Social Club => Blah-Blah Bar => Topic started by: Thryleon on June 18, 2025, 09:23:58 am
Title: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Thryleon on June 18, 2025, 09:23:58 am
I thought id start this thread because this topic isnt being discussed anywhere else and it figured a title like this provides the requisite satire to not take life too seriously in what is a very serious situation.
I found the strikes against Iran eyebrow raising.
The whole nuclear rationale for attacking another nation to me to be an excuse.
It reminds me of Saddam Hussein, Iraq and the weapons of mass destruction that to my best knowledge, never turned up.
Israel are feeling the backlash of this. Deservedly so. No sympathy for an aggressor in war. They did what their intel told them to I suppose.
The more recent comparison we have is Ukraine and Russia. These conflicts have the capability of plunging us into world war 3. We are rather fortunate here in Australia. We dont have to worry too much about this stuff as the only nation likely to invade us has largely achieved it through immigration and real estate anyway so they won't be coming for us any time soon.
Give us your thoughts. Im not sure Israel has garnered much sympathy out of this. Is it a continuation of the stoush with palestine where Iran was seen to be an enabler?
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: madbluboy on June 18, 2025, 09:42:13 am
Didn't Iran launch hundreds of drones at them last year?
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Lods on June 18, 2025, 10:08:31 am
A lot of these situations are complicated for us by the fact that we, at the 'common people' level, don't have access to intelligence and information available to the 'higher ups' Actions that are taken might seem wrong, barbaric even.
So any judgement we make is made at a very general level, often based on our own knowledge, values and background. What we sometimes don't appreciate is the 'walk a mile in my shoes' aspect of some of these conflicts. Put ourselves in the place of - -the Palestinian in Gaza or the West Bank who live in fear of what the Israelis might do next in terms of relocation for settlement...or worse, -the Israeli with some neighbours who don't believe in their right to exist and are constantly calling for that nation's destruction. -the Russian speaking Ukranian, with for all intents and purposes a Russian identity, and a wish to belong to that country who lives on or near the border. The Russian invasion would have seemed more like a liberation.
In any of those situations...and there are many more, our perspectives on right or wrong would change and actions we regard as wrong or barbaric would seem entirely justified if we actually lived those scenarios. They're the kind of situations we can't appreciate. We are in some repects protected by our isolation. Our foes aren't right next door, although that might not always be the case with a nation of 300 million just to our North -West Our alliances also put us in the firing line to some extent.
The Israelis are engaged at the moment on a bit of a mission to degrade all opposition...Palestine, Lebanon, Syria and now Iran. They don't do things by halves. They learned that from the 'very best' last century. Would these attacks have happened now if it wasn't for the events of October 7th. How many lives lost can be traced back to that event. Gaza may not have been a paradise for the people living there, with the constant threat of their Israeli neighbours...but it almost certainly wouldn't be the hell it's become. You have to wonder what the thinking was...did they expect neighbouring Arab countries to rise up in support. They certainly would have had no doubts about the 'shock and awe' Israeli reponse.
The Israeli's are no doubt hoping that once they're finished any threats will have largely been eliminated. Unfortunately, while the more apparent, obvious threats may be downgraded they will have spawned extra generations of hatred, who often resort to a more subtle but equally deadly and destructive forms of revenge.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: crashlander on June 18, 2025, 10:12:02 am
Iran and Israel have been fighting proxy wars for years; Iran backs almost anyone who hates Israel. Hammas, Hezbollah, the Houtis is Yemen, just to name a few. Being a theocracy, Iran does things no matter what their people may want.
That said, I wish Israel hadn't struck first. :(
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 18, 2025, 01:09:22 pm
This is about wealth, in the form of oil, gas, real-estate, etc., etc..
There is nobody from either side with the right to the high moral ground in this dispute, they are all gutter crawling.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: DJC on June 18, 2025, 01:15:31 pm
This is about wealth, in the form of oil, gas, real-estate, etc., etc..
There is nobody from either side with the right to the high moral ground in this dispute, they are all gutter crawling.
