If only Kemp could kick straight. Obviously doing well in some respects but can't be kicking at goal like he is.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 20, 2026, 07:19:09 pm
Not bad from crap list with holes everywhere.
Sorry couldnt help myself.
Had some crapfull umpiring atrocious kicking for goal, played them on their home patch had them them claw back a 5 goal lead and still ran over them.
And played a bunch of kids on a very talented forward line without Weitering.
Amazing the difference when players have a system they can clearly see works and all buy in, they all know there role, cover for one another and play as a team.
Fraser is making the coaching decision harder as each win is notched.
Scotch time 🤓
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: PaulP on June 20, 2026, 07:51:20 pm
5 in a row. Sweeeet.
Those foundations that Voss laid are rock solid.
Not the best game of footy, but a wonderful effort and well done to all concerned.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: townsendcalling on June 20, 2026, 08:21:45 pm
A couple of observations: Saad and Williams are purely break glass in case of emergency. Never underestimate the influence of Newman or the work ethic of Acres. Derksen is a more than adequate backup as a key defender. Harry Dean will push Jagga for the Rising Star..... and that's saying something. (The only time Cadman threatened was when Dean was off.) Our 3 imports took a number of weeks to find their place, but they are now adding a new dimension to the team, including a bit of 'extrovertivness'which we lacked before. Harry loves being second ruck. A fit Sam Walsh is a dangerous Sam Walsh. Take on Byrne at your own peril. Mc Govern is still a valuable swingman. The captain obviously doesn't like it when people doubt him!
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Gointocarlton on June 20, 2026, 08:32:15 pm
Bula from Fiji Never a doubt
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: kruddler on June 20, 2026, 08:43:48 pm
Not the best game of footy, but a wonderful effort and well done to all concerned.
Something that Fraser backed up, yet again, in the pre-match interview.
For the second week in a row we won without playing great. Both weeks we've played worse than we did against Brisbane, but the difference in opposition talent/performance made the difference.
Still need to work on our kicking, both inside 50 and at goal.
It will cost us a game, again, unless we clean that up. I thought from the 3rd to halfway through the 4th it was as bad as its been all year.
Just need to keep the pressure up and results will continue. Still got to target some decent tall forwards in the up coming trade and draft period. Kemp at 1.5 needs to get comfortable in front of goal. Harry is better off playing up the ground and being 2nd ruck. Gov is a good swingman but not a long term option.
Besides an underperforming HOK, we don't have any other options. Need to fill this hole this off-season as a priority.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 20, 2026, 08:48:50 pm
If there was no or even little improvement to the horrible W/L, we would have heard ‘see its the weak horrible list and nothing to do with the coach’
Yet we change coaches to an untried interim coach and break a record in the process by winning 5 zip and ‘its on the back of Voss ground work’
You get much more credibility to just admit the change in coach has made a huge difference rather then doubling down with every win as with each win the evidence that Voss was not the right man is further enhanced.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: kruddler on June 20, 2026, 08:53:43 pm
If there was no or even little improvement to the horrible W/L, we would have heard ‘see its the weak horrible list and nothing to do with the coach’
Yet we change coaches to an untried interim coach and break a record in the process by winning 5 zip and ‘its on the back of Voss ground work’
You get much more credibility to just admit the change in coach has made a huge difference rather then doubling down with every win as with each win the evidence that Voss was not the right man is further enhanced.
Have you not heard Fraser, repeatedly, as well as Jagga, Crippa etc etc etc say the exact same thing. We are just working on the foundations that Voss built. We haven't changed much. The tide had turned under Voss already we just weren't getting the reward.
But sure, you know better than the 'genius coach' himself.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 20, 2026, 09:05:55 pm
If there was no or even little improvement to the horrible W/L, we would have heard ‘see its the weak horrible list and nothing to do with the coach’
Yet we change coaches to an untried interim coach and break a record in the process by winning 5 zip and ‘its on the back of Voss ground work’
You get much more credibility to just admit the change in coach has made a huge difference rather then doubling down with every win as with each win the evidence that Voss was not the right man is further enhanced.
Have you not heard Fraser, repeatedly, as well as Jagga, Crippa etc etc etc say the exact same thing. We are just working on the foundations that Voss built. We haven't changed much. The tide had turned under Voss already we just weren't getting the reward.
But sure, you know better than the 'genius coach' himself.
i look at the scoreboard.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: rocky on June 20, 2026, 09:54:12 pm
Will get in my votes, but HUGE shout out to Cowan. Really, really good game. Maybe his best for the year?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 20, 2026, 10:04:52 pm
For the second week in a row we won without playing great. Both weeks we've played worse than we did against Brisbane, but the difference in opposition talent/performance made the difference.
Is that the same Brisbane that had 14 goals kicked against them in a quarter by the very outfit we beat today. The result today flattered them. Time to let go of the comparisons.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Thryleon on June 20, 2026, 10:21:21 pm
5 in a row is some achievement. I left Melbourne on may 30.
The club needs to start talking to my employer and funding my overseas adventures.
Last time I went, was 2023 in June....
