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Topic: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ?? (Read 118503 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #120 –
Quote from: LP – on
Quote from: Professer E – on
Funny, three years ago people were raving about our ruck riches.  Fast forward three years and one is starring for another club (for a pick that went nowhere), one was shed for a middling pick, one looks as if injury will hinder his career and one is unsuited to the modern game.  Now we are basically back to square one and potentially relying upon a discard off the rookie list.

That light we thought we saw at the end of the tunnel .... is the 6:14  from Smacktown.

The writing was on the wall, most could not read it or simply refused to believe!

This part is going to make you spew because my next prediction is this, Carlton will use an early 2014 draft pick to secure a potential ruck/forward.

This is where we make mistakes.....you either pick ruckman or you pick forwards not ruck/forward jack of all trades but masters of none types ie Casboult/Rowe...we need specialist KP players.

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #121 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
This is where we make mistakes.....you either pick ruckman or you pick forwards not ruck/forward jack of all trades but masters of none types ie Casboult/Rowe...we need specialist KP players.
This was always my argument, we kept the hybrids and removed the specialists. Now Jacobs and Hampson first ruck at other clubs while we continue to try and make Kreuzer a forward, and we hang onto Casboult and Rowe in the hope they can be a bit of both. We are our own worst enemy. We got rid of AFL quality ruck specialists, weakened our ruck division in the process and kept some VFL quality hybrids..
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #122 –
if we fare as poorly as it seems we may, there WILL be light at the end of the tunnel. One of the top picks this year is a lad called Wright who plays for Calder. He moves very well for a very tall guy and he rucks quite decently. He is a probable top 5 pick. Oh, I forgot to mention, he has hands with super glue on the fingers.
Live Long and Prosper!

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #123 –
Quote from: crashlander – on
if we fare as poorly as it seems we may, there WILL be light at the end of the tunnel. One of the top picks this year is a lad called Wright who plays for Calder. He moves very well for a very tall guy and he rucks quite decently. He is a probable top 5 pick. Oh, I forgot to mention, he has hands with super glue on the fingers.


Do we want a ruckman with our first pick given the trend these days is to steal readymades rather than waste time developing these big blokes on your own list.....the next Tom Boyd/Jon Patton is where I see our first pick going

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #124 –
Quote from: crashlander – on
if we fare as poorly as it seems we may, there WILL be light at the end of the tunnel. One of the top picks this year is a lad called Wright who plays for Calder. He moves very well for a very tall guy and he rucks quite decently. He is a probable top 5 pick. Oh, I forgot to mention, he has hands with super glue on the fingers.

Seriously don't mind if we finish on the bottom Q, It may be a blessing at the draft table. As long as there is signs that young crop of draftees have impressive potential ill be stoked. 
“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it's time to pause and reflect.”

― Mark Twain

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #125 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
Quote from: crashlander – on
if we fare as poorly as it seems we may, there WILL be light at the end of the tunnel. One of the top picks this year is a lad called Wright who plays for Calder. He moves very well for a very tall guy and he rucks quite decently. He is a probable top 5 pick. Oh, I forgot to mention, he has hands with super glue on the fingers.


Do we want a ruckman with our first pick given the trend these days is to steal readymades rather than waste time developing these big blokes on your own list.....the next Tom Boyd/Jon Patton is where I see our first pick going

No ruckmen with early picks! You can poach via FA when required.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #126 –
I agree that you aim for ruckmen through FA.

Yes that will cost you more at the time of recruitment but they are nearly all useless before 24, so you end up blowing 1.5 mill while they are coming up to speed anyway and that's with zero guarantee they'll come any good, there's been a number of top 3 ruckmen who have failed.

So pay the ruckman tax and reduce the risk.

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #127 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots – on
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
Quote from: crashlander – on
if we fare as poorly as it seems we may, there WILL be light at the end of the tunnel. One of the top picks this year is a lad called Wright who plays for Calder. He moves very well for a very tall guy and he rucks quite decently. He is a probable top 5 pick. Oh, I forgot to mention, he has hands with super glue on the fingers.


Do we want a ruckman with our first pick given the trend these days is to steal readymades rather than waste time developing these big blokes on your own list.....the next Tom Boyd/Jon Patton is where I see our first pick going

No ruckmen with early picks! You can poach via FA when required.

We've learned that lesson the hard way!
Reality always wins in the end.

