC ...
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Thryleon on April 23, 2025, 08:03:11 pm
I just had a look at the Geelong website and their injury list makes ours look like it's providing a wealth of information in comparison. They have seven players with TBC timelines and two others with indefinite timelines. ::)
Interestingly, former Blue liniment lizard, Jack Martin, is suffering from "Management" and his timeline is TBC ...
Yeah he is a gamble player. Cats dont need him to fire given what Danger is doing forward, but its a hell of a luxury to have a classy player like Martin come in and allow them to move him around the ground.
Great depth cover, and what I was hoping Haynes would be for us.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Professer E on April 23, 2025, 09:08:30 pm
He's doing exactly what most reckoned he'd do to the cats...Clog the list, chew up the salary cap and use up medical resources
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: DJC on April 23, 2025, 09:38:31 pm
I just had a look at the Geelong website and their injury list makes ours look like it's providing a wealth of information in comparison. They have seven players with TBC timelines and two others with indefinite timelines. ::)
Interestingly, former Blue liniment lizard, Jack Martin, is suffering from "Management" and his timeline is TBC ...
Yeah he is a gamble player. Cats dont need him to fire given what Danger is doing forward, but its a hell of a luxury to have a classy player like Martin come in and allow them to move him around the ground.
Great depth cover, and what I was hoping Haynes would be for us.
Yes, Jack could be a VIP for Geelong at the pointy end of the season but only if he can get on the park.
I’m not sure who came up with the following but I think that it may have been Lord Lucifer - and I’m paraphrasing:
You don’t bring in depth players. You bring in players who force established players to become depth players.
Who knows what Mackie and Wells were thinking when they threw Martin a lifeline but I suspect they won’t be too happy with whoever signed off on his medical.
Anyway, Jack won’t be playing against us on Sunday.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Thryleon on April 24, 2025, 08:59:41 am
I think Lucifer has that wrong. Sometimes you find a depth option and bring them in at a discount. Mitch Morton for the Swans rings a bell. He played 12 games for the Swans in two years including 3 finals, one a winning grand final.
I think having hard and fast rules around list management is a way to result in poor list management.
Particularly once the compromised drafts begin. If you can bring in an older player or a broken player and they fire up for you at the right time, then provided you aren't relying on it its fine.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Professer E on April 24, 2025, 09:08:33 am
The other point of view is relying on discounted, broken players, and you end up with a substantial portion of the list existing in the twilight zone of "he's a matchwinner....but he's never available when you need him". Like us in the second half of 2023 being a prime example. You don't win flags on hope.
The flipside is resurrecting a broken player, who you got at a discount. Matt Carroll looks like one examole, but what's our strike rate in this realm, five percent?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 24, 2025, 09:15:23 am
I think Lucifer has that wrong. Sometimes you find a depth option and bring them in at a discount. Mitch Morton for the Swans rings a bell. He played 12 games for the Swans in two years including 3 finals, one a winning grand final.
I think having hard and fast rules around list management is a way to result in poor list management.
Particularly once the compromised drafts begin. If you can bring in an older player or a broken player and they fire up for you at the right time, then provided you aren't relying on it its fine.
Correct.
If you bring in players who will be best 22, you pay them best 22 prices. If someone gets pushed out of your best 22, they were already on best 22 prices. Thats a quick and easy way to screw over your salary cap.
It doesn't matter what you play for any particular player, just that you get good value for them.
A rookie is the cheapest of the lot, but if he is never going to play a game then he becomes a list clogger and not good value. A brownlow medalist who costs you 2mil dollars is not good value because he takes too much away from the cap and away from other players, forcing them to leave. A top up player can be good value at the right price and right availability. Doesn't have to be best 22. Look at Fogarty or Boyd....both cost us next to nothing, both can do a job at AFL level. Both are borderline best 22-best 28. Both good value.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: LordLucifer on April 24, 2025, 12:02:17 pm
I don't know why this pre-match thread has been turned into a List Management but anyways ............
For the record, I have never read so many offbeat theories in my life.
On top of that, we are not in the "depth" business !!
If you want depth, then you create it by bringing in better credentialled players into the top half/third of the list thereby forcing players on the fringe (who may be getting a game) further down the pecking order.