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: laj on June 21, 2026, 02:04:05 am
5 in a row is some achievement. I left Melbourne on may 30.
The club needs to start talking to my employer and funding my overseas adventures.
Last time I went, was 2023 in June....
I went OS in June 2024, I watched us flog Rich on my phone in Rome in front of the Colosseum. We were 2 or 3rd that stage. The day I landed back in Melb we played Haw and got knocked out of the 8.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Gointocarlton on June 21, 2026, 06:09:28 am
I think the “focus on one week at time” thing was awfully clever and the correct thing to do. Week to week is ALL they should be looking at.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 21, 2026, 06:45:25 am
Maybe give him one more week, but it's probably time for Ison to have a week or two back in the VFL. Just as a developmental thing. He's struggled a bit the last few weeks. Let him go back and get a bit of confidence and a few possessions.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 21, 2026, 07:01:30 am
Welcome back Cottrell
https://www.facebook.com/reel/1571066917937090
https://www.facebook.com/reel/1570883747985879
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: LP on June 21, 2026, 07:09:36 am
Maybe give him one more week, but it's probably time for Ison to have a week or two back in the VFL. Just as a developmental thing. He's struggled a bit the last few weeks. Let him go back and get a bit of confidence and a few possessions.
Weiters in, Ison out?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 21, 2026, 07:12:12 am
The burning question for me all year has been....
"What does Frankie Evans have to do to get a free kick" ::)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: kruddler on June 21, 2026, 07:14:16 am
Maybe give him one more week, but it's probably time for Ison to have a week or two back in the VFL. Just as a developmental thing. He's struggled a bit the last few weeks. Let him go back and get a bit of confidence and a few possessions.
Weiters in, Ison out?
Weiters for derkson.
Moir for ison.
Those 2 play similar and possibly fighting for the same spot. They also seem to be up and down in terms of form at opposing times.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: laj on June 21, 2026, 07:24:38 am
5 in a row is some achievement. I left Melbourne on may 30.
The club needs to start talking to my employer and funding my overseas adventures.
Last time I went, was 2023 in June....
I went OS in June 2024, I watched us flog Rich on my phone in Rome in front of the Colosseum. We were 2 or 3rd that stage. The day I landed back in Melb we played Haw and got knocked out of the 8.
I'm the reverse. When I travel we get the sh it kicked out of us....lol.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Baggers on June 21, 2026, 08:47:20 am
Maybe give him one more week, but it's probably time for Ison to have a week or two back in the VFL. Just as a developmental thing. He's struggled a bit the last few weeks. Let him go back and get a bit of confidence and a few possessions.
Weiters in, Ison out?
The Derk doesn't deserve to be dropped... Perhaps Weiters in, Ison back to the Magoos and The Derk up forward to replace Ison?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Gointocarlton on June 21, 2026, 09:05:02 am
Maybe give him one more week, but it's probably time for Ison to have a week or two back in the VFL. Just as a developmental thing. He's struggled a bit the last few weeks. Let him go back and get a bit of confidence and a few possessions.
Me personally, I'm leaving him in. He (and Byrne, Dean) have something we have been lacking for years, kent. Give them good long runs in the 1's I reckon, their confidence will come when given the challenge and having faith put on them. The team has grown in confidence and together, they have worked out how to get themselves out of the pickle they were in the first 7 or 8 rounds. Ison and Byrne need to dragged along in all that. We have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Just my opinion, its neither right, wrong or what the MC will do neccessarily.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Professer E on June 21, 2026, 09:31:36 am
Liked Dean not taking crap from Greene, who is looking at a holiday if the MRO has any consistency at all. I reckon Greene is all but out the door to the Cats- I posit that a few senior types at GWS aren't buying what's been sold. They're a bazillion times better than losing at home to us by 4 goals (should have been 10).
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: RiverRat on June 21, 2026, 09:53:37 am
The Derk doesn't deserve to be dropped... Perhaps Weiters in, Ison back to the Magoos and The Derk up forward to replace Ison?
Derksen looks like he belongs and does not deserve to be dropped but he lacks a few inches against taller opponents. If Weiters is back, giving him a look up forward should be on the table as an option.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 21, 2026, 09:59:37 am
How long has it been since we had blokes that either have a touch of Kent or that SA in your face style?
Dean, Cowan, Bryne, Cottrell, Ainsworth, Newman, Haywood all have it
Add in the mid field bulls we have and finally we are no longer as EB filled with too many 'Von Trapp' types and its working.
Also isn't Dean an absolute bloody ripper. In his first season has to be an outside chance to be in 40 man AA squad. Is never beaten and has not had the support of Weitering and still gets it done. Should win the rising star if form continues.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 21, 2026, 10:03:01 am
The MC all of sudden is making the right decisions.......Funny that
Playing last years B@F, Keeping faith with the kids by giving them a decent block of games, no automatic inclusions to the likes of Hollands, Saad, Williams.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: madbluboy on June 21, 2026, 11:31:01 am
Cottrell played earlier in the season and was poor.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 21, 2026, 11:38:57 am
Derksen looks like he belongs and does not deserve to be dropped but he lacks a few inches against taller opponents. If Weiters is back, giving him a look up forward should be on the table as an option.
