Princes Park => Robert Heatley Stand => Topic started by: crashlander on June 18, 2026, 09:20:01 pm
Title: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 18, 2026, 09:20:01 pm
The 2's play GWS at their home at 12:15 on Saturday. It is unlikely that all of the Emergencies will play. Flynn Young back gives the 2's a target they haven't really had of late.
I think Reidy is back. Ollie Hollands will play his first VFL game for a while, but we will miss Ben Camporeale, who has a minor hamstring. Lucas may well play: he is available. We really need some leadership out there, as our last few weeks have been pretty ordinary. Saad and Cottrell not providing a huge amount.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 19, 2026, 07:23:34 pm
Our line-up:
B: M. Duffy (41), L. Young (33), D. Harvey (61) HB: H. Charleson (28), J. Boyd (37), A. Saad (42) C: L. Camporeale (21), O. Hollands (4), C. Vickery (59) HF: L. Fogarty (8), D. Hogg (70), Z. Williams (6) F: A. Moir (43), H. O'Keeffe (40), F. Young (45) R: F. Riley (38), C. Chesser (31), C. Lord (36) INT: S. Paea (66), T. Logan (68), L. Prout (74), C. Cotter (72), L. Farrar (75) 23rd Player: C. Cotter (72) EMG: O. Badr (53), W. Cookson (77), J. Sammartino (58), A. Davey (57), T. Evans (67), J. Rule (65), T. Gresham (78), W. Reinhold (60)
IN: L. Camporeale, C. Cotter, O. Hollands, F. Young OUT: M. Cottrell (AFL), B. Camporeale (hamstring), O. Warburton (wrist), J. Sammartino (omitted) NEW: Charlie Cotter, 19, 178cm, Uni Blues/Claremont
[1] I thought Reidy might have been fit, but he's clearly not come up. As at least one of the senior Emergencies won't play, that could be interesting.
[2] Nice to Lucas C back. Hopefully he is all over his injury.
[3] 15 listed players. Hopefully we can come back to something like form, as the last couple of weeks have been pretty ordinary.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: LP on June 20, 2026, 01:00:01 pm
Looking like a cricket score, against us, we look so small and light compared to GWS.
So far early in the 2nd Qtr we are seeing the worthless nature of winning taps without 2nd efforts, 23:1 in our favour, but clearances are roughly 50:50 and the scoreboard is all theirs! In this regard, Riley is miles off, and it highlights the difference between genuine worthwhile rucks stats and basic counting.
What Riley needs to do is follow up his tap work with clever positioning, to help prevent GWS pegging and forcing turnovers from his team-mates, and to also buy his fellow midfielders time and space to dispose effectively. But at the moment he's a worthless beanpole not unlike others we've had in the past, he's just a spectator after the tap, not positioning, no blocking, when he gets in the way half the time it's in the way of his own team. It's like we've never heard of the word shepherd, when we play like this we are roadkill!
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Lods on June 20, 2026, 01:38:13 pm
Only just tuned in but one thing I didn't expect to see was the leading possession winner is Ashton Moir :o The big question is "Have they been impactful?"
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: LP on June 20, 2026, 02:07:50 pm
Fans worry about the AFL, but 1/3 of our list plays VFL each week and in the absence of one or two who make an effort we are almost toothless.
I don't get it, we got a bit of a rise for a few weeks when Voss was kyboshed, but now it's back to business as usual.
Does it say something about the mindset of our list?
Today's AFL game will be a real tell, I hope I am wrong but I fear the worst. If after this we are smashed today in the AFL, it almost certainly confirms that the tail wags the dog, ............... still!
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 20, 2026, 02:12:03 pm
Got one back, but at 59 points, it really is an ordinary showing.
Flynn Riley is dominating: he has twice the number of taps than the other 3 rucks combined, and O'Keefe is 2nd by the length of the straight. But we're not getting the clearances and we're not doing anything when we get one.
Got one back, but at 59 points, it really is an ordinary showing.
To me it's not so much the scoreline, it's the manner of the defeat, to call it listless would be an understatement.
It reeks of players who have zero pride in performance, the well paid mercenary who quits in the face of the opponent they aren't certain to defeat.
All I want each week is a group that has a crack, I can accept not winning but I can't accept this, especially from some players that I know have the capability to be much better.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 20, 2026, 02:24:14 pm
2 quick goals, but this one is all over. Still Paea and Cookson had to get them. Much better that the opposite.
Make that 3: Liam Farrar does the deed.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 20, 2026, 02:27:15 pm
Comeback didn't last long. 2 to GWS.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 20, 2026, 02:37:40 pm
Got one back, but at 59 points, it really is an ordinary showing.
