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Topic: Ciaran Byrne (Read 14894 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #15 –
Quote from: LP – on
Showed more in his first game than Mitchell, McCarthy, Casboult and Watson have in their whole career.

It's a bit rough lumping Casboult in with that lot LP but you're not far off the mark  ;)
It's still the Gulf of Mexico, Don Old!

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #16 –
Quote from: DJC – on
It's a bit rough lumping Casboult in with that lot LP but you're not far off the mark  ;)

You are right it was a bit harsh, but was it fair?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #17 –
I dont think its fair based on one factor.  The positive performance of Casboult has directly effected at least 2 results for our mens seniors let alone the VFL seniors.

Something that the others cannot even hope to boast as yet.

Lets not forget the relative obscurity Casboult has come from to join us as opposed to Byrne who although is new to AFL is a star in his own right back in Ireland.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #18 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
I dont think its fair based on one factor.  The positive performance of Casboult has directly effected at least 2 results for our mens seniors let alone the VFL seniors.

Big statement, which games?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #19 –
Aside from the two games, he kicked 3 goals against the Bombers when we mauled them in 2012.

His better performances were actually against Brisbane, the Doggies and Richmond in that same year.

That game against Essendon everyone had a huge day.

Was pretty good against GWS in 2013 too.

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #20 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Aside from the two games, he kicked 3 goals against the Bombers when we mauled them in 2012.

His better performances were actually against Brisbane, the Doggies and Richmond in that same year.

That game against Essendon everyone had a huge day.

Was pretty good against GWS in 2013 too.

Hmm, think carefully, are you sure?
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #21 –
Looked 200% more accomplished than half the spuds we had on the field against Essendon on Sunday night......
Football is life, there is nothing else....

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #22 –
Quote from: LP – on
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Aside from the two games, he kicked 3 goals against the Bombers when we mauled them in 2012.

His better performances were actually against Brisbane, the Doggies and Richmond in that same year.

That game against Essendon everyone had a huge day.

Was pretty good against GWS in 2013 too.

Hmm, think carefully, are you sure?

Yes.  I'm sure.  Just like I'm sure you shall spew forth some ruck work response which doesn't take into consideration where Levi has come from to get where we are today and theft that he is a forward who can help in the ruck, rather than a ruckman and should therefore not be graded according to conventional ruck KPI's.

@Vfl level he kicked a lazy 5 goals for the bullets in an elimination final.

"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #23 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Yes.  I'm sure.  Just like I'm sure you shall spew forth some ruck work response which doesn't take into consideration where Levi has come from to get where we are today and theft that he is a forward who can help in the ruck, rather than a ruckman and should therefore not be graded according to conventional ruck KPI's.

@Vfl level he kicked a lazy 5 goals for the bullets in an elimination final.

Whatever dude, your opinion I suppose.

HERE is the link to Casboult's record against all sides.

Perhaps you are getting him confused with the big Tractor who was very good in some of those games you list!

As for rating him as a forward, for the VFL level at 200cm and 100kg he should be kicking bags of goals regularly not just on one special occasion, but he doesn't! Comparatively Boyd bagged 5 for GWS in his first ever reserves game, there is a forward for you!

In any case it is you that argues for his support ruck value as a bonus to his forward value, I argue both are inferior!  ;)
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #24 –
Quote from: LP – on
Showed more in his first game than Mitchell, McCarthy, Casboult and Watson have in their whole career.

I just proved to you, that this was a false statement.

This is the origin point of the discussion.

The fact that you are bringing in Kreuzer in to the discussion also proves that I knew you were going to discuss his rucking ability.  In reality, its not important. We lack Key forwards, and comparing a rookie that made it to AFL footy to a number 1 draft pick is the most laughable part of the discussion.


The sad part?  Levi has kicked 3 goals in one match during his career.  From memory that would equal Matthew Kreuzer's game high record goals kicked wouldnt it?  The sample population of matches, and the original talent level for both players are worlds apart to go with that, which speaks for just how wrong our club gets the developement of footballers.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #25 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Quote from: LP – on
Showed more in his first game than Mitchell, McCarthy, Casboult and Watson have in their whole career.

I just proved to you, that this was a false statement.

This is the origin point of the discussion.

The fact that you are bringing in Kreuzer in to the discussion also proves that I knew you were going to discuss his rucking ability.  In reality, its not important. We lack Key forwards, and comparing a rookie that made it to AFL footy to a number 1 draft pick is the most laughable part of the discussion.


The sad part?  Levi has kicked 3 goals in one match during his career.  From memory that would equal Matthew Kreuzer's game high record goals kicked wouldnt it?  The sample population of matches, and the original talent level for both players are worlds apart to go with that, which speaks for just how wrong our club gets the developement of footballers.

I brought Kreuzer into the discussion because in several of the games you list as evidence of Casboult influencing a result he had stuff all impact! It was SpecialK who impacted the result in a couple of the same games, I just assumed you struggle to tell them apart!  ;)

When you want to quote games from 2, 3 or 4 years ago memory and opinion are just not good enough, you have to support your assertion with stats and records. That link above doesn't so much support my argument but it does ask a question about the validity of your claims!