Yesterday they had Gov floating back into D50, in Ison's absence I'd leave Gov in F50 and leave Derksen in besides Weiters.
Fraser is a bit more tolerant than the fans and quite a bit calmer, I suspect he might persist with the kid for another game or two before he rotates the crew. The thing forcing the MC's hand might be the good form of Derksen.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: madbluboy on June 21, 2026, 11:50:27 am
Don't you think it's more than a coincidence these poor decisions stopped when Fraser took over.
Cottrell had two bouts of injury, and started the season off the back of interrupted pre-season, so he was always going to be a player who needed games under his belt to get into the season. Most of us were stating as much before the seasoning opener.
AFL / VFL didn't really make much difference.
As for that strut, that's the way to display it to put you in the proper mindset, when you're there act like you belong there and deliver it cold.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Sexybronco on June 21, 2026, 11:52:40 am
Akso Hewett’s omission from the team in the first part of this season remains the most perplexing decision I’ve seen from the club in a long time.
Based on his form now versus his form earlier you had to say it was the right decision. He might not have liked it, some fans might not have liked it, but it looks like it's exactly what he needed to get back to his best.
FWIW, it looks like the VFL stint has done Acres wonders as well, funny how not being automatically selected brings some effort.
Maybe some of the list had forgotten about the privilege of playing AFL, they were just expecting to play! ;)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: LP on June 21, 2026, 12:07:04 pm
I have to reiterate this because it's obvious and yet ignored.
The current good form of Cripps and Walsh is a direct consequence of the players around them making an effort. Instead of standing back waiting to benefit from what Cripps and Walsh do, the players around them are now rolling up their sleeves and helping out more which gets Cripps and Walsh to the end of games in much better condition. That, along with confidence in execution, is the real reason for the current 4-Qtr efforts, not some invisible change of game plan.
We are playing the exact same style that we did from Rnd 0, the difference is we are now making less mistakes at it and sharing the load. Our better players aren't hitting the wall at the end of the game, and the lapses are diminished. It's the same game plan the Lions play, and even with the Lions you can see how it can go horrible wrong when it's left to few.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Micky0 on June 21, 2026, 12:14:21 pm
The difference Ive noticed is that they’re not second guessing themselves and Crippa said post match if they make an error they dont dwell on it they just keep going.
I didnt pick them to win this one as that Bombers game was ugly - but if course rapt they did. Love Cow and Dean - agree re Ison maybe going back to VFL for a bit… just not getting to it, seems slightly off the pace. Loving Byrne too, ferocious tackling.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 21, 2026, 12:14:59 pm
Don't you think it's more than a coincidence these poor decisions stopped when Fraser took over.
I think they wrote the season off and didn't risk injured or unfit players. Which they shouldn't have in the first place.
i dont understand MBB - you just said he was played injured now youre saying they didnt risk injured players cause they wrote season off ??
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Micky0 on June 21, 2026, 01:00:27 pm
Regardless of why you cannot say that changing the coach has not worked - i am Team Voss but there was obviously something there which meant the foundations if laid, could not be built upon.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 21, 2026, 01:27:57 pm
Regardless of why you cannot say that changing the coach has not worked - i am Team Voss but there was obviously something there which meant the foundations if laid, could not be built upon.
spot on
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: kruddler on June 21, 2026, 01:28:07 pm
Don't you think it's more than a coincidence these poor decisions stopped when Fraser took over.
Akso Hewett’s omission from the team in the first part of this season remains the most perplexing decision I’ve seen from the club in a long time.
Vossy was the one who brought Hewett back into the side. Vossy was the one who played Dean and Jagga from day 1. Vossy was the one who brought in Wilson. Vossy was the one who played Harry as 2nd ruck.
Vossy was the one who did 99% of what Fraser is getting credit for.
I've got no issue with Fraser and what he is doing....and what he did previously with the bullants etc. But lets there is a lot of attempting to rewrite history going on. When Fraser took over, we were ranked with the easiest (or 2nd easiest) draw coming up through the middle part of the season. He has been good since he come on board, but right place and right time play a huge part in that.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: PaulP on June 21, 2026, 01:28:31 pm
Regardless of why you cannot say that changing the coach has not worked - i am Team Voss but there was obviously something there which meant the foundations if laid, could not be built upon.
It has worked, but not IMO, for the reasons given. I suspect it's more in the psychological space. Pressure's off, the media is off our case, Elijah and 2nd half lapses are distant memories. Everyone is having fun and enjoying the caretaker head space. Fraser is definitely pulling the right levers IMO, and he certainly deserves full credit for that.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: cookie2 on June 21, 2026, 01:38:20 pm
I am guessing that there were issues/differences of opinion between Vossy and at least some of the players. Something has definitely changed, we play with so much more belief and authority. It’s remarkable and refreshing.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Thryleon on June 21, 2026, 01:45:04 pm
Regardless of why you cannot say that changing the coach has not worked - i am Team Voss but there was obviously something there which meant the foundations if laid, could not be built upon.