Yes, and it's the ordinary citizens on both sides who are bearing the brunt of the politicians' war.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Professer E on June 18, 2025, 01:18:16 pm
The actions of Israeli settlers have been particularly repulsive, certain aspects clearly underscore that this conflict is the usual "we want something that the other mob have, so we're gonna take it". Usual negative human actions- greed, coveting fhat of others etc
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 18, 2025, 01:22:26 pm
Iran and Israel have been fighting proxy wars for years; Iran backs almost anyone who hates Israel. Hammas, Hezbollah, the Houtis is Yemen, just to name a few. Being a theocracy, Iran does things no matter what their people may want.
That said, I wish Israel hadn't struck first. :(
Israel had no choice imo, when your enemies are building their nuclear capability to intimidate you it's better to engage in warfare that's conventional than wait for a nutcase on the other side to test out their fresh nuclear toys.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Thryleon on June 18, 2025, 01:40:03 pm
Feel free to offer feedback about the thread title too!
https://youtu.be/iIpfWORQWhU?si=R8YYsewd77ZVhw6n
:D
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: DJC on June 18, 2025, 02:01:02 pm
Tulsi Gabbard, US Director of National Intelligence, told Congress in March that the intelligence community “continues to assess that Iran is not building a nuclear weapon and Supreme Leader Khamenei has not authorized the nuclear weapons program he suspended in 2003.”
After the Iraq WMD fiasco, US intelligence pronouncements have to be treated cautiously but I suspect that Gabbard has a better handle on things than Taco. The latter seems to be more concerned about keeping in lockstep with Bibi than following authoritative advice and/or trying to end the conflict.
And Thry, I'd be running too if I came up with such a cheesy thread title ... but you did bring a smile to my dial :D
Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Thryleon on June 18, 2025, 02:07:54 pm
Now this is something that ive often had issues with. Generally speaking, here is a graph.
Iran do not feature on the list of nations possessing nuclear weapons.
Israel on the other hand, do.
Its fundamentally hypocritical to stop another nation from obtaining them if you have some.
Or does it matter which side is the goodies, and which are the baddies?
The fewer countries that have the bloody things the better.
If a countries leaders constantly sprout the elimination of your country and embark on a program that could result in them obtaining nuclear weapons, then the rules of 'fairness' and hypocrisy go out the window. You don't play fair. You use the advantage while you still possess it. You're going to do everything in your power and capability to make sure such a program doesn't progress.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 18, 2025, 05:13:04 pm
While those counts in the hundreds and thousands of warheads are alarming, the vast bulk of the listed weapons fall into the tactical nuclear weapons category. The real threat is the yield relative to the size of the device, they yield a similar level of devastation to massive conventional weapons but at a fraction of the size of a conventional weapon.
This means they can be deployed on missiles, cruise missiles, aircraft, even shells (artillery), etc., etc.. Also, the yield of a tactical weapon is typically variable, in that they can be "adjusted" over a wide yield range subject to the intended target. For example the bunker busters can yield from as low as 1 kiloton up to several tens of kilotons and be delivered deep into subterranean spaces.
It's not clear the types of weapons various states hold, the count itself is not so useful, it's unlikely the initial weapons of a new player would be tactical. They are more likely to be strategic requiring ICBMs or heavy bombers. I know that doesn't sound very comforting but it caps the useful range of most weapons in modern warfare, it's not at all clear how they would be reliably delivered.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Gointocarlton on June 18, 2025, 06:58:26 pm
All I'll say is that it's at times like this that I am glad we are 12,000km away. People in the region need to make snap decisions based on intel, these regions basically live on high alert. Fark that.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: DJC on June 18, 2025, 07:05:30 pm
Iran do not feature on the list of nations possessing nuclear weapons.
Israel on the other hand, do.
Its fundamentally hypocritical to stop another nation from obtaining them if you have some.
Or does it matter which side is the goodies, and which are the baddies?
The fewer countries that have the bloody things the better.
If a countries leaders constantly sprout the elimination of your country and embark on a program that could result in them obtaining nuclear weapons, then the rules of 'fairness' and hypocrisy go out the window. You don't play fair. You use the advantage while you still possess it. You're going to do everything in your power and capability to make sure such a program doesn't progress.