And lastly .......... "best 22" means absolute jacksh1t, look at Norths best 22, they can't even blow out a candle.
If you want to be a genine contender, then you need to create a "competitive 22" that is the equivalent of (or better than) the top 6-8 clubs.
Being in the best 22 players on a craphole list means nothing and never will, it's a bottom of the barrel mentality.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 24, 2025, 12:15:54 pm
I don't know why this pre-match thread has been turned into a List Management but anyways ............
For the record, I have never read so many offbeat theories in my life.
On top of that, we are not in the "depth" business !!
If you want depth, then you create it by bringing in better credentialled players into the top half/third of the list thereby forcing players on the fringe (who may be getting a game) further down the pecking order.
And lastly .......... "best 22" means absolute jacksh1t, look at Norths best 22, they can't even blow out a candle.
If you want to be a genine contender, then you need to create a "competitive 22" that is the equivalent of (or better than) the top 6-8 clubs.
Being in the best 22 players on a craphole list means nothing and never will, it's a bottom of the barrel mentality.
We have a competitive 22. We don't have a competitive 32. We need to add depth. You can do that by bringing in a 22 player and pushing one out or you can do that by bringing in a player that can do a role when required. O.Holland/Boyd/Cincotta/Fogarty are examples of that....they won't be in everyones best 22, but when they are called upon to perform at AFL level, they don't look out of place and we don't suffer.
Kids come through and push best 22 players out when they are ready - Look at Docherty.
Not every trade needs to improve your best 22, it just needs to improve your list, because having a completly fit best 22 is a fantasy that is unacheivable.
Nobody is saying dont try and get the most talented players you can, but you don't simply do it at the detriment of your long term stability requiring you to have a fire sale to fit everyone else under the cap.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 24, 2025, 12:17:45 pm
Cats are an example of this.
Jack Martin isn't best 22 for them, but he is a good depth player to have when required.
I'm more than happy that he cannot be picked this week. When fit, he worries any opponent. Thankfully, he is not often fit, including this week.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: LordLucifer on April 24, 2025, 12:18:31 pm
Jack Martin isn't best 22 for them, but he is a good depth player to have when requiredif he is ever fit enough to play.
I'm more than happy that he cannot be picked this week. When fit, he worries any opponent. Thankfully, he is not often fit, including this week.
Edited for accuracy :)
Yes, I'm pleased that Jack isn't available for selection this week, but the chances of him (a) being fit enough to play and (b) managing to string games together are pretty slim. Perhaps Jack should channel Max Rooke and get onto calves blood extract.
If Jack was fit, who would he replace? I don't think he could he could perform Miers' role but Ollie Henry, Clohesy and Close haven't exactly been setting the world on fire with their scintillating forward craft. Either way, it's not a problem Geelong's MC will have to deal with.
Who gets the matchup with Dangerfield when he goes forward? I think I'd go with Haynes but with Silvagni, McGovern and Saad picking him up from time to time and running him around.
I'd play Lord on Smith and give him a licence to be unsociable :)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Professer E on April 24, 2025, 02:17:17 pm
Jack Darling was a lauded pick up as a top 22 player at the start of the year, all the stuff I've heard since the weekend is that he's a washed up dud. But he was acquired to "fill a role", "free up others" and provide "depth". Funny I would have thought that his previous years' were a good guide what to expect in 2025.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 24, 2025, 02:27:03 pm
A top up player can be good value at the right price and right availability. Doesn't have to be best 22.
How many more top up players do you want ??
Fantasia Haynes Lord Boyd White Cincotta Evans Cottrell O'Keeffe Duffy Monahan
11 players out of 45, that's 25% of our playing list that are top up options (i.e. undrafted & untraded for).
Not sure your figures are exactly accurate, but that is besides the point. A top up player can be traded for, and drafted, so your logic is wrong anyway.
Let me put it this way.... Monaghan Duffy Okeefe Lemmey B. Camporeale L. Camporeale Smith White O'Farrell Wilson Charleson Carroll
If you want to extend that out to 5 games or less, you can also include.... Moir Binns Lord
That is 15 players on our list who have played 5 games or less......1/3rd of our list. You need to pick 23 players each week. On our list, we have 45 players.