It has worked, but not IMO, for the reasons given. I suspect it's more in the psychological space. Pressure's off, the media is off our case, Elijah and 2nd half lapses are distant memories. Everyone is having fun and enjoying the caretaker head space. Fraser is definitely pulling the right levers IMO, and he certainly deserves full credit for that.
the weight of expectation is gone too.
Our season turned around when we all accepted it was gone which allows the players to play woth more freedom.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: PaulP on June 21, 2026, 01:51:26 pm
Akso Hewett’s omission from the team in the first part of this season remains the most perplexing decision I’ve seen from the club in a long time.
Vossy was the one who brought Hewett back into the side. Vossy was the one who played Dean and Jagga from day 1. Vossy was the one who brought in Wilson. Vossy was the one who played Harry as 2nd ruck.
Vossy was the one who did 99% of what Fraser is getting credit for.
I've got no issue with Fraser and what he is doing....and what he did previously with the bullants etc. But lets there is a lot of attempting to rewrite history going on. When Fraser took over, we were ranked with the easiest (or 2nd easiest) draw coming up through the middle part of the season. He has been good since he come on board, but right place and right time play a huge part in that.
Vossy also had us at 1-8.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: laj on June 21, 2026, 03:58:03 pm
The difference Ive noticed is that they’re not second guessing themselves and Crippa said post match if they make an error they dont dwell on it they just keep going.
I didnt pick them to win this one as that Bombers game was ugly - but if course rapt they did. Love Cow and Dean - agree re Ison maybe going back to VFL for a bit… just not getting to it, seems slightly off the pace. Loving Byrne too, ferocious tackling.
Neither did I. It's the only one I have wrong....lol.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: laj on June 21, 2026, 04:29:47 pm
If we don't manage to bugger up the next 2 games you'd hope we sit in 10th. At least for now it's a nice ride so happy to enjoy it while it keeps going.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: DJC on June 21, 2026, 06:17:20 pm
Vossy was the one who brought Hewett back into the side. Vossy was the one who played Dean and Jagga from day 1. Vossy was the one who brought in Wilson. Vossy was the one who played Harry as 2nd ruck.
Vossy was the one who did 99% of what Fraser is getting credit for.
I've got no issue with Fraser and what he is doing....and what he did previously with the bullants etc. But lets there is a lot of attempting to rewrite history going on. When Fraser took over, we were ranked with the easiest (or 2nd easiest) draw coming up through the middle part of the season. He has been good since he come on board, but right place and right time play a huge part in that.
There's also the integration of our VFL and AFL squads that Jordan Russell gave Vossy credit for in his interview last week.
Then there's the fact that the coach, whether it's Vossy or Fraser, doesn't select the team himself but is one voice, admittedly a loud one, on the match committee.
There's no doubt that Fraser is doing a great job but, as he and others freely admit, it's on the back of the foundations Vossy and the other members of the coaching panel built.
I hope that Fraser sticks to his guns and continues to rule himself out of the top job. Another Teague Train debacle could be be terminal for players, supporters and the club.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: DJC on June 21, 2026, 06:26:01 pm
An interesting observation from one of the commentators last night was along the lines of the GWS defenders being under more when we bombed high kicks inside 50.
Apart from taking marks inside 50, we were able to bring the ball to ground where good crumbing and manic defensive efforts created scoring opportunities. Unfortunately, we didn't capitalise on that and missed far too many simle shots at goal.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: tex on June 21, 2026, 06:46:25 pm
With both Lij and Ollie out - do we need them back?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: laj on June 21, 2026, 07:40:05 pm
Vossy was the one who brought Hewett back into the side. Vossy was the one who played Dean and Jagga from day 1. Vossy was the one who brought in Wilson. Vossy was the one who played Harry as 2nd ruck.
Vossy was the one who did 99% of what Fraser is getting credit for.
I've got no issue with Fraser and what he is doing....and what he did previously with the bullants etc. But lets there is a lot of attempting to rewrite history going on. When Fraser took over, we were ranked with the easiest (or 2nd easiest) draw coming up through the middle part of the season. He has been good since he come on board, but right place and right time play a huge part in that.
There's also the integration of our VFL and AFL squads that Jordan Russell gave Vossy credit for in his interview last week.
Then there's the fact that the coach, whether it's Vossy or Fraser, doesn't select the team himself but is one voice, admittedly a loud one, on the match committee.
There's no doubt that Fraser is doing a great job but, as he and others freely admit, it's on the back of the foundations Vossy and the other members of the coaching panel built.
I hope that Fraser sticks to his guns and continues to rule himself out of the top job. Another Teague Train debacle could be be terminal for players, supporters and the club.