Even if the supposed best intelligence network says that the program doesn't exist?
I bet Ukraine is spitting chips that it gave up what was the world's third largest nuclear arsenal.
You're right though, no-one should have nuclear weapons, but I can't see that happening unless we produce a brand new crop of genuine leaders not wedded to 20th century ideologies and nationalism.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: madbluboy on June 18, 2025, 09:13:25 pm
Putin has offered himself to be peacemaker.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Gointocarlton on June 18, 2025, 09:16:49 pm
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: DJC on June 18, 2025, 11:05:01 pm
Iran is Russia’s source of drones for its war on Ukraine. It’s in Putin’s interests if Iran’s weapons manufacturing capacity isn’t diminished by the Israeli bombardment.
Until the recent transfer of US-supplied Patriot missile systems to Ukraine, Israel has refused to provide military aid to Ukraine or to impose sanctions on Russia.
Two of Tsar Vlad’s very few supporting nations are bombing the crap out of each other and it’s in his in interests to hose things down.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 18, 2025, 11:33:54 pm
Iran is Russia’s source of drones for its war on Ukraine. It’s in Putin’s interests if Iran’s weapons manufacturing capacity isn’t diminished by the Israeli bombardment.
Until the recent transfer of US-supplied Patriot missile systems to Ukraine, Israel has refused to provide military aid to Ukraine or to impose sanctions on Russia.
Two of Tsar Vlad’s very few supporting nations are bombing the crap out of each other and it’s in his in interests to hose things down.
Gets his ballistic missiles from Iran too, Putins recent Middle East forays havent been great having been booted out of Syria along with his puppet Assad with rebels now in charge who are backed by Turkey and the USA.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 19, 2025, 02:08:11 pm
Maybe I'm paranoid, but it looks fairly obvious to me that Russia, China and Nth Korea are barracking for RedTrump to involve the USA, and they are doing so by prodding the MAGA faithful to force RedTrump's into action!
But keep in mind, in terms of politics and funding, the bigger donor to the GOP or Democrats is AIPAC. AIPAC is the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, and they donate roughly 5x or10x more than other individuals or company! I think last election in total AIPAC donated US$350M, the next best was one of the big weapons companies that made about US$84M in donations, and there is a whole host of weapons companies in the top ten.
Interestingly, Musk does not appear on many lists, are his claims of huge donations bogus or are they so otherwise indirect they can't be measured? Would it be odd if a RedTrump ally issued bogus claims?
Of course that is now eclipsed by a US$600M aircraft! ;)
While all that is happening, RedTrump's focus on Iran is a convenient distraction to what is going on in the Indo-Pacific, just what China and Nth Korea would like!
btw., When you read all these numbers, $10M, $50M, $600M, it's really all chicken feed to wealthy nation states and huge multinationals. For example, Apple's 2024 advertising budget was US$7.2B
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 19, 2025, 03:26:16 pm
Maybe I'm paranoid, but it looks fairly obvious to me that Russia, China and Nth Korea are barracking for RedTrump to involve the USA, and they are doing so by prodding the MAGA faithful to force RedTrump's into action!
But keep in mind, in terms of politics and funding, the bigger donor to the GOP or Democrats is AIPAC. AIPAC is the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, and they donate roughly 5x or10x more than other individuals or company! I think last election in total AIPAC donated US$350M, the next best was one of the big weapons companies that made about US$84M in donations, and there is a whole host of weapons companies in the top ten.
Interestingly, Musk does not appear on many lists, are his claims of huge donations bogus or are they so otherwise indirect they can't be measured? Would it be odd if a RedTrump ally issued bogus claims?
