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Topic: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain (Read 76090 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #150 –
Quote from: laj – on
In reality though it's a real "who cares". Not sure why we are wasting so much air and newspaper space on something so minor and trivial.

Firstly, it incites the crowd, nobody wants it to end badly, and we all want to feel safe at the football!

Secondly, people seeing through the hypocrisy of Goodes, Ch.7 and the AFL. Do they really think this was Haka like, seriously?

Finally, why did Ch.7 imply Carlton fans were being ejected because of some clash that lead to Goodes exhibitionist behavior, like that would be a justification for what happened!

In many countries scoring celebrations are restricted because they incite the crowd. NFL bans or fines players for excessive or exhibitionist celebrations, soccer has greatly wound back the scoring celebrations, particularly in regards to approaching the crowd.

It seems in this regard rugby(League and Union) has the high moral ground, for in rugby the primary form of interaction with the crowd is to thank them for the attendance and support(As opposed to indicating that they are not welcome!) Rugby knows where it's bread gets buttered, and it isn't about to turn on those who pay their wages!

All this episode has proven is that Goodes is a goose, does he really think complaining about being booed is going to make it better, as far as opposition fans go they have him on toast now!

PS: Does Yarran, Smith, Jetta, Walker, Rioli, Franklin, etc., etc., etc.. get booed. If there were so many racists in the AFL crowds why would they discriminate? As an accusation racism just doesn't hold water!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #151 –
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PotXGpd_owg

Remember this from Micky O'Loughlin? It was great and the look on that Eagles supporters face was priceless.  :))

Are we getting a bit too precious about Goodes? Time to move on.
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #152 –
Quote from: LP – on
PS: Does Yarran, Smith, Jetta, Walker, Rioli, Franklin, etc., etc., etc.. get booed. If there were so many racists in the AFL crowds why would they discriminate? As an accusation racism just doesn't hold water!

They don't openly criticise those who are racist. Goodes does. He's been the same player throughout his career but has only been booed from the time he has done this.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #153 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots – on
Hey BN, I tried to show you respect but this post is littered with insults and written/edited after Crashlander said no more. You realise that's a sure sign of someone losing the debate? Indigenous dance in Indigenous round, only an idiot would suggest it's the wrong time and place. ;)

Wrong Carrots, I know that the time shown of my last edit shows it was edited after Crash posted, however as you can see, the actual post appeared before he posted. My edit was only about correcting spelling mistakes.

Once again, for reasons that have become obvious to me, and yes, this will probably be seen by you as an insult,  is that there is a light on but no one is home. You make up your mind on an issue, and no matter how logical anyone else's point may be, you just totally lack the comprehension to understand it, let alone accept it.

Once again you say "Indigenous dance in Indigenous round, only an idiot would suggest it's the wrong time and place."

I understand that I'm trying to have a reasonable discussion with someone bereft of reason, however, I will give it one more shot.

Unless you are a complete racist, no one could possibly have a problem with AG expressing his Aboriginal heritage by doing his "war dance".

The fact that you are unable to comprehend that the time that he did it, after kicking a goal half way through the second quarter, and the place that he did it, in front of the Carlton supporters who, by his own words were totally respectful of him up to that point in time, says to me, that you have no comprehension of the meaning of the word, tact. And, that you have no comprehension of the meaning of the word respect for other peoples feelings and views.

You see Carrots, we all have our views on life. And we all have different views. We are so fortunate to be living in a Democracy that allows us, provided we do not incite people to violence or commit terrorist acts, to express those views freely. 

However, with freedom comes great responsibility, and we all need to be considerate of other peoples feelings when expressing those views.  You may say, that I haven't been considerate of your feelings when expressing mine, and perhaps you are correct, so for that I apologise.

Adam Goodes used the freedom that is available to him to express himself on a day, and in a round of football which celebrates our original Indigenous Australians.

However, he did what I and many people are guilty of doing, and, hopefully, will not do again. He did not consider the feelings of those before whom he was performing his war dance.

I reckon that if the announcer at the ground would have said that when the Swans run out on the ground, Adam and his co Indigenous players will be performing an Aboriginal war dance similar to a Haka to celebrate Indigenous round, and they will perform this in front of the Swans cheer squad, followed by a performance in front of the Carlton cheer squad, as I said, unless you were a died in the wool racist, no one could possibly have objected.

Furthermore, I reckon it would have been great to see them do it in front of the Carlton players, and then, if the Carlton players in Yarran and Walker knew how to do it, they could have returned the compliment.

Now, If, after all that the Carlton cheer squad would have booed Goodes and his fellow Indegenous team mates, I would have lead the charge to condemn them.

But Goodes allowed his ego to take the place of reason.

And the result has been the discussion that has taken up pages in our newspapers and TV programs and has polarized the community.

Goodes had a perfect opportunity to make a statement about his and all Indigenous players heritage, which would have left a magnificent impression on us all, and who knows, perhaps changed the view of some of our more bigoted Australians.

As I said, CarrotTs, time and place. Only an idiot wouldn't understand what that means. ;)

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #154 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots – on
They don't openly criticise those who are racist. Goodes does. He's been the same player throughout his career but has only been booed from the time he has done this.

Not true, the booing started a year or two after his 2006 Brownlow when he got caught clearly staging for a free kick on video.

Then a couple of years back Hawthorn started booing Goodes because he nearly wrecked one of their defenders by sliding into him feet first.

