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Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6690 –
Andrews is copping more criticism over his 'code brown' response which is designed to ease pressure on the health system. He's already backflipped on IVF being deemed as elective, which was always going to happen once the media jumped on the young women emotional TV appearance about her missing her chance to have children. All of a sudden the science supported IVF not being elective -X

Now senior surgeons are saying the blanket restriction has not been thought through as there are a several 'elective' surgeries that  apply very little pressure to the health system yet assist patients getting better quicker and ease the pressure on another back log once restrictions are lifted. He said day procedures that don't require stays overnight can be safely preformed during this time and stopping them is simply non sensical.

We have 120 odd in ICU in a state of over 6.5 million. One ICU bed per 55,000 in a state with 90% plus vaxed against statistically the weakest Covid variant and we are lead to believe the system is overwhelmed to the extent where restrictions this dire are necessary.   If this is true then our health system needs a serious overhaul.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6691 –
Quote from: shawny – on
Andrews is copping more criticism over his 'code brown' response which is designed to ease pressure on the health system. He's already backflipped on IVF being deemed as elective, which was always going to happen once the media jumped on the young women emotional TV appearance about her missing her chance to have children. All of a sudden the science supported IVF not being elective -X

Now senior surgeons are saying the blanket restriction has not been thought through as there are a several 'elective' surgeries that  apply very little pressure to the health system yet assist patients getting better quicker and ease the pressure on another back log once restrictions are lifted. He said day procedures that don't require stays overnight can be safely preformed during this time and stopping them is simply non sensical.

We have 120 odd in ICU in a state of over 6.5 million. One ICU bed per 55,000 in a state with 90% plus vaxed against statistically the weakest Covid variant and we are lead to believe the system is overwhelmed to the extent where restrictions this dire are necessary.   If this is true then our health system needs a serious overhaul.

Whilst I share the sentiment over the last few weeks at work I noticed that the furlough numbers at my old healthcare employer were at roughly 10% of the workforce being off for at least the last 4 weeks.

This doesn't apply solely to medical staff.  People eat, linen gets washed, people are admitted and booked in, payroll staff organise for pay, it work is done, health information services apply coding data nurse educators provide nurses with education etc.

Each department runs with minimal staff at maximum efficiency.   The pandemic has caused a burnout in these places on a level I personally hadn't seen before.  Thing is the pandemic response has been as big an issue as the pandemic itself.  You have a lot of staff who have had no meaningful break from work, and no time off at all. 

They are monitoring 10000 patients in the community along with pcr testing, and vaccine administration, and the regular fulfilment of services despite what the numbers look like on covid statistics.

Surgical booking and the like, is something that can scale.  Despite "restrictions" category 1 and category 2 patients continue their surgeries as scheduled and what isn't happening are the cat 3s and 4s (which are bing done as category 1 because there is no sense stopping everything when not necessary).

The pandemic isn't stopping hospitals from operating, they just aren't using 100% capacity to cater for surge where necessary.   Thing is, that's a sliding scale.

Don't buy into the external noise.  They don't listen to what's going on in the healthcare networks its designed to make you outraged.

The real question I have is why are you outraged?

The health care networks are stretched staff wise but not because the kick up in patients solely, its because of the potential kick up.  One health service monitoring over 10k patients who are covid positive and not admitted is something someone needs to plan for even if you don't think it's necessary because if they all need up needing care, it does need some provisioning and the code brown is as much about furlough as it is the pandemic.  There is no use someone being monitored for a cardiac arrest or stroke by a covid positive nurse or doctor or pushed around by a covid positive PSA or served food by a covid positive kitchen staffer.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6692 –
@LP Regarding change the only thing permanent is change.  During the pandemic ive operated on a plan for the worst and plan for the best case scenario but ultimately my employer made it easy for me to embrace change because of their sheer short sightedness (yes, Vic health).

I plunged 10% of cash into the stock market last year to Kickstart a retirement fund.  Tick.  Bought blue chip stocks at discounts not seen since the GFC, and most have recovered quite nicely.

I commenced a course in cyber security to leverage a growing demand in my industry whilst in lockdown.  This may or may not pay off but im learning things which is good enough and at worst broadens my skillset.

The other thing I've done is leveraged the vaccine mandate to get myself a promotion and career growth using the vaccine to my advantage.  Lots of anti vax sentiment in IT land, has resulted in shortages of people who will be dedicated to the task and appropriately qualified.   Thats got me into a role i lack formal qualifications for but I have some experience doing as part of a helper of sorts.  End result a smaller company recognised i can fill a hole and have taken a bit of a gamble based on my potential to fill the need.



These things will pay dividends in time, once covid is a thing of the past and maybe sooner if I'm lucky, but even if covid is here to stay, I've done what I can to profit from a crap situation, now its do what I can to avoid infection and stay safe.  Easy enough to do. 