Of course that is now eclipsed by a US$600M aircraft! ;)
While all that is happening, RedTrump's focus on Iran is a convenient distraction to what is going on in the Indo-Pacific, just what China and Nth Korea would like!
btw., When you read all these numbers, $10M, $50M, $600M, it's really all chicken feed to wealthy nation states and huge multinationals. For example, Apple's 2024 advertising budget was US$7.2B
The USA are involved officially or unofficially like always....they start, escalate conflicts and then leave when the damage is done , the repair bill then arrives and the refugees need a new home which is where the rest of the world have to come in and pick up the tab.Protect the oil fields at all costs and dont spill a drop is the USA battle cry, meanwhile we are paying double for our petrol, have doubled our detention centres, and the USA are claiming to have saved the day again.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Thryleon on June 19, 2025, 07:08:02 pm
I prefer to look at this as the ongoing stoush from history. Instead of a side winning and losing you have an arm wrestle that never ends.
Even when one side is down, and the other well and truly dominant the stoush will eventually blow up again, and all that changes is which people suffer along the way.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: shawny on June 19, 2025, 07:15:56 pm
Maybe I'm paranoid, but it looks fairly obvious to me that Russia, China and Nth Korea are barracking for RedTrump to involve the USA, and they are doing so by prodding the MAGA faithful to force RedTrump's into action!
But keep in mind, in terms of politics and funding, the bigger donor to the GOP or Democrats is AIPAC. AIPAC is the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, and they donate roughly 5x or10x more than other individuals or company! I think last election in total AIPAC donated US$350M, the next best was one of the big weapons companies that made about US$84M in donations, and there is a whole host of weapons companies in the top ten.
Interestingly, Musk does not appear on many lists, are his claims of huge donations bogus or are they so otherwise indirect they can't be measured? Would it be odd if a RedTrump ally issued bogus claims?
Of course that is now eclipsed by a US$600M aircraft! ;)
While all that is happening, RedTrump's focus on Iran is a convenient distraction to what is going on in the Indo-Pacific, just what China and Nth Korea would like!
btw., When you read all these numbers, $10M, $50M, $600M, it's really all chicken feed to wealthy nation states and huge multinationals. For example, Apple's 2024 advertising budget was US$7.2B
The USA are involved officially or unofficially like always....they start, escalate conflicts and then leave when the damage is done , the repair bill then arrives and the refugees need a new home which is where the rest of the world have to come in and pick up the tab.Protect the oil fields at all costs and dont spill a drop is the USA battle cry, meanwhile we are paying double for our petrol, have doubled our detention centres, and the USA are claiming to have saved the day again.
They are an necessary evil for us living in OZ.
While they are not the clean skin worlds policemen they like us to believe i would hate to imagine our future here without their backing. Regardless who is in power, both countries have been strong allies for a long time and while the reasons behind the relationship mostly favour them - when you have the land we do and then have an underwhelming defence force with no chance of defending a real threat - you have no option but to be someone's bitch.
It wouldn't take long to see our freedom here being challenged IMO if not for there ties to us.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 20, 2025, 12:51:04 pm
The USA are involved officially or unofficially like always....they start, escalate conflicts and then leave when the damage is done , the repair bill then arrives and the refugees need a new home which is where the rest of the world have to come in and pick up the tab.Protect the oil fields at all costs and dont spill a drop is the USA battle cry, meanwhile we are paying double for our petrol, have doubled our detention centres, and the USA are claiming to have saved the day again.
They are an necessary evil for us living in OZ.
While they are not the clean skin worlds policemen they like us to believe i would hate to imagine our future here without their backing. Regardless who is in power, both countries have been strong allies for a long time and while the reasons behind the relationship mostly favour them - when you have the land we do and then have an underwhelming defence force with no chance of defending a real threat - you have no option but to be someone's bitch.
It wouldn't take long to see our freedom here being challenged IMO if not for there ties to us.
Agree with all of that in theory Shawny and that's how it's been in the past but I don't trust the USA to hold up their end of any agreements unless it's affecting their bottom line or national interests. I'd rather see us spending more on defense and looking after our own backyard than relying on the USA to help us.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 20, 2025, 01:21:14 pm
Agree with all of that in theory Shawny and that's how it's been in the past but I don't trust the USA to hold up their end of any agreements unless it's affecting their bottom line or national interests.
I'd rather see us spending more on defense and looking after our own backyard than relying on the USA to help us.
RedTrump has made it clear, under his leadership help goes to the highest bidder, or the most profitable, he'll walk over your corpse for a coin, being an ally and having fought side by side throughout history means nothing to RedTrump.
