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Topic: Trumpled (Alternative Leading) (Read 854457 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2730 –
Amazing: Trump supporters were betting big on Trump to win even after the vote count was swinging towards Biden:
Quote
Late that night, Fox News called Arizona for Biden, and Nevada started looking good for him, too. Overnight, new batches of mail ballots made Biden the clear favorite in Wisconsin and Michigan and suggested he was on a good pace in Pennsylvania. By the morning, Biden was a heavy favorite all over the market. And by 2:30 p.m. Eastern on Thursday, two days after the vote, Biden was -1100 and Trump was +575 at Bovada.

Through it all, Morrow said a huge majority of the money bet at his site remained on Trump—including “3- or 4-to-1” on Trump after the election.
How Offshore Oddsmakers Made a Killing off Gullible Trump Supporters, Slate. Click HERE

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2731 –
Stupid is as stupid does!

I heard a radio commentary that claimed a bunch of GOP Senators or other high profile movers and shakers are rallying against the vaccinations, on the basis that there are some potential deadly side-effects for some. While COVID is just a cold I suppose, .......... except for some! ::)

FYI, in the USA the COVID Death rate is hovering around 1.8%, 310K deaths from 17M cases, the serious long term effects(months to forever) of COVID cases hovers around 10%. This can range from rheumatic / arthritic effects, diminished smell, impaired vision or impaired hearing to heart or lung damage and even quadriplegia.

So far it's too early to tell, but the vaccination death rate is so far smaller than 0.01%, the long term side effect of specific COVID vaccines obviously cannot be determined yet as it is too early, but vaccines typically result in long term side-effect complications in 0.1% of cases, about the same as developing a food allergy.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"
 

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2732 –
Can’t imagine there’s much sympathy for the losing bettors. Trump would be outraged, of course. He’d be thinking that the bookies have stolen money from him as that money should have gone into his fraudulent legal defence fund. And of course Sidney Powell and Alex Jones wouldn’t be happy as that means less money for them. But let’s think of the poor prosperity pastors. How are they going to maintain their lavish lifestyles when their flocks have already been shorn?

It’s like watching predators fighting amongst themselves to gorge on an animal that one has brought down.

Ordinarily, you’d feel sorry for people being shamelessly ripped off. But unlike prey animals, these people run to the predators and feel good about being eaten. They are part of a movement dedicated to destroying democracy and enshrining minority rule. They aren’t innocent victims - they’re part of the problem.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2733 –
Quote from: Mav – on
They aren’t innocent victims - they’re part of the problem.
A Christmas thought? ;D

I think their prejudice diminishes our sympathy, but I suppose they are no less victims, be it difficult to think of them that way. You just know if you offer them a hand in sympathy they'll bite it, it's that grievance addiction again, all their troubles and all the troubles of the world are somebody else's fault!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2734 –
Let’s face it, those idiots who bet on Trump despite the odds being way too skinny and those who contributed to Trump’s “legal defence fund” almost certainly signed on to Trump’s campaign to brand Covid as a Democratic hoax. They’d be the types to confront people wearing masks, yell at them and cough on their faces. It’s a two-fer: attacking democracy and spreading Covid.

Do I have even a bit of sympathy for them? Hell no! The world will be better off if their financial losses and disillusionment drives them to check out. Unfortunately, it’s more likely they’ll be driven to violence against truly innocent people.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2735 –
I have a different perspective.

I understand why Trump won.  Its unthinkable, but it fires a rocket into the political hemisphere and sounds a very loud warning.

"You imbeciles in your ivory towers are so disconnected from the very people you claim to have in your best interests, that they dont believe in you or your system anymore."

Electing Trump sends a very strong signal to everyone.  Improve, be better or else.  We would back in the worst candidate ever in front of you career politicians.

Its a very strong stance for the American people to take, and I believe one period of him as POTUS is hopefully enough to cause the waves it requires.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2736 –
If that was the aim, then they should have repudiated Mitch McConnell and ideologically inflexible congressional candidates. But McConnell has prospered by producing congressional gridlock. I don’t see how irrational toddler-like tantrums thrown by voters are going to have any positive effect.

I think Trump’s main appeal was to white supremacists. He did his best to turn back the clock to a whiter time. For that type of voter, improving their financial position was always a secondary concern. Entrenching their social superiority was worth more than money. If there were blue collar types who were stupid enough to think Trump would boost their finances, they would have been sorely disappointed. Why the hell would a so-called billionaire care about them? Instead, he gave the rich a tax cut and he and his family and friends made out like bandits.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2737 –
Quote from: Mav – on
I think Trump’s main appeal was to white supremacists.
But he's the least racist person in the room! :o

btw., How clever is that, that is his genius, the more you highlight that contradiction the better it is for him!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2738 –
It has to be a bit more complex than that.
There cant be 70+ million white supremacists in the US.

What Thry said has some merit.
In a speech Biden made on election night, when he all but claimed victory, it was very clear that the 'politicians' had won back control.

The Republicans are like a leaky sieve at the moment.
They're  just trying to hold some semblance of unity until after the Georgia Senate election.
Then that unity will collapse and all efforts will be turned to putting the Trump era behind them.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2739 –
Why would the GOP suddenly become more reasonable? Trump has shown them they can succeed by playing to the Trump base. The more extreme they behave, the more seats they win and the more they raise funds. The majority of their congressmen signed on to the ridiculous Texas suit in the Supreme Court and few Republicans have called out the election fraud conspiracy theories.

Remember, this comes a decade after the Tea Party dominated the GOP. Now we have QAnon believers in Congress.