So if you were to exclude the 15 kids mentioned above, that means you have a total of 30 players to pick from with AFL experience.....before you get injuries. Of course, that includes some names like, Evans, Fantasia...and you've lost Newman for the year.
You are now down to 27 AFL players to choose from and a bunch of essentially untried kids..
How many injuries do you reckon we have on any given week? How many players have we got left to choose from now??
....and people wonder why we started 0-4 when we had average of about 10 players over that time.
We currently have too many kids and not enough senior ready players.
Thankfully, Lucas Camporeale, Matt Carroll and Will White have exceeded all expectations thus far and Cooper Lord appears to have taken it up a notch as well. We all hope Jagga will be a gun. That still leaves 11 players who are giant question marks at this stage.
So how much depth do i want? Some would be nice.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: PaulP on April 24, 2025, 06:27:16 pm
McKay, Cowan and Docherty in for this game.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Professer E on April 24, 2025, 06:55:55 pm
Can't see it myself
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Lods on April 24, 2025, 07:18:34 pm
That's what it is No outs yet.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: DJC on April 24, 2025, 08:07:20 pm
Subject to getting through our main training session, we have eight players named on an extended bench. At the risk of offending sentimentalists, the only one of that eight whose form doesn’t really warrant selection is Doc … but he may have trained the house down this week.
The bottom line is that it’s likely that there will be three players who are stiff not to make the final 23. Then there’s the likes of Pitto, Lemmey, Boyd, Charleson, Binns and Evans, whose VFL form must have pleased the MC, and the Camporeale twins, Moir, O’Farrell and Wilson aren’t far off.
I suspect that a few other clubs would love to have our depth.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 24, 2025, 08:54:53 pm
Subject to getting through our main training session, we have eight players named on an extended bench. At the risk of offending sentimentalists, the only one of that eight whose form doesn’t really warrant selection is Doc … but he may have trained the house down this week.
The bottom line is that it’s likely that there will be three players who are stiff not to make the final 23. Then there’s the likes of Pitto, Lemmey, Boyd, Charleson, Binns and Evans, whose VFL form must have pleased the MC, and the Camporeale twins, Moir, O’Farrell and Wilson aren’t far off.
I suspect that a few other clubs would love to have our depth.
Take off the navy glasses DJC. Half of those players won't be on the list in a year or 2, their form is far from AFL level form.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: DJC on April 25, 2025, 01:23:16 am
Subject to getting through our main training session, we have eight players named on an extended bench. At the risk of offending sentimentalists, the only one of that eight whose form doesn’t really warrant selection is Doc … but he may have trained the house down this week.
The bottom line is that it’s likely that there will be three players who are stiff not to make the final 23. Then there’s the likes of Pitto, Lemmey, Boyd, Charleson, Binns and Evans, whose VFL form must have pleased the MC, and the Camporeale twins, Moir, O’Farrell and Wilson aren’t far off.
I suspect that a few other clubs would love to have our depth.
Take off the navy glasses DJC. Half of those players won't be on the list in a year or 2, their form is far from AFL level form.
Let's revisit that in two years.
I'd say Evans will be gone and Binns will have to find some form to stay but the rest will be fixtures.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Lods on April 25, 2025, 05:50:58 am
Take off the navy glasses DJC. Half of those players won't be on the list in a year or 2, their form is far from AFL level form.
Let's revisit that in two years.
I'd say Evans will be gone and Binns will have to find some form to stay but the rest will be fixtures.
I think this might be a 'make or break' year for Wilson. He shows a bit from time to time but not enough to press for senior time.
Moir is an enigma. Could be 'anything' or not make it...he's also a bit of a wait and see.
Whether Pitto is on our list will depend to a large extent on whether DeKoning goes, and how O'Keefe develops.
I also have hopes for the others though....