We were one of the few countries to support the USA in the Gulf, my UK friends were embarrassed by the UK's lack of involvement. They questioned what it meant to be British, "If Australia was there how can it be we aren't?"
The people who fought, some who died, side by side with our own troops, aren't they some of the ones RedTrump called losers?
RedTrump called US Veterans losers, and his MAGA fans still think he'll come to their rescue! :o
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Thryleon on June 21, 2025, 08:27:30 am
Has anyone done any research into exploding tactical nukes in their bunkers and nuclear fallout vs them exploding as part of a weapon?
I.e. lets pretend Iran has said nukes, what is the projected impact of bombing it before its launched vs what the projected fallout is from deployment.
Obviously the nation receiving said nukes is better off, but there's no guarantee it's actually launched. Meanwhile, if it gets blown up whilst in its underground bunker, there is a guarantee it goes off. Are thr Israelis and USA playing a dangerous game with a nuclear arsenal they dont have a good understanding of? What if there is a worse impact from this action of striking first than there would be from not?
India and Pakistan have nukes. They may use them against each other they probably won't. Anyone who launches one sits in crazy territory to me. They will end life as we know it for their own squabble and reminds me of the bully destroying toys in the mode of, "If I cant have one, you cant either and ill wreck it for you" except this way most of the world suffers.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Professer E on June 21, 2025, 09:31:35 am
It's already been done. The poms blew up a warhead at Maralinga in the 50s, we were still picking up highly radioactive debris until recently. Cost us hundreds of millions, killed countless regional South Australians with bizarre cancers. The scary thing is attacking a working nuclear power plant, that will explode if the control and cooling system is rendered inoperable. I can't believe the Israelis would be reckless enough to even contemplate that, they should be considered a rogue state if they did. PS I believe warheads deteriorate over time, something about the tritium decaying to deuterium which dampens the chain reaction, also there's a complex Li metal hydride that is an enhancer that has a limited shelf life. Wondered why Li has been in the news lately? It's not just an EV battery component.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 21, 2025, 10:11:15 am
Russia shelled Ukraines Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant before Ukraine abandoned it to safeguard any further damage. Israel have also targeted Irans only Nuclear Power facility which is run by Russian staff and forced them to abandon the facility to prevent further attacks. The transmission infrastructure is usually the main target but it's a fine line in terms of accuracy and a disaster waiting to happen.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 21, 2025, 01:11:54 pm
The failure mechanisms and risks are very specific to the type of facility or device, most of what gets discussed in media are generalisations from worst case scenarios for specific types of device or facility.
If you destroyed a large scale SolarPV farm with conventional munitions, the dust from some rather nasty trace elements used in the manufacture of SolarPV would be as deadly if not even more deadly and toxic than radioisotopes. The same applies to grid scale batteries and battery fires.
In Australia, most of the weird detections of radioactive isotopes possibly correlated to cancers come from the French nuclear testing regime. I say possibly because the connection / correlation is pretty weak, in that thyroid cancers are often found with radioactive isotopes associated with nuclear testing but the reality is nearly all of us who lived through that era will test positive to some isotope associated with testing yet most won't even develop a correlated disease. The trace isotopes are so common around the globe earth sciences now use that layer as a date marker.
The reality is, if you live in a building, have a basement, sub floor or below ground enclosed space in your home, you are already exposed to far more radioactivity from radium gases than you'll ever get from nuclear testing or even medical imaging.
A lot of people involved in mining in states like SA and WA want to claim their ill health is a result of nuclear testing, I suppose it suits the lawyers. Reality is the outback is littered with natural sources of radioactive isotopes, and as soon as you start digging they are in the air, in dust storms and watering holes, our wide brown land is trying it's best to kill us.
That's not making an excuse for nuclear testing, it shouldn't be done and nuclear weapons should be illegal, but we should not be generalising the risk of nuclear energy in the same category.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Professer E on June 21, 2025, 02:41:15 pm
Read up on some history mate, atomising 8 kg of weapons grade fissionable material wasn't good for anybody. Why do you think water tanks were banned across SA for a long period?