All the while I have been critical of some of the strategy and government response, for its somewhat hypocrisy.   As a health care worker I spent more time in the covid firing line than the average employee.  I didn't qualify for the payments that other employees got for being in that firing line because of a lack of understanding of people to see that some staff go into the danger zone and come out again rather than doing a full shift in an equivalent where there were no covid positive patients.

This also meant no proactive testing for us.  A big stuff up from staff who only see the patient care experience from the clinical perspective which was arguably what made it easy for me to jump out of that space.

Ironically, I'm facing more restriction from my new client side about attending than I did at a health service who publically told staff not to move around and then internally asked why it took so long to see someone from IT and encouraged seeing more people as soon as possible. 

This is where the government lack empathy for the common person and are solely reacting with a lack of fore thought to all the things.  Its like the effort goes into the key visible reaction rather than the unseen prevention and a cynic will state its because no votes or glory is won in areas that aren't publicly visible...
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6693 –
Re code Brown...
Instead of the government trying to get a grasp on the intricacies of the hospital system, and the differences between hospitals....

.... why not allow hospitals to make their own calls?
If they want to cancel ivf, day surgeries etc etc then do it.  If not, don't. If they want to change their mind, then do it.

Is it not that simple?
What am I missing?

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6694 –
Quote from: kruddler – on
Re code Brown...
Instead of the government trying to get a grasp on the intricacies of the hospital system, and the differences between hospitals....

.... why not allow hospitals to make their own calls?
If they want to cancel ivf, day surgeries etc etc then do it.  If not, don't. If they want to change their mind, then do it.

Is it not that simple?
What am I missing?



Exactly!   But that takes common sense which this government during this pandemic has shown an inability to use and with a power trip premier at the helm a blanket restriction is more in his kit bag.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6695 –
It isn't that simple.

Follow the funding model for hospitals and you will have your answer.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6696 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
It isn't that simple.

Follow the funding model for hospitals and you will have your answer.

OK, so money controls everything, we know that, but what does that change in this scenario?

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6697 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
It isn't that simple.

Follow the funding model for hospitals and you will have your answer.

So the surgeons at the coal face saying they should proceed with certain elective procedures are ill informed?

I have had to deal with a few of the very top surgeons over the years and there is no greater respect I have for anyone in any field then those guys. There are hero’s, who work crazy hours because they are devoted to the cause and apart from being the smartest people I have ever encountered, there wasn’t much about the health and hospital system as a whole they did not have a good grip on.

So if you saying we should take the governments decision over several respected surgeons view who have spoke against the restriction not a chance.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6698 –
Quote from: shawny – on
So the surgeons at the coal face saying they should proceed with certain elective procedures are ill informed?

I have had to deal with a few of the very top surgeons over the years and there is no greater respect I have for anyone in any field then those guys. There are hero’s, who work crazy hours because they are devoted to the cause and apart from being the smartest people I have ever encountered, there wasn’t much about the health and hospital system as a whole they did not have a good grip on.

So if you saying we should take the governments decision over several respected surgeons view who have spoke against the restriction not a chance.
the surgeons are not running the place.

The government are the ones who set the accreditation standards. 

The government funds the place using tax payers dollars.

The nurses are generally the ones that run hospitals.

Surgeons, are surgeons.  Brilliant at what they do, but they don't run health services, even if they run their own private practise.  Most of them are poor at anything but their specialty.  In fact, they're highly specialized and usually pretty crap with the finer details of things outside their profession including being notoriously bad at managing finances.

Next time you speak to your top notch surgeon, ask them about how the health services are funded.

They wouldn't know.  They don't know that the government funds e erything based on health information managers applying codes to each and every treatment that is administered in a hospital encounter.  Heck, most of them don't even write their own notes.

The government doesn't do a Stirling job of everything.  I've been employed by a health service since Chris Judd last played for West coast, and the biggest issue I had with what they did with money was how they consumed their budget to ensure they got a similar amount next year, but they do service all parts of the community in like fashion, and they don't share staff across health services because there are additional considerations there regarding employment contracts, resourcing, training, and ensuring that staff actually know what they're doing at each health service.



"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6699 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
the surgeons are not running the place.

The government are the ones who set the accreditation standards. 

The government funds the place using tax payers dollars.

The nurses are generally the ones that run hospitals.

Surgeons, are surgeons.  Brilliant at what they do, but they don't run health services, even if they run their own private practise.  Most of them are poor at anything but their specialty.  In fact, they're highly specialized and usually pretty crap with the finer details of things outside their profession including being notoriously bad at managing finances.

Next time you speak to your top notch surgeon, ask them about how the health services are funded.

They wouldn't know.  They don't know that the government funds e erything based on health information managers applying codes to each and every treatment that is administered in a hospital encounter.  Heck, most of them don't even write their own notes.

The government doesn't do a Stirling job of everything.  I've been employed by a health service since Chris Judd last played for West coast, and the biggest issue I had with what they did with money was how they consumed their budget to ensure they got a similar amount next year, but they do service all parts of the community in like fashion, and they don't share staff across health services because there are additional considerations there regarding employment contracts, resourcing, training, and ensuring that staff actually know what they're doing at each health service.