The current booing issue has only recently gained momentum because of the stuff Goodes does. In my opinion Adam Goodes is the beat up merchant. Why he is doing it I cannot know, but perhaps he wants you to think the booing is about race because it is less embarrassing than if it's about staging!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #155 –
Quote from: bignic – on
Wrong Carrots, I know that the time shown of my last edit shows it was edited after Crash posted, however as you can see, the actual post appeared before he posted. My edit was only about correcting spelling mistakes.

Absolute lies. Your initial post was one line. I stopped reading here FYI. Save your veiled insults for someone that takes you seriously.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!
 

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #156 –
@BN

That idea of the pre game war dance is a great one BN. It should be picked up by the AFL for next year, I'm sure it would be a popular one - as long as it's not directed against the paying customers of course.
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #157 –
Quote from: LP – on
Not true, the booing started a year or two after his 2006 Brownlow when he got caught clearly staging for a free kick on video.

Then a couple of years back Hawthorn started booing Goodes because he nearly wrecked one of their defenders by sliding into him feet first.

The current booing issue has only recently gained momentum because of the stuff Goodes does. In my opinion Adam Goodes is the beat up merchant. Why he is doing it I cannot know, but perhaps he wants you to think the booing is about race because it is less embarrassing than if it's about staging!

But other players stage all the time as well and they don't get booed.

I have never said every booee is racist, I have said a portion of them are, as well as a portion of Australians are racist. I think that we can all agree on.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #158 –
In term of this specific situation, I'm not bothered by the dance itself. What bothers me is the post hoc rationalism that he uses after the fact. "A warrior representing my people." Oh really ? I thought he was an elite, highly paid, highly pampered, sportsperson / entertainer representing a particular club.  

If he'd come out and said that he lost his head a little, gave the CFC fans a bit of a razz up, and they did the same in return, maybe it would have ended there.

As with all men on a mission, he can get ahead of himself sometimes.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #159 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots – on
Absolute lies. Your initial post was one line. I stopped reading here FYI. Save your veiled insults for someone that takes you seriously.

Oh that. I got rid of that within a minute or two after I posted it, and decided to write a new longer post.

That longer post was still originally posted before Crash's. Open your eyes and look at the time it was posted.

If you don't want to believe that, that's up to you.

You have, lived up to my expectations and, I can tell you, the expectations of others that post on here, Carrots.

Unfortunately, you have what I term a cement brain.  Once you have made up your mind about something, you totally lack the ability to reconsider your opinion, or consider that another view may be correct, or even accept that the person with whom you are debating, actually agrees with one part of your argument, Indigenous dance on Indigenous day, but has a different view as to how and when the dance should have taken place.

I hope for your sake and your future employment prospects, or business prospects, that you manage to rid yourself of that cement brain.

I have seen it before, that even in some very successful people, their success is short term, as the cement brain comes to the fore and effects their decision making and their relationship with their co-workers or employees.

If nothing else, this discussion has confirmed our opinion that it is a total waste of time trying to have a reasoned debate with you.

I won't fall for the same trap in the future.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #161 –
Quote from: LP – on
Firstly, it incites the crowd, nobody wants it to end badly, and we all want to feel safe at the football!

Secondly, people seeing through the hypocrisy of Goodes, Ch.7 and the AFL. Do they really think this was Haka like, seriously?

Finally, why did Ch.7 imply Carlton fans were being ejected because of some clash that lead to Goodes exhibitionist behavior, like that would be a justification for what happened!

In many countries scoring celebrations are restricted because they incite the crowd. NFL bans or fines players for excessive or exhibitionist celebrations, soccer has greatly wound back the scoring celebrations, particularly in regards to approaching the crowd.

It seems in this regard rugby(League and Union) has the high moral ground, for in rugby the primary form of interaction with the crowd is to thank them for the attendance and support(As opposed to indicating that they are not welcome!) Rugby knows where it's bread gets buttered, and it isn't about to turn on those who pay their wages!

All this episode has proven is that Goodes is a goose, does he really think complaining about being booed is going to make it better, as far as opposition fans go they have him on toast now!

PS: Does Yarran, Smith, Jetta, Walker, Rioli, Franklin, etc., etc., etc.. get booed. If there were so many racists in the AFL crowds why would they discriminate? As an accusation racism just doesn't hold water!

Like I said, who cares. Waste of airtime and space. Not at all important. Didn't incite anything and never going to. Gets booed, whoppy doodle doo.

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #162 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots – on
But other players stage all the time as well and they don't get booed.

I have never said every booee is racist, I have said a portion of them are, as well as a portion of Australians are racist. I think that we can all agree on.

Yes they do!

Goodes is no different from any/every other person, he is not special in any way, shape or form!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #163 –
Good Bloke Goodes
Thought his war dance was good, he would get a good mark for a Maori Haka.
It was not aborigine. No Way.
But he has had injury,
lots of pressure on him,
nearing the end of his career.
hamming up a bit.
I hope enjoyed the stir

ps if he was playing for Carlton I would have thought it highly appropriate

Re: Round 9: Carlton vs. Sydney Post Game Pain

Reply #164 –
Quote from: LP – on
Yes they do!

Goodes is no different from any/every other person, he is not special in any way, shape or form!

He was Australian of the Year, surely that makes him just a little bit different than the rest of us.
The only thing in this world worth more than a hill of beans is the Carlton Football Club.