We could look at Teague who was an interim that didn't work, or look at Ratten going back, that did work, going 0-7 tanking 7 games in his interim year. Not every circumstance is the same.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 21, 2026, 10:23:00 pm
If Fraser continues on his winning ways I just don't think he could stay at the club next year if he's not the senior coach. A new coach will have a new approach. One that will differ from what is currently having success. If Voss has created a foundation and Fraser is continuing it as many argue, with success. How is it possible for a new coach to come in with the spectre of a successful Fraser in the background. An experienced coach like Longmire might get away with it. A new inexperienced coach with the teething problems that entails won't have much of a chance if they don't notch up wins from the start...and Fraser is waiting in the wings.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Professer E on June 22, 2026, 07:27:42 am
Rewatched the game, a few things stood out for me in this game;
Umpiring. I just don't understand so many calls, even worse are the awful missed calls. Dreadful delivery into F50 by both sides. Park football stuff. Woeful goal kicking... We kick from angles far too often but we waste so many set shots. Talor needs to nail the few chances he gets and he ain't. Thirty metres out should be simple. Our marking targets McG- Kemp-Harry are an issue. Harry plays better up the ground, Kemp can't finish reliably and McG is barely going. If Derkson is going to make it he needs a kicking coach...he lays back on every kick and its heart in mouth stuff every time as a result. Cerra's lack of pace and current "third wheel status" in the midfield - going to get squeezed out I reckon. There was an amazing contest between Ainsworth and a Giants mid in the square, both players went real hard and it was great....I shudder to think about Jagga slammed like that.. He is still very small and light and it was really obvious against the likes of Stone, Callaghan, Daniels etc
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: LP on June 22, 2026, 09:04:27 pm
I shudder to think about Jagga slammed like that.. He is still very small and light and it was really obvious against the likes of Stone, Callaghan, Daniels etc
50 to 75 games is all it takes.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: blueboys_1 on June 23, 2026, 11:37:14 am
I am guessing that there were issues/differences of opinion between Vossy and at least some of the players. Something has definitely changed, we play with so much more belief and authority. It’s remarkable and refreshing.
Mentally I think they are so much more on point. I have only seen a few games this season and for one reason or another what I noticed was that you could see there heads drop if something didn't go to plan. You could feel it at the ground. Now watching them there like bulls at a gate wanting to gang tackle and applying immense pressure on the opposition. So maybe the fresh voice along with a couple of tweaks to the game plan the players have responded. The players keep harping on about how they have been trying to play this way all year and now its working. Don't they say that football is 90% above the shoulders?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 23, 2026, 01:14:23 pm
If folks want to make comparisons between Voss and Fraser look don't look at recent history. Look at the last half of 2023 and now. Same/same
That 2023 run we built on the back of relentless pressure and effort, double teaming in tackles. We lost our way in 2024- 2025. A lot of that was the result of injury and in 2025 off-field disaffection and division. That pressure and effort...and belief is back now.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: kruddler on June 23, 2026, 04:55:11 pm
If folks want to make comparisons between Voss and Fraser look don't look at recent history. Look at the last half of 2023 and now. Same/same
That 2023 run we built on the back of relentless pressure and effort, double teaming in tackles. We lost our way in 2024- 2025. A lot of that was the result of injury and in 2025 off-field disaffection and division. That pressure and effort...and belief is back now.
You know what else is the same??? A fit Patrick Cripps.
Was he fit at the start of the year? No. Walsh? No.
Makes a difference when your good players are fit. Who'd have thunk it?!
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 23, 2026, 05:05:22 pm
AFLCA votes for Round 15: 8 - Patrick Cripps (CARL) 8 - George Hewett (CARL) 8 - Sam Walsh (CARL) 4 - Jagga Smith (CARL) 1 - Nick Haynes (CARL) 1 - Nic Newman (CARL)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Shakin77 on June 23, 2026, 05:23:37 pm
Rewatched the game, a few things stood out for me in this game;
Umpiring. I just don't understand so many calls, even worse are the awful missed calls. Dreadful delivery into F50 by both sides. Park football stuff. Woeful goal kicking... We kick from angles far too often but we waste so many set shots. Talor needs to nail the few chances he gets and he ain't. Thirty metres out should be simple. Our marking targets McG- Kemp-Harry are an issue. Harry plays better up the ground, Kemp can't finish reliably and McG is barely going. If Derkson is going to make it he needs a kicking coach...he lays back on every kick and its heart in mouth stuff every time as a result. Cerra's lack of pace and current "third wheel status" in the midfield - going to get squeezed out I reckon. There was an amazing contest between Ainsworth and a Giants mid in the square, both players went real hard and it was great....I shudder to think about Jagga slammed like that.. He is still very small and light and it was really obvious against the likes of Stone, Callaghan, Daniels etc
Cerra has gone out to a wing. No CBA's for the last 4 weeks. Not getting as much of it as he was but I thought he was pretty tidy on the weekend.
He has made way for Hewett
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: RiverRat on June 23, 2026, 06:23:54 pm
If folks want to make comparisons between Voss and Fraser look don't look at recent history. Look at the last half of 2023 and now. Same/same
That 2023 run we built on the back of relentless pressure and effort, double teaming in tackles. We lost our way in 2024- 2025. A lot of that was the result of injury and in 2025 off-field disaffection and division. That pressure and effort...and belief is back now.
You know what else is the same??? A fit Patrick Cripps.
Was he fit at the start of the year? No. Walsh? No.