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #128 –
Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on
Quote from: crashlander – on
if we fare as poorly as it seems we may, there WILL be light at the end of the tunnel. One of the top picks this year is a lad called Wright who plays for Calder. He moves very well for a very tall guy and he rucks quite decently. He is a probable top 5 pick. Oh, I forgot to mention, he has hands with super glue on the fingers.


Do we want a ruckman with our first pick given the trend these days is to steal readymades rather than waste time developing these big blokes on your own list.....the next Tom Boyd/Jon Patton is where I see our first pick going

Actually we haven't failed recruiting ruckmen, we have failed converting them into forwards, all our ruck picks have turned out capable AFL level first rucks. It might be the only recruiting we have done that is a clear success!

I understand Crash's point but I highlight it with this. Most people conveniently forget that Casboult was a junior ruckmen who played one season and one season alone as a forward, based on that one season we recruited him as a forward. We recruited a ruckmen to be a forward.  He was a giant kid, a man child , playing amongst boys who out of necessity was re-task as a forward. When as a junior you are 6' taller and 20kg heavier than just about every other opponent it is not too hard to be a success in any KP.

We need to learn from this, look for specialists who have a proven record in a set primary role when compared to the best and if you need to develop their skills for a secondary role, do not  try to change what they naturally do best! A forward is a forward, a ruck is a ruck and a defender is a defender.

I feel Carlton has b0rked up most of it's current playing list trying to turn players into something they are not, this I blame on megalomaniac coaches. All the guys were good enough at something to get drafted in the first place, let them show us!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #129 –
I see.  So our ruck division has regression has coincided with our midfields inability to dominate.

Could it be that Judd was that good that he made both our midfield and our rucks look better than they were/are?

We have failed alright.  Failed to grasp what our problems really are and jump at shadows accordingly.  Once we get a midfield that is better able to be competitive with the better teams I feel our ruck issues might be less of a problem for us.

After all our ball use was our biggest problem against Richmond and it didn't help us against Port Adelaide either.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #130 –
Disagree, our problem against Richmond was failing to show up for the game up until half time. Port it was failing to show up after half time. We've played four quarters of football out of eight, that is our problem. You would think that considering the last three times we'd played them (Richmond) we'd let them get more than 5 goals clear that perhaps we may show up on time and make sure that didn't happen. Until we put together four quarters of football not even the best midfield in the comp will save us.
Ignorance is bliss.

ONWARDS AND UPWARDS!
 

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #131 –
Quote from: PassIt2Carrots – on
Disagree, our problem against Richmond was failing to show up for the game up until half time. Port it was failing to show up after half time. We've played four quarters of football out of eight, that is our problem. You would think that considering the last three times we'd played them (Richmond) we'd let them get more than 5 goals clear that perhaps we may show up on time and make sure that didn't happen. Until we put together four quarters of football not even the best midfield in the comp will save us.

Maybe a good old fashioned gee up at the start of each qtr might help. Also telling a few home truths about how players are playing, yes, you might hurt their feeling but hopefully they'll get over it. ::)
2025... Moir of the same to come

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #132 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
We have failed alright.  Failed to grasp what our problems really are and jump at shadows accordingly.  Once we get a midfield that is better able to be competitive with the better teams I feel our ruck issues might be less of a problem for us.

After all our ball use was our biggest problem against Richmond and it didn't help us against Port Adelaide either.

Our ball use has and decision making has always been the worst in the league but our supporters prefer to blame the 200cm guys who have the pill dropped on their head from 50m away. Then like mind numbingly stupid commentators they applauded in anticipation when our HBFs runs through the wing and kick over the head of the 200cm leading player, often to a one on one marking contest in the square between our small forward and a Matthew Scarlett or Brian Lake type. I have watched this happen for the last five years, and I have no reason to believe it will change.

As for the rucks, there is some inconsistency in our list management if you believe the ruck is not critical, because we have kept the bloke who can tap and do nothing else! When 206 plays the stats say the taps are won but the clearances lost, when Kreuzer and Hampson were rucking is shared it was often the other way around, and that is why the tap stats are overrated. It is also why I don't rate Casboult and Rowe as viable rucks although last game Rowe was better, not because they lose the tap but because they offer little else in the ruck role. They are as lost when rucking as Kreuzer is when forward.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #133 –
On talking footy, Malthouse says MK has to learn to be a forward as well as ruck.... It's like a never-ending nightmare. Trade him, let him flourish because it won't be at the blues.

Re: Kreuzer VS Warnock VS Wood - How Will This One Play Out ??

Reply #134 –
Malthouse has set us up for a world of pain in regards to his ruck comments;

And so it begins with Jon Ralph.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"