Lemmey is getting better. Boyd is unlucky not to be in the side. There is obviously something he's been asked to work on.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Baggers on April 25, 2025, 09:04:33 am
Interesting listening to Mitchell discussing coaching against C Scott. Apparently you have to really be on your toes as Scott is very tactical/strategic game day and doesn't hesitate to make changes. So he's -- no surprise -- an excellent game day coach. This will be a big test for our coaching lads on Sunday.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 25, 2025, 09:08:28 am
Interesting listening to Mitchell discussing coaching against C Scott. Apparently you have to really be on your toes as Scott is very tactical/strategic game day and doesn't hesitate to make changes. So he's -- no surprise -- an excellent game day coach. This will be a big test for our coaching lads on Sunday.
Simpson was even better to listen to about Scott. He was asked which coach trouble him the most and the Answer was C Scott. He reckons they couldn't figure out how Geel created the spare man so willingly in all areas of the ground. He said in the end, they just conceded on it and worked on what else they could do to combat him/them.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 25, 2025, 09:09:55 am
Take off the navy glasses DJC. Half of those players won't be on the list in a year or 2, their form is far from AFL level form.
Let's revisit that in two years.
I'd say Evans will be gone and Binns will have to find some form to stay but the rest will be fixtures.
Evans, Wilson, binns should be gone end of year. Ofarrell and Charles in havnt shown anything yet, but are freshies, so will get more time. Same as Campos. Pitto is contracted for a couple more so will be there unless we trade him. Boyd appears to be on the outs for whatever reason. That leaves us with lemmey and moir from your list. That comes with the caveat of how hard up we are for list spots and how willing we are to wait for them. Potential, but unrealised.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Lods on April 25, 2025, 09:38:31 am
I've just moved the last couple of posts on discussion of the list changes over to the "List Management" thread Can we continue the discussion there and leave this thread to the pre-match
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Thryleon on April 25, 2025, 12:14:20 pm
I was going to comment but decided against it. My point is a general one, the fortunes of any one player on our list are directly tied to what's available, where our cap is, and what older players fall out. In a world where names are on a team sheet, certain players will go, and others will stay. Thing is, these youngsters have time on their side, and some of our older players are approaching a cliff. That might mean someone like doch and newman retires instantly giving wilson another year as an example.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 25, 2025, 12:22:07 pm
Cant see Wilson making it, was an odd choice imo and never saw the hype around him.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: DJC on April 25, 2025, 03:55:45 pm
I've just moved the last couple of posts on discussion of the list changes over to the "List Management" thread Can we continue the discussion there and leave this thread to the pre-match
It’s funny how there seem to a couple of topics that emerge simultaneously in several threads and list management is one that is cropping up all over the shop at the moment 🤔
We destroyed Geelong last time by employing a similar ball movement to what we did against North. It will be interesting to see whether Scott can come up with a counter to that and, if so, what our Plan B will be.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: townsendcalling on April 25, 2025, 05:06:48 pm
Only 1 change: Harry for Lewis
Is our last interchange named generally our sub?? If so, it's Acres which I'm not totally against.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: tex on April 25, 2025, 05:22:02 pm
Is our last interchange named generally our sub?? If so, it's Acres which I'm not totally against.
I believe Lord is listed sub isn’t he
Not announced until an hour prior to the game.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 25, 2025, 06:47:38 pm
Coach Voss says Jacob Weitering has great pain tolerance and after hobbling off in the win over Nth thats not convincing me he is very fit and should be playing. Im sure he will be jabbed up etc but Id rather him miss one game than be out for the next couple after Geelong which are probably more winnable.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 25, 2025, 07:10:42 pm
Coach Voss says Jacob Weitering has great pain tolerance and after hobbling off in the win over Nth thats not convincing me he is very fit and should be playing. Im sure he will be jabbed up etc but Id rather him miss one game than be out for the next couple after Geelong which are probably more winnable.
Playing him has disaster written all over it. I reckon he'll be a late out.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: pinot on April 25, 2025, 11:48:15 pm
Weits is a beast he will play.
Get the win Vossy.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Lods on April 25, 2025, 11:57:24 pm
If there is a bit of doubt, don't play him.
It's a lesson we should have learnt after some fiascos last year.
