Carlton Supporters Club

Yep.
I see that tall Durds has been given another contract and was an emergency for one of our finals... reckon he and Young will be competing for the same spot during pre season training.

Reckon tall Durds is like that fire extinguisher you have at home or work you walk past everyday and hope you never have to use....for me he is there to replace one player only in the main and thats Jacob Weitering.

I’m not sure that Pitto and the King would be selected ahead of Cox and Cameron but Collingwood won the premiership with two genuine, lumbering rucks and two key forwards.  Admittedly, one of the key forwards was a bit of a decoy because their first choice KPF was injured.

Of course, both of Collingwood’s rucks are a threat when they go forward.  Neither managed a goal in the GF, but they demand a decent defender.

The idea that we’re unbalanced with two rucks and two tall forwards doesn’t stack up, particularly since the alternative is two tall forwards, one ruck and a third tall forward/undersized ruck.

That’s not to say that Brisbane model - one outstanding ruckman backed up by one of their two tall forwards - isn’t effective.  It worked quite well against us, but there were other factors at play.  However, it wasn’t effective against Collingwood.

I don’t understand the reasoning behind some of our team selections but I do understand that the reasoning behind those decisions is based on more and much better information than I have, as well as far superior footy understanding and knowledge.  Games of footy aren’t lost by the MC.  They’re lost because the players aren’t good enough or they’re not at their best, or the gameplan is flawed or not executed well enough.

Flags have been won in many different ways. 2017 Richmond won with one key forward and a small forward line, then in 2019 they won with Lynch, Riewoldt, Nankervis and Soldo. 2020 they did it with one ruck and a pinch-hitter. 2018 the Eagles won with Vardy, Lycett, Kennedy and Darling, Melbourne won with Gawn, Jackson, McDonald and Brown, 2022, Jackson was very proficient forward. 2022 Geelong went with Stanley, a part-timer ruck in Blicavs and as well as Hawkins and Cameron. Looks like you can win it with many different combinations.

If you go in with an one extra tall, or one extra small probably it isn't going to make alot of difference. Most important thing to me is that at least one ruck can play well around the ground and go forward and kick a goal. Can't have two centre bounce rucks that can't do anything else. That's where you come unbalanced, like essentially being like a player down. If you have one that can take marks around the ground and kick a goal, great, play 2 rucks. If you have just 2 plain centre bounce rucks that can't do much else then you need to pick a pinch hitter. It's why Levi, for all his faults is a very handy footballer. Luke Jackson probably a better version.

The match was won and lost in so many little moments of people switching off at the wrong time, that team balance being "the reason" is completely irrelevant.

Flags have been won in many different ways. 2017 Richmond won with one key forward and a small forward line, then in 2019 they won with Lynch, Riewoldt, Nankervis and Soldo. 2020 they did it with one ruck and a pinch-hitter. 2018 the Eagles won with Vardy, Lycett, Kennedy and Darling, Melbourne won with Gawn, Jackson, McDonald and Brown, 2022, Jackson was very proficient forward. 2022 Geelong went with Stanley, a part-timer ruck in Blicavs and as well as Hawkins and Cameron. Looks like you can win it with many different combinations.

If you go in with an one extra tall, or one extra small probably it isn't going to make alot of difference. Most important thing to me is that at least one ruck can play well around the ground and go forward and kick a goal. Can't have two centre bounce rucks that can't do anything else. That's where you come unbalanced, like essentially being like a player down. If you have one that can take marks around the ground and kick a goal, great, play 2 rucks. If you have just 2 plain centre bounce rucks that can't do much else then you need to pick a pinch hitter. It's why Levi, for all his faults is a very handy footballer. Luke Jackson probably a better version.

Flags have been won in many different ways. 2017 Richmond won with one key forward and a small forward line, then in 2019 they won with Lynch, Riewoldt, Nankervis and Soldo. 2020 they did it with one ruck and a pinch-hitter. 2018 the Eagles won with Vardy, Lycett, Kennedy and Darling, Melbourne won with Gawn, Jackson, McDonald and Brown, 2022, Jackson was very proficient forward. 2022 Geelong went with Stanley, a part-timer ruck in Blicavs and as well as Hawkins and Cameron. Looks like you can win it with many different combinations.

I said it before.

In a grand final like the one we saw, Jarrod Berry's 2 50 metre penalty brain fades had more to do with the result than any other factor.

Even so, had Bailey not played advantage in that last minute and a half of bedlam, and Brisbane kicked another goal the result flips, we talk about a brisbane premiership, and how Collingwoods decision to play Billy Frampton as a purely defensive forward cost them the game.

Or, Nathan Murphy's concussion becomes the difference.

The match was won and lost in so many little moments of people switching off at the wrong time, that team balance being "the reason" is completely irrelevant.

Yes, Bonehead Berry's brain fade was as costly as it get. Can even go back to the QF and Maynard's hit on Brayshaw cost Melbourne the game. If it wasn't for the hit putting Brayshaw out of the game the Pies may well have been out week 2.

Let's not forget the impact of the umpiring non-decisions that robbed GWS, nothing players can do to manage those moments!

Ultimately, the Filth took their opportunities no matter how they were delivered, they might be lucky but hard work also tends to make you lucky!

I guess the same could be said about going with two very good around the ground rucks when neither can play the support/tall forward role.

Yes, there's no hard and fast rule about ruck/forward combinations, but your point about not going with two one-dimensional rucks is pretty close to being a rule.  I guess the same could be said about going with two very good around the ground rucks when neither can play the support/tall forward role.

Pitto and the King, when they're on, make a formidable combination.  They weren't really on against McInerney but Cox and Cameron were on in the GF and limited McInerney's influence.

Levi will be preparing for his third season since we announced his retirement 

Thats what i've been saying all along. This is why it relates to OUR team, and not other teams that play 2 rucks, or 1 ruck or whatever.

This is why i prefer when Jack plays backup ruck because he doesn't have to do much in the actual ruck, but he does a lot more around the ground than any of Pitto and TDK.

I said at the start of the year that all of this is dependent on TDK and IF he can learn to play another role, we are better off. If not, its a luxury we cannot afford.

I don't care if other teams play 1 ruck, or 23 rucks, that doesn't matter to me. What matters to me is OUR rucks and what they can (and can't do) and thats what effects balance.

Another thing (or 2) that works against us in this instance is....
1. Our bigger midfield and its inability to chase....or more to the point, catch anyone outside of a contest. See Cripps and Kennedy
2. Our 3rd (or 4th) taller defenders. Weitering, Kemp, McGovern, Marchbank all playing together (at times) down back mean we are extra tall down there.
Put it all together and we are asking our smaller/quicker mids (and forwards) to simply do too much to run, chase, tackle and pressure.

So yes, team balance is about our team, not other teams because it is about OUR players, and rucks.

Nothing like flogging a dead horse 🙄

I think that most folk agree that playing Jack Silvagni as second ruck does not work.  He might get the odd clearance but the opposition second stringers touch him up.  McInerney and Daniher would have a picnic, as would Cox and Cameron.

Backing up in the ruck also affects Jack’s output as third tall forward.

Our best ruck combination, until someone else comes along, is Pittonet and De Koning, followed by De Koning and O’Keeffe, then Pittonet and O’Keeffe.

The solution to the lack of foot speed by some of our mids isn’t playing the even slower Silvagni as a second ruck.

Anyway, we won 11 of our last 13, the only team to do so, and I think the MC have got the team balance exactly where it should be.