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 21, 2025, 03:50:55 pm
This isn't a debate about whether something is good or bad, it's a debate / discussion I made about relative risk.
For example; Smoke detectors commonly use americium 241, it's present in the amount of a microgram or so and has a half life of only 432 years. Most have many such devices in their home, and the occupants get more radioactive isotope exposure from those detectors than all the nuclear testing ever conducted collectively.
Uranium used for weapons has a half life of 700 million to 4.3 billion of years dependant on the 235 or 238 split isotope, that determines how long it takes for half of any quantity to emit decay via an alpha particle(typically a helium nucleus). Suspensions in water are typically measured in picograms.
While you wouldn't swallow a small amount of any such material deliberately, the chance of direct harm by accidentally consuming some is vastly overstated relative to exposure to other natural sources of radioactive elements or toxic chemicals.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 22, 2025, 02:04:22 pm
Trump and the USA enter the conflict between Israel and Iran by bombing Fordow and associated sites which is no surprise, Im presuming we will have a rise in terrorist attacks given Iran wont be able to do much on the conventional warfare front to hit back. https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world/trump-says-iran-strikes-spectacular-military-success-and-warns-bully-iran-to-make-peace-or-face-greater-attacks/ar-AA1HaEZf?ocid=winp2fptaskbarhover&cvid=90f3385e21284febd21efc1258a9becb&ei=8
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: tonyo on June 22, 2025, 02:40:53 pm
Gotta love the Trump tweet - talking about the successful bombing raid on Fordow, and ends with (in capital letters) NOW IS THE TIME FOR PEACE.
That's a novel way to commence diplomatic discussions.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Thryleon on June 22, 2025, 03:34:31 pm
Imagine punching someone and then labelling them the bully for retaliating.
In my lifetime (since 82) the USA has been involved in more conflict in the middle east than Carlton has been premierships.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: kruddler on June 22, 2025, 05:22:17 pm
Imagine punching someone and then labelling them the bully for retaliating.
In my lifetime (since 82) the USA has been involved in more conflict in the middle east than Carlton has been premierships.
There was some stat which i will bastardise, but you'll get the point.
In 240-odd years, America has been at war with 1 country or another for at least 1 day of that calandar year for 230-odd of those years.
US are the biggest bullies but have a very good propaganda machine. I mean, its so good they got trump elected.....twice!
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Thryleon on June 22, 2025, 07:08:31 pm
No doubt krudd. I want to highlight that their work is a somewhat necessary evil at times and they play a proxy role of world police, but this latest one is just an abject joke. They dont even hide that they push their own agenda. As soon as Iran threatened to block oil off the USA went to bomb the place.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: crashlander on June 22, 2025, 08:15:09 pm
I do wonder about the thoughts that went through Trump's head (assuming there were some). [1] smarter men with better understandings of world politics have faced similar situations (and more reason or need) and decided NOT to get directly involved. Yet, Donald goes in first first. [2] Trump's election promise was not to get into another 'Forever War'. [3] It would be nice to see the end of the Islamic Republic of Iran (which is neither particularly Islamic nor a republic), but what happens if the government does fall? I don't see whoever rises from the rubble being a better world citizen that the present bunch. Old maxim: when a regime is replaced by force, the successor state is usually very similar to one it replaces, even if their stated ideology is totally different. Example: Czarist Russia & the Soyuz Sovietsky Socialisti Replubliki.
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 22, 2025, 10:58:17 pm
MAGA is self-destructing now, a faint stench of anti-Semitism helped MAGA in it's foundation, and now RedTrump is assisting Israel.
They are so conflicted, they no longer know who to hate!
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: Lods on June 24, 2025, 09:32:50 pm
Donald's not happy. He's going for the Nobel and folks aren't helping. Reckon's Israel and Iran have been fighting so long that "they don't know what the Fck they're doing"
Title: Re: Iran, I ran so far away - flock of seagulls
Post by: LP on June 25, 2025, 07:48:05 pm
So RedTrump claims the bunker busters dropped on Iran were bigger than Hiroshima!