Makes a difference when your good players are fit. Who'd have thunk it?!
The same pattern evolved when Teague was coach - Cripps was injured in 2021 (only 5 votes in the Brownlow) and Curnow only played the last few games of the season - The next year Cripps won the Brownlow, Curnow kicked 64 goals and we recruited Hewitt and Cerra - How good a coach was Voss? Did Teague get any credit for player development?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: ElwoodBlues1 on June 23, 2026, 06:35:45 pm
Fit or not fit we are heavily dependent on Cripps still and to a lesser extent Walsh if they dont play well we still struggle. Its not healthy moving forward and not sustainable imho, Bulldogs have the same problem with Bont having to be in the best players on the ground each week for them to win.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 23, 2026, 06:53:21 pm
Fit or not fit we are heavily dependent on Cripps still and to a lesser extent Walsh if they dont play well we still struggle. Its not healthy moving forward and not sustainable imho, Bulldogs have the same problem with Bont having to be in the best players on the ground each week for them to win.
Agree but think we are improving in this space. While there is no doubt Cripps and Walsh hitting form we are harder to beat i feel we are building more strings to our bow.
Dean, Jagga, Cowan, Wilson, Ainsworth and Haywood have all been great this year and made us a more even list
Weitering was another that needed to play for us to win but we seem less reliant on him too.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: LP on June 23, 2026, 09:58:00 pm
The next year Cripps won the Brownlow, Curnow kicked 64 goals and we recruited Hewitt and Cerra - How good a coach was Voss? Did Teague get any credit for player development?
Of course he did, at least he did from anyone not blinded by hate or rage.
Did Teague return, no, will Voss return, no, does Voss deserve some credit, absolutely he does!
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: LP on June 23, 2026, 10:01:16 pm
All players suffer it to some degree, it's a consequence of increased scrutiny.
Picking Daicos as an exception doesn't work as his worst year statistically was his 2nd season, so he isn't one of the handful of exceptions. Nick Daicos career to date on FinalSiren (https://finalsiren.com/PlayerStats.asp?PlayerID=3132)
But my comment is more about the stupid things fans blame on the coach. (Actually, they are right to blame a coach, just that they blame the wrong coach, it's the opposition coach who is at fault!)
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 24, 2026, 10:01:46 am
All players suffer it to some degree, it's a consequence of increased scrutiny.
Picking Daicos as an exception doesn't work as his worst year statistically was his 2nd season, so he isn't one of the handful of exceptions. Nick Daicos career to date on FinalSiren (https://finalsiren.com/PlayerStats.asp?PlayerID=3132)
But my comment is more about the stupid things fans blame on the coach. (Actually, they are right to blame a coach, just that they blame the wrong coach, it's the opposition coach who is at fault!)
Are you reading that table upside down? His second year was better than his first.
Brownlow votes 2022-11 2023-28
AV disposals 2022- 25.8 2023- 31
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: ratlice on June 24, 2026, 10:42:27 am
All players suffer it to some degree, it's a consequence of increased scrutiny.
Picking Daicos as an exception doesn't work as his worst year statistically was his 2nd season, so he isn't one of the handful of exceptions. Nick Daicos career to date on FinalSiren (https://finalsiren.com/PlayerStats.asp?PlayerID=3132)
But my comment is more about the stupid things fans blame on the coach. (Actually, they are right to blame a coach, just that they blame the wrong coach, it's the opposition coach who is at fault!)
Crippa's first season was a write off but he was Rising Star runner up in his second season. He didn't really suffer from second year blues until his seventh season. The Bont's second year blues hasn't happened yet.
Dean and Smith, by their performances and importance to our team, have made themselves the objects of as much scrutiny now as they will get next season or throughout their careers.
Some players may well experience a physical and/or emotional speedbump in their second season but the idea of a universal second year blues malady has no basis in fact.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: kruddler on June 24, 2026, 12:14:19 pm
People talking about 2nd year blues are just guessing. We'll know soon enough.
But every year i say the same thing when evaluating our chances. Some kids won't come on as expected, or even go backwards. Some older players will decline in output, some may even fall of a performance cliff and/or retire early. Some gun players will get injured.
Happens to everyone, every year. Whether thats Jagga and Dean, or Byrne and Ison.....or whoever. This year O'Keeffe definitely fits that bill.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: DJC on June 24, 2026, 12:46:54 pm
I have to reiterate this because it's obvious and yet ignored.
The current good form of Cripps and Walsh is a direct consequence of the players around them making an effort. Instead of standing back waiting to benefit from what Cripps and Walsh do, the players around them are now rolling up their sleeves and helping out more which gets Cripps and Walsh to the end of games in much better condition. That, along with confidence in execution, is the real reason for the current 4-Qtr efforts, not some invisible change of game plan.
We are playing the exact same style that we did from Rnd 0, the difference is we are now making less mistakes at it and sharing the load. Our better players aren't hitting the wall at the end of the game, and the lapses are diminished. It's the same game plan the Lions play, and even with the Lions you can see how it can go horrible wrong when it's left to few.