Hopefully he's a 100% and good to go. If he plays injured and gets hurt we won't hear the end of it. ;)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Professer E on April 26, 2025, 08:44:29 am
Can't believe Cowan was even named.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: shawny on April 26, 2025, 09:30:22 am
Massive game - haven't beaten a decent team in 10 months which regardless of reasons has to stop this week.
We can't use injuries as an excuse and seem to match up ok against Cats.
If sitting 2nd in the second half of last season wasnt a anomaly we have to win this. No excuses just get it done.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: crashlander on April 26, 2025, 10:27:57 am
It's a lesson we should have learnt after some fiascos last year.
Hopefully he's a 100% and good to go. If he plays injured and gets hurt we won't hear the end of it. ;)
I tend to agree. Playing unfit players is fraught with danger. Making an injury worse would be a disaster.
I agree.
However, I'm not sure weiterings i jury is one that can get worse. From my eyes it was a knock on the knee. I doubt he broke anything and your not really going to get any ligament damage.
He may be in pain, but playing won't make it worse.
If.....my armchair diagnosis is correct.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Thryleon on April 26, 2025, 03:02:59 pm
We'll never know. I hears a tale from an ex afl player today who pushed through thr pain barrier. Was an Achilles injury. Ended up tearing the hamstring off the bone on the opposite leg as it was compensating for the injured ankle.
Perhaps that's a correlation not causation but the logic has merit. You could make something worse by playing injured. Just depends what. Also depends on the person and the injury.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: hanwell on April 27, 2025, 08:01:53 am
Little Hanners and I will be on the train from the old Rat today with a great expectation, we match up with this lot, B. Smith is not that much of a difference, Myers out is! No Tomahawk will be a massive boost for the Weitbot. Just hope they go with the DK ruck duel again.... Baggers by 20+
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: townsendcalling on April 27, 2025, 10:34:30 am
Lewis Young not playing in the twos! Let the speculation begin!!!
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Gointocarlton on April 27, 2025, 12:29:35 pm
Cant believe reading online how many people are up and about for todays game commenting with things like "we will towel up" Geelong citing last years 10 goal win. We've beaten no one of any substance yet this year. I want to see wins against good teams like Geel before I get up and about. Two more putrid teams than Norf and WC you will not see, maybe at a pinch StK now us in the first 4 weeks.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on April 27, 2025, 12:38:02 pm
Cant believe reading online how many people are up and about for todays game commenting with things like "we will towel up" Geelong citing last years 10 goal win. We've beaten no one of any substance yet this year. I want to see wins against good teams like Geel before I get up and about. Two more putrid teams than Norf and WC you will not see, maybe at a pinch StK now us in the first 4 weeks.
We usually matchup ok vs the Cats and are seen as massive underdogs which helps as they play with a bit of arrogance and entitlement which can lead to their undoing. I agree we have beaten nothing so far as WC and Nth are rubbish but I think we can give the Cats a run for their money and be competitive and with a bit of luck take the 4 points.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Lods on April 27, 2025, 12:38:45 pm
Cant believe reading online how many people are up and about for todays game commenting with things like "we will towel up" Geelong citing last years 10 goal win. We've beaten no one of any substance yet this year. I want to see wins against good teams like Geel before I get up and about. Two more putrid teams than Norf and WC you will not see, maybe at a pinch StK now us in the first 4 weeks.
I'm not confident of a win, but I do believe we'll see a strong effort. We did beat bottom sides, but we beat them like good sides should.
A poor effort today would be very disappointing after seeming to get back on track, and would take the winds out of the sails in a big way
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: PaulP on April 27, 2025, 01:06:29 pm
I'm not fussed who we beat, or how we beat them. I just want to see us get enough wins to make finals, then load up and go from there.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: kruddler on April 27, 2025, 02:56:42 pm
NO LATE CHANGES
SUBSTITUTES Carlton: Cooper Lord Geelong: Oliver Henry
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: LP on April 27, 2025, 03:03:21 pm
What odds Dangerflog takes out a soft target like Motlop or Durdin early?
Can't say it will be them for certain, but it's generally someone who won't or can't hurt Dangerflog back, funny about how that works out! ;)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 7 2025 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Geelong at the MCG
Post by: Thryleon on April 27, 2025, 07:05:17 pm