To me it's not so much the scoreline, it's the manner of the defeat, to call it listless would be an understatement.
It reeks of players who have zero pride in performance, the well paid mercenary who quits in the face of the opponent they aren't certain to defeat.
All I want each week is a group that has a crack, I can accept not winning but I can't accept this, especially from some players that I know have the capability to be much better.
Agree, a few of the older players know its over career wise and couldnt be bothered. GWS dont have a lot of big names in their team either which makes it more disappointing. Riley has had a million hitouts to nothing but has had zero impact on the game. Hollands and Williams probably our best imho.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Lods on June 20, 2026, 02:38:27 pm
Riley's getting plenty of the taps but seriously...he's not rucking to Cripps, Walsh, Smith and Hewett . He's not even rucking to all our second string extractors with Ben C missing.
Will this be an indicator to the senior game. We'll know in a couple of hours, but making judgements on the AFL team who haven't even played and the VFL team missing quite a few is probably a bit harsh.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Lods on June 20, 2026, 02:41:55 pm
I wouldn't be surprised if a few of our older guys know they are for the chop. Did Boyd get injured early on?
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 20, 2026, 02:43:45 pm
Boyd was injured. Arm? Shoulder? Moir hasn't had a possession this quarter.
GWS putting the foot down now. Very ugly.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 20, 2026, 02:51:31 pm
Charlie Cotter gets his first goal. Congratulations, lad.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: crashlander on June 20, 2026, 02:59:16 pm
Carlton: 12 - 14 - 86 GWS: 24 - 11 - 155
We managed 6 goals in the last (as did GWS). Ollie Hollands: 25 possessions, 6 tackles, 3 clearances Darcy Hogg: 25 possessions, 2 tackles, 5 clearances Harry Charleson: 22 possessions, 3 tackles, 1 clearance - his 2nd half was better statistically. Zac Williams: 21 possessions, 3 tackles, 2 clearances Ashton Moir: 20 possessions, 0 tackles, 3 clearances Cooper Lord: 20 Possessions, 3 tackles, 4 clearances, 1 goal 1. Flynn Riley: 18 possessions, 53 taps, 11 clearances, 2 marks
Not a lot else.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: LP on June 20, 2026, 03:23:00 pm
Riley's getting plenty of the taps but seriously...he's not rucking to Cripps, Walsh, Smith and Hewett . He's not even rucking to all our second string extractors with Ben C missing.
Will this be an indicator to the senior game. We'll know in a couple of hours, but making judgements on the AFL team who haven't even played and the VFL team missing quite a few is probably a bit harsh.
When you win the tap so often, even by dead chance you should be able to influence the next contest 50% of the time, he's not even going at chance!
He wins the tap, at least sometimes he taps where he planned to tap, and yet he is effectively zero in the follow up efforts. At least a few times he should have been first to the footy, or at least lay a tackle when GWS sharked it! 53 Hit Outs, we are smashed in clearances and Riley had 0 tackles, you can't even do that by accident. Was he coached not to touch anybody? :o
That's not a comment about him long term, but it's a clear statement about how far off he is and how foolish it is for fans to be calling for him to play seniors!
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Lods on June 20, 2026, 03:28:24 pm
I missed a lot today. Moir seemed to be playing in defence. The question is are we doing that to add extra strings to his bow or is it an attempt to see what else he offers prior to putting him on the trade table.
He's contracted until 2027 but I reckon there might be a club who would pay a reasonable price thinking that they could make a better fist of developing him. South Australian... so one of the Crows or Power might have an interest.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: LP on June 20, 2026, 03:30:16 pm
Moir seemed to be playing in defence. The question is are we doing that to add extra strings to his bow or is it an attempt to see what else he offers prior to putting him on the trade table.
Just thin on the ground.
That's not a problem, the problem as I see it is the way the defeat occurred not the why it happened.
It's only halfway through the season, and we look like we've finished up early, getting in the holiday plans before the end of season rush maybe!
btw., Whether this stat is accurate or not matters little but it confirms the vision and the style of the game. We had 64 hit outs to 5, but they had 8 tackles to 0, who do you think had more influence? They won about 50% of stoppages yet our dominating rucks had zero tackles, zero, I can't even fathom this!
I mean, you'd expect rucks being rucks that even by chance they would have tripped over their own feet and fell on a ball carrying opponent!
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Lods on June 20, 2026, 03:39:43 pm
Riley's getting plenty of the taps but seriously...he's not rucking to Cripps, Walsh, Smith and Hewett . He's not even rucking to all our second string extractors with Ben C missing.