Fair enough.

Agree to disagree on this one. I would back the surgeons in and the ones I knew had a lot of knowledge about the system they operated in. I understand your point just struggle to back the government over them. 

Anyhow on a completely different front you mentioned Chris Judd. My wife and I happen to sit with the great man and his family on a plane last week. Very down to earth all of them and couldn’t believe how well behaved the kids are!  Chris looks like he could still play by the way. His son had a cough and beck said don’t worry it’s not corona and chris grinned and said it’s not a good time to have a cough!
Geez I loved watching him in his prime. How many games when you could really see he was on another level to everyone on the field.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6700 –
Aaron Rodgers Rips Joe Biden And 'Fake White House' In Anti-Vax Rant, HuffPost.

What is it about rich sports stars that make them think they understand medical science? What a drop kick. I might just have to re-watch the ending of the Packers' playoff game. The universe has a sense of humour.

How this guy ever was invited to host Jeopardy on the basis he's some sort of intellectual has me beat. Learning at the feet of Professor Rogan isn't much by way of accreditation.
 

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6701 –
Baby ‘turned blue’ after bizarre Covid advice from underground Telegram group, news.com.au.

Reporters from Vice had infiltrated a QAnon Telegram group which shared tips on treating Covid (not that they believe in Covid) with Ivermectin and the like. A young father of a 6 month old asked for advice given his wife had tested positive for Covid a week before and the baby began suffereing "flu-like symptoms". He wondered whether Ivermectin was suitable for babies.

Quote
“Baby aspirin to thin the blood a little and drop any fever and I would put some ivermectin on the bottoms of her feet,” one group member responded — while others said he should wait to take advice from “experts” in ivermectin usage on the group.

One user called Katie, who claimed to be an expert, piped up.

“From what I understand, yes it is safe to give to an infant, however please stop calling it Covid, it’s not Covid, it’s a simple cold. That’s how we got in this mess to begin with,” Katie wrote.

Jason took the advice and gave his baby a dose of ivermectin.

“We gave her two doses of ivermectin at 50mg each. That’s what was recommended by someone on here. She got really sick after that. Related? I don’t know,” Jason claimed in an update.

Within minutes, Jason reported that his little girl’s condition was deteriorating.

“Baby threw up. Is that common side effect? She’s also turning a tad blue,” Jason said.

Shockingly, somebody said this had happened to their child as well and they took him to hospital — something Jason wasn’t keen to do.

Jason responded: “We don’t trust hospitals. I told my son to give her more ivermectin.”

Group members pleaded with Jason to go to the hospital.

“That baby needs to go to the ER. Do not hesitate,” one group member called Barbara, who said she was a respiratory therapist, wrote. “I’ve seen too many go south due to O2 levels being low. The blue is hypoxia and that’s lack of oxygen at the tissue level. Please!”

Finally, Jason told the group, the child was taken to hospital.

“[My] son is taking baby to urgent care. Against my wishes but I’m praying for her. It’s in God’s hands now,” Jason wrote before later adding an update that Ruby was “doing better.”

“God knew what to do even though I thought hospital was certain death,” Jason wrote on Wednesday night. “Thanks for everyone’s advice.”

Oh boy ...

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6702 –
Quote from: Mav – on
Baby ‘turned blue’ after bizarre Covid advice from underground Telegram group, news.com.au.

Reporters from Vice had infiltrated a QAnon Telegram group which shared tips on treating Covid (not that they believe in Covid) with Ivermectin and the like. A young father of a 6 month old asked for advice given his wife had tested positive for Covid a week before and the baby began suffereing "flu-like symptoms". He wondered whether Ivermectin was suitable for babies.

Oh boy ...
These people need their anonymity removed and to be charged, that child is better off with some other family.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6703 –
As countries open borders, in the hope that the public's will to travel resumes soon, I don't get why we not testing every traveller that arrives on the spot.

A RAT test takes about 10 to 15min to complete, way faster than it takes to get through border control and customs quarantine. It's not hard to imagine they could issue a RAT for each arriving passenger sometime prior to passport checks, and get the result prior to collecting baggage and clearing customs quarantine.

When there have been regional terrorist threats the heightened levels of security promote countries doing manual bag searches of full aircraft, sometimes more than once, up in SE Asia it's quite common to go through scanners then a manual baggage check at the gate.

So they can't really argue it's too hard to swab everyone from an arriving flight, a few dozen health care workers could each do a passenger a minute comfortably because each passenger already has identifying documents. Most of the domestic testing lag is due to forms that would not be needed in arrivals. In any case, swabbing for a RAT is as fast as if not faster than having your carry on checked.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour

Reply #6704 –
Booster done. Had it yesterday. So... Az+Az+Moderna booster. Sore arm, tired but no temperature, headaches etc. Almost 5 months between 2nd Az and Mod. 24 hours on and continuing to improve.
Only our ruthless best, from Board to bootstudders will get us no. 17