Your blind faith in Levi is staggering, the fact you picked him out of a debate on Ciaran Byrne just highlights that. I hope he proves me wrong for the clubs sake, but after 5 years I have given up waiting for the 200cm x 100kg full forward to show something at AFL level.
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #26 –
Interesting, Kreuzer didnt play in the 2012 Doggies game with Casboult.

Kreuzer also didn't play with Casboult in the 2013 round 21 match vs Richmond either where Casboult also kicked a lazy 3 goals directly contributing to a win.

See my previous statement stands up:

Quote from: Thryleon – on
I dont think its fair based on one factor.  The positive performance of Casboult has directly effected at least 2 results for our mens seniors let alone the VFL seniors.

Something that the others cannot even hope to boast as yet.

Lets not forget the relative obscurity Casboult has come from to join us as opposed to Byrne who although is new to AFL is a star in his own right back in Ireland.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #27 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Interesting, Kreuzer didnt play in the 2012 Doggies game with Casboult.

That is why I wrote "a couple" and not "all"!  ;)

That doggies game was hardly an example of Casboult's influence on a game!

In that Nthmond Rnd 21 game, I credit Casboult for the goal after the siren I think at 3/4 time, but the one off the ground that a the press went ape sh1te over was just dead lucky. And we won't talk about those dropped pudding chest marks inside or around F50 when the game was in the balance!  ::)

Some say you make your luck, and as I see it at the moment Levi is dead lucky to still be on the list so well done to him. But if he doesn't pull out a miracle form reversal nobody, even his most fervent supporters, can doubt that his luck is running out and blokes like Ciaran Byrne and others may stroll right past him!

If you haven't already done so watch the Alex Marcou Driving with Sam Pang video. He makes some great comments about the limited amount of time players get and wasting it, Marcou might have been quoting Parkin!
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #28 –
Casboults good AFL form and Kreuzer playing are not mutually exclusive, ergo proving you incorrect.

Meanwhile how harsh are you being, the guy hasnt even reached 20 AFL games yet!

Lets use him as a litmus test comparison to a solid yet uninspiring mainly forward and see whether or not his career is going okay:

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/players/C/Chris_Dawes.html

Lets not forget that Casboult has played his footy in a team with no big target like Travis Cloke to share the workload forward, and that Collingwood were a top 4 proposition in the years that Dawes played his early football.  We also use Casboult in the ruck more than Chris Dawes would have played there at the pies.

Then you have to consider our forward structure, and our sub standard delivery to tall targets over the last few years.

So at the moment I would say he is coming along okay.  He might forge a decent career for himself if we were a little more understanding and forgiving of the fact that this bloke has not played much footy to match the high expectations that people have on him.
"everything you know is wrong"

Paul Hewson

Re: Ciaran Byrne

Reply #29 –
Quote from: Thryleon – on
Casboults good AFL form and Kreuzer playing are not mutually exclusive, ergo proving you incorrect.

Meanwhile how harsh are you being, the guy hasnt even reached 20 AFL games yet!

No but he has been around here almost five years, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013 and now 2014. Defending him using 20 games as in five years, when our list has only one crippled tall forward target, isn't really a defense it is an indictment!

Any tall forward worth half a soft rotting spud could have waltzed into our team over the last few seasons, and yet not one forward on our list has. That tells you something about the forwards, and it is not just a coaching issue!  ;)

Quote from: Thryleon – on
Lets use him as a litmus test comparison to a solid yet uninspiring mainly forward and see whether or not his career is going okay:

http://stats.rleague.com/afl/stats/players/C/Chris_Dawes.html

Lets not forget that Casboult has played his footy in a team with no big target like Travis Cloke to share the workload forward, and that Collingwood were a top 4 proposition in the years that Dawes played his early football.  We also use Casboult in the ruck more than Chris Dawes would have played there at the pies.

Then you have to consider our forward structure, and our sub standard delivery to tall targets over the last few years.

So in a team bereft of structure, the 200cm mark clunking, VFL finals goal kicking, gorilla forward cannot get a game. That is the point of what you have written over the last few posts isn't it?

Quote from: Thryleon – on
So at the moment I would say he is coming along okay.  He might forge a decent career for himself if we were a little more understanding and forgiving of the fact that this bloke has not played much footy to match the high expectations that people have on him.

You could say that, but I think you would be very wrong!  :D

If you come out and said you liked Meat because he is handsome, because he is powerfully built, because he marks well, because of his olive skin, because he can bump, because he can jump or if you just told me it's because he is your favorite I would not disagree with you.

But alluding that he has had some sort of major influence over games as a justification for the kid spending almost five seasons on our list, no way!

Ticking, ticking, that is what time is doing for Mr Meat! He needs to get desperate and as Mr Jeans stated, "Do something, don't think just do!"
"Extremists on either side will always meet in the Middle!"