While I wouldn't say that we had players standing back, I think that the improved form and effort of the support cast in Hewett, Acres, Cerra, Aisworth, Hayward, and now Cottrell, has taken pressure off Cripps and Walsh. If Cripps or Walsh is quiet, others are filling the void but that support is also enabling Cripps and Walsh, as well as Jagga Smith, to accumulate possessions and distribute the pill effectively.
Cottrell's ability to get to contest after contest and affect the outcomes of those contests is elite. I don't think that he'll ever by a high possession player but his work rate, endurance and ability to snag a goal or two is invaluable ... and then there's his gob iron :)
I don't that there's any question about Billy Wilson's ability to have an impact at AFL level now, and I think that he has probably consigned Adam Saad to depth player status. Billy's chase and run down tackle with 30 seconds to go warmed the cockles of my heart. That's the effort and desperation that wins finals.
Harry Dean's ability to hold down a KPD spot, even in the absence of Weiters, has probably exceeded my fairly high expectations. You know that he's not going to lose many contests, even against the best key forwards. Then there's his willingness to fly the flag for his teammates. I wonder how Toby Greene felt when he was ragdolled by an 18 year old.
Harry's equally inexperienced fellow KPD in Wade Derksen has also exceeded my expectations and has shown that he's more than capable at AFL level. His lack of experience shows at times but his ability to intercept and spoil is right up there. Some folk have concerns about his lack of height but he's on a par with Dean and Weiters. It would seem inevitable that Weiters will replace Derksen but the latter will be stiff to miss out. Maybe he should get a shot as a forward :-\
I was on board with Thry's prediction that Ainsworth would the best of our trade-ins but I think that Hayward has just shaded him now, and Florent is not far behind. The ability, aggression and attitude that those three have added to the team is really starting to pay dividends.
Brodie Kemp's ability to win the ball inside 50 was a real bright spot but his kicking for goal is reminiscent of Levi Casboult at his worst. His field kicking is good but his technique is all over the shop when he lines up for goal. The "experts" will tell you that kicking for goal is the one aspect of the game that has never improved and Kemp is living proof. I'm reminded of a Nathan Burke anecdote. He thought that having his AFLW players just concentrate on the goals might help so he had the behind posts removed for training. It made no difference at all to their accuracy. Anyway, a goal kicking coach for Kemp is a must.
Lods suggested that it might be time for Jack Ison to refresh with a run in the Magoos. I'm not to sure about that. While he may not be getting much of the pill, he is tackling and his tackles stick. I'm more concerned about Byrner, but he is also contributing to our forward pressure. Like Kemp, he needs to work on his goal kicking.
I wasn't confident going into the game, particularly without Weiters, but it was a good win even if our poor kicking for goal reduced the margin.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: kruddler on June 24, 2026, 01:00:27 pm
While I wouldn't say that we had players standing back, I think that the improved form and effort of the support cast in Hewett, Acres, Cerra, Aisworth, Hayward, and now Cottrell, has taken pressure off Cripps and Walsh. If Cripps or Walsh is quiet, others are filling the void but that support is also enabling Cripps and Walsh, as well as Jagga Smith, to accumulate possessions and distribute the pill effectively.
Cripps' form is scary when compared to the teams performance
Have a look at the following breakdown of team with Cripps possessions in that game in brackets.
Our worst 2 games for the year IMO would be... Sydney (19 touches) St. Kilda. (14).
Our best games of the year would be IMO GWS (33) Port Adelaide (32) Geelong (30) Brisbane (32) Fremantle (32) Richmond (32) Bulldogs (29)
While I wouldn't say that we had players standing back, I think that the improved form and effort of the support cast in Hewett, Acres, Cerra, Aisworth, Hayward, and now Cottrell, has taken pressure off Cripps and Walsh. If Cripps or Walsh is quiet, others are filling the void but that support is also enabling Cripps and Walsh, as well as Jagga Smith, to accumulate possessions and distribute the pill effectively.
Cripps' form is scary when compared to the teams performance
Have a look at the following breakdown of team with Cripps possessions in that game in brackets.
Our worst 2 games for the year IMO would be... Sydney (19 touches) St. Kilda. (14).
Our best games of the year would be IMO GWS (33) Port Adelaide (32) Geelong (30) Brisbane (32) Fremantle (32) Richmond (32) Bulldogs (29)
Thats the point I have been making yep others have improved but imo its all down to Cripps and to a lesser extent Walsh returning to their best. The timing of the improvement is also confusing for me, why did the change of coach prompt such a massive form reversal and ability to run out games. I dont buy its all the new Fraser game style/methodology etc etc ...Cripps couldnt run out of sight on a dark night under Voss but under Fraser is bobbing up as the matchwinner late games under Fraser and is in brownlow form.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: DJC on June 24, 2026, 02:28:30 pm
You shouldn’t take Cripps and Walsh’s performances in isolation.
Their best performances are when the support cast is firing.
You may debate which is the cause and which is the effect and, to a certain extent, it’s a feedback loop. However, my observations are that Cripps and Walsh are riding on the wave of support from their teammates.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: DJC on June 24, 2026, 03:02:41 pm
People talking about 2nd year blues are just guessing. We'll know soon enough.