If the public was trying to send a message by electing Trump, they should have sent an explanatory memorandum to ensure the GOP didn’t misinterpret the message.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2740 –
Quote from: Lods – on
There cant be 70+ million white supremacists in the US.

Well, white supremacist is probably a bit of a gross generalisation, but they all hate somebody and Trump harvests hate like it's a money tree,

............ er maybe there is the problem!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2741 –
By the way, Kelly Loeffler, one of the GOP Senate candidates running in the Georgia run-offs, has borrowed from Trump’s playbook. Trump disregarded the 3rd rail of US politics: don’t have anything to do with white supremacists. He suggested there were many fine people of both sides after the tiki torch March and violence  in Charlottesville. He failed to disavow David Duke, saying he didn’t know who he was (despite discussing him previously). He continuously retweeted memes from white supremacy sites.

Loeffler has learnt to parrot Sgt Shultz whenever she has posed for photos with well-known white supremacists:
Kelly Loeffler Keeps Posing For Photos With White Supremacists And Other Extremists, HuffPost:Click HERE.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2742 –
Quote from: LP – on

Well, white supremacist is probably a bit of a gross generalisation, but they all hate somebody and Trump harvests hate like it's a money tree,

............ er maybe there is the problem!

That's true but the thing is he doesn't just engender hate in one side he does it in both.

You know what I think his most effective weapon has been....and I reckon he's done a lot of it accidently, because he's a buffoon.
He's more a Chaplin than a Hitler.
That's not to say there aren't some evil and dangerous influences and ideas that he's triggered.
Dangerous folks that have felt empowered.

But...
He's also taken decent folks on the left with a good social conscience, good principles and a decent wish for a better world and turned them into 'haters',
As a result they hate not only Trump, but have directed that hate towards any that support him.
They deride those supporters, they're dismissive of them, they find them 'deplorable'
Even the ones who voted for him who may have gone into the booths 50/50
All who voted for him are tarred with the same brush.

Now if you tell folks their beliefs are reprehensible you don't change their opinions....you enhance them and you get them angry.
You add to the hate and you don't change their minds.
Now you may argue that it's a legitimate tactic, and it's the end result that matters, that right will eventually win out, but sadly that approach also comes with consequences and no guarantees.
The most likely result is that it drives the problem back underground.
The attitudes and values that folks possess are always there... Sometimes they're just hidden.
Trump doesn't create them, he gives them a voice and rallying point.
The best I think we can hope for is a generational maturity (we see it in the young) ...it's a slower process, but much more lasting and effective.

As far as the Republican party goes....Many in the GOP want Trump out of the way so the 'politicians' can regain control of their party. Like any organisation there are moderates and extremists.
It's a battle they have in the future. How to rid themselves of the Trump legacy yet retain his supporters.
A lot will depend on Trump's immediate future. State courts may take a lot of his attention, but if he's allowed to 'roam free' he is more likely to be disruptive of the party. He's certainly not a unifier.

Just curious...we're a 180+ pages into this thread.
I'd say we're mostly negative in our opinions of Trump
But has anyone really changed their opinion in all that debate.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2743 –
Quote from: Lods – on
But...
He's also taken decent folks on the left with a good social conscience, good principles and a decent wish for a better world and turned them into 'haters',
As a result they hate not only Trump, but have directed that hate towards any that support him.
They deride those supporters, they're dismissive of them, they find them 'deplorable'
Even the ones who voted for him who may have gone into the booths 50/50
All who voted for him are tarred with the same brush.
Wow. I think you might be the one tarring with the same brush. I focussed on the fanatics who have signed on to the election fraud conspiracy. But apparently that means that anyone who voted for Trump, no matter how reticently, must be regarded in the same way. If you don’t think Trump’s base is rife with racism, you must have been in a coma for the last 4 years. The election fraud cases have all focussed on heavily black districts and it’s pretty hard to ignore the sentiment that they think blacks were allowed to vote too much.

Trump lost. His supporters lost. I don’t hate them. But I don’t have any sympathy for them. They don’t deserve to be coddled. The joke is they used to laugh at “snowflakes” who couldn’t handle losing to Trump. Now they can show how to handle losing with grace, although they’re not off to a good start.

The racist rump are probably going to be coddled by Biden, though I hope not. His self-image is that he can strike deals with everyone. I can just imagine him saying that he doesn’t want to upset those good folk who just love their Confederate “heritage” and he understands just how hard it is for cops to avoid killing unarmed black men, women and children.

Re: Trumpled (Alternative Leading)

Reply #2744 –
You seem to have taken it personally mav... and I guess in some respects my response was triggered by your comment that his 'main appeal was to white supremacists'
The fact is I'm not sure how 'you' feel about the more moderate Trump supporters...only you know  that.
I'm pleased though that you regard yourself as "decent folk on the left with a good social conscience, good principles and a decent wish for a better world." ;)

No, not all folks on the left feel that strength of antipathy towards Trump supporters.
That's not how I meant that to come across...but many do, and the point I was making is that normally measured folks I know have had feelings bordering on 'hatred' for anything that even smacks of pro -Trump or anyone who supports him.

Of course there is a racist background to his 'core' support.
That's where those 'people' live on the spectrum.
If they vote they're never going to vote Biden.
And yes, Trump does little to call them out as he should.

Yep, Trump appeals to a white supremacist group but he also appeals to conservative folk who may not like some of the changes (actual or proposed) occurring in their lives, average folks with no strong convictions either way but who are not sure about Biden, people who may not have fared so well under Obama but who have done a little better in recent times, folks in industries that they feel are under threat and who believe Trump is still the best option for their futures and  people who feel a little threatened by some progressive social agendas.

With a vote of seventy million plus there were numerous reasons folks voted for Trump...lots of them nothing to do with white supremacy