Will this be an indicator to the senior game. We'll know in a couple of hours, but making judgements on the AFL team who haven't even played and the VFL team missing quite a few is probably a bit harsh.
When you win the tap so often, even by dead chance you should be able to influence the next contest 50% of the time, he's not even going at chance!
He wins the tap, at least sometimes he taps where he planned to tap, and yet he is effectively zero in the follow up efforts. At least a few times he should have been first to the footy, or at least lay a tackle when GWS sharked it! 53 Hit Outs, we are smashed in clearances and Riley had 0 tackles, you can't even do that by accident. Was he coached not to touch anybody? :o
That's not a comment about him long term, but it's a clear statement about how far off he is and how foolish it is for fans to be calling for him to play seniors!
As I've said I haven't seen a lot of the game...but 53 touches to 5 by the opposition means that he's winning half the battle....he's getting first touch. It's probably more of an indictment of our lack of midfield depth and support. However "follow-up and impact"...seems to be an area where he was lacking today. That's funny because one of the things I first noticed about him 'back when'....was that he did do that follow up work. It's what got me first interested. It may have been something that has drifted out of his game...and he needs to regain it before decision making time. I'm not sure we'll hang on to four ruckmen. I'll have to try and grab a replay.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Lods on June 20, 2026, 03:52:27 pm
I have to bow to the criticism because I didn't see much of the game
But looking at good old stats.... :D If I was just looking at the stats 19 disposals isn't bad. He only had two marks, so much of the ball would have been earned in contest. And he had more clearances than anyone else on the ground...that could just be volume.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: kruddler on June 20, 2026, 04:03:47 pm
When you win the tap so often, even by dead chance you should be able to influence the next contest 50% of the time, he's not even going at chance!
He wins the tap, at least sometimes he taps where he planned to tap, and yet he is effectively zero in the follow up efforts. At least a few times he should have been first to the footy, or at least lay a tackle when GWS sharked it! 53 Hit Outs, we are smashed in clearances and Riley had 0 tackles, you can't even do that by accident. Was he coached not to touch anybody? :o
That's not a comment about him long term, but it's a clear statement about how far off he is and how foolish it is for fans to be calling for him to play seniors!
As I've said I haven't seen a lot of the game...but 53 touches to 5 by the opposition means that he's winning half the battle....he's getting first touch. It's probably more of an indictment of our lack of midfield depth and support. However "follow-up and impact"...seems to be an area where he was lacking today. That's funny because one of the things I first noticed about him 'back when'....was that he did do that follow up work. It's what got me first interested. It may have been something that has drifted out of his game...and he needs to regain it before decision making time. I'm not sure we'll hang on to four ruckmen. I'll have to try and grab a replay.
First things first......if that stat doesn't backup how useless that stat is, then you will never be swayed.
Yes, first touch on it is good.....but what if first touch goes to the opposition? Is it still good.
Over the years of looking through stats, there was an example that actually showed, statistically speaking, you were more likely to get a clearance from an opposition ruck, than your own. Now i can't remember the details, but some rucks were uselss as getting a hitout to advantage and some rucks hit to the opposition more than their own team.
Nah i didn't see any of it today, but that could very much be the case to help explain the result.
Personally, when i think we have the upper hand in these scenarios, your best bet is hitting it outside the stoppage and into space. Communicating to your teammates in advance where that will be. That is the way you benefit from hitouts. Not simply dropping it at your feet all the time.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Milhanna13 on June 20, 2026, 04:53:13 pm
Surely there is something there with Riley- ok taps aren’t worth everything, but jeez that’s a lot of them, if we can teach him to use the better, surely he could be a weapon. A decent amount of touches as well. There must be something there
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: LP on June 20, 2026, 06:27:28 pm
Even by accident, if you had 50+ taps, eventually you have to find yourself in a position to lay one tackle. This is 50+ taps at VFL level. The kids was tapping the footy cleanly in front of himself and stopping like it was job done.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Professer E on June 20, 2026, 10:06:05 pm
Losing by that margin, with so many senior listed players, is a very poor. Pretty clear who is getting the lemon and sars at the end of year.
Title: Re: VFL Rd 13 2026 Carlton vs GWS in Sydney
Post by: Baggers on June 21, 2026, 08:51:46 am
Surely there is something there with Riley- ok taps aren’t worth everything, but jeez that’s a lot of them, if we can teach him to use the better, surely he could be a weapon. A decent amount of touches as well. There must be something there
Probably the only potential positive from that dreadful disappointment of a game. Yes, Moir got a lot of the aggot roaming around down back but a lot were easy possessions. Seems to want to be a mark and kick kinda guy, without wanting to put his body on the line? Undoubted skills, but endeavour still has a ?