But every year i say the same thing when evaluating our chances. Some kids won't come on as expected, or even go backwards. Some older players will decline in output, some may even fall of a performance cliff and/or retire early. Some gun players will get injured.
Happens to everyone, every year. Whether thats Jagga and Dean, or Byrne and Ison.....or whoever. This year O'Keeffe definitely fits that bill.
Skull has the added burden of being set for a new role and one that may not entirely suit his skill set.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 24, 2026, 03:03:34 pm
You shouldn’t take Cripps and Walsh’s performances in isolation.
Their best performances are when the support cast is firing.
You may debate which is the cause and which is the effect and, to a certain extent, it’s a feedback loop. However, my observations are that Cripps and Walsh are riding on the wave of support from their teammates.
^ This. If the players around him aren't contributing then the job of Cripps becomes that much harder.
It is easier for the opposition to nullify him....because their own jobs aren't difficult and they can lend a hand. But if they're tied up with their Carlton opponents it gives an opportunity for Cripps to get off the leash. At the moment a few of our 'big dogs' are loose.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: Lods on June 24, 2026, 03:35:53 pm
I don't think that there's any question about Billy Wilson's ability to have an impact at AFL level now, and I think that he has probably consigned Adam Saad to depth player status. Billy's chase and run down tackle with 30 seconds to go warmed the cockles of my heart. That's the effort and desperation that wins finals.
I'm a Billy Wilson fan.
I like his work ethic. He provides pace and link work coming out of defence and has a pretty good boot on him. His run-down tackle late in the game on the weekend was sensational, occurring when it did. His pace allows him to do those run-downs.
But if I was to identify a weakness in his game it's probably the front-on tackle. It's an issue that will probably be addressed with extra strength and experience but just at the moment he does find it difficult to contain players running straight at him.
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: shawny on June 25, 2026, 09:15:52 am
While I wouldn't say that we had players standing back, I think that the improved form and effort of the support cast in Hewett, Acres, Cerra, Aisworth, Hayward, and now Cottrell, has taken pressure off Cripps and Walsh. If Cripps or Walsh is quiet, others are filling the void but that support is also enabling Cripps and Walsh, as well as Jagga Smith, to accumulate possessions and distribute the pill effectively.
Cripps' form is scary when compared to the teams performance
Have a look at the following breakdown of team with Cripps possessions in that game in brackets.
Our worst 2 games for the year IMO would be... Sydney (19 touches) St. Kilda. (14).
Our best games of the year would be IMO GWS (33) Port Adelaide (32) Geelong (30) Brisbane (32) WE LOST Fremantle (32) WE LOST Richmond (32) Bulldogs (29)
Average/poor performances against.... Melbourne (21) North Melbourne (21) Adelaide (29) 29 touches and WE LOST Collingwood (25) Essendon (23)
Coincidence??
No Cripps. No Carlton
You wanted to trade him when the whole list was playing well below their standard earlier in the year then we get on a roll after a coach change (pure coincidence of course) and now we can't win without him. Clearly there is more to this then simply No Cripps no Carlton. And if you want to credit all the wins to Cripps playing well not sure what happened in the 4 games when he had over 25 touches and we still lost?
He is dual brownlow medalist and still a top 3 inside bull and along with all the top tier players who naturally have a big influence on the result when they fire - Heeney, Daicos, Bont, Jackson, Dawson, Gawn, Smith are all in that basket so do all those teams fall into the same line of thinking?
Title: Re: AFL Rd 15 2026 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS
Post by: LP on June 25, 2026, 02:12:13 pm
Cripps' form is scary when compared to the teams performance
Have a look at the following breakdown of team with Cripps possessions in that game in brackets.
Our worst 2 games for the year IMO would be... Sydney (19 touches) St. Kilda. (14).
Our best games of the year would be IMO GWS (33) Port Adelaide (32) Geelong (30) Brisbane (32) WE LOST Fremantle (32) WE LOST Richmond (32) Bulldogs (29)
Average/poor performances against.... Melbourne (21) North Melbourne (21) Adelaide (29) 29 touches and WE LOST Collingwood (25) Essendon (23)
Coincidence??
No Cripps. No Carlton
You wanted to trade him when the whole list was playing well below their standard earlier in the year then we get on a roll after a coach change (pure coincidence of course) and now we can't win without him. Clearly there is more to this then simply No Cripps no Carlton. And if you want to credit all the wins to Cripps playing well not sure what happened in the 4 games when he had over 25 touches and we still lost?
He is dual brownlow medalist and still a top 3 inside bull and along with all the top tier players who naturally have a big influence on the result when they fire - Heeney, Daicos, Bont, Jackson, Dawson, Gawn, Smith are all in that basket so do all those teams fall into the same line of thinking?
Maybe i still want to trade him. Whats that got to do with it? Never said he can't play. You gotta give up something to get something.
20-25 touches these days is the old 17 touches. For a dual brownlow medalist, you'd take that if you were the opposition.