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Topic: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood (Read 37311 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #135 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Yep most of our inside fifties went straight to Jack crisp.

Reckon another coach might have said if I put a player who can take a mark on Crisp we might snag half of the nine he took....I remember Crisp lost his lunch in the middle of the ground when a high ball came in and he came up a few steps short so any semblance of pressure down back on him might have led to some scoring opportunities...but instead we just left him on his own and he looked like Gary Dempsey taking mark after mark down back...as a supporter there is nothing more frustrating than watching repeat entry failures from your team with the same method.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #136 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
Reckon another coach might have said if I put a player who can take a mark on Crisp we might snag half of the nine he took....I remember Crisp lost his lunch in the middle of the ground when a high ball came in and he came up a few steps short so any semblance of pressure down back on him might have led to some scoring opportunities...but instead we just left him on his own and he looked Gary Dempsey taking mark after mark down back...as a supporter there is nothing more frustrating than watching repeat entry failures from your team with the same method.
It will continue to happen if we insist with going with 7 defenders....which we do more often than not.

Until we can let go of that safety net, we will struggle to get quality inside 50's.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #137 –
Often, not always, rebuilds have a stinker for one year at some point before coming good again. Even Richmond had a stinker in 2016 before winning a flag in 2017. Geelong had one in 2006 before winning in 2007. Even back to the Lions, they had a stinker in 1998, a spoon, then immediately turned into a super side. Those were at later stages than ours but it often happens. Even Ratten had a bad one in 2012 after improving every year, if you can call that a rebuild given our rotten recruiting with a side stuck with near half a side off the rookie list. Probably always going to require a 2nd rebuild given our recruiting.Fortunately 5 Rising Star nominations last year indicates things might be better.

On the other hand Hawthorn went straight though to 2008 and the Dogs did similar.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #138 –
Was at the game Friday night and wow I can see why our defence sucks and his name is Mullet. The media is getting on Jones and Weitering but in Jones' case, he is covering for the soft, stat chasing Mullet and it's making him look bad. I speak of a goal to Treloar, whom Jones was standing, the ball was kicked to Stephenson (I think) just outside 50 and Treloar was in the pocket. Jones was the closest player so he left his player and ran to Stephenson, as you should when playing a team defence, else Stephenson could have jogged into 40 and kicked an easy goal.

In leaving his player, it is the responsibility of the spare man or closest man to roll over and cover Treloar, this did not happen and Stephenson was able to pop a 35m pass to Treloar who goaled from a set shot.

When Treloar marked I looked at the closest players, and Mullet was standing at the top of the square guarding no one. This goal was not Jones" fault but Mullet's. The cynic in me (which is more often than not right) would think that Mullet was standing close to goals, so in the event of a point he could grab the ball and kick in, have you noticed he ALWAYS taps the ball on his foot from a kick out, just to get a stat.

Plowman must be feeling very secure and happy about his position in the side, as he does not much else than stand an opponent and look as he breaks his tackle or out sprints him to the ball. I'm convinced if Plowman and Mullet were replaced by Docherty and A.Silvagni then Collingwood doesn't get half it's score. I like Cunningham at half back, while it wasn't a perfect game he did some things that made me think a year or two there and we'll have a real player.

Now we look forward and Lamb must only be played from now on when we play Hawthorn, and Matthew Wright, if he's not getting the over the top goals then he's near useless. Does not chase, does not rove off hands and clogs movement up by standing in leading paths.

People laud Cripps and what a great player he is, I've watched him twice this season live and both times I've been staggered at his lack of second efforts without the ball, if a player gets around you, then you have to chase, whether you think you can catch him or not. Three or four times a player got around Cripps and he offered a jog at best for 5 steps. Kruezer on the other hand will chase even if he has no chance just to apply a bit of pressure, and FFS Cripps take the first, and more often than not, the best option rather than try and fake 5 players out and do a no look fancy hand pass that and work 10% of the time. SPS is guilty of this too, yet Fisher will give the first and best option, regardless if it looks great or not.

J.Silvagni needs to come back in to give us someone with forward understanding, Kerridge for Dow who needs a rest, Mullet for the bootstudder. Wright is lucky Pickett's not up and going and the same goes for Plowman and A.Silvagni.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #139 –
Thank-you Raydan, it proves to me that a lot of the commentary is bullcrap based on clips and stats without half of them ever having watched a game live at the ground.

A lot of this is impossible to mistake for anybody half interested in football, yet it's barely mentioned in professional sports journalism! The reports often slaughter the last bloke in the line, and are ignorant of the person responsible. Our last line of defenders, and often that is Jones and Weitering, have been left with way too many opponents to cover and it makes them look silly especially when smart teams take advantage of that situation. Then the defenders desperate efforts to kill the footy look chaotic, too little and too late, but it is not their fault!

You would have also witnessed some of those long F50 entry kicks that dropped short, while our forwards stood motionless waiting for the ball to fall in their lap, over the back of the pack! In one incident our bloke stood at the back of a pack while a 50m to 60m kick came into the F50 from between the wing and HFF, two Collingwood defenders looked at each other nervously waiting for the forward to move because they were caught 5m in front of him, he didn't move, and they virtually shrugged in disbelief ran forward took any easy uncontested mark and ran out of our attacking zone with minimal pressure. This wasn't a bullet like pass that left the forward no time to react, it was a long high kick that took seconds to get there and was probably only 5m short of perfection, maybe three or four steps for our forward! ;)
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #140 –
Jones and Mullet are both B grade VFL footballers, a type of player of which we have far too many. Not sure how you can criticise one without the other. Jones was pantsed by Franklin last year, and Mullet wasn't even playing.

I think you need a bigger sample space before you pot blokes like Cripps, Wright and Plowman, all three of whom are among the very least of our problems.

I don’t understand why people take pot shots at some of our kids, e.g Dow, and then think we can bring in plonkers like Jack S and Kerridge, as if somehow they will be better.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #141 –
Quote from: PaulP – on
Jones and Mullet are both B grade VFL footballers, a type of player of which we have far too many. Not sure how you can criticise one without the other. Jones was pantsed by Franklin last year, and Mullet wasn't even playing.

I think you need a bigger sample space before you pot blokes like Cripps, Wright and Plowman, all three of whom are among the very least of our problems.

I don’t understand why people take pot shots at some of our kids, e.g Dow, and then think we can bring in plonkers like Jack S and Kerridge, as if somehow they will be better.

Guys like Buddy and Lynch pants anyone, Rance included, one on one.

Only think that works is a team defence, mids included.

It's the mids who have failed to provide ANY defensive support when we get smashed.

By the time the ball is streaming through the midfield with no pressure on the ball carrier, there is little, no SFA, a defender can do unless the delivery is woeful (an anti skill that only carp teams like us can achieve).
Finals, then 4 in a row!
 

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #142 –
And if you can't see how a Kerridge type (not Graham) isnt an improvement on the current Dow, well God help you.

Look at the bloke's stats the last 6 or so games in 2017 - when he was given a run at it, better than Murphy or Gibbs.

Dow needs to play 2s - earn a spot in the 1s - just like anyone else.
Finals, then 4 in a row!

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #143 –
When was the last time Buddy kicked 10 on a player ? When was the last time Lynch kicked 8 on a player ? Can' blame the midfield all the time. Defenders have to defend at some point.

What irks me more than anything is Jones isn't even near the contest. He's meters away. If he's there with the forward, at the drop of the ball, trying to mark, spoil, harass, punch the ball away, then fair enough. He's not as big or strong as Buddy, Lynch etc., so if he gets out bodied, I can live with that.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #144 –
Quote from: flyboy77 – on
And if you can't see how a Kerridge type (not Graham) isnt an improvement on the current Dow, well God help you.

Look at the bloke's stats the last 6 or so games in 2017 - when he was given a run at it, better than Murphy or Gibbs.

Dow needs to play 2s - earn a spot in the 1s - just like anyone else.

Kerridge has already played 30 odd games for us. We've seen what he as to offer, and it isn't great. He's a panic merchant, pure and simple. Dow is a kid, still getting used to the pace of the game, playing against experienced, hardened bodies, and he already looks cleaner than Kerridge.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #145 –
Quote from: PaulP – on
When was the last time Buddy kicked 10 on a player ? When was the last time Lynch kicked 8 on a player ? Can' blame the midfield all the time. Defenders have to defend at some point.

What irks me more than anything is Jones isn't even near the contest. He's meters away. If he's there with the forward, at the drop of the ball, trying to mark, spoil, harass, punch the ball away, then fair enough. He's not as big or strong as Buddy, Lynch etc., so if he gets out bodied, I can live with that.
Jones isn't a good body on body player he's better using his athleticism and reach to beat opponents.

We are struggling because on field there are too many people focussed on themselves rather than helping the next bloke.  Defence is a team within the team and currently it lacks leadership to the point Marchbank going down costs us big time.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #146 –
Kerridge can get the ball ok but his usage is woeful even at VFL level.
His kicking action is fine and he seems well coordinated so it must be between the ears, he lacks focus, concentration and decision-making skills.
Replacing Dow with him, or Graham either for that matter, would be a retrograde step.
I saw some of the VFL on the weekend, the only player you might consider is Silvagni and then only for his work rate.
The only thing in this world worth more than a hill of beans is the Carlton Football Club.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #147 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Jones isn't a good body on body player he's better using his athleticism and reach to beat opponents.

Yet in the ruck he's more than useful, far better than Casboult, and currently far better than McKay or De Koning. After his last 18 months I'd rate Jones the equal of Rowe in the ruck.

In think people underestimate Liam's ability, he shows great intent, recovery and persistence, it's not his physical attributes that limit him it's experience in those roles.

Why would we chop someone likes Jones after what he's shown in the new roles over the last 18 months, when we've persisted with other players for almost a decade? Wouldn't that be a little hypocritical?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #148 –
All defenders struggle when the ball is coming in under no pressure, with Docherty and Byrne fully fit next season I'm happy that our defence will be as good as any.
It's the midfield and forward pressure we need to lift but that will take time and only come as youngsters develop and we can replace some players who aren't good enough.
The only thing in this world worth more than a hill of beans is the Carlton Football Club.

Re: 2018 Rd 3: Post Game Platitudes: Carlton vs Collingwood

Reply #149 –
Jones smashed Lynch last year, our team has had no structure the last 2 weeks. Even looking back at round 1 if we take away the Tigers slow start they killed us as well with their fast transition.
2012 HAPPENED!!!!!!!