Carlton Supporters Club

Yes
I also agree
The point is that Voss's departure is being framed as a 'sacking' rather than a failure to renew a contract.
Now, you can argue "little difference" ...the end result is the same.
But there is a difference... in terms of who determined the timing of that decision.
We will write that the club determined that timing, and over the years that will become "we sacked Voss midway through the year," when in fact the timing and method of his departure was determined by Voss.
He went out on his terms, at a time of his choosing.
Which version do you think he would prefer?

Quote from: Thryleon – on Today at 04:36:31 pm

actually 5 goals happens in most games these days.  Collingwood jumped sydney just the other night, and then sydney did it back.  Geelong put 7 straight on against Brisbane in Brisbane. Lets not discuss hawthorn and Melbourne. 

Scoring 5 without a goal going in the other way is largely irrelevant when you might kick 0.4 from set shots. 

Not all situations are the same. Ive picked my examples from this round alone and I remember having done more analysis into it when teague was coaching, we were often one set shot missed  away from preventing those 5 goal run ons.

Not every week to the same side.

Alot of people are trying very hard here.

I've walked the road saying "They were appointed, they MUST know what theyre doing"
I no longer have the confidence or foolishness to believe that...

Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on Today at 04:57:37 pm

GTC..I'll see who Wright and Davies appoint as Coach and List Manager and judge their dumbness accordingly🤔....

I'm confident.

Quote from: Gointocarlton – on Today at 04:52:17 pm

EB I'd be ecstatic to make a Mickey Mouse wildcatrd final but we MUST NOT lose sight of the fact there is much work to do. That work is motion now and must not be deviated from no matter what the season ends up looking like. Your last sentence is it in a nutshell whether we win all, some or none of the remaining games. Wright and Davies arent dumb.

GTC..I'll see who Wright and Davies appoint as Coach and List Manager and judge their dumbness accordingly🤔....

Quote from: ElwoodBlues1 – on Today at 03:10:55 pm

I guess where we differ is our opinion of the list, I think its terrible, slow, poorly skilled, unbalanced, wrong age profile/games played for a bottom team and built for a gameplan that Noah designed before he built the ark. The sacking of Agresta and Austin would tell me that Wright isnt convinced either and wants changes and im sorry but Id be trading Cripps and a couple of others while they have value. A few sugar hit wins like we saw with David Teague just wallpapers some massive cracks imo and leads us to another false dawn . I want a rebuild of the list, draft picks to help fix it and a List Manager who knows what he is doing.
To me making a wildcard final game would be the worst result as the club would think it has the list moving forward and  the cycle will start again and another coach will have his head on a stick outside ikon park in a couple of years.
Strip it all back, new coach, new captain, new leadership group, new List Manager and do it right...

EB I'd be ecstatic to make a Mickey Mouse wildcatrd final but we MUST NOT lose sight of the fact there is much work to do. That work is motion now and must not be deviated from no matter what the season ends up looking like. Your last sentence is it in a nutshell whether we win all, some or none of the remaining games. Wright and Davies arent dumb.

Quote from: shawny – on Today at 12:28:50 pm

I dunno about that method EB. I prefer we build a winning culture still get Walker and maybe attract a decent FA - the list is not anywhere near as bad as our ladder position IMO.

Get games into the 6 kids that played yesterday and add Walker to that and our young talent is more than ok.

Just for our culture I dont want to lose Cripps and a bottom 2 finish regardless of a few extra low picks will make it hard for him to want to stay and no chance of attracting talent in via a trade.

Get 8-9 wins finish 11th-12th and we will be viewed very differently internally and externally if we win 2 more games and finish bottom 2-3. Our club needs wins to be spirit and the winning culture much more IMO then an extra early pick or 2.

     

I guess where we differ is our opinion of the list, I think its terrible, slow, poorly skilled, unbalanced, wrong age profile/games played for a bottom team and built for a gameplan that Noah designed before he built the ark. The sacking of Agresta and Austin would tell me that Wright isnt convinced either and wants changes and im sorry but Id be trading Cripps and a couple of others while they have value. A few sugar hit wins like we saw with David Teague just wallpapers some massive cracks imo and leads us to another false dawn . I want a rebuild of the list, draft picks to help fix it and a List Manager who knows what he is doing.
To me making a wildcard final game would be the worst result as the club would think it has the list moving forward and  the cycle will start again and another coach will have his head on a stick outside ikon park in a couple of years.
Strip it all back, new coach, new captain, new leadership group, new List Manager and do it right...

Quote from: PaulP – on Today at 03:07:17 pm

I tend to agree.

Yes
I also agree
The point is that Voss's departure is being framed as a 'sacking' rather than a failure to renew a contract.
Now, you can argue "little difference" ...the end result is the same.
But there is a difference... in terms of who determined the timing of that decision.
We will write that the club determined that timing, and over the years that will become "we sacked Voss midway through the year," when in fact the timing and method of his departure was determined by Voss.
He went out on his terms, at a time of his choosing.
Which version do you think he would prefer?

Quote from: laj – on Today at 04:19:29 pm

Good try. Side do kick 3 goals in a row., Happens every week.  Not sure why you'd use 3 goals in a row as an issue to suit an argument. 5+ goals in a row, as we did every week, doesn't happen so much, and not on a weekly basis. Fact was the game was always close and stayed that way the first 3 qtrs with never a lead of more than 11pts,  until we opened up in the last qtr. That 2nd qtr we did kick one goal, but the Dogs were heading for a goalless qtr  until that very late one, which I guessed you missed. Barely anyone scored in that qtr. Played the 4 qtrs for the first time all year, running the game out.

actually 5 goals happens in most games these days.  Collingwood jumped sydney just the other night, and then sydney did it back.  Geelong put 7 straight on against Brisbane in Brisbane. Lets not discuss hawthorn and Melbourne. 

Scoring 5 without a goal going in the other way is largely irrelevant when you might kick 0.4 from set shots. 

Not all situations are the same. Ive picked my examples from this round alone and I remember having done more analysis into it when teague was coaching, we were often one set shot missed  away from preventing those